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Subscribe to RSSNEW YORK -- Highlighting growing security concerns at “Occupy” protests around the country, a 26-year-old man has been arrested and charged with sexual abuse of a woman at the encampment near Wall Street where the movement was born.
Tonye Iketubosin, a Brooklyn resident, was arrested late Tuesday and remained in custody Wednesday while the incident was investigated, police said. He had been working in the encampment's kitchen.
The Wall Street Journal reported that police were investigating an alleged attack by Iketubosin on an 18-year-old woman from Massachusetts. The woman told police she accepted his offer to let her sleep in his tent while he went to work at the kitchen early Saturday, but later returned and raped her, the newspaper quoted an unidentified law enforcement official as saying. Charges were pending.
Iketubosin allegedly groped a 17-year-old woman days before that incident, on Oct. 24. He has been charged with third-degree sexual abuse in that case, the newspaper reported.
Brendan Burke, 41, of Brooklyn, who helped start the “Occupy Wall Street” security team, said there had been three or four assaults since the protest began on Sept. 17 committed by two men.
In such cases, he said, protesters “go straight to the police.”
Burke said the security team, which consists of up to ten members and has help from outside groups to help keep the site safe, has non-violent measures for handling aggressors, including encircling them and shouting them down. A community watch group, akin to neighborhood watch, also monitors the site overnight, he said.
“People forget this is the middle of the street,” Burke said. “All walks of life are in here, so it’s not like a bunch of crazy people are in this park. But there is an element in this park that is eating free food, living in tents and being subsidized by the movement. It’s one of the weak parts of the movement, but it’s changing. … It’s just a thing everyone’s working out as we go along.”
He said the protesters attempt to integrate such interlopers into the movement when possible.
“We have also a track record of including troubled kids into the fray of working groups … and becoming part of the movement,” he said.
Protesters find allies in ranks of the wealthy
Security issues have bubbled up at some “Occupy” sites around the country in recent weeks.
“Occupy Boston” is looking at measures to deal with taking troublemakers out of the camp, protester Ravi Mishra, 25, said Tuesday. There have been no reports of sexual assault, though they have had to deal with people who are rowdy, drunk or have substance abuse problems, he said.
Some people who were not really a part of the movement have shown up and gotten “up to no good,” Mishra said.
“We’re doing our best to navigate, you know, both sides of the line,” he said. “On the one hand, we want to make sure that we’re not being exclusive by any means, on the other hand, we do understand that there is ... a degree of realism that we have to take with these issues.”
Old guard back in the trenches at "Occupy" protests
“Occupy Dallas” also has had a few security issues arise with people coming to the camp who were not associated with the movement, protester Michael Prestonise wrote in an email.
“Our position is one that might run counter to the continued accusations of our movement primarily consisting of hippies and freeloaders,” he said. “We actively work with the police to enforce the law.”
Prestonise said the protesters had dealt with theft by announcing stolen items at “general assemblies” and conducted their own investigations in some cases. A fire watch team also coordinates security and organizes shifts to maintain an all-night safety patrol, he said.
Both Occupy Boston and Wall Street have tents for women only. Burke said the camp is safe, but people should not think it’s a crime-free zone.
“There’s a myth about this … that it’s not every day America,” Burke said. “We’re just Americans doing our constitutional right. It doesn’t mean that there is a magic spell that will protect you from crime.”
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What? Go to those defenders of corporate greed and the status quo?
Anybody know where Cain was? Is he at it again?
These protests are starting to implode. The activists are now their own worst enemy as they violate others rights. No longer interested in their concerns given their lack of civil behavior. I am fine with their expression of frustration while they adhere to their rights. Personal and public assault is not tolerable...ironic in that they claim (at least I think they do) that corporations are violating them...yet they are no better or actually worse.
Black Panthers, Nazis, homeless are just some of the people at these protests.
Shut down a working seaport containing employed union members...ya, that's really making a point.
Good Grief.....
Many teachers took off to join the protest in Oakland. These are the same teachers that often come onto this site to tell how much they care for the well being of your children. Much like the protests in Milwaukee, most of these teachers don't give a rats @$$ about your kids or their education. I say let them protest and give substitute non-union workers their jobs. Then we might actually see some bang for the bucks we're spending on education in this country.
This is why the police are heavily present at the 'occupy' sites. Someone gets injured and ends up suing the city for failing to protect the public.
And cities are being forced to spend a bundle of taxpayer dollars to pay the police officers at the protest sites...and that's 24 hours per day. Maybe the "OWS" folks will take some of the big donation money they are receiving to pay back the cities...and the taxpayers...for the high costs of police staffing !!! Those tax dollars mostly come from fellow members of the "99%".
Back to reality...the "OWS" folks will not contribute one dime to cover the expenses forced upon others due to these tent cities they've built. Just like the "OWS" could not care less about the loss of business many businesses are forced to endure because the so called "protests" are interfering with their work.
I guess the "1%" are not the only folks who have a bit too much of the "greed" we keep hearing about.
Don't bother being ashamed of your comments, I am of you.
What a joke. Now these "Protest" sites are demanding more police and security to protect them from the participants. Shoes the quality of some of the protesters themselves.
Some of the people posting comments here have got to be the most uneducated, unintelligent, unthoughtful people I've encountered. In every case the groups have gone straight to the police when incidents like this have happened, thus, they do not condone or tolerate this behavior. Yet, the idiots use the few people (less than a handful) who have perpetrated these crimes as characterizations of the entire movement. Let's not forget that when the tea-baggers first started holding their little rallies, there were scattered incidents of violence and widespread displays of hate and racism.
@Chris H,
YOU and the bunch of people at the OWS are the most uneducated, unintelligent, unthoughtful people I have encountered. Dont waste my tax dollars and do something more concrete than this protest. What a waste of time and money!
People are fed up with the way things have been going!!!
This isn't about the police nor is it about saving some building!!!
THIS IS ABOUT THE SELLING OUT OF CITIZENS FOR POLITICAL AND FINANCIAL GAIN!!!!!
This about not having our lives dictated by a few and about being able to dictate our own lives!!!
This is about forcing our political leaders and leaders of organizations all across the world that we want fairness as well as the ability to take care of our families!!!!
If we can't have that then we don't want anhy of this that we have now!!!!!
Dick, probably not Herman, but I note that the Wall Street Protest is just down the street from Slick Willy's crib. this sounds way more like Ol Bill gettin a Lewinsky while hillary is out of town
Chris H, I didn't see all of those good folks in Oakland going to the police.
This is what killed the movement in the 60s. Their hippie socialist ways dont work. Period.
Peel layer, 'this is about not having our lives dictated by a few and being able to dictate our own lives'.
Then why are the few OWS protesters and other movements shutting down businesses where ordinary Joes like you and I (more likely just I) go to work? It seems to me like the few of you are dictating which businesses should be punished and with it, most of the 99%ers working inside. Also the demands made by many of the protesters (free education, etc.) will come at the expense of the 99%ers. Isn't that dictating to the many workers by a few deadbeats? Isn't going to happen Skippy. I've worked the last 11 days without a day off so I can take my family on vacation this winter. I'm certainly NOT going to give the protesters any more than my share of the taxes for my labor.
Great point, peanutGallery, a point which has been proven daily for the past 34 months by the guy in the white house.
Judging by the protesters, if they really are the 99%, then it's amazing that our unemployment rate isn't .........well about 99%.
So far, it seems that if OWS is to have it their way, there will be total anarchy. They are far from representing 99% of Americans. They sure don't represent me and I'm not in the 1%.
Can we get a list of names of these protestors? I want to have a list to use for background checks when I hire employees. I want to be sure to NOT hire any of them.
Does anyone know what Obama's position is on the OWS movement?
You got to love the comment..."Burke said the security team, which consists of up to ten members and has help from outside groups to help keep the site safe, has non-violent measures for handling aggressors, including encircling them and shouting them down.." "Hey...bad person!! STOP!! STOP!! or we'll yell louder!" These people are a joke! They harbor criminals and addicts and they are supposed to represent the 99%?? You've got to be kidding! They certainly don't represent me!
I read where some masked "protesters" were trying to break things until the other protesters made them stop. This leads me to believe that there may be hired "protesters" to cause disruptions within the group to try making them all look bad. How hard would it be for someone to hire a dozen people to go into the group and start trouble to get the police to stop them all?
I also think it's funny when these people on here that post about wasting their tax dollars on helping the poor don't realize that Bush has already spent their tax dollars. Your tax dollars for the rest of your life has been spent on a needless war you supported so my tax dollars are being used for useful things like helping people in this country.
My favorite part of the story is that people are "coming into the camping area to eat free food". These young morons are finding out first hand that there is no free lunch and there are many that want to take and do not want to contribute. Just like in the real world.
One more thing, 17 and 18 year old girls really should not be down there sharing tents with strangers. Use some judgement and common sense. Sleep with mom and dad and come down during the day to protest.
Larry, actually your tax dollars, your childrens tax dollars and your grandchildrens tax dollars will go to paying off the massive debt (mabye just the interest on the debt) wrought on us by this administration. And most of this money went to states to keep state union workers going for 1 year. Dub didn't do the US any favors in the debt dept., but it's a drop in the bucket compared to what this administration spends. Enjoy your well spent contributions.
I like the logic of those condemning OWS. By this logic - chrisianity is a group of criminals. After all - the leaders have been accused of raping children. And members have been convicted of a multitude of criminal activities - from rape, imbezzlement, driving drunk, to fraud, burglary, and murder.
So - by this logic, christians are all evil. I always knew...
I think all of you that are against the protests need to watch the video of Rachael Maddow, explaining why people are protesting. The 99% vs the 1%. Sorry, but if you can't understand that, then you should be happy to accept a $9 an hour job. I, and others will not accept a $9 hour job, working like a slave, to make investors billions. They squeeze every red cent out of the worker, so they can live high on the hog. People aren't looking for handouts, they are looking for work that pays them a decent wage. Why is that so difficult to understand?
Please tell me in what way will anybody in this country benefit if the ows is able to bring about the death of capitalism....anybody??
This is an angry mob, period. They will descend into the depths of mob-dom until something goes terribly wrong, at which point everyone will stand around wondering why our politicians, law enforcement, and civic leaders let it get so out of control. Every day this movement is allowed to grow more disruptive and violent without being denounced and condemned will add to the second guessing when it all blows up.
You watch the news and they ask people why they are there and they get a myriad of answers. Many don't know why the are there. They are angry about anything and everything. There is free food, lots of drugs, sex, and an atmosphere of anarchy. They have created a "parallel universe" to live in there where all they have to do is misbehave and they get attention.
If we were smart we would pack up the cameras and take them back to the studio, arrest all those that break the law, and ignore the rest. Soon they would go back to their parents' basements and resume their video games.
Sorry StephAce, but stating references from 'journalists' on MSNBC (Maddow especially) is not exactly bolstering your case. It doesn't provide any more credence than someone from the right regurgitating Glen Beck talking points. Just because someone is successful doesn't mean you automatically get stuck with a $9 an hour job. Unless of course, you lack the fortitude and drive to rise above that job.
Run for your life, the OWS crowd is coming your way. They're the human animal hybrids we were warned about. Slimy, filthy, socialist communists and UNION (department of redundancy department)people. Soon they will be attacking innocent tea people and job creators or at least sitting on their lawns. Lets get the cops to shoot them in the head with tear gas cannisters. "We thought we heard shots from the unruly crowd just after their Muslim prayer meeting, we were forced to shoot to kill" "Get off my lawn".
Not to make lite out of sexual assault, which can happen anywhere especially downtown after dark, but this article makes it sound as if this is who is being represented when God knows every group of people will have it's miscreants and criminals and opportunists, as history shows on both sides of any arguement.
"Keep as cool as you can, face piles of trials with smiles, it riles them to believe that you perceive the web they weave, keep on thinking free."
Seriously! Those commenting on here and defaulting to what is for all intents and purposes "phony" righteous indignation over a few (very, very few) to discredit the 99% movement is so transparent as to be laughable! Where was/is your outrage at the death of Free Enterprise? The game is rigged by monopolies, multinationals, large banks and corporations who have all but done away with competition, supply and demand and any job creating prospect of new paradigms of innovation, i.e. Green Energy. And to top it all off they get corporate welfare and pay "0" taxes! The PERP is the 1% and they have RAPED US ALL!
Great comment calmbeforethestorm!! People want to blame others for their misfortune. StephAce sounds like a bitter person that didn't apply himself either working for someone or if he truly felt he was being exploited, then he could have started his own business and chartered his own success.
So what you right wingers are saying, is AMERICAN CITIZENS involved in protest against corruption in our system should not get any kind of Police protection! Interesting view!
LOL! That's just priceless! Allow me to paraphrase:
...there is an element in this country that is eating free food, living in federally subsidized housing and being subsidized by the US Government. It’s one of the weak parts of the country, but it’s changing. …( I wish it were!)
We always get what we ask for. Good or bad. Stop asking for the bad and start asking for good.
See you in 2012.
The problem I see with the OWS movement is that what should be their core message is being blurred by their actions. The outcry that corporate America, their greed, and their buyout of politicians is a huge problem today is a much supported notion. Most people get it. There is always a time and place for protest, including the old school way of picketing. I have no problem with calling for voluntary strikes, everybody has a right to choose to protest. However, when actions by these protestor's cause others, who happen to be in the 99%, from doing their jobs and making a living for their families, they've crossed the line.
You want to prevent corporations from sending jobs overseas and importing goods from China? Don't buy those products. Organize efforts on the internet, educate people what products they should be buying to support American jobs. The internet is an amazing tool, millions of people can be reached within seconds. Research, make lists of common things people buy that are make by Americans and get it out there.
If you're pissed at the giant banks, pull your money out and put it into local credit unions. Tell the bank manager why you're doing it. Look at what happened with B of A's $5 fee. You know darn well they knew push back was coming when they announced it, but they didn't know it was going to be at the level it was. They feared losing money. You want to change their ways? Change their bottom line and they'll listen.
These are only a couple of examples. There's something to be said for physically showing up and protesting. It does send a message. Go protest on, say, Saturday. But spend the rest of the week doing other things that captures the attention of America in a way that won't turn them off and gets the message across. A lot of the core principles are great, but they're being ignored or are ridiculed by a large number of people because of the ways the movement is doing things.
And they are surprised that the nation hasn't rallied to the side of a bunch of unemployed, drunk and high kids who are camping in public parks, defecating on concrete and still haven't produced a coherent vision or message.
Seriously, at what point does this stop being a protest and just become loitering? 2 months? 6 months? A year?
I believe what is being said is that this is an illegal protest, that is not led by, but certainly harboring violent criminals who have hurled glass, rocks and molotov cocktails at buildings and police. Whose whole basis for protest is just loitering and defecating in public squares, and that they do not deserve the added police protection or overtime being charged to taxpayers to pay for it.
They should hire their own private security with their astroturf ACORN donations to keep their embarassing and unsightly tent cities safe.
Then quit feeding them and maybe they'll go away. Think of it like welfare; if you subsidize something, you will just get more of it. Try taxing them and they will certainly pack up and leave, kind of like corporations.
Mishra thinks she's talking about all of the homeless who have appeared and like all the freebies. After all, their lifestile just got a boost because someone put in a kitchen. Mishra should be concerned about the socialist/communists who look at the OWS crowd as "useful idiots" to make their ideas sound good. Good luck Mishra. Stalin's got your back.
http://www.breitbart.tv/former-soviet-citizen-confronts-socialists-at-occupy-wall-street/
The amazing thing is how quickly we have forgotten what communism is about. Do we really want to trade the crooks we have for a group of thugs? Are we really ready to trade our imperfect system for one that has killed hundreds of millions of people in just under 100 years?
@Chris H.
"Yet, the idiots use the few people (less than a handful) who have perpetrated these crimes as characterizations of the entire movement"
sounds just like the liberal media and the entire democrat nation when it came to the TEA party gatherings...tough luck
@Ben
you almost got my saying correct ....ha
if you put up a sign that says "Free Hamburgers"...it isn't just the hungry that will show up
Chris H.-2386235 and Robert Mack, you're each suspended for a day for violating #1 of the Code of Honor.
...
None of the cheap current event derails restored.
@Steph Ace
Who is forcing you to take a $9.00/hr job? The way it works is, you apply for a job, if the employer feels you are qualified they offer you the job. Then you negotiate salary or hourly wage. Sometimes, in order to save everyone time in the process the employer will announce a wage or wage range they are willing to pay someone to perform this job. Other times the employee will tell the employer what they require to do the job. Generally, the more specialized the job, the more difficult it is to fill, the more the job pays. So a job say stacking bricks at a construction site will pay less than say the mason building the wall. Often, although not all the time, the engineer who designs the building will make more than the mason.
The easiest way to get paid more than $9.00/hr is to find a skill you possess that others do not possess, then get them to pay you to fulfill that need. In order for this to work you need this skill to be something they value but either don't possess themselves or that to them it is worth more than $9.00/hr to have done for them. Now, if the demand for this skill is so great that you cannot fulfill it on your own, you can find other people to help you fulfill this demand, but- and here is where things get interesting-, you collect the money for these services. This is a fee for finding the people who need this skill and the people who can fulfill this need. You collect from the "customers" and you pay part of the fee to the "workers" and you keep the "profit". If you find a "product" or "service" for which there is a great need, and you can fulfill that need you can be financially successful, i.e. make more than $9.00/hr. This does not make you an evil person.
How much you pay the "worker" is determined by a formula. In the simplest terms it is something like this; how much, and how many people, will pay to have this good or service - how many people can/will do this work= "profit". The more people who are capable and will perform a duty, the less you have to pay them to do it. This is why a person who can throw an oblong ball accurately 20+ yards away at a moving target consistently, can make more money than the five guys who stand in front of him to keep others away. There are fewer people with the first skill than the second, and more people will pay for that "product" (entertainment).
Thus concludes today's Econ 101 class.
I believe....the tea party got this whole thing started. The problem was they layed all the blame on the government, and no responsibility on Wall Street. So you mean to tell me that the genius minds on Wall Street that created the mortgage bundling "products" were not intellegent enough to forsee the mayhem they would inflict on our economy? The economy is the vehicle for all that they do; but you're telling me they have the intellegence to create the rules so they can never be held accountable for the devastation they put upon investers, taxpayers, and those who have not yet been given the opportunity to participate in this great American experiment called "the free enterprise system", but they are not intellegent enough to work within the system that they create and control with any integrity,ethical standard, or degree of fairness. AND it sounds like the lot of you nay-sayers feel it is preposterous that they should be held accountable for their actions. What is the term for a capitolist state that grows so large and powerful that it encompasses and eventually consumes that entity it was originally designed to serve? Cancer. Parasite. Whats a better word ? anyone?
Hmmm. Burke says "It’s one of the weak parts of the movement, but it’s changing. … It’s just a thing everyone’s working out as we go along.”
Funny. I was working out a movement earlier today. It smelled a lot like the OWS gang but displayed a lot more intelligence.
It's too bad your intelligents droped out with your movement. Come back when your head clears.
Ha-ha. Good one, Ken.
Game, set and match.
For anything close to a game, set, match, Ken would have had to have been smart enough to either use spell check or know how to spell intelligence. For you OWS protesters, try to stick with one syllable words. See Packers above response for an example.
hilarious
Know how to spell intelligence? How about knowing how to spell dropped?
MassKen,
With your spelling abilities you are the last person to critique anyone's intelligence.
With the fact that intelligent people know better than to question a person's intelligence based on spelling since you're also bashing the educational system with your right wing propaganda and it is obviously their fault some people cannot spell. Intelligence has nothing to do with book-smarts in most cases. It has to do with common sense and normality. What strikes me as Ironic is how every comment in support of the Occupy movement has been "closed by the community." Intelligent people welcome opposition because it supports progress, new ideas, and a strengthening of reasoning/logic. However, this group has shown the opposite. This group has squashed all opposition with insults and ill-placed rhetoric instead of understanding truth. One incident happens and you all think all of them are like this and this is how they act. You are wrong. That is the very definition of a stereotype. Stereotypes are wrong 99.99999 percent of the time. How stupid can people be? Obviously pretty stupid. Go ahead, vote this closed. It will be read by people who use their brains no matter what you do unless it is forced completely off of the page. In that case this has been copied and pasted and can be posted as often as it needs to be. Original thought in the service of truth is worth the repetition anyway. Only an idiot assumes that something is right or wrong simply because he or she believes it. Pursuit of overwhelming evidence to support your claims (not just one or two documented incidents across the entirety of the nation) should be your goal. Instead you insult and demean like the bullies, charlatans, and dogs (as in, "attack dogs") you are. Have a nice day.
and you moderators can moderate that too, because it is no less respectful than the disrespectful comments made against those in support of OWS and other occupy movements. All it takes is a little reading to notice that.
Yeah.... right, OWS is SOOOOOOOOOO much like the teaparty.
Well yeah, OWS protestors don't have the luxury of FreedomWorks bussing them in, feeding them, and making sure they get home in time for weekly BINGO at the church hall....
The TEA Party paid it's own way - including fees to cities, etc., for public gatherings. And most of the TEA party members go back to WORK - something these OWS loafers abhor.
Dr. Larry
Your absolutely right. The tea party actually stood for something. Campaign reform, a balanced budget, and cut government spending.
However the majority of Americans do not support their movement. Yet fools come out in droves to join this "occupy movement"
It's a very telling description of where this country is heading. I feel sorry for my kids. We expressed the importance of personal accountability and responsibility. By the time they grow up those two qualities will have vanished from the American landscape.
These guys need food, heat, housing, everything given to them. Now they even steal sex! Can't earn anything without taking from others!
its funny that we get angry at these protesters for wanting a "bail out" when we've handed big businesses billions of dollars in exchange for them "f"ing us around every corner. I wish we instilled personal responsibility and accountability to the businesses as well.
Dubdeuces,
A business is responsible for turning a profit. That's how they stay in business and keep people employed.
The real problem was everyone buying things with borrowed money and credit cards and not paying for it. As citizens we gave our money away then borrowed other peoples money and spent that as well.
People need to step up and take responsibility for the way they spent money, but we both know that won't happen.
I agree some business practices were very shady, however with that said consumers were never forced to participate, they choose to.
Tea Party people were bussed in, and go to you tube and see the people you are so proud of. Many on SS, and medicare, but that's only for the GOOD PEOPLE, bought and paid for by Dick Army and freedom works. The OWS has good ideas and intentions, it just takes a few bad people, and trouble makers to taint the whole movement. If you like armed people marching, claiming to want to take THEIR country back, join up with the baggers! Jam Vee good post!
Bobby Jones, do you think businesses never borrow money? How do you think the whole housing bubble popped? Ever hear of leverage? Here, check out the Crisis of Credit: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4759275362410693117#.
And actually, when I joined my company, our business statement was to (and I'm paraphrasing) "provide affordable, quality goods to our customers, provide a clean and safe work environment to our employees and a fair and reasonable return to our investors." Customers first, employees second and investors last. Now, after a recent round of lay-offs, our upper management told us point blank in a follow up meeting that our company's only obligation is to (and this is a direct quote) "maximize profits to our investors." And if that means our company will abuse workforces in foreign lands where the governments don't care one bit about child labor, unsafe work conditions or environmental pollution, so be it.
Please don't tell me that you can defend a company's right to make money without attaching some sort of social responsibility to it, either to their customers, their workforce or the environment. Because what I've outlined right here is the underlying movement behind OWS. It's not that they hate rich people. After all, they're not protesting actors or musicians or athletes. They're protesting folks who made their millions by effing over millions of other folks.
Social Security? You mean that thing you get when you have actually WORKED for a living? So these wretched tea partiers had the audacity to fritter away their lives WORKING at jobs and paying taxes and didnt just smoke pot and do Shrooms and live in tent cities? What is their deal???
And some of them are now too old to drive? Well that must mean their opinions don't matter then. Because if someone rides a bus, well they must be an idiot, a dupe, a rube.
And you're saying a few actually exercised their second amendment rights with open carry??? My God, you're right. Who would want to be around people who both understand the US constitution and have a work ethic. These people are MONSTROUS and deserving of ridicule.
A lot of people agree that the corporations should not have been bailed out. The biggest problem is government. They think that they can shove their hands into the "free" markets and make things better. Of course government needs some control or corporations will extort the economy. But they can't decide where a company can build a factory or decide who the winner is in the markets. No bailouts, no scam loan guarantees for political gains. Obama has literally divided this nation and created this mess. He has choked companies with regulations and forced them out of the country. He wastes taxpayer money on several failing energy companies. His federal raid on Gibson Guitar was to enforce an INDIAN law on wood export when he doesn't even enforce our own federal laws. He should stay away from the economy. He has already drowned us in over 4 trillion dollars.
So if a guy is raping a women, then only thing they'll do is shout at him?.... Like that's gonna work. I'm sure the women will feel much better knowing a crowd is shouting on her behalf while she's being raped.
The biggest problem for legitamate "Occupy" participants, is the movements strong attraction to lawless Anarchists and Hooligans. Unfortunately, as the crowds get larger, the violence will increase (look at Oakland yesterday).
Sounds like they need some community organizers. Maybe some stimulus money too.
Didn't take long for the OWS participants to turn to the "Some are more equal than others" position.
Yeah, heard that in the statements the OWeS (us) members were making in the article. Ha ha.
The comment about someone else eating their FREE FOOD really cracked me up.
Not only the world OWeS them, but they don't want to SHARE either...LOL.
Why not some stimulus money Packer fan, especially when "I Hate the Federal Goverment and Stimulus" Rick Perry and Mitch Daniels took plenty of it to balance their books, all the while rallying against it...
I would think safety concerns will have to grow with the OW groups..however..they are correcr in what they are doing. FOr no other reason than to finally get membes of congress and the rest of this nation to wake up before this country is completely sold out by politicans of both parties. The only things congress is managing to do is one..protect their wealthy friends who hand out money for elections..and..themselves.. These politicans were elected to do a job which. todate..they have show beyond doubt that they are not capable of doing. We surely need changes..to start with we need new people in congress..all new people....that are not beholding to their parties to the estream as we have today.
If one ever needed a good example of what an 'attractive nuisance' is, other than the example of a swimming pool that's usually cited, this would be a good one.
I'm afraid if you've got anything going on involving more than just a relative handful of people, some undesirable characters are going to find their way in and have their way with it. The various 'Occupy' gatherings are tantamount to putting posters announcing an open-invitation party at your house all over town. People you've never met and will never see again will be in abundance if there's even a remote possibility of free beer!
Come to think of it, I seem to recall that the overthrows of several monarchies over the centuries, especially Russia and France, happened when an energetic crowd of ostensible revolutionaries stormed the palace, helped in liberating the contents of the wine cellar, and then disappeared as soon as it was dry, completely satisfied with their extent of involvement in the movement.
Where is Feisty Redhead? I can't believe she's not on here. I have also heard there have been more than a couple of rapes at OWS. Why isn't NBC reporting that? This "movement" is nothing more than a bunch of thugs out for freebies.
She's probably trying to figure out a strategy for accusing Herman Cain of offering her a bite of his Hostess Ho-ho.
Like your communities und churches where rape has been going on forever....but I guess you will point to the "others" and say: ...thats not us,right?
Oh politics, here you go with the pointless grandoise emotional BS.
http://fieldnotes.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/11/02/8603904-sex-assault-arrest-highlights-security-concerns-at-occupy-protests
They are, did you leave your tinfoil hat in the bathroom again?
Yeah, how DARE those American CITIZENS go out and DEMONSTRATE. What a bunch of jerks!
(though it should be peaceful!!!)
If there were rapes, NBC would cover it. However, it's only the right that make up these stories to villify OWS. Their scared, and I don't blame them.
Ken, You put way too much faith in NBC. The right is sitting back watching the OWS crowd make jackasses of themselves. Businesses are losing money and now starting to lay off workers due to this so called "protest". A major port is now shut down and those laborers will not be getting paid when they are not working. They have families to feed and are not part of the 1% that the OWS has targeted. I'm not saying changes are not needed, but this will not get it done.
MassKen -
Did you read the article you're commenting on?
Perhaps MassKen is one of those men that also thinks there's no such thing as sexual harrassment.
I can't wait until some 'global warming' affects the occupiers! Snow, below freezing temps, howling winter winds. Bring it!
I put myself thru college. No debt when I graduated with a BS in Business Management. Because the economy at the time was close to recession, I took a job at an auto finance company. 1st day on the job, I was in the nastiest ghetto in Detroit calling on "Acie Smith" (real name on the purchase contract). This guy was 6 months past due on his note to the fianance company. He couldn't work because he was recovering from a .38 bullet wound in the abdomen. He explained to me that I too would be recovering from a .38 bullet wound if I were to attempt to repo his car. I busted my axx to get thru college for this!?
The point is, the occupiers need to get a life. Find work. Start whereever you can and work your way to better jobs and more compensation. Your Mamma ain't gonna help you. Nor should Uncle Sugar. It's up to YOU to grab your bootstraps and get in the game!
This shows they are the low life that they are. This is not about Wall Street. It has everything to do with bums wanting something for nothing.
Chuck Case, i believe you are making a blanket statement, which in my mind and experience, makes it a moot comment, as in all protests, you find the legitimate concerns as well as opportunists, and why shouldn't the least of our Americans have a say on what this economy is doing to their lives, i.e., most of the jobs they are qualified for are being filled by middle class who have families to take care of, that $10 an hour corporate America is paying these days; they shipped all the key manufacturing jobs overseas for more profits. You see, you just can't pay rent and car payments and college tuition on $10 an hour, and a family can't make it on $10 an hour either, legitimate complaints. Too bad the opportunists have to muck it up, and that's my humble opinion. BTW, I worked and paid all my own bills for 28 years in this great country, until 2007, when the attorneys decided they needed to keep more of their money and buy Blackberry's instead of pay a human being to keep track of their businesses. Oh well, right?
In all of the tea party protest I have not heard of ANY rapes or other hideous crimes. I guess that shows who the civilized people are compared to the animals.
You/re right. They were much more into beating up people.
Bill,
Where did the Tea Party beat up people? I must have missed it. They are are still looking footages of the Tea Partier who allegedly spit on the black Congressman. Nobody has been able to come forward and collected the $100,000 reward offered to anyone who can produce a video, picture, etc. Typical left-wing lies.
Off your meds again, Bill?
That would be because the LIBERTARIAN (not DEM, note this.) based Tea Party is making a genuine effort to take government out of our daily lives, they have a strong sense of independence from government; whereas the OWeS is a bunch of whiny brats that do not know HOW to live without a handout. Case in point: setting up camp in public places and waiting for someone to GIVE them food and tents. Their FOUNDATION for protest speaks loudly as to what they are all about. Their "coumminity organizers" need to come up with a better plan.
hey RoadWarrior one of Rand Paul's staff members was charged by the police in Kentucky with physically assaulting a female reporter that he knocked to the ground and stomped with his boots and Joe Miller's staff beat up people including a reporter in Alaska last election cycle to name a few.
I seem to remember someone getting beaten up at a TP rally, but I can't remember if it was a TP member or some outside group protesting them. I'm not sure, but I think it was the TP member that ended up in the hospital.
There were no rapes at Tea Bagger rallies, because who would rape a shriveled up old woman with a husband dosing off beside her.
MassKen does have a valid point this time.
The demographics are considerably different between the TEA party and the various Occupy gatherings.
I suppose the most probative difference really is that most TEA party rallies were over before most people knew they were happening, placing the opportunistic leaches far behind the power curve. The Occupy protests are well entrenched and last for days, if not weeks, so everyone knows the 'when' and 'where' and has plenty of time to get there and enjoy a piece of the action.
But what MassKen says also holds very true. Rape is a crime of violence, and most violent crimes are based on some sort of misplaced anger. This is why it's usually younger people who commit them! In part, you get yourself sorted out and move on in life after a certain point, or else your anger consumes you and your acting on it has landed you a cozy room in the house of many doors that you get to occupy for much of your life. Otherwise, darn it, we all reach the point where either we just don't care enough to vent our frustrations - verbally or physically - or we don't have the energy. Assaulting someone in any significant way does take some 'zip' a lot of us just don't have after age 45 or so...
Bill - can you cite a reference? The only place I see something like that is on far-left, liberal blogs. Any actual news stories to verify it?
It was a parapalegic tea party (Kenneth Gladney) member in St Louis. Beat up by SEIU union thugs. Link is below:
http://videos.stltoday.com/p/video?id=5507918
No one should be grouped or raped, but these people put themselves in situations where they have no control.
Most of these protestors are bums. Since they have no self respect, respect for others or their property, what can anyone expect.
Yeah, most of them are bums. Like the veteran that got beaten up, right?
I bet you said that about the protester's of the Viet Nam war too.
Can you tell us all why you're against holding the executives of Goldman and other such firms accountable for their actions? Why you're against holding law breaking politicians such as Charlie Rangel accountable for their actions? Guess you're just another one of the sheep.
SHE SAID MOST! And she is right.
No she is not right...I am a veteran myself and have been to protests in Chicago and NY and they are not all bunch of bums. I know many teachers, off duty police officers/fireman, nurses etc, who attended on their days off..hardly bums. A bunch of my former Navy shipmates joined me at the one in Chicago, are we bums too?
Sorry, you're both wrong.
Thanks fred.
Donna,
I hope your child and the rest of our service members stay safe while they are fighting overseas. However, you are an idiot.
Donna you are right on and the real 99% of us absolutely support your view. It's only a matter of time before we come in and shut this crap down. We can not allow civilians to be threatened and harassed as well as spending our hard earned tax dollars to handle these criminals and vagrants. I feel for the few that really want to make a difference and have fought long and hard for their freedoms and while I don't support their movement I do support their rights. However I have also fought for the freedom of everyone else in this country and when protests turn violent and infringe on other civilians rights, it has to stop. Unfortunatley these groups have been infiltrated by anarchists, criminals and other agitatirs that are there to commit violence against people and proprerty.The majority of this country will not tolerate this kind of behavior and will do what needs to be done when called upon. Please tell your son his brothers are here for him and to get home safe.
You're spot on, Cobra, and your last sentence was very moving. My husband is a 20-year Navy veteran, and I know well the sacrifices our men and women in the armed forces make.
Thank you for your service, and Donna, know that your son's service to our country is appreciated. Bless you all.
Cobra Cmdr and Kai,
My son and I appreciate your kind words. May God bless and keep you safe.
God Bless The USA!
Of course there will be some trouble. It is drawing all the street people. But their record is far better than Herman Cain's.
Yeah, Bill. There are a lot of rocket scientists, mathematicians and successful CEOs out there among the rioters, I'll bet. Speaking of a weak record of accomplishment, maybe you're getting Herman confused with some other black guy.
So you say....................you Liberal dog...............
It won't be long before the cold weather drives that gaggle of dirty hippies and hipsters out of NYC...so tired of their obnoxious drums & megaphones.
Hmmm, did you say that about the Viet Nam war protesters too?
Not really sure why you object to holding executives in firms that were responsible for the economic collapse accountable for their actions. And the politicians too.
I feel sorry for you folks that appear to need someone in power to tell them what to do and think, regardless of whether it's legal or ethical.
I am sure the British had hoped for the same thing back in the late 1700s...
You might want to brush up on your reading comprehension as I was merely complaining about the obnoxious noise being made by the protestors, not their right to protest or their objections to certain aspects of corporate America.
Obviously you don’t live in NYC and you haven’t actually seen the OWS protestors in Zuccotti park. Believe me; it’s not even remotely as glamorous as some media reports would make it out to be and it’s such a rag tag group of individuals that they’ll never be able to focus their message or be taken seriously. And the smell coming from their ‘camp’ is not to be believed…it’s like a mixture of sewage, marijuana and patchouli.

"And the smell coming from their ‘camp’ is not to be believed…it’s like a mixture of sewage, marijuana and patchouli."
Hmmm... that's the same kind of smell that came from the Viet Nam war protesters. The young people who are the inheritors of this country who brought an end to that insane war that was contrived to make the MIC (Military Industrial Complex) and oil companies (and copper) rich. And then what happened? Oh, it was a total disater as Communism took over the world like our "leaders" said would happen. No? Oh, I guess not. It was all lies!!! We are allies and trading partners now!
Less than 30 years later Bush gets us into another insane war for similar reasons. It's about time the younger people stood up to be heard. Do all of you really think that we as citizens should defend the fact that corporate interests (especially the banks and oil co.s and Big Pharma) have taken complete control over the economy and our lives??? That's what you are saying when you put down these protests. Don't you see what's actually happened in the past 50 years? Are you blind? Keep believing the lies.
OWS...here's some advice from Antoine Dodson
"he's climbing in your windows, he's snatching your ppl up"
"hide your kids"
"hide your wife"
"hide your husband"
http://youtu.be/hMtZfW2z9dw
Please name a Tea Party person who beat up someone. You can't, LIAR.
So those Tea Party Rand Paul supporters were not bashing that woman's head into the pavement for trying to ask Senator Paul a question?
What do you would have happened to woman if she approached King Obama the way she approached Paul? They did not bash her head into the pavement, they took her down and stepped on her bean to keep her under control, try telling the truth lib. This was right after the Giffords shooting, security just doing their job, you dope
Speaking of ignorance being dangerous, it's good to see that sara palin's fifteen minutes is over. Any bets on how long before she leaves todd for hank williams jr.?
No Pat L - She's moved up in the world. She'll leave him for an NBA player.
One, the tea party is by far way smaller than the OWS and had a few rallys and that's it...they then sold out to the right and have pretty much sold out the American people as well... You guys can keep putting down OWS all you want... these people are more committed than you...they are probably much smarter than you. I think the tea party are jealous and afraid of the OWS because it's an honest to goodness grassroots movement, where there's was created by the Koch Bros. and the GOP. The tea party is a total fake movement, we all know it by now. The tea party is going away and we all know it. If you can't see and appreciate the power of the OWS movement then you are blind and only seeing and hearing what you want to see and hear, stuck in your own narrow view of the world. Look, we're all aware of your "Demonize then Justify" tactics. No one believes you anymore, so you are wasting your time trying to sell your B.S. to each other and we are pretty much laughing at you for continueing down the same road while the rest of us move on from the Glenn Beckisms and the Rush Limbaugh (Only believe me, every one else is lying to you, so I can manipulate you)B.S.... You guys seem very slow... You've become a joke, a punchline... Why don't you actually do something independent instead of just blindly following the GOP down the tubes... Obstructionism is Un-American...
They certainly have more TIME on their hands, they certainly are more indoctrinated. LOL
They had 2 Million people marching...while this "occupy" rat hole ensemble has a few Ks...
I think these cockroaches should peep down or the real 99% might stomp over them in a bloody mess.
Adam, some might interprit that as a threat. The right wing of America is the most weak-minded, and violence is the only way the weak-minded know how to express themselves.
Adam Smith - where did you get 2 Million - oh right the picture Faux News showed which was later debunked to be the picture of "The Million March" held years before
Wow Chris H, I guess the Oakland contingent of the OWS group is right wingers. Thanks for pointing that out!
Whoa, people living off the system, offering nothing, working for nothing and they want stuff for free and when they don't get it they cause trouble and won't leave....hahaha....sounds familiar
You are "living off the system" too! Or do you think you paid alone for the road or the hospital? Get real!
And in your communities and churches is rape ...but it is not you, right?
Somebody should tell Burke if that "element" is not part of the 1%, they're part of the 99% and he should embrace them.
Some of us are intelligent enough to know reality from dreamland and have learned how to live the "system" as you call it. Have you ever considered that every society from the beginning of man is based on a "system". Of course in your jaded on-way or highway simple mind the "system" is something that is evil. Evil perhaps because it requires a certain amount of conformity to a standard. Some of you have problems meeting any kind of standard, (excuses, lazines, whatever). So get over it, go live by the river.
mr fred-851708: greed is evil, that's why the protesters are "living by the park!"
I pay for much more of the road or hospital than those people out in the street. Much more.
Instead of 1% or 99%, let's discuss the 47-50% that don't pay federal income tax. And the top 10% that pay over 70% of ALL federal income tax. Even the 1% that pay nearly 37% of ALL federal income tax.
That's reality.
According to Fox. Dr. Larry...So by saying that you pay more in taxes than most, I guess that means you should get more say in the political system. That is what has these protesters in the streets in the first place.
I pay taxes, and yet I am not represented by my politicians. Do you know why Larry? Because some corporate shill has a large bag of cash that he gives "my" Representative to "Lobby" for the corporation. This makes my minuscule tax contribution moot, so I get no say in the situation. This is the reason we overthrew the government of England. We arose because of taxation without representation....This is the very crux of the matter, so save that "I pay more so I matter more" stuff. There are diverse crowds at these protests...Including Doctors and lawyers, cops, firemen, soldiers and anyone else that cares to join the movement.
If expressing their protest bothers you so much, then do something about it...Call your Congressman...Oh? You get no answer? Do you have a personal lobbyist? No? Huh? I guess you should incorporate..They always get laws changed to favor them over the average citizen....
I protest, and I am a working man. I pay my taxes, and I see the system is BS. These peaceful protests should be embraced...Because as you know...Violence is bad MMMKKKAY?
Occupy for peace Larry...It might make you a happier guy, and a more involved citizen. I am sure they could use a doctor...Not that you could do charity...That's not capitalism...That's....Being kind to your fellow man.
Hairfarmer---I like a lot of your posts. If only people where more able to back up their opinions with statements that don't sound like they were pirated off of their party site.
I like that you keep trying to tear down the whole party line crap and keep trying to point out that people generally do not understand what they are speaking about.
My only gripe is that all this "corporate greed" stuff is a small part of the problem. Personal greed is so much worse. It sounds like you have your house in order which is great for you man.......but a lot of people I have heard talk about this always gloss over just how responsible the individual is for living beyond their means.
I just want to say your posts should make some of the Occupy haters think a little bit. But....the Occupy people need to take the hint and think a little bit as well.
I see a lot of name calling from people who should know that debate has no place for such pettiness.
Thanks Brian,
I try to do my part. I try to keep it civil and respectful. I find the discussion to be enriching.
It does amuse me how Americans (me too) are so hypocritical sometimes...Life is far too short and beautiful to waste being angry and hateful. The key is to enjoy it while we are here, and try to leave it better than when we found it so the next generation can enjoy their stay...Like an earthly timeshare...LOL
I gotta go...The taxman needs his next check...DOH!
Peace
The whole point of my initial comment was to show the complete hypocrisy of occupiers, the government, the banks all of it. I mean gimme a break when the pols and the unions are now latching on. Same thing happened to the ridiculous tea party when the republicans got on it. The organizers complaining about people taking advantage of their generosity is just stupid. Hell, now the head banker thief says he understands the movement.
Just when I started to think these people were on to something. What a bunch of idiots.
Brian and Hair - Great additions...finally normal people that can have a conversation.
Wow-3058090,
Probably because of the way you presented your statement in your prior post showed a lack of debating intelligence. Regardless, the article did say they were working through it. Sometimes incorporating these people into the movement when possible. I would image that the ones that are not there to be constructive, but just the opposite by being disruptive, are not welcomed just like in our general society today. One of the reason's we have laws. They seem to trying to do that. It is a very young movement and will take some time to iron things out.
I went by our Occupy Emcampment last night on my way home and most of the protesters that I saw were not very clean people. Thier hair was unkempt, they needed shaves, and look very much like street people to me! I conversed with a few and had to stand upwind of them because of the odor of them made me ill! {:-(}
Damn poor, why can't they just buy a house and get a shower for Pete's sake....
Hahahaha, great comeback.
Well yes...the tea party members had the benefit of organizations like FreedomWorks bussing them in daily on luxury busses, then feeding them, and then making sure they get home each night to catch Wheel of Fortune. They never actually "roughed it" by camping out for their cause. I am sure the early Americans never dreamed of missing out on their favorite recreation activities in order to rise up against the British (and they were always very clean too).
THey might have rename themselves OWeSS.
That's right Trinity. The tea party people made their point, then they packed up and went back to their families and jobs, or looking for jobs. No one was hurt. There was no vandalism and they disposed of their refuse appropriately.
Since you're doing comparisons, are you recognizing any more contrasts here?
Gary 2009, unfortunately that is the real affect of corporate greed on humanity. if something doesn't change soon for the people, it will only increase these reduced life circumstances.
Packer,
All you've done is pointed out that the Tea-Baggers just aren't all that committed to their cause. They just half-ass it. They wouldn't have even gone to any of these rallies if the Koch bros and the GOP hadn't bussed them in, fed them and bussed them back home. Basically, they're puppets that did what their conservative Lords told them to do. Mindless bodies that the GOP uses to promote an agenda of hate and intolerance.
Chris - you obviously have no clue how the TEA Party works or how committed they are. I know a lot of members and they don't like or take orders from most current politicians.
Do you remember the 2010 elections? Get ready for more of the same.
BTW - by definition, teabaggers would be liberals.
Chris H.-2386235----I love to read posts where someone complains about posters generalizing a group of people then one sentence later they trash a different group with general and lazy observations.
Now...can you pick up on the fact that while you called out people on here you decided to do a little "calling out" of your own.
Time and time again we see this from the so-called "educated" and "open-minded" groups who seem to conveniently forget that those words are not a entitlement. What I find most surprising is just how many of you simply cannot state you think you are better than people who disagree with you.
Why should anyone listen to your voice when you use the same name calling and finger pointing the other side uses?
For all you education and your ideals...you are downright common sense dumb if you still think this is a party problem.
Brian - well played sir...
Brian, the difference is that as free thinkers who are not controlled by the words of Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, it's not so easy to fit us into a little box of generalization. Tea-Partiers (republicans that are just too ashammed to admit it, and rightfully so) are mindless zombies who fit into all the stereotypes put forth about them (ie racist, evangelical pseudo-christian right wing nut jobs.)
So Chris you have met every single tea party member? Amazing! Careful, your hypocricy is showing (and look, he even voted up his comment - how cute).
Security is a problem when the police are dropping off rapist and sex offender to the rally and encouraging the homeless to go there. Its sad how they are trying to villianize the protestors!! The NYPD are a joke!!! A paid strong arm of wall street !! I am so glad that this is growing!!
That's right, bow down to your corporate masters! It sounds like a lot of people suffer from something similar to battered woman syndrome, " He didn't mean it, he loves me, he broke my jaw because he loves me."
"The rich earned their money, by dilligence and hard work, the worked a billion times harder than the manager at Mcdonald's."
The very democracy that fostered the rich to acquire their wealth has been abandoned by them, shipped overseas to exploit even more impoverished people in order to maximize corporate profits.
Wow3058090 - - - I was SO going to post that. Amazing, there are actually people out there who are just wanting a free meal? Free place to live? astounding. I didn't think people like that existed! Even more amazing . . . . OWS used a bad word . . .subsidized. ooooooo. So bad.
Unfortunately, in any group there will be those who take advantage of the situation to pursue their own agenda. For example: police officers engaging in crime, business managers coercing employees, church leaders becoming wealthy from donations. Of course not all police, managers, and church leaders are bad, but there are always a few whose self interst outweighs moral values. I'm glad to hear that OWS groups are self-policing in an effort to protect each other from the 'bad apples'; sadly, such efforts are necessary in human society.
What did they think may happen living out on the streets of NYC? Like i said before most of the protestors are young, college graduates, who come from a decent up bringing, not accustomed to being around actual homeless people that will do anything to survive. Of course you will have the occassional vagrants that will take advantage of the situation. Who ever started up the OWS should've planned more effeicently for situations like this, the NYPD won't do but so much because they don't want them there anyway. It's a dose of reality for these young people!!!
Sexual assaults at "Occupy?" What was Cain doing there?
Anarchist wannabes creating their own Utopia with civil disobedience, riots, vandalism and sex crimes. Wow, what a movement that smells worst than fresh cat poo. Someone bring out the pesticide, the infestation needs to be cleaned out.
"the infestation needs to be cleaned out..." Yes, Tad, and it's called CORPORATE GREED.
Tad, you're yet another example of a weak-minded fool who thinks violence is the solution to all of Earth's problems. I can't believe MSNBC hasn't taken your post down for promoting genocide.
Tad, this is exactly why ole George McGovern won sooooo many states, and Richard Nixon won twice. The anarchists never learn that if you look like a varmit, talk like one, then you are one. It always shows at election that they want nothing to do with the anarchists OWS idiots. I wish it was Nov 2012 now, then we could start getting this country out from under Obamunism sooner.
We didn't clean out the TEA bag infestation, I'm sure we can deal with these guys for a while longer.
I mean really, how novel an idea? Go sit my A_— somewhere until I grow mold.
The occupy group needs to be watchful of opposition groups such as the teapot party. The occupy group wants to raise taxes on the rich, exactly opposite of the mission of the teapot party. And the teapot party is part of mr grover's gop who are not above dirty tricks.