An 18-page application to get food stamps? She shot the wrong people.

This is so sad. The state officals wont simply check if she was employed. Dont pay your taxes they will track you to the ends of the earth, and know to the last cent what you own where you work, pay scale and how long you lived at your home. Sneak across the border present phony documents and you will get the stamps no questions asked and even get an interpter to fill out the 18 pages.

Are you kidding? The republicans? Eight is more than enough stupid for everybody.

People...before you go all progressive on the issue read a complete story....

http://www.chron.com/news/article/State-Mom-who-shot-kids-self-denied-food-stamps-2348338.php

The woman clearly, did not try too hard to receive benefits...she missed appointments to review the application and did not complete it....the injury to her children had nothing to do with anything but her own instability.

Thankfully the others she held in the office got out without injury. Prayers for her children and the family they have that can hopefully make sense of their mothers behavior to them some day.

A tragic story concerning 2 children. Yet, the story never mentions the father or fathers of the children....the other half of the equation.

Let's have them all be taken care of by the 50% of the nation that pays taxes - that way, we won't have to face the horrible thought of the other 50% of the population taking care of themselves

50% pays income taxes. 50% doesn't pay income taxes.

All the other taxes... both halves pay.

If you don't buy gas, you won't pay the tax on gas. If you don't make enough income, you won't pay the tax on income.

How hard of a concept is that for some people?

It is hard for folks like yourself to understand that your analogy only works if you would have stated " If you dont buy gas, you wont pay taxes on gas. If you dDONT WORK, You wont pay taxes since there is no income to tax". That statement is comparing apples to apples NOT the statement you made.

Also didn't this lady know she could have wentto a food bank in her area or a church or even a shelter if her kids were hungry. This tragedy has nothing to do with the political sceen so why reference it?

I heard Newt speak about the poor this week. These people have no clue as to what is going on on the streets of this country! People are starting to get desperate! And if something is not done soon, I am afraid we will see more tragic stories similar to this!!!!

Maybe, this just shows us how desperate people are out there trying to feed there families...She would rather see all of them dead then watch each other die of starvation....Sad day in the USA...

What you may want to pay attention to is those who feel that their is no way out of poverty who wants to turn their anger towards the officials taking away their programs!!!!

It's hard to kill yourself before taking it out on those who are making it hard for the poor!!!!

Sadly two innocent children are dead.

Has society gotten so cruel as to turn this into a political argument?

What horrible circumstances led this mother to do such a horrific deed?

We may never know.

What has food stamps to do with this story? Typical MSNBC story.

Nowhere did I actually read that the kids died. The story just says she shot them. Common misconception, I guess, but many, many, many people (maybe even most people) who get shot live through it. As did these two kids, as far as I can tell from this story.

culheath

An 18-page application to get food stamps? She shot the wrong people.

Seeing as this was in Laredo, TX, one would assume 9 pages of English and 9 pages of Spanish.

But to your broader point, should we make it a one page application with no confirmation and everyone can qualify? As Benjamin Franklin said, "I am for doing good to the poor, but I differ in opinion of the means. I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. In my youth I travelled much, and I observed in different countries, that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer."

Miker...didn't say they died...said she would rather see them dead...although interesting that you would pull that from my post instead of the fact that she couldn't be bothered to make the scheduled meeting to go over the application...

sell the gun by some food first.

I'm sure she had some personal issues and what she did cannot be explained from simply not getting food stamps.

That said, the current welfare systems, which vary by state, generally suck.

I had a friend that lost his job, then his home (he was renting), could not find a job (and he was legitimately looking), didn't have a dime for food, and was turned down for welfare and delayed on food stamps. By the time his pride let him make his phone call to me for a free meal, he was skeletal. Two weeks later, with my help, he got some food stamps. He has since died of cancer (unrelated to this, i guess), but he never found shelter, did not get welfare, and could not get employed because of his skeletal appearance and age.

My take is that we have plenty of hard-ass safeguards to prevent people that don't deserve the assistance from getting it... so hard-assed that people that DO need it can't get it either.... and, what, we can't give someone some temporary food stamps while they are getting approved? I guess we would need absolute documented proof that they were f'ing hungry?

It's not that we don't have the right systems is place, it's that they aren't working. That DOESN'T mean you get rid of them, it means we fund them for a change and fund the auditors to make sure they're working.

If running government CORRECTLY instead of INTO THE GROUND makes me liberal, then so be it.

An 18-page application to get food stamps? She shot the wrong people.

You are right, I mean why have an application at all? It's not like the system is abused as is with a difficult application process so why would it be with a walk up and collect system.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/06/9257355-feds-couple-claimed-welfare-lived-in-12m-home

LmarcT....in local news stories the problem occurred in part due to the fact that she did not show up to the meeting to review the paperwork....when she did not show and did not call to reschedule her file was made inactive...do you think that subsidy programs should go search out every applicant who can't bother to show for their appointments?

Actually, txmom32, what's interesting is that you assumed my comments on GSW's were directed at you, when several comments preceding yours affirmatively assumed that the children had died.

What a bunch of idiots. She couldn't do 18 pages worth of paperwork, so she tries to killer kids, then she kills herself.

And all you idiot liberals blame republicans for for making it so difficult that her only option was killing herself.

Republicans don't have any problem with someone needing, and receiving help. But they do have a problem with the endless abuse of the system.

If it takes 18 pages worth of paperwork to minimize the chances of fraud, then so be it. Even the slowest of us could work through 18 pages of paperwork in a couple hours.

If you idiot liberals think that murder/suicide is a reasonable alternative to a couple hours of work to verify you're eligible to receive something for free, then please please please feel free to kill yourself.

Sorry Miker....my bad.

Spencer, one side of your brain must surely be out of order. Let's set some records straight. I didn't see one post condoning her actions.... making that part of your statement ridiculous. In fact, in my post, I was in line with your statement that she should not have done it and that it surely didn't warrant the action she took. Secondly, your if 18 pages are needed, so be it is a flip comment without any knowledge whatsoever. What could be in 18 pages that would be a prerequisite for food stamps? She was desperate... NO. the department shouldn't be chasing people around, but a process that pushes people away to guard against fraud... especially concerning FOOD, is inane.

BTW, we DO blame Republicans for 1) making it too hard to enter, and 2) decimating the regulatory and auditing funding under Bush... which is at the heart of all this fraud your own politicians complain about. Now you criticize the spending needed to restore the monitoring... what BS!

txmon, No, I don't think they should chase everyone down... but please do not pretend that any of these support processes are simple or easy... and maybe they shouldn't be, but they shouldn't be impossible. The resources running these government systems are way under-funded and have been for several years now.

I-believe....no she would rather see them all dead and blame someone else before being inconvenienced to go to the meeting about her benefits.....she missed the meeting and didn't call back for a couple of months.....she didn't deserve her children.

This sounds like you're assuming she's just lazy and that's the reason she blew her kids away. Did you consider untreated mental illness? What are those numbers on uninsured in Texas again? Did you consider that she may have cracked under pressure and not had any safety net? Have you ever been desperate and stressed and in a situation that you weren't educated enough to wrap your brain around? This woman slipped through the gaping cracks in our system, and you think she's just so lazy she'd rather kill her children than show up at a meeting. Doesn't sound like she had a spouse to share the burden, or to pay the bills while she sat around commenting on internet message boards - I guess some Texas moms are just better of than others, eh?

Marc,

People in need go through the process and get approved for food stamps every day. It is NOT a difficult process. It's not a 5 minutes in and out process. But anyone can get it done in a few hours spread out over a week or two.

She was desperate... NO. the department shouldn't be chasing people around, but a process that pushes people away to guard against fraud... especially concerning FOOD, is inane

If a process involving a couple hours of paperwork, and a couple meetings (less than most of us do in a single day at work) drives you away, then you're just lazy, and don't deserve help.

Something that liberals fail to understand is, not all people are hard working are honest and hard working by nature. Not even most people. If people can get something for free, they will do it. No, not every one. But enough to make the system unsustainable.

And I should throw in that I'm not a republican. They're as corrupt as democrats. Republicans get their bribes from a few rich people. democrats get theirs from millions of poor people.

Both parties do have their uses though. Republicans keep democrats from robbing from those who work, to give to the lazy, in too high of numbers to be sustainable, and Democrats keep the republicans from letting the filthy rich abuse the poor to the point they all starve. If just the republicans or just the democrats had total control of the government for more than a few years this country would go the way of the USSR very quickly.

Some of you are serious oxygen thieves......seriously! Quick to go the political route instead of starting with "this woman was obviously OUT OF HER MIND". Karma. Karma is a wonderful thing and if you tempt fate, you will end up looking at Karma face to face. But, from what some of you posted, you will then be all hurt and surprised and act like "it shouldnt have happened to me, this is unfair...LISTEN TO ME, (foot stomping)(demanding of instant attention)".

try not to overdose on moron pills anymore please? Some of us do care.

Moved from Ohio to Texas 9 months ago... Kinda tried to get food stamps for 6 months... kids were "apparently" home-schooled.

A whole lot of conviently missing information... but a righteous, liberal, class-warfare sounding headline none the less.

Does my heart good to find many slamming back at the hate mongers comments.

First they force everyone into worse poverty than ever witnessed in this country by breaking the very system that allows everyone to sustain a healthy country... while keeping the masses blindfolded until most recently ( thanks OWS! ).

They take the jobs away, nothing new developed, industries collapse, people evicted into the streets.. nah, there's no 'plans' visibly found here.

Had the richest not taken the jobs overseas this would not have happened. The richest, callous - you can't even call them people - that have destroyed this country all for the sake of maintaining their $50 million dollar a year living expenses - homes, autos, boats, vacations... as they rake even more from their overseas company.

If everyone had not allowed life sustaining prices to continue raising for the last 50 years..... and had they prevented large business from eating up all the smaller businesses... we might be in better shape than what they've currently forced upon this nation.

NOW? They're going after the world.. as eventually the small select still having jobs, will be pressed into having more taken from them as help to the rest without jobs continues to drag all income down until the few support the many.

Great work rich its. Those having six-figure incomes per year ARE going to feel the crunch as government assistance vamps up to deal with all the starving and homeless. You still feel none of this will ever affect you? Possibly you're among the mindset of - kill the low-life's off.. we can get by without them, and live better in so doing?

Sad, VERY SAD state of affairs for this country... and the major reason OWS can NOT fail.

Quan----

You right wingers love that statistic that only 50% pay taxes. You love to try to make it look like half the country are freeloaders. What you don't point out is that most of the people not paying taxes are working and making less than the tax breaking point or are like me, in an aging population, on Social Security. Rail against Social Security all you want, but I have been paying into it since I was 17. Every last paycheck I ever got in my half century of working withheld money for my Social Security. It's not a gift and the only reason that the taxpayers are having to support it is because corrupt politicians on both sides of the aisle stole the funds that were there.

Now we find out that Bush gave away $7.7 Trillion to the blackmailers on Wall Street long before the paltry funds that Obama gave away with TARP (that saved jobs at GM as opposed to financing bonus checks on Wall St.). Wall Street steals trillions of dollars and you're worried about food stamps?

Exxon-Mobil pays zero federal taxes (in fact, we pay them) and you're worried about food stamps? Why is it that when the country is in trouble financially you see money to be saved ten cents at a time instead of the obvious billions that are being stolen every day by corporations?

Willie Sutton got famous for answering the question of why he robbed banks by saying, "Because that's where the money is." Clearly if Willie Sutton had been a conservative Republican, he would have been holding up school kids for their lunch money.

Some people obviously have issues if they read children were shot and go straight to politics. Do you feel better now that you got it out of your system? If she really loved her children she would do like that guy who left his child with the neighbors because he couldn't feed him, not try to kill them. Basically, nothing to do with politics so grow up!

A tragic story concerning 2 children. Yet, the story never mentions the father or fathers of the children....the other half of the equation.

If he/they had been around, she might not have needed food stamps.

AtlasWillShrug

culheath

An 18-page application to get food stamps? She shot the wrong people.

Seeing as this was in Laredo, TX, one would assume 9 pages of English and 9 pages of Spanish.

Assume all; you want, there was nothing to indicate that was the case and even so, 9 pages of application for food stamps is just as absurd.

But to your broader point, should we make it a one page application with no confirmation and everyone can qualify?

More assumptions (no confirmation)...but you can get a lot of information on one page and this was a woman with two young children asking for access to food. God forbid we should be expected to feed a complete stranger...how do we know they are really hungry or deserving? She had been trying since July...this is what month again?

As Benjamin Franklin said, "I am for doing good to the poor, but I differ in opinion of the means. I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it. In my youth I travelled much, and I observed in different countries, that the more public provisions were made for the poor, the less they provided for themselves, and of course became poorer. And, on the contrary, the less was done for them, the more they did for themselves, and became richer."

As far as your Franklin quote goes...it's always easy to moralize about other people's poverty circumstances, especially when you are not poor yourself.

I opt for compassion first and then we can ask questions.

You can say that again.

She was appling for the stamps and kept being denied.

Other than the fact that they may have been starving and needed the stamps to live, probably none. The article didn't mention whether she had a job or not, but evidently not if she was home schooling the children.

As I read the story, the woman was trying to fill out an 18-page application and did not submit all the information that was required. I don't think she was turned down for food stamps, I think the application was still on hold, not even under review, until the missing information was submitted. She might actually have qualified, if the forms were completed.

Bob, you mean they give jobs to anyone that asks for one in Texas? Wow! I wonder how fast my family can move to Texas. Here every time there's a single job opening somewhere several hundred people apply and all but one are turned down. I'll alert my neighbors and we'll all try to be in Texas before the holidays. We're getting jobs everybody!!!!

Thanks Bob!

well there are too many facts missing from the story , but perhaps she felt like a failure for not being able to provide adequately for her children and thought it best to end her life and the lives of her children .....

Its sad though, some people figure that the only way out is to end their own lives , only such hopelesness would push a person do so such. I hope the kids survive and can move on.

I maintain: as long as you are living there is always hope....no matter how bad the situation is, taking ones life isnt the answer ....

Having only read the article, it sounds as if she and her children were running from something or someone, IE an abusive situation. Why the He(ll) would anyone want to run to Texas (a republican stronghold) to ask for help. Ok, so this lady was not thinking straight, that still doesn't mean we shouldn't help her. I would like to know about this 18page application, WTF. You want to talk about a state that gets in your business, I remember filling out security clearence questionaires back in the military that were 18pages. Why would you need 18 pages UNLESS you did NOT want to help people and could use any blank as a reason to deny benefits.

G

Why do you assume she was mentally deranged? She may have been a perfectly healthy, full of life worker who was able to take care of her kids until she was unemployed or hit bad times. We can't assume. But obviously she was desperate, and this was her last safety net.

This article is missing a boatload of information. I don't see how anyone could write a credible article with "a woman shoots her kids and kills herself" tied to "she was denied Food stamps." (Inferring that was the reason she did this.) In the article, it doesn't say she was denied, it said she didn't provide all the information, they tried to reach her to complete the form, but she wouldn't respond. Very poor writing, meant to elicit an angry, emotional response from those who skim, instead of reading the entire article.

18 pages aint too bad, most of it is probably waivers and warnings and instructions. Try filling out an SF86 =P

Very poor writing, meant to elicit an angry, emotional response from those who skim, instead of reading the entire article.

The link was made, obviously, because the shooting took place at the welfare office. If it's true or not - who knows. But that's why, lol.

texasbob

Just maybe she should have sent her kids to school and got a job.

People like you are why people like her dont get the mental help they need. You are a perfect texan and no texas stereotype is lost on you.

A mother looking for food for herself and her kids. Although I do not agree with her response to the situation but imagine a mother having to see her kids go hungry. Imagine for one minute the anguish she must have felt. All the while we spend how many millions a day to support wars for people and country who are not America, are not Americans and do not pay American taxes. Shame on us. We have collectively failed a human being.

Good old Rick Perry's Texas. Where the rich get richer and the poor and hungry are left to fend for themselves. Welcome to the Republican dream.

PeterJacobs if she had sent her Kids to school they woud have more than likely qualified for free lunch and breakfast so they would not have starved. This has nothing to do with food stamps, democrats or republicans. It only has to do with a nutcase.

PeAcE LoVeR-2838047

What a tragedy obviously a mentally deranged woman. What does food stamps have to do with this story?

Well, for one thing, judging by the photo it seems to have occured at the office where she was denied food stamps. So, it seems to be a little more than just spin- it was a major part of the story.

Anyone who thinks she didn't have major issues beyond the food assistance is clearly diffusional. She never provided the information needed so she was denied.

Shuklac - they've updated since I posted.....They do that a lot.

If she had done this, if she had done that, etc.... It is about a human being needing help. The office should have had counselors there to help her. Ever heard of emotional overload? Getting to a point where people just can not handle one more drama in their lives? I hope perry is nice and cozy in his capitalist shark cocoon. There are a myriad of reasons that she couldn't or wouldn't provide information. Either way, bits and pieces of missing information are no reason for people going hungry. There also may be reasons why her kids were not in school. Either way, as a society we have collectively failed her. The military kill and maim yet leaves no one behind. We left her behind all the while our tax dollars go to killing more civilians in other countries.

Having experienced some of the things this woman has, I can understand SOME of her actions. We were raised right at the poverty level. My father died when I was young & mom never remarried - or even dated. She worked her butt off to make sure we never had to accept welfare / food stamps. We didn't have any of the new toys or cars the other kids & families enjoyed, but we always had our home and food in our bellies. Mom made sure of it with hard work!..........

My daughter is now a college freshman. I called the business office yesterday concerning a matter and spoke with a very young man. Even though I was on every piece of information submitted when we registered my daughter at the school, we did not fill out a "release of information" form this idiot in the business office said he needed before he could tell me when I would be reimbursed for my out of pocket expenses that were to be covered by scholarships. We are short on money as it is and work very hard to get our kids ahead. If I could reach through the phone and pop the pimple that was this kids head, I would have. I am sick of forms and regulations. I am tired of arrogance and failure to provide reasonable customer service - free of animosity and provocation.

I can see why this woman flipped out. I don't understand why she shot her kids, but I can empathize with her plight.

What a sad country its turned into, she was obviously struggling..God help us.

Why is it that the parents kill their children? Sad really.

So many families wanting to adopt a child and this lady would rather they be dead?

I have a neighbor with 3 children (and an abusive, deadbeat ex husband) that tried to apply for food stamps and they sent her a letter informing her of a phone interview that was to be held on the same day the letter was dated! Obviously she missed that interview! As did the mom in this article. This mom works hard at a $10 an hour job.

How can you say she didn't have mental problems?? Seriously? She SHOT her KIDS. That is NEVER the answer to ANYTHING. Why didn't she send them to school and look for work? Send them to school and look for help at charities, shelters, and churches? There's always another answer. And the article says she wasn't denied it says she didn't fill out the whole application. That is different. She obviously had major issues.

Impatient girl

Who was saying she didn't have mental problems? Undoubtedly she did.

In recent years, when ever I have had occasion to enter such a place ( no I'm not receiving welfare) there have been metal detectors at the door. Some people might say if more people carried guns, this sort of thing might not happen. Well, this was in Laredo, TX. You can carry concealed weapons there and they really love their guns, yet that only served to allow a disturbed woman to get a gun into a frustrating place with her children. Why didn't an armed person take her out? Simple. She had a gun drawn! I don't buy into the argument that if everyone is packing, nobody gets hurt. That's the sort of thinking that led to nuclear proliferation.

That's pretty bad for collapsing Texas Bob for making a reasonable statement....2.5

Just maybe she should have sent her kids to school and got a job.

She could have also gone to a food pantry...local church....shown up for the meeting to review her application instead of blowing it off...she could have made a phone call to follow up on her application..there were all sorts of things she could have done that would have been better than an armed standoff that resulted in attempted murder/suicide.

I think before you completely put the blame on this Mother you should look at the system, it is broken and broken bad. I will tell you that the office in my city you have to ask for someone who speaks English or for paper work that is in English not the other way around. She had 18 pages plus what ever else they might want her to fill out well I can tell you the paper work here could be a tree. It took the neighbor 2 days to fill out all their paper work and some of it was to sign over any assets and this was for food stamps. The system is broke. This Mother needed help in more ways than food stamps and no one was willing to take that extra step how sad. Maybe she had already gone to the local food bank or her church and if they are like other cities they are also hurting and can't help many. There is to much left out of this story to know what really happened and by not looking at the whole picture you all are blaming the Mother. Look she did the wrong thing with I will agree but so did the system.

critical thinker

re: post 2.8

I agree. An 18 PAGE APPLICATION FOR FOOD STAMPS???? OUTRAGEOUS!!! When I was in the Army I had to apply for a White House Duty Access security clearance- a government form #398. THAT was only 4-5 pages long. An 18 page application for friggin food stamps is not the government trying to help- it is the government making things extremely difficult for the applicant so that the applicant gives up and the government need not help (all while trying to look good). An application for food stamps up here in Vermont is only a couple of pages long and lets people apply for more than just food stamps. I speak from personal experience because I had to fill one of those out too at one time. Texas doesn't have an application- they have a governmentally approved run-around/roadblock to recieving assistance. This woman's act was born out of desperation and despair. It most certainly wasn't because of mental illness- that is just going to be one of the excuses Texas, Texans and some individuals will use to smear this needy citizen who, when desperate for help just in simply feeding her children, was instead handed the sh/t end of a stick and told to 'Munch, it tastes good. Really!'. This was the "Party of No" and their policies in action. History can demonstrate a line of women who have killed their children in order to spare them the sufferings of hunger or worse. To denigrate or slur this woman, instead of the situation and roadblocks that were placed so as to deny her help, demonstrate the the narrow minded selfishness that was behind the creation of that 18 page application. Texas, your secret is out and your hypocrisy exposed. Never again will you have the right or ability to complain about liberal this, that or the other. At the least we make serious efforts to ensure that everyone is fed without putting an 18 page roadblock in the way of desperate and disheartened fellow citizens with hungry children. Not only that, we run our government ( Vermont anyway) so as not to be in deep, deep debt (and we don't have a single oil well either!). You could learn a lesson from us in fiscal responsibility and simple charity. What would Jesus Do? He sure as heck wouldn't put an 18 page application for food stamps in front of a hungry woman and her children. Texas..Pffft!

BTW- 18 pages of application? What did you want to know about her, what hand she wiped her a$$ with?

Txmom,

They also collapsed Peacelover's comment whichstated she was probably mentally deranged and that is also a reasonable statement as indicated by impatient girl. This is MSNBC, many people on here don't think and just want to keep every ting politically correct. PC is going to be the down fall of this country. Someone makes a harsh but true statement and the PC police come out and collapse it so it does not "upset" the cry babies...er I mean "community". Oh and I agree with your post :)

American Man...I'm not a fan of squelching free speech...particularly when it stifles more than just that one voice....I've posted under some of Peacelover's posts and it irritates me that I have to open the collapse just to follow a legitimate conversation. I personally think that life is so much messier in reality than PC allows.

Regarding the collapsing of comments. If the post is violating terms of use or obviously trolling then collapse. If they are just bothering you, then you may hide that user's from yourself by choosing "ignore" otherwise you are just censoring opinion as if you were a Cambodian dictator. Thanks.

FYI- it was probably 18 pages because it was written in English and Spanish, plus there's the instructions (step by step) of how to fill it out, and the list of the things you will need to bring with you , the application itself is only a couple of pages and MOST counties here in Texas you can apply ONLINE, just because some crazy woman who moved here from Ohio recently, killed herself and critically wounded her children, don't blame our state for it.

Gosh golly Ms. Tx, obviously you missed your calling to be THE BEST social worker in the whole wide world, as you today have had ALL the right answers in your perfect world. Awesome possum.

There are too many in this very situation across this nation. Why do you think I jumped out at everyone for coming together ONLY when a crisis situation occurs???

Tornadoes hit - People help
Hurricanes hit - People help
Floods hit - People help
Earthquakes hit - People help

National citizens homeless, no shelter, they need food - VERY FEW ARE HELPING!

Stand together united? Only when half or an entire state gets wiped out by nature - THEN everyone wants to be the 'good guy'.

Stand together to go after the true Criminals that forced everyone on this continent into the situation we now face? .... "... I'm not supporting OWS.... "

GIVE ME A BREAK.

If all of us fail OWS? You will begin to see a whole lot more than just what this article has presented.

People in your own community are feeling this crunch... not one, or two or simply a few.... MANY!

Your cushy income and comfort zone is being encroached upon at a daily rate.. not even daily - EVERY MINUTE. Prices raise and everyone keeps paying.

Keep thinking none of this will EVER affect even you or your family... time will prove even you to be incorrect.

Support OWS, GET INVOLVED... learn what can be done to correct America's improper situation.

OWS is all over the Internet and in well over 200 cities and counting. Where are you standing?

Think about how many executions Texas has every year. They lead the nation in executing people. They don't go back and test DNA to see if POSSIBLY they have to wrong person, but one has to fill out an 18 page application for food stamps. Something is very wrong.

My god, liberals have messed up priorities.

The facts of this story are: This woman couldn't be bothered to make a phone meeting to set up her food stamps, and she tried to murder her two children.

No amount of hard times is justification for trying to murder your kids. Yet you liberals try to make her out as a victim. To deny that she had mental issues is simply turning a blind eye to facts. But that's the liberal way, so I'm not surprised.

Garland did it for me.

Copied from collapsed thread...

I'm sure she had some personal issues and what she did cannot be explained from simply not getting food stamps.

That said, the current welfare systems, which vary by state, generally suck.

I had a friend that lost his job, then his home (he was renting), could not find a job (and he was legitimately looking), didn't have a dime for food, and was turned down for welfare and delayed on food stamps. By the time his pride let him make his phone call to me for a free meal, he was skeletal. Two weeks later, with my help, he got some food stamps. He has since died of cancer (unrelated to this, i guess), but he never found shelter, did not get welfare, and could not get employed because of his skeletal appearance and age.

My take is that we have plenty of hard-ass safeguards to prevent people that don't deserve the assistance from getting it... so hard-assed that people that DO need it can't get it either.... and, what, we can't give someone some temporary food stamps while they are getting approved? I guess we would need absolute documented proof that they were f'ing hungry?

It's not that we don't have the right systems is place, it's that they aren't working. That DOESN'T mean you get rid of them, it means we fund them for a change and fund the auditors to make sure they're working.

If running government CORRECTLY instead of INTO THE GROUND makes me liberal, then so be it.

Completing an 18 page document is a lot of work for free food to feed her hungry children.

Texas is notoriously stingy with benefits of ANY kind. They practically brag about it.

So to receive Texas state benefits you have to provide proof of employment and residency? Uh, so if you're applying for welfare because you're unemployed and homeless you don't qualify for welfare?

Bet if she asked for a gun permit, she would have received it in 5 days.

I hear tell that texans all pray five times a day, they lay down their saddles and sidearms facing east towards mecca (i.e. washington DC) and pray to their absolutely powerful God who gave them all their brains and talents. That God I believe they call BurroCrazy, a texas slang derivative of bureaucracy. Then they wash each other's feet in holy oil (black crude I believe). Then they celebrate by shooting off the minimum full round of ammo into the air (or wherever they happen to aim).

18 pages is a lot of work to get free food (and nothing is free!)? NO, working for you food, and to provide for those that don't work, thats a lot of hard work! And its not an 18 page essay, its filling in boxes, checking things that apply.

Should she be helped, probably.... but come on folks!!!

Also, we could create jobs that would be funded by the money it saves, if we had vigorous checks into all welfare cases. All those that are fradulant and or abused should be taken away.

Also, welfare is meant to help people help them selves, and to get people back on their feet (except for the extremely old and disabled). Welfare is NOT meant to provide for you for life, and for you to pass it down and teach generational welfare!!!
This needs to be fixed so that we can help those that truly need it!

Unfortunately, people who are hungry/starving are not able to wait about for months to 'help themselves'....something about how the human body can only go without sustenance and water for a finite period of time.....Its not just the 'extremely old and disabled' who are prone to dying if they don't have enough food.

I would say may'be God screwed up in the blueprint but then again the bible does talk about feeding the hungry, healing the sick, etc. so more likely we are the ones screwing up over this.

I'm not buying it. This woman shoots her two children because she has been denied food stamps? No, she shoots her children because she was evil.

Did the food banks also refuse to give her food? Did "Angel Ministries" refuse to give her food for her children? Did she ask? There are private groups, separate from the State comrades, that work to feed the hungry in America. For some of you who have posted showing compassion you may want to consider a Christmas or Hanukkah gift to Angel Ministries or your local food bank. Their supplies are shrinking for obvious reasons.

From FDR to LBJ the alleged "temporary" fix, as stated in Post #4.6 by Karen-1587734, has become institutionalized and a multi-generational "way-of-life." The State seems happy to have taken away any incentive. We all have hit upon hard times. The State also seems pleased to have replaced the love of neighbor and the past work of our nation's churches.

Do you really want to be dependent upon The State or The Federal Government for your shelter and your food? I think there are only four states in our Nation who are able to balance their books. The other 46 are running in the red, some deep in debt, and dependent on the Federal Government for money. How many Trillion is the Federal Government in debt now? 15 T. and counting? The day will soon come, and it will probably be on the 200th birthday of Charles Dickens, ( food for a true story Chuck), that the food stamp giver will not be able to fork over the stamps. What will people who are dependent upon them all do? Shoot their children and then blow their own brains out? No, they will first watch the food stamp giver jump from her window to the pavement as she is now out of a job.

What's the difference between "evil" and mentally unstable?

Thats the problem, that long speech and all we needed to do was feed a family of three.

Don't mess with Texas

MrCool "From FDR to LBJ the alleged "temporary" fix, as stated in Post #4.6 by Karen-1587734, has become institutionalized and a multi-generational "way-of-life."

for some people, not everyone.

and even then, when we break down the demographics we can see area's in which those people USED to work jobs, but that work doesnt exist anymore. we shipped our manufacturing overseas, there is no hard labor work for the less than college educated person - at a decent livable wage. and the work isnt coming back.

you take away the assistance and dont replace it with good jobs...it's a recipe for a civil war.

I could go down another path, about the fact money isnt real...it's merely a tool. there's plenty of work to do, there's just no "money" to pay anyone to do it...but thats a philosophical discussion, and way over most peoples heads. when you believe money is real and finite, you cant see anything else.

"The State seems happy to have taken away any incentive. We all have hit upon hard times. The State also seems pleased to have replaced the love of neighbor and the past work of our nation's churches."

the reality is, LOVE OF NEIGHBOR never existed unless your neighbor looked, talked and walked just like you.

as for the churches, they have plenty of money...they chose to build massive megachurches that are pretty and impressive, and pay their megachurch pastors millions...rather than do what their actual job is...help the needy, feed the hungry, give shelter to the homeless. i'm not saying no churches do these good works, im saying the richest ones (just like the richest americans) dont...you can see where their money went, and it wasnt into the community around them.

it's not the govts fault that churches suck at their only job. the govt HAS to help people because americans, especially christians...are not so christianly after all.

If she was an illegal in California, she would have had food stamps, insurance, housing and a Coach handbag

God bless those kids. I hope they will be ok. : (

Did a person really ask "what is the difference in Evil and mentally unstable?" Are you serious???? There is a HUGE difference in being Evil and mentally unstable. I can't believe someone actually asked that question.

. Did you consider untreated mental illness?

Ye she managed to get a gun. She was also the source of education for these kids? that would have turned out well. One of the biggest problems in this country are all these people just chomping at the bit to give everything away. she might very well have needed it. ?But it's not too much to ask to be able to justify it. Why not just give EVERYONE food stamps? I've love to get a few hundred a week to offset my food costs.

If she wasn't capable of filling out the forms that apparently hundreds of thousands manage to do yearly, she probably wasn't able to care for the kids much less home school them. What kind of system do we have when unstable individuals are the sole source of children's education? No wonder we have so many illiterate kids growing up today.

If she was that desperate, she would have had documents from Ohio to be passed on. the requirements aren't that much different state to state. In fact, could she function at any level?

Hell, at least pawn the gun.

It was satirical the response was to a statement that was collapsed.

don`t know if i have met evil people,but people with an unstable grasp on reality can act really evil.

In Texas.... can't get food stamps, plenty of oil wells ( those that haven't dried up as yet.. ) and HEY, plenty of cattle on the farms... she could have shot one of the herd and fed twenty kids!

OH.. yeah, you gotta PAY for that at the grocery store - or go to jail for trying to feed your hungry kids.

Then there always is that notorious... city/state hunting permit...........

Just reading a few of the comments

You know....when you think of it, think of the money that goes to the movie industry every time we buy a ticket (ie certain movies make more millions than others). Most people who complain are walking around with all of their WANTED (NOT necessarily needed) goodies

We give money to reelection campaigns (doesn't Mr. Obama have almost 1 BILLION in his war chest?) that certainly could help families in need. We also pay for a 17 day vacation since this really is not a "vacation" with staff climbing every wall.

You're right....something IS amuck here.

I agree with "Hockey Girl", if they can raise so much money to campaign, why do we need to pay taxes?

Please don't forget the 1 Billion Dollars A DAY we spend on waging useless wars, and the 7.77 TRILLION DOLLARS in corporate welfare to bail out banks. In fact, as I read it, banks were strong-armed into taking bailout money whether they wanted to or not. I wonder if their CEO's had to fill out 18 page personal disclosure forms as well.

lord shado....agree'd

hockeygirl.....the point is we give billions away every year to support other countries...when the money could and should be used here, at home, to get our country right. If those billions were spent here to support our crumbling infrastructure there wouldn't be a need for so much welfare. Thats not to say this wouldn't have happened anyway....there seems to be a good bit of this story missing...perhaps mom was troubled beyond simple assistance...we don't know...but shado did make a valid point.

Shado did make a valid point......but he failed to mention all the other countried being handed money.....and IF Mr Obama were sincere in being "fair"( as he continued to mention over and over again in his speach yesterday) he would spend more time looking to right the wrongs of all broken systems rather than campaigning and blaming.....

And you speak of infrastructure. Are your talking about bridges and roads? There's more to life that bridges and roads. I drive (don't fly) everywhere and the roads seem pretty good to me. If you're talking about the jobs "infrastructure" could provide........what about women and people who aren't able to to that heavy kind of work (you know, the kind where they can take a break in their truck to smoke pot and drink)? Where are the jobs for anyone who doesn't work in the Union?

hockey girl - what about the trillions that GW Bush and company gave away? Are you saying only Obama does this? What about GW vacations? You know, the Republican President who took more vacations than any President in history? What about him?

Geez, you guys always turn everything into an Obama hate fest...Do you really think the President is responsible for all the troubles in this country... if so you have been wearing your Fox/GOP/TP blinders for way too long and only have the narrowest view of what's actually happened and is still happening. If you've never seen your children hungry, really hungry and had to tell them there is no food to eat and that you don't know where the next meal is coming from, then you have no right to judge this woman. If you've never experienced that kind of desperation, then you simply are not qualified to judge. I'm not agreeing with her but it was obviously a very desperate act...a person with no hope...no where to turn. People are starving in the streets and the politicians are playing politics, so out of touch with this, and the common man that they simply turn a blind eye to it....to them its colatoral damage in the war to secure the power and money they want... People truly needing help in these times should be given help... American neighbors help each other. This is just too sad and you people are talking politics...

Tim

Read my post!!! Now listen carefully......I said I complain about both.

Next....just what have you done lately...soup kitchens?...fixing full meals for needy family?....how about saving your change all year long and dropping the can filled with money on doorstep of someone you know (You must know someone if you're bring up the subject). Buy someone in the street a meal?

I've done all that and plan to spend Christmas at local soup kitchen....

Don't malign someone you don't know, don't know who they voted for....don't know anything about them.

I need to go to work. At 65 I started my own business with $50. Igive time and money to my whole community. Needless to say you're pontificating to the wrong person!

You can politicise hunger and misery if you want and point to Obama with 1 billion in campaign funds but we all know it is the economy and Obama didn't cause that. Bush II has over 1 billion in his accounts along with too many others and not paying a fair share of tax which would help support the poorest by creating jobs and bringing the economy back faster. People will stop blaming Bush II for his destruction to America when that destruction is over. Then he will just fade into memory as the biggest idiot and greediest president we ever had. In Florida we have a saying. "You forget about the last hurricane after all repairs are made and go a couple of years without one." I think that applies to Bush II also. We should give Obama credit he is doing well getting us out of the Bush II depression and America is starting to feel better about itself. According to economical and other reports, but if you live in a hole you wouldn't know.

The original poster has forgotten an important lesson from history: never include racism as part of the basis of an argument. Hitler learned that one the hard way. Even his dog had to pay for that mistake.

The argument that we spend more emotional capital on the starving in other countries then our own is valid enough. So, vote democrat across the board. A comfortable 65 to 70 votes in the senate and 3/4 of the house, and we can actually pass some laws that help the poor in this country, instead of propping up the oil countries that make our millionaires into billionaires.

Shado--billions of dollars are spent each year in the United States for the care and comfort of the illegal immigrants that come across the border and suck the life's blood out of the American taxpayer. If we refused services to them, I assure you they would go back to their native land and our states would be able to support the needy legal citizens without any problem. Now, because our politicians will never refuse an illegal anything (God forbid you piss off the Latino community and lose the vote), states will always be struggling, so that is not the answer.

The answer is whenever one fills out a form for assistance, be sure to put a "z" at the end of your surname. That way, you'll never be denied for any reason, never mind for not filling out the forms correctly. They always fill their forms out correctly because the taxpayer pays for bi-lingual administrative help to make sure of it. Pitiful, pitiful, pitiful. Oh, and for those who may wish to call me hateful, racist, etc., because of what I've written, go ahead, I don't care.

and why in the H*ll do we need to give Israel 8 billion dollars when we are in need right here RIGHT NOW!! see this is the sh*te that has people royally pissed off and Im one of them!!

Lets be real, if she was of a minority, she wouldve been approved..and thats the truth. i see this everyday where im from. minus the shooting.

Desprate people do desprate things, 18 pages yet there was just a story about that couple living in a 1.2 million dollar home on our dime, I wonder if they had a problem with that 18 page application, really if they collected for that section 8 rent you can be sure they collected food stamps .....

The US threw away millions and millions of dollars just to drive out the leader of Libya. More millions to drive out the leader of Egypt. For what? Egypt is in worse shape today than it was years ago.

Yet, in the US mothers with children who really need help have to wait and fill out papers, wait and wait some more just to get food stamps to feed the children.

Just an FYI, Obama is getting ready to leave for a 17 day vacation in Hawaii. Pretty sure his two children will be very well fed, sleeping in a nice mansion.

There were other options for this mother, like the Salvation Army or churches, but it sounds like she was just driven to the brink. If she was new in town, she may not have known where else to go. Darn bureaucracy at its worst, and now those kids are not only injured, but without a mother. I'd hate to be the one to have to tell them! Let's hope the community takes care of them and they don't just slip through the cracks, the system is so broken it is more crack than anything else!

Hockey Girl, how many pucks have you been hit with,,one to many is my guess.

I think Hockey girl got hit with a hockey Puck in the head. Got to wear that Helmut Hockey Girl.

I see NO point in questioning why we pay taxes - the answer is because it's the responsible thing to do. The REAL question is WHY don't the Rich people pay their fair share? Most of them pay a lower percentage than I do, and they get away with paying none on profits they grow every year. If they paid the amount that everyone else does, these problems wouldn't exist.

Illegals are welcomed with open arms and a person who is obviously having a difficult time trying to maintain and is most likely an AMERICAN CITIZEN can not get any help. We have laws to deal with the illegals just not carried out and this person reachs the end of there rope and some of you morons on here who don't have a clue what it is to struggle throw stones not even knowing the circumstances can go F yourselves from your own pointless stupidity. This is what runs this country now, MORONS and JACKASSES!!!

YourGodinHeaven,

I see NO point in questioning why we pay taxes - the answer is because it's the responsible thing to do. The REAL question is WHY don't the Rich people pay their fair share? Most of them pay a lower percentage than I do, and they get away with paying none on profits they grow every year. If they paid the amount that everyone else does, these problems wouldn't exist.

Your statement is ridiculous. You should question everything. How do you know they pay a lower percentage? Do you know anything about the tax code? If someone of means invests in a business he is putting his capital at risk. If the business fails he loses his capital. If it succeeds he not only makes money but more than likely employs others. The reason they MAY pay a lower percentage of taxes than you do is due to the tax laws. To spur economic development the government allows for depreciation of business equipment, property, etc... This entices entrepreneurs to invest, grow a business, and employ others. You are clueless. You probably don't know the difference between capital gains and ordinary income. Your last sentence is hilarious. If they paid the amount that everybody else does it would be a lot less than they are paying now.

No, the question is why isn't the government more responsible with the money we currently pay in taxes. Blaming the rich is the lazy thinker's way out. If you have the mental capacity think about this. All of these government agencies filled with bureaucrats spending taxpayer money pell-mell on so many different programs you can't count them all. You really think that they care how or how much of your money they spend? Give me a break. Here's a clue for you. All government agencies try to spend all of their budget every year. They don't try to save a dime. Know why? Cause if they don't spend it all they'll get less next year. The head of Medicare that just quit said that 30% of funds spent through Medicare was lost due to fraud or unnecessary services. How you like them apples?

2Wylde4U #5.5,

Sad to say that we'll probably be seeing more of this as time goes on. Our various levels of governments have failed to pay attention to our rapid population growth, coupled with the reduced need for people to handle or manage tasks that are now handled by automation/computers.

http://geography.about.com/od/obtainpopulationdata/a/uspopulation.htm

Those who were given the reponsibility to monitor and evaluate the data to keep everything running smoothly have failed us miserably. Probably the largest reason for this is that the majority of politicians are always counting votes and always want as many as they can possibly get.

It's more than a little late to start, but maybe the states should call for a Constitutional Convention to significantly reduce the scope and power of our federal government. Imposing term limits would be a good starting point.

Robert-2302414

"I agree with "Hockey Girl", if they can raise so much money to campaign, why do we need to pay taxes?"

Someone please explain to me how such an inane comment gets 12 pos's (at the time I posted)? We are talking molehills vs. mountains here after all.

Svenolafson...NO! The question is why aren't people of means more responsible with the $$$ they're raking in from all those Bush tax cuts?! Just how much more do they need their taxes cut before they start investing more of it back into their business and creating good jobs, genius?!

she should have changed her name to gonzalez, walked in wearing a sombrero, faked pidgeon english...eh voila the fed coffers would have opened like sesameeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The story could have easily read"Women given parking ticket kills herself and two children". Quite frankly any number of incidents would have probably set her off. No one has bothered to determine her past history which I have no doubt was not the sanest.

We don't need to give Israel or any other country $8 billion in aid, and we certainly don't need to create $7.7 trillion out of thin air for the banking industry. Our people need help, and beyond that, they need jobs. WHERE ARE THE JOBS? Republicans, Democrats, Mr. President, anyone? I'm reminded of that old bumper sticker: "Lead, follow, or get out of the way." Time and past time for Congress and the President to follow that advice.

You mean they don't demand that a starving person prove their starving, they don't demand that you prove that you don't have a lot of money (you know, prove a negative), they actually have compassion, *OMG*, the next thing you know, I'll bet the police actually serve and protect the public. /endsarcasm.

I'm sure the Texas Dept. of Health & Human services did what it was required by law to do. However, after waiting for hours, completing an 18 page (eighteen pages!!!!) application, enduring an humilitating interview in person, I'm sure this woman had reached the end of her obviously very tenuous rope and decided that if the State of Texas couldn't feed her and her children, at least they could bury them all.

I'll bet you any money that she found sheer irony in the fact that it was probably easier for her to get a gun permit and buy a gun than it was to get enough assistance to eat. Amazing how easy it is to get a weapon which has as its sole purpose the death of a human being, yet how difficult it is to get the basic necessities of life.

Are you that stupid? It doesn't work like that fool.

My God, there's a lot of idiocy on this forum - way too many people making unsubstantiated suppositions about this woman and how this incident unfolded in order to further some personal agenda.

From what was actually in this badly-written article:

This woman applied for food stamps back in July. There is no indication that the woman acted in an irrational manner.

The article says she was denied but it sounds like that wasn't the case. She just didn't supply the required information. We don't know what info she supplied and what was missing. If the registration form was like every government form I've ever filled out, only a portion of those 18 pages would have been required. Obviously, the state HHS office can't just hand out money to anyone that asks for it.

When her application was reviewed and found to be incomplete, the office called her and scheduled an appointment, presumably to help her with what she needed. She didn't keep the appointment and the HHS was unable to contact her despite "repeated attempts".

She suddenly shows up at the HHS office with a gun and starts shooting.

It seems to me that this article is purposely intended to cloud the issue and inflame public opinion.

Just look at the headline: "Officials: Mom who shot her 2 kids was denied food stamps". From what I read, that is not true. The state workers just needed more info and had actively tried to help the woman with the requirements.

Then the first sentence of the article says: "...had for months tried unsuccessfully to qualify for food stamps...". Again, this seems to be false. According to the spokesperson, this woman had contacted the HHS office ONCE before she showed up with a gun.

It seems to me that the HHS workers made more than a reasonable effort to help this woman.

It also seems to me that whoever wrote and edited this article did so in a manner intended to obscure rather than illuminate the incident.

A very accurate post, foolishness abounds. Two more things come to my mind.

One, she didn't just walk in and start shooting...something was discussed first. What was that? Probably a denial of benefits and the reason(s) why. What were they? A Catch-22 set of reasons, the kind that make rational people want to kill someone? We'll never know now. We'll only know what HHS wants to tell us. I'm sure it won't be the truth if it incriminates them.

Which leads to number two; We will only hear what HHS has to say about this entire event (starting from July apparently). The mother is no longer able to tell HER side of the story, and I'm sure the kids don't know it all. We will get the story as HHS wishes to spin it, and you can be assured that, unless a whistleblower steps forward, there will be nothing in it that will appear unfavorable to HHS or the state of Texas. Unless, of course, you believe the government would never lie to us to save face!

There is no indication that the woman acted in an irrational manner.

You mean other than shooting herself and her two kids?

Just as thought........

"....... I brought them into this world, they've been mistreated at school, so home schooling may be better, oh, now no job, losing shelter over our heads.. get help. They keep pushing us off.. They can't provide us with decent lives - I'll take those I brought in, then myself and there will be no more worries..."

Just as thought.... what would your thoughts be? With no possible job prospects available, two mouths to feed beyond your own... no possible means of decent income to provide for a family?

You say get a job.. great now you have gas money, where's the FOOD paycheck? It takes an entire weeks paycheck to cover just rent, utilities and required expenses - ins for car, health etc.... leaving barely anything toward food - especially to cover two mouths not of working age - all from one measely pay check of $7.50 an hour.

It isn't the income, the job or the amount of pay people. It's the COST OF EVERYTHING that is causing the problems. Because people continue to pay the prices as they raise, they continue to raise them, without taking into consideration - Government assistance is affording them the ability to obtain food in many cases - but hey, they keep paying the higher prices, so let's just keep charging more and more - we can blame it all on the high cost of gas/fuel for transporting the goods.

Government has caused enough problems in many industries which only helped to force prices higher, rather than help everyone out.

More farms are needed, more homes are needed, ALL without charging three times what they used to cost just forty years ago.... yet local governments are behind the costs - charging more and more, year after year for the same piece of property that hasn't changed much in twenty or so years... yet they keep tacking the higher prices onto everyone... as they increase their very own paychecks - local governments.

Only way to send a message to them all.... just quit. The machine is broken and those still working are only allowing it to become worse. Come together to help everyone, including yourselves. Then and only then can actual change take place.

The richest sure aren't doing much, except becoming richer from forcing even your face down in the mud.

Today's society is live or die. This woman chose to die. Right or wrong.. those of wealth can no longer complain she's expecting a handout. They'll even sleep well tonight knowing another one of those low-life's went away ( as they look upon it.. ).

Rather than kill ourselves to avoid the inevitable - all of you are needed to come together to make the full and total change that our very own Government is unable to make.

It will take each and every one of you to finally take the stance - OWS already has. They can go no farther without help from the entire rest of you. Stand with OWS, THEN you can stand against the problems causing news reports such as this one.

The rest of society needs to wake up and begin by joining the fight that can put an end to all of this madness. Why do you think they bash OWS? They know what OWS is currently presenting is necessary and is the only current proper path for America to return.

Leave it as is - even you will lose all you currently own.. the rich want it all for themselves, regardless if you can or can not pay for it. They about have it already, just the few hold out still blindly following. The sector your job is in, can NOT sustain the entire nation.

Our time is now.. or change will never happen in this country. You, and those holding out can make the changes needed to provide a better country - just many are still content to bash those that already have stepped out to show their solidarity in desired change.

Many call them un-educated ( politely.. ), worthless, homeless, bums, hippies, jobless low-life's that need to go out and get a job.. or an education to get a job.

Thankfully, many have begun to learn. OWS is average, everyday people just the same as you. They have jobs ( or have held... ), they have or had homes, and they have realized all their efforts are NOT making a change in this world... but through OWS, that change stands the chance.

The chance for what everyone used to know as America, or Americans, to stand up, stop the wrongs, and begin making a whole lotta corrections in many areas to bring this country around.

Ability to stop the richest from continuing to dig even deeper and deeper into your very own pockets rest on your very own individual decision - allow this all to continue to eventually even your own income is no longer sustainable, or join those already protesting against it to help them form a better method to rid this country of the current cancer eating her from within - Corporate Control.

How many more will kill themselves, or die, from lack of Life, Liberty, and Prosperity?

You obviously have not filled out very many applications for anything during your lifetime, or you would know that out of an 18 page form, there were probably all of three pages that applied to her specific situation or required any comment from her. Also, if she was so desperate, she would have made certain that she provided all the required information in order to be approved for assistance. Sounds to me like she thought it would be as easy as going down to the local welfare/food stamp office and demanding her share of the golden goose.

Same form here in NY - may be a federally required form. Basically it's a response to taxpayer demands that nobody get something for nothing - you have to provide demographic and financial information on every aspect of your life, right down to burial funds, and the same for anyone living with you, whether they will be receiving funds or not.

13 of the 18 pages have to be filled in; the other 5 are explanations of how to do it, exceptions and legal gobbledygook. It's almost as daunting as filling out the FAFSA, and is used not just for food stamps but housing and medical assistance if needed. I do think in emergency situations as this may have been, especially with children involved, people should be given the benefit of the doubt and given a start on food stamps while the application is being completed and reviewed, within say 60 days. Sometimes it's hard to gather a lifetime's financial and identification information in short order. For many people it is an overwhelming process

She was obviously mentally unstable or she wouldn't have SHOT her KIDS over ANYTHING.

Living in America, exhausted, hungry and probably in need of medical care, shoots children and self. I understand exactly why she would do this, sadly, sometimes dying is the only answer in this country. My husband is disabled and in very bad condition but not near death..to be able to keep his medical going we are forced into abject poverty. I am not allowed to make enough money to keep the utitlities and rent paid and yet am expected to grovel in gratitude for the health care they grudgingly give him. I have thought of murder/ suicide many times...while I won't do it, it does remain a constant temptation and I'd do it at republican headquarters here in our town. It's their fault anyway. America is a cruel place if you are poor, sick or disabled, if you can get any help at all you are stripped of all dignity and the hope of ever getting ahead. The rules are set up so you can't make enough to get off assistance and assistance is not enough to live on.it's a circle and it has no happy ending for anyone caught in it.

cronewinter... hang in there... people will never understand unless they've been there. I have been on all sides: welfare, middle class and in the top 2%. Trust me, no one up here knows or understands... and I find myself questioning certain abuses still (cigarettes, kids get no Christmas gifts, yet live-in boyfriend has new truck in the duplex driveway, etc.).

We feel for you, crone, that situation sucks! I wouldn't blame just the repubs, though, the Dems have built up so many programs, put so many people on them that don't deserve it, it's hard to support everyone that truly needs it. Hang in there, hope things improve for you!

Cronewinter, you understand why this woman shoots her two children? Wow, you are all heart. I suggest you go where it is not like America to be poor, sick, or disabled. By the way, in what country is it nice to be poor, sick, or disabled in?

Yes Pedro I do..and yes I do have a heart.

Pedro, you are utterly clueless. Truly.

Cronewinter, thank you for sharing that. You are right. You are, unfortunately an example of what is wrong in this world and this country. Unempathetic people are running things, that have NEVER been where you are. I am so sorry about your situation. That is one reason I voted for our President. The man has some empathy. Most politicians....do not. Hang in there. I hope you can get some serenity in a terrible situation.

Yes, Pedro is the dictionary definition of jerkwad. I undersand you Cronewinter. I am 100% disabled from a blood clot in the brain 13 years ago this coming February. I lived to see my two youngest kids grow up and move on, and for that I'm thankful. But other than that, I DO wish I had not survived, and I'm just lingering and getting worse. I feel I'm a burden to my wife, and I should be in a nursing home (or assisted living). But we can't afford that. I went through it with my mother years ago. Because of her condition, she needed 24hr care, and since we both worked, we couldn't just take her in with us. (My father had already died) She used Medicaid. To get it, she had to give up her home, everything she owned, and out of her SS (she worked all her life) she was only allowed to keep $50.00 per month. We visited her every other day at the nursing home, and we supplied her with personal stuff and money for meals when they would bus them to restaurants or events, because $50 per month was simply ridiculous. We also took her out to eat and shopping occasionally, and had her here at home on holidays when someone would always be here with her.

It was a nice place, close to us, and where I should be now. But in order to do it, Medicaid would take everything away from my wife...our home, her income, my SSD which assists in paying the bills. The only way around it is to divorce, and put everything in her name. Still, they would take my disability away, and without that little extra, my wife would not be able to manage the mortgage and would have to sell the house. Compound that with the current economy, where the house DID have $100,000.00 in equity but is now worth less than what we owe. I have a little bit of life insurance through her work, I had major life insurance through my former job. I lost that after I was taken out of work and lived too long. Since it was with my company, COBRA was too expensive and ran out. So she would be out with nothing no matter which way we go. I really don't care what happens to me, my dignity is already gone. It's what they'll do to the one I love. It's called a Catch-22 for a reason...it was designed that way. When they're dealing with someone who has nothing left to lose, hold their loved ones hostage. I completely understand how you feel, Crone. Everyday I keep waking up is another bad day.

Dear Steel Toed Boot you made me cry..I'm sorry you feel like a burden, my husband does to and I (we,,the spouses) try so hard not to make you feel that way..we love you. I understand the fear of homelessness..I live it every day but I have no answers. Please, be well and hug your wife..she loves you.

18 pages for food stamps yet TARP was 3 pages...hmmm.seems banksters get all the money they want yet Americans starve. Tell me, where is this deficit you speak of when we give $700 billion plus another 7.7 TRILLION to banks?

Crone and Steel - You are right about the system for the disabled being inadequate, it makes me so sad, but please hang in there - you have eachother. I know someone who is disabled with MS, and I've tried to help her so her son (my kids' friend) can have relief to live his life (college student). The bureaucratic nightmare is unreal when they try to maintain their independence, and this little bird of a woman does not qualify for food stamps, as she gets a few hundred dollars a month from her ex - the one who abandoned her shortly after her dx. Primarily, she is on disability, and should probably be in assisted living, she is so disorganized (part of the advanced MS/meds). She is terrified of the nursing home idea, poor thing.

She has a regular support group, but asked me to pinch hit - what an eye-opening experience that has been. Most people just don't know what the disabled and their families face.

That includes those untreated for mental illness - surely this mother was in that category.

She definitely had some mental illness process going on. And it's really too bad she didn't turn for help to a local food bank or church or the Salvation Army. Then again, maybe they require 18 page applications, too.

I know, cronewinter, my wife has never made me feel that way. It's a kind of depression that settles in after so long, and I'm sure your husband is going through it too. I feel that I'm a burden. I'm in a wheelchair now. I allowed my drivers' license to expire when it became too dangerous to drive. Now I come up with reasons not to go anywhere (other than doctor appointments and hospital labs) because I don't want her loading and unloading my wheelchair into the car or having to push me around everywhere. I know that I would want to do it for her if the situation was reversed, and I'm reasonably sure she wants to do it for me. It's just in my mind. For instance, I wouldn't wish my current condition on anyone, and I'm sure your husband wouldn't either. Yet sometimes I wish that the situation was reversed so that I could take care of HER for a change. But then I become rational again and I realize that the only reason I feel that way is that it would make ME feel better about myself, and end up hating myself for even thinking of her in my condition.

But back on point, when I was healthy (like some of the people commenting on stories like this who can't see past the end of their noses) I couldn't see past my nose. I would look around at all that was done to make the lives of the disabled easier, and said "Wow, they've got it made here in America." Then I became one of them, and now I see it from their side. All the effort is greatly appreciated, but as far as the help you really need, it's greatly lacking, is made as difficult as possible to get, and when you DO get it, you're made to feel guilty and ashamed that you're getting it (by the government). If that isn't bad enough, then you have to read comments by a few a$$holes who have no idea what they're talking about who make you feel like a freeloader trying to milk the system. And THESE are the people who wonder why people like this woman kill. Can't see further than their noses!

Sometimes, it's even people who THINK they're doing good. I went from a cane to a walker to a wheelchair. With the cane and walker, I would come to a crosswalk and, because it took me a long time to cross the road, I'd always wait until nothing was coming for a long ways off before crossing. But drivers are conditioned when they see somebody with a cane to stop for them. I try to signal them to go ahead, but they won't. I know they think they're doing me a favor, and I appreciate that, but I just feel in the way as I shuffled across the street and held up traffic when they could have gone by, quickly got out of my way, and I would not have been in theirs. Trouble is, when I was healthy, I would have stopped too. There are even some things we CAN'T complain about, so the healthy just are unable to understand.

I made my wife cry one day not too long ago. My wife and I have been married 32 years. Feeling depressed during morning coffee, I kind of shook my head and said, "You know, it's too bad you didn't marry someone else when you were young and hot and had the chance." I thought she would laugh. At this stage of the game, I need to reevaluate what's left of my sense of humor.

When my husband lost his job last year and we applied for public assistance, our paperwork was lost twice. As the weeks rolled by after having to resubmit because of some reason or another, we became slightly frantic as we got closer to falling off the edge of everything. At one point my husband, daughter and I went into the office again and I stood in the middle of the room and had the ugly cry. You know, snot, open mouth wailing. The works. That got a manager into the room and guess what? They found my "lost" paperwork lickety split and we were processed that day.

So if I were to take a guess on the scenario that this woman experienced, in my mind it goes a little something like this:

Desperate and in need of help this woman with children she can't afford to feed goes to a place she was told could help her. She fills out the paperwork and gives her home number as the way to contact her, because she can't afford to pay for a cell phone, but she isn't home very often as she's out looking for work during the same hours that the place of aid would be phoning her. Having missed her interview and unable to reach a live person when trying to call back, she is then informed that she needs to resubmit all her paperwork again, wait two weeks, and then wait by the phone with baited breath only to have them not call on the day they said they were going to call.

Round and round she goes until, beyond frustrated she shoves a gun into her pants (because some people think guns solve problems better than ugly crying does) and takes her kids to the office, because she doesn't have anyone who can watch them for her, while she goes to get someone to listen to her and actually help. She tries to explain to the slack jawed mouth breather behind the counter what her situation is and how difficult it's been to try and actually receive aid, meanwhile her kids are starving and tired. She is given the regular lip-service and told to fill out her paperwork again and they'll get back to her in two to three weeks for another phone interview.

Tears streaming down her face she pulls the gun on the lady behind the counter and demands to have her paperwork processed and to have her interview NOW. Of course the place erupts in panic and the police are called. Seven hours of a standoff ensues and the woman is sliding further and further down into a hole she can't figure out how to climb from. No one is helping her. They just want her to go away. She sees her kids. Hungry and scared. She realizes that she can't take care of them any longer and just wants their suffering to end. So in her dark hour she points the gun at them and closes her eyes. Two loud bangs later and her babies are lying in a puddle of blood.

Suicide had not even been in her thoughts until she saw what she had done to her kids. For one brief moment, ending their lives seemed like the right thing to do to spare them the rest of the miserable years ahead, but after the deed was done, and she was faced with her decision, she couldn't live with it and turned the gun on herself.

And that's how I imagine it happened.

I have trouble agreeing with you. As a parent, you do everything in your power to provide for your children. Growing up, my dad worked long, hard hours doing manual labor- anything that came his way to provide for his family. We didn't always have everything we wanted but we never went without anything we needed. His hands prove even today how hard he works, never giving up. My husband has a good paying job and we have never worried about our kids but if my family was in that situation, both my husband and I would be out there looking for work. Suicide is not the answer, killing your kids is not anything a good parent would ever even dream of. You are siding with this awful monster, giving excuses for her. And seriously the tantrum you pulled yourself does not set a good example for your children. I am sick of people putting the blame on others for their own troubles. Don't give up, work harder, stop trying to get the government to fix everything for you and stop having kids if you can't afford to feed them.

Yes, this seems about right. Everybody asks why, because she could not go one day more! How does that song go, "The eyes of Texas are upon you..." There is a another song by Bob Dylan, "The Ballad of Hollis Brown". He killed himself, his wife, and his five children, because life turned against him, and he couldn't face one day more. Everybody, when things like this happen, point to the imperfections in the persons character, they were mentally lacking, they had no courage, they weren't smart enough to fill out an 18 page form. I've been penniless at times, in my life of sixty-five years, but never poor or without hope. I don't know what it would be like to live without hope that things will get better. But whatever the reason, in a country like ours situations like this shouldn't happen, for three or four hundred dollars a month. Food stamps are not a hand out, they are more like a hand up. "For whom the bell tolls, it tolls for thee..."

Why shoot the kids first?

Paul Harvey said it perfectly when he used the term, "Abortion, after the fact!"

When there is no hope of helping your child and the system has rejected you for what ever reason then killing them is much better than watching them slowly starve. It was an act of deep love and desperation.

It's not that she did not want them to see it happen, she wanted to protect them from further hunger and the slow living hell of hopeless poverty. It was maybe the only and last loving thing she could do for her kids.

Maybe she grew up in the foster system and had bad experiences, and did not want her children to have to go through that.

Yep Pedro we can be..and we're even worse when our kids are hungry or cold or we feel trapped or hopeless. Yes indeed, we can be a bit stubborn and bitchy.

Why not go stand in line at a soup kitchen to prevent the starving? I still don't see the shooting excusable.

The shooting isn't excusable. But neither is allowing the current economic situation to claim any more innocent victims when a parent reaches the end of his/her rope.

I do agree, but something was wrong with the mother to begin with to be able to shoot her own children. I doubt it was the economy is what's wrong wit her head, might have been a trigger at best

David, I posted that also. I can totally see a military security clearence, but an application for food stamps? WTF, only if you have no intention of letting into the program.

G

texasbob

sounds like you are a typical texican.

An application for a military security clearance?

When I was in the military, I started out with a Confidential security clearance and was upgraded to a Secret and, eventually, to a Top Secret clearance according to the work I was doing.

In all of that time, I NEVER had to fill out any paperwork. In my experience, the MILITARY decides what type of clearance you need for a given position and THEY do the investigation. They certainly don't rely on what YOU say to make the decision.

What don't you get about "There are no jobs," Texas Bob? It's so easy to say "get a job." But I bet you're also on some other threads whining about how bad unemployment is under Obama and how he isn't producing any jobs and letting the country go down the drain. So which is it? Are there jobs, or aren't there? And if there aren't (and yes, jobs for unskilled single mothers ARE extremely hard to come by, especially for minorities), then your comment is way out of line.

Why is the color of her skin relevant to your point? I am confused as to how race has anything to do with her income or her potentially ill-gotten food stamps. Please explain....

Allison, what exactly is the point or points that you feel I should take note of? I'm all about learning.

Very obvious that Allison actually had no point for you or even a relevant point for anyone. You called its bluff and once again, they came up empty.

What did being white have to do with any of this? Also seems obvious that it is Allison that has the racial hang up.

Other reports indicate she had lived in Texas previously, before she lived in Ohio. The family was originally from Lost Creek, Montana.

Maybe she moved to areas that were hiring in order to try to get a job?

Jackson and Sharpton don't help anyone unless it will help them get publicity. Look at Sharpton- he smeared sh/t and garbage all over a young teenaged girl (Tawana Brawley) and then accused 2 innocent white police officers of doing it to stir up racial hatred. A real piece of sh/t he is. I won't even get into Jackson waving MLKs bloody shirt around for support.

Why don't you turn in that person, Pepa? Her husband is probably doing some creative, yet illegal, accounting practices.

Pepa, your telling me that you KNOW of a welfare fraud case and you haven't reported it? What a true American you've turned out NOT to be! Even though all polititian's want to call this period in time a "recession" it's actually a depression, a lot of our fellow countrymen need help who have never needed it before. So what's the Real reason you haven't turned them in? Do you think your brave enough to go back the MSNBC'S front page and read the article about the welfare fraud couple living in a 1.2 million dollar house? I certainly hope that you do, afterward's then respond to me, nothing like a "healthy" debate.

Hope to hear from you soon Pepa!

Fisrt I have been moving to Utica, NY back to the year of 2003. I could not find a job for the first 2 years, in the mean time I was applied just for the Medicate for my kids only, not for my self or my wife, they denied because I own a house and car. Did you know what they tell me? Sell my car and my house first !!! This was from the welfare employees at Utica, NY office.

There is a woman here in Maine that has two "Food stamp" cards. She drives a Dodge RAM, used to be a Cadillac Escalade. Her boyfriend has a very profitable construction business. She is white, so race has nothing to do with it. It is people that no how to game the system.

Robert,Just like I asked Pepa, when are you going to report this person that you say is a welfare fraud? That's the problem, people like you & Pepa "claim" to know of but have not done anything to report this. And you 2 can only complain, there are families who are in need for the very 1st time.

then turn in the cheat instead of cutting help to those who need it. For every cheat there are thousands just trying to live.

Several years ago I ended up in a terrible medical situation that happened suddenly. I went to DCF (Dept of Children and Family) to inquire about getting some help. I'm a very independent woman that has always done everything for and by myself, I've never asked for help from anyone for any reason, I always depended on myself. I went to DCF with my tail between my legs to ask for some help. I was given paperwork to fill out and I answered each question honestly, especially the part about if I had any money in a savings account (I had a little). The woman read my honest answer and she laughed in my face, said I will NOT get ANY type of help because I had a few bucks in my savings account. Furthermore she told me not to bother applying for ANY type of help as I will be turned down immediately. Talk about being kicked when you're down! That whole experience left a terrible taste in my mouth!! I still have my medical situation to contend with (and will for the rest of my life) but thankfully now I am making it, without the help I was originally asking for. I understand how people feel, getting frustrated, feeling humiliated, shamed, while another person walks in the office demanding to have their welfare transferred from another state to here because they just moved. An experience I will never forget!!

" The children, a 10-year-old boy and a 12-year-old girl named Ramie and Timothy, remained in critical condition on Tuesday. "

What is also appalling is the horrible quality of the English in this article. Is the girl's name Ramie and Timothy?

Not all pages apply to everyone seeking assistance. You have to identify those in your household, etc. , like the census. Granted, a private sector company would probably be able to cut it in half. Considering it is the U.S. government, 18 pages is a breeze!

Cullerco, the food stam application was strictly a local texas thing. Which is entirely what the repulithugs are trying to do, make things SOOOOO complicated that nobody will use it, all the while decrying goverment being TOOOOO big and intrusive.

GOP = Greed Over People

G

It's 18 pages in NY too, 13 of which need to be completed. The same form can be used for food stamps as well as housing, HEAP, etc. but you still have to supply all of the financial information and demographics (for yourself and anyone of any age living with you.) You need documentation to prove identity (e.g. birth certificate) marital status, children's births, parental ID, any support sources, tax returns and income resources in every category imaginable, location (e.g. utility bill, mail with current address), etc. At least in NYS once you have certfied for benefits you can recertify by phone.

GOP = Jobs over poverty. Some of you just want to keep people dependant on your welfare, so you can better control them. People with job that earn their own way in life and don't depend on other tend to think for themselves as well.

"Lets see...Texas... one page application for gun permit..."

*Because they are over run by illegals and drug runners.

"10 pages to vote..."

* Because they are over run by illegals and drug runners.

"18 pages to get food stamps..."

* Because they are over run by illegals and drug runners.

Need we say more about our government and it's immigration policies?

Kevin....I think that is saying that those who actually apply to register their guns are more honest than those who will lie to receive benefits...

What you are neglecting to acknowledge is that there are also many questions on the Food assistance form that will lead to other forms of assistance, particularly for children. They will automatically flag these applications for the CHIP program...free and reduced lunch...low and no cost day care...public housing assistance etc...

You really don't consider much beyond your own agenda or point do you?

not fair twisted... there were many illegal irish 150 years ago. I'd say the immigration policies are tough, they deport those who are illegal when found.

Let's see... Texas.... one page application for gun permit.... 10 pages to vote.... 18 pages to get food stamps....

Texas... please join the human race

Janellect, that is not even close to the truth.

150 years ago, any European entering America went through Ellis Island and was processed, examined, and either allowed in or sent back. That was in accordance with the LAW at the time.

Nowdays, when an illegal is found, they are usually given a date for a hearing and RELEASED. Of course, the great majority don't show up for the hearing. IF they are caught again, there are numerous scams to delay and, in many cases, avoid deportation.

We are all immigrants...if you think about it.

Diver, I part American Indian, part original settler (300+ years) and part recent immigrant. If we knew everyone's story on a personal level, we might be a little more open minded.

I quickly noticed that when you have no real response of any magnitude, you quickly resort to name calling. Why does the mear mention of self-reliance bother you? Are you one of the many able bodied people unwilling to work for a living? Self-reliance is not an outdated concept. If you are not teaching your children how to be both compassionate and self-reliant, you are not doing them justice. It is people that do this that are raising a whole generation of non-performing, dysfunctional, lazy, government assisted living welfare recipients. I am very proud to be self-reliant. I am also thankful to the God above that I was blessed with good health, and raised by good parents that taught me to be compasionate and independent. I make no appologies for people with lesser work ethics though.

No apology needed and remember: pulling a gun will solve all problems.

I so understand..sometimes a whole state just feels wrong. Texas is one of those places..maybe something in the oil fumes just kills the compassion..who knows..they are evil down there.

[from another post] one page application for gun permit....10 pages to vote....18 pages to get food stamps....

Our country would be much better off without this state. I hope that if they ever DO secede no one in D.C. makes any effort to stop them. The only pride this state seems to take in itself is pride in it's ignorance and corruption.

I hope that if they ever DO secede no one in D.C. makes any effort to stop them.

Although your wish is uninformed the benefit from seceding would be immigration laws...The state could easily deny public assistance to those folks who wish to cruise from state to state in order to game the public assistance system.

I wonder if this woman bothered to register her gun or apply for a carry permit?Maybe it was just too darn long to keep her attention.

Please be done for the day. I read your rants about Republicans and religion. Sounds to me like you are just a hateful pos.

As for the rest of the Texas haters- f you. We are supposed to be one nation, but liberals and Obama make sure that doesn't happen.

The woman was obviously suffering a mental condition. And somehow the liberals turn it into a Republican bashing. So much for the party of tolerance. What a joke.

Grif999,

Both sides do the same thing....both sides. Everytime I get on here, wouldn't matter if the article was about toads and warts, somehow it would be the PRESIDENTS fault. Happens everytime. Everday.

And the article clearly states she RECENTLY moved here from Ohio.

Charles I am very sympathetic to this situation,I just believe that the great overwhelming majority of suicides are due to a mental affliction. Very very sad,what would make you think otherwise? Of course if the woman was in her right mind would she attempt to murder her own children? Even if she ended up homeless she could put them in foster care.

Charles - there are now about 60 Million people receiving public assistance to some degree. 59,999,999 did not take a gun to the welfare office and shoot their kids because they didn't understand the forms. Peace has a reasonable argument that she had a problem beyond the forms.

no stress - nothing says she didn't understand the forms. She was desperate and beyond frustrated with not being able to get help for her kids since JULY. It should NOT take 6 months to get help. And IF she had problems understanding the forms she should have been given help from Texas social services or a volunteer organization in completing the forms correctly and in full long before she got to this point. Clearly it is easier to buy a gun in Texas than get food stamps to feed your kids.

Must apologize for any double posts I keep getting error messages,and am now running a scan.{so sorry}

Floretta....if you read the article it clearly stated thay they had tried repeatedly to contact her and could not get a response...her application was on hold because SHE failed to bring all the needed documentation that was required.

Don't try and lump this in with buying a gun.....thats just assinine and makes you look pathetic for trying to use this tragedy as a soapbox for your political opinions.

I agree with you. I never had to apply for food stamps but when i was fresh out of college and needed some assistance from the government pertaining to supplemental health insurance because i was working at a job where our health insurance literally paid for no coverage(i might as well not have had it)the forms were ridiculously long and the process was frustrating. They would send me forms id fill them out and send them back and then they would send me another form and give me what felt like a threat.."if you don't fill this out and send it back in by such and such date (which would be like 2 days later or sometimes one) you will not be able to get assistance". Being a college educated person i sat there staring at these forms like why the heck do you need all this information...i need your help..just help me. And then they kept playing games with me...and switching me from one health package to another...and at this point i had become pregnant to my husband and was 8 months pregnant when they sent me a piece of mail saying my supplemental health insurance was discontinued. I lost my mind in hysteria....called crying and angry and when the person on the other end got me calmed down..they said "oh didn't some one call you and tell you that this health plan gets turned off when you apply for HIPP..and i came back with well HELL that would have been nice to know to start with. The Government assistance application process is freaking ridiculous! Getting help shouldn't be soo stressful...and the qualifications for this stuff is ridiculous... They shouldn't make it soo hard for the people in the world who are actually hard working citizens and need the help.

I also wanted to add...i do not condone buying a gun and shooting innocent children or anyone just because you are frustrated with the system. I do empathize with the frustrationbut take a deep breath and clear your head and go from there. Violence is never the answer. (not to sound like an after school special but this statement always has merit.)

I understand Charles, it's a sad thing that one must lose every smidgen of dignity and privacy to apply for assistance on any type. If the problem is medical it is apt to continue for a long time and the degradation multiplies until the self worth is totally gone. That's when the thoughts of suicide creep in and make themselves to home.

Clearly it is easier to buy a gun in Texas than get food stamps to feed your kids.

Maybe she should've used the money to buy food instead of a gun then eh?

Please someone show me where in the Constitution does it say that anyone has a right to food stamps or that I am supposed to feed your kids.

I'll show you ... right after you show us where the rest of the states are required to pay all the bills Texas keeps sending to the feds. You know that money ain't free either. It comes out of the pockets of the rest of the states.

Texas is right there with Mississippi at the Federal trough. And that is with a Republican Governor. Someone has some 'splaining to do.

Its easy to talk "Balanced Budgets" when you are at the backdoor asking for handouts.

No you won't beoweolf because the constitution does not guarantee anyone food stamp nor does it put the burden on me or anyone else to pay for someone Else's kids. Take responsibility for your self and stop depending on others for your financial welfare.

Federal law does subsidize food stamps, as well as school lunch programs (both free lunches as well as tthe costs of regular lunches), in all the states - including Texas. Texas chooses not to fund or fund at a lower rate than most other states.

So, in answer to your misguided observation. If Texas didn't participate at all, then that's their decision; however, they chose to participate and they took the Federal funding. It doesn't matter if its in the constitution... they took the money, they can provide the service. Texas also benefits, greatly, from the food / farmer subsidies, programs to grow crops, ranch - where minimum payments are set to insure minimum profits during downturns in the market.

Quit trying to portray Texas assome hermitage in the wilderness, somehow immune to the necessity of providing basics modern services and safegurads.

First my hearts go out to the family of the chldren. Second, many of you are missing the point. These are two innocent children. No matter how the mother was treated, there was no reason for her to try to take their lives. God gracious. What is happening in this country? Everyday I get on line, someone has killed their kids or their entire family. No matter how bad a situation is, it is no excuse to kill your kids or other innocent people. I had a lot of bad things happen to me when I was growing up but did not go out and kill people. If they want to c ommit suicide, fine. But they should not take innocent lives with them. It is not their fault. Also, if she had been in California, they would not have cared about her residency. She wuld have been better off there.

Like many a desperate person she was not thinking straight, I'm sure. She would not have taken herself out of this world and left the kids behind to fend for themselves. She couldn't provide for them, how could they care for themselves? I'm guessing that may have been how she felt.

guenavere you are such an innocent, what exactly do you suggest she do for them..watch them starve slowly? It's very easy to judge her but I don't see you offering a solution to her problem. She was already in the system and they were not helping. What exactly do you suggest she should have done?

they should cut the red tape in half

and double the jailtime for frauds

sold the gun /

and the food stamps office should had given her a gov funded free phone (track-assuried)

to many folks are in countrol that were taught what to think /not how to think

they should cut the red tape in half

and double the jailtime for frauds

sold the gun /

and the food stamps office should had given her a gov funded free phone (track-assuried)

to many folks are in countrol that were taught what to think /not how to think

That's absurd; her heirs get the food stamps? The mother may have been distraught, but she could have left the kids at a hospital, police station, or fire station, then gone off and did "her thing". She is a/was selfish; sounds like my mother. Very sad for the kids; hope they will be okay.

Ashamed to be one of you.