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Subscribe to RSSEDINBURG, Texas -- School officials in South Texas confined students to campus buildings and pondered erecting a cinder-block wall to block bullets from hunters on adjacent ranchland one day after two middle school boys were shot while trying out for the basketball team on an outdoor court.
It seemed the most immediate solution for a problem specific to rural schools. With no law in Texas prohibiting hunting on private land next to schools and high-powered rifles firing ammunition that could go more than a mile, school officials said a barrier seemed a good idea.
Harwell Middle School opened just this year on rural property northeast of Edinburg, which is about 50 miles northwest of Brownsville. Homes line the road approaching the school, but ranchlands covered with thickets of short trees and undergrowth stretch out to the west and the north.
"We were not aware that there was hunting on the west side of the school or that there were (hunting) leases on the west side until last night," school district Superintendent Rene Gutierrez said. A wall stretching along the back of Harwell Middle School and a neighboring elementary school and curving around to protect the middle school from the north are being considered, Gutierrez said.
Now, a chain link fence separates the campus from about 200 yards of open field, and there a tree line starts an expanse of thick scrub to the west.
The boys, ages 13 and 14, were in a parking lot that had been converted into a temporary basketball court behind Harwell when they were shot about 4:45 p.m. Monday. There were about 50 children there trying out for the team. One boy going for a layup was shot just under the right arm, and the other was shot in the back while awaiting his turn.
Earlier: Deer hunters held in middle school shooting
Four coaches immediately rushed children inside the building while other staff tended to the wounded students, Gutierrez said. Both boys underwent surgery and were listed in stable condition, he said.
Investigators were able to retrieve a bullet from one of the boys. Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino said they will check for a ballistics match with rifles taken from three men who were questioned.
Two of the men were shooting target practice about 800 yards, or nearly a half-mile, from where the boys were shot, Trevino said.
"Their initial statement leads us to believe that they were in the right line of trajectory," Trevino said.
The men were released around 2 a.m. Tuesday, but are still under investigation, he said.
A third man remained in custody Tuesday. He was trespassing on adjacent land and carrying an AR-15 assault rifle. Trevino said he was in the country illegally and could face trespassing charges in addition to his immigration violation. Investigators were still trying to pinpoint his location at the time of the shooting to determine whether he was in line with the victims.
Mike Cox, a spokesman for Texas Parks and Wildlife Department, said he was not aware of a specific law or regulation that prohibits hunting close to public buildings, such as schools or hospitals. He said it is against the law to discharge firearms within city limits or along any public road.
Trevino also said he didn't believe there was any law preventing hunting near a school.
"You're in the state of Texas and the state of Texas, like any other state in the union, has rural schools all over the country," Trevino said. "And a lot of the schools are surrounded by hunting ... Even during dove season, we get literally hundreds of calls of residents having barbecues having pellets rain upon their roof. I mean that happens every year. You've got to remember you're in rural Hidalgo County, Texas, and it is a hunting state."
However, he added, "you would seem to think also that there's some sort of personal responsibility that one has to take as a hunter or as a responsible adult."
A property owner northeast of the school had told school officials that he leased his property out to two deer hunters and that this would be the last year, Gutierrez said. That property owner advised the hunters of the school's location and told them to only shoot north, away from the campus, he said.
After speaking with school officials Tuesday morning, Esmeralda Gutierrez said she remained concerned about the safety of her son, who is in eighth grade, and other students at Harwell. Classes were held as scheduled Tuesday but with more security and counselors on campus.
Gutierrez said school officials told her that students won't be allowed outside for activities this week. Since the adjacent land is private and the hunters have permission, there's nothing school officials say they can do, she said.
"I didn't know there was hunting there. It surprised me," Gutierrez said in Spanish. "It's dangerous for the kids."
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Those Texans certainly know how to lock the barn door after the horse has been stolen. But they're also the people who blessed themselves with George W. Bush and Rick Perry in their State House.
A wall?...really?...ah how about not spending tax payers dollars for a stupid wall and NOT ALLOW HUNTING NEAR FREAKING SCHOOLS......DUHHH!!!
Or if you are going to build a wall, raise the price of hunting licenses and tax hunting rifles & ammo to pay for it!
Yeah, a wall is the answer....NOT. Close up the children in walls like a prison, free from seeing the scenery around the school, while the barbaric gun-toters shoot everything in sight. Such a great idea. Once again, the tail wagging the dog in Texas politics. I sure hope some new laws outlaw hunting on adjacent properties or within so much range of a school. If they can pass laws to keep sex offenders away, why not laws to keep hunters away from schools too? Just as dangerous.
Or how about not building a school in the middle of an established hunting area? Did ya think of that? Obviously the city planners didn't either.
Because hunting is so much more important that the education of children in the rural areas.
Bill from Oregon: I have no issues with hunting, but schools DO come first. People don't HAVE to hunt; children DO have to attend school in a no-shooting zone.
That's absolutely right. I live in Edinburg, and those ranch lands have been there for years. The only reason why the school district decided to build the school out there is because the land was donated to them. Everyone in this community knows that out there there is nothing but ranchlands used for hunting. For the superintendent to say that he was unaware that the proximity of those lands were so close to the school is absolutely untrue. This school district is always trying to pinch and spend less, and look what it led to. Maybe the superintendent should donate some of his $200,000 a year paycheck to those kids who were unjustly injured for his and the school boards stupid decision.
I m all with protectin the kids from stupid gun owners...
I do question though who in the first place built a school in a hunting zone? I doubt it's a Texan...
The average Texan is armed to the teeth, but that does not mean we are irresponsible....
But at the same time startin a war with a Texan aint gonna get you anywhere....
Doc -
Those two idiots who fired their rifles without knowing where their shots were going were pretty irresponsible.
Eugene, I do agree that kids need to go to school. But would build your house in the middle of a toxic dump because you need a house?
A little common sense is what has been missed here.
If they built the school there they should of also passed the law that you can't discharge firearms there. If they didn't know better, they shouldn't be making decisions.
I am so tired of dumb shxt's making decisions and more dumb shxt's agreeing with them.
"A third man remained in custody Tuesday. He was trespassing on adjacent land and carrying an AR-15 assault rifle. Trevino said he was in the country illegally and could face trespassing charges in addition to his immigration violation. Investigators were still trying to pinpoint his location at the time of the shooting to determine whether he was in line with the victims."
Where the F did that assault rifle come from?? An Illegal immigrant with an AR-15 assault rifle within shooting range of an elementary school, wonderful. Maybe our government will enforce the fukn law now.....awww who am I kidding
It is not an assault rifle if it is in fact an AR-15.
I thought AR stood for assault rifle, but regardless:
An assault rifle is a selective fire (selectable between semi-auto and fully automatic) rifle (capable of being fired from the shoulder) that uses an intermediate cartridge and a detachable magazine
Doesn't matter if it was a 9 mm pistol, same stance on the subject.
I think you added to the end of 18.11 while I was responding. No disagreement with the final sentence of either post.
The "AR" in AR-15 refers to Armalite a division of Fairchild. Colt bought all rights and manufacturing documentation to the design in 1959.
Unless that guy was walking around with a rifle that is almost 50 years old it is not an assault rifle if it is an AR-15.
BTW we used to fight over who got stuck with the M-16s and who got to carry the M-14A1.
A AR15 can't fire full auto without being modified, a M16 can and does. No difference other than that.
I have to agree with that.
Whats on the other side of those trees and bushes? I don't know, lets shoot in that direction.
But to allow hunting close enough to a school so the kids are hit with friendly fire is pretty irresponsible too.
CYGNUS_X1, you're a moron, plain and damn simple. Hunting is NOT barbaric. Firearms are NOT barbaric. What is barbaric is your attitude. You are an intolerant a$$, a left-wing liberal communist piece of $hit. How dare you dictate to anyone what should be and what should not be. You do not have that right. Go read the US Constitution and the Bill of Rights, you apathetic butt monkey. How freaking dare you!
As far as the idiots target shooting of hunting or whatever they were doing, I highly doubt it was intentional. However, that does not excuse them in the least. One of the guiding principles of hunting and hunter safety is knowing damn well what is down range. Also knowing what the maximum effective range of your weapon and adjusting where you shoot and in what direction based upon that. The article also mentioned a 3rd shooter. who was by the way trespassing with an AR-15, who was indeed an illegal immigrant. But your sorry liberal a$$ would no doubt like to make that illegal mutt a citizen. Someone who doesn't speak English, doesn't know our laws (or much less care what our laws are). The last time I checked, you had to be a US citizen to have a firearm in this country. But then again, you feel sorry for the illegal and law-breaking POS, don't you?
Shut your mouth and open your freaking eyes before you judge ANYONE on ANYTHING
Bill from Oregon: You're right, someone should've had a brain long before now. BUT...Toxic waste dump? Bad comparison.
You build the schools where they make the most sense. If the logical/convenient place is in the middle of a hunting area, then you remove hunting privileges. Again, that should have been done long before the school was finished being built, and wasn't. But it makes a Hell of a lot more sense to make hunters drive a few more miles than the kids. So sorry if it costs a lil extra in gas.
Mike SPike, reported. I keep things civil. You showed your stripes loud and clear. Classy.
Devil's Son that may be but consider the following from quarterbore.com:
Also anything manufactured after Firearms Owners' Protection Act of May 19, 1986 would be illegal for a private citizen to own.
MrMikeSpike banned, multiple accounts with mikespike, also banned.
Don't violate #1, folks:
Specific no but there is a way to do it. Guess he needs to familiarize himself with his departments website.
Yep all they have to do is enact a city ordinance in Edinburgh that prohibits hunting, perhaps the lease property is in the city of Edinburgh but outside of the city limits thus making the discharge of the weapon legal but a city ordinance would make it illegal regardless of city limits if its a city ordinance.
but but but, you dont understand.....hunting and guns are like food, air, and water to these morons. They'll never use common sense and safety to override their guns.
This was all ranch land but some of it was donated to the school district. The poacher was hunting from local news they say the other 2 where target shooting not hunting at all. The story has changed a few times now typical valley corruption at it's finest.
Gee, ya think? Boy that should be a nice view for the kids, some nice concrete blast shields to protect them while they're out at recess...
"Mommy, why is that wall there?"
"So dumbsh*ts don't blast a hole in your sternum, dear."
Children should not have to go to school in a bunker. Responsible gun owners should support laws restricting the use of weapons within a mile of a school. That still leaves a whole lot of Texas to go shooting and hunting in.
Anita, you would think so, wouldn't you? Kind of like common sense, huh? How difficult is "Don't shoot a gun towards the school next to the field you're hunting, Scooter." But this is Texas and the right to own/shoot a gun trumps the safety of kids in a school playground. If you don't believe me, just ask Rick Perry.
" But this is Texas and the right to own/shoot a gun trumps the safety of kids in a school playground."
It trumps common sense and intelligence.
Texas. Only in texas would you have no laws that prevent shooting near a school. Maybe that is how they plan to keep unemployment down. Kill the young before their employable. Texas, you have got to love it. Deprive the working poor, kill the children, and before all else GOD bless America.
Ok ya bunch of yankee's you can stop Texas bashin already. Look we love our guns, we love to hunt and fish but above all that we love our God, our Children and our Country in that order. I am quite sure the article said the School just opened, I am betting the hunters had no idea the school was even there. Hunting is seasonal so if it wasn't there last year, I seriously doubt they'd have known it was there this year. I feel this was a civil engineering failure with the city of Edinburgh. When they built that school they should have validated all the land surrounding it. IT IS TEXAS after all they know there's lots of hunting leases out in rural area's especially south Texas good mule deer and white tail down there. I am glad both the kids lived and are recovering. However, the city of Edinburgh needs to re-evaluate their placement of the school and pass an ordinance prohibiting hunting. The hunter's aren't at fault here.
Thank you, Sir, for your explanation. Now the entire world will understand how Texans think. Truth here trumps satire!
Funny...
My, oh my. such defensiveness. Could it be that TX is the last of the true 'wild west' bastions governed by six-shooter justice?
Yep, they are. First thing I learned about hunting, several decades back, was "Know where your round is going to end up, or don't shoot"
After they're found to be negligent, the shooters should be publically flogged.
Idiots like that out in there with live ammunition is the reason I haven't hunted in 20 years .
Excuse me, Praz, but the article states quite clearly that the landowner advised the hunters of the proximity of the school:
That property owner advised the hunters of the school's location and told them to only shoot north, away from the campus, he said.
So you'd lose your bet -- the hunters absolutely knew the school was nearby, but they shot in that direction anyway. They are totally at fault.
I disagree, the hunters/target shooters are at fault for not being aware of what was down range. One of the first things you learn in Hunter Safety is exactly that. I am a hunter, I have a Hunter Safety card, I have never shot at anything where there was a risk of shooting another person, or property, or the wrong animal. These guys need to tell their story, and the illegal alien needs to be jailed for being here illegally, in possession of a firearm illegally by a criminal, who knows, he was probably the bastard that shot the kids as the property owner only gave permission to the other two yokels and told them only to shoot north.
Susan the article says that the property owner said he told them that, it doesn't mean he did. Now that a terrible accident has occured of course he'd try to save face and his ass by saying he warned them. It's possible he did warn them but you can't just assume he's telling the truth.
MikeSpike, its ok to go after the illegal, but leave the legal "hunters" alone? Once again, showing your stripes. Stay classy.
aww, @!$%#...really???
Numskulls :/
OK, so it was determined that two guys were target shooting on property 800 yards from the school and a third guy who was determined to be an illegal alien was found trespassing while carrying an AR15 (not exactly your typical hunting weapon), so why has the media called this tragic shooting of the two boys a hunting related shooting??? Perhaps the typical liberal media spin on hunting and guns? Good journalism is suppose to be about reporting things factually.
So now the school and those that govern it in typical kneejerk reaction are pondering building a concrete barrier wall to stop projectiles from entering the school zone. Hell, if that is a concern, perhaps every school in urban America should be surrounded by concrete reinforced with Kevlar to prevent stray rounds from gang members trying to off each other hitting students. Better yet, maybe we can build an electronic force field a'la Ronald Regan to prevent bullets, mortar rounds, and the occasional meteorite from taking out our little academics. Just think of the Americans that could be put to work building such a project, or perhaps we would just bankrupt the country a bit faster than the Obama administration is already working on.
Because a wall is so much cheaper, easier, and quicker a fix than banning hunting beside schools.
The land was hunting land before the school was built there. Why should government be allow to locate a school near hunting land?
I live next door to a school on a small farm. I have to be careful where I shoot and I do not aim South where the school is. My house was built about 1918 by my grandfather. I believe he was there before the school was even dreamed of.
Are they getting "game plans" from Arizona?
Got a problem? Build a wall!
Just outfit the kids playing outside with Kevlar helmets and flak vests. Problem solved.
Just what Texas needs, ANOTHER WALL!
So you can't have a drink in a bar next to a school but you can fire a high-powered rifle onto school property? Yeah, makes perfect sense.
In Chicago they bring the high-powered riffles to school!
Ya think? Ya think a barrier between bullets and schoolkids is a good idea do ya??
Hey I'm for arming the kids..
Ok, how about the ranch owner take some responsibility and stop allowing hunting on his property? Isnt the fact that two kids were shot something that would make most people with a concious go "Hmm maybe this isnt a good idea."? Sorry, not anti gun by a long shot, but this is radiating stupidity from the loudest speaker around. The schools idea isnt bad, just goes along with the mentality that "the easiest way is never confrontational". That is not always true, confrontations have to be made. Stand up for your students, and their right to have an educational experience free from fear or harm.
I have zero problem with hunting on public or private lands. But If you don't know where your bullets are going, you have no business shooting. Period.
It's Texas afterall. Why don't we just arm every child in school and let them shoot back?
That should be easy to do. In TX you can pack a gun at age 3 (or is it 6 months?) so even pre-schoolers will be able to protect themselves.
Only here in Texas. Sure lets arm the students and then have to build the wall anyway to protect the surrounding property owners and hunters from the armed teenagers.
On a serious note, this is sad. While I agree that the hunters do need to be held accountable (know what is beyond your target in case you miss) I also think that the school officials, and city/county officials need to be held accountable. They all knew this to be hunting territory and yet they build a school? Without putting safety measures into place? Something wrong with that.
Those poor kids are going to feel like they are in jail. This is BS. They need to pass an emergency ruling banning and revoking hunting near that school. Shouldn't the kids safety get priority over the hunters' privileges?? I thought there was such a thing as public safety.
Irresponsible rednecks. They should be the ones to stop hunting.
TX needs another compound built to keep all their wannabe politicians locked up so the rest of us don't have to suffer.
And who is going to pay to have the barrier built? Landowners, hunters who cannot seem to exxcercise common sense-oh wait this is Texas, just listen to the blather of its governor-no common sense-or the tax payer. Take a guess.