Also, an article yesterday had many more details. Students told the police that Gonzalez was running around waving his gun which looked completely real. One student could also be heard in the recording telling police that Gonzalez said he was "ready to die!" Clearly he is old enough to understand the terror this would cause, especially in the wake of so many other school shootings. He knew what he was doing and knew what the consequences were! And as for the parents- sorry for your loss, but these officers did not use unnecessary force. When the suspect aimed his gun at police, he was at a distance which would not have allowed the use of anything else like a taser. Additionally, when a suspect aims a gun and can fire in a split second, police are not supposed to wait until they are fired upon to take that suspect out.

Why is it that the parents are trying to blame everyone else. Maybe it is because they know that they are partly responsible for what happened since they did not teach their son not to bring firearms of any kind to school. Police will not attempt to use a TASER on someone holding a firearm because the muscle contractions caused by the electrical jolt from the TASER would almost certainly lead to the weapon the person is holding being discharged. This would put anyone in the area in extreme danger of being shot.

I am sick of the media trying to make people feel sorry for this kid and his family. What happened was a direct result of the actions of the kid and an indirect result of the poor parenting on the part of his mother and father. I do not wish to see anyone killed if it can be avoided, but in this case I have no sympathy. The police did what was necessary to protect everyone else in that school building. These parents who are crying that lethal force was not necessary would be the first ones suing the police department if the police had tried to disarm a suspect instead of taking him down and their child had been shot. There are some things in life that are fairly certain. One of those things is that if you point a weapon at police officers endangering them and nearby civilians while refusing their directions to drop the weapon, they are going to shoot you. The fact that this turned out to be a pellet gun is immaterial. Under the circumstances, there was no way the police could tell that it was not a regular firearm. Pictures of the weapon posted with other articles show just how much like a regular firearm this pellet gun looked. Also, depending on the model of pellet gun and where someone is hit, they can be lethal. The police acted appropriately and entirely within guidelines and their training when they shot this kid. Had they not taken him down and this kid had fired and killed someone, these same people who are now saying that they did not need to use deadly force would instead be blaming the cops for not taking decisive action and shooting the kid to prevent it. The only people in this entire story that I feel sorry for are the two police officers who have to spend the rest of their lives living with the fact that they had to shoot and kill a 15 year old kid. They are the true victims here, not the kid who brought a gun to school.

Totally with you "Wheels". Pointing a gun and not dropping it upon Police request - that is plain stupid. And the father of the kid makes some extremely unrealistic remarks about tazing and excessive force. BS!

If a gun is pointed at me - you die.

My brother was a State Trooper, for 28 years, he only once drew his pistol, and that was during a bar fight. The man in question came out of the bar with a gun pointed at two officers who had responded to the call, my brother being one. They told the man to drop the weapon or they would shoot. he did and lived. caring a weapon no matter what kind it is and pointed it at someone is stupid to began with. They have a split second to respond or get shot themselves. Try waking in their shoes and see what the see, then respond

I see it as suicide by cop. It's a big bad world out there.

If most of you had a gun pointed at you by someone intent on using it, you would've probably been shot.

The "point a gun at me and you die" statement, is only relevant if the person pointing the gun doesn't blast you right away, or gives you time to draw your own weapon(if you even have one on you at the time).

The article yesterday also said that the kid got shot in the back of the head plus two shots to the torso. A "real-looking" pellet gun? It looks real except for the muzzle-size, which is half the size of a .22. If you get hit in the eye a pellet can put your eye out, but if it hits you in the leg it won't cause more than a minor injury. So this kid was murdered by a cop because they couldn't tell the difference between a pellet gun and a real gun?

As I have said many times, guns can and do kill people, and even a pellet gun or a bb gun can get you killed. Why no Taser, or once the caliber had been ascertained, just rush him and knock him down? For lack of bulletproof goggles and a vest some luckless kid gets murdered at school by a member of the trigger-happy law-enforcement crowd. That is all that this kid's life was worth, not even the cost of a bulletproof vest!!!

How much is a Taser these days, $199.99? How much is a can of pepper spray or Mace? Is that all your teenager's life is worth? This case is why America needs civilian review boards to review all police-involved shootings, so maybe on down the road a little more thought and care is put into situations like these. This isn't the Wild Wild West anymore, nor the OK Corral.

There was a Cleveland cop who over a 20-year career in the 1970s and 1980s shot 9 unarmed people in the name of "law-enforcement" before he got caught using a throwdown weapon to try to cover-up his 10th murder, and after his arrest, his friends found machine guns, hollow points, hand grenades, and C4 in his house too. Another tough-guy cop gone bad.

Maybe since our national violent crime rates are down substantially since the 1970s maybe it is time to reduce police firepower, take steps, change policies, and provide training that promotes the first use of non-lethal force in most of these cases. After all, in Europe, where there are a lot less guns, and where the use of immediate lethal force by police is generally not employed, there are both a whole lot less police-involved shootings as well as a whole lot less policemen killed in the line of duty too.

Not only that, but Europe's average jail sentence is less than half of what ours is too, which allows them to spend their tax money on more-important things. Right now it is costing the American taxpayer pretty close to $200 billion yearly to keep 3 million people in jail, money that I am sure that we could find a lot of better uses for too.

The police has to balance the needs of the suspect with the needs of themselves and everyone else around. It's a huge and difficult job. When faced with a suspect that's holding a weapon and refused to respond to the officers' demands, the decision on the use of force is, for all intents and purposes, removed from them. They have to choose between one life and possibly the lives of many. In this situation, that's really no decision at all.

Old Timer- you are not paying attention. First off, it's already been stated that the distance from which the suspect was to police was too far for a taser. Also at that distance, it would be impossible to tell for certain it wasn't a real gun. Thirdly, the officers responded to a call from the principal who told them a student had a gun, and the students said he had a gun. The boy yelled out he was "willing to die." And lastly the recordings prove that the officers instructed him not once- not twice- but several times to put the gun down. They clearly did not want to have to shoot him, but he left them with absolutely no other choice when he ignored SEVERAL warnings, and proceeded to aim his weapon at the officers. "They should have rushed him and knocked him down" you say? GET REAL!

I'm still trying to figure out how shooting the kid 3 times was excessive force. If they had unloaded a magazine into him each, reloaded, then continued to fire then that's overkill. But 3 bullets is not excessive

C'mon Old Timer! You got all the answers huh, just taze him right? I am a federal agent with 24 years of experience. I have served as a member of an SRT and have made hundreds of arrests over the course of my career. This was a terrible tragedy no doubt, but one that was brought on by the student. Lord knows what caused that kid to bring a gun to school, but had it been real and had he used it on his classmates and teachers, I have no doubt that you would be typing away saying that the Police did not act fast enough. The reality is that law enforcement officers are just like you and the many people who post their thoughts in here. We have families that we want to come home to, we want to see our kids grow up, and we don't want to have to hurt (much less kill) another person. However, we are sworn to protect you and keep the peace. You are right its not the OK Corral any more, its actually worse. And please don't sit there and try to talk about a handful of law enforcement that are bad because it doesnt fly. Yes there are bad cops and they are rooted out and removed from service and sent to prison. Lastly, you are really going to pull the EU card out on us? which country is better than this one? And if so much better why arent you there? Taxes in Europe are through the roof, unemployment dwarfs ours, they suffer worse immigration problems than us, and have lost their national identities. Oh yeah, before you start calling me a conservative neo Nazi, I would tell you that I voted for Obama, Clinton (twice) and Gore.

You're right. Police can't wait to be shot to see what kind of gun is being pointed at them. The boy should have dropped the gun when told to do so. Tragic, but the officers had no other meaningful choice.

@ tony - Oh, come on, who's spouting BS now? You don't think that a person tear gassed can't randomly fire a gun? Do that around a school and see just how many kids can get wounded or killed. I'm sure every officer also carries a water cannon on their belts too. Get real. Time is of the essence in these cases. The police don't have time to check out every possible contingency to avoid bloodshed. You simply ask for too much.

tonybinca, are you for real? water cannon, tear gas, binoculars? they were at a school not a street riot! as sad as this story is, the boy had a chance to save himself and refused it. the real victims here are the 2 cops who had to respond to that call.

If the boy was unarmed and on the roof and threatening to jump they would wait for hours while trying to talk him down, but when the subject is armed there seems to be very little patience for talk, before orders to disarm are followed by deadly force, even if the subject is not in a position to harm others. This report does not indicate whether the boy was in a position to move away from the police and become a threat to other people in the building (assuming that his weapon was a real firearm) so it's hard to judge if the deadly force used by the police was necessary.

@Old Timer:

1. Guns don't kill people, people who PULL the trigger on a gun kill people...

2. I own a REGISTERED .357 Magnum Desert Eagle pistol, I also own a Desert Eagle pellet pistol. The two pistols laying side by side LOOK IDENTICAL... The only difference between the two is the barrel diameter, and even at six feet, you would NOT be able to discern the difference between the two pistols, especially when one is pointed at you in a HIGH STRESS situation...

3. No amount of "training" can teach a law enforcement officer to discern a weapon's caliber by looking at the weapon when it is pointed at them, especially when pellet pistols are made identical to the pistol they are copying.

4. It is sickening to hear the media play on the heartstrings of their readers by saying that the police "requested" that he lay his gun down.... I can assure you that they were SCREAMING, "DROP YOUR WEAPON!!" many times before they shot him... This is not a case of murder by police, but citizen protection.

My condolences go out to the child's family and to the officers that had the unfortunate duty to uphold the law and protect the other students and faculty at that school.

My wife and three of my four daughter are school teachers. When police get a call saying someone is carrying a gun on school grounds by a school official they come running. There are so many dead children and teachers shot while at school from previous shooters the police don't take chances and I for one don't want them too, it could be at my wife's or one of my daughter's school. This kid had a pellet gun that looks very much like a glock, and was waving it around at people. The police ordered him to drop it, he refused and pointed it at them, being to far away for a teaser to work, they shot him. When the police told him to drop the gun and he didn't, his fate was sealed. Sounds like suicide by cop to me. I'm sorry the kid was killed, I'm sorry for his family and friends, and I'm sorry for the cops, what a horrible thing to have to do. But I'm not sorry for the way the police followed procedure and protected the school and the teachers and students from such a perceived threat.

Robert, the difference is the threat level to others around the youth. He had what, by all accounts, was an incredibly realistic weapon. The principal and other students thought he had a real firearm. He was quoted as saying he was ready to die. He aimed a pellet pistol, which was not discernible from a real firearm, at officers. I, for one, am amazed at the restraint they used in warning him SEVERAL times to lower the weapon before firing on him. Considering the times we hear about honest-to-God instances about police brutality or overkill, where men without weapons are shot 40, 50, 60 times and the officers had to reload to get that many shots off, I fail to see what the officers did wrong here. They responded. They warned him several times to lower his weapon. He refused and aimed at them, so they fired. As soon as he went down, they stopped.

My heart, thoughts and prayers go out to the boy, his family and his community. But, there would have to be a real revelation for me to think the officers acted inappropriately.

Tonybinca, water cannon? seriously? you do know that water cannons need to be on a truck like vehicle? You want to go up against what looks like a gun with a fire hose? As far as the cops knew he had a real gun not a pellet gun. What were the supose to do wait until he made a break for a classroom full of innocent kids that did not bring weapons to school that day?

Ever heard of tear gas? Water cannon? Binoculars? $$$$ing cops are out of control thugs.

There's a reason none of those options were used. Mainly, because none of them were options.

Tear gas: Generally used by SWAT or similar tactical team which is equipped with gas masks since CS or similar compounds do not discriminate - they affect the offender, everyone in the building, and the officers who are supposed to be taking control of the situation. SWAT wasn't there, and in cases where gas is deployed, medical attention is usually required to supervise those affected and make sure they recover without complications. This would create a huge mess and would get very expensive in a school environment given the number of people in the building, so it would be a last resort.

Water cannon: In most areas, a fire hose is the 'water cannon'. May be suitable to quell a riot that's been building to a head for some time, but law enforcement officers don't carry fire hoses on their duty belts. Firefighters and paramedics only enter a scene where there is a violent crime in progress after the scene has been secured and there is no perceivable danger of the firefighters and paramedics being shot at.

Binoculars: I know officers who have them, especially deputies and others who work in more rural areas. They usually stay in the patrol car, though. Too bulky to carry in a pouch on the duty belt, which is pretty well filled up by the equipment today's officers carry. Carried around the neck, they get in the way of most routine law enforcement activities, would be a significant hindrance when chasing a suspect on foot, and would be a tremendous liability in a scuffle with a suspect. Note that most officers today no longer wear neckties on patrol, and those who do use 'break away' types. Binoculars also do not work well in low light, and every school hallway I've ever been in has been far from being 'well lit'. They're also worthless when the pulse is pounding, the adrenaline is pumping, and the user can't hold them 100% still. The suspect generally isn't going to hold completely still for examination through binoculars, either.

I doubt these officers were out of control, but I'm pretty certain they both felt considerably stressed by the weight of the situation and the mistakes they made weren't in judgement so much as they were in perception. The student with the pellet gun (not a firearm, but still a gun as it launches a projectile) was adult size (5'7" tall), was presumably acting like he had a loaded centerfire pistol in front of the officers, and may have been dressed such that he looked like an adult male armed criminal. Officers have to react to what they can see and hear when they're on the scene and there usually isn't time to ask very many questions, especially if the situation looks dangerous, like a man with a gun in a school.

Old Timer says

It looks real except for the muzzle-size, which is half the size of a .22.

Actually a BB gun barrel is .177 inch which is 80% of .22 inch not "half the size" I assume everything else in your comment was based on that error. It's been my experience that the bore of a gun looks somewhat bigger when you are staring down it.

My condolences to the officers and the parents. The kid apparently got exactly what he wanted.

@John-1964908

I enjoyed your well written bit right up until you got to the part about the EU. Your rant about how what a PoS Europe is showed how completely uneducated the average American is. I have lived in three countries in Europe and now live in the US (my home country). If the average American travelled to Europe and did so with their heads outside their rectum (which most can't seem to do), the riots would begin fairly quickly here. Is it better over there? Yes and no. Same goes for this country. This is NOT the greatest country in the world. No country is. You think it is because you were born here and have a good life here. The Tribal Shieks in Iraq think Iraq is the greatest country in the world too. Guess what, they were born there and are doing very well also. You are right that EU countries are losing nationalism. That isn't a bad thing alone and more importantly the EU is what the US would be if every state was a different culture with a different language and a different economy. No sh** they are losing identity - it is bound to happen as the world's population swells. It will happen here too - rest assured. And yes, in YOUR lifetime. High taxes? Ask someone in Switzerland (which has the highest taxes) how they feel about that. They have virtually no poverty, free healthcare, almost no unemployment and there public works is outstanding. The US can't claim any of that. Why would someone complain about high taxes in such a place? I'm sure you would but they don't. EU still has that nationalism where they want to take care of their own -- true nationalism. Nationalism here in the US is waving a flag and beating your chest about your freedoms (in arguably one of the least free countries I have ever lived in or visited). Nationalism here is being an ignorant bigot who loves his country because he grew up in the Cold War era and is thoroughly brainwashed. Immagration is a non-issue because the way it is handled there is night and day to here. It is a problem, yes, but it is dealt with. Here, we piss and moan about it but don't do anything. Again, it comes down to geography. "Immagrating" there is like driving from Jersey to NY. How many people in the US have taken a job out of state? That would require immagrating there. The numbers are skewed drastically when taken out of context in American eyes. Pretty hard to get around it. Again, population swelling is to blame more than anything. Lastly, why don't I move personally? If you don't ask some neo-nazi conservative will. I don't move because my family is here. I don't move because I don't want to see my home country collapse -- even if it has turned into a shadow of its former self in only 10 years. I went into the military to fight the GWOT. When I got out and came home -- I found the US the way it is. My country has turned into a steaming pile of corruption and greed in one decade. Patriots are morons and are the leading reason a country collapses. They refuse to accept faults. The sooner all Americans get their act together and accept how far we have fallen then the sooner we can start fixing the US. I fear it might be too late though.

1) The kid's pellet gun looked VERY real. Amazing there is no picture of it in this tragic story.

2) Cops aren't going to walk up to some crazed kid and see if it's a real Glock or a pellet gun (pellet guns don't have those orange tips like toy guns and BB guns). You can say the Columbine tragedy has changed the way kids in schools are handled when waving guns (and pointing them at cops).

3) As a concealed weapon permit gun owner, I can fully state without question that had this kid waved a gun - pellet or not - at me or my family, he'd have been shot dead right there.

4) The father obviously failed at raising his kid properly. The kid was a gangsta wannabe and you can bet in a matter of a few short years would have had his hands on a REAL gun. And God only knows what the outcome of that would have been for innocent lives.

JS in SD

The only people in this entire story that I feel sorry for are the two police officers who have to spend the rest of their lives living with the fact that they had to shoot and kill a 15 year old kid. They are the true victims here, not the kid who brought a gun to school.

I agree.

However one point you didn't make is that these police officers are also the true heroes.

Regardless of the situation after the fact, this was not a rehearsal, it was live and intense. If anyone has had to look in the eyes of an irrational and threatening person with a lethal weapon in his/her hand, you know you have literally seconds to make a decision. This poor kid had no idea what he was up against when he started his wild tirade with a firearm in his hand. He was considered a lethal threat. These police officers walked into a potentially lethal situation. Dozens of innocent children and teachers were probably within range of gunfire, the options were flying through the officers minds. The instant they, or someone else, were threatened with danger the options were significantly narrowed. This poor child had no chance at that point. The officers acted appropriately. Yes, they will live in those moments for the rest of their lives, they were involved and will remember those confusing and difficult moments forever. Unfortunately justicia is not always decided in a courtroom, sometimes it happens in the least expected place.

They will hopefully recover and realize they were correct in their action. They are heroes and should be celebrated as such.

Condolences and prayers to the family and friends of the lost student.

Obviously, all the details aren't yet available about this tragedy. It does not seem, however, as Jhawke above states, that this kid was a gangsta wannabe, but rather a sad or depressed child who somehow saw this as a way to get out of his troubled life. Did anyone think that if he'd wanted to hurt somebody - students, teachers, cops or whoever - he would have brought a real gun to school. Instead of thinking about what was going on with this student, you all are so busy saying, yeah, if it was me, I WOULD HAVE BLOWN HIS F-ING HEAD OFF. Such compassion.

P.S. This is NOT a condemnation of the police or school, just a comment about the kid. I would assume while this was going on that the other students were moved to safety (if not, why not?), so that the only ones in danger were the police. They're the ones who have to live with what they did, so I hope they were right in their decision.

boy, still cant believe the parents of this boy want JUSTICE. It has already been delivered swiftly and very effectively. As a parent, I sympathize.......but when will his parents understand that law enforcement gave an option to their son. This my friends is how many people see what they want and only care about their own, forget everyone else.....its all about OUR family.

Well considering Texas has a concealed carry law pointing a gun at someone is called terminal stupidity. I feel sorry for the family but if my kid had pointed a gun at a cop after surviving my grief I would have understood the pain the police officers will live with. I don't know what they expect to find on the video except a kid with a gun in a school full of other peoples kids who should not have been put into this position. I never had a father I also was never stupid enough to point a gun at a cop. People need to quit using broken families as an excuse because when you grow up it won't pay the bills.

I only feel sorry for the cop. I had to carry a gun during hiatian ops and during boardings of other vessels . We were taught minumum force tactics and at the end of the class the instructor always said that it is better to be Judged by 12 than carried by six. I never had to use my weapon on anyone think GOD only in the Shoot , don't shoot classes.

Tunnel vision will not get you killed in class but in real life i do not want to sit there and become some kind of toy expert if it looks deadly it just might be the kid obvisouly was looking for trouble and he found it.

A suspect holding a gun(or what looks like one), is not a proven threat, like someone who has already fired their weapon.

I can see police taking down a perp(kid or not) that is firing or has fired their weapon.

Someone brandishing a gun, still doesn't show INTENT to use it.

Semantics? Maybe, but law enforcement officers come in different calibers(no pun), and some might try taking a little risk and talking first(not just screaming at someone to drop their weapon.

It sounds likely that this kid wanted to commit suicide by police shooting.

Anyone who thinks the police over reacted is just crazy. Read the news and there are many reports of children/teenagers killing others with guns. Just think about the situation at Columbine H.S. and ask yourself again if the police over reacted.

Was the dad a gangbanger???

alwaysanother,

You make a very good point!!

The only thing I wonder is what everyone who is crying about police excessive force would say if they realized the cops could be fired for not taking the actions they did. Face it they asked numerous times for the young man to drop the weapon which is policy in almost all jurisdictions, until the perpatrator with a appearantly deadly weapon attempts to point the weapon at another human being. Then the perpatrator is to be shot. The shots are to be center mass, not to wound. Yesterdays article stated the young man was shot with rifles, so the cops that shot the young man were on overwatch. Basically snipers so, someone else gave the command to fire, also.

This was a tragic situation but not the fault of the policeman or in any way a judgement of their abilities it was entirely a case of suicide by cop, unfortunately. What I would like to find out is what drove the young man to such despair that he would state he was "ready to die." If the statements by the parents and the priest are honest then something really bad happened during the week leading up to this event. That is the stuff that needs to be investigated.

I hope ICE shows up at the funeral for a roundup. They're gonna need more than one taco wagon.

A suspect holding a gun(or what looks like one), is not a proven threat, like someone who has already fired their weapon.

Merely holding a gun in public would generally be brandishing unless the context was such that a reasonable person would not believe themselves to be in danger, such as a person examining a firearm at a sporting goods store or gun shop. Even having a holstered gun visible can be brandishing, depending on the circumstances. If you have a problem with somebody and you go knock on their door and ask to talk it over with them, it would be a very good idea NOT to be armed, especially such that they could see you were carrying a gun. A normal person seeing this would presume the purpose of the gun being present and visible was to intimidate. Brandishing is a non-specific threat, i.e.: a weapon is displayed and probably maneuvered, but not pointed at anyone in particular or employed in such a way as to constitute an assault.

If you point or aim a firearm at someone, you are committing assault with a deadly weapon. A reasonable person would be fearing greatly for their safety and/or their life at that point as all it would take to be seriously injured or killed outright would be the person aiming the gun at them to squeeze the trigger. It is most definitely a threat, and it would not be considered reasonable to wait for the person assaulting you with a gun to fire a shot at you first since that is presumed imminent at that point. It could likened to an assailant having raised a knife while standing within arms' reach of you. Are you in danger as he's about to stab you, or do you have to wait until he swings the knife down into you to say, 'Yep! I'm in danger all right!".

Is it a good thing to try to talk someone into putting a gun down before you shoot them? It depends. It is purely a judgement call on behalf of the person who is being assaulted, in this case, the police officers the young man was aiming his pellet gun at. By not shooting at him to neutralize the threat as soon as they recognized it (saw him aiming the gun at them), they were taking a significant risk, although one or both of the officers may personally have considered it to be more a leap of faith. It's also possible they were pretty sure he was aiming a gun at them but gave him an extra moment or two while they looked again to ascertain that's what they were really seeing. We just don't know. Personally, I would only try to talk someone down in a case like this if they were a family member or a good friend who had wandered down a dark path in life. I wouldn't risk it dealing with the usual thugs and lowlife law enforcement officers deal with on a day to day basis. If you're shot and killed, it's tough for those you leave behind, but they will more or less get on with life. However, you could just as easily be made a paraplegic by a handgun bullet and spend the rest of your days in a wheelchair or even end up as a quadriplegic or in a coma and spend the rest of your life bedridden, too. What do you think THAT does to your family? From everything I've ever seen, in 8 or 9 in ten cases where a criminal offender is crippled or killed, what family they have left either doesn't miss them very much or tends to forget about them in large part shortly after they're able to win a judgement in court against the municipality for wrongful death or else they find out that won't be happening. Those who lead a life of crime usually do not come from loving, caring families, which is probably what made them become criminals in the first place.

The only ones to blame for all this are the parents. Why was their eighth-grade child running around with any type of gun making threats? Why did they allow this? Where were they? They need to stop placing the blame on the police (who did what they had to do when they thought they were being mortally threatened) and anyone else. They caused this. They must take the full blame and responsibility.

the only way to deal with a child is to shoot and kill him?

give me a break.

i thought that was what rubber bullets were for. or tasers. or a stun grenade. or those things that are really loud, to the point of painful. or pepper spray.

most handguns are pretty heavy. and so see this kid 'waving' it around effortlessly, well, i would expect for some adults to have the brights to see that, and to know how to handle the situation-----without death.

sorry, but those cops are a disgrace. and should be fired and replaced immediately. but in this country the gun is king and the more the better. and anyone who crosses you should be shot on sight.

has everyone lost their senses. from where i sit, it sure seems so.

the anti abortion people are so pro gun, even in situations such as this one. if defies any logic. ''life is sacred'' except if you can shoot it to death. idiots.

So sad that this kid died, but I do agree with the police, play like a big person, suffer the results. You cant cure stupid just lower the gene pool.

most handguns are pretty heavy. and so see this kid 'waving' it around effortlessly,

There was a time when this was true.

However, that was twenty five years ago and more.

Aluminum alloys began to see use in pistol frames right after WWII; in the US Colt introduced their 27 ounce downsized .45 pistol as the Commander in 1951 and the venerable Smith and Wesson Model 10 .38 Special revolver was released in all aluminum as the 14 ounce Model 12 Airweight in 1952.

The Glock 17 appeared in the mid-80's with a polymer frame and weighing only 22 ounces. Other polymer frame service pistols have followed in the decades since, and seldom do any of them exceed 25 ounces.

Many of the old steel frame pistols and revolvers could easily reach 40 ounces in weight, and police officers and others who had to carry a sidearm in the course of their duties certainly felt it at the end of the day. With the new polymer and aluminum alloy handguns, it can become easy to forget that one is wearing them if it wasn't for bumping an elbow against them or getting them hung up on things while exiting vehicles or maneuvering through tight spaces.

A real polymer framed pistol may have weighed no more than and possibly even less than the pellet gun replica.

The Wild West is alive and well in the U.S.A. Always kill the suspect, just in case they might actually be dangerous -- then investigate whether lethal force should have been used.

Disclaimer:

The following comments are not directed to or meant to blame any individual or organization.

This is very sad. Maybe, no minority parent should buy his or her kid any fake or real weapons. Minoritycide has been and is too prevalent in our society.

Hey Paul, we dont use those things anymore. No Need. We ELIMINATE the threat through DEATH. END OF GAME!!

Jaime Gonzalez Sr. said the only thing he had left to say was "justice." Asked to explain what he meant, he said, "Justice means finding out why they shot him the way they did."

“I would have felt more satisfied knowing was a real gun,” the elder Gonzalez said, according to the Brownsville Herald. “If they would have ‘tased’ him, all this wouldn’t have happened.”

What kind of justice is this father looking for? They shot for having what was reported and looked like a gun. It sounds as if the father is going for a lawsuit. Probably one based on the fact that a minority was shot while acting a fool. God forbid the cops are white.

PAUL in chicago-1569139

the only way to deal with a child is to shoot and kill him?

give me a break.

i thought that was what rubber bullets were for. or tasers. or a stun grenade. or those things that are really loud, to the point of painful. or pepper spray.

Ghee paul in chicago. I take it you have something in common with the kid and his parents. Being in chicago and all. It would be pretty STUPID to bring a taser to a gun fight. But then you would probably like those odds being against the cops and in favor of a 15 year old with what could have very well been a real gun. The kid got what he deserved and his father and anyone who thinks the cops overreacted are the real disgrace. It's just one less thug that society has to support while sitting in prison or using the local emergency room as his private physicians office.

Maybe, no minority parent should buy his or her kid any fake or real weapons.

Any parent should think twice about buying his or her child any kind of fake or real weapon.

If it's a toy, do not forget that toys are meant to be played with, and in this case your kid will be playing with a facsimile of something that is meant to inflict injury or result in death of another person.

A person is the sum of their experiences. The experiences of a child make up a tremendous amount of the person they grow into. Do you want your child acting out criminally assaulting and/or murdering his or her playmates? This is pretty much what toy guns, toy knives, toy swords, and any other weapons are used for. A person who does this as a child can find it takes years to unlearn this behavior when they reach adulthood and are in a position where they utilize weapons. I am not a fan of toy guns.

Now, when it comes to air guns, which is what the pellet gun this young man had was, I have no problem with those whatsoever. The caveat is that even though they do not use pyrotechnic means to generate the pressure used to launch a projectile, they are still guns nevertheless. In most cases, a person under the age of 18 should not have free access to them. They need to be kept under lock and key, same as a firearm would, and when they're used, they're as a parent-child activity. Shooting is a lot of fun in its own way, but it's not necessarily fun to watch - you have to be an active participant. Kids like action. Shooting is as much action as, say, painting or photography is. Unless it's being done in a reckless or unlawful manner (as seen on television every day), it takes a mature mind to appreciate the discipline, concentration, and skill that precision shooting is all about.

Children learn through example. If their exposure to the use of guns is what they see in movies and on television and they reinforce that by acting it out with toys, they'll be on a collision course with disaster at some point and the result may be tragic, seriously disturbing, a near miss, or a close call. If their exposure to guns demonstrates to them that what they see on the screen, big or small, is not reality and that firearms are intended for serious uses and not to be taken lightly, they'll retain that, too. Young people can still be enthusiastic about that. Most everything I explored in 4-H and as a Boy Scout were serious things that could be potentially dangerous - or even deadly - if not treated seriously. Things like building fires, operating equipment, using tools, working with animals. As a 12 year old boy, I enjoyed all of those things under the guidance of knowledgeable mentors who were there to make sure I was successful in those things and that I stayed safe while doing them.

Paul in Chicago

If you were a cop would you carry rubber bullets in your gun? Point a gun at a cop and youre going to get shot, end of story.

Tazing would have caused the trigger finger to pull.

The original release of the story said he'd been shot in the back of the head. I have to admit, although I sided with the police in this case, the head wound did bother me. Now we learn that it was a laceration, most likely from hitting the floor when he went down. So there were two shots, center mass, to end the threat. Now I can't consider at all any opinions that the police did anything but what they were forced to do. The kid was entirely in the wrong.

Thank you for the appropriate words, madcitizen! Yes, it is so easy to just blame the officers. Wrong, they were in the right and something was wrong in the house of the kid that he would even think to take a gun to school.

Let's ask here what is wrong with his home and upbringing? Everybody seams to praise the kid, hmm, somebody is missing something big time.

According to the article:

"The Brownsville Herald said it has filed an open-records request with the Brownsville Police Department for a copy of the video. The department is forwarding the request to the Texas Attorney General’s Office for an opinion because the recording is part of an ongoing investigation, the newspaper said."

I wonder... how would releasing the video can possibly harm the investigation, I mean they were in grave danger right? that's why they put 3 rounds on the kid right? one of those rounds to the head the other two center mass in the chest, so the question is, what is the problem showing how threatened they felt by this boy. I mean, afer all if anything this video should only help their case, or, would it??? "To serve and protect" they should add to that to serve and protect the interest of our masters, we are and always been a tool to oppress and punish the masses and the people.

Hey Teabag, your reading comprehension must not be too high. Two to the chest and one to the head you say? Read again.

The autopsy showed the head wound was not from a gun shot but a laceration from the fall.

Shalt Not Think,

The autopsy report states the boy died from TWO shots, not three. Just do a simple search--"student shot autopsy".

And you have the nerve to call someone ignorant?

There's absolutely no point in arguing with Thou Shall Not Teabag. He obviously has a god complex ( evidenced by spewing new testaments ala "Thou Shall Not..." ) and firmly believes his own twisted B S interpretations regardless of the evidence. His icon/logo/avatar or whatever the fck it is proclaims his position on any news items coming from Fox News and his evident displeasure at 'listening' to anyone with an opinion adverse to his own. His constant denigration of anyone to the right of himself shows that his anger management has gone astray and he is having difficulty dealing with society in general. I would say he's probably a dangerous individual and in need of medical attention for a disorder called elitism, in which anyone he considers to be not as smart as he (meaning everyone to the right of him politically) should be silenced, preferrably by extermination.

Thou Shall Not Teabag, give it a rest. Your tinfoil conspiracies are giving me a headache. Have a Reich day!

TSNT suffers from pseudologia fantastica.

I agree with those who stated that however very sad & unfortunate the outcome was, resulting in the death of a teenager, WHAT WAS HE THINKING SHOWING UP WITH A PELLET GUN (or anything for that matter) "pretending" it was a real gun? Most certainly, law enforcement did not know, and by the way, depending on the distance between the teen & the police, tasing him may not have been the option.

This will hopefully serve as a lesson to anyone, teen or adult, DO NOT THREATEN ANYONE WITH A TOY GUN or the potential "victim" on the other end of the target may have a REAL gun. Is it even remotely worth it people? What was with this boy's bad & aggressive behavior, punching a kid in the nose "at random" for no reason whatsoever? Seems this kid wasn't an angel so much when his parents or pastor wasn't around. I still feel for his family, but why don't they put their energy into going to schools and teaching kids about WHY they SHOULD NOT carry toy guns instead of shouting "justice" in Spanish?

First listen what his father said at the end...that he would have felt better knowing that his kid carried a real gun not a BB gun or pellet gun...now that is really telling you something...That his own father would be happyer if his boy carried a gun in school...not trying to find out why and what made his son carry any thing to school and not comlpy with the police officer...I would have had not thought one second in not pulling a trigger at a boy or a grown person holding a gun and pointing it in my direction...End of story and life...And just think if that was a real gun...how many other's may have been hurt or even killed because of a boy and a gun...and then the COP's not shooting or pertecting the other students....That is something that his parents must think about...why were his action in school by carring a gun....and Yes every one a BB gun or a pellet gun can Kill a person or blind you if your shot in the head or eye...so it's really not a toy is it....I know this from being a Retired Detroit Police Officer....

Thou Shall Not Teabag; Obviously suffers from the mental disorder called "Liberalism"

Bazerko8-1

Thou Shall Not Teabag; Obviously suffers from the mental disorder called "Liberalism"

Actually, the correct terminology is the acronym P.W.H.U.A. which stands for "Posting With Head Up Arse".

So why NOT release the full video of the "incident"? The autopsy says the kids cut his head when he hit the floor, the ORIGINAL story says he was hot in the back of the head. Release the video, let EVERYONE see what REALLY happened.

Or are the cops afraid that they won't be shown "correctly"?

What really happened is that an IDIOT brandished a weapon and threatened. He is now DEAD where he should be along with the rest of the idiots rotting in HELL!

Thank you. Families of police officers who wait for their return every day thank you. Excessive force? They're taught to shoot to kill, not wound. Myself and my children expect their father to do whatever he can to come home safely every day.

And I support you, Suzeeq62!

Johnny - Put yourself in that situation then come back and spout off about the feelings an officer has afterward.

Johnny the cop, the kid same culture, same background, not a different race or species. All that rambo stuff is in your head. They go to the same churches, shop in the same stores,go to the same fast food joints this ain't LA. I know I live in the next town up US77

Had INS done their job, none of this would have happened,period.

"You are now dead. Thank you"

LOL!! Love that show.

Yeah, 25 cents to die - what a bargain! Lol

I can go for that idea!! I will finance it!!

Thanks for this. MSN should hire you.

dumb ass

Never trust a woman with a hyphenated last name.

it took hours to determine it was not a real gun???? that tells us something, doesn't it.

Yes, it tells us it was a very REAL looking gun

Er, or a priest giving a eulogy, just used a, to him, generic term for money. Being as how the ceremony was in Spanish and English. Whatever his faults, it is tragic that this child died. He was obviously troubled and needed help.

Way to interject your own political axe to grind into someone else's personal family tragedy...

if you are really a teacher... we can see why kids get a piss poor education and absolutely no moral or ethical examples from our schools... you should be ashamed of yourself. Judgmental bigoted scum using stereotypes to judge a kid, a kid shot in the back of the head by police.

Sorry cbawl, Moral and Ethical examples should start at home at an early age!

cbawl,

where does it say he got shot in the back of the head?

So kids that beat up others when they actually do is a stereotype. Someone threatening with a gun a gang banger, is that a stereotype? Do good kids beat up others and threaten with guns, that is not a stereotypical good kid. Fore illegals the gang bangers seem like masculine role models. Stereotypes exist for a reason as hispanics are 19X more likely than whites to be gang members.

RDSO40 Do you even have Children???? I bet NOT thank Jesus for that one. At age 40 I am still someones child guess what you are too unless you were hatched it is still speculative....

Schoolyardbrawl:

They do but once the child is in society at age 6 for kindergarden they pick up stuff from PEERS Hence PEER PRESSURE. Where you people EVER children or raise any on your own????

I lived in Puerto Rico for 2 years. The US dollar is the currency they use, but the call the dollar a peso.

CBawl- just stop it already! He was shot twice in the torso. More detailed articles such as one on yahoo state that the parents claimed he was shot in the back of the head. His autopsy confirmed the blood on the back of his head was due to an injury from falling.

Apparently you cannot read ashleyaddams. If you look real close it says "Schoolyard" not "Schoolyardbrawl". Nice try though.

Schoolyard I can read and articulate...again do you have children???

Jenlee; cbawl got that from the first release of the story. More than likely, he didn't read THIS story before commenting. Unfortunately, lots of people on these forums make comments without knowing what they're commenting on.

Also unfortunate is the media's habit of rushing a story out before they have all the facts straight, just to try to scoop their competitors. Of course they can correct it later, but as in this case, they've given all the police bashers the ammunition they need to spew their venom. And even though they correct the facts, these police bashers will continue to spread the false story as if repeating it makes it true, so that they can continue to side with the wrong-doer against the police who did what they had to do. I think I blame media = 35%, people who don't know what they're talking about = 65%.

Ashley,

Yes I do, a daughter she will be 17 in Feb. Raised her myself and she will be graduating from high school ahead of her class. Just like I did 30 years ago. Are you ok now?

ashley, schoolyard, don't make me send you to the principal's office. play nice.

what shooter??? the kid hadn't shot one bb/pellet...oh you must mean that shooter that put the bullet into the back of the kids skull....ya, that shooter is a danger to the people...as are those that gave the order to shoot a kid in the back of the head and then cover it all up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2083089/Why-shoot-the-head-Father-demands-know-police-shot-dead-son-15-took-pellet-gun-school.html

"

'Why shoot him in the back of the head?' Father demands to know why police shot dead son, 15, who took pellet gun to school"

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2083089/Why-shoot-the-head-Father-demands-know-police-shot-dead-son-15-took-pellet-gun-school.html#ixzz1inRMxeO9

Daily mail is from the UK the regular street cops can't even carry guns. They have a special swat team named Operation Trident to deal with black gun crimes though,& the shootout they had with a black illegal triggered race riots in London last summer. Without guns the regular street cops got beat up when vastly outnumbered.

cbawl. There's nothing to cover up. So what if they did shoot him in the back of the head? A gun is a gun, no matter what it shoots, especially in a school, after he was told to put it down, and stop pointing it at them. The use of deadly force is clearly evident. Did you read in the daily mail that there is video? But I'm sure you'll say the video was altered, and its all a conspiracy/cover up. You probably work for the daily mail, or some professional blogger! Your a joke just like opinion, and the daily mail....

cbawl... he was NOT shot in the back of the head.

two shots in the torso..... after he raised his weapon at police.

As a result of the gene pool police not doing their job, we have cbawl! Hmm, I see, reading does not appear to be your thing.

Here's of paragraphs from the original article published yesterday, this is to remind all the spinners from the nefarious extreme Reich were he was really shot according to the pictures taken, did you hate wingers hear that? FROM THE PICTURES!!!! TRY TO SPIN THAT ONE

His mother, Noralva Gonzalez, showed off a photo on her phone of a beaming Jaime in his drum major uniform standing with his band instructors. Then she flipped through three close-up photos she took of bullet wounds in her son's body.

"What happened was an injustice," she said angrily. "I know that my son wasn't perfect, but he was a great kid."

Jaime had gunshot wounds on his shoulder and rib cage, and one in the back of his head.

"That's the shot that bothers me the most," Jaime Gonzalez Sr. said to The Brownsville Herald.

What say you now extreme Reich spinners?

There's absolutely no point in arguing with Thou Shall Not Teabag. He obviously has a god complex ( evidenced by spewing new testaments ala "Thou Shall Not..." ) and firmly believes his own twisted B S interpretations regardless of the evidence. His icon/logo/avatar or whatever the fck it is proclaims his position on any news items coming from Fox News and his evident displeasure at 'listening' to anyone with an opinion adverse to his own. His constant denigration of anyone to the right of himself shows that his anger management has gone astray and he is having difficulty dealing with society in general. I would say he's probably a dangerous individual and in need of medical attention for a disorder called elitism, in which anyone he considers to be not as smart as he (meaning everyone to the right of him politically) should be silenced, preferrably by extermination.

Run around even pretending you have a gun, you need to get shot. The kids family sounds insane.

Wrong cbawl: From Brownsville Herald "A preliminary autopsy report on Gonzalez says the cause of death was two gunshot wounds, one in the chest and one in the abdo-men. He also had a laceration on the right side of his head, the report said."

A laceration on the right side of the head. Just making stuff up?

cbawl you're two days behind in the news nobody shot him in the back of the head head injury was a laceration. And the daily mail should stick to finding out about the dead body at Kensington it's closer to home. I'd trust the Brownsville Hearald or KRGV tv they are at least nearby. KRGV has a web site for those who can't read can get missed newscasts. They serve the local community well.

Maybe before jumping down the parents throat you need to realize that in Brownsville the school cutoff date is September 1st and that many children come into school deficient in English and get held back because of that. My kid dropped out of 9th grade at 17 and got her GED from the school system before the end of the year. If you don't pass intermediate TASS tests you don't go on. I'm not as surprised at a kid being 15 in the 8th grade. It's better than passing a kid who's not ready. It is a sad situation for all the Valley.

Sucks to be the kids, maybe their parents should think about that before they bring them here from mexico and fail to teach them ENGLISH, the common language of AMERICA

Brian, it is standard police procedure not to comprimze evidence by discussing specifics or releasing it to the media during a pending investigation. The Police Department is following correct procedure in contacting the State's Attorney General with regard to the media freedom of information request of the tape. Be sure that the tape has been reviewed by law enforcement officials that are not members of the Brownsville P.D. as a matter of investigative protocol.

Hey, I bet you think that 9/11 and the falling of the World Trade Towers was an inside job? Loosen up your tinfoil hat and you may think more clearly.

Brian123

Why would you say that? Do you hate the cops that much? For me I will wait till all the facts are in.

Before they release it, it will be edited, you'll never hear/see what actually happened until they're done with the editing and finishing their stories. Then and only then, you'll get what they want you to know about what actually happened.

I am positive you're not talking to me rds040 because I am neither an idiot, a dimwit nor live in the hills.

Not smart enough to know the video is evidence and police control evidence always. How about commentingbecauseyouhavesomethingitelligenttosay?

Brian123, you are absolutely right and it's very perceptive of you to call that to the attention of all those radical police-state nutjobs in favor of this kid getting blown away by these third reich jack booted thugs under the color of being an officer of the peace. Look at all the low intellects, people with absolutely no visionary aptitude whatsoever, attacking your comment, Brian. You've got to remember, most of those against your comments Brian are corporatists bent on the complete subjugation and seperation of America into 2 parts--1. A few thousand mega rich, and, 2. 300 million homeless desperate poor.

You are anti-justice. Maybe you could be so lucky to eat a bullit SOON

yep - and if this was some other kid, and he shot their kid because the police didn't act fair enough, they'd be shouting Justice (in Spanish!) and hiring their lawyer to sue the police for not protecting their kid. The parents are in denial - 'great kids' don't point guns at armed cops and ignore orders to drop their weapon.

I'm wondering if the parents are actually American citizens or legal immigrants at this point.

I was about to ask the same thing. What was the stressor in this kid's life that made him want to die? He might have been a good kid to his parents, but his friends and kids at school may have seen a different side to him. I remember at 15 not knowing the consequences of death...the permanence. He may have wanted to get someone "back". Maybe his parents, a girlfriend? I could be all wrong; this is just conjecture on my part. Anyway, my heart goes out to the family and friends of this young man as it does to the officers and their families of this very tragic incident.

Sucked to be him. Maybe he should have grown a pair of balls!

.."and was thus shot in the back of the head by the police!"

Cbawl you keep preaching that he was shot in the back of the head. Read the whole story from the link you put in your post. It says he was shot twice in the body. Wonder what you would do if someone was pointing a gun at you, You will never know because you would rather hide behind your computer and criticize others for stuff you know nothing about.

First there is no confermation a bullet hit him in the head. it says there is a laceration on the side of his head. cop's rightfully are taught to shoot 2 to the chest 1 to the head. so are the military.

second a BB gun is NOT a toy, it is in fact a leathal weapon. some BB guns are as powerful as a 22. I have used BB guns for hunting for years. the cops had now way of knowing nor does it matter that it was a BB gun. BB guns can look very real. they come in 22 caliber as well as 17 caliber. now you look at that and you might think its a toy, but the little 17 HMR packs a hell of a wallop.

The taser is never an option in a gun fight.

@cbawl...stop with anti-police drivel. Have you seen what this pellet gun looked like? Very hard to distinguish from a real weapon. Especially in that situation. The manufacturer states it is as close to looking like the real thing as possible. Were the police supposed to call a time-out, inspect the weapon, give it back and then say "time in, now we can tase him"? He either drops it as told or he gets shot. He made the call. Not the police.

Go bawl someplace else.

cbawl should quit reading two day old newpaper articles from another country. I suggest KRGV.com or KGBT.com the two Valley TV stations I don't know if XHRIO has a website but you could try that one too. Also there is the Brownsville Herald or the Valley Morning Star both from the same county as the incident. You might actually get some up to the minute news not colored by bias.

yea cops traveled back thru time and faked the phone call to the cops saying the kid has a gun.

mike, you call it neutralize the threat.

why try to dress it up?

you would just shoot to kill the child. and you have no other options, huh? just one. a bullet. sad. beyond sad that anyone thinks that way.

Because neutralize is all anyone is after. If the suspect drops the gun before dieing, the police stop shooting and call for medical help. They don't step up and finish off the suspect.

There is not much question, the kid dropped the gun when the FIRST bullet hit him...did the cops stop shooting and call for medical help...NO...did they finish off the suspect...YES...your comment states what should have happened but it is sooooo far from reality.

@ Today - Really you're blowing smoke. Most likely both officer shot at the same time. (Within a sec of each other.) Show me where they stepped up and finished him off. You're dreaming if you think that the split second a bullet hits the suspect reacts and either dies or drops a gun. Hollywood isn't real life.

Both the Strasbourg tests and the Sanow & Marshall study shows that barring a Brain or central nervous system shot, it takes around 4 seconds - best case - to incapacitate someone. You don't wait around to find out if the first bullet is going to do the job. Not if you expect to continue going home to your family. You do hope your shots throw the suspect off balance or stuns them enough to prevent them from getting any shots off until they are incapacitated.

There is not magic bullet or special technique that says you can wound a suspect every time without danger to anyone else around. Just the opposite really.

You are simply wrong and just plain foolish...I refuse to respond...you don't deserve it.

No shot to the back of his head. The Paramedics said that was a cut from him falling, Don't be a moron.

cbawl, there was no shot to the back of the head. That was the media twisting the story. It was later found out that it was a laceration to the head, probably from the fall. No one is twisting the story now, it was twisted from the begining.

With a high powered gun you can have a hole in the front of the head and the back for the cost of one bullet. In fact the exit wound will usually be bigger

cbawl: When you IQ hits 50, I advise you to sell.

@ED LMFAO!!!

Hey Cbawl,

6th paragraph down on your link: "Despite his anger, Brownsville interim Police Chief Orlando Rodriquez said the preliminary autopsy report showed the boy was not shot in the back of the head."

Read more: #ixzz1insJvEmp

Also just FYI: If he was shot in the back of the head with an assault rifle (usually a AR/M16 .223cal) there would not be an open casket because the exit wound would have destroyed his skull.

How ignorant can you be to post a link to an article that proves your comments invalid?

My I am a police survivor. My father was shot 21 times in 1978 with an M16, I know those ballistics charts very well.

You sir/madame are an idiot!

hey cbawl quit yer bawling, THERE IS NO THIRD BULLET HOLE, and there is no grassy knoll shooter either!

i agree with the other guy cbawl is not intelligent

Yes cbawl, he was shot in the back of the head with an assault rifle. Wow, how can people be so ignorant these days. They wouldn't be having an open casket funeral if he was shot in the back of head, as you put it, with an assualt rifle. Ballistics and what a bullet can do to the human body seems to be too much for some to understand.

Don't trust msnbc then read web sites from the local area. Heck we've got 3 english tv stations and 1 spanish the Brownsville Herald prints an edition in english and one in spanish and you could try the Valley Morning Star 30 miles down the road in Harlingen. I'm sure they all covered the story not just the day it happened but everyday. I know y'all think we're stupid here in Texas but we're not we can read and all that.

Who cares where he was shot. He threatened the security of a school and community!! Sucks to be him

You mean like the15 year old was shot--so you think police with 2 month education is better than a 15 year old boy?

It is funny though my old friends sitting around the county (heroes), seem to have been forgotten later in life, like they are some piece of trash!

Yes, before you start I was 6 years in the air force, so stop the ranting!

If you spent 6 years in the Air Force, then I commend you on your service and I give you the respect you deserve. I will not however feel the same you do regarding the police. Obviously you do not feel they deserve the same respect for their service. That being said, how does a conversation regarding the sad incident that caused the death of a 15 year old child come to our law enforcement officials not being educated?

I have a BB pistol powered by CO2.......It has no such orange tip.....

By the same token, This BB pistol is quite powerful. Given the proper impact point, It's very dangerous.

It's 17 caliber BB's passed clean through a snake of about 2 inches in diameter. There are several possible soft tissue targets on a person. It's not to be considered to be a toy. I carried it when my job took me into high crime areas where the criminal has the advantage and where you right to defend yourself is somewhat hampered by hysteria.

I've never heard of a cop with two months education.

Chances are you were not getting shot at while in the Air Force.

Put yourself in that spot and see if you don't have a change in additude.

Every cop I've heard of in the last 20 years has the equivilent of an A.S. degree

"TOY GUNS" have painted tips, not pellet or BB guns. (Any gun that shoots a metal projectile is a weapon.) This is meant to keep cops from shooting a child who is playing cops and robbers with a plastic toy gun. The "young adult" that was killed was holding a weapon pointed at the cops. A pellet gun is not a toy and can shoot a .22 cal pellet at 1200+ fps. (this is faster than a .45 cal bullet btw) When that young "ADULT" walked into the school with a gun he was breaking the law.

Oh and any of you tranquilizer and taser guys wanna put YOUR life at risk then give me a real handgun and see if i still cant shoot you full of holes when you taser me or tranq me. Go for it.

Suicide by cop, horrible reporting by the press, baseless speculation by lots of folks who have never been shot at before....My sympathies go out to the police officers that had to do their jobs that day and will carry that tragic memory with them forever.

Wrong pellet and BB co2 guns do not have an orange tip. They aren't toys and they are available at Wal-mart although the last time I bought one I had to show age ID of 18. Soft BB guns have orange tips not the ones that shoot field points. They are target and hunting weapons. Quite capable of discouraging a badger from hanging around the house I know.

Yeah, I DO think the police officers, regardless of their education, are worth more than a 15-yr-old punk who is randomly punching other kids and brandishing a weapon in school. Didn't even have to think about it. The officers are heroes. I'm glad they were there, and I hope similar officers would respond in a similar manner if the same thing happened at my son's school.

Have you even read any of the coverage on this? What kind of moron would make a statement like this given the information provided not only by the audio evidence but also by school officials that were there? It is individuals such as yourself that incite negativity with out being informed. While it is your right to comment, atleast be informed.

Bundgaard - Many police officers are college educated and most police academy training classes attend for longer than two months. Often, recruits that are selected to attend a law enforcement academy have prior military training.

With regard to the "U.N. coming here to investigate the 800 people shot by the police last year", would that be the same U.N. that just called for a moment of silence to honor the passing of Kim Jong Il, a mass murderer of his own people???

No need for the UN to come here. Most of the inne cent black people shot where actually being bad but family lied about. The NYC guy shot on his wedding day was actually shot after he left a strip club, hit a cop car, and almost ran down a cop that was busting hookers. The Harrisburg,PA guy shot on his way to church sunday morning at a routine traffic stop was shot shortly after the bars/strip clubs closed, driving on a suspended liscence, the wrong way on a one way street, hit a parked car,& charged at a cop. The only church that guy could go to before 3am is Our Lady of Jiggling Ta Tas. The vast majority of the black men shot by cops had been convicted of crimes before.

The Un should have been IGNORED 25 years ago!!

There not!!!

The original story had the kid shot twice in the chest and once in the back of the head. They made it sound like there were cops all around him emptying their clips into him. Apparently, commentors (not readers, obviously) like @cbawl, up above, are going with that report and not the updates.

You can blame the media on that one. The reported story when this first broke was that the kid was shot twice in the chest and once in the back of the head. Some people hate the cops so much that, facts be damned, they are sticking to the original story. Anything else must be a coverup involving dozens of co-conspirators.

You can't blame the media for the choice of certain people to not comprehend all the facts in the very article they are using to back their opinions.

Who cares where he was shot. He brandished a weapon and threatened

The laceration occured when the second bullit spun him around and then he got one in the head. How fitting for an idiot!!

cheesy, what the hell are you talking about! It is extreamely important that kids have early exposure to guns.

mine are under lock and key. I take the kids out shooting with me all the time. I teach them about gun safety all the time. They are NOT allowed to point a toy gun at anyone! My 3 year old has never touched a real gun but he is learning gun safety, how loud they are"with hearing protection. They also know the damage they can do. Children are never too young to learn gun safety and respect. If they have a friend that is playing with a toy gun they correct them in proper handeling and safety.

I've never heard of such a thing...teaching 3yr olds about guns and how load they are. Reading maybe but guns?

Even a three-year old understannds "Don't touch!"

There are three very different groups of people here those who don't trust cops no matter what, Those who think the whole world is pavement and those who since they live in the country have guns and teach don't touch, don't point on the off chance the kid will find an unattended gun. It is a sad situation but please don't bring your racial prejudice to this situation where the kid and the cops were the same. Don't bring big city cynicism to a situation where the biggest city is only 70,000 people. This isn't your world, this isn't your reality.

I like that!!