Well since most cities map the city by ethnic groups this is nothing new. It is used to show trends of movement and immigration within the city. Helps to define which areas need which services more. My population geography teacher had us use Milwaukee's during the 70's to discuss trends such as the neighborhood I was born in German at the time was now hispanic. And all the Germans and Poles were now living south and west of that neighbohood. Known as urban sprawl. It shows which way cities are growing and who is moving into which neighborhoods. Retail stores use the same maps to figure which areas would be good for new stores. So I don't see why that part of the article should bother anyone. I mean putting a liquor store in a muslim neighborhood would be kinda useless.

"New York City Comptroller John C. Liu, who is expected to run for mayor, warned that "we should not as a matter of policy profile people based on religion or race — it goes against everything this city stands for." "

I agree with that. We should base it on a group's activities, and when viewed from this perspective, I fully endorse 'keeping an eye' on any group that exhibits terrorist tendencies.

Radical Islam is neither a 'race' nor a legitimate religion.

Yes, and I'm sure that Milwaukee was sending undercover agents on leisure trips with German and Polish citizens who had done nothing to raise suspicion and noting how many times a day they prayed, right?

Muslims should be watched very carefully. Islam is a form of government more than it is a religion. 90% of Mosque donate money to radical Islamist terrorist groups like the Muslim Brotherhood and Ha-mas. They say not all terrorist are Muslim, but 99% are. Racial Profiling is a must, and my own family is of multiple races. Islam does not allow for peaceful coexistence with anyone.

Wow, that's weird. I guess the Muslim gentleman who owns the business beneath my apartment, the Muslim clerks who work at the corner store, the Muslim teller at my bank, and the several Muslims that work in the same building with me must be the exception. They seem to have no problem coexisting.

Rick-4289354 "They need to keep track of potential terrorists. And why stop with Muslims? They could be attacked by Irish associated with the IRA. Hispanics with drug gangs and Hugo Chavez. Italians with the Red Brigade. English with communist labor unions. Virginians with Confederate Seperatists. Or even Christians with the KKK."

When any of those groups kill tens of thousands of innocent civilians, I'm sure we'll keep track of them as well.

Lev...., the Mosque that they belong too surely aids and funds Terrorist Groups. Their ultimate goal is to install Shari Law on the rest of us. You should never trust any of them as deceiving an infidel is not only OK, but demanded by their religion.

"Lev...., the Mosque that they belong too surely aids and funds Terrorist Groups."

That's interesting. Given that our statutes concerning material support for terrorism are extremely broad, one wonders why the leaders of these mosques haven't been prosecuted. After all, according to such an expert as yourself, they "surely" fund terrorist groups.

keep track of these people? are you kidding me? here's a better idea, NO FREE LUNCH, face it folks these clowns attend our schools at OUR expense, WHY??????

oh and rick, get a grip or troll elsewhere whichever suits................

When any of those groups kill tens of thousands of innocent civilians, I'm sure we'll keep track of them as well.

Well, we need to start watching christians. they passed that number LONG ago!

Statistically speaking, American Muslims are better off than the population as a whole. Foreign students generally represent the most prosperous segment of their populations. American Muslims are also much more likely to agree with the claim that violence against noncombatants is always unacceptable than Christians or Jews. But why let a few little facts get in the way of your bigoted preconceptions?

Got to agree with you Roy Wilson, Killing 3 thousand + people on US soil and destroying a large part of the largest city in America certainly changes the rules. 3000+ and still counting as many NYC first responders and people that worked on the rescue and recovery are still suffering and dying today. Couple that with the way this enemy uses infiltration tactics and covert operations to attack. This enemy does not wear uniforms or fight according to the Geneva Conventions. If anyone has watched the Muslim world during all this has certainly seen how they change sides at the drop of a hat. Today they are a ally and tomorrow they shoot you in the back of the head.

by all means DM after all ya gotta watch them Christians......are you insane? stupid? or just trolling? me i dont do the whole "religion" guy in the sky thing, but get e grip, some DO.

, NO FREE LUNCH, face it folks these clowns attend our schools at OUR expense, WHY??????

International students do NOT attend our schools at OUR expense. In fact, international students usually pay much MORE than American students to attend our colleges and universities because they are not eligible for financial aid, scholarships and/or grants. Additionally, many universities charge an extra fee for international students.

The exception to that being if their university has a reciprocity exchange agreement with the American university ... then sometimes (not always) some of the fees are waived because they are waived for American students abroad as well.

Beth,

True, but why let facts get in the way when we are facing a concerted effort to institute Shariah law?

thank you Beth for correcting me, but that is not always the case. here it is completely the opposite. they come to the UNI ( university of iowa) on a full scholarship paid for by the U.S. govt. (us) autonomously to learn medicine and become doctors to go home and help their own, but then something strange happens,,,,they STAY......

Ah Lev ... those pesky facts will get you every time!

Those exceptions are VERY few and far between. No matter what, there will ALWAYS be an exception. But as a general rule, what I said in my post is correct.

"Thank you Beth for correcting me, but that is not always the case. here it is completely the opposite. they come to the UNI ( university of iowa) on a full scholarship paid for by the U.S. govt. (us) autonomously to learn medicine and become doctors to go home and help their own, but then something strange happens,,,,they STAY......"

To think! Those ingrate doctors who stay and practice medicine in such a tempting destination like Iowa when there are so many qualified American medical professionals just itching to live in your state!

beth

i really do hate to conterdic a lady but very frankly go to your own local hospital and see how many "interns" speak English, not broken English, not heavy dialect, not Spanish...just plain ol English. my own V.A. doc is Korean, and is simply bubbling at getting her doctorate so she can set up practice.....HERE......

oh and LEV..

what total perfect state do you reside in utopia?

It cracks me up; all these douche bags arguing that Islam is not a legitimate religion, that the Middle East is occupied by towel heads, Middle Ages mentalities, and devil worship.

So, so unlike the chrisitians, who base their beliefs on ancient men, from the Middle East writing of a prophet, wearing a dress, living a century earlier, in the Middle East.

It seems as about the only religions American folks can invent are Christian Science and Mormonism: Both based on spacemen. It's no wonder I still pray at the altar of Barbarella.

It's simple; white Americans are frightened of anything and anyone who is different, and are afraid to admit that bluster must be answered with intelligence, ingenuity and unity. Wholly unlike the republicants candidates, their right wing mouth organs, and white trash everywhere who champion their divisiveness and destructive hyperbole, bigotry and shallowness. May your hate back at you, and you alone.

Roy Wilson --"When they kill innocent victims... " -- said Roy Wilson.

Then by all means, our policy should be to keep Christians under surveillance, if not locked up for the general safety. We'll call it the "Roy Wilson Said So To Keep (I Love) America (Don't You) Safe Act of 2012.

If we're not careful, they'll try and make us live under Christian Law. Thanks, Roy, for saving us from the religious zealots. Oh, you meant the OTHER zealots...

I dont know much, so someone tell me, PLEASE! how many people have been killed in the name of god since time began?

IA.ScooterTramp "by all means DM after all ya gotta watch them Christians......are you insane? stupid? or just trolling? me i dont do the whole "religion" guy in the sky thing, but get e grip, some DO."

O.o Are you insane, stupid, or just trolling? I swear if people get any dumber they'd stop breathing. Christians have only been butchering those who don't agree with them for, oh I don't know, roughly 1600 years. Or we could look at why people were willing to cross the Atlantic Ocean on big sailboats to settle well away from civilization. It must of been for the green grass and beautiful women. What's that? It was because of Protestant vs. Catholic persecutions to the point of killings and war between entire countries? *Gasp* Next thing you know you'll be telling me the reason separation of church and state was so important to the founders was because they didn't want a Christian version of Sharia Law to be implemented here like it had been in Europe for hundreds of years. :O HOLY SMOKES! That's true too?!?!

So yeah, they really aren't dangerous at all and are completely different from radical Islam...

I find it amusing that people have their panties in a bunch about the supposed impending implementation of Sharia Law when you have a Muslim population of ~0.6% and no elected officials pushing for it while at the same time you have a ~65% Christian population plus elected officials who believe in Christian Dominionism. Which of those sounds more likely?

I'm just going to stare in shock at the Confederate Separatists dismissal. It's not like their predecessors ceded from the U.S., dividing the country and causing the Civil War which happened on U.S. soil and killed a great many of people.

Allow me to place the premise in a hypothetical setting to test it. The premise is that because a fringe minority of a large group commits an act which kills X number of people the entirety of the larger group is subject to suspicion. So, in our hypothetical universe, we have a group, called the Inquisition, which is comprised of individuals who believe they are on a holy mission for Christianity by hunting and killing anyone who reads Harry Potter because it makes them witches. The Inquisition manages to launch a successful attack on a Harry Potter convention killing several thousand citizens in Los Angeles. Does this now mean that everyone who is a Christian is now under suspicion of being an Inquisitor to the point of being surveilled by law enforcement as a potential threat?

When you compare Christianity with Islam you are shopping for apples in the orange bin. In its present configuration Christianity is a religion and nothing more. Islam, on the other hand, is a religious form of government that lays out strict parameters governing its adherent's lives, both religious and secular. This difference alone is alarming to any person who wants to practice any sort of freedom. Coupled with Islam's avowed plan for a world-wide caliphate and its unbridled use of violence it is not unreasonable to place an umbrella of surveillance over the religion. It is an act of merit to lie to the unbeliever. It is an act of merit to raise mosques on the sites of Muslim military victories; they consider 9/11 a victory. There are literally scores of Islamic charities, some honest but many feeding funding to militant Islam through the Muslim Brotherhood. We have reason for deep concern. If only one percent of Muslims are radicalized that is still a number in the multiple thousands. Ignore these people at your own risk.

Keep up the good work NYPD! Never trust any muslim! Time and events have proven to the entire world that ALL muslims believe in the writing of the koran and it's demands that non believers must be killed and that islamic law, sharia must be followed. If anyone looks at all the terrorist killings and bombings, it's easy to see that 99% of them originated in muslim mosques and were planned and trained by the imans there. The so called " moderate and peace loving muslims "have done nothing, not a single act of stopping terrorism, but only sit quietly and say nothing. NYPD...keep after these bastards!

Rick,

You have a point! But this is not the time to be PC. I never heard of anyone in the nut ball groups you mentioned willing to strap bombs onto themselves, get on a bus, airplane, etc. full of innocents, and detonate it believing they will go to heaven for having done such a thing! Every group has committed atrocities in the "past" christians included. But most have abandoned the sick, twisted version of their beliefs, while enough muslims to be a threat haven't!

American citizens should never be placed under surveillance simply because of their religion. If foreign born muslim students are so terrifying perhaps they shouldn't be allowed to come into this country in the first place.

@Jack

non believers must be killed and that islamic law, sharia must be followed

I guess you are getting your Qur'an from an Evangelical or - you never read it? The non-believers you mention - they mean people who hate god - they do not consider Christians, non- believers..... and Sharia Law is up to the Imam - it is only for Muslim people and cannot be used for disputes, etc with any other religions.

The ignorance of some of these posts is astounding - it reminds me of when Hitler said Jews were vermin and filthy.... I have never seen a rat (the animal) with a yamaka

Which Muslims must we watch? The ones that live in Russia? The large populations on the continent of Africa - or the ones we didn't kill when we decimated Iraq? Which ones?
What about the American Black Muslims - must we watch them also?

I'm going to watch my garden grow - it's much more practical.

I had no idea there were so many Islamic scholars and experts on counter terrorism measures and law, out there.

Reading some of these comments makes it painfully obvious that we now live in the most ignorant and intolerant Western country. I applaud those of you who can use common sense and logic without jumping to harsh bigoted assumptions. First off let me start by stating one simple FACT. There are over 50 Muslim majority countries in the world right now, but only 2, thats right 2 (Iran and Saudi Arabia) follow and are governed by Sharia Law. If the plan is to implement Sharia all over the world why have they not done it in the countries where they are already a vast majority of the population? The Koran does not teach Muslims to kill and in fact it forbids forced conversions. Any religious book can have verses taken out of context to make the same argument. In the Bible there are calls for genocide against the Amalkites and God tells the Israelites that all non-believers can be taken as slaves or killed. The attacks on 9/11 weren't religious, they were political. They were a result of our involvement in the Middle East(troops in Saudi Arabia, the backing of brutal dictators, and unwavering support of Israel) It should also be understood that almost all of the attacks that have been thwarted since then have been because Muslims tipped off the police or the FBI

Mike, tell that to Rick Santorum. He would be the first to try and actually politicize Christianity.

IA.ScooterTramp - You don't know what you are talking about. The only foreign students who are getting any aid for U. Iowa are receiving aid from the school directly (and I doubt there are many to speak of...U. Iowa is not exactly a hotbed for International Students).

Federal loans and Grants are not given to foreign students, you are incorrect. It is obvious from your posts that you are prejudice, the only people you are convincing already agree with you.

QUOTE: " We have people out there who are partners who feel the trust is betrayed.”

I'm certain that some of those are very nice people, but some of their religious brethren are NOT very nice and they even cheered when the World Trade Center was destroyed... I know because some of these latter were my neighbors at the time of that Muslim sponsored massacre. I would never vote for someone who fails to protect our vulnerable families and neighbors simply because they want to garner Muslim votes. The 'nice' Muslims should understand, and they should help us to defend ourselves.

Rick you can lay in bed with your muslim radicals. Most muslims are radical so they need to be watched.

I have to disagree with you. The way to do this, is watch for any abnormalities. Instead we waste all our time watching everyone, especially 90 yr old granny..

How much of YOUR money are you willing to spend for this surveillence? Wou you like to be under surveillance?

We are all under surveillance. Its called GPS! Installed on most every cell phone available. Why do you think the Phones are free Upgrades from the old style? Now all the new cars have them and before long you will be required to have a security RIFD chip implanted just to ride a train or get on a plane! Its happening NOW!

Pete from Sunshine State "How much of YOUR money are you willing to spend for this surveillence? Wou you like to be under surveillance?"

If I'm planning some terrorist activities, or associating with those that do, I should expect it.

Yes, Roy, a careful look at the history of government surveillance of citizens and residents surely leads to the conclusion that only the guilty are surveilled. Do you honestly believe that, or do you not really care if innocent people are subjected to this because you're pretty sure it won't be you?

To dave 555: I agree! People need to remove their heads from their butts and think for a change. Have you noticed how many are flowing into this country? To those who read the news or watch it, Honor killings are the way it is done. Just recently, in Canada it happened and here also. You have to ask, if they hate our way of life so much, what are they doing here? Have you forgotton it was muslims who was supposed to have attacked us? Not irish, italian and etc. Just let an american try the same thing over there, and see what happens.

"Have you forgotton it was muslims who was supposed to have attacked us?"

Dunt theyz knowz that we heres in Amurica has ours proud traditions of thats gnlish language and wearin blue jeans and sech?! What does they thinks they ares doin' comin up on here to Amurica in them there dresses?

It's to bad that King Georgie didn't bother to monitor foreign students learning to fly commercial aircraft in 2001.

It was Muslims who attacked us..............Well Timothy Mcviegh blew up the Oklahoma City building so should we now watch every middle-aged white guy. And really, "most Mulisms are radical?" Where did you get that stat? The Bigots Almanac. Your comment is radical, so should someone be watching you? Do any of you idiots even know 1 Muslim person. The fear mongering and paranoia in this country is amazing. Some of you people need to get a grip on reality. There are over 1 billion Muslims in the world so if most of them were radical I think we would be seeing a lot more attacks and a hell of a lot more bodies.

SAM writes: "I have to disagree with you. The way to do this, is watch for any abnormalities. Instead we waste all our time watching everyone, especially 90 yr old granny.."

Sam, I believe that what you just wrote is illogical... How does one "watch for abnormalities" without searching for those who might be hiding them from the public eye.. These people don't simply announce themselves you know. Thus far all of the terrorists -- without exception -- have been Muslims. Who should we then watch? The Mormons? The Unitarians? The Budhists? How about the Muslims? BINGO! I would hope that we are already watching such institutions as Drew University in NJ which has long been a hotbed of Muslim activity.

Sam, I believe that what you just wrote is illogical... How does one "watch for abnormalities" without searching for those who might be hiding them from the public eye.. These people don't simply announce themselves you know. Thus far all of the terrorists -- without exception -- have been Muslims. Who should we then watch? The Mormons? The Unitarians? The Budhists? How about the Muslims? BINGO! I would hope that we are already watching such institutions as Drew University in NJ which has long been a hotbed of Muslim activity.

By paying more attention to tips and etc. We would have stopped 9-11 if we had followed the flight instructor up on his tip about the students asking questions about ramming buildings. Theres plenty of otherways we can watch for abnormalities, without impeding on anyones rights.

It is a faith. It is a religion. In what sense is it not? The argument is absurd and reflects a deep, deep ignorance.

IA and the obama is a muslim nonsense. And he wonders why nobody sees him as credible...

Satanick

troll....need i say more?

DMorgan

you talking to me?

How am I a troll?

satanic,

while i am quite sure you truely believe you are some kind of satanic wiz kid and all that nonsenses and its all like you actually believe that horse@!$%#? puleeeze..... grow up some.

Irate, Make up your mind is Obama a Muslim, a member of church with a radical christian minister in Chicago, a socialist, a communist, a fascist, a Kenyan, a Indonesian, a dictator, a Democratic liberal or what. First I suggest you look up the definitions of what I have listed. If you do you'll see you have repeatedly accused OUR president of being things that are absolute opposites.

I am an atheist. And even if I was a satanist that would totally irrelevant to this discussion. You grow up.

@ Devil's Son
Obama is obviously all of the above. And the antichrist.

satanick,

you claim to be an "atheist" yet invoke Satan in in you sign in? hahahahah then rant to devils son about a Antichrist? so tell me .............oh wise one ......how oh how does an "atheist " believe in an antichrist?

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sarcasm
I hope that answers your questions ;)

As an Agnostic of many years standing, it is not surprising to see all organized religions painted is such dark and violent colors in these posts. Is anyone out there listening to what's being said? Some of these posts are more frightening than whatever threat Islam presents. If we are made of such corroded metal we need to rebuild our structure while there is still time.

@IAScooterTramp

Satanick

troll....need i say more?

No, you really don't need to say anymore, you are rude, have nothing of importance to say.

@Mike - I couldn't agree with you more. Surveillance of Americans - it used to be against the law. Thank you Congress for not reading the Patriot Act or any of what has been added to it since (and not knowing Constitutional Law) - our country is being undermined by sheer ignorance and grandiose intolerance - it's embarrassing and as you said, very frightening.

What is "American clothing?" Is that tights, powdered wigs, and tricorner hats?

How exactly is someone wearing the clothing to which they are accustomed "forcing other traditions" on anyone?

What is "American clothing?" Is that tights, powdered wigs, and tricorner hats?

How exactly is someone wearing the clothing to which they are accustomed "forcing other traditions" on anyone?

Lev: When muslims refuse to take off the veil for a driver's license photo ID, that's when they're forcing their traditions on us. When they don't want to clock out to pray 5x/day and insist to get paid for prayer time, that's when they're forcing their traditions on us. When they don't speak English and donate money to terrorists, that's when they're forcing their traditions on us, when they're out to supress our freedom of speech to print a picture of Mighty Mo, thats when they're forcing their traditions on us, and especially when they're making bombs to throw into subways and synagogues, that's when they're forcing their favorite traditions on us.

Still waiting for them to turn on or condemn their terrorist buddies, but you won't hear a word.

Ambiguity cleared up for you Lev?

"Still waiting for them to turn on or condemn their terrorist buddies, but you won't hear a word."

Wow, I guess you were too busy being horribly oppressed by Muslims in your day-to-day life (I mean, seriously, if Muslims insist on praying while at work, what's going to come next? Jews taking the day off on Yom Kippur? The federal government acknowledging Christmas as a national holiday? Perish the thought!) that you missed the countless statements by Muslims organizations condemning terrorism in no uncertain terms.

1: Signed by approximately 50 prominent Muslim scholars and politicians:

“The undersigned, leaders of Islamic movements, are horrified by the events of Tuesday 11 September 2001 in the United States which resulted in massive killing, destruction and attack on innocent lives. We express our deepest sympathies and sorrow. We condemn, in the strongest terms, the incidents, which are against all human and Islamic norms. This is grounded in the Noble Laws of Islam which forbid all forms of attacks on innocents. God Almighty says in the Holy Qur’an: ‘No bearer of burdens can bear the burden of another’ (Surah al-Isra 17:15).”

2. Signed by: Shaykh Yusuf Qaradawi, Qatar; Tariq Bishri, Egypt; Muhammad S. Awwa, Egypt; Fahmi Huwaydi, Egypt; Haytham Khayyat, Syria; Shaykh Taha Jabir al-Alwani, U.

“All Muslims ought to be united against all those who terrorize the innocents, and those who permit the killing of non-combatants without a justifiable reason. Islam has declared the spilling of blood and the destruction of property as absolute prohibitions until the Day of Judgment. … [It is] necessary to apprehend the true perpetrators of these crimes, as well as those who aid and abet them through incitement, financing or other support. They must be brought to justice in an impartial court of law and [punished] appropriately. … [It is] a duty of Muslims to participate in this effort with all possible means.”

3. Shaykh Muhammed Sayyid al-Tantawi, imam of al-Azhar mosque in Cairo, Egypt:

“Attacking innocent people is not courageous, it is stupid and will be punished on the day of judgement. … It’s not courageous to attack innocent children, women and civilians. It is courageous to protect freedom, it is courageous to defend oneself and not to attack.”
Agence France Presse, September 14, 2001

4. Abdulaziz bin ‘Abdallah Al-Ashaykh, chief mufti of Saudi Arabia:
“Firstly: the recent developments in the United States including hijacking planes, terrorizing innocent people and shedding blood, constitute a form of injustice that cannot be tolerated by Islam, which views them as gross crimes and sinful acts. Secondly: any Muslim who is aware of the teachings of his religion and who adheres to the directives of the Holy Qur’an and the sunnah (the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad) will never involve himself in such acts, because they will invoke the anger of God Almighty and lead to harm and corruption on earth.”

5. Shaykh Yusuf al-Qaradawi, chairman of the Sunna and Sira Council, Qatar:
“Our hearts bleed for the attacks that has targeted the World Trade Center [WTC], as well as other institutions in the United States despite our strong oppositions to the American biased policy towards Israel on the military, political and economic fronts. Islam, the religion of tolerance, holds the human soul in high esteem, and considers the attack against innocent human beings a grave sin, this is backed by the Qur’anic verse which reads: ‘Who so ever kills a human being [as punishment] for [crimes] other than manslaughter or [sowing] corruption in the earth, it shall be as if he has killed all mankind, and who so ever saves the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind’ (Al-Ma’idah:32).”

There are many, many more statements like this available. The fact that you are ignorant of them shouldn't be held against the world's SEVERAL BILLION MUSLIMS.

Oh, wait, I forgot-- they are simply following their prophet's command to obscure their true nature from the infidel. It's all part of that extremely threatening attempt to install shariah law. I know in my neighborhood morality squads frequently roam the streets flogging anyone eating pork. I also hear that some of them wear turbans to hide their horns. Do you believe this nonsense? Or perhaps better to ask: do you honestly think that you wouldn't have fallen for the same kind of anti-Semetic lies in 1930s Germany?

The 9/11 hijackers had a number of college students. All learned some English, wore "American clothing"; paid taxes...and would probably mouth off any words about allegiance to a flag. Wouldn't have stopped them.

Norm,

LOL seriously? Because they will not take off their clothes for a pic you say they are forcing you to do the same? How is them not taking off a turban or a veil forcing you to do the same? Please, you need to do better then that if you are going to try and make a point using that.

You also have no proof, aside from the fearists rantings, that all Muslims contribute to terrorist organizations or make bombs in their basements and bedrooms. Oh and those pictures they complain about are probably images that defame Mohammad.

What would you say if someone made a picture of Jesus having gay sex with Satan or shooting some pastor in the knee with a bow and arrow? What would you say if someone made an image of God in a bandolier covered with grenades and fighting against a mob of white people trying to get into heaven using guns?

You have absolutely no clue what true religious forcing is. Take a look at any Republican state or ay anything Rick Santorum has said in the past month. That is real religious intrusion into our lives. When you claim someone is "forcing their religion on you" you are insinuating that they are forcing you to conform to their religion, meaning that Muslims wearing turbans are forcing you to also wear a turban in your driver's license pic.

You are just another clueless Muslim hater trying to juxtapose an argument to justify your own intolerance.

@Norm - It is nice to see that you are representing the latest and greatest American tradition...Ignorance. Essentially all your rant is saying is "if they ain't cornbread eating good ol country boys like me, then we don't want em!" I get Christmas off work, why are they forcing Christianty on me? We get Yom Kippur and 100 other Jewish holidays off, so why are they pushing Judaism on me? You don't have to take your veil off for an ID picture, clock out to pray, speak to anyone that doesn't speak English or donate money to anyone, so how exactely are they forcing these things upon you? Your comment is forcing stupid upon this whole message board

Levtolstoy if you read those statement they are worded in typical islamic vague references that actually mean nothing.

That is the best you can come up with? These statements are the "outcry" against radical muslim terrorism?

They are obviously worded in such a way as to avoid "offending" any radical muslims, and reinforcing the idea that Islam is the "true" religion; the condemnation of the attack is secondary. Maybe the writers of these are so brainwashed the don't even know they are doing it.

They make it clear that the offenders will be punished by Allah, not by the muslim community.

They only infer that these actions are wrong, what is important to them is they say they are anti-Islamic. Because in their mind Islam is the only thing that matters.

They all have built in loopholes.

"No bearer of burdens can bear the burden of another" wtf does that mean? Why is nonsense like this included in an "official" statement?

"permit the killing of non-combatants without a justifiable reason" built in loophole - they can justify it if needed.

"it is stupid and will be punished on the day of judgement" - stupid, huh? What a harsh condemnation. We won't do anything about it though, we will wait for Allah to do something about it.

same thing with #3 - "it will be punished on the day of judgement"

"terrorizing innocent people...will invoke the anger of god almighty" again passing the buck to "god" to punish them.

"despite our strong oppositions to the American biased policy towards Israel" Oh had to get that in there huh. Equally as important to blame Israel always as to condemn these acts.

"Who so ever kills a human being [as punishment] for [crimes] other than manslaughter or [sowing] corruption in the earth, it shall be as if he has killed all mankind" Is there a penalty for "killing all of mankind"? Sounds like I can kill anyone I want if I fell they are "sowing corruption in the earth".

All these statements were made for political reasons, of course they had to "condemn" these acts, or make it appear they condemn them, because in the days after 9/11 they had no idea what the US response would be and they were covering their ass from getting attacked in revenge.

Now I'm sure all the people involved in these statements truly did think these actions were horrific. But it is evidence of the strangle hold the so called religion has on their brains that they cannot even make an official statement without couching it entirely in terms of Islam. Because Islam is the only thing that matters to them. If you are not a muslim you are nothing; and even if you are a muslim your life doesn't matter, all that matters is the "judgement of Allah".

In a couple hundred years most muslims will realize it's just a book written by men, nothing to to with "god". Until then this religion will cause nothing but trouble for everyone on this planet.

This straw dog argument that "christianity" is just as bad is comparing current times with actions of hundreds of years ago. How many innocents have been murdered by christian fanatics in the last 20 years? 50? 100? More than have died from shark attacks?

Which one of these so called leaders who made these statements has taken any ACTION to stop these sort of thing? They are just meaningless words. "There are many, many more statements like this available". Show me one that actually condemns one who murders in the name of Allah. I doubt their religion allows them to make that statement.

"But, with Islam... they are leaps and bounds beyond dangerous. They are completely indoctrinated, since birth, and given the right amount of stimulation, they will turn very violent, and frenzied by that violence."

Have you ever even met a Muslim?

"What kind of "stimulation"?? The simple burning of one quran would be one example. Doing so in the open public air, and announcing it -- anywhere in this world, and you could find yourself dead just for saying so...

That is not a normal reaction, and certainly not acceptable."

I agree-- it is not acceptable. But sadly it is quite "normal" Now try walking into a bar in many areas of this country and start deeply kissing another man. Or burning an American flag. I think you will find that your life will be immediately put in danger.

"Does any religious group intent on ravaging the entire world economy for every dime they can squeeze out of all the world's inhabitants, sound acceptable to you? They are dangerous, VERY dangerous... wars to them, are profit incentive... religion is the poison folks.. and it comes in all brands and nationalities -- and they all should be removed from the planet, like we would with any virulent disease."

Yes, religion is very, very dangerous. People like you who refer to literally billions of people as a "virulent disease" that needs to be wiped out are, of course, not dangerous at all.

While I mostly agree with your post, there are some issues I'd like to clarify.

"Should this include other sects, like orthodox jews" - as far as I know, the worst form of violence they ever committed was spitting and burning garbage containers. They actively refuse taking up weapons, leaving IDF service to the secular part of Israeli society. They think they better serve their country by praying.

"after they are sterlized to be unable to reproduce, ever. Islam needs to be utterly banned as a religion, worldwide, as well, and all those theocratic countries like them, swept clean..." - does it mean all inhabitants of Vatican must be castrated? This would mean the end of RC Church because according to the Church law a castrato can't be elected Pope.

But yes, I totally agree with you that Islam as ideology must be thoroughly defeated and banned worldwide. Islam's place is on the proverbial trash heap of history together with National-Socialism and Communism.

Brilliant. First person advocates genocide against Muslims and Jews. Second person comes in to point out that really we should just slaughter all the Muslims. You people make me absolutely sick.

The dillema is simple.... Islam is very definitely a religion that seeks to take over the world, by means of first spreading everywhere, violence, or taxation... That is precisely what their "good book" says in its original translation.

Funny. You jstt described the BuyBull and christianity, and how they are trying to influence and take over the minds of everyone all over the world. Been spreading like a disease since Day 1.

To some on this page...you know who you are: I believe that extremist, right wing Christians, like Rick Santorum and his followers, are also planning on taking over the world. They want to start right here by replacing our constitutional republic with a Christian theocracy. They lie about what the founders of this country and the writers of the constitution intended, they lie about what is written in the Federalist papers and they lie about what people like Washington and, particularly, James Madison actually meant by some of their private writings. These people are the American Taliban, as far as I am concerned. Only their beliefs are the correct beliefs, only their God is the right god, only their morals are the correct morals. They are, apparently, exactly like the Muslims you condemn. Yet, I hear no one, particularly people like you saying a word about that. This country is rife with right wing extremist militant groups who openly advocate the overthrow of our government with violent means. I don't hear people like you saying they, too, should be under constant surveillance even when scum like the group in Michigan are arrested for plotting to kill police officers and government officials.

1) And if every single person in the United States had been placed under administrative detention then we could get traffic deaths to zero overnight! Had OJ Simpson been summarily executed in 1984 he never would have killed his wife! See anything wrong with this reasoning?

2) They weren't illegal immigrants. They had visas. That makes them legal immigrants.

Well, not really. Atheistic communist regimes and fascist/nationalist regimes with ambiguous stances on religion have done a pretty good job of killing people.

Rubbish. I'll address this utterly ridiculous comment, which is a flat out mischaracterization.

Yes, religion has a lot of blood on its hands. Can the same be said for atheists and atheism? Haven't atheists killed more people in the name of atheism than religious theists have killed in the name of their religion? No, because atheism isn't a philosophy or ideology. Atheists do not gang together and kill people in the name of "No God". It is not a philosophy or ideology that people crusade for.

How many people have been killed throughout history by Communists in the name of Atheism & Secularism? None, probably. How can that be? After all, millions and millions of people died in Russia and China under communist governments — and those governments were both secular and atheistic. So weren't all of those people killed because of atheism — even in the name of atheism and secularism? No, that conclusion does not follow. Atheism itself isn't a principle, cause, philosophy, or "belief system" which people fight, die, or kill for. Being killed by an atheist is no more being killed in the name of atheism than being killed by a tall person is being killed in the name of tallness. If someone killed you, and he happened to not believe in your god (or any god), how does that make his atheism the motive? Why then couldn't you say that his lack of belief in Leprechauns was the reason he murdered people?

People were killed in communist nations for a lot of different reasons. Some were communists who disagreed with those in power and were killed because of that. Some were anti-communists who opposed the government and were killed for that. Some were simply in the way or inconvenient and were killed for that. These are political disagreements that people were being killed over, not murder in the name of atheism. But weren't a lot of people killed because they were Christian? Certainly — but not simply because they were Christian. Communists typically regarded religious organizations as a hindrance towards the creation of a worker's paradise. Some religious groups also opposed the communists. Once again, we are generally looking at political issues, not a question of atheism.

Even if some people were killed simply because they followed a religion, it does not follow that they were killed in the name of atheism. Why? Because a lack of belief in god(s) isn't a belief system or ideology which can, by itself, inspire people to do things — good or bad.

TO UNDERSTAND THIS BETTER, consider times in the past when religion has been involved with violence — the Inquisition would be good. How many people were killed during the Inquisition in the name of theism? NONE. Those doing the killing acted not because of theism, but rather because of Christian doctrines. The belief system is what inspired people to act (sometimes for good, sometimes for ill). The general ideology of theism, however, did not. THERE...Does that comparison rattle around in your noggin and clear things up a little??

Similarly, communism certainly inspired people to act and gave them motivations to do certain things, but atheism — which is the absence of a belief and not even a belief itself — did not. The assumption that people in Russia and China were killed merely on account of atheism is based upon two other myths: first, that atheism is itself some sort of philosophy or belief system which can motivate people, and second that atheism is somehow interchangeable with the actual belief system of communism. It also pretends that all the various elements of communist totalitarianism were irrelevant to what happened — which is utter nonsense.

Let me repeat that. UTTER NONSENSE.

"How many people have been killed throughout history by Communists in the name of Atheism & Secularism? None, probably."

We probably agree on a lot of issues, DMorgan, but you are dead wrong on this one. I hate to cite wikipedia, and I'd be glad to get you more authoritative sources, but I think the following information is fairly widely-accepted by historians of all stripes who actually know something about the operation of Communism. Whether or not this accords with atheism as you understand it, your claim that no one was killed "in the name of Atheism" is absolutely incorrect. You might want to take a closer look at the facts before you throw around words like "rubbish" and "UTTER NONSENSE."

"The USSR anti-religious campaign of 1928–1941 was a new phase of anti-religious persecution in the Soviet Union The campaign began in 1929, with the drafting of new legislation that severely prohibited religious activities and called for a heightened attack on religion in order to further disseminate atheism. This had been preceded in 1928 at the fifteenth party congress, where Joseph Stalin criticized the party for failure to produce more active and persuasive anti-religious propaganda. This new phase coincided with the beginning of the forced mass collectivization of agriculture and the nationalization of the few remaining private enterprises.Many of those who had been arrested in the 1920s would continue to remain in prison throughout the 1930s and even beyond.The main target of the anti-religious campaign in the 1920s and 1930s was the Russian Orthodox Church, which had the largest number of faithful. Nearly all of its clergy, and many of its believers, were shot or sent to labour camps. Theological schools were closed, and church publications were prohibited.More than 85,000 Orthodox priests were shot in 1937 alone. Only a twelfth of the Russian Orthodox Church's priests were left functioning in their parishes by 1941."

I'd appreciate an apology.

I just pointed out that atheistic regimes killed tens of millions. Can you read?

And I just responded to that nonsensical comment of yours -- since you suggest causation where none exists. It was a very uneducated comment on your part.

See above.

Good luck finding confidential informants after alienating the entire Muslim community.

As if having tons of Muslim LEOs would be any easier? Or do you intend to dump tons of "I am a white guy, I feel like being a radical today"?

Its called stereotyping. If you are a minority in any group you have to be a "model minority" else you are prone to being stereotyped or seen with an exaggerated suspicion.

IF you wear a diaper on your head....IF you pray 5 times a day....If you speak any language other than English, yes you will be stereotyped and profiled.....get used to it or get the FRACK out of my country!!!!

Tcko63

IF you wear a diaper on your head....IF you pray 5 times a day....If you speak any language other than English, yes you will be stereotyped and profiled.....get used to it or get the FRACK out of my country!!!!

Ah here they come out of the closet...the redneck racist white trash .. who can't handle diversity and is basically a school dropout. If there's anyone who should be kicked out of America it's racist white trash like you. LOSER.

@Tcko63 - So I guess I would be justified in sterotyping you as uneducated, poor white trash! Since when the hell is this YOUR country?

Have you ever read the Qu'ran or are you just repeating the same bullsh*t you heard from some other ignorant fear monger? I would love to see this outlined plan of attack you speak of. Islam is one of the worlds three major monthestic religions and the Qu'ran is certainly less violent than the Old Testament and since that book is considered holy by both Jews and Christians under your logic they shouldn't be protected by the Constituion either, right? How do you define religion? What you believe is a religion and everything else is not? Thats what it seems like!

Most of them are not "guests" but citizens. And Muslims live in all parts of the world. Almost 25% of the world's population is Muslim (getting close to 2 billion people). And while everyone is watching Iran for nukes, Pakistan already has nukes. And while baby Bush told the world, Bring it on, I would not suggest getting involved in a nuke war, no one wins, especially if the other nuclear powers also start tossing nukes--we won't have to worry. So your plan to plant all Muslims with a GPS, can't be done, even in the USA, where a lot of these Muslim are born and are citizens. Regarding watching people in New York, Timothy Mcveigh was born in NY, was a US Vet, and his terrorist act was considered the deadliest act of terrorism in the US until 9/11. So do we watch everyone. I would rather have my freedom thank you. Your hate and fear is scarier then concerns about Muslims.

Kevin-747617

Plant all Muslims with a GPS and we can keep track of them. They are usually up to no good. They are guests in our country and not friendly ones either. They hate us deport them all. Even the American ones. If the wanna be Muslim go back to the Mideast.

Please attend some diversity training and take meds if the anxiety is over bearing. It can help you get over your issues. Typing crap on the keyboard is not a permanent solution to your issues.

STFU redneck.

You should worry about racism in America and try to help people of color feel comfortable. Also attend some diversity training classes so you can better adjust to a changing world around you which is clearly making you unconfortable.

tck, when the group you're a member of is the one targeted, you'll feel differently.

We didn't have these kinds of problems before they came here. If my troubleshooting experience has taught me anything, it's when a new problem arises, always suspect the last thing changed. Usually removing it cures the issue. Racist or not, thems the facts...Muslim men between the ages of 17-45 are responsible for the majority of the terrorist attacks. So, what do you think...I think we should delete them.

mo nig

We didn't have these kinds of problems before they came here. If my troubleshooting experience has taught me anything, it's when a new problem arises, always suspect the last thing changed. Usually removing it cures the issue. Racist or not, thems the facts...Muslim men between the ages of 17-45 are responsible for the majority of the terrorist attacks. So, what do you think...I think we should delete them.

That is racist stereotyping.

You come from a country that killed a few million Iraqis looking for WMD's that didn't exist and you think that's not state sponsored terrorism ? Terrorism has no religion and extremists exist across the world.

some do it in the name of nationalism ..others in the name of religion and still others do it in the name of the Bible.

@Tck063 - I think that someone should be watching you. People with your ideology and mindset are what constitute the greatest threat to this country. Maybe you can explain to me how on the one hand you can call someone's religion evil than on the other threaten to exterminate a religion of over a billion people. Your intolerance and glaringly obvious ignorance makes you no different than a terrorist. It's sad knowing that there are people, a lot of people in this country that are just as bat sh*t crazy as you are. Have you ever meet a Muslim? How a bout a black person or Hispanic? You should crawl out from under your rock and educate yourself about other peoples and their beliefs and customs instead of just loading your guns living in unfounded fear.

Nate1, would you like to include the Westboro Baptist Church as a hate-group? They picket funerals of US servicement and descrate the American flag. How about the wingnut Christians who shoot people they feel are doing bad--but legal--things.

Islam is the monotheistic religion articulated by the Qur'an, a text considered by its adherents to be the verbatim word of God. Get educated before you embarrass yourself in public....

Or blow up abortion clinics, assassinate doctors, etc.

Sooooooooooo Carlo, I guess you do not live in NYC.... if you did you would know exactly how we all feel with the terriosts muslims blowing up our twin towers......... if the muslims are so good, then why do they not come forward and tell us Americans and stand with the American people against Jihadist..... we have opened up our country to them, given them free liberty and go to school without paying a tutuion, we send trillions of dollars to the middle east countries, soooooo tell me why not one of them will stand for us and speak their words about our great nation......are they afraid of their own people???? They are allowed any thing in our country, starting with freedom of speech, etc, YET NOT A ONE WILL COME TO DEFEND THE AMERICANS. SO I AM SAYING YOU AND EVEYONE ELSE WHO IS READING THIS HOORAY FOR THE NYC DEPARMENT, ITS ABOUT TIME..... I FORGOT TO TELL YOU ONE OTHER INCIDENT, 3 OF MY DEAREST FRIENDS WERE MURDERED, MURDERED, MURDERED IN THE TWIN TOWERS JUST FOR DOING THEIR DAILY JOB,

Ellie : sorry abt your friends but it's not like only white folks died on sept 11 th. and it's not like all muslims were behind the attacks.

As far as sending trillions of dollars..the US does that for OIL. there's no charity.

and why should every muslim have to defend himself ? Do you go around and justify yourself for what Tim Mcveigh did in Oklahoma just because both of you are white and american ?

BTW , The terrorists on Sept 11 were from saudi arabia and that country is an ally of the US.

yeah a lot of people are suffering from chronic anxiety it seems.

I couldn't agree more with this statement. This whole "fear" of all muslims is incredibly irrational. The USA was founded on ideals that let us be a country of freedom that made us different from the rest. I am a Christian, but whos to say my nieghbor down the street can't be Islamic? It's the Constitution that lets us beileve whatever we want and have a free enviorment in which to do it in. What if somebody bombed an Islamic temple in the name of Jesus? Should all Christians everywhere be watched? No! It's absured to think that this will stop anything, but do you what will? Don't fear them. Terroists jobs are to inspire fear through violent acts, well you know what? Don't fear them, because if you do then the have already won.

And this isn't towards muslims, this is towards the extremists in the religion that think harming innocents is the right thing to do. Because in this day and age every religion has some power-hungry leader somewhere, I mean look at the right-wing extremists. I think they are just as much the route to terroism as any for inspiring people that its actually something that we can stop, all we can do is hope for the best, and prepare for the worst. I mean, unless someone out there can tell the future or read minds?