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Subscribe to RSSTrayvon Martin's final phone call -- made to his girlfriend -- is shedding new light on the moments leading up to his deadly confrontation with a neighborhood watch volunteer. NBC's Lilia Luciano reports.
Updated at 8:01 a.m. ET: A 17-year-old boy whose death has sparked national outrage fearfully told his girlfriend over the phone moments before he was shot to death that he was being followed, contradicting the shooter's self-defense claim, the family’s lawyer said Tuesday afternoon.
Benjamin Crump, the lawyer for Trayvon Martin's, held a news conference on Tuesday to discuss the teen's phone records in the hours before he was shot in the gated Twin Lakes, Fla. community on Feb. 26. Crump said Martin, a black teenager, had gotten caught in the rain and had put on his hoodie, unaware he was being followed by neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman, NBCMiami.com reported.
"He's just a kid trying to get home from the store and get out of the rain, that's it, nothing else," Crump said.
Martin was unarmed and had gone to a nearby store to pick up a bag of Skittles and an iced tea when the confrontation occurred. Earlier on Tuesday, ABC News reported that Martin's girlfriend said she they were on the phone together at the time.
Trayvon Martin lawyer speaks: Read more on NBC Miami
"He said this man was watching him, so he put his hoodie on. He said he lost the man," the girlfriend, who was not identified, told ABC. "I asked Trayvon to run, and he said he was going to walk fast. I told him to run, but he said he was not going to run."
Sybrina Fulton and Tracy Martin, the parents of Trayvon Martin, the unarmed Florida teen shot dead by a neighborhood watch volunteer, tell TODAY's Matt Lauer they want justice for their son and want the shooter, George Zimmerman, arrested.
Call logs from Martin's phone confirm he spoke with the 16-year-old girlfriend interviewed by ABC News minutes before his death, the news station reported.
More than 435,000 people, many alerted by tweets from celebrities such as movie director Spike Lee and musician Wyclef Jean, signed a petition on Change.org, a social action website, calling for the arrest of Martin's shooter, George Zimmerman, who has claimed he acted in self-defense. On Monday, the Justice Department and FBI announced they opened an investigation into the shooting.
Florida's 'Stand Your Ground' law could complicate Martin case
Although Martin initially told his girlfriend he wasn't going to run, he eventually did, she said, but the stranger managed to corner him.
"Trayvon said, 'What, are you following me for,' and the man said, 'What are you doing here.' Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the headset just fell. I called him again and he didn't answer the phone."
Visit msnbc.com for breaking news, world news, and news about the economy
After that, the line went dead, she said. According to ABC News, other than screams on 911 calls as Martin and Zimmerman scuffled, those were the last words Martin said.
Mom: Trayvon Martin was killed because of 'the color of his skin'
"What George Zimmerman said to the police about him being suspicious and up to no good is completely contradicting to what he was doing," Crump said Tuesday. "This claim that Trayvon Martin was the aggressor is preposterous."
Martin's girlfriend is traumatized, Crump told reporters.
Grand jury called in Trayvon Martin case
"She couldn't even go to his wake. She was so sick, she spent the night in the hospital," he said.
Zimmerman called police 46 times
Zimmerman called 911 dozens of times in the months that led to the fatal shooting, The Orlando Sentinel reported Monday evening. The Seminole County Sheriff's Office released six calls he had made, four of which called police to report "suspicious" persons -- all of whom were black -- in or near the Retreat at Twin Lakes enclave, the paper said.
The other calls were about a neighbor's open garage door and children playing in the street at dusk, reported The Sentinel. None of the newly released calls are related to Martin's shooting.
More content from msnbc.com and NBC News:
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We can hope this scab on humanity does the noble thing and commits suicide soon.
I hate the loss of any life, but I have to agree with you on this. Too bad the young man didn't think to call 911 and report Zimmerman following him. I pray for the family. This just breaks my heart.
Wasn't Florida trying to reinstate firing squads to execute death row inmates. The family did not seem to display the level of hate that I find for Zimmerman, and it is not my place, but it makes me less sad to know Zimmerman potentially faces death row.
May the Martin family find peace knowing how much this nation showed that Trayvon's life was important.
Sounds like cold blooded murder by a paranoid man with a gun.
It is now utterly obvious that this boy was killed because of his skin color. EVERY person Zimmerman called about was black.
Previously on this Board, people complained that African Americans pull out the race card all the time. This is a PERFECT case to show that Blacks are targeted for nothing but their skin color.
Mr. Simmerman called 911 46 times? I guess he boiled over from the lack of police response.
I am pissed....and I am white....
This was a cold blooded murder, probably motivated by hate....
He was told by the operator not to follow the kid...he did anyway.
The kid calls his buddy to complain somebody is following him...
She tells him to run, but the kid being a kid and a little afraid; decides to walk fast at first, then decides to run when he notices the f*cker still following him....
The racist bastard latino guy catches up to him and asks him what he is doing in a white neighborhood (technically)...
The kid, out of being scared, tries to run; the idiot follows still follows him. O
Out of desperation, and primal fear when you know something bad is about to happen; natural instinct takes over and he goes for the gun...
The idiot then shoots him in cold blood....right infront of everybody
Then pretends to witnesses that he was the one calling for help....
The whole thing is just so senseless. A young man's life taken away from him and his family is just sad.
jlmyers: Sadly, if Trayvon had called 911, it wouldn't have really helped...the police were supposedly on their way in response to Zimmerman's call.
Zimmerman should NOT have been in the position of neighborhood watch at all, let alone carrying a gun!
Shows you what happens when misguided people judge others through bigoted eyes with intent.
Sounds more like a cadet flunky wanna be 'tha man'. Have gun, see World through gun, think through gun, err through gun. Neighborhood watch is watching and reporting and not acting out alone. What an idiot.
I have a hard time accepting that the alleged neighborhood watch captain called the 911 emergency number 46 times to report everything BUT emergencies.
Where I'm from, we see the things he was reporting all the time. Generally, we don't report them because we're not that worried about them. An open garage door? Children playing in the street? Seriously? People we don't recognize walk by every day. If anything warrants a phone call, it's on the non-emergency 'business' line. Goes to the same place, but it's clearly identified as not as high a level of priority that a 911 call should be.
Apparently just keeping a log of observations wasn't good enough for this guy. On the other hand, given that where I live we have no neighborhood watch let alone anyone who actively patrols the neighborhood, I'm guessing that there has been some significant instances of crime that happened there and presumably the residents were not only fed up, but anxious to see the problem resolved.
It might very well be not just one man who was paranoid, but rather that he is the face of the neighborhood who elected or appointed him to be the neighborhood watch captain.
Neighborhood Watch volunteers are not supposed to be armed. They are only to be eyes and ears. They aren't supposed to confront. They are to report only. This person is going to be charged with murder. That is what he committed. Murder. In Florida that is a capitol crime. Too bad they retired Ol' Sparky.
The guy chases the kid, corners him, and then claims self-defense when the kid tries to get away because he has no idea who's chasing him? I heard the 911 call Zimmerman made, and the dispatcher asks him "are you following the person?" and Zimmerman says "yeah" and then the dispatcher says "yeah don't do that." Yet he did it anyway and now a child is dead.
I hate it when I catch myself thinking like you, but I think you may have a great point and I agree, after all you know what they say about when two or more come into agreement!
I urge justice and perhaps the Florida Law needs to be revisited...
Okay I have posted this a couple of times, but wanted to support my fellow Texan DocHolliday on this!!!
I grew up with guns in our house. We hunted and I have done so all my life. I have never killed anyone. I have guns in my home now. For hunting and self defense. My guns are in my home, where if we are under attack I can use them if absolutely necessary. That is why they are in my home. If we travel, I carry one with me so that if we are on the side of the road in the middle of nowhere (which we have a lot off here) I can defend myself or my family IF absolutley necessary. In all cases, they will have to bring the fight to me and I will defend wilth as little as possible or as much as it takes.
THAT IS NOT what happened by what we know at this point. He was told to stand down by the authorities. He did not. Thus, HE carrired the fight to the kid. We don't know much else except that because of his actions a young man is dead. The color of the boys skin is important because in this case he was profiled. I wish I was wrong, but I am not.
This is manslaughter at the VERY least. Appears to be a murder except that it will be hard to prove pre-meditation. Just an absolute shame
I've left my garage door open before. Neighbors come knock my door to point it out to me, they don't call 911. This Zimmerman is nothing but an unbalanced, racist control-freak with a gun.
Gee. Another gun-violence incident in America. What a shock. How could this have happened? It must never happen again! But you can't take our guns from us because guns don't kill people... blah, blah, blah.
Until we can have a reasonable adult discussion about guns in this country, things like this will continue happening, and families will be forced to grieve untimely deaths due to crazy people with guns.
Another example of a whacko, nut case, moron, imbicile who got a hand gun.
The wannabe cop is listed as a "Watch Captain". Sounds like he wanted to be the "Shoot Captain".
I hope the family gets justice. I also hope they know that a good deal of people who are outraged and signed the online petition are white. Although there are a good deal of racists still out there, I believe there are more people that are not. We will not sit idly by while a child of any race is killed by an adult just because of the color of their skin. Crap like this makes me ashamed to be white, especially when you start reading comments by obvious racists. I can't believe this man is still out there walking around.... it just defies logic.
We tell our kids to be aware of strangers... and to run when approached. I'm sure this kid thought twice about running because of his race. I've heard a lot of young black men state that they're careful NOT to run out of fear of something like this happening. A running black man must be guilty of something. That's what history has proved to them. Florida is trying to keep that history alive.
Hey Gun Nuts - Is this an example of the protection and how "Guns Save Lives" BS you're always shoveling? How on earth was this nutbag permitted a gun and a fake title of made-up authority?
Why was this neighborhood a gated community? Why did this neighborhood have a
Neighborhood watch program? How many crimes were committed in this neighborhood
in the last year? The last 5 years?
This boy and his Dad was visiting someone in this community. Why didn't the
person tell his visitors about the community rules?
This kid is worried about someone watching him...and he calls a friend instead of 911?
You can reason like that because you are an adult. It's been medically said kids don't have their brains fully developed until 18 or older. That's why underage kids need to be protected. Because most likely, they won't have the full capability to make a sound decision in an extreme danger situation.
Astounding that there are those who desperately need to believe this guy is white. Once more, this guy is Hispanic and when you look at his photo, he could easily be the next Frito Bandito.
Don't blame the gun Travis-1944. It didn't shoot the kid, the man holding it did. He could have just as easily beaten him to death with a baseball bat. The problem here is the incesant and on-going racial discrimination and bigotry that is present here. After all of these years it still rears its ugly head in our society. For some reason it just won't go away. I sometimes believe that there is a concerted effort on the part of some in our society to perpetuate it just out of their own hatred and warped personalities.
I'm pretty sure the kid didn't think he was in any real danger, just unnerved by the person following him. Then when Zimmerman confronted him, it was too late. I hope Zimmerman gets the full force of the law for punishment.
Like DocHolliday I too have many guns and some have been in the family for generations. I just bought an XD 40 here in Florida for my protection so I'm not a gun control freak. With that said I really believe the no retreat law in Florida is really insane in respects it gives a person a right to kill simply by making the claim of self defense. I believe the intent of the law may have been good but it leaves open a claim that cannot be disproved since the other party cannot deny the claim. With the law as it stands now, I could go into a bad neighborhood, gun down a few "bad gang members", then claim self defense, and probably get away with it.
On the other side of the argument, when I lived in Ohio I was told by the sheriff deputy that if someone was breaking in my home and I shot him before he got completely inside, I should drag him the rest of the way in then put a knife in his hand. A person should not have to do that either. If the person is breaking into your home and doesn't heed the warning to stop you should be allowed to send him to his maker without repercussions.
The difference here is the fact whether or not a crime was committed. Trayvon was not breaking any law and Zimmerman had no authority to stop him from walking in the neighborhood simply because he was black. That's the only thing Zimmerman knew...Trayvon was black with a hoodie over his head. Not enough reason to confront the kid. Even in a gated community.
Apparently it's okay to carry a concealed weapon in FL as long as you are registered as a paranoid schizophrenic with obsessive compulsive behaviors.
CaptainHeartMan,
What rules are you talking about? You're not allowed to walk around by yourself? Don't be such a dumb ass and keep focusing on the wrong things. Focus on the fact that you have a mentally unstable, racially profiling, cop wannbe, trigger happy fool patroling those streets.
Bart Conner,
I totally agree with you. I find it funny every time something like this happens, some misguided self-righteous person always talks about how racism will never end if we don't stop playing the race card. Racism will end when people stop subscribing to racial stereotypes and acting upon them. The race card is only a symptom of the actual issue, which is racism.
Here's my plan:
1) Invite everyone I don't like to a fun vacation in Florida
2) Bring gun
3) Start individual fights with everyone I don't like
4) Shoot them
5) Claim 'self defense' under Florida law
6) Profit
Since apparently in Florida it is perfectly legal to start a fight with someone, then kill them in 'self-defense'... regardless if you are armed and the other person isn't.

What rules are those? No blacks out after 7pm? No Skittles in public view? No hoodies?
Welcome to the U.S. , every nut can carry a gun. If you do'nt like something,just shoot it.
If you are white,its your God given right. If you are a minority you just go to Jail.What God are we talking about ?
"Why didn't the person tell his visitors about the community rules?"
And what rules would those be, exactly? No walking down the street while black? Seriously?!?! From every last detail that has been reported in every reputable news source I have seen, this kid did nothing wrong. Nothing. He had every right to walk to the store and back without being accosted by a nutjob with a gun and shot dead. What is this world coming to?
The more information that comes to light about this tragic story, the worse Zimmerman looks. If I was Zimmerman I would be very, very worried right about now.
Butch, relax. Don't be so hard on the man. He's the victim here. Isn't he?
Poor Mr. Zimmerman felt threatened by this "black male" walking through the compound with his hand in his pants. He was frightened. Apparently he had a terrible experience as a child involving a bag of Skittles. And that was only heightened by his fear of iced tea ever since his mother made him drink all of his tea at dinner when he was five. He was so afraid of this horrible teenager that, despite the fact that the police told him NOT to follow or engage the "suspicious person" he felt compelled to follow him, engage him, and shoot him. After all, you never know when some high school football hero might try to Skittle you to death!
I apologize to everyone here. This is making too light of a very serious situation. Zimmerman obviously was racist. He, countless times, called police regarding other black (suspicious persons). He also, equally obvious, has a self-esteem issue which compels him, despite the fact that he has no real official standing in the community, to prowl the streets at night pretending to some degree of importance. Did he think he was protecting the precious neighborhood from some horrible, villainous criminal teenager? Did he expect to be carried through the streets on his neighbors' shoulders, praised for his great deed of slaughtering a 17 yr old high school student in cold blood?
Honestly, I am equally appalled by the residents of this community who took no action other than to cower behind their doors as the teen screamed for help until Zimmerman fired on and murdered his unarmed victim.
Is there really any way anyone could find some justification for this butcher's actions? Maybe. But only if he got a good lawyer to argue diminished capacity. Kind of ironic. An hispanic racist shoots and kills a black. One victim of racism victimizes another victim of racism. If the state and/or the federal government does not take action against this man, there is no justice in America. Zimmerman had apparently been prowling for 'suspicious' blacks in the neighborhood for months looking for trouble. Well, I hope he finds more than he can handle in this case.
Do I wish him dead? Of course not. That is a horrible mentality. But, I suppose my mindset might be even worse. I would wish him the next fifty years of his life spent in prison or a mental hospital contemplating his actions. And, even more so, I would wish a court would require him to spend the rest of his life making amends, to whatever extent that might be possible, to Trayvon Martin's family.
sepp jancsik - Zimmerman wasn't "white" so I guess you're posting on the wrong story. Nice try though...close but no cigar.
Shuklac - you say "Since apparently in Florida it is perfectly legal to start a fight with someone, then kill them in 'self-defense'... regardless if you are armed and the other person isn't." You can really only make that statement if Zimmerman is either not charged or found not guilt. I get the feeling this guy is going to pay the price. The no backdown rule will not save him in this case as he was the aggressor as he himself stated in his 911 call.
i'm surprised that i haven't seen some crazy comment yet like "if that kid would've had a gun, he could've protected himself! YAY GUNS!!!" though there are 7 pages of comments and who has that kind of time...
I have 2 teenage sons and this story makes me sick. I grieve for that mother, and wish I could give her a hug and tell her it will be alright; but it won't be alright, because Zimmerman took her son's life in the most cowardly way possible.
Floridians need to get their heads out of their @** and change this "law" which does nothing but give every person with a racist (or other type) grudge a license to shoot people they don't like. Zimmerman should have at least been arrested, but that would really be all the cops could do because he claimed "self defense". That is how stupid this law is. Thank god for the 911 call. Consider this too, if his mother and family had not screamed long and loudly about this, none of us would even know. That is tragic in and of itself.
And don't even get me started on Concealed Carry, because that's how this jerk was able to walk around armed in the first place. Sickening.
This idiot sounds like a real turd...calling 911 for neighborhood watch so many times for situations like open garage doors and kids playing outside! Sounds like this guy is a baffoon but I don't know by the letter of the law if they are going to be able to do anything about it...it's really a sad tragedy to think this guy is probably going to get away with what sounds like murder to me.
He put his hoodie on because of the rain!??? I would like to have a black male suspicously walking around your houses late at night, and see how you respond! I know, you would just go to sleep, leave your doors unlocked and not worry about it! Because the black youth of today is such an honest, and upstanding generation of people. I mean, just listen to how "non-racist" the highly educated rap "artist"(couldn't think of a more appropriate word) are today, and the peaceful law abiding music. No we won't change our law's, and yes most of us are carrying. Don't come in our neighborhood's if you don't live here, acting shady!!! If your 17, you don't need to be out wondering around neighborhood's you don't live in late. Oh, and if your going to show pictures of your kid on the news, don't make them from 5 yrs ago when he was clean cut! I wasn't there, and I hope justice is served!! But if these animal's of this generation dont' change their way of acting, they will get shot!!!!!!!! Come enjoy Florida's beaches, but act right while here!!
This guy is, from all the evidence reported so far; unstable and dangerous.
Why is this guy still free ?
Is there some kind of cover-up here ? Smells like it !
Well the fact that he was let off on 'self-defense' by police, wasn't even tested for alcohol/drugs as per standard procuedure in homicide cases... remains a free man.... and that the police were not even going to bother putting this case up to the DA UNTIL people began protesting about it and the media began picking it up, leads me to wonder....

It was shortly after 7pm.
I'm coming to your neighborhood, with my hoody on, and I'm going to walk right through it with Skittles and Iced Tea. You gonna shoot me?
@ Ray -
Geez....can you stereotype an entire group of people a little more please! Your bigotry is showing..and i'm white!
What is wrong with all of you screaming about the race card and this law creating open season on minorities! You are all acting like this happens daily down in Florida...don't get me wrong I think this Zimmerman idiot needs to be strung up by his marbles but quit acting like this is an everyday thing and that we need to change gun laws. Are we going to stop selling butcher knives and steak knives every time someone is killed by a knife? If someone is deranged and wants to find a way to kill they will. This case sounds every bit like a loose cannon went off the deep end and it is an absolute tragedy for this young man and his family. Hopefully with all of the outrage soem good will come from this.
It wasn't late at night. It was 7pm, just after dark. He wasn't looking through people's windows, he was looking at houses from the sidewalk. I'm sick of people trying to sensationalize and make it seem like Trayvon was doing something he shouldn't have been doing. All you paranoid types that say he sounded dangerous are part of the problem and probably shouldn't own guns. Zimmerman WILL be tried for murder, and if he somehow gets off, I wouldn't want to be in Florida that day.
Why did a mental incapacitated ex-felon own a gun and how did he become "captain" of anything given his felon status. His photo we saw on the video was pointed out by another commentator in one of these boards was from his orange county mug shot for an offense back in 2005.
Given the number of 911 calls he had made over the corse of a month for non-emergency issues, why was he not arrested for abusing the 911 system. That is the law, no matter where you live. Most likely, this "boy who called wolf" too many times didnt get the police response it should have ... they probably thought it was "just another of his calls" until he stated he got out of his car to follow the kid. No where, over the time frame of this adult's stalking and pursuit of a minor child, has the response time to this incident been reported by the news. Many times, they will brag it only took 3 minutes to rescue people. How long did it take, given who was calling 911 initially, did the police response take to get there considering they knew someone "mentally challenged" with an ex-felon record who was lisenced to carry a gun and had self-reported he was stalking someone that he considered "suspicious" (once again).
How long was this kid talking to his girlfriend, who he called after becoming afraid of this stalker until he was accosted by this pervert. We know it is shorter than the time between when this guy called 911 and when he murdered this child.
And again, how does a mentally deficeint ex-felon qualify for a gun license ANYWHERE??
When did this neighborhood "Watch" program elect this clown "Captain" of it, and then turn it into a neighborhood vigilante, shoot every black kid in a hoodie, and call it self defense program? This is unbelievable! The fact that this clown act is still in that neighborhood, and probably still armed is an outrage! Makes me sick to my stomach that society as a whole is this dysfunctional! Anyone patrolling my neighborhood as a watcher best not be packing a gun with them unless they want it shoved up their proverbial corn hole! God Bless the family of this young man, and may lady justice find her way to your front door Mr. Zimmerman!!!!
The police stepped in it big time by not arresting this guy and essentially brushing this under the rug. When the FBI comes into the case they also look at the police, I bet some of those men and even the head of the police wish they could turn back the clock and arrest this Zimmerman.
Ray,
I'm sure the statement I'm about to make comes to you as no surprise....You are a FIRST CLASS A$$!!!
Bart
Perfect Description.
Not so perfect.
Paranoid people really aren't real world examples. There are plenty of racists, just as there are other prejudices. The race card is thrown out so often that real racism gets lost in the shuffle.
I personally have not heard or read the more obscure details of this crime, only the headlines and the basics.
However, though it has not been stated, if he was, in fact, a convicted felon, not only would he not be eligible to be granted a permit to carry a firearm, under federal law, he is prohibited from effectively even touching one. Acquiring one as a felon is, itself, a felony, and can land a person in a federal penitentiary for a number of years.
If the mug shot was only for a misdemeanor arrest, then generally he could have firearms and ammunition, UNLESS it was for a domestic assault or abuse. Then, under federal law, it's treated exactly like a felony. I know of many cases where men convicted of misdemeanor domestic assault received jail time for a stray .22 rimfire cartridge or an old shotgun shell being found in a junk drawer, in the seat cushion of their old work truck, a box of old family belongings in the attic, etc.
In response to some other comments that appear here, anyone can claim 'self defense' any time they want to, just as anyone can sue anyone for whatever they want to. Making the claim doesn't mean that that's what happened, that it carries any weight, or that a jury would concur with it. I can tell you that any claim of self defense needs a few elements to be valid. One of the basics is that you cannot get off on self defense while committing a felony, which may have some bearing here. It is absolutely untrue that the Florida law or any similar allow you to just shoot anyone who you don't like or feel uncomfortable with. You are just not required to run from them first, which is something some people (elderly, partially disabled, etc.) have a very difficult time doing. It still has to be a legitimate case of self defense otherwise, which means you have to be in actual danger from someone who has the motive and means to hurt you. Unless Mr. Zimmerman was a midget, what was it about a 17 year old teenager that would have made him fear for his life? He can't exactly claim the kid had a deadly weapon, since he didn't.
As many others have stated, it is absolutely a homicide, and probably not a justifiable one. Why the local police have been dragging their feet on it is a mystery to me.
No one will go away thinking you are clean cut.
The minute Zimmerman got out of his car to pursue Martin, after the police 911 operator told him not to, he lost all claims to self defense or the stand you ground law. This is a simple case of a racist vigilante who was itching to shoot someone. In addition, neighborhood watch policies say that watch members are supposed to observe and report, not try and intervene, and should not be armed. Zimmerman deserves to be charged with second degree murder with a hate crime enhancement, since his actions were no doubt racially motivated. Zimmerman should be immediately taken into custody and bound over for trial.
It's a disgrace to Florida, that this young boy lost his life... I blame the shooter and two others... First the lobbyist for the NRA and the former Governor, Jeb Bush... If it were not for the big money put up buy the National Rifle Association the stupid Law in place would not be there...
My heart goes out to the parents and family... I can only hope that true justice will be served...
gun control.
If it were my son, I'd sure as hell take advantage of the Florida law, shoot Zimmerman, and claim self defense. It appears to be working for Zimmerman.
I bet if this "young man" was white the feds wouldn't investigate.
Also, I have the feeling there's more here than meets the eye.
Approx. half of the articles I have read and news reports I have listened to have described the shooter/killer as a "self-appointed" neighborhood watch, or "one-man neighborhood watch." It is good that a grand jury will finally look into this case (after more than two weeks have passed, with no action or detailed investigation by the police.
My neighborhood has a legitimate, organized "Neighborhood Watch" formally supported by the local law enforcement entity. Each residence has a telephone call list (the phone numbers of immediate neighbors within 500 feet of our own homes. And the County Sheriff sends an outreach deputy to each quarterly Neighborhood Watch meeting to report on crime trends, and meeting minutes are sent to each residence.
The results: In the past year or two, our 'Neighborhood Watch' has found that the most serious "crime" issue in our area is that teens have been stealing the Neighborhood Watch signs in the middle of the night to hang on the wall of their bedrooms as trophies; a rather humorous bit of irony when you think about it. ;-)
We DO NOT have self-appointed vigilantes with guns walking the neighborhood and confronting and challenging people who have the "wrong" look, behavior or skin color in the eyes of the vigilante.
This shooter/killer was NOT part of a legitimate neighborhood watch.
Bart Conner
Sounds like cold blooded murder by a paranoid man with a gun.
_____
This is as the gun-nuts -- most of whom are unbalanced racists looking for opportunity to find out what it's like to kill a human, while getting away with it -- and the NRA want it. And the NRA is currently lobbying to repeal laws which prohibit the mentally defective from having guns. As it already is, most gun-nuts, by their own disregard for fact, reason, and responsibility, are unqualified to have guns.
Now the acquiescent public is going to be forced to confront the full implications of the stupid "Stand your ground" law: in view of presumption of innocence, and the fact that everyone has the same rights, criminals are also being protected in their claims of self-defense. But let's see the majority of sane citizens succeed in their efforts to repeal this law up against the mega-bucks minority of loons that is the NRA and its equivalent collections of dim-wits, nut-cases, criminals, and domestic enemies.
This is what happens when a majority relies on others to tell them what the facts and realities are instead of taking responsibility for educating themselves.
This isn't about the Second Amendment; this is about the lies told against the Constitution, Second Amendment, and the Framers themselves told by the gun industry, and those who hate Framers, Constitution, gov't, and rule of law because they interfere with their predations.
GrouchyDude
I bet if this "young man" was white the feds wouldn't investigate.
Also, I have the feeling there's more here than meets the eye.
_____
If the young man -- boy, actually -- were white, he wouldn't be dead.
What "more than meets the eye" here is your failing to admit that you're a racist. The only "evidence" you need is "I have the feeling" and "skin color".
Admit it: your name is Zimmerman.
I am amazed at how many "punks" are hanging around calling people racists just because it's the fashionable and righteous thing to do.
Long live the NRA!
jnagarya you have a flawed understanding as to what the NRA promotes and expects. They are for the safe, legal, and responsible use of firearms. They do not condone what zimmerman has done in this instance. I can tell you have intentionally kept yourself from interacting with any person who is pro-gun because the vast majority of gun owners out there are not interested in using their firearms to gun someone down. If you would like to see only irresponsible people having firearms then by all means keep promoting excessive gun control laws. If you think for one second that something as silly as a man-made law will keep determined criminals from getting their hands on a gun then you are in for a nasty surprise.
I don't necessarily think the law is bad in nature. If someone were trying to break into my house and a neighbor saw it and stopped him by any means, I would appreciate it immensely. I also think if one is confronted by someone threatening, they should be able to protect themselves without having to try to run. If the person has a gun or knife and you run, you could still be killed.
However, if you do use deadly force on another person, you had better be able to make a real good case that there was a real danger to yourself or another person. That certainly is not the case here. This guy was clearly targeting Dayvon. He needs to be charged with murder and I think the evidence is strong that it was a hate crime. They only released 6 of the previous 911 calls. They need to look at all of them, and if it is clear that he was focusing mostly on black people along with the racial slurs he used, it will clearly be a hate crime.
If Zimmerman gets before a court of law, you can bet he will be charged with murder because the jury would be afraid of the ensuing riots if he's acquitted.
On the other hand, if he actually is guilty, then he should be charged with murder. Like I said in an earlier post, there may be more here than meets the eye.
With a slew of post office shootings back in the 70's and 80's, the phrase "Going postal" was born. Unfortunately for the fine members of the Zimmerman family who had nothing to do with the actions of one Loser Zimmerman, their family name will be known from now on to mean killing someone claiming self-defense, with no witnesses. My condolences on the stain to your family name. Regardless of how any court may (or may never) rule on this, Zimmerman will always be thought of as guilty, kind of like O.J. The guy should have backed off. He was not fit to be patrolling any neighborhood, most especially while armed.
I think the police should have been more proactive. When someone calls 40 times with complaints such as children are playing in the street and someone left their garage door open, the police need to check this person out. They are obviously paranoid. The cops should check whether they have a weapon, and whether they possibly pose a threat to the community.
A little common sense can go a long way. The cops are supposed to protect us, not just clean up afterwards. I know they can't catch everything before it happens, but this guy was sending clear and repeated signals for a long time.
More than meets the eye?
Yeah, you are absolutely right, because for this guy's bogus 'self defense' explanation to be legitimate MEGATRON and mfkn OPTIMUS PRIME would have to be involved somehow.

We would need to double the size of police forces in order to deal with the sheer number of armed paranoid whackjobs that call the police constantly. Every neigborhood has one.
Zimmerman should get a medal for valor.
Zimmerman should be given a thorough psychiatric evaluation and a small, quiet room by himself. He needs to be removed from society since he is clearly a well-armed, self-appointed danger.
Lot's of people here are willing to condemn this guy without knowing enough information. We don't know what happened. Only two people were there and one is dead. It doesn't look good for Zimmerman but I think we need to withhold our judgment of him based on minimal hearsay.
Here is why it is difficult to withhold judgment:
This case was murder, pure and simple.
Both sides of this are taking it to the extreme. It was one wacko. Not a reason to start a race war against hispanics.
Bracchus, you forgot that Zimmerman still has his gun, too.
Phone conversation=
0% facts,
100% hearsay.
The 17 year old initiated a confrontation.
that is why no arrest have been made.
Was the 17 year old tested?
after he had been cuffed and questioned,
they also took the word of the witnesses and the evidence at the scene itself.
Zimmerman was on the phone with 911 throughout most of this ordeal.
Zimmermans call was taped for the record
Trayvon Martins conversation is all hearsay.
Ray-2459046 for racist outburst.
No thank you.
Ray-2459046 banned for racist outburst.
No thank you.
If Zimmerman was scared then, he should be terrified, now. Even if he gets off with the courts, someone is going to find him, and show him what "vigilante justice" is like on the receiving end!
Even if he escapes conviction, he will be broke the rest of his life.
I feel he's going to "rabbit" shortly.
Pressure's mounting and he's in hiding now.
The reason why vigilante justice is banned is because vigilantes screw up way too often. Oftentimes they kill or injure innocent people instead of actual criminals.
Or maybe because of that pesky 6th Amendment to the Constitution...
Oh, what the heck, if he's not charged and arrested, if he's not put on trial and he get's away with this cold-blooded murder he'll have it made! He'll hire a ghost-writer (I don't think he's intelligent enough to write a book on his own), tell his outrageously untruthful side of the story, make a million dollars, go on TV talk shows, go on a book tour and die a rich man, all because he's an ignorant racist jerk who, out of pure hatred and fear, took an innocent boy's life!
Let's hope I'm wrong and he get's life in prison without parole, but we all know that probably won't happen...
You said constitution and here come the loonies. Please don't say constitution; the people who are so full of it because they have not taken a constitutional in days start with their moronic nonsense.
He called 911 for pressing emergencies such as open garage doors and children playing outside after the street lights came on? Now, where I come from, you can get cited for repeated abuse of the 911 system.
I'm guessing that shortly we will have interviews with other local saying he was a strange guy you yelled at the kids for touching his grass but we NEEEEEEEEVER thought he'd do something like that. Followed buy the obligatory relative who insists what a big generous heart the guy had.
TNRebel - stupid post and nothing to do with the subject. I hope Zimmerman spends the rest of his life in jail - in general population!
Don't you worry Susie; we are all following this and will ensure Justice is done for this poor boy. What exactly was this guy that shot Trayvon defending himself against? A candy bar, or soda. This boy didn't have a black belt in karate, I don't think. Zimmerman will not get away with this one; no way! I believe having a few well known celebrities involved will also help. I blame the local police department for having to be forced to do something.....they must have a terrible track record with the black community. Someone should follow up on this. Did the shooter have any serious injuries, did he have any bruises from a scuffle? Was a knife even found? What provoked him having to use a lethal weapon? Can't wait to hear the details.
The Hispanic man was watching him because he was black, it was reported that there was numerous break-ins in the neighborhood by blacks. Was the guy over the top, yes. But ask yourself, is there a history of blacks robbing, murdering, and theiving? Black peoples reputations are earned, just ask the 49 people in Chicago shot this weekend whom a vast majority were black. If the man is guilty we have a justice system that will take care of it. As of making this about race the reputation is earned. I prayed for both families last night.
geo-1957883 - your assumptions show a total lack of maturity and are more than part of the problem. I can assume that anyone who makes blanket statements about a race should be put away because they may do harm to people for no reason but that isn't the law, nor is shooting someone because of their color. I can name as many blacks who are good, upstanding citizens. Your assumption just shows total ignorance. Your comparisons to Chicago have nothing to do with this story.
so with your logic...white peoples rep is earned too...for hundreds of years of treating anyone who is darker than them like animals...latest scoop...his call to his friend saying a man was following him...that says it all..i have taught my children to watch out for strangers...Zimmerman was a stranger to Trayvon and following him...
Ask yourself this those doubting Trayvon and this...Why did Zimmerman follow him...why did he confront him...why did he disregard authorities, why did he not just ask the boy where he was going from his vehicle or offer to walk him to his Dad's house to make sure he safely got home...
Because he assumed Trayvon was a criminal...why? Because he was black and in a hoodie...wow.
By that same logic, I can stop and question every white person who comes into my neighborhood because 39% of ALL hate crimes, not just racial but ALL hate crimes are committed by Whites against Blacks whereas it's 2% the other way around. And as far as the history of Blacks robbing, murdering and thieving, it ain't nothin' compared to the history of Whites. Blacks rob liquor stores, Whites rob continents, Blacks murder individuals, Whites murder peoples and cultures, Blacks steal cars, Whites steal countries. So try again.
Zimmerman is not a hispanic last name. His Father is white and his mother is Latino.
You said: "There a history of blacks robbing, murdering, and theiveing? Black peoples reputations are earned"
I say: "There is a history of over 200 years of white men of robbing, murdering, and theiving committing crimes againts the Africans brought by force against their own will to America. It is an reputation that white people have earned."
All white people are not criminals just like all black people aren't criminals but we have to stand against any form of racisim that is still ever so clear, present and dangerous in 2012.
geo-1957883 are you serious - it doesn't matter what the history of black people is that doesn't mean this young man deserved to be stalked and murdered. White people are know to be child molesters and rapist does that mean I should treat them all as such because they've earned that reputation, Hispanics are known as illegals and drunk and Asians are know to be horrible drivers, that doesn't give you or anyone else the right to pass judgement on a person you don't even know because of their race. This entire incident is about race the boy was followed by a paranoid idot with a gun who was afraid of black people, Zimmerman looks hispanic should I assume he was drunk. Your post is disgusting and adds absolutly nothing to this disscussion.
Katz, what do you call 49 people shooting each other in Chicago? Of whom the vast majority were black! Seeking Sanity, Why all the press for this incident? And none for the little Hispanic girl in chicago both seemed innocent. Answer political gain! Let me get this straight black on black crime OK, hispanic on hispanic crime OK, black on white crime OK, hispanic on white crime OK, but not prosumed white on black!
Where are all the "let's hear the other side of the story!!!" guys?
Here's my plan:
1) Invite everyone I don't like to a fun vacation in Florida
2) Bring gun
3) Start individual fights with everyone I don't like
4) Shoot them
5) Claim 'self defense' under Florida law
6) Profit
Guns don't kill people, morons with guns kill people.
Shuklack, if you have any toddlers you want to get rid of this is a great state for that too. Just don't keep them in the trunk for too long!
Seeing that FBI criminal profilers have clearly shown that the vast majority of twisted, serial killers are white males, I guess ANY white male I see, I should treat like a potential serial killer.
And since Sexual Offenses records show that most cases of incest and child molestation involve heterosexual male family members, I should treat all the men in my family like they are about to molest their kids or their nieces, cousins etc.
And since the majority of terror attacks on home soil have been by Muslims, EVERY Muslim I encounter, I should treat like a terrorist.
This is the kind of stupid thinking that gets innocent people hurt. It also allows for generalizations to blind you in cases where the one you least suspect is actually the criminal and blind people from atrocities because they can justify their reaction as fear.
In actuality, a black kid walking, by himself, though a predominantly white neighborhood has more to fear than the residents there just as the lone Arab on the plane has more to fear from the other passengers looking at him with suspicion than they from him.
The part I hate about the Trayvon case is the fact that the police never took Zimmerman down to police headquarters to take a statement from him about what happened. Never tested him for drug or alcohol which is suppose to be done after a homicide. Does this law only cover shooting people you don't know and non members of the family? What would happen to me if I shot my wife then claimed self defense? Would they believe it? I don't think so.
What a worthless, thoughtless and lying comment. But hey, as long as it riles the stupid, what the heck, right?
@ geo-1957883 I'm part black so whats my deserved reputation???
Rick's Real...heshe does it all the time. He tries to bring the President into every single comment he/she makes. Tries to get those of us who support the President to bite and he/she does it all the time.
This is a sad story but very typical. Guns don't kill people. Stupid people with guns kill people and sadly there doesn't seem to be an easy answer. I want to be able to carry a weapon if I want, but I don't want crazy people to be able to carry a weapon...but how do we regulate who is crazy and who isn't? Tough call.
gina- you have all the qualifications to be president.
Nice racist jab there Concernedvet .... still butthurt over your crushing defeat 4 yrs ago by a black man ?
How about the beat down your about to take this November by that same black man ?
TNRebel - the South may rise again, but rest assured there are a whole lot of Americans adept at playing Whack-A-Mole.
Come November, you'll be icing your knotty heads.
Obama/Biden 2012
The battle goes on. Obummer is half white - half black. His battle not mine.
We don't need to wait until November for clear evidence of that, TN.
doubtingthomas-1957
If Zimmerman was scared then, he should be terrified, now. Even if he gets off with the courts, someone is going to find him, and show him what "vigilante justice" is like on the receiving end!
_____
Right: vigilante justice is the RIGHT way to show that vigilante justice is WRONG.
Let me guess: your name is Zimmerman: master of incoherence.
TNRebel-4016842 Comment collapsed by the community
Constitution?..Oh, don't worry about that, the ATF, DOJ, Holder, Obama, they sure as heck don't..:)
_____
You should be able to recognize those who reject the Constitution because YOU do:
US Con., Art. I., S. 8, C. 15 The Congress shall have Power To provide for calling forth the Militia to . . . SUPPRESS INSURRECTIONS.
Geo:
I agree with you. Crimes like this happen on a weekly basis in almost every major city in this country. Why all the press for this one?
Noah- The answer is Obama needs Florida that simple, isn't that sick?
He needs to be put away for good
I just feel sick to my stomach every time I read about or think of this. The watch guy needs to be charged with 1st degree murder. Hopefully, he will get the death penalty. It is the penalty he dished out simply because the teenager was black and walking at night.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-trayvon-martin-family-20120315,0,2583523.story
looks like zimmerman may have been attacked by the kid.
No, it doesn't look at all like the kid attacked the lunatic with the gun. I read the article you posted. Not sure where you got that out of the article.
He was.
he had a head wound and a bloody nose. not saying he was definitely attacked but something happened.
Well, which ever one of YOU people said that this child attacked Zimmerman has no common sense. He was trying to DEFEND himself you morons!
HATR and vet - I invite you to post the passage that says Martin attacked Zimmerman. Otherwise, you can just shut the hell up and stop making things up.
why would i do that when i am only providing more info that people didn't have earlier. i don't know what happened and have not said i do. you really need to chill out cause you're taking this way too personally and in doing so risking a suspension from this site. you need to read the code of conduct.
Because otherwise you make yourself look like an idiot. You're providing info that doesn't back up any of your claims.
actually inferring that someone is an idiot and telling them to shut the hell up is a violation of the code of conduct and you can be suspended or banned for violating it. how do you believe i'm making myself look like an idiot when i'm just trying to get all the info possible out? i haven't made any claims but rather posted a link. it is possible that trayvon attacked him, it is also possible that he attacked trayvon. it's also possible that while following trayvon while he was running zimmerman fell down and hit his head. those are possibilities not claims.
copy and paste whatever claim you think i made.
That's how. By posting a comment like this, you make it seem as if Martin went out of his way to attack Zimmerman, when the idea is preposterous on its face. All available evidence points to Zimmerman stalking and cornering this poor kid, then shooting him when he started to lose in the ensuing fisticuffs. Mind you, Florida has the 'don't stand down' law, which makes it legal for MARTIN, not ZIMMERMAN, to defend himself. That is how you make yourself look like an idiot. So go ahead and try to ban me, I see much worse exchanges here every time I look at the comments. You're really Hurting me there, HATR.
key word in that is MAY. that is not a claim, it's a possibility. the kid may have confronted zimmerman about being followed and when he didn't like his resonse or refused to answer questions he may have attacked him or told him to F off or many other possibilities. you honestly can't see a situation where zimmerman grabs the kid to hold him for police and the kid hits zimmerman?
as for the suspending, have you ever gone back to a day old thread and looked at what tyler(a moderator) has done to the people who were namecalling and such? i've seen entire pages of people suspended and banned. the article about this case going to grand jury he's in there doing some now.
And this changes things how? Do any of those scenarios hold any legal justification for Zimmerman to kill, or do they hold legal justification for an innocent KID to defend himself? That is the only question that should be asked.
I would say as an innocent, Martin had justification (No Stand Down law and all) for telling Zimmerman to F off, or to get away from someone who is ILLEGALLY trying to detain them, or whatever action he took, even if it was a punch in the nose. But none of those scenarios are justification for killing someone.
And for the last time, I don't really care about suspension. I generally have better things to do with my time than sit on my computer all day. Your threats don't really mean a whole lot to me. *yawn*
Hatr, your post is ugly in the implication that the dead teen brought about his own murder. He deserved to be killed because he was afraid of the lunatic that acosted him, right? He "may have attacked Zimmerman" is an outrageous assumption. How can Zimmerman be attacked if he doesn't get out of his car and assault the kid? The kid was on the sidewalk and tried to get AWAY from Zimmerman. He said as much on the 911 recording. Your post based on the pile of crap uttered by that worthless cop is foolish. This was murder...
The kid was trying to get away from Zimmerman. If he fought back when Zimmerman caught up to him, then good for him! I wish he'd have had a gun to defend himself against the racist lunatic that was chasing him down.
So HatrHurter, what you are saying is Dayvon may have gone after the man that was stalking him and brandishing a weapon and that gives Zimmerman the right to shoot him. In other words, it's okay to defend yourself against a punch by shooting someone, but it isn't ok to defend yourself from someone with a gun by trying to hit him to perhaps get the gun or to try to get away? Dayvon was the one in danger. He could use whatever force he needed to to try to get to safety. Unfortunately, he didn't have a gun. I just wonder if he did have one and used it to truly defend himself, would he be sitting in prison now?
you people sure love to put words in other people's mouths. nb, you assuming i think the kid deserved to be killed for any reason is a pretty outrageous assumption.
I don't normally agree with HATR, but the rest of you need to take a deep breath and read. The article clearly says Zimmerman had injuries. We don't know how he got them, but HATR making the assumption (or guess, really) that it's possible he could've been hit is no different than any other assumption any of the rest of us are making about this case when we weren't there. Be reasonable.
boocs2006 - It does make a difference. Under Florida law (I don't agree with the law, by the way, but you mentioned legal justification, so...), if Zimmerman was attacked he had the legal right to defend himself. I still believe the guy was a racist and unstable, but this information is important if we want justice.
and LA99999 - The boy's name was Trayvon, not Dayvon.
If this was a book,you could find it in the fiction section of your local Library.
He lied. he said the recorded scream for help was his not the 17 yr old's. That's all I need to know
What if he wasn't lying? If it wasn't Trayvon's screams then there may be another victim out there somewhere.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-trayvon-martin-family-20120315,0,2583523.story
he may not have been lying as he had a bloody nose and head wound according to info that for some reason isn't being spread very well. he may have screamed while he was getting those and thought it was the one on the call.
Grasping at straws....
no, simply providing info that wasn't available earlier. make your own conclusion about the info and stop making assumptions about my intentions.
You and your links, and still you can't read.
funny you mention that since you obviously have not read the code of conduct on here, especially the part about namecalling. if you choose to remain ignorant to certain parts of this story then don't read all the info you can, i prefer to have all the info.
We've read those reports, and under Florida's own laws, you don't have to back down if cornered and threatened. Which would mean Martin was fully within his rights to defend himself. You can have 'all the info', but it certainly can't help you think any clearer.
good for you. guess what, you're not the only one on here. everyone is entitled to the information and should have all of it they can before coming to a conclusion. that is not to say that i think the kid attacked him, but rather did not know as of this article earlier that zimmerman even had any wounds.
I've read that article. If anyone should be using the self defense argument, it should be the deceased, since Zimmerman was the one who aggravated the situation.
i can agree with that. zimmerman definitely shouldn't have even been near the kid. like i said earlier to another poster, it's neighborhood watch, not neighborhood take the law into your own hands.
Ditto, David. He is lying to protect himself. And, Zimmerman's father needs to listen to the damn 911 recordings where Zimmerman admits to following Trayvon, even after the dispatcher told him not to. I think the police chief should be investigated, too, which I would imagine will be part of the DOJ's investigation. And, Hatr_Hurtr: stop coming back with your little threats about the "rules" of conduct on here. It only makes you seem very childish.
Zimmerman hunted down and killed this poor kid and now his family will never see him grow into a man and watch him take on the world. I am so glad that so many people are up in arms over this.
Seriously, no one knows for certain, yet, who was calling for help. It could have been a 17 year old kid who was being stalked on his way home from a nearby convenience store with his Skittles. Or it could have been the adult who probably has 50 punds on the kid, was following in his car, got out with his gun and went after the kid. Hmmm. I may be going out on a limb here, but I'm guessing it was probably the victim that was calling for help. But then again, he can't tell his side can he?
Guys where do we go from here? When fear and hatred are present, anything will and can happen that effects us all on a human level. This is a tragic story and a life has been lost. While this family grieves, we argue over petty issues. Let's gather the facts, right what has been wronged and never allow this to happen again. Unfortunately, it will. This is how some feel safe in a world where life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness was only a dream deferred. My condolences to the grieving family and may God have mercy on the other young man involved. God help us all!!!!
"Guns don"t kill people,people kill people." The NRA must be so proud ! When the hell are we going to start using commen sense and not lobby groups to make our laws?
Never. My father always told me (and I have found it to be true), "The least common thing in the world is common sense."
The NRA is funded by the gun industry. To all those singing the NRA song, please investigate your organization, and then think and make some decisions.
Mike-753967, I can't agree with you more! I can pretend all day to have a gun in my hand and pull the trigger but no one will end up dying. So guns DO kill people!! And those who believe differently are one of two things: not in touch with reality or just don't give a damn.
You can have my gun when you pry it from my cold dead hand.
Making guns illegal doesn't make them go away. Just ask the citizens of Chicago that had a huge upswing in gun violence (iirc 10 dead, 39 wounded) this last weekend. They have some of the most stringent gun laws on the books. Besides, this isn't about guns, it's about idiocy, bigotry, and irresponsibility.
The problem is the paranoia people have that make them buy a gun in the first place.
The NRA is a business lobby group that wants people to buy more and more guns, which is why it scares you into thinking there's someone out to kill you.
Well until we can get "idiocy" and "bigotry" under control, how about we control the idiots and bigots' access to guns?
Making guns illegal will do about as much good as making drugs illegal has. In both cases, we want the market above ground where it can be regulated, not pushed underground where anything goes and distribution rights are settled by gunbattles instead of contractual agreements.
Sorry, Bart, but I did not buy a gun because i am paranoid. I bought a gun because I am a single mom living in a sketchy neighborhood. If someone were to break into my home, I need the means to protect myself and my child. A gun provides me with those means. And before you start with the "what if your kid shoots him/herself", both of us have taken gun safety classes and shooting classes, not to mention my child has hunted (with adult supervision). We respect gun safety. 'Nuf said.
Mike:
In case you didn't get the memo, criminals don't follow the law. You take away the right for legal citizens to arm themselves only puts them in more danger. The criminal will still have their gun. I, for one, like knowing that I have protection in my home.
Sadly, in the usa, guys like Zimmerman will always get their hands on a gun .....
Agree with real_life: I don't own a gun because I'm paranoid or crazy...I own a gun because OTHER people are! If and when one of them enters my home uninvited, they will leave on a stretcher.
When has "banning" anything worked?! Liquor was banned once and THAT worked like a charm! No one could find a drink, there were no underground speakeasies or anything!
If banning actually works... then I say we should ban crime!!
Lobby? when will people just call it what it is? It's bribery plain and simple. And so many children are dying because of it. You have stupid murderers trying to play the system to get a free kill and you have bullying going on in schools.
The NRA is funded by the gun industry? You don't say!
Good thing we've got you to tell us these things! I never could've guessed!
I have it on good authority that the AARP is funded by the Geritol people.
Mike, I'll bet you're good with it when lobbyist push for gun ban laws.
It's not the NRA's fault and it's not the gun's fault, it's the idiot neighborhood watch guys's fault. He wanted to be a hero and now he is a murderer.
Banning guns will result in less gun related crime ... in about 30 years. The supply doesn't change just because the law does. Better parenting would do a quicker job of reducing violence in the short term.
Zimmerman basically stalked and killed this young man!
Florida won't convict, probably won't even get an indictment in that backwards third-world hole - they'll give him a medal instead. Hopefully the DOJ does its job and puts this POS into a small cell with a few Panther members.
Sadly, you may be correct. I think the local DA can be trusted on this, but the Sanford Police have not done anything in this matter to inspire confidence. After the Sanford Police Department, the next biggest problem is the Florida "Make My Day" law. It encourages killing, and it might help the shooter get away with it. It needs to be changed, but it won't be by our NRA-funded Florida legislature.
What is wrong with the laws in Florida that they can call this justified homicide? This guy is gonna claim that the kid pointed a bag of skittles at him? He was afraid because it was a black guy in a hoodie? What an outrage this is, this guy should get life for this.
I think this time justice will be done. I'm just not sure if it'll be for the right reason. Zimmerman definitely killed this kid for no good reason, and that should be the reason, but he's also Hispanic. That probably WILL be the reason.
I'm surprised Casey Anthony didn't invoke the "at will" law.
I d try conviction, if not death penalty . Zimmerman deserves it. I was station in Florida while in the Navy. I hope this man
loses home , bank account, all his earnings past and future.
I served with all races in both army, and navy. I hate guns, even I used them in Nam. I am not allowed a firearm because mental condition. I hope this news media presses enough to convict and put this man away for life!
This article made me more certain than ever that I never want to live in Florida. Trust me I've had plenty of distasteful experiences that already had me convinced. But this story is a doozy. I can't believe the worthless trash "police" didn't even take the murderer to the station to question him, or take evidence to verify his claims.
"You just shot this 17 year old dead in his own neighborhood for buying Skittles? Oh ok, move along then, you're free to go."
I hope the FBI and justice department reams these dumb yokel cops a new one. Small town dictators that think they have the right to determine who lives and dies. We'll see how you feel when the Feds are breathing down your neck and the wrath of the populace is upon you. I bet they feel no remorse, they're just wishing their utterly foolish way of handling it never came to light.
Let's hope they take a good long look into the financial affairs ofall the senior law enforcement personnel connected with this case. This smells so bad the sheriff of this jurisdiction should be arrested and tried for polluting the neighborhood. What do we know about Zimmerman's connections on both sides of the law. Maybe he's a cartel guy that threatened these guys until they peed their pants. Maybe he has political and/or family connections to the Sheriff. At the very least, the feds should be able to make a case of depriving this man of his civil rights. I do hope they find something on these cops. My brother was a Cleveland cop working the ghetto districts, he would have dragged this Zimmerman POS into a cell in a New York minute. Who is investigating the prosecutors office? THis thing reeks of graft and corruption, or something worse. Maybe they need to be brought in and strapped to a lie detector along with the sheriff.
From the information coming out about Zimmerman it sounds as though he had been itching to shoot somebody, anybody, for quite a while. I think his life from now on will be a drive by shooting waiting to happen.
Because Zimmerman pushed the altercation and was first to use deadly force, the "Use of Force" rules in play mean that Zimmerman should face first degree murder charges -- it's premeditated and planned, even if just for a few minutes. Zimmerman had a chance to leave but chose not to.
I'm sure his defense will use self defense, but it's not a defense when Zimmerman was the aggressor.
Thank goodness the kid has his cell phone on to record the attack.
Unfortunately, the Florida self-defense laws give people the right to "stand their ground", which can include acts of aggression. That is part of the problem with all of this.
Under Florida law, you can shoot to kill if you are afraid something is going to happen to you, and you don't have to take half a step back. It was good enough for the Sanford Police Department to let the killer go with no investigations. They were not going to refer it to the DA until the protests forced the DA to take it up himself. Like this comment if you don't like the law.
fuzzy: Wouldn't/shouldn't that law also apply to Trayvon, who had every right to "stand HIS ground" when he was confronted by an aggressive armed man?
Indian River: If the armed Zimmerman was so afraid that something was going to happen to him, why didn't he just stay in his car and/or not follow Trayvon, as the 911 dispatcher directed?
But Zimmermann had a gun and Trayvon didn't. And might makes right.
I expect Zimmermenn thought he'd be the only witness, so the police would just have to take his word for it.
However...
@HadEnough-- that's actually part of the problem with the law. The way it's written, if you have a fight between two people and one kills the other, it's all legal, because either has a reasonable fear of the other (it doesn't have to be a fear that they'll kill you, just that you could be hurt). This was actually tested a couple of years ago with relation to a gang fight-- Because they were in the context of a fight, the stand your ground law made the resultant shooting self-defense.
In fact that law has been successfully used as a "get out of jail free card" by drug dealers engaged in gun battles, even when innocent bystanders have been killed.
Wow! It's been a long time since I was in Florida, and hearing that, it will be forever before I cross that state line again! Thanks for the info...
Zimmerman was not defending himself. Anyone who buys that is a fool. He stalked the kid. He called 911 and called the kid the N word and refused to stop stalking him after the real authorities told him to stop.
Where the hell can anyone get self defense out of that situation?
He sounds like he has serious emotional issues, a wanna-be police officer, looking for a reason to feel important/needed. I'm curious to know if he ever has worked as a security guard or if he has sought employment or training as a police officer.
yep, I thought the same thing once I read about his other calls to police. very, very sad story!
The forty-six 911 calls made by Zimmerman over things as mundane as a neighbor's garage door being open and kids playing outside at dusk should have resulted in citations and the resulting court appearances and fines. Did the Homeowner's Association make him "Neighborhood Captain?" They needed to reevaluate that situation as well-- though it may not have made any difference since this guy obviously suffers from extreme paranoia among other mental issues.
What's terrible is they might use his forty-seven 9-1-1 calls and paranoia in his favor and try to argue that perhaps he is insane. Which he may very well be, who knows. This is absolutely tragic and FL has got to make this right for the family. Not that anything could ever truly make it right. He took a young innocent life for no reason other than his own irrational fear and bias. May he rot in prison.
Face it people. What this Zimmerman wuss is, is just a drama queen that wants to take the focus off himself, and hope that no one discovers how he makes his money. Wonder who's social security number he's using. He's probably guilty of stealing himself. How does one like him happen to live in a gated community in the first place. I doubt very very seriously that there is or ever has been anything upstanding about him. He's the one playing the race card right now, and the poor pitiful me. Where's his bravado now? Nowhere. He's hiding, like the scared little thieving, sniveling coward that he truly is. I don't care if he's pink and purple polka dotted. You can try to defend this lily livered little yellow backed coward all you want, and it just won't wash. Decent people know what he is and no matter how many faces he tries to show, he's always going to be the little drama queen he is. I just hope justice is served. Society doesn't need his kind.
Sounds like they need a more responsible Neighborhood Watch captain. I think he took his "job" too seriously & most likely was racist by previous 911 calls.
Mary... I read he appointed himself for this job.
If Zimmerman stalked Martin then it wasn't self-defense, it wasn't manslaughter, it was murder.
Funny thing, our Florida law has screwed up the logical assumption. Can you stalk someone and then justify killing because you were afraid they were going to hit you? The law says you can stand your ground and kill if you are afraid. It does not say that you lose the right to stand your ground if you caused the problem. This is a bad law.
new info that may change things
Zimmerman had a damp shirt, grass stains, a bloody nose and was bleeding from
a wound in back of his head, according to police reports.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-trayvon-martin-family-20120315,0,2583523.story
I read that this morning, the idiot still started the fight though.
So does this mean if I want to kill someone, all I have to do is start a fight with them and get knocked around a bit?
They were wrestling on the ground. I wouldn't expect less HATR but I wouldn't expect to be killed, either.
like i've said to others, i'm just providing info that most didn't have. i wouldn't expect to be killed over it either.
HATR-HURTER
There have also been local reports of self-inflicted wounds and,of course, his quick disappearance from town. Papi says Zimmerman left because he felt threatened when described as a racist. Also, the local police chief who feels in no way obligated to explain any decisions made (such as concluding the investigation on February 26) has quite a bit to cover up/explain and this is being discussed locally. Best idea yet - bring in the FBI. Police Chief says he "welcomes" help from outside agency . . . Huh?
so if a concealed weapons carrying individual goes and knocks on zimmermans door knowing that zman may be armed and has a history of shooting to kill and asks the question "did you murder that young man?" you know just a concerned citizen wanting to get the truth of the situation, fears that zman may not be happy with the interruption and line of questioning and intends to go for his own weapon. so our self appointed private detective in defense of his self is faster on the draw and guns zman down would this same stand your ground law be relevant. kind of a rhetorical question.
no doubt there needs to be more digging trusty. i don't trust zimmerman's story or the way the cops are just outright dismissing the neighbor crutcher's story. as for the dissappearance, people are pissed about this, only an idiot would show his face in public after that.
clark, i have a feeling that on his property there would be a harder sell on that but who knows.
I really hope that the 46 prior calls to 911 are allowed in as evidence in this case. To call him a vigilante isn't correct, they avenge crimes. To call him a Good Samaritan is not correct as they intervene in crimes in progress. This guy seems to be a solution looking for a crime - so he could be some sort of hero (of a situation he created and manipulated). Well, now a crime's been committed - he's the perp, and not the hero, and he needs to be held accountable.
On another topic, how tragic for this kid and his family. By all accounts a good kid - and maybe against all odds at that. And for all of that amazing, awe inspiring potential he possessed, for that future to be summarily ended by a thug on a mission with idiotic ideas about black and white, threats and intimidation, justice and judgement... I grieve for Trayvon, not just for the loss of his life and infinite potential, but for us, because we really have not come very far at all.
God bless his family.
I believe the accused is hispanic. I know it does not make a difference in the end because the kid is still dead.
So what if Zimmermman was hispanic? Does that changes the circumstances?
Hispanics can hate blacks. Blacks can hate Jews. Asians can hate Hispanics. Bigotry can come from anywhere.
Used to be GOP:
Glad you saw the light, probably after they put the INC behind GOP.
And the hate continues to be "carefully taught" (song from South Pacific).
TNRebel
At least you openly admit you use the "N" word in casual conversation. Real classy of you.
This kid made it through the Florida system unscathed - until his death, without being arrested for anything, real or imagined ... can you understand how unlikely that is in South Florida? Thats like finding a Passenger pigeon and a DoDo bird riding on a Unicorn, in the middle of Manhatten - asking for directions to Shangri la. The system of catch 'n release seldom fails, get young black males "in the system" - its unheard of.
Even the Sanford police officers were surprised and admited as much when his Mother confronted them about running a Prior arrests search - on the victim of a homicide. With agressive policing, stop and interview of any black male seen on the street - no matter what they are doing or not doing. It has become a requirement in most cities that police generate a dossier on all Black male teens - just in case.
Maybe I don't understand how "Neighborhood Watch" works, but since when do Neighborhood Watch captains chase people down and confront them with guns? I thought the Neighborhood Watch program was there for people to keep an eye out for themselves and their neighbors, not become vigilantes.
Based on the number of times Zimmerman has called 911 for NON emergency issues...( A neighbors garage door being open??? Kids playing in the street at dusk??? ) The police may have gotten to the point where they didn't want to respond any longer. This may be a case of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf". In any case, the system appears to have completely failed Trayvon Martin. It seems this boy did nothing wrong EXCEPT walk into Mr. Zimmerman's line of sight.
How sad is it that this has become a world where a 17 year old kid can't walk home from the local convenience store with Candy and Iced Tea without fear of being shot by some over zealous "watch captain"?
My prayers go to Trayvon's family and my wishes for REAL justice ( not vigilante justice, not a slap on the wrist) for Mr. Zimmerman.
We don't have all the information for sure, but the more we know the more it seems like Zimmerman is likely guilty of least manslaughter. I feel so sorry for Trayvon's family and friends.
another wannabe cop. now he's claiming he isn't racist because he's hispanic. I'd be curious to know if he's fluent in spanish or just using some remote family history to try to make himself appear to be "one of them" The bigger picture is the authorities. What century do we live in? Only in Florida does this murdered walk among us, free from the threat of jail/prosecution while a boy lies dead because of the color of his skin. It seems little has changed in the last 50 yrs as far as the justice system is concerned. If this were the other way around a white guy was dead at the hands of a black kid, that kid would be in jail right now. That is the sad reality of it. We've changed little as a society since civil rights began in this country. very sad story.
Since he is a hispanic he may get a free pass.
Yes, we have changed significantly in terms of civil rights. 60 years ago this would not have been investigated by the FBI and it would not have been splashed all over front page news. Furthermore, this wasn't a white southern good ole boy killing a black person for drunken sport, as was done in past times, pre-civil rights.  The perpetrator here is a head case who is hispanic (good ole boys would have killed him for sport, too) who apparently didn't like black people and who was itching to shoot someone, and it all culminated in the tragic death of Trayvon Martin, and he's going to get the book thrown at him, unlike the aforementioned good ole boy. Apples n' oranges.
To Bob Spade:
Excuse me? I don't know what world you live in, but as far as I know, no race is exonerated from guilt or wrongdoing! If anything, just for being hispanic he'll be put deeper into the hole! And frankly speaking, I hope he gets charged to the full extent of the law! Seems to me this Zimmermman guy is very hostile!
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-trayvon-martin-family-20120315,0,2583523.story
new info that may change things
Zimmerman had a damp shirt, grass stains, a bloody nose and was bleeding from
a wound in back of his head, according to police reports.
I disagree that certain races don't get treated the way others do. You haven't been paying attention. Most white men don't get near the sentence that African Americans, Mexican Americans or other races get. Look at the prison populations. Sorry but white folks get off a lot easier.
It says a lot that crack possession gets you over 20 years in prison, and meth possession gets you treatment for drug addiction.
It doesn't look good for Zimmerman or the Florida PD...If I were his lawyer, I'd be begging for a deal. The evidence is just mounting like a stack of bills, and it is coming due.
It is one thing when you're defending yourself or your home and loved ones, but once he disobeyed orders and played sheriff, he crossed that line.
I have nothing but sympathy for the family of the victim...no one deserves to lose their loved one in such a fashion.
I suspect his lawyer's going to play the "stand your ground" card. "I was totally justified in shooting this kid I was stalking because when I grabbed him to make a citizen's arrest he fought back and I felt threatened."
Severed: Couldn't the scenario also read "Trayvon was totally justified in standing his ground when he was confronted by an aggressive armed bigot" ? Unfortunately, Trayvon did not survive to tell his side of teh story...and I'm certain there's more than one version of events leading up to this tragedy.
I agree with you completely, but it's his lawyer's job to spin it however he can to get a not guilty verdict.
Sadly because of the way the law's written there's a possibility it would work.
Citizen's arrest for what crime would be my comeback if I were the D.A. The kid hadn't done anything wrong. You can make a citizen's arrest, but you have to have witnessed a crime and you are also responsible for any injury to the suspect during your arrest.
Not in Florida,
Wm. Sanders
Even the cops say that it was not a lawful order, so he disobeyed nothing.
The kid started the physical violence and it did not work out good for him.
Self defense unless it can be proved otherwise.
thats mexican justice sounds to me couldnt handle it like civalized human,
Sounds to me like someone is a bit ignorant.
Where the hell do you get "Mexican Justice" from. I haven't read where it states that Zimmerman is Latino. What a racist comment and very much uncalled for right now. It doesn't matter what race the shooter is, a crime has been committed. My condelences for the family of this young man.
The majority of Hispanics in Florida are not from Mexico originally, and most are US citizens.
Actually Zimmerman's father said he is Hispanic -- not necessarily Mexican; just Hispanic. That's an ethnicity, not a race. There are Hispanics of all races - black, white, asian.
BUT...That is an indicator of the ignorance and prejudice in the country today. As soon as a bigot hears the term "Hispanic", he makes the erroneous leap to a conclusion that the person is Mexican. Race relations have not improved in this country...the only thing that's changed is that now there are more cultural groups that are victimized.
From a biological perspective, what is a Latino? I don't recall there being any ancient Latinos. Sounds more like a modern invention to me much like the construct of race. We are all human with subtle differences that make us unique. We are too diverse to be pigeonholed into racial categories.
Esoteric, I am just now seeing this post but strongly agree with you. I spent three years in Chile, Argentina and Venezuela, all delightful people who are as different as those of the nations of Europe. Why anyone would think to lump together such varied peoples into such an arbitrary group is beyond me. This would be as silly as calling us 'Nothern Europeans' .. oh ... well .. I guess they do that, too, but it is just as silly.
In fact the ancient Greek word which would translate as 'Latino' would, in fact mean either Roman, or Rome (this, by the way, is the word, Λατεινος, which reduces by the Isopsephy to 666, but then that is quite another story. We thought given your name, it might be of interest, but then you may well already know this :c).
Everything else aside, I think they could have said he was 17 instead of showing a picture of him at 13. No, it makes no difference, but I don't think I need to wade through hours/days of media crap to find out the 'child' was 17, not 10-13 as the photo seems to show.
The pictures they are showing of him are current, he is a small child with a baby face. The picture with him holding his baby sister was taken the weekend he was killed.
I beg to differ, he's 6'3".
I keep reading posts that say "He was Hispanic" for the record, in America hispanics are considered white. They started that years ago as the white birth rate started to decline. In this case, it does not matter what color the shooter was, he should be in jail, and or prison for life. But, this is America, I would NOT be surprised if the man gets off for murdering an innocent young Black Male. It's happened hundreds of times before. A Black life has little value in a racist nation. I hate to say it, but, IT'S THE AMERICAN WAY
Ron Barker, The kid was NOT 6' 3". He was small in stature, he weighed 140 lbs. Have you seen any pictures of Trayvon that resembled a stringbean? Can you picture what a 6"3" boy would look like at 140 lbs? Anniejaye posted that the picture of him holding his baby sister was taken the weekend he was killed. what proof do you have that this kid was over six feet tall? I suspect Zimmerman is over six feet tall, he weighs over 220 lbs...
Mackman- The point is that Mr. Zimmerman has not even been charged with a crime and the FBI can only charge him if they can prove this was a hate crime- which is an uphill battle.
And I agree with you, saying Mr. Zimmerman is Hispanic doesn't make it less of a race issue. it always surprises me that Caucasian Americans assume that Hispanic Americans would not be racist against black Americans- maybe because they are both shades of brown?
Stupid comes in a rainbow of colors.
There should be some racketeering charges filed in this case for extortion and obstruction of justice.
Yeah. Self defence. A 17-year-old buying candy and iced tea is so scary. I feel so bad for his family..
A 140 pound kid and a 250 pound man.
Exactly. If you were a 17 year old kid walking in a strange neighborhood, and noticed a guy in car tailing you, you'd probably get a little nervous, probably start walking faster. And if that guy kept pace with you and then got out of the car and started waving a gun around, you'd probably run. And if the nut with a gun started chasing you, you might just decide that the only thing left to do was turn and confront him in the hopes that he backed down, or that someone in the neighborhood noticed what was going on and intervened, or at least called 911.
And I loved Zimmerman's statement that Trayvon was "looking at houses." When I walk through my neighborhood, I look at houses, too. But no one's ever chased me down and shot me because of it.
flbiker: It's interesting to note that you made no mention of the color of Trayvon's skin in your scenario. I am white, and your scenario describes exactly what my reaction would be...I can only imagine how much more magnified Trayvon's terror would be as a black man in a predominantly white, gated neighborhood, given the atrocities that have been perpetuated by white men on his culture in the south for many years.
info that isn't being spread very well says that zimmerman had a head wound and bloody nose so trayvon may have attacked him.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-trayvon-martin-family-20120315,0,2583523.story
@Hatr
Well if someone's stalking me and coming up behind me I would try to defend myself as well since I don't know why they are coming after me. Did you expect him to stand there and take the bullet in silence?
@hatr_hurter, if some NUTJOB was following/stalking me, I would have fought, and defended myself too. would'nt you???
To hear anyone attempt to justify the actions of Zimmerman is disgusting. The facts leading up to the murder of Trayvon are concrete indicators in this crime.
Zimmerman followed the teenager.
~ Claiming that Trayvon looked suspicious and informing the 911 dispatcher that he was black to justify his creepy stalking behaviour.
* keep in mind that Trayvon did nothing to warrant a call to 911. Something that became increasingly apparent when Zimmerman opened his mouth. The 911 operator sensed that Zimmerman was overreacting. Hearing his breathing, she suspected that he was following the teenager, asking him directly "are you following him" and he said "yeah" alarming her to admonish him, telling him that " they did not need him to do that." But this was not harsh enough to arrest the thoughts that brewed in Zimmerman's mind. He mumbled on " they always get away" to the operator, as he continued to follow Trayvon down the dark rainy streets of Twin Lakes.
Those who claim that Black's committed a rash of break and enters (B&E's) in Twin Lakes Retreat are exaggerating, or they are distorting the reality of what is actually taking place, in their neighborhood and in their heads. Zimmerman told the 911 operator that Trayvon was looking at the houses, implying that he was scoping them out, when in fact he was looking for someone to help him. Surely someone in Twin Lakes seen Zimmerman doing this, and trust me this is not something that he just started doing on February 26 2012. No person in their right mind would justify what Zimmerman did by suggesting that a rash of B&E's incited him to murder a child. Such rationalization is such a large stretch that it becomes implausible.
In Zimmerman's world, you only need to say that you feel threatened to get away with murder. There is no way that he could have felt threatened by Trayvon. This Zimmerman character knew that Trayvon was young and that he had no weapon or means to defend himself. Trayvon was rightfully afraid because he did not know what was going on inside of Zimmerman's head. Trayvon did not know why Zimmerman was looking at him, and it made him uncomfortable enough to call one of his friends and tell him that the creep was following him. The discomfort that Trayvon felt, quickly turned into fear and panic when Zimmerman approached, and this would explain why he ran into someones back yard. His screams for help was silenced by a single gun shot to his chest. Yet some fools want you believe that Zimmerman was screaming for help just before firing the weapon. The Seminole County Sheriff's Office should have detained Zimmerman to collect evidence to prove or disprove his story. Not doing this makes them an accessory to this crime, because their incompetent actions. Evidence such as:
His shoes, clothing, fingerprints, powder residue,hair samples, blood sample, and pictures of all injures on his person. Including details about when he started following Trayvon and when he approached him and what was Trayvon's reaction to him, Why did he continue following him after being told to stand down? What compelled him to carry a weapon? Have the sheriff's office made any attempt to address Zimmerman's abuse of the 911 number?
Too much to think about, so I'll just end it here......... Disgusted.
I believe the law should read ANYWHERE in the U.S. that if you shoot someone, regardless if you claim self-defense, you should go to jail until they prove it. Since when did police take a persons word that it was self defense, if the man can't prove it and the kid is dead. He should be locked up NOW, and let the investigation go on. Why give him a chance to leave to avoid prosecution? He should have been locked up that nite it happened. You cannot claim selfdefense if the dead person has no weapon!!!!!! They proved he was on the phone at the time the murderer shot him, so what is so complicated about it? How do you commit a crime with a phone in your hand, talking, skittles and a can of tea in the other? FBI, JD, what are you waiting on? It's not making sense....ARREST ZIMMERMAN!!!!!!!!!!!
Unfortunately another minority has to be murdered over the color of his skin. I reside in Florida and the racism is out of control. But one thing is for sure I have a gun permit and I am more than willing to put a hot one in these radical white folks ass that even considered that pulling that @!$%# with me... Violence will never solve problems but being a minority in this country leaves you no choice....
I just want to know when did nneighborhood watch start carrying guns. We carry cell phones and phone in. I live in the country and we deal with drug dealers and cattle rustlers . I have yet to see any of us carry a gun.
I'm sure he would have been carrying his gun whether or not he was on a neighborhood watch. It has nothing to do with neighborhood watch, and everything to do with trying to play policeman.
I was involved with a neighborhood watch years ago, and we were specifically instructed by the police department NOT to carry weapons while "on patrol". Of course, that was years ago, and things have apparently changed since then...
My guess he was neighborhood watch because he liked to carry a gun, not carrying a gun because he was neighborhood watch.
Neighborhood watch is just that - they watch. They are not suppose to engage. They quietly observe and are there as a presence to deter crime. If they do witness a crime, they should call the police. The only time they should engage a suspect is if someone's life is in imminent danger. Most civilians just don't have the training nor experience to handle a weapon responsibly in a stressful situation. Simply training at a gun range won't give you that.
This "MURDER" shows that American society has many FLAWS.
This murder shows that there was one serious head case out there with an itchy trigger finger. Let's not blame an entire society. Oh wait, we live in the no-responsibility-for-one's-own-actions era...... Society MADE him do it. Put everyone else in jail!
Zee: Unfortunately, society is made up of individuals, and individuals like Zimmerman represent the flaws in society. You're right that this is the result of a head case with an itchy trigger finger, and that person must be held accountable for his actions...but it's also true that our society is flawed.
The flaw is the law that this guy is hiding behind. So yes, we as a society have "flaws". Don't jump on that "Anyone who says anything is wrong with America is anti-American" bandwagon. Citizens are supposed to stand up and complain about unjust (or plain old wrong) laws. If we don't, we will have no right to complain when we wake up one day in a police/anarchist state.
True CJ. The self-defense law was enacted because somebody was sent to jail who shouldn't have been, but it creates a Wild-West atmosphere. If two people with concealed carry licenses meet and, for any reason, one feels the need to pull his gun--what happens when the other person responds by reaching for their gun? Can the first person shoot the second "because he was going for his gun"? Sounds like the old quick-draw to me.
The patriotic thing to do is to always point out the flaws in your country and work to fix them.
The FLAW in society is how a man like Zimmerman with a proven record of paranoia and instability was allowed to carry a concealed weapon. The FLAW in society is how a man like Zimmerman even got to be allowed to be in a Neighborhood Watch. The FLAW in society is how a man like Zimmerman after committing such an act was not even arrested. The FLAW in society is how people like Zee have been raised and taught to think that such things don't represent flaws in society, and not to feel any need to speak up or act to change such flaws.
RUN TRAYVON RUN!!!!
Wow... seriously? Douchetard...
Not funny!
Rixster - You're a clown and most likely a right wing asshat. Please take your boring and predictable posts to a Fox news site.
Zimmerman is toast. That's a given. No let's figure out who the local police stooges were that didn't see this for what it was right from the get go and let this sleezeball walk away.
That police department should be disbanded. Outrageous!
It's rather astounding that the police didn't hold him, not only because of his actions, but even more so because he must've been a serious thorn in their side. This guy was a cop wannabe who called 911 46 times in just over a year for nothing. If I were a cop in that town, I'd at least spend some time lecturing him while I had him!
While this obviously needs to be properly evaluated in court, the argument of self-defense is laughable. If you chase an unarmed person who has not committed any crime on a public street and corner them, the justification for self-defense is on the other side. In other words, the young man would have been within his rights to fight back. This guy sure looks like he wanted to shoot someone.