trust2112, being a few inches from someone doesn't take a lot of accuracy. Just saying.

rich what is the violent past thing? You do realize all you even have to do is jerk your hand away from the police and that is considered assault, yep believe it or not we now live in a police state thanks to all of those who choose not to protect themselves.

Yeah there's the restraining order deal too, no arrest usually means no assault charges. The thing is you could have an argument with a neighbor and they could file for a restraining order against you and get it. Simply because of the better be safe than sorry!

I'm still waiting on all the evidence to come out on the case and let the courts decide either way about the case. If the witnesses and the evidence prove too be true, he is innocent of murder. Not saying he isn't guilty of making a bad decision, but, if anyone here was in that situation at the time and had a weapon, they'd done the exact same thing. Now how that would play out into the laws hands might be a different scenario.

Rich - what lies? What fake photos? Everything he mentioned has been publicly reported in news media, transcripts, etc... unlike many of the FAKE tidbits passed around in the "protest" circles that aren't facts at all. I can't find any links to any information presented by them, especially the "coon" rumor. I was about to change a bit of my view when I heard this, so I went and listened to the audio myself. Nope, can't hear "coon" at all. There is a hard "C" sound, but no hard "N" sound. I can't hear "coon" no matter how hard I try to hear it.

That is only one example of the fake information thrown out there by the "protest" community. Just one example. There have been many. And each time, it started affecting my viewpoint, but then I went to look at sources to back it up and there was nothing. Nothing at all other than some poster somewhere said it. Then I read the comments, and am appaled at the number of people that aren't even reading the articles at all. And it ALWAYS seems to be one of the protester groups doing it. They post something completely contradictory the information right there in the article they are commenting on. I only see this coming from the side of those calling for Zimmerman's blood.

This is why the tide of public opinion is turning... your group has lost all integrity. Once you have been shown to lie once, people that believed you start looking much closer at the details. And what they find is that the evidence supports Zimmerman's claims.

Now is this funny or is this funny. A complete story about how the pictures presented are outdated and YET the author doesn't include recent ones. LOL......I am so over all of this!

Nice how the author writes a story about the perception of the people, but yet states "Zimmermans past brush with the law enforcement", but then states nothing about Travon Martin's CURRENT use of drugs an being expelled from school. Guess that makes Martin an upstanding citizen of the state so nothing needs to be mentioned in the story.

@ED Ryan, very well said. @trust. it's called point-blank range. Remember Taylor was trying to take the gun so it was probably within inches of him. @Vern, Oh don't get me started on Jesse or Sharpton. I think they have done exactly the opposite of what MLK did for our people and our country.

I can understand that parents would want to portray their child as "innocent"...after all, how many times have we seen criminals charged or convicted with absolutely heinous crimes whose parents seem to always say that their child is a "good boy" or a "good boy who just made a mistake"...? I'm not sure whether it's just self-delusion or an actual disconnect with reality, but if your kid does bad things then he's not a "good boy".

Sadly, I believe Trayvon was a victim of a disfunctional home life more than anything. Children of divorce often find ways of dealing with their feelings of betrayal, etc by acting out. If his parents were inattentive, then he might have been trying to establish some odd sense of self-worth by latching onto a ganster type mentality. It's possible that this mentality drove him to confront Zimmerman rather than just let the matter go...after all, he was on the phone with his girlfriend and, more than likely, didn't want to look "soft". If he did go back and confront Zimmerman after Zimmerman lost track of him, then I'd say he contributed to his own demise because he did have the option of just walking away and returning to the home of his father's girlfriend where he was a guest.

Regardless, the fact that this is being turned into a racial issue is sickening....it's like Al Sharpton has an internal magnet for capitalizing on the death and misfortune of others. No one should ever call him a reverand...it's demeaning to all those pastors who actually are Christian leaders. Be one or the other but a Christian leader and a "civil rights" leader are mutually exclusive....after all, didn't Jesus say "Bless them that curse you...."

@ Ed ryan, well said and skipster56 good point about the Media's suppression of Trayvon's problems. So the answer is YES, using old photos has shaped public opinion, as has suppression of the deceased school, and drug problems. I'm still waiting to find out if Trayvon's blood was tested for drugs, alcohol........

Why would the media do this to influence the American Public, and in turn, spur on the "mob mentality?" Shame on them for not stating the FACTS and instead inserting their personal agenda. It does not say much for the level of journalism in this country. The New Media should not model themselves after the "tell-all" magazines found in the checkout line at the grocery store. They're supposed to be better than that. (Not so much anymore.)

Eyeguy - the police orders were "We don't need you to do that."

"The call taker’s suggestion is not a lawful order that Mr. Zimmerman would be required to follow. Zimmerman’s statement was that he had lost sight of Trayvon and was returning to his truck to meet the police officer, when he says he was attacked by Trayvon." ~ Bill Lee, Police Chief

It is absolutely amazing that any journalist would finally admit what those of us with common sense and sanity already know, which is that the media has been manipulating this incident from the beginning by their selection of photos and other published statements. What is even more amazing is that MSNBC would publish this confession on their web page.

The fact of the matter is that no one knows exactly what happened except the two people involved. None of us will ever know the complete truth, so it is incomprehensible that so many people are so ready to lynch Zimmerman based on incomplete evidence. Maybe that only goes to show how ignorant much of our population has become. The sad thing is that these ignorant individual who are so willing to lynch Zimmerman on shoddy, anecdotal evidence are also eligible to vote. If they can't be objective in this situation, then they are easy fodder for the media to manipulate into voting for the candidates who fulfill the media's hidden agenda. Our country is doomed when the public can be so easily influenced.

Ed Ryan - your comments were right on the mark until you started insulting us by questioning our ability to read. Hateful, insulting comments like that tend to override any worthwhile commentary that you have to make.

Jasmine and other with similar views - get over yourselves. You have no idea what happened.

I am so glad to see others feel the same as I do with comments like "PLEASE al sharpton and jesse jackson if you to claim to be the speakers of GOD why all the one sided racism, your hate appauls us all. You two DO NOT deserve the title to be Reverand"

These two fly around the country with a rope in hand to hang whites using the race card. Men of God or the Devil? Don Imus faced those he made comments about on his radio show but have you seen either Sharpton or Jackson face the Duke players that they were ready to hang in a public square without trail or knowing the facts. This has everyones attention time for the media to back off and let the facts come out.

In a divorce, only two people know what really went wrong. And they don't agree.

Rush to judgment Americans, helping to destroy America from within.

Why don't we think it's time for the courts to decide? All this is doing is making it more difficult to find am impartial jury. And Amanda...your dialog is just proof of this. You have no idea of the accuracy of the information you used to come to your conclusions. You need to realize that this information is provided to you not to serve justice but to get eyeballs to sell advertising, Sharpton and Jackson use it as opportunists to keep the money flowing to them as spokesmen for a truly important cause, and even Trayvon's parents trademarked his name. If the real pictures of Trayvon today are a fair representation rather than the ones provided by the media when he was a bright eyed youth with hope for his futue, Trayvon may be a victim of the Miami ghetto he was born into just as much as Zimmerman's zeal to be a cop...Why are Sharpton and Jackson not in that Miami ghetto helping the innocent kids portrayed by Trayvon's media pics? Why aren't the media addressing the real issue and getting to the source of the problem in the black ghettos of this country where black youths like young Trayvon are assaulted daily by black gang members...like what just happened in Michigan where a young black man the age of Trayvon shown in the media pics, straight A student, got an iPad from his parents, went outside to show his friends and a black gang member went up to him, demanded the iPad and shot this boy in the head when he refused to give it to him.Where's Jesse and Sharpton...the media execs...when this black on black crime was committed? ...in their cozy mansions...sipping martinis...celebrating Trayvon's death and the opportunity to make another buck.

@amanda

unfortunately your arm-chair analysis is just that... arm-chair analysis

You are only seeing bits of information you assume are factual and you make some broad assumptions and speculations. This is why we have a court system, and if there isn't enough evidence to charge him with a crime then no charges should be made.

Why not let the court decide? If Mr. Zimmerman is so innocent, then the truth should set him free. That being said, all the cards have to be on the table. What he said. What he did. All the 911 transcripts.

The 2nd Amendment does give you the right to have a gun...but it does NOT give you the right to play Cowboys and Indians, or Cops and Robbers. Like or loathe the police, they are at least TRAINED to handle these kinds of situations. They have protocols and procedures they are supposed to follow. What training did Mr. Zimmerman have? Did he obey orders?

Whatever Trayvan Martin looked like is pretty irrelevant from a legal standpoint. I'm sure every poster in this room is not a Gap model. If you are male, and just "look" imposing, then you could be fair game. Doesn't matter what color or clothes you wear.

Mr. Zimmerman should have his day in court. Martin didn't get a chance to have his, or tell his side of the story.

The thing that struck me about this is that the article said Martin was 6 feet tall and weighed about 140 pounds. That is extremely skinny for a 6 foot person. I am only 5' 11", and the least I have ever weighed is 155. The ideal weight for my height is 160 to 165. It sounds to me like this boy was half starved to death. How does such a skinny 17 year old boy beat anyone up? He's the kind of boy that you see in those old commercials getting sand kicked in his face at the beach by some bully.

Old pictures of Trayvon are put out there to show skinny boy who loved to play footbal and in the snow. Knowing that what happened in school might come out, they needed to make him look innocent. How much more innocent can those older pictures have. We need to let the wheels of justice turn and wait for the investigators to complete their investigation. I was not there, so I even assume to know if GZ stopped following when told, and TM started to follow GZ and attack. I keep hearing that GZ, when brought into the police station looked pristine. Shirt tucked in, not walking like he had just been beat. Could it be he tucked his shirt in after getting medical attention? I have to admit, the lack of any blood from a gun shot bother me, however the forensics will bring out what factually happened that night. Not the arm chari QB's.

So, MSNBC is going to wait until they print the next " tabloid style" article on Martin and Zimmermen to show us the more recent pictures?

Justice -

Okay, you could only hear the hard "c", Joe Oliver (Zimmerman's buddy) thinks he heard "f'n goon" which he claims is a term of endearment. Okay, whatever. I clearly heard "f'n coon." Maybe there are different enhanced versions of the tape out there.

One thing I think we can all agree on is that Zimmerman was not trying to chase Martin down to give him a friendly tour of the neighborhood. He surmised, based on Martin's appearance only, that the teen was a threat to the community. Defending Zimmerman's misconceptions only serves to stir up hatred and increase the racial divide. He was simply wrong.

Another thing that I think we can all agree on is that, if Zimmerman had just stayed in his vehicle as he was advised to do, Trayvon would still be alive today.

Based on those two issues, Trayvon Martin's family deserves to have a full and thorough presentation of the evidence in a court of law with a jury of Zimmerman's peers deciding whether his actions were justified.

You can all rant on about the media, Sharpton, the protesters, et al, but the fact is, but for the public outrage on this case that the media generated, there would be no further investigation, nor a trial, because the authorities let Zimmerman off because he claimed protection from prosecution under the Stand Your Ground law - case closed.

I agree with the law in principle, but I think a jury, not the police or prosecuters, should decide whether an offender really was standing his/her ground or not.

I hope that happens in this case and all others going forward. If the SYG laws are modified because of this case, then maybe Trayvon Martin did not die in vain. It would be little comfort to his family but a least it's something.

So this article goes to all of the trouble to basically admit the slanting of the story by showing outdated photos, it details there are much more current ones available, but then it doesn't show them. Any reasonable person simply asks why. The logical answer is that the shooter now looks far less intimidating, and the victim is much more grown up. Doesn't change the tragic thing which happened that night. But certainly reveals the spin put on this story by certain media accomplices (remember this story was nowhere before an attorney representing the family of TM got CBS to do a bit on it) and a the usual cabal of race baiters who are prostituting themselves for the cameras, but don't show a flying shiite of concern about the black on black gang war which is presently raging on the south side of Chicago.

Talking about photos trying to convince us about something else, what about how the media uses print? (Allegedly assaulted an officer. The charge was later dropped.) So, he pleaded guilty to another more serious charge in order for leniency, and the assault charge dropped. It doesn't mean that he didn't commit assault, it just means it was pleaded away. In my opinion, he is still guilty of the assault if in fact it actually DID take place. THE MEDIA NEEDS TO STOP PLAYING WITH THE PUBLIC LIKE THIS, AS THEY DO IN POLITICS. FUNNY HOW MANY TIMES THEY MENTION A CERTAIN POLITICIAN A LOT MORE THAN ANOTHER. THAT IS BECAUSE THEY WANT THEM IN OFFICE. Just the same as how they want a certain outcome of a criminal trial.

This is has became an lighting rod for criticism from day one. No matter what the facts are people are going to stand where they stand. We are arguing something that is beyond us to argue and holding talking points of tidbits of information. Every side accusing the other side of not knowing the facts of the case and not looking at it realistically. The best character of a person is their ability to reason and to me we are losing that. We are a Democracy that is no longer willing to compromise. This is what we are trying to sell to the rest of the world as the best form of government, the majority rules. Why in the world would they want this when we do not get along?

This is like going to a married couple for maritial advice yet everytime you go they are fighting amongst themselves. Why would you take their advice? This is a shame of a democracy with the losing side wanting to take their proverbial ball and go home instead of playing. Everything is being turned into a political or racial issue.

We used to be prove of our differences however now of differences define us. If you don't believe. look, think or act as I do you are wrong. I am not willing to compromise my policitical agenda even if it differs from my religious agenda.

This story is that of every parnets worst nightmare of an inept police investigation of a child. Regarldess of the race of the child this was a sloppy investigation. His body laid in a morgue for 3 days as a John Doe when they had his phone and ID. Again think about that for a minute. If you ever watch the first 48 the first thing they do is dail the last number you called to see who the vicitm is. Secondly the police report calls Mr. Zimmerman by name and address Trayvon as a Black male throughout, Why is that when they found his information at the scene? Imagine trying to find your kids for 3 days calling his phone and he is laying in the morgue as a John Doe? Can you imagine the outrage you as a parent would have.

I am not addressing what happened that night because I do not know all of the facts, I am merely addressing what happened afterwards. I am not trying to prosecute Mr. Zimmerman on the blogs but would rather him have his day in court. That is what I want and that cannot happened if their is no due process of the law. Until then we continue to fight over tidbits of information. Imagine what his mother is going through. In the mean time we have other mothers losing their sons whether to drug abuse, murder or wars. Yet we continue to argue this case in this court of public opinion.

Again to summarize, We have became a Democracy unwilling to compromise or see others views as valid. We would rather argue and start wars to settle our differences. This is a tragic waste of a young man's life and of our time.

Holy cow Amanda, you have way to much time on your hands?? I hope you spend that much time trying to analyze why Blacks are killings Blacks in record numbers all over this country and Sharpton & Jackson could care less ??

One thing that gets me is all the people calling Zimmerman white and not Hispanic or a "white Hispanic" or Hispanic is an ethnicity and not a race, and therefore the shooting was race-based, because Zimmerman is really "white".

I just wonder if Zimmerman were an illegal alien, how many of those same people would be calling anyone who called him "white" racist against Hispanics.

the media is in business to sell soap, cereal, advertising revenue; they take a tragedy such as this and fan the flames; let us all wait for the investigation to finish; so far it appears that Zimmerman will not face any charges, if the reports of his injury's are true; and from the original police reports it appears to bear out his story.

I personally would like to see the results of an investigations. So far I have not seen any photos of either person that were taken recently so it is just a bit difficult to judge from appearance.

You have to remember that as far as the law is concerned, Martin is a juvenile and his records are not available for public inspection so we don't know what his past is.

Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton have both made a fortune off racism. I suspect they would be reluctant to end that gravy train just in the interest of racial harmony. We (whites and blacks) can put an end to this behavior is we refuse to enable opportunists like Jackson and Sharpton.

AMANDA I understand your thought about the initial Police report not stating anything about blood.. I will wait for a complete report to be released before I would think either way.. It was raining and at night so I challenge you to find a few blood spots in those conditions with a flashlight.. The other thought would be that not all injuries bleed profusely like you see on TV.. People have had their skulls crushed and the skin is not torn or broken so there is no apparent bleeding.. Modern first aid is a wonder and you can witness this watching a boxing match.. Nasal sprays that stop nose bleeds, ice that shrinks swelling, powders that stop bleeding.. The military has access to the cutting edge of these and that is why we see so many wounded vets with missing arms and legs.. I honestly think they are giving the media and these haters enough rope to hang themselves with.. The lamest one is that grainy video and the statement "he doesn't look injured to me".. Bet there are great photos of his injuries that will not be released because they are cornerstones to his defense and we don't need to know because we are not the DA or jury.. If after interrogation,reading initial reports and the review of eye witnesses accounts the police did not detain him or charge him, the detective had credible evidence to self defense.. Detectives always try to guess a charge but the DA/prosecutor make the final call..

We have seen several shootings in Ohio cities.. One was a drive by with no apparent motive yet where a teen was killed and a 50ish man was wounded.. I for one would not be surprised if this was spurred on by all this hate being generated by the inflaming mouth pieces..

Speaking as a white person, I have no idea when an incident will push minorities to put bounties out on another person.

There are tens of thousands of minorities murdered each year, often minority on minority crime, and, not a peep. Why are not minorities outraged with those atrocities? Where is Hollywood, entertainers, sports figures, Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, Spike Lee?

Even if the bounty is 'collected' on Zimmerman, it will not change the tens of thousands of others who are murdered ... while the silence from those who have made a rich and powerful life out of minorities suffering is deafening.

Makes no sense.

@Amanda - post #1.39 et al

I have read your "reports" I have no reason to dispute they are verbatim as transcription's of the conversations surrounding the event i.e., the killing. I read what appears a lapse of communication as the police have to be directed to where Zimmerman is to located...exactly. This I have read numerous times is due to Mr. Zimmerman's decision to ignore the directive of an agent of the enforcement authorities. This point keeps being put off in such lame terms as: this was only a directive (tantamount to an order...I and most would follow such a directive) not an absolute order and other rubbish to explain away Zimmerman's pursuit of an unarmed teenager that has committed no known crime.

The fraudulent, apparently fabrications, of Zimmerman's are too many to list but the one point I want all to have clear is that Zimmerman turned off all communication with the police just prior to confronting, chasing the teenager with his buzz cut, red windbreaker and looking to me to be a gangster a low rider chasing a teenager, Zimmermans appears to me to be the "ganster" and for all we know gun in hand what proof is there that Zimmerman did not have his weapon in his hand? Only Zimmerman's word...and what has that shown to be? Of course Martin went for the gun of someone ready to shoot him dead and what ensued? I mean Zimmerman's ntegrity his veracity in reconciling the murder scene and his ever changing accounts of matters.

But let us put all that aside and concentrate on this aspect: from reading your posts I gather that as reported there is a gap in the conversation due to "lost communication" with Zimmerman and this is due to Zimmerman closing said communication just he starts his running pursuit of Martin. I read in you posts such a lapse do you see this I am in a rush but I read your posts and I thought they lend credibility to the said "gap" initiated by Zimmerman...do read or glean this same conclusion of fact?

Have to run but it has been reported Zimmerman turned off his radio and to me that is incriminating and puts everything Zimmerman's says in total suspicion.

HS321

One thing that gets me is all the people calling Zimmerman white and not Hispanic or a "white Hispanic" or Hispanic is an ethnicity and not a race, and therefore the shooting was race-based, because Zimmerman is really "white".

I just wonder if Zimmerman were an illegal alien, how many of those same people would be calling anyone who called him "white" racist against Hispanics.

I will go even step further, if Zimmerman had shot a white kid under the same circumstances would the liberals then be all up in arms to protect him? I would give good odds they would spin it entirely differently.

Steve,

I want to know how walking home from a convenience store on a public sidewalk while talking on a cell phone with a friend is perceived as "acting strange."

Here is a video from Breitbart showing how NBC has even edited the 911 call to make Zimmerman sound racist.

And people scream FOX lies all day?

http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2012/03/30/NBC-Deceptively-Edits-Zimmerman-911-Call

And people scream FOX lies all day?

Well... yes. Because Fox DOES lie all day long.

What's your point?

This case isn't about a white or black child being killed and it's not about a "hoodie". Several kids I know and adults who are white put their "hoodies" up so "yes" President Obama your right... It could have been anyone of our children. It's about a man who had a gun and had the itch to use it. It's about a man who felt that once he shot and killed someone it would make him feel "whole". To bad his family didn't see this and take him and his gun for some mental help and or deer hunting maybe we wouldn't be here today and maybe a young man would still have his future.

My point is that you should watch the video. Its not just the photos they are using to sway opinion, but they are editing the actual evidence to play up a false narrative.

It's true that dispatchers are not police officers, but they do receive extensive training on how to handle these situations, and instructions such as the one the dispatcher gave to George Zimmerman would be a standard part of this training. In fact, if Zimmerman had been talking to a police officer he would've been told the same thing or some variant thereof. Under no circumstances would the police ever tell a citizen to pursue a potential suspect, so the dispatcher's instructions should be viewed as flowing directly from law enforcement. His choice of words wasn't the issue here. As far as Zimmerman is concerned, he murdered a young man who was walking through his father's neighborhood minding his own business. I, for one, don't buy the f***ing goon story from his brother. I've heard those audiotapes and he says coon. Twenty-eight year olds don't use words like goon, eighty-eight year olds do. I also don't believe Zimmerman would have ever gotten out of his car if he believed Trayvon Martin was a genuine threat, gun or no gun; although I do think having the gun emboldened him. I think Zimmerman was a man who had issues with anger management (as evidenced by his arrest record) and perhaps tried to channel that anger to patrolling his neighborhood targeting certain individuals through a lens of suspicion. The bottom line is Zimmerman had no reason to call the cops. If a patrol car had been cruising through that neighborhood there would have been no basis to detain Trayvon Martin. He was walking in the rain with his hood up. Period. That's not probable cause for anything. Trayvon Martin should not be dead. He is dead because of an angry, over-zealous self-styled tough guy (who may or may not have been under the influence himself at the time—we’ll never know) who wanted to poke a gun in someone's face and bully him. Trayvon had no duty to identify himself to this nut, and if he had survived would have had every right to invoke the Stand Your Ground defense in his own defense. Trayvon was the one being pursued by an armed man--he had every right to defend himself physically at that point. End of story.

Where can I hear the entire 911 call Zimmerman made? Usually the dispatcher asks you to stay on the line until the police arrive. All I have heard are clips of the call. Imagine what the rest of the tapes could reveal as far as timeline of incidences and what happened in the confrontation, or what happened after the dispatcher said "we don't need you to do that" and Zimmerman said "OK."

Just wondering

"....and therefore the shooting was race-based, because Zimmerman is really "white".

What difference would have been if he was really "white" or not? He isn't black. I have no idea whether it was race-based or not, but that makes no sense.

willowbrook

@ Ed ryan, well said and skipster56 good point about the Media's suppression of Trayvon's problems. So the answer is YES, using old photos has shaped public opinion, as has suppression of the deceased school, and drug problems. I'm still waiting to find out if Trayvon's blood was tested for drugs, alcohol........

I'm curious as to why u don't want to know anything about zimmerman's blood content ?

It is so obvious when reading to know who is pro zimmmerman and pro-martin. There is no objectivity, no middle ground. U either for or against.

Zimmerman's past is not very credible.... 3 different instances of arrest, not one. A picture has been painted of someone that has trouble following the law. The fact that he didn't obey a suggestion by the 911 operator would collaborate his past.

Martin is suspended for trace of weed but has no documented trend of bad behavior. Such an incident wouldn't even get you arrested. An isolated incident is not painting a picture of someone with anger issues.

We'll see what happens though.

Zimmerman complied with all of my verbal commands and was secured in handcuffs. Located on the inside of Zimmerman's waist band, I removed a black Kel Tek 9mm PF9semi auto handgun

The Kel Tek handgun that I collected from Zimmerman was placed into evidence under TS-1

These lines excerpted from post 1.33 are probably quite accurate as they reflect standard procedure in instances such as this...that apparently a great number of people were not aware of.

A number of people figuratively cried and screamed about Mr. Zimmerman still having his gun and remaining free to do as he pleases. I knew better than that, but didn't have anything to cite until now. I knew his gun had been taken in as evidence - that's what ALWAYS happens in the case of a shooting, even police guns are removed from service at the scene of officer involved shootings until they can be forensically examined to prove which guns were and weren't fired and which guns fired bullets that hit a suspect and which didn't.

I was also pretty sure that he was arrested. Mind you, 'Arrested' means any time when you are in the actual custody of the police and not free to leave. If you're in handcuffs, you've been arrested! In some jurisdictions, arrest is virtually guaranteed if you shoot at and/or actually hit somebody. In others, you may not be, depending on circumstances. How you interact with the officers and what they make of you based on your appearance, demeanor, and the incident in general will often determine this.

I saw the other day an article where officers had come out stating they wanted to keep Zimmerman in custody and charge him but the DA didn't seem to be so excited about it, citing the Stand Your Ground law. I would call BS on that...not the police...but the DA. If that is an accurate reflection of the way things are there, I suspect they've got a DA who's lazy and trying to get out of more work, or else the courts are seriously backlogged down there and the DA thought this looked like a plausible excuse for not taking on another case. I can see where the police would want Zimmerman off the streets for awhile, sounds like he's been a bit of a thorn in their sides lately. The DA could have a racist steak and upon learning the victim was black lost enthusiasm for prosecuting, or maybe was just looking for an 'easy out' to an increased case load and thought no one would notice this one.

About the photos, yes, using them like statistics to make your opposition just look bad has been done as long as photographs have been commonly available. Politicians have been doing it for years. When they show a picture of their competitor in an ad, it's usually the least favorable picture they were able to get their hands on.

OMG!!! the media misleading the public to further their own agenda!!!??? Say it ain't so!!!!

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

AL Sharpton PLEASE PAY US the MONEY you US TAX PAYERS

IMHO: We will never know the whole story here. This is because the Sanford police failed to collect any forensic evidence at all. They didn't even get the shell casing or bullet. There was zero protection of the crime scene and there have been constant leaks of anti-Martin pro-Zimmerman information from both the Sanford Police Dpartment and the state Attorney General's offfice.

But there are things that we do know for absolute certainty:

1) Trayvon Martin was where he was supposed to be. His father lived in the subdivision and he was living with his father. He had walked to a convenience store to get an inced tea and skittles for his step-brother and was returning home in the rain. The shooting took place outside of his father's home.

2) Zimmerman had no way of knowing whether or not Martin was supposed to be there. He had no list of residents and no way to really know. The idea of wandering around a racially mixed gated subdivision with no way of knowing who was supposed to be there and who was not is pretty absurd.

3) Zimmerman was a short fat man with past anger issues. Period. You may say that short or fat is irrelevant, but any forensic psychologist will tell you that "under 5'9"" is a red flag. Seriously overweight and under 40 are a red flag. Having previous arrests for anger-related issues is a red flag. Unfulfilled aspirations to be a cop are a red flag. Association with paramilitary groups (even his version of armed Neighborhood Watch) is a red flag. Constant calling to 911 is a red flag. This man should never have beenm able to buy a gun, let alone a concealed carry permit. The current background check system is estimated to catch only about 15% of people charged with a felony, convicted of a felony, or under current or past court injunctions. And that is going down because cash-strapped law enforcement groups simply do not have the resources to even report major felony convictions to the national database.

4) There was no attempt to preserve the crime scene. Almost immediately the scene was contaminated and it was raining, quickly washing away such things as blood spatter evidence and trampled grass. Even witness statements were heavily edited by the officers to show a very one-sided view of events. For example, one woman, a schoolteacher reported Martin calling for help. The police thoughtfully "corrected" her statement to say that she heard Zimmerman calling for help.

5) Contrary to best practices, Zimmerman was allowed to have weeks in which to prepare and hone his story without having to repeat it for the police. I am an old intelligence analyst (never an investigator, but I had the training) and one knows that with a person like Zimmerman, you get him to tell his whole story in minute detail as quickly after the crime as possible. Then you make him repeat the story over and over and over and over in as much detail as possible each time. When a person is not being truthful, over time even the most adroit liar's story will "drift." Without an opportunity to prepare in private the criminal really doesn't stand much of a chance in keeping the same story for even a couple of re-tellings.

6) The entry of politics into the situation was almost inevitable. The racial hatred in this country is on the rise and many many people see overt racism --- even extending to shooting innocent people --- as okay and entirely the fault of the victim. I live in Alabama and people here, like Florida, assume that if you are white that you are racist. But Zimmerman's reference to "n****r c**ns" on a 911 call are sufficient for me to assume that he is a racist.

I am not anti-handgun. I own two handguns and one (together with its ammo) was specifically selected for self-defense. I have a military background, so my view of weapons is a little different. I would only pull a weapon if there was a reasonable expectation that I would use it. And if I used it I would attempt to kill the intruder. But I also know that when interviewed afterwards by the police, that I must demonstrate three things: a) that either I tried to flee or fleeing was not likely to help the situation or was impossible. b) that I had a reasonable belief that the person was armed in a way that was life-threatening. And c) that I feared for my life because of something external (not just an internal fear of being threatened --- the real name for that feeling is cowardice.) But even then I would expect that I would be charged with manslaughter and tried because there is no statute of limitations on crimes involving killing and a trial would protect me against being charged with murder 20 years from now. I would anticipate that the police would actively try to help me build an air-tight self-defense case.

And before you assume too much about the motivations of the police, have you ever noticed that so many policemen carry briefcases that they put in the trunk of their cruiser? Well, all 50 states have shield laws that prohibit the searching of these private briefcases without a very specific type of court order. The reason is that better than 20% of these briefcases contain "throwaways." A throwaway is a knive, a cheap handgun, of small amounts of narcotics, all in baggies, without fingerprints, and not traceable to the officer. If a cop had shot Martin, his body would most likely have been found with a handgun underneath it. This is how cops play the game. Rarely do they get caught.

Amanda,

Not sure where to begin with you but I will try.

All of your assumptions that you propose in your first long winded waste of time are answered in your other 3 or 4 long winded wastes of time. You suggest that the body was laying in a grass area away from a road? Then in your 3rd post which is a transcript of the officers report, the report states that the body is laying between two homes next to a road in the subdivision.

You arent any better then the media trying to sensationalize this BS. You arent even smart enough to realize that you contradict your own posts in the same thread.

Get off the keyboard and go work in your yard. It is better for your mental situation and the exercise will do you good. Oh and realize that the grass next to the road is not a remote field.

Here's your sign.

Bernitch

104th US Congress. 1/1995 to 1/1997. BOTH GOP Majority amount of budget deficit begins to drop.

105th US Congress. 1/1997 to 1/1999. BOTH GOP Majority first budget surplus since Kennedey

106th US Congress. 1/1999 to 1/2001 budget surplus continues.

107th US Congress. 1/2001 to 1/2003 recession probably due to collapse of dot com boom is ending, employment is improving, gdp though weak is holding pretty much steady.

108th US Congress. 1/2003 to 1/2005 Unemployment averages around 5.2% and gasoline is under $3/gallon. The stock market is countinuing to improve and gdp is showing some signs of growth. President issues a "systemic" warning that financial institutions are out of control and regulatory agencies need to take control.

109th US Congress. 1/2005 to 1/2007 Employment holds steady, the Dow tops 14,000 and the deficit to gdp appears to be dropping. The democrats take control of congress in 2007 after the mid-term elections of 2006. The housing bubble which is a result of policies put in place in 1999 appears to collapse in December, 2007

110th US Congress. 1/2007 to 1/2009. Only the last 2 years of Dumbya Bush, not the full last term, as some RIGHT WING LIARS would want you to believe -- BOTH DEM Majority. I have not seen where any conservative has indicated that the dems had control in 2005 and 2006. Obama took office on Jan 20, 2009.

The economy was cruising along pretty well until 2008. Obama took control in 2009 just like Bush took control in 2001 yet you want to blame Bush for 2001 as well as 2009.

AND, try this scenario: Even if you could show this was due to Democratic-controlled legislative policy before 1995 (which you cannot) – then, with 12 years of full GOP legislative control after that in BOTH HOUSES, why the hell didn’t the GOP solve the problem before this happened

You liberals have complained constantly how republicans blocked the democrats while democrats had control of the government yet you refuse to admit that democrats had the same power. I have addressed you statements and provided a different (and truthful) point of view.

NOW HOW ABOUT DOING THE SAME FOR ME!

http://www.sjsu.edu/faculty/watkins/subprime.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4A0RuXhnQA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UZ9l_AxKjA&feature=related

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/warning/interviews/born.html

And the one that goes into how Frank/Dodd will probably get us into even more trouble:

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/businessdesk/2011/07/joseph-stiglitz-barney-frank-r.html

And I almost forgot what Clinton handed to Bush before he left:

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2009/11/24/the-dot-com-bubble-how-to-lose-5-trillion/

.

willowbrook & Thou Shall Not Teabag I stated my thoughts you stated yours. Neither of you came up with a valid reason for this to not come up before a grand jury and/or go to a trial, if it did, the prosecution would present their facts and the defense would present theirs and the controversy would end! WHY would you or anyone have a problem with that?

What photo albums are available to the media when an incident like this happens? What ever is publically available, right? So no, I don't think the media looked for mug shots of Zimmerman or adolescent photos of Martin. Here is my issue, putting aside race and looking objectively; a 17 year old was killed at gun point because a man was fed up with crime in his neighborhood. A jury needs to make the call.

Bernitch

BTW, What does that have to do with old photos of Trayvon Martin?

I see the Left wing Kangaroo Court is still alive and well.

Monarchy,

If there is a court case then its a miscarriage of justice and the DA should be ashamed of bowing to the Jesse Jackson's in our society.

All of you who only see a dead 17 year old and say Zimmerman should of stopped I give you this.

If the kid was scared for himself why didnt he go to the first house, knock on the door, and ask for help? If Trayvon would of done that he would be alive today. Instead the kid chose to attack Zimmerman. Where is the discussion about the fact that Trayvons choice to attack Zimmerman led to his death?

Everyone of you that are wanting this poor mans head on a spike know that Trayvon brought it upon himself. That kid had no business trying to confront a would be attacker. What was he going to defend himself with? A bag of skittles?

This isnt a black thing, its a stupidity thing.

Oh and It wouldnt surprise me one bit if Trayvon saw that Zimmerman was carrying a gun and Trayvon wanted the gun. That is the only logical reason why a 17 year old kid would ambush a would be stalker carrying a pistol.

On another note, I love how from day one Zimmerman was carrying a Tec-9 submachine gun and today he was carrying a Kel Tek 9mm pistol.

Our country is done. You see it in our politics. You see it with the idolization of the children of the lawyer that got OJ off. And you see it when our media sensationalizes the death of a 17 year old to get more rating share.

@ rbk - why I didn't talk about Zimmerman's blood test is he should have been routinely tested since he is the admitted shooter. But, since it is Zimmerman's claim Trayvon attacked him...Trayvon's blood should have been tested to see if he was under the influence of anything that would have impeded his judgement and encouraged him to attack Zimmerman. Many illegal substances "stimulate" aggressive behavior. I have been a the recipient of this behavior by more than one friend under the influence. It definitely should be checked out. You have to admit, the Mainstream Media has had next to nothing on the current history of Trayvon, except the glowing reports of the grieving family. Not very thorough investigating skills.

@ blondness there is a big difference in my opinion to wait for the results of the investigation as to yours, who has already tried and convicted Zimmerman, even though there is much conflicting evidence. Both sides of this should be investigated first. You are part of the "mob rule" right there with the other racists. Had Zimmerman been black and Trayvon been white, we wouldn't even be having this discussion. Blacks are the new racistpower in the US, led by folks like the Reverends Jackson and Sharpton, Spike Lee and even others in our current Adminstration who are encouraging this "mob rule." (by looking the other way when crimes like Spike Lee's terrorising of an elderly couple are committed) I would be pretty ashamed if I were you.

This case has bigger implications. It is an attack against protecting oneself in light of a portion of our Society giving a pass to crime, depending on what race commits it. No crime against another is OK regardless of who is the aggressor, and the victim must have the right to defend ones self. With this mentality, attacks against law-abiding citizens will be more common, since the citizen will have no legal recourse to protect of defend himself. That's not an America I can believe in.

Let the courts choose what will or won't happen in this case. To all people that keeps bringing up the fact that this man had a 9mm on him and "stalked" the "boy". Why don't you do a little research and find all the other cases that deal with a 17 year old "boy" and defend them as well. In the eyes of the courts a 17 year old in many cases is no longer a "boy", but a man. It's all a play on words to get your view across the way you want people to see it. Look at more than one news source, more than one persons comments and more than one racists view of the case. With that said.... No matter how or why this event happened it is sad that a 17 year old person lost his life.

MrIndia:

Are the righties here saying that if a black guys is 6'2", has gold teeth and is anything less than a model citizen, he can be willy nilly shot in the streets?

I don't see anyone saying that. What I see people saying is that if you are actively beating on someone, he can shoot you in self-defense.

but the bottom line is that he was chased and shot for no reason at all by a private citizen

Here are some facts. He was followed but not chased (or "hunted down.") As best as can be determined, Zimmerman was trying to keep him in sight to point out to the police. Martin was beating Zimmerman at the time Zimmerman fired the shot.

Greg

It's clear to me he pursued Trayvon

Unfortunately, it is also clear to you that Zimmerman was given orders that he was never given.

Teabag:

The [FICTION] that the police told Zimmerman NOT to stalk anyone, yet he CHOSE to anyhow and the fact he CHOSE to take a 9mm hand gun, speak for themselves.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that Zimmerman routinely carries his gun. After all, he would have no way of knowing that he would run into Martin.

Out in the woods:

Even if Trayvon had gold teeth and smoked weeds, those are not reasons to hunt him down like a rabbit.

This much is true. On the other hand, his suspension does lend weight to the idea that he would want to "take care" of someone he thought was going to rat him out to the police. Zimmerman did not exactly shoot Martin from the safety of his truck.

Joe:

So this article goes to all of the trouble to basically admit the slanting of the story by showing outdated photos, it details there are much more current ones available, but then it doesn't show them. Any reasonable person simply asks why.

The simplest answer is simply legal issues. The family will not give the media the required permission to publish those photos. I think it's because it would show the "fakes" aren't so fake.

AmericaToday-Anthony said:

Amanda,

Not sure where to begin with you but I will try.

All of your assumptions that you propose in your first long winded waste of time are answered in your other 3 or 4 long winded wastes of time. You suggest that the body was laying in a grass area away from a road? Then in your 3rd post which is a transcript of the officers report, the report states that the body is laying between two homes next to a road in the subdivision.

According to the police report filed by Officer T. Smith:

I was advised by dispatch that the report of shots fired was possibly coming from 1231 Twin Trees lane I was then advised after receiving multiple calls that there was a subject lying in the grass between the residences of 1231 Twin Trees Ln and 2821Retreat View Cir. I responded to 2831 Retreat View Cir and exited my marked Sanford Police vehicle and began to canvas the area. As I walked between the buildings I observed a white male wearing a red jacket and blue jeans I also observed a black male wearing a gray hooded sweatshirt laying face-down in the grass.

The officer specifically states he exited his vehicle to begin canvasing the area, so the logical extrapolation would be that the body was laying in a grassy area away from the road, as the officer had to approach the crime scene on foot.

TiGor:

If that is an accurate reflection of the way things are there, I suspect they've got a DA who's lazy and trying to get out of more work, or else the courts are seriously backlogged down there and the DA thought this looked like a plausible excuse for not taking on another case.

Prosecutors are notoriously loathe to put a lot of effort into an acquittal. The evidence makes self-defense plausible. The "stand your ground" law means that the prosecutor needs to show that it was not a case of self-defense. Until the media hype came along, the two chances he had for a conviction were zilch and none.

Chris:

This man should never have beenm able to buy a gun, let alone a concealed carry permit.

Your opinion is duly noted. However, this man had no convictions. Anything used to prevent him from being able to be armed could also be used to ensure that only the supporters of a totalitarian regime could be armed. I don't have a whole lot of trust for governments. Unfortunately, we need government. But its power needs to be tightly controlled.

Then you make him repeat the story over and over and over and over in as much detail as possible each time. When a person is not being truthful, over time even the most adroit liar's story will "drift."

Or, for that matter, even if he is being truthful. Human memory isn't perfect. And what you are describing is pressing for more detail than he can actually deliver. As we all know, many people are wrongly convicted of crimes. Some are eventually exonerated. What you describe sounds very useful toward getting the initial wrongful conviction.

.

You know, I've been trying to stay away from these threads as much as possible because logic doesn't seem to apply here. But because of some of the *ahem* misinformed citizens posting on here, I can't sit back any longer. Regardless of what you believe about Trayvon Martin or George Zimmerman, the fact is that Zimmerman was on the phone with the cops. The cops told him NOT TO PURSUE Martin. He did anyway. If Zimmerman had actually done what he'd been told, Martin would be alive. Period. No ifs, ands, or buts. Now personally, for everyone saying Martin "assaulted Zimmerman," and "broke his nose, slammed his head, etc." why doesn't he have a huge ass swollen nose? Why aren't there scars on the back of his head? When I broke my nose, it stayed swollen for two weeks, even with medical attention. Zimmerman was looked over by paramedics. Yet his nose miraculously healed within 48 hours? As did the cuts on the back of his head? Right. That's all conjecture, however. Try looking at it this way instead. Martin tried to disarm Zimmerman? God damn right. I would've done the same thing. If I was close enough to take the gun away from the guy stalking me, your damn right I would've. Or would you guys just let the guy following you keep his weapon?

Just heard Jesse Jackson on the news, stirring the pot, calling for civil disobedience. Great, more 60's racism. (not) While at Walmart, People Magazine had a younger picture on Trayvon on the cover. Certainly not going to buy that magazine since they seem to be on the biased bandwagon. Oddly enough, the people of Sanford want justice, but don't believe Jesse Jackson's method is the way to go. I'm with the people of Sanford, lets keep "innocent until proven guilty" an American belief, instead the lynch mob mentality of a few immature, backward looking people. The more the racists do, the less serious they will be taken....(except by those taking them to jail for their actions.)

Mickey-1983943

The thing that struck me about this is that the article said Martin was 6 feet tall and weighed about 140 pounds. That is extremely skinny for a 6 foot person. I am only 5' 11", and the least I have ever weighed is 155. The ideal weight for my height is 160 to 165. It sounds to me like this boy was half starved to death. How does such a skinny 17 year old boy beat anyone up? He's the kind of boy that you see in those old commercials getting sand kicked in his face at the beach by some bully.

When I joined the Marine Corps 19 days after my 17th birthday (almost the same age a Trayvon to the day) I was 6'2" and weighed 146 lbs and I can assure you I was not starved to death and was quite capable of defending myself. I'll admit though that after 12 weeks of boot camp I weighed 176 lbs and was even more capable of defending myself (but almost never had to prove it.) Yeah he was tall & skinny, but had the advantages of youth, reach and quite probably fear & anger so I would imagine that he could have been a rather formidable opponent when pushed into it.

I'm not taking sides here, just pointing out that the kid was not necessarily the proverbial "98 pound weakling" & the media always portrays it as a skinny teenager against a 200 lb man I just think they're being a bit disingenuous.

I think the real issue here is why doesn't the media do their job. The photos of both people are intentionally inflamatory and not how the people look in the present.

We should required honesty from the media in the material that they present, otherwise our "news media" is the electronic equivalent of the tabloid rags at the supermarket checkout.

The logical me that would like to stay on topic and knows that would be the right thing to do, is saying that, Yes, the photos have created some issues in reference to people's perceptions surrounding this case. Me, personally, even though they continued to say Martin's age it just didn't coincide with my vision from the photo so I always had this "Oh, but he was just a baby" thing going in my mind. However, once I saw the most recent photos it clicked that he was far from a baby. Today's version of a 17 year old, regardless of skin color is vastly different from the version of a 17 year old in 1930, 40, 50, 60 or even 70 - some of the differences are good but, to me, most are pretty bad.

Ok, Now, for the Illogical part of me that wants to respond to some things from above - they do not really have to do with the Original question in reference to the photos but, hey, I did say that I was being "Illogical" at this point. So, here goes:

@ Mickey-1983943

"The thing that struck me about this is that the article said Martin was 6 feet tall and weighed about 140 pounds. That is extremely skinny for a 6 foot person. I am only 5' 11", and the least I have ever weighed is 155. The ideal weight for my height is 160 to 165. It sounds to me like this boy was half starved to death. How does such a skinny 17 year old boy beat anyone up? He's the kind of boy that you see in those old commercials getting sand kicked in his face at the beach by some bully."

As @Ron D above infered Skinny does not equal weak. My ex is 6'3" and about 145/150 at the most and he's in commercial construction - the guys on the sites are amazed because he can lift/move stacks of beams and planks that normally take a few guys or forklift to move. He's been mistaken for weak because he's so thin and those that made that mistake learned not to make it again. There is a vast difference between Skinny/Frail and Lithe/Lean - A very big difference. Also, to this point, there have been conflicting reports as to Martin's size some say he was closer to 200lbs. - so, just as with most of this case and all of our opinions, there is just too much speculation.

@Just Wrong

"We should required honesty from the media in the material that they present, otherwise our "news media" is the electronic equivalent of the tabloid rags at the supermarket checkout."

Look, I am sorry to say this but the bulk of our news is already nothing more than Tabloid fodder - it's not just On It's Way to being it - it's already there. Also, I think it is impossible to require "Honesty" from a Media that is just giving we American's what we ask for. We don't truly want honesty. We spend more time watching/idolizing "Reality TV"; Fake Celebrities; Bankrupt, Overpaid Athletes; Crooked Politicians and reveling in the messes of other people just to make ourselves feel somehow superior than any people in any other country that "HONESTY" has become a foreign concept to most Americans. We don't even know what real friendship, true love or family is instead we gauge our worth by who has the greatest number of "Facebook Friends", who snags the richest man/woman on "Date a Millionaire.com"/who has gathered up more $ than the next guy no matter the devestation to our economy,ourselves or future generations that this causes & as for family it has turned into how many brothers/sisters from the same family you hook with or how many children you can have with the greatest number of men/women- 10 kids with 10 different father's and mother's - Perfect. 10 kids had between a couple that has been together for 20 years - Lunacy. Face it, we live the most corrupt lives in one of the most corrupt countries and if you think we can "require" the media to be honest...well, I'll just say that you are in my prayers.

@Chris-749391

I think you scare me more than either Zimmerman or Martin ever could. The fact that you seem to know exactly what is needed to get over on the police and investigators should you ever be in Zimmerman's place makes me think maybe you shouldn't have those guns you proudly state you have.

See Zimmerman is no mastermind and has his wrong in this mess and Martin was no mastermind and has his wrong in this mess and when it comes down to it the resulting situation is, exactly that, a MESS. As such, whether it was Zimmerman killing Martin or Martin killing Zimmerman - in the end, it is just two guys that did the wrong thing on the spur of the moment and no matter what either of their pasts are this is just all around tragic for everyone involved. So, there ya go people, my true feeling about this - Remove all the grandstanding and what you have is a tragedy that occured because two men, jumped too fast and decided aggression was well worth the effort when speaking with one another could have avoided the whole thing but, again, we live in an aggresive country - hit first, speak later - we're Brilliant.

See, Chris, Zimmerman shouldn't have had a gun because he most likely was not trained, cautious or respectful enough to handle a gun properly and Trust me, by the time this is over he will either break because he is not mentally able to handle the onslaught of the investigations/media or he will continue on his story because it just may be the truth but one thing is for sure he is not cunning enough to ride this out and minipulate a whole country. You, however, probably shouldn't have one because you fully understand the mastery both Physically and mentally needed to use a gun and get through the aftermath resulting from such usage. That, to me, makes you one Scary MF'r and a perfect example of why we need better gun control in this country. With your advanced knowledge of Police procedure and protocol you may just be cunning enough to minipulate a great many people. ORRRRR... You just read a lot and like to act as if your Mr. Big Man on Campus when in reality your just like must of us and not really that spectacular at all - just average. Either way, that leaves you with the potential to be quite dangerous - Brains always tend to beat out brawn and cause much more damage in the end.

By the Way, if your little briefcase story is true I'm sure that the law enforcement are very thankful to you for getiing the news out there and even further bringing down their reputations in the eyes of Americans. I worked for two Homicide detectives - a Sargeant and a Captain and have been around many officers and their vehicles and I have never come across the vision of your Golden Black Briefcase - they did have what you condider "Throwaways" but the weapons were always concealed somewhere on their person for expediency sake and NEVER did any of them carry, on them or in their vehicles, drugs - I'm not saying that some officers might not play that way just that those in my life and those that I have come across including my nephew who is on the force and in narcotics do Not as a matter of fact they would lose their jobs and the many years of service that they put into their careers if they did something like that and were caught.

Again, Chris, no matter what your deal is - I'd keep a gun away from you.

I did not even get past the first listed posting and it's responses. I can't even imagine what I would have come across if I had chosen to read further. Frankly, I'm shocked I stopped my ranting when I did as there is much that I disagree with in many of the posts - however, I think that adding my opinion to much more of what is here would be meaningless - shoot the comments I already made are probably useless anyway - people pay more attention to the posts that Scream, yell, Curse and are beyond Angry than they do to any of the posts that are actually sensible. There is a lot of anger and ethnic bashing rearing it's ugly head and while I'd love if it would calm down I know better than to believe that will happen. Besides, when it comes down to it, as I have already said, there is too much assuming going on for any of us, despite our own personal opinions, to know what really happened that night... I'd hope the one thing we could all agree on in reference to the events of this tragedy is that the whole thing was absolutely senseless. When will the people of this country gain an ounce of common sense and a bucket load of respect for ourselves and for one another??? This is a trip, people think that this started over a kid wearing a hoodie and guy that lost his "Be a Cop" dream. A HOODIE & A WANNABE- give me a break!

I promise that if any of you were to be in the martin's position, and it was your son that was shot, you'd be screaming all sorts of shart about Zimmerman being a Hispanic or Latino and digging up everything on him that you could and screaming for justice. Because the kid was black, because Zimmie had made 50+ 911 calls in the past, because there was crime in his neighborhodd and because Trayvon got pissed and challenged him as to why he was following him, you all get on a public forum and post the trashiest shart I have ever seen. You uphold a man that was told to leave the boy alone by a 911 operator and you substantiate the murder of a 17 year old boy with no priors. Bull$hit and I am white and I am throwing the race card on all of you idiots that think there should not be an arrest, there should not be a trial and there should not be a jury.

jmonarchy

here's something to comment on

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-04-02/news/os-two-arrested-seminole-beating-20120402_1_victim-arrest-affidavits-crimeline

but back to the shiit spreading

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-26/news/la-na-nn-trayvon-martin-case-20120326_1_police-dispatcher-new-details-protesters

Said it before and say it again.. If the parents were willing to throw mud they should expect to get a bit of blowback.

First and foremost, you too are using every black kid's crime to justify the killing of Trayvon Martin. I can show you a lot of googled links to show how hispanics brutally murder folks everyday and also how white kids do the same. You wouldn't like those facts just as you would be pissed to learn that white people are the largest recipients of welfare and food stamps in this nation, twice the rate of Hispanics and more than blacks. as to your second posted link; Zimmerman was filmed at the PD in Sanford 35 minutes after the shooting and he had no visible injuries, swelling, blood or any other indications that he was beaten brutally and attacked. The lead sanford investigator told Norm Wolfinger, the State Attorney, that he felt like Zimmie was lying and his story did not match the evidence and Wolfinger refused to allow an arrest until further investigations were done. You can't cherry pick your evidence T_V. I'll lay down $100 to a donut that Zimmerman will be arrested and tried for MS or murder. He was told not to follow Trayvon. When Trayvon asked him why he was following him, he could have told him he was with the neighborhood crime watch and was observing but that didn't happen. Zimmie was packing heat and felt like a badass and obviously bowed up on the boy and it pissed him off. Now Trayvon made the mistake of standing his ground and he paid for that mistake with his life, but Zimmie needs to pay for his mistake through the justice system.....and he will.

First and foremost, you too are using every black kid's crime to justify the killing of Trayvon Martin

No I am pointing out that Black on White crime is NOT made into national news. Not even when it is within 5 miles of what has been MADE national news. Al and Jesse are already in the area and they can't be bothered since it is just two thugs attacking a White person minding his own business on a PUBLIC street.

I can show you a lot of googled links to show how hispanics brutally murder folks everyday and also how white kids do the same.

Good luck on the Hispanics one. I never said Whites don't kill only that it only makes news when it inolves something sensational and only stays in the news a few days, unlike the 10 plus stories on this one incident that has consumed over 3 weeks so far. DOJ statistics show that roughly equal numbers of Blacks and Whites commit most homicides: http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/homicide/race.cfm

From 1976 to 2005 --

• 86% of white victims were killed by whites
• 94% of black victims were killed by blacks

• Black victims are over represented in homicides involving drugs. Compared with the overall involvement of blacks as victims, blacks are less often the victims of sex-related homicides, workplace killings, and homicide by poison.
• Race patterns among offenders are similar to those among victims.

and 2.1% or less are either victims, or killed by, other races.

You wouldn't like those facts just as you would be pissed to learn that white people are the largest recipients of welfare and food stamps in this nation, twice the rate of Hispanics and more than blacks

I am not sure why you bring welfare into this discussion but lets do discuss that since you brought it up. Whites happen to make up the majority of the population in this once great country. I would expect them to make up a greater number in the welfare rolls. But again Blacks make up a larger proportion on the rolls of welfare than they do in the general population.

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/07/27/us/shrinking-welfare-rolls-leave-record-high-share-of-minorities.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

or

With regard to AFDC the figures are:

White 38.8% vs 72% of population based on US Census of 2010
Black 39.8 vs 13%

Oh hey notice that by percentage Blacks represent more on welfare than Whites in 2010?

as to your second posted link; Zimmerman was filmed at the PD in Sanford 35 minutes after the shooting and he had no visible injuries, swelling, blood or any other indications that he was beaten brutally and attacked

Have you seen the ABC enhanced video? The SYG law does not require ACTUAL serious injury only the belief that it will happen if lethal action (which is their words not mine) is not taken immediately.

The lead sanford investigator told Norm Wolfinger, the State Attorney, that he felt like Zimmie was lying and his story did not match the evidence and Wolfinger refused to allow an arrest until further investigations were done.

AND? Wolfinger was following SOP. INVESTIGATION. Isn't that what all the clamoring is about now? While the investigator "felt" George was less than truthful, he had no evidence and the statute clearly states they CANNOT make an arrest unless they PROVE the one claiming SYG self defense is in the wrong. I didn't write the poorly written law but I can read it. The law not only states they can't make an arrest until they PROVE wrongdoing but that the arresting agency is immediately on the hook for legal fees and damages if they are unable to prove wrongdoing. Sort of a lawyers wet dream.

I'll lay down $100 to a donut that Zimmerman will be arrested and tried for MS or murder

What brand of doughnut do you like? The MOST they can charge is MS... again see the Florida statutes in general and SYG specifically. Lets CLEARLY define the parameters here. Arrest and trial or Arrest, trial and conviction? Arrest is easy. Does trial count if the judge determines statute 776 applies and throws it all out before trial even starts? Conviction is rather clear... Convicted of MS or greater... I don't think conviction of discharge of a firearm meets the bar of your proposed wager. A plea deal to MS of any degree counts as a trial and, or conviction.

He was told not to follow Trayvon.

Word nuance but he was ADVISED "We don't need you to do that" They never TOLD him not to follow. At least we agree he followed and not chased, pursued or stalked.

When Trayvon asked him why he was following him, he could have told him he was with the neighborhood crime watch and was observing but that didn't happen

No actual evidence only hearsay and guessing. One side says one thing occurred and the other says something different. Police are now stating that the evidence bears out Zimmermans claim of a sucker punch after being challenged by Trayvon. Lets leave that to those who have the inside knowledge and access to evidence.

Zimmie was packing heat and felt like a badass

We both agree on that part. For some, packing heat does make them feel omnipotent. I see it the other way as I need to be better than 100% certain of my actions. I won't try to guess Georges thought process leading up to or during the encounter. It would only be a guess. I do know that he allowed Trayvon to get way too close whether he was packing or not. That's self defense 101.

obviously bowed up on the boy and it pissed him off. Now Trayvon made the mistake of standing his ground and he paid for that mistake with his life

That is part of the debate that only evidence we are not privy to will determine who came up on who. So, not so obvious.

but Zimmie needs to pay for his mistake through the justice system.....and he will.

He made many mistakes, I agree. Whether the legal justice system will impose ANY punishment has yet to be seen. As to the "he will" part???? I am hoping that once the legal justice system makes a determination one way or the other EVERYONE leaves it at that. IF, big if, he is convicted and sentenced that is where it needs to end. If he is not, it also needs to end there.

BTW, I will take that $100 via paypal or USPS money order 8-)

let's see. The two males that killed the white guy are where right NOW? Arrested and in jail with no bond. You make zero points. I agree with the rest. My AFDC chart from 2011 shows 35.8% White, 34.2% Black 17.4% Hispanic, ....

apparently the two males... see even you can't say Black males even though there are CLEAR photos, are in jail... Still no statement from the holier than thou Reverends. Brutal crime is brutal and independent of race.. but apparently not how it is reported.

Ok so the 2011 numbers differ from 2010. Any argument that the Black recipients on welfare are disproportionate to their percentage of general population? Again I'm not sure what welfare has to do with THIS specific story but you did throw it on the table.

I won't assume anything about a lack of response to the rest of our exchange.. it does take time to research. I was sort of expecting something on the dollars to doughnuts wager though LOL. I'll even make it a bakers dozen.. though most doughnut places don't understand the term.

The bet still stands. The lady assigned to do the prosecutrial investigation from North Florida has a pretty tight history on these sort of cases, so I think ultimately GZ will be arrested, released, and tried. Now convictions are purely out of the bet here, so I will be happy with a maple bacon donut. I never have tried one but they look good.

so I will be happy with a maple bacon donut. I never have tried one but they look good.

Sounds like a good choice.. I might have to send it from an internet store though... I might have to see if I can find one of those local myself.

Agreed on the bet. Where does it put us if the judge says no dice? null bet?

I've seen some of the history on the lady AG. I think she is one of the ones saying the law, as written, sucks. Honestly I am glad they picked her but I worry that if she loses, or says her hands are tied, there will accusations based on the choice.

Cases like this are like abortion; we should let the courts do the deal and accept the outcomes. I live on the Space Coast SE of sanford and in my community, we have our share of crime. We are on the I-95 corridor so the gangs from South Florida come up here to steal or sale stolen merchandise or drugs or whatever. If I catch anyone snooping around on my property, especially inside the confines of the privacy walls, you'll probably see me on TV. We had a car broken into and the cops won't come out to investigate. In fact, I had to file a report on line. I caught some boys breaking into a neighbors car 4 weeks later and called 911. It took them 3 hours to show up and i live 2 miles from the PD HQ. That was 9 years ago. I told the officer and the Chief I will never waste a call to them again. Likewise, i said when a corpse is removed from my property, it will be hard for him tell any lies or for them to prove I was not in fear for my life when the hiar trigger emptied the oversized clip on my 9mm. LOL. I'm originally an Italian Hillbilly from southern WV and a big fan of firearms, the right to bear em and the right to protect my family and property from unlawful intruders....I just think in this instance, out on the street, all of the parameters involved....the community would be served if there is a full investigation and IF Warranted, charges and a trial. I have sworn off of sodas and donuts and treats and pizza and all that good food for the last year or so. If you try one of those donuts, let me know what I am missing.

It took them 3 hours to show up and i live 2 miles from the PD HQ.

Hey that is a record I think... I called to report a teen threatening to shoot me and it took them 2 hours to respond. A month later someone reported my niece MAY have seen who was trying to kick a cat and 3 cars with 2 officer each arrived in 10 minutes with lights and sirens running.

Maybe we should both start reporting cats being abused?

I guess for the next few days this is the closest we will be getting to those maple bacon doughnuts. Then again we might have to drink to them http://www.geekalerts.com/rogue-voodoo-doughnut-bacon-maple-ale/

I agree this situation warranted an investigation. I believe it was ongoing but the parents got impatient. Certain individuals took it to this mess.

i might drink one of those. I'm more of a white lightening kinda guy myself. I don't have any but I know a guy? :))))),

!!Justice For Daniel Adkins!!

Agreed, the media shares in the responsibilty for the bad choices many others have made in this mess. They sought to turn a story about the slow process of and parent's fight for justice into a feeding frenzy of race in order to sell their product. Makes one wonder if they were hoping for some good ole fashioned race riots. They would sell news!

The sad part is that they've done it at the expense of justice for both Trayvon and for Zimmerman. When all is said and done my guess is that the story is somewhere in the middle and both individuals made a series of bad choices, which sadly ended in the loss of a 17 year old's life.

System's Down - The problem is this - "I didn't do those things." Therefore you have no right to hate me for them. And if you do, it is simply because I am white and white people did those things. That's called racism. It is no different than those that hate all black people because of what some black people do.

@systems's down

Wounded Knee - 1890

Emmett Till - 1955

Jack Johnson - HW boxing champ 1908 - 1915, died 1946.

Emmett Till's death was a tragedy no questions - however it happened 57 years ago. This was before the civil rights movement and the world has changed a great deal since then. Someone who was 4 years old when it happened and maybe able to remember it would be 62 years old and able to retire (if they retired early). I am hazarding a guess that you were not even born then but you are looking over old pictures and wrongs to find reasons to hate people who were also not born then and whose parents/families most likely had nothing to do with any of it.

Yes, African Americans can be racists. Some of the worst racists I have ever met have been AA. My college roommate was from Africa (2nd generation). The AA girls on our dorm floor were appalled that she did not want to join their clique based on her color and basically were hateful for no good reason to both of us. My ancestors were Irish and German immigrants that fought for the North in the civil war. So yes I am blonde Caucasian but I have no roots in the South and no history with any of the items you mentioned. What "brought us here" as you say has nothing to do with my past or history.

In the Trayvon Martin case I want the prosecutor to figure all this out. His family needs justice and closure. Personally, I am not sure that Trayvon did not attack Zimmerman because Zimmerman was being an a$$ to him. If he did he should have just ran home and called the police about the crazy man (Zimmerman) in the neighborhood but running is not promoted in today's movies/video/music. It is all about being a man and making sure you get the respect you deserve (and these type of messages are everywhere). However even though I want justice for Trayvon, I do not agree with Spike Lee Twittering addresses, or Jesse and Al race baiting.

As to tap dancing, I am not sure anyone taps anymore. What I would ask for you is not that but that you look forward ... not forgetting your history but not letting it consume or blind you. People are people and need to be judged on who they are not what they are and this is true no matter the race and etc.

Systems down. Don't ever mention all that the white man has offered and given assistance to you since then either.

There are problems alright, but it isn't so one sided either. Another thing, you can't legislate racism, bigotry, or any feeling away. Working together, hopefuly, can accomplish much more.

You have a good point vs191...but why not let the impartial investigation complete and let the truth be decided in our courts.

Somebody wrote very well above - "If zimmerman had not followed Martin, Martin would be alive today". And that comment gets collapsed. That is absolutely horrible. So you don't want to hear the truth. Your perception of what Martin was or how he could've attacked zimmerman could be comforting to your prejudices but is extremely unhealthy for society to say the least.

If Martin had not returned to exact some form of revenge upon Zimmerman for "following him", Martin would be alive today.

System Down....Interesting you only take history back to the point to support your position. You do know northern Africans made slaves of southern Europeans for centuries, right? You do know the vast majority of pre-civil war southern whites never owned a slave, right? Did you know the Romans made slaves of much of white Europeans for centuries. The made the English slaves for 200 hundred years. You do know that American Indians made slaves of each other. The Aztecs made slaves of and practiced live human sacrifices of their fellow Indians. Asians made slaves of other Asians and eastern Europeans. Africans have made slaves of other Africans for as long as records exist, and still do to this day. Wounded Knee...how about the Rwandan Genocide?

If we have to hate everyone whose ancestors who did something wrong to someone elses ancestors, then not only do we have to hate everyone else, we have to hate ourselves.

@ Mr. Rightnow,

I don't consider myself entitled and never inherited anything from anybody. In fact, I grew up dirt poor on a farm in rural Ohio, and upon graduation worked a full time job and two part time jobs to get where I am today. I am not wealthy by any means, but I live very comfortably thanks to my own hard work.

Nobody ever got ahead by crying "Woe is me the man is keepin me down." Why do you think we have a black president? Obama was a hard worker and an excellent student. In other words, he got off his ass and didn't wait for goverment assistance to take care of him.

People need to leave race out of it....it is a crime being investagated. They are crimes committed everyday and race does not play the part...the evil in this world is what the problem is...drugs out of control and things of this manner....Al Sharpton needs to keep his big mouth shut and let the law handle it.....there are injustices made everyday I see no one remembering the injustice of Kaylee Anthony for instance. The media needs to quite adding fuel to the fire. The Race issue is nothing more than what the individual makes it....If it was 2 Latio's this wouldn't have even made the news or if it was 2 black men ...wouldn't be on the news....SHUT THE PIE HOLE AL SHARPTON

I don't consider myself entitled.......Oh but you do if you don't understand why all somebody has to do is work their ass off to be successful...And if you think the fact that Obama is president is an indication of the climate in America I would agree somewhat but it does not paint the total picture....I am a high school administrator with a doctorate who realizes that racism is alive ....An example of this happened when Obama wanted to give students a speech about hard work and staying in school a couple of years ago .....and over 100 parents kept their kids home.....When GWB made the same address two years earlier nobody even complained

Also I agree that.... Nobody ever got ahead by crying "Woe is me the man is keepin me down,

but in order to address a problem one usually has to identify it...Then through revolution and dissidence and effort can the problem be ameilorated ....As far as inheritence ...I don't know how old you are but I am in my 50s So if you were my age I have to say .....you inherited the right to go to superior schools ...You inherited the right to walk down most city streets unaccounted ...You inherited the notion that two equally qualified job or college applicants of different races have the same opportunities.....I could go on

Many rich people don't seem to care about color (except green).....I guess as far as hard work I am willing to bet that you don't work any harder than the fruit and tobacco pickers do in Florida where I now live who are almost exclusively minorities.....

You live in a racist paradyme its not your fault.....

Well, at 6 foot, Trayvon would have been near anorexic. I'm thinking he probably weighed in closer to 160. Zimmerman looks closer to 190. I weighed 143 lbs after the onslaught of Grad-School and I have to say, I'd of kicked a 5'9" 190 lbs fat man's tuckus. Weigh me in at 160 lbs of lean muscle and Zimmerman better bring a gun...

Nice post Mr. RightNow,

However, keeping their children home had nothing to do with Racism. It was fueled by the misconception that Obama is a Socialist and he'd be brain washing them with his Liberal ideals. Now, unless Liberal, Democrat, and Socialist are races, it isn't racism. Totally agree with the rest of your post.

The way the Florida law is written is why Zimmerman will not be arrested,In some other states he would have been arrested.

If you actually take the time and read the law that Zimmerman is covered under it is easy to see why he will never go to jail, There is no way to prove that this was not self defense under Florida's law.

776.012 Use of force in defense of person.

776.032 Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of force.

776.041 Use of force by aggressor.

http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/Chapter776/All

For those of you thinking it is about time they addresses the old photos, don't you think it is about time they addressed phrases such as this:

Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch volunteer whose father is white and whose mother is Hispanic....

Sorry, but if his father was African-American and his mother white (or vise-versa) they wouldn't hesitate to go to the minority and call him African-American. Why slant the news by being so specific in this case and not going towards the minority and calling him Hispanic?

Who gave the picture of the teenager to the press? That is who decided what image people would have of the deceased. Why not post a toddler picture? The pic of Zimmerman was released by who? Police? Family?

At some point, the stats of both Martin and Zimmerman will come up and eventually true images of what they currently looked like will surface as well. Unfortunately the water is polluted. Zimmerman's dad, a democrat, is apparently horrified by Obama's actions. Obama once again took sides without allowing our legal system to determine what really happened. So one man's child is important, but another not so much.

One thing is for sure. Things between races have just taken another step down. We have the New Black Panthers saying they do not need to adhere to white laws. I head that comment myself during the interview with Anderson Cooper. I have yet to hear Obama tell the New Black Panthers that they indeed will listen to the laws on the books just like everybody else.

Mr.Right Now Good points.

I understand what ppl are saying about about the poorer cities being so dangerous and racist but for three years I lived in what is considered to be a bad neighborhood and every day I went to work in Detroit. In Detroit while things looked dilapiatated ppl were pretty much nice. One time someone did start to harass me while I was waiting for my bus at night but another woman helped me out. She was a black woman. I am white with blonde hair and blue eyes. In my neighborhood one day I had a medical emergency and no phone. I went to different neighbors houses and they all ignored me one lady had her kids throw rocks at me and it was clear that I was serverly bleeding. It was a black family that actually allowed me to use their

Yes of course it is misleading, it was meant to be. They needed a story.

If he thought the kid was commiting a crime, why should he stay back? Regardless of what the cops say? To many people "stay back" and let things happen and let criminals get away.

We do not know the truth yet. Many people hope this was what the media says it is. They hope and pray, because without it, they look like fools.

Most of the wealth ( well over 90%) in this country has been passed on from generation to generation ....It was also common during the days of slavery for a white slave master to father many children through the raping of female slaves. Some of the offspring slaves got to live in the house with the master and some were treated like the other slaves. Many slave masters sold their “mullato children to other masters who were sometimes cruel. The White children (progeny of the master) inherited the fruits of the slave labor for just being the white son. Even though it was the black (mullato children who worked the land)... So it does not surprise me when I see the entitlement that so many whites have because many of them have been indoctrinated that way by the rule makers. The thing that astounds me is the hypocrisy......You will probably say that you owe your cousins nothing or you black brothers nothing....But then you are entitled because of your race.... I just assume that you're one of those guys who thinks its okay to inherit money that you never worked for but it’s not okay to give food stamps to a child who doesn’t have enough to eat.

Most White people never saw a penny of that 90% of the wealth you are talking about, The top 1% of the people are the ones that inherited all the land and the money. So 99% of the white people have nothing to do with anything you are talking about. slaves were sold out by their own people to start with and the blacks that are here now have so much more than they would have ever had if they had not been descendants of slaves in America. My relatives never owned a slave,they never even owned the land that they worked themselves to death on they were lucky to have a shirt on their back,dirt poor so to speak. The same as 99% of the white people in America that happen to work for the same 1% of the people that the blacks work for.

I do not owe any person of any color a damn thing.

And the pendulum swings again...

I could care less about the photos, but it's interesting that for 3 weeks they tried very hard to find something bad about Trayvon Martin, then kind of, oops, let it slip that the guy with the gun had 2 previous arrests for violence. The fact still remains that if it had been a black man shooting an unarmed white teenager, he'd be in jail, and the media and the public would be screaming for his scalp, no questions asked, no "mitigating circumstances" allowed, and certainly no "stand your ground" when the shooter pursued the victim. 6' is tall, but 140 or even 150 is slim, and a gun certainly trumps a bag of Skittles; it apparently made Zimmerman FEEL big enough to get out of his SUV & chase this kid on foot.

All I can say is that it is not safe to walk down the streets of any major city today. The police cannot help you. I am predominately white in my ancestry although there are many Native Americans there as well. I don't hate anyone. I don't fear anyone. I carry two pistols (legally) where ever I go. I am a Korean War Veteran and I served with black men throughout my tour of duty. I cannot remember even one instance of racism (either whtie or black racism) during my 3 years in the U. S. Army, and I was in a position to see that if it had occurred. The black family unit, for the most part does not exist. The stereotype is that there is a black single mom on welfare and no dad in sight. Kids grow up hungry, unsupervised, exposed to drugs, gangs, and weapons at an early age. Only a few survive to become contributing members of society. Even those who achieve greatness in sport, entertainment, or any other calling sometimes fall by the wayside (O.J., Whitney, Billie Holliday, Dennis Rodman, Tiger, and the list goes on and on). When a black person falls by the wayside, it attracts more attention than when a white person falls (Denny McLain, Ryan Leaf, Mickey Rourke, Brett Favre, and there are plenty more names in this list as well). You must remember that Southern Plantation owners bred black people for size and strenght to work in the fields for generations. Now, the descendants of those slaves are becoming well known sports figures because of their athleticism, and the only thing that is missing is their character. There is no training, generally speaking, with regard to training in ethics and morality. They grow up hating white people and take it out on whoever is nearby. That is why I carry pistols. That is why I stay out of certain parts of any major city. That is why the inner-city neighborhoods look like war zones and exists for the benefit of drug dealers and criminals. It is not even safe for decent black people to live in the inner-city. The federal government could go in and re-build the inner cities across the country and within a few years they would look like disaster areas again. How many countries can you name in Africa wherer decent housing, clean water, an effective sewer system, a government that cares about the people, or even a hint of Western civilization exists? Once you get out of North Africa (Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Morocco, and Algeria) or the country of South Africa you are entering a stone-age culture. Where are the twp countries of Rhodesia today? Once the land was taken from the white farmers and given to the native blacks, chaos resulted and the farms stopped producing and food went away and nothing good ever happened there again. Think about it. Why are our prisons so full of young black men? Is it because of white racism in the justice system - I don't think so? Is it because they are doing the crime and must do the time? Think about that, and the fact that for every young black man in prison, there are probably dozens more that ought to be there with them. It is not safe to be around black people anymore. It is different when you compare the black people in the United States to the black people in other countries. In no other country in Western civilization where there is a large black population do you find the mentality and criminal attitude of the American black. It is a phenomenon you will not find in Brazil, Venezuela, Panama, Holland, England, Ireland, Jamaica, Bahamas, etc. It is very disturbing to me that the American black person has to live in such a world.

ron-1902603

"Most White people never saw a penny of that 90% of the wealth you are talking about, The top 1% of the people are the ones that inherited all the land and the money."

I am not talking about most white people.....

blacks that are here now have so much more than they would have ever had if they had not been descendants of slaves in America......

Thank you for your benevolence

My relatives never owned a slave,they never even owned the land that they worked themselves to death on

I am once again not talking about people who have nothing so to speak.

The same as 99% of the white people in America that happen to work for the same 1% of the people that the blacks work for.

See my previous point

I do not owe any person of any color a damn thing.

You may not ....you would have to change your outlook on justice and civilization in order for this to be the case...You seem to sport the same attitude that the slave masters did ....who owed nothing to non white children.....

If any race has been abused by this nation, it's the Native Americans. The white Americans genocided more Native Americans than Hitler killed Jewish. Yet, little focus is directed to this atrocity, and yes, the Native Californians as young as two were sold in CA as house, field and sex slaves after tribe after tribe was pushed extinct.

We stole their land, threw them out into the desert and placed them in concentration camps. We have not been a Nation Under God. We're as evil as they get. Slaves and genocide, as American as apple pie.

Two stupid, violent males wrestle on the ground, each with the intent of injuring the other more; one is. Not a news story outside of Sanford, FL. Never was. Until one of the guy's parents brought in Sharpton and Co., which ALWAYS entails extra baggage of national cable news bottom feeders that need 24/7 content and firestorm after firestorm, much self-created for profit and ratings. The internet and print media follow suit. Days or weeks of non-information hype tumbles out of the useless abyss, before landing smack square on what was the most plausible, common sense ending. The dopey entertainment addicted U.S. public never learns to simply ignore the corporate mass media.

Zimmerman had a right to follow Martin. Anyone can follow someone walking through their neighborhood if they think they are suspicious. Really hat it when people call it stalking, or pursuing. It was following plain and simple.

Martin had a right to be walking through the neighborhood to get to where he was staying.

So it does not matter what anyone did before, it all comes down to what happen when they finally connected?

Did Zimmerman grab Martin and try to "detain" him due to anger issues and Martin fought back and when Zimmerman was outmatched he used his gun?

Did Martin attack Zimmerman, either out of self defense because someone was following him and he was a worried kid, or because he thought he was being disrespected and then Zimmerman used the gun?

If it is the first, then I would say he is guilty of a crime. If it was the second, then clearly self defense.

They were both doing completely legal things until the physical part, that is the key. Problem is that it does not seem that anyone witnessed the beginning of it.

Dwayne said:

As far as I know there isn't a single white person currently living in this country who ever owned a slave,

Then you haven't been paying attention to the human rights crisis with people trafficking men, women and children into this country to serve as manual labor slaves and even more disgusting, sexual slaves. I personally knew a girl who was kidnapped by a rogue militia from a small village somewhere from Rwanda, sold to human traffickers, trafficked into the US at 12 so that a citizen could make child porn with her for 5 years before she got too old to be appelaing anymore and threw her out. She was picked up as an 'illegal' and died in a TX deportation camp after being raped by the camp chaplain and her baby was given into the custody of its pedophile father.

So yes, there are plenty of slaves living in the US and the US is one of the biggest markets for foreign slaves. Try doing a Google search for 'Human trafficking'.

skor154,

Don't know about you, but I was not around 150 years ago. I refuse to take the blame for what people did hundreds of years ago, much like I refuse to take the blame if some white guy robs the corner store.

Mr. Rightnow

You seem to sport the same attitude that the slave masters did ....who owed nothing to non white children.....

I have no idea how you got that from this,

I do not owe any person of any color a damn thing.

(that includes white people.)

If i had children of any color I would take care of them,you are lumping all white people together again as slave masters.

I personally knew a girl who was kidnapped by a rogue militia from a small village somewhere from Rwanda, sold to human traffickers, trafficked into the US at 12 so that a citizen could make child porn with her for 5 years before she got too old to be appelaing anymore and threw her out. She was picked up as an 'illegal' and died in a TX deportation camp after being raped by the camp chaplain and her baby was given into the custody of its pedophile father.

What was her name?

Jim in Auburn

Did Zimmerman grab Martin and try to "detain" him due to anger issues and Martin fought back and when Zimmerman was outmatched he used his gun?

Did Martin attack Zimmerman, either out of self defense because someone was following him and he was a worried kid, or because he thought he was being disrespected and then Zimmerman used the gun?

If it is the first, then I would say he is guilty of a crime. If it was the second, then clearly self defense

Under Florida's laws both of them are legally self defense.

The first is self defense under,

776.041 Use of force by aggressor.

The second one under,

776.012 Use of force in defense of person.

There were many 911 calls that night...but not one from Treyvon.

He was feared for his life so bad, he decided to call his girlfriend?

But, Zimmerman needs to go to jail for having a gun and not using good judgement when in possession of it. Maybe manslaughter, but not a lynching that many are insinuating.

But, Zimmerman needs to go to jail for having a gun and not using good judgement when in possession of it.

He did use good judgment that's why he is not the dead guy.

Deceptive? I don't believe so. If one is strictly a visual perceiver of information, then how would other information be processed? Facts and forensic evidence are not all always visual. When looking at a situation objectively, fairly facts need to be taken into consideration. In my analysis, my questions about George Zimmerman's immediate injury status were asked as soon as I read the first article about his claims that he was beaten and his nose broken. The head and neck are highly vascular and this man would be bleeding profusely cuasing the Sanford Police Department to seek out IMMEDIATE Medical Intervention, not paramedical intervention. Opened, dirty flesh wounds are entryways to infection and secondary disease such as the Tetanus Toxoid Bacteria. Zimmerman's Tetanus Immunization status would have had to have been assessed by at least an ER RN. A serious head injury requires thorough Neurological Medical Examination and CT examination to rule out the possibility of an even more dangerous Subdural Hematoma which only 24 hour observation would reveal. If his nose was broken, Ice would have to be applied to reduce oxygen compromising swelling immediately and further medical assessment for septum deviation to note oxygenation compromise...he would have difficulty breathing. The fact that the Sanford Police Department, while taking Zimmerman into custody, should have taken him to an ER to be objectively examined Medically to get the wounds documented and absolve themselves of liability should he suffer further. More than 30 hrs. would have lapsed before Zimmerman now obtains medical treatment at which time opportunity for suturing, cleansing and treating of wounds and Neurological Care and follow up are compromised severely. Fact: George Zimmerman was not severely injured. Fact: Someone's seventeen year old son died at the hand of George Zimmerman. Citizen Gun Laws or not, the perpetrator needs to be arrested, charged, investigated further and his weapon admitted for evidence. Fact: The Medical Examiner did not note any offensive bruising, skin scraping to Trayvon Martin's hands post mortem to indicate that he could have thrown injurious blows to Zimmerman. Were Trayvon's clothing examined for Zimmerman's blood, skin evidence that there was an injurious fight? Do I need pictures to help tell this story? No. The pictures released were to appeal to emotion which is a basic form of deriving human interest. The picture of Zimmerman was the only available publicly accessed photo since he chose not to come forward about the incident. I cannot speak to the Martin family. What did you look like at seventeen?

I agree Zimmerman like others who have mistakenly killed another though not intentionally should at least be tried for manslaughter. But in any case life will correct him whether he goes to trial or not.

What needs looking into are the phone records between Zimmerman's father and the chief of Police of Sanford, if there are any... It is very suspicious that the police chief was there on the scene and no arrest was made...

Zimmerman's father is a retired judge and it seems with connections... This whole story stinks...

A seventeen y/o child shot dead for what? seems to be a no good reason but for the fact he was wearing a Hood and walking while being black...

Ron:

Severine. I never could pronounce her last name and couldn't spell it if I tried. Dad made me learn French and Spanish when I was young, and she spoke mostly Tutti and Acholi and a few words of French.

We met in Ritmo--the deportation camp in Raymondville, TX where she was going to be deported for being illegal as soon as she gave birth and where I was looking at the rest of my life in civil detention for being undocumented. I was adopted internationally as a child, never told before Dad and Mom passed away in a car accident, so when USCIS lost my adoption paper 18 years after I was adopted and ICE came to me saying 'Papers, please' , I had no idea what they were talkng about.

They couldn't deport me because as an abandoned infant with no paperwork to show where and when I was born (the legal term is 'stateless') there was nowhere to send me. I was placed in a deportation camp and told I would spend the rest of my life there unless or until I provided them with the adoption paper (My legal BC with my adoptive parents name on it, my SS card, and DL were not proof of citizenship.) I spent three years writing to every courthouse in three states (Dad was in the military, we moved around a lot) trying to find that adoption paper. I eventually found it and they let me go.

Whitefeather said:

In my analysis, my questions about George Zimmerman's immediate injury status were asked as soon as I read the first article about his claims that he was beaten and his nose broken. The head and neck are highly vascular and this man would be bleeding profusely cuasing the Sanford Police Department to seek out IMMEDIATE Medical Intervention, not paramedical intervention.

And according to the report filed by the first officers on the scene such was not the case.

Ofc Timothy Smith was the first officer on the scene, here is his report submitted 2/27/2012 at 3:29:

On 2/26/2012 at approximately 1917 hours I responded to 1111 Retreat View Cir in reference to a report of a suspicious person. As I arrived on scene, dispatch advised of a report of shots fired in the same subdivision.

I was advised by dispatch that the report of shots fired was possibly coming from 1231 Twin Trees lane I was then advised after receiving multiple calls that there was a subject lying in the grass between the residences of 1231 Twin Trees Ln and 2821Retreat View Cir. I responded to 2831 Retreat View Cir and exited my marked Sanford Police vehicle and began to canvas the area. As I walked between the buildings I observed a white male wearing a red jacket and blue jeans I also observed a black male wearing a gray hooded sweatshirt laying face-down in the grass.

I asked the subject in the red jacket, later identified as George Zimmerman (who was original caller for the suspicious person complaint), if he had seen the subject. Zimmerman stated that he had shot the subject and was still armed. Zimmerman complied with all of my verbal commands and was secured in handcuffs. Located on the inside of Zimmerman's waist band, I removed a black Kel Tek 9mm PF9semi auto handgun and holster. While I was in such close contact with Zimmerman I could observe his back appeared to be wet and was covered in grass as if he had been laying on his back on the ground. Zimmerman was also bleeding from the nose and the back of his head.

Shortly after securing Zimmerman Ofcr Ricardo Ayala arrived on scene. I advised Ofcr Ayala that I had not made contact with the black male subject laying on the ground. I observed Ofcr Ayala make contact with the subject and attempt to get a response, but s met with negative results. Shortly after this other officers began to arrive on scene and along with SFD rescue 38 who began to give aid to the subject lying on the ground.

Zimmerman was placed in the rear of my police vehicle and was given first aid by the SFD. While the SFD was attending to Zimmerman, I over heard him state "I was yelling for someone to help me but no one would help me.” At no point did I question Zimmerman about the incident that had taken place. Once Zimmerman was cleared by the SFD, he was transported to the Sanford Police Department.

Zimmerman was placed in an interview room as SPD, where he was interviewed by Investigator D Singleton. Zimmerman was turned over to investigators and this was the extent of my involvement in this case.

The Kel Tek handgun that I collected from Zimmerman was placed into evidence under TS-1.

A seventeen y/o child shot dead for, what seems to be no good reason but for the fact he was wearing a Hood and walking while being black...

A 17 year old young man shot dead for attacking someone.

Zimmerman had no obligation to wait until he was severely injured before he defended himself,The point of shooting the 17 year old young man was to not sustain great bodily harm in the first place.

Ofcr Ricardo Ayala’s statement submitted 2/27/2012 2:28

On 2/26 at approximately 1917 hours I was dispatch to 1111 Retreat View Cir in reference to a complainant seeing suspicious person in the area. While en route dispatch stated that they were receiving calls in reference to gun shots being heard in the area where I was responding to.

Ofc. T. Smith stated via radio that he was arriving in the area. Ofc. T. Smith later states that there was only one subject shot and he had one at gunpoint.

Upon arrival Ofc. T. Smith had a white male later identified as George Zimmerman, in custody. Zimmerman was also the original caller in reference to the suspicious person.

I then noticed that there was what appeared to be a black male wearing a gray sweater, blue jeans, and white/red sneakers laying face-down on the ground. The black male had his hands underneath his body. I attempted to get a response from the black male but was met with negative results. At that time Sgt. Raimondo arrived and attempted to get a pulse on the black male but none as found. At that time Sgt. Raimondo and I turned the black male over and began CPR. Sgt. Raimondo did breaths and I did chest compressions.

Sgt. S McCoy arrived on scene and relieved me continuing compressions. Sanford Fire Rescue arrived on scene and attempted to revive the subject but could not. Paramedic Brady pronounced the subject deceased at 1930 hours.

The scene was then secured with crime scene tape by Ofc. Mead and Ofc. Wagner. Ofc. Robertson began a crime scene contamination log.

Lt. Taylor arrived on scene and notified dispatch to have Major Crimes respond to the scene. Ofc. Mead and Ofc. Wgner were able to make contact with neighbors in the area. They were able to obtain statements from all witnesses on scene.

The scene was turned over to SPD Major Crimes.

hmmmmm to all of you on the wealth kick, take a look at pro-sports how many Football, Basketball,Baseball and Soccer players are make millions a year playing a game? and how many are Black? and people Hispanic s not a race sorry to tell you. As for the fall of the "motor city" I grow up in Northwest Indiana in a town right next to Gary , Gary was founded n 1906 most of the cities around it were founded in the mid 1800's and of all the cities Gary s the most run down trashed city n the area. it also has the most blacks. now how come if a white man walks in a Black area of a city and gets robbed he is told he was in the wrong part of town and should not of been there, but if a Black man walks in an all white area and anything happens he screams racism ?

If the autopsy shows the kid was shot in the back, I want Zimmerman arrested.

If it shows he was shot from a good distance front or back (not in personal space) I would like to see him arrested.

Other than that,I believe it was self defense.

Regardless of what the autopsy shows, I think all the people that have been inciting violence and those putting out wanted dead or alive posters need to be arrested.

Amanda-2017567

Thank you for the information and for the way you explained it in post #2.52.

:-)

@Ickmiblls "I would just like to thank the 2012 black community in America for proving what I have been saying all my life since being born (1956) and raised in Detroit, that you truly are the most racist people on the face of the earth. And you will NEVER get along with anyone: white, asian, hispanic, arab,indian,etc,etc.If you hate "

I agree with you, 100%. I'm Hispanic, born and raised in Dallas. In my experience living in that city and travelling to others across the south, I've found them to be the most contemptibly racist and hateful race of people here, I'd even feel the same if all the others were combined. Sure, racism exists in other races as well.. and sure, whites did a lot of harm with their racism during a period of time. But this is the 21st century, and a vast majority of everyone except blacks have moved on.

Unless you and your people change, you will continue to be the most hated race on the planet, by EVERYONE. Not just whites. Every race on the planet.

There will be no justice for either Martin or Zimmerman. Martin was in all likelihood unjustly gunned down. With the hyper publicity surround this, I don't see how they could ever find an impartial jury in the universe much less the planet, Thank You mass media, Al Sharpton, and Obama. Now when Zimmerman gets off, the streets will be running with blood, blood that will be on the hands of MSNBC and every other media outlet that chose to try Zimmerman in the court of public opinion. SHAME ON YOU ALL!

AMANDA - So what does all of this have to do with original question posed by the article itself? Your ability to rewrite (improper use of quotes and mulltiple type-o's makes your piece irrelevant.) uncited data is unimpressive. What is the source? Who is the author? Are you an employee of the City of Sanford? Where did you obtain your information? First Aid does not qualify for appropriate Medical Intervention. I doubt that you were able to comprehend the entirety of my post. That is the reason for the lengthy justification of my thought processes. A Police Officer is not a Medical Doctor and is therefore not capable of assessing serious injuries as stated by Mr. Zimmerman. Fist Aid is nothing more than applying pressure to minor bleeding incidents, splinting, removal from immediate harm until the victim can be treated by qualified Medical Personnel...Paramedics administer First Aid and are directed and instructed by Certified Truama Care Nurses to proceed with any life saving interventions under Standing Medical Orders until transported to the closest Emergency Department where a team is prepared awaiting standby of arrival for further assessment, treatment and intervention.

B Stevens: ...truely showed there true colors and stupidity....

It's ''their true colors and stupidity''

There will be no justice for either Martin or Zimmerman. Martin was in all likelihood unjustly gunned down.

You have found Zimmerman guilty with no evidence or trial of course there will be no justice in your eyes.

The Feds are trying the best they can to find any little technicality they can charge Zimmerman with and it is just not working out for them. Zimmerman is covered 100% by Florida's laws including immunity from civil prosecution.

I think Floridas self defense law may need some tweaking on some of its wording but as it stands now anything less than video tape that shows Zimmerman was never losing the fight or in trouble will not be enough to convict Zimmerman of anything.

Ron:

Thank YOU for your understanding--many people (ICE included) don't understand the difference between undocumented and illegal. Being undocumented does not automatically mean 'illegal'.

Mr.Rightnow.... If you are an example of a school administrator with a doctorate it is not a surprise that our education system is in such poor shape. As I grew up I witnessed my area of town change from being 70% white, 25% black and 5% Native American to being 90% black, 3% Native American and 2% white. When I was 4-5-6 years old we had a nice inclosed shopping mall, major chain grocery stores, a twin screen indoor movie theater, strip malls with major chain stores anchoring mom and pop shops, etc. My parents could send me to the store alone to purchase something they needed. I could leave the house at dawn and play throughout the neighborhood all day long and until I was called in after dinner. By the time I was 12 and we moved NONE of the above conditions existed. I was a virtual prisoner in my own home. The simple and required act of walking home from school had become a game of "can I make it home today without being jumped by a group of black people?" Even my black "friends" would attack me when other blacks encouraged them too (which I kind of understand. better to be one of the 4-5-6 doing the attacking than 1 of 2 being attacked). Fortunately this ocurred in the early 70's before everyone over the age of 8 was packing heat and virtually all of my injuries were superficial. All of this being the case I believe you have misindentified the problem. It isn't the white man keeping you down it is many of your fellow black Americans that are doing so. I am not bitter about my experiences. Just the opposite in fact. It taught me how to defend myself and survive. It also taught me how it feels to be hated and persecuted for no reason other than the color of my skin.

Your welcome- Amanda,

I have respect for everyone that tells their side of anything that does not revert to name calling.

It is refreshing to get the info asked for instead of some sort of BS.

You know it's real sad i sit here and read everyone's post and there more on the subject of rasicism then what really happen to the kid right is right wrong is wrong it dosent matter how we end it for zimmerman guilty or not god know's what happen and if he did what he did outta hate then the true judge will put him where he need's to be. Everyone need's to wake up and unplug before it's too late. live and love life in god's name amen.

Amanda-2017567

Ron:

Thank YOU for your understanding--many people (ICE included) don't understand the difference between undocumented and illegal. Being undocumented does not automatically mean 'illegal'.

So are BOTH Amandas commenting on this thread?

THIS HAS ZERO to do with ILLEGAL immigrants. TAKE YOUR BOOHOO story to the ILLEGAL immigrant thread. QUIT attempting to subvert this and other stories to your whiny made up story. That the Hispanic community has not shown ANY support for Zimmerman is astonishing at best.

When this story dies down we can debate your lies in the undocumented = ILLEGALS thread. Not having proper visas to enter this country make one ILLEGAL Same if George did not have a license to carry concealed would have made him illegal.

skeeter-339704 had this to say:

Systems down. Don't ever mention all that the white man has offered and given assistance to you since then either.

Ummm, guy? What has "the white man" offered to people of color, precisely? You do know that modern medicine in the US is largely rooted in black culture, right? What isn't rooted in black cluture is often rooted in Hispanic or Native American culture or female culture.

The "white man" believed in Calvinism--that is, you get sick because you are a bad person and misbehave or because God disapproved of you and smote you down. Black people (male and female) were much more interested in herbal cures and minor surgical interventions. Once doctors who were white observed what the local herbalists and midwives were doing, they started experimenting and realized that they were good practices. While "white men" brought in such innovations as microscopes and so forth (though, arguably, microscopes came from Persia, and came into Persia from Asia). It was the dynamic inter-meshing of cultures that has allowed modern medicine to emerge.

There are many things that people think the "white man" brought into the world that the "white man" did not. So, friend, why not try naming those things you think came from the "white man," and let the rest of us demonstrate that while white men might have popularized it, and might even have brought something to the table that was important, that the development was just the tiniest bit more collaborative than that.

Let's remember, for example, that Ethiopia was a civilized and cosmopolitan place (read your Bible--it mentions the princes of Ethiope) when the "white man" was still jumping up and down in bearskins and eating other people. This is not to say that the "white man" (by which I am guessing you mean Aryan--and remember that Greeks and Italians aren't considered quite white enough to be Aryan) wasn't effective in what "he" did--look up the history of the Germanic tribes (very brutal--managed to ambush and kill an entire three legions of Romans in the Teutoburg Forest in 9 CE). Still, in relatively recent history, it was the "white man" (the central, northern, and western European) who had civilization brought to "him"--not the "white man" who brought it to others. Have a great day.

Whitefeather said:

What is the source? Who is the author? Are you an employee of the City of Sanford? Where did you obtain your information?

Source: martinpolicereport (dot) pdf. Sorry I have to do it like this but for some reason I can't get links to stick.

Author(s): Officer T. Smith and Officer R. Ayala

Employee of Sanford: No

Source of information: martinpolicerepot (dot) pdf. It's out there, do a Google search.

A Police Officer is not a Medical Doctor and is therefore not capable of assessing serious injuries as stated by Mr. Zimmerman. Fist Aid is nothing more than applying pressure to minor bleeding incidents, splinting, removal from immediate harm until the victim can be treated by qualified Medical Personnel...Paramedics administer First Aid and are directed and instructed by Certified Truama Care Nurses to proceed with any life saving interventions under Standing Medical Orders until transported to the closest Emergency Department where a team is prepared awaiting standby of arrival for further assessment, treatment and intervention.

And as Officer Ayala's report stated, there was a paramedic on scene, since only a medical professional can officially and legally determine if a subject is deceased. Officer Ayala specifically states that 'Paramedic Brady pronounced the subject deceased at 1930 hours.'

(improper use of quotes and mulltiple type-o's makes your piece irrelevant.)

Um. Sorry about the improper use of quotes, I'm still relatively new to this Newsvine forum thing and I don't know all the ins and outs yet.

As far as misspellings and typos:

On Officer Smith's report: I did not capitalize 'Lane' and did not put a period after it. I did not put a period between 'Ln' nor after the 'Cir'. I neglected to insert a space between '2821' and the street name 'Retreat'. I did not put a space between 'PF9' and the word 'semi' and did not hyphenate 'semi-automatic' as is proper. I typed 'Ofcr' instead of 'Ofc.' There is a stray 's' between the words 'but' and 'met'. I did not capitalize 'Rescue'. I did not put a period after the 'D' in the investigator's name, it should read 'Investigator D. Singleton.' Those are my mistakes. My apologies.

The use of the word 'laying' instead of 'lying' and 'over heard' for the word 'overheard' are the original police officer's words and were kept because that is how he wrote it.

On Officer Ayala's report:

I neglected to insert a period after 'Cir'. I neglected to insert 'a' between the words 'seeing' and 'suspicious'. I missed a 'w' to turn the word 'as' to 'was'. I neglected to insert a period between 'S' and 'McCoy'. Those are my mistakes and I apologize.

Use of the word 'dispatch' for 'dispatched to 1111 Retreat View Cir', 'face-down' instead of 'facedown' are Officer Ayala's words.

That having been said, I am currently abed with time on my hand (the other hand is inoperable) from having broken my elbow rollerskating with my children. I am therefore typing with my left hand only and my right middle finger is being used to hold the shift key, and that is the extent of the current mobility in that limb.

AMANDA - So what does all of this have to do with original question posed by the article itself? Your ability to rewrite (improper use of quotes and mulltiple type-o's makes your piece irrelevant.) uncited data is unimpressive. What is the source? Who is the author? Are you an employee of the City of Sanford? Where did you obtain your information? First Aid does not qualify for appropriate Medical Intervention. I doubt that you were able to comprehend the entirety of my post. That is the reason for the lengthy justification of my thought processes. A Police Officer is not a Medical Doctor and is therefore not capable of assessing serious injuries as stated by Mr. Zimmerman. Fist Aid is nothing more than applying pressure to minor bleeding incidents, splinting, removal from immediate harm until the victim can be treated by qualified Medical Personnel...Paramedics administer First Aid and are directed and instructed by Certified Truama Care Nurses to proceed with any life saving interventions under Standing Medical Orders until transported to the closest Emergency Department where a team is prepared awaiting standby of arrival for further assessment, treatment and intervention.

You used 'type-o's' instead of the proper 'typos'. There should have been no period between the word 'irrelevant' and the ending parentheses, unless the word 'uncited' should have been capitalized, which then would make placement of the period OUTSIDE the parenthesis mark appropriate to indicate the end of the sentence. In sentence 12 you missed an 'r' in 'First Aid'--so far as I am aware, there is no such thing as 'Fist Aid'. You also misspelled 'Trauma'.

trust_verify:

You know my story, I've posted it often enough. I came here legally. Was adopted legally, wasn't my fault USCIS lost ithe paper. Ron simply asked a question related to an earlier post I made in reference to modern day slavery as applied to blacks today and I was answering it. I'm not going to get into this debate with you here--I should have answered Ron privately instead of on this forum.

My apologies to Newsvine for posting those comments here, I didn't even think to send it via 'contact author' link. I'm still relatively new and will remember in future.

In reading all of the opinions above, I have to say, I can understand all sides! I am of mixed races, but choose not to have to say which ones. Bottom line is there is a person dead, a family grieving and someone else that is in his own kind of turmoil. There are only 3 persons that truly know, at this moment, what happened one is in hiding, one is no longer on earth, and one is God. While I understand the obvious pain and suffering that the Africans were in when brought here, against their will. I am also understanding that it was long ago. So many have fought for a peace, amongst people of all races. Media has a way of reporting the news, so that people who do not "know" or do not "live" amongst people of races, other than themselves, can form opinions about these other people. These opinions are called stereotypes. If all of this discussion could happen, without people being so angry about it, all of the time, we may be able to get somewhere, in this country. Sadly, we have people from two of the ethnicities involved, going over the top and "hating" each other even more. If we as a society are not careful, we will see the repercussions of this hatred toward one another, backfire. I think that if we take a look at the people who we meet everyday, some we do know, some we don't, we can really see how far we as a society have come. There may be people in power, that are white, and you feel this holds you back or holds you down. Also know that some are African American, Hispanic, Jewish, Asian and some are European, that hold places in our Government, too. There are people of the Human race that may just not like a person because they don't like the person. There are far more people that feel that way, than the way the media intends for us to dislike them for, the color of their skin or the accent in their voice. It is time to wake up and try to do the best we can with what we have, in our daily lives. If this means that you don't feel safe in the place you reside, get out and do better, for yourself and your family. I know African Americans and Caucasions that have to worry about violence that could happen and does, right outside their door. I, also know of many of them that have told themselves, no matter what the cost, they are going to get out of where they are, for the safety of their families. I also know Caucasions and African Americans that worry about where their next meal is going to come from, where they are going to live when their jobs have laid them off. With the good discussions that have gone on here, maybe people from this Human Race, that I spoke of, can come together and try and figure out how to get people of all races to live and survive the daily lives that everyone has to live, these days! My heart goes out to the family and families of anyone who loses a loved one, no matter how it happened. To lose a life in vain, or accidental is bad enough. But for someone to die, that has lived a live filled with hatred for the next person, is to die never to have known life at all.

i rally doont car how anyome speels as loong as i no what theay r tring two saay.

Ron: I don't either but I really do need to watch my posts. Having a broken arm isn't an excuse. I shouldn't have gone all sarcastic on him, I'm feeling a little guilty right now because of it and I'll probably send him a private message later to apologize for getting angry and going sarcastic on him. His comment about typos making the post irrelevant just...irritated me a bit.

Amanda,

is this the report you wanted linked for your post#2.70 ?

http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/Twin%20Lakes%20Shooting%20Initial%20Report.pdf

Mr. Rightnow If you are a doctorate carrying school administrator I for one would like to know which school system you administrate.. Attitudes like this, your quote "but in order to address a problem one usually has to identify it...Then through revolution and dissidence and effort can the problem be ameilorated" are totally unacceptable for any educator.. Change is brought about by education and leading by example.. Now I understand why Black American values are screwed up.. It is because of people like you contaminating young minds to think force and lawlessness are accepted behavior..

This teenager was allowed to roam freely at night even though he was suspended from school.. This shows a lack of discipline by his parents and is further proof that Black society values are poor.. Some African people are aggressive by nature and I have witnessed this first hand.. My Hungarian coworker lives in a Cleveland suburb and was having a birthday party for his son.. Being neighborly he invited some of the neighbors children who were Black to eat and play games.. They were fine for the first hour or so then I watched as they started becoming aggressive and collectively started to bully the White kids.. My friend noticed that a few thing were missing including some beer.. He caught one of them with a bunch of stuff under his shirt.. So he took the kid by the arm and marched him to the child's home.. Upon explaining this to the parent they laughed and threatened my friend because he had the nerve to search his child and grab him by the hand.. The other boys decided to bust a chair and knock over some food to show their anger and stomped of yelling some foul language.. His home was vandalized several times and things were stolen.. He has since moved..

dmac225

Mr.Rightnow.... If you are an example of a school administrator with a doctorate it is not a surprise that our education system is in such poor shape.

Just because you didn't get anything out of it doesn't mean its in bad shape..... google it its still the best education system in the world.......

Your opinion of Africa is as narrow minded and uneducated as your post - Shel Rama. Since it's obvious you've never travelled to Africa you should at least enlighten yourself via armchair travel before posting such ignorant thoughts.

The federal government could go in and re-build the inner cities across the country and within a few years they would look like disaster areas again. How many countries can you name in Africa wherer decent housing, clean water, an effective sewer system, a government that cares about the people, or even a hint of Western civilization exists? Once you get out of North Africa (Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Morocco, and Algeria) or the country of South Africa you are entering a stone-age culture. Where are the twp countries of Rhodesia today? Once the land was taken from the white farmers and given to the native blacks, chaos resulted and the farms stopped producing and food went away and nothing good ever happened there again.

There many African countries with well developed cities, sprawling infrastructure and viable economies. Here's few modernized African cities that negate your claim; Luanda, Angola - Lagos, Nigeria - Maputo, Mozambique - Accra, Ghana - Kinshasha, DR of Congo - Nairobi, Kenya - Yaounde, Cameroon - Dakar, Senegal, - Asmara, Eritrea - Windhoek, Namibia - Addis Ababa, Ethiopia - Ouagadougou, Burkina Faso - Harare, Zimbabwe are just a sample of developed African cities with thousands or millions of Africans residing in each. None of these listed countries have governments ruled by Arabs as in North Africa or by South Afrikaner Caucasians. While this is totally off the subject of the Travon Martin shooting case and old vs new photos, it on topic of painting a different picture than the truth as you attempted to paint about Africa and African people.

Roadrunner0

So he took the kid by the arm and marched him to the child's home.. Upon explaining this to the parent they laughed and threatened my friend because he had the nerve to search his child and grab him by the hand..

just so I know the story correctly,

did he grab him by the arm or did he grab him by the hand?

Roadrunner0

"Change is brought about by education and leading by example..

Many educated people are complacent which is part of the problem and in order to form a viable revolution education is a must but it is not enough

Now I understand why Black American values are screwed up..

I probably shouldn't continue .....your stereotyping of an entire race makes your position clear I am engaged in a discussion with an obvious racist

It is because of people like you contaminating young minds to think force and lawlessness are accepted behavior..

Sometimes it is..... thats why we have wars....But I have never advocated force or lawlessness

A revolution (from the Latin revolutio, "a turn around") is a fundamental change in power or organizational structures that takes place in a relatively short period of time. Aristotle described two types of political revolution:

1. Complete change from one constitution to another
2. Modification of an existing constitution

Shel Rama

In no other country in Western civilization where there is a large black population do you find the mentality and criminal attitude of the American black. It is a phenomenon you will not find in Brazil, Venezuela, Panama, Holland, England, Ireland, Jamaica, Bahamas, etc. It is very disturbing to me that the American black person has to live in such a world.

I have never claimed that i was the sharpest knife in the drawer, once again i think I need the statement above clarified as it seems to contradict itself to me.

Scratch Windhoek, Namibia off the list and replace with either Abidjan, Ivory Coast or Brazzaville, Republic of Congo for other examples of modernized African cities.

mr right now, in one of your slanted attacks, you posted "Where did you get nine violent acts....... just pulled that one out your azz didn't you?" May I suggest you do a little research, head straight to the FBI website (or any other showing demographic breakdown of crimes, specifically race related violent crimes) and you will find it there in black and white, pun intended.....it is a FACT, not speculation, not guessing, not reading tea leaves...it is a FACT that blacks commit violent hate crimes against whites at a rate of 9:1....

so please before you accuse someone of pulling something out of their "azz" begin by pulling your head out of your's and look at the facts. you lose ALL credibility to everything else you say because of dumbazz statements like that.

@callingitasitis

No, you are pulling it out your azz.

From the FBI website: "In 2010, the races of the 6008 known hate crimes offenders were as follows:

-58.6% were WHITE (3520 instances, BTW)

-18.4% were Black

-8.9% were groups made up of individuals from various racial groups

-1.1% were Asian/Pacific Islanders

-1.0% were American Indian/Alaskan Native

-12.0% were unknown" (FBI Website, Uniform Crime Reports, Hate Crime Statistics 2010)

Nice try, though. Maybe you should cite your sources before you post your work, kid. We check attributions here.

callingitlikeitis I see somebody already set you straight .....I was going to but I guess it really doesn't matter whats in black and white to you .....

Out of the 58,6%

how many of them were against blacks?

From 1976-2005 In the US

14% of all murdered white people have been killed by blacks or other races

while only

6% of all murdered black people were killed by whites or other races

And the blacks are the minority in the population.

Such a pity all of you have already sentenced a man without hearing the facts. Before you convict Zimmerman, or in some cases, sentence him to death; please wait for the verdict.

I can think of many reasons (some of them in this thread) of why Trayvon would attack Zimmerman. I can also think of reasons that Zimmerman would think a young man wandering through a gated community would be suspicious. If you cannot, please, Please, SHUT UP. If you cannot see past the color of their skins your as guilty of killing Trayvon as anyone else.

Think before you decide if someone is guilty. Take in the facts.

1. The area had been robbed several times of late by a gang of black youths.

2. A black youth is wandering around the area talking on the phone, hood up so that it is harder to identify him.

3. Calling the police, an endeavor that might get a police officer out there sooner or later, your told to let the suspicious youth get away.

There is the part you have to think about. Would you follow said youth to see where he is going, or if he is just checking out houses.

I have yet to see answers to the following questions.

a. Did Trayvon's father's girlfriend, not his father, but the girlfriend, live in the gated community? Was it a short cut, or did he just want to wander around.

b. Did Zimmerman approach with his gun visible or did it come out in the fight?

c. Consider if you will that Trayvon is a teen ager and athletic. Both of these types of people usually have attitudes when it comes to dealing with the world. Can you be certain that seeing a smaller older man trying to boss him around that Trayvon did not physically attack Zimmerman first.

d. Where was Trayvon shot, front or back, possibly in the side. Were their powder burns on Trayvon's hoodie.

If any of you can answer these questions, please do. If not, drop the DAMN subject. Your only making the problem worse.

Just for the record, showing a child's picture of a grown man can make anyone think he is innocent. After all kids are dear to most people.

On the Subject of racism. America has problems, this is certain, but if YOU are not willing to work toward fixing them, they please shut up and let those with the desire to fix the problems work. I see the organizations like the Black Panther party as an insult to the dream of Dr ML King. Please take this into advisement from an ex soldier that think that each person needs to be judged on their own merit not the color of their skin. As to the rest of you that seem to think that being racist is the way to fix any problem, I pity you, and your children. They will never, ever be able to see past the color of the skin of the people around them.

The native americans that evil whitey oppressed on the East Coast were primarily Europeans anyway, so it was apparently a case of whitey oppressing whitey. Apparently genetics have revealed that the origin of East Coast tribes generally arose from Spain/French regions 30 to 40,000 years ago, during the last Ice Age and predate the Asiatic influx and 'Native Americans' descended from Asiatic backgrounds.

ron-1902603

From 1976-2005 In the US

WAY to misrepresent FACTS and abuse statistics!!!!! How about you report those stats as they were provided rather than slant them????? What you are doing is not only as bad as the other side but worse because you already agree what they are doing is wrong.

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/homicide/race.cfm

From 1976 to 2005 --

• 86% of white victims were killed by whites
• 94% of black victims were killed by blacks

For the years 1976-2005 combined -

• Black victims are over represented in homicides involving drugs. Compared with the overall involvement of blacks as victims, blacks are less often the victims of sex-related homicides, workplace killings, and homicide by poison.
• Race patterns among offenders are similar to those among victims.

WAY to misrepresent FACTS and abuse statistics!!!!! How about you report those stats as they were provided rather than slant them????? What you are doing is not only as bad as the other side but worse because you already agree what they are doing is wrong.

LOL,

I did not misrepresent anything, I told the truth then you went and confused yourself.

How do you figure what I said,

14% of all murdered white people have been killed by blacks or other races

while only

6% of all murdered black people were killed by whites or other races

is any different than what you just posted?

86% of white victims were killed by whites

.

Black victims are over represented in homicides involving drugs. Compared with the overall involvement of blacks as victims, blacks are less often the victims of sex-related homicides, workplace killings, and homicide by poison.

Still ROFLMFAO @ your post.

If he thought the kid was commiting a crime, why should he stay back? Regardless of what the cops say? To many people "stay back" and let things happen and let criminals get away.

1. He should stay back because the 911 operator instructed him to, and the police were en route to investigate.

2. He had no reason to believe that the kid was committing a crime. The kid was in a public place, before curfew, was unarmed, had candy and a beverage on his person, which to most would indicate that he may have been coming from the store. A competent police officer would most likely have questioned him in an non-threatening way, to determine whether he should be in school, and nobody would have been hurt. That is why officers are trained to de-escalate things.

3. He had no training to make him competent to determine whether the kid was committing a crime.

4. The kid was, in fact, not committing a crime, so no legitimate reason existed to to act in any way that would interfere with the kid.

5. The kid had a right to walk in a public area.

6. If he was in fact, acting as neighborhood watch, that duty ended when he called 911 so the kid never should have never been made aware that he was being reported.

7. The kid has a right to walk on the sidewalk, because this is the United States of America, and he was not hurting anyone.

9. Untrained citizens have no business trying to detain suspects, especially when instructed by professionals not to do so.

10. So he reported this kid for no reason, except his appearance. He confronted this kid for no reason except his appearance. He intentionally disregarded the instructions of professionals. He was acting as if he was law enforcement with no training. The simple fact is this. If Zimmerman had simply acted like any reasonable concerned citizen, he would not have killed Trayvon Martin, and the community would have been just as safe. Instead he killed a 17 year old with no crimial history. Let's not make this guy a "concerned citizen" because good citizens rely on the law to protect them. They report what they believe to be suspicious activity. And they generally understand that teenagers generally dress differently than adults.

So let's recap:

iced tea is not equal to a 40 ounce bottle of Old English

a bag of skittles is not equal to a pocket full of narcotics.

People typically do not burglarize homes with a bottle of tea and a bag of Skittles, unless they are hypoglycemic, I guess?

Trayvon was reasonable to defend himself against Zimmerman. It was not his responsibility to explain himself to a stranger. He was reasonable to feel threatened. Zimmerman approached him in a way neighborhood watch generally would not, since they do not approach suspects. It probably did not occur to him that he appeared suspicious, since he was not doing anything a reasonable person would call suspicious, and he was carrying tea and Skittles, much less imposing than a 9 mm kicked to it's side, unless someone is highly allergic to sugar and antioxidants.

Sometimes the difference between trained and untrained is the difference between life and death.

1. He should stay back because the 911 operator instructed him to, and the police were en route to investigate.

Agreed and as far as we know he was returning to his vehicle... Police now confirm the evidence exists to support Georges statement to that effect.

2. He had no reason to believe that the kid was committing a crime. The kid was in a public place, before curfew, was unarmed, had candy and a beverage on his person, which to most would indicate that he may have been coming from the store. A competent police officer would most likely have questioned him in an non-threatening way, to determine whether he should be in school, and nobody would have been hurt. That is why officers are trained to de-escalate things.

There had been a series of crimes in the area.

No debating "the kid" was in a public area... really tired of the whole candy and drink thing. In the dark at a distance there is no distinguishing small objects as to whether they are harmless or a weapon

You have already stated George is NOT a police officer so why make like he is now an incompetent one?

3. He had no training to make him competent to determine whether the kid was committing a crime.

Which is it he is trained or not trained? It doesn't take a rocket scientist to determine suspicion. Crimes had been committed and were ongoing until this incident. We don't know WHY George found him suspicious. No one has ever said "the kid" was committing a crime, just acting suspiciously to the observer.

4. The kid was, in fact, not committing a crime, so no legitimate reason existed to to act in any way that would interfere with the kid.

Until the physical altercation there is no evidence George "interfered" with "the kid". Contacting police dispatch is not interference.

5. The kid had a right to walk in a public area.

Agreed. There has never been a statement he did not have the right to be there.

6. If he was in fact, acting as neighborhood watch, that duty ended when he called 911 so the kid never should have never been made aware that he was being reported.

Agreed except there are others on "the kids" side who say he should have verbally challenged "the kid"

7. The kid has a right to walk on the sidewalk, because this is the United States of America, and he was not hurting anyone.

See 5.

hmmm 8. seems to be missing?

9. Untrained citizens have no business trying to detain suspects, especially when instructed by professionals not to do so.

There is NO evidence that anyone attempted to detain a suspect. There was NO instruction about detaining a suspect, only "We don't need you to do that" when it was determined George was following the suspect at the beginning. following does not equal detaining. Observing does not equal detaining.

10. So he reported this kid for no reason, except his appearance. He confronted this kid for no reason except his appearance. He intentionally disregarded the instructions of professionals. He was acting as if he was law enforcement with no training. The simple fact is this. If Zimmerman had simply acted like any reasonable concerned citizen, he would not have killed Trayvon Martin, and the community would have been just as safe. Instead he killed a 17 year old with no crimial history. Let's not make this guy a "concerned citizen" because good citizens rely on the law to protect them. They report what they believe to be suspicious activity. And they generally understand that teenagers generally dress differently than adults.

Sort of covered 10 in your previous Q/A. The good citizens relying on the law (police) to protect them is a whole other debate that is a discussion in and of itself.
The entire event is a tragedy but has been fanned into much more than it should be by all sides involved.

Maybe I should clarify number 5. He has the right to walk in public, without being followed by a stranger who did not identify himself, as any legitimate authority figure would. And, yes, many are people are saying he did not have the right. It is inherent in the argument that Zimmerman was not acting as an aggressor and escalator in the incident.

As I stated before, Zimmerman is not trained, which is the point. He was acting as if he was a trained professional. He was not making the decisions that a trained professional would. That is a crucial difference. I could, in stupid confidence, perform surgery on a person. That I am acting as if I were a surgeon does not make me a surgeon.

As far as being tired of the "candy and drink thing" unfortunately, those are the items he was carrying. When someone sells a toy gun, it has a red, brightly colored tip, much the same color as a bag of Skittles. If Zimmerman could not discern what Martin was carrying, it still does not make him suspicious.

As far as I know, the description of the perpetrator was not a thin black man with a hoodie. This makes it unreasonable to assume that Martin is the perpetrator of said burglaries. Especially since he was not.

In his call to the police, it is apparent that he was moving, judging from the background noise and his breathing.

The location of the body of Martin calls into question the version that he immediately returned to his vehicle.

Actually, 10 is not "a whole other debate" in my estimation, it is the core of this debate.

I do wholeheartedly agree with you that this tragedy has been unnecessarily politicized. I do think that it would be naive and disingenuous for a reasonable person to argue that Martin's appearance was not a factor in Zimmerman feeling that he was "suspicious." Zimmerman knew absolutely nothing about Martin outside of his appearance. I concede that it may not be exclusively race. If Martin was wearing a suit, would Zimmerman think he was not suspicious? Possibly. Would he think he was a follower of Farrakhan? Maybe. I personally am suspicious of people who think that the Facebook of the other Trayvon Martin is the same kid. Besides the skin color, they both have different facial features, as well as physical proportions. I do not believe you fall into that category, since you did not mention the Facebook page.

I also contend that if Zimmerman had called 911 before following on foot, as a responsible neighborhood watch volunteer would do if they had a suspicion (founded, or unfounded-in this case) He would not put himself in a position in which he felt justified shooting Martin.

Maybe it should be changed from "Observe and report" to "Observe and report..once reported, do not continue to follow for a few blocks. You are not a police officer. You did not bring your firearm to your watch again? You know we do not condone that. By the way, was the person acting suspiciously, or just looking suspicious? You realize that one is a behavior, and the other is an indicator of your personal prejudices? Disregard this and you might get someone killed."

unfortunately not everyone is as unbiased as you

Amen! The appearance of either changes nothing about the facts that are important.

A man with a gun pursued and shot an unarmed man who was doing no wrong at the time.

Also irrelevant is all this speculation of whether Zimmerman was threatened or attacked. Trayvon was walking down the street when approached by a stranger with a gun. Trayvon was the one more likely to feel threatened, and had every right to defend himself.

21st - you make it sound like Zimmerman was brandishing his gun. He had a Concealed Carry permit. Concealed means, not visible. So Trayvon had no idea he was armed with a gun; that is until he was beating Zimmerman and noticed it. Then tried to reach for it to assault Zimmerman with it.

You are imagining a completely different, fantastical scenario than that which is shown from ANY evidence; even the most damning evidence for Zimmerman.

Justice,

Wrong.

It has nothing to do with whether a gun was being brandished or how Trayvon might have reacted to Zimmerman. 21st Century Patriot is correct, the core point is:

A man with a gun pursued and shot an unarmed man who was doing no wrong at the time.

Zimmerman (for whatever reason) chose to interrupt and thereby end the life of an innocent person minding his own business.

It's curious how Zimmerman's claim that Trayvon was trying to grab his gun was not mentioned in any of the initial police reports - you would think, if that happened, it would be front and center, printed in bold and highlighted.

Could it be that Zimmerman's initial claim that Martin was beating him to a near vegetable state won't hold water? Hmmmm...

Yes, the photos ARE deceptive. Since most people won't take the time to READ the entire article they are. Most will look at the cute pic of the kid; look at the pic of the man in "orange" (making them see him as a convict already); read the headlines with the article and ASSUME the guy in orange is guilty of killing a cute kid. The photos ARE deceptive. What if they had shown Martin in a hoody and unshaven and showed a pic of the man with his wife and small children??? Would the person who just read the headlines to the article feel differently??? You bet your @$$ they would. Do NOT underestimate the power of visual aid!

Everyone forgets another line in Zimmerman's taped call to 911. THEY always get away with it." Everyone forgets Zimmerman also WASN'T on a so-called neighborhood watch patrol. He was returning from somewhere and happened to see a black kid in his white neighborhood wearing a hoodie on an apparently rainy nght. My problem is that the Police reports, the security cameras at the Police station and the 911 call just don't seem to add up. Why is the medical examiner's report not been released? Are they still writing it to match the inital Police report? The mortician saw no evidence during preparing the body for burial of any injuries to Trayvon other than a gunshot to the chest. I don't think any amount of evidence presented is going to change a conservatives opinion. A white/hispanic man killing a black man is good, a black man in the same situation killing an unarmed white 17 year old, would see the conservatives and Fixed News screaming for justice for the white boy, and pouring through court records and police records to prove the black man was worthless.

To Kari - you're right! Horace Greely, "You supply me the pictures and I'll supply the war!" The root cause of the Spanish- American War, photos.

culheath:

Zimmerman (for whatever reason) chose to interrupt and thereby end the life of an innocent person minding his own business.

You might clarify your statement: Zimmerman was in HIS OWN GATED community, saw a STRANGER (at night) he DID NOT recognize and stopped him. Although Zimmerman was NOT on PATROL DUTY he WAS/IS a bonafied Neighborhood Watch patrolman. The "stranger" was wearing a hooded sweatshirt with the hood up so his identity could not be immediately determined from just passing by. Because it was dark and the stranger was covered with a "hood" it was impossible to determine if the stranger was White, Black, Yellow or Green!

The GATED COMMUNITY had been the victim of SEVERAL break-ins and robberies and was located adjacent to another community with a (reported) high crime rate.

Zimmerman had a couple of options. He could continue driving home, HOPE the stranger lived in the community and was no threat OR he could stop the stranger and question him in his de-facto position as a Neighborhood Watch Patrolman.

The above would be a more relevant opening to YOUR racist slant.

So the mortician is now playing coroner?? Big difference ya know, Coroners are licensed doctors and Morticians are usually not.. Your whole argument is based on hear say, circumstantial evidence and a grainy surveillance video.. There were several break-ins so the entire mixed neighborhood was paranoid.. And what about the screwdriver the innocent Trayvon was carrying?? Nothing makes a difference except the moment physical violence started.. Following or even chasing someone is not illegal.. Calling someone a name is not illegal.. Confronting someone is not illegal.. Grabbing someones clothes is iffy.. Direct physical contact [ poking, scratching, punching, kicking, biteing and tackling is illegal.. This is why this case has been rejected 3 times without charge or detention of the subject involved.. No racial issue all 100% legal grounds.. If you bring out 1 persons past in all fairness you need to bring out the others.. We have not seen true character attacks and defense yet as the schoolmates interactions with Trayvon and the community interactions with George have not been played out..

Thank you, Rick. A lot of people have forgotten what they see week in and week out on TV crime shows - that law enforcement agents identify themselves by yelling "police" if this is not apparent to those being pursued. Zimmerman did not identify himself so Martin understood would know why he was there. So it's no surprise that Martin's conversation with his girl friend indicates he was being stalked by someone who anyone would think was a thug or mugger if we were in the same situation.

Zimmerman initiated the confrontation, so it is Martin who could claim he acted to defend himself. The photos have no relevance except to show that Zimmerman has a history of brushes with the law that will not work in his favor in a trial. Neither does the Stand Your Ground defense have relevance because Zimmerman did not indicate to Treyvon Martin why he was being followed, and he had been told to stop following Martin. Zimmerman took the law into his own hands - but walking with a hood up in the rain while talking on a cell phone is not a crime.

Zimmerman should be in jail. And, no surprise, it was Treyvon Martin who acted in self defense, out of fear and anger. The neighborhood watch volunteer should have identified himself, then asked if someone was expecting Martin and finally indicate that he would watch to see that he arrived safely. Instead, what once would have been a street brawl turned deadly when the aggressor found he had met his match and pulled a gun. That was a dumb move - but so far the scales of justice have been tilted in Zimmerman's favor. Enough of the side shows! An arrest is in order.

PappaDave-956353 "Zimmerman had a couple of options. He could continue driving home, HOPE the stranger lived in the community and was no threat OR he could stop the stranger and question him in his de-facto position as a Neighborhood Watch Patrolman."

Neighborhood watch is there to observe and report...not stop and question

Because it was dark and the stranger was covered with a "hood" it was impossible to determine if the stranger was White, Black, Yellow or Green.....He reported that the suspect was black to the police so he could obviously see him

Would you feel the same way if Zimmerman noticed your son?

Chuck...ya just gotta make Zimmerman white, don't you! A white/hispanic???? So that makes Obama a white/black.

It just doesn't work for you unless Zimmerman is white.....talk about racist!

sarah-3519311

It's curious how Zimmerman's claim that Trayvon was trying to grab his gun was not mentioned in any of the initial police reports - you would think, if that happened, it would be front and center, printed in bold and highlighted.

Could it be that Zimmerman's initial claim that Martin was beating him to a near vegetable state won't hold water? Hmmmm...

Could it be you have not SEEN Zimmerman's statement? So far we have yet to see most of the actual reports.

@Chuck-2258469

He was returning from somewhere and happened to see a black kid in his white neighborhood wearing a hoodie on an apparently rainy nght.

Careful what you argue there Chuck. It can't just be raining for TM to put his hood up. It may have been local showers but not THAT local.

Why is the medical examiner's report not been released?

It is called an ONGOING investigation. YOU and others are NOT entitled to see it until the investigation is complete. Unlike "CSI Miami" TV show, they don't just put a drop of blood in a mass-spectrometer and magically get results. Most CSI in real life send blood work out to certified labs due to the cost involved and need for neutral party to render results impartially... something that many don't seem to care for in this incident.

Hispanic is not a race. It's a geographical and cultural term used by North Americans.

The president of Mexico, Chile and Argentine speak Spanish and are Hispanic. They are not less white than Bill Clinton, Hillary, Paris Hilton, Bill Gates or George Bush.

Stop you racial garbage, hypocrisy and coded KKKluxian agenda to fool people.

Obama a white/black yes. He is multiracial form white and black parents.

White Americans should stop believing that the entire world have adopted their racial garbage colorization. Multiracial people like Obama, Tiger, Hines, Beyonce are seen as blacks or Africans only in United States and Canada. Take them to an African city or village everybody will tell you that they are not blacks as Europeans will tell you that they are not whites. They are multiracial and I don't see why whites have a problem with that.

Wisconsin You do not know if at the point of confrontation he identified himself because you were not there.. That makes it a guess or speculation and just plain BS..

Mr. RightNow if it was my son he would not have been paranoid and ran and evaded because he has no guilt.. Is this how you react when walking on a sidewalk and someone drives up?? Do you have to identify yourself if someone asks what are you doing here? No.. But would it hurt to say? No, well maybe your ego if you thought everyone suspected you.. I am not sure of the time but if this was very late and he was 17 and suspended he would not be walking around in the dark.. His butt would be in his room in bed..

@Cypres rhicin. How come my relatives in Germany, France, Ireland and all their friends say they're white?Talking a little bit out of your ass, aren't you? Sounds like you hate "whitey".

Back in the 70s in Cleveland Murray Hill was an Italian neighborhood.. If you walked through there at night you better have a reason and if asked your business 20 times in a 1/2 mile you damn sure better answer no matter what race you were.. If you didn't 5 250+ pound guys would show up and they would not ask nicely.. This was their neighborhood watch and when my car broke down near by I respected their neighborhood rules.. Had help in 5 minutes and was on my way in 10 thanks to a 300 pound guy in an Italian flag tee shirt.. It was a loose wire on the battery and it was not charging, cost me a thank you and a smile..

PappaDave-956353......You forgot some of his options. He could have done what the police told him to do and stop following the kid. He could have stayed in his car until police got there.

If they didn't have any other pictures..I can see them doing this..but that kid is almost 18 and has a rap sheet..his last mug shot would do (not as a 12 year old)..As for Zimmerman he looks the same age in picture just a few pounds thinner.

Don't blame Zimmerman, Don't blame Trayvon, as Cain recently said "Blame Yourself"!

Mike said:

If they didn't have any other pictures..I can see them doing this..but that kid is almost 18 and has a rap sheet..his last mug shot would do (not as a 12 year old)...

A RAP sheet is a 'Record of Arrest and Prosecution'. Trayvon has none according to the Orange Co FL police dept. A suspension from school reportedly (not calling it as fact because of the media circus) was for having an empty baggie with marijuana residue in it in his backpack.

Roadrunner0 if it was my son he would not have been paranoid and ran and evaded because he has no guilt.. Is this how you react when walking on a sidewalk and someone drives up??

With a gun ...yes every time ....even if I can't see the gun... sometimes you can tell that someone who is accousting you has something clandestine planned

I am not sure of the time but if this was very late and he was 17 and suspended he would not be walking around in the dark.. His butt would be in his room in bed

This happened a little after 7 p.m. What is your 17 year old childs bed time

Justice099...The fact is you don't know when he revealed his handgun. No one but Zimmerman and the seventeen year old boy who is deceased know and Zimmerman isn't going to tell the truth. First, the safety has to be removed from the gun in order to render it usable. Did he do this in the car in preparation for the "intented shooting" or did he accomplish this while in pursuit of Trayvon Martin whom he mistook for a grown man (70 inches tall and 140lbs...the average 70 inch tall male is at least 190lbs.-200lbs. full growth potential. Trayvon would never reach his full growth potential until the age of 20 years to 21 years! If Zimmerman was appropriately educated in Policework, he could have assessed this!) in his highly reactive adrenaline fueled state of mind? Do you even think before you blog?

Mike - FYI Trayvon Martin turned 17 years of age on February 5, 2012. Apparently you blog before you read all of the facts. You are doing exactly what "mass" anything sets out to accomplish...reacting instead of responsibly gathering information before posting opinions. That is what the "Mass Media" intends to appeal. Emotion first, rational reasoning (higher level brain function.) second if at all. You fell for it...or should I say into it?

"Since most people won't take the time to READ the entire article they are. Most will look at the cute pic of the kid; look at the pic of the man in "orange"... ...and ASSUME the guy in orange is guilty...."

You are correct - in the court of public opinion. Fortunately, the justice system works slower and more deliberately and ''most people'' can't convict or acquit anyone of anything.

I know this is emotion filled (obviously) and I know this is very important (obviously) but the fact is, everyone is going to have to wait and let the investigators do their jobs. If there is evidence that this was a stalking murder of an innocent young man - then they'll charge Zimmerman and the court & jury can be presented the evidence. If there is evidence that this was an encounter that escalated horribly into a self-defense situation - then that will come out during the investigation.

What these two individuals look like in in the past in hand-selected photographs shapes our emotions, but should have no real bearing on the case. Fortunately, only the evidence that the investigators can uncover about that tragic evening should have any bearing at all.

lckmiblls

Hey Trayvon, sucker punch anyone lately?

I am 99.99% sure Zimmerman is not guilty of anything and I am 100% sure that your statement was completely disrespectful and uncalled for.

mike277

If they didn't have any other pictures..I can see them doing this

If they would have used the pictures they had and told everyone that the pictures were old but all they could find at the time,then I agree.

Whitefeather

Justice099...The fact is you don't know when he revealed his handgun. No one but Zimmerman and the seventeen year old boy who is deceased know and Zimmerman isn't going to tell the truth.

Whitfeather,

You have no idea if Zimmerman is telling the truth or not about when the gun came out,you just assume he is lying, you never even gave it a second thought that Zimmerman could be telling the truth.

Roadrunner0

Once again you are missinformed

"Coroners are licensed doctors and Morticians are usually not.."

A coroner is an official who determines if a death needs further investigation. The coroner may make the finding, or the case may be considered by a panel (coroner's jury). He or she can be a doctor, and usually is in larger jurisdictions (ideally, a forensic pathologist) but requirements vary according to the location and local law.

If you research this you'll find that although there many coroners in rural areas many are not doctors.....Sanford is a rural ares

But in my rural area a doctor is coroner and he had to study for and pass a State of Ohio required minimum in forensic sciences.. No one with a morticians license or a doctors license alone is qualified to be a coroner in my area.. A person can study forensic science and become a coroner without being a doctor.. Very few places have staff forensic pathologists except at the State level due to cost of their services.. So only high profile and complicated cases are usually seen at this level.. Most cut and dry deaths are determined by the attending physician and the county coroner through consensus and the coroner acts as the official who issues the death certificate.. Although there are required studies depending on circumstance per State mandate.. I do agree that any crime lab studies needed by the police are done at the pathologist level.. About the only thing in question to some is if George struck the young man first or not and if the young man struck George.. No study could prove the timing so that point is useless.. I am chuckling thinking that this man would be punching himself in the face as he is chasing Trayvon while releasing the safety and shooting him.. Then maybe he threw himself on the ground and banged his Head repeatedly on the sidewalk while holding the young man on top of himself..

Mr rightnow

If you research this you'll find that although there many coroners in rural areas many are not doctors.....Sanford is a rural ares

????? What about Orange County FL do you find to be rural?????

http://spotcrime.com/fl/orlando

Sanford is a city in the central region of the U.S. state of Florida. It is the county seat of Seminole County. As of the 2010 U.S. Census, the city had a population of 53,570. It is a principal city of the Greater Orlando metropolitan area, which was home to 2,134,411 people as of the 2010 U.S. Census.

Perhaps YOU should some research. It may not be LA, NYC, or SFO but even those cities have wooded areas still.

Oh BTW when I did as you suggested and google best education in world Finland seemed to come up quite often followed by the nation of the reporting website so the UK said UK type reporting.

Is your "Mr Rightnow" monicker because you want instant gratification?

trust_verify

"It is the county seat of Seminole County

So what does Orange county have to do with anything?

And as far as Finland having the best educational sytem well ..........That's a matter of opinion ....What country has the most educated population? Maybe it is Finland but if thats the case why do so many come here to become educated ?

That's why the news stories all quote the pathology report prepared off the top of the head of the funeral director.

sarah-3519311

Could it be that Zimmerman's initial claim that Martin was beating him to a near vegetable state won't hold water? Hmmmm...

With everyone that is involved in this case, i wonder why zimmerman has not been arrested?

Could it be that Zimmerman's initial claim of self defense is tighter than a nats @ss?

Hmmmm...

gnats buttock is proper...

Dear trust_verify

I forgot to answer the last part of your question last time ......"

Is your "Mr Rightnow" monicker because you want instant gratification?

Nope if that were the case I would be using a litany of unflattering adjetives to convey my doubts about your abilities......

Keep in mind that once the police make an arrest a time clock is started. The accused may ask for a speedy trial-as is what happened in the OJ Simpson case. This was very detrimental to the prosecution because of the time crunch. If Zimmerman isn't a flight risk, a delay in the arrest will allow the prosecution more time to gather info and have a solid case. Not sure how it works but the prosecution may have to present enough evidence to a grand jury to get a warrant. Just because he isn't speedily arrested doesn't mean he won't be or that he will get away with what he has done, if the evidence points to the fact that this incident wasn't self defense. Time is on the side of the prosecution. I'm waiting for all the facts to come out. This case could go either way depending on the facts. Lets not lynch the guy, let justice take its course.

plain bob

gnats buttock is proper...

Thanks.

Could it be that Zimmerman's initial claim of self defense is tighter than a gnats buttock ?

Hmmmm...

Quote culheath :

"A man with a gun pursued and shot an unarmed man who was doing no wrong at the time.

Zimmerman (for whatever reason) chose to interrupt and thereby end the life of an innocent person minding his own business. "

Gee its really black and white (no pun intended) for you uh culheath, you've decided Zimmerman is the big bad and racist guy, and Martin is the innocent good guy "who was doing no wrong" (except maybe jumping on Zimmerman, but let's ignore that fact).

Note that Zimmerman was not the aggressor, Martin was.

Anyways, since when does following someone (whether you are actually following or the other guy thinks you are following him) gives the one you are following the right to attack you??? and if he/she attacks you you're not supposed to defend yourself???

You know what, if Zimmerman hadn't used his gun, maybe it would be him who would be dead today.

The RIGHT to bear arms is a RIGHT.

ILLEGAL drugs are ILLEGAL.

The right to bear arms comes with caveats as do 'Illegal" drugs.

Cocaine is legal under some circumstances as is morphine as is marijuana.

You do not have a right to own an atomic bomb or own a machine gun or if you are mentally ill

Arizona you got that right, but who are they going to sue. mo money, mo money.

What a sick, cynical comment. What Trayvon looked like is irrelevant; the parents lost a son for no reason, and the guy who shot him isn't even being tried. Whether Trayvon was guilty of any past transgressions is also irrelevant; they had nothing to do with the incident. Whether Zimmerman was attacked is also irrelevant; Trayvon had every right to protect himself from unarmed stranger confronting him for no reason.

21stCentury "Patriot" - How is it irrelevent? It is EXACTLY what this article is about. What a dumbass.

"Whether Zimmerman was attacked is also irrelevant; Trayvon had every right to protect himself from unarmed stranger confronting him for no reason." And that statement makes you ABSOLUTELY stupid. Not only is it VERY releveant, you were so lacking bloodflow to the brain when you posted it, it is obvious you meant "armed" not "unarmed."

How can you be a "patriot" and have such horrible views on gun rights? I assume the "21st Century" part is some kind of qualifier that you are a patriot of a more socialistic government, not our country as founded.

Rich - you come across as an idiot. Plain and simple. I really have no other response, except you did the same thing with your comment: "

You do not have a right to own an atomic bomb or own a machine gun or if you are mentally ill"

Get some freaking coffee or something before you post. You both sound like morons.

Again what boy are you talkin about this was a 17 year 6'3 young adult male. I would call him a grown man now. CALLING him "BOY" who is an adult male is a derogatory/racist remark on your own kind.

First and most important I feel this is a great tragedy. @21st - You showed your cards in your statement that "the guy who shot him isn't even being tried". In the legal system they first have to investigate all the facts of just that incident. Then look to see if any laws were broken. Then if they have the evidence to file charges, issue an indictment and warrant. Then that person is allowed a "Trial" and then all sides are given in a court of law and then a jury of that persons peers decide guilt or innocence and then, if found guilty, sentencing for that crime. You went straight to him being tried with skipping a few steps. I'll bet in your own mind you have already skipped to the sentencing phase.

I think some of the biggest tragedies in this aftermath is all the wannabe's trying to hop on the media spotlight and getting their 15 minutes of fame and the news media just keeps stirring the pot to sell the story. I've watched some of these news people doing interviews and they try to twist the people's words to get them to say something completely different, just so they can say "You heard it here first." or "New evidence has just came out." I just pray that the wannabe's go home, the media quits stirring the pot, the officials do a thorough investigation and most importantly the families find some peace in their hearts.

Im 48 white male, and my 84 yr old mother still refers to me as a kid...Trayvon WAS a kid.. He was unarmed. He was not bothering anybody.He was followed by Zimmerman, after being told not to by police dispatch. Trayvon was shot and killed, by a self appointed vigilante. I, as a parent of children who wear hoodies ; and who like skittles-am concerned that they could be the victim of of a summary execution by people like Zimmerman. I believe blacks have a right to look at this as a hate crime. This boy was racially profiled by Zimmerman,and killed. All people. of whatever color or denomination, should shout for justice. Reverand Sharpton and Jackson are recognized leaders. Their credentials are not on trial or up for scrutiny in this matter. George Zimmerman-and the shooting death of Trayvon Martin are and should remain the focus..

Kennyg5 NORMALLY a man who shoots an unarmed person, killing him spends time in jail, while an investigation is done. In this case the armed white/hispanic man was treated with kids gloves, interviewed for about a half-hour, enough time for a recused prosecutor, who probably knew a certain judge, said release him no charges. Now, ask yourself if it was a black man, who didn't have a judge for a daddy, was in the same situation, wouldn't he still be in jail waiting for a hearing and the completion of all the investigation that is supposedly going on now?

What's new? Citing more recent photos does not negate the fact that Mr. Zimmerman killed Trayvon Martin after he was asked to back off by the 911 operator. Allow justice to take it's course, satisfying all parties that justice is served.

Several comments suggest that doom's day is around the corner if we don't cease this discussion, i.e. race riots, 'lynchings' (do tell!), 'stirring the pot' and other absurd extremist views. Rather than proceeding with healthy dialogue! More absurd is the suggestion that 'people go home!' The rights under the constitution apply to ALL Americans!

It's fairly obvious that racism is alive and well in our fractured nation and they only thing they fall back on is lashing out at the news media for being "liberal!"

If the kid would not have been following Zimmerman as he headed back to his truck to seek shelter from the rain and wait on the cops,and then had not attacked him like a mugger in the night, he would still be alive today.

Has the video of this innocent looking young kid been released yet of him buying skittles and tea from the store?

How about the receipt, was it in his pocket?

Chuck We recently had a Black senior citizen shoot and kill a Black teen who was breaking into his house.. No charges were filed and he was not even taken into custody.. When asked why he put a 32 caliber bullet into the child's chest he stated he feared for his life.. So your crap that all black people are arrested or for that matter taken into custody is total BS.. So many minorities are killed with violence and the murderer is never found because people in those communities fear the criminals and police and each other.. The fact that the media demonized George is far to common of an occurrence..

Ok in today's world it is near impossible to cover something like this up. With all the cops and firefighters on scene one of them would have come forward by now if the police reports were false. The amount of money they would make from the TV appearances alone would motivate someone to tell the truth if the guy was not injured at all. The way this is looking is that it is a rare case where both individualsthought they were confronting a stranger. Both thought their life was in danger. If the other person would have had a gun at the time he may have used it. I know that being a black man he would have gone to jail. It makes me sad that our country is still that way. If the boy (only called him that to tell the difference between the two) would have killed Zimmerman out of self defence they people would be fighting to get him released from jail. I wish the justice scale was even but it is not. If we want the truth then we need to let the officals investigate this and let it be settled either by the Grand Jury of in the court room.

People are addicted to conspiracy because TV has glamorized forensic sciences through shows like CSI bla bla..

The term "boy", is ONLY racial to a RACIST.

If the "boy", was trying to get away, he would have been shot in the back.

Not if he was running backwards.

i can hear Sharpton now,

Altho the young kid was shot in the front, he was trying to get away by running backwards while keeping an eye on Zimmerman.

Chuck We recently had a Black senior citizen shoot and kill a Black teen who was breaking into his house.. No charges were filed and he was not even taken into custody.. When asked why he put a 32 caliber bullet into the child's chest he stated he feared for his life.. So your crap that all black people are arrested or for that matter taken into custody is total BS..

I must agree with this to an extent, since the man was black. I must also point out that a fundamental difference exists between someone feeling threatened by an intruder into his own home, since the intruder, by definition is willing to violate the rights of the homeowner. Martin was in public, and had committed no crime.

The two examples well describe the difference between the castle defense and the stand your ground defense. One is reasonable, the other has tripled the firearm related death rate in the State of Florida.

As a firearm rights advocate, I am disturbed that the NRA would support such a stupid law, given that irresponsible gun ownership and use, in the long run, is a clear threat to firearm ownership rights of citizens.

There is no denying that black america has an image problem. The music the attire is all gang related. Why are so many black americans in prison? Why are drive by shooting commited by black youths? The facts cannot be denyed. So you believe what you want. I will believe the truth. Numbers dont lie!

You mention prison numbers in your comment. If Blacks could commit multiple crimes and never get prosecuted there would be a lot less Blacks in prison. Zimmerman has been arrested and charged before. Even after he shot someone he remains free.

<p>There is no denying that black america has an image problem.

The same media that started the firestorm now seeks to tell the real story they should have told, without their liberal race baiting bias.

Systems down. Don't ever mention all that the white man has offered and given assistance to you since then either.

There are problems alright, but it isn't so one sided either. Another thing, you can't legislate racism, bigotry, or any feeling away. Working together, hopefuly, can accomplish much more.

Zimmerman has been arrested and charged before. Even after he shot someone he remains free.

As long as he does not go to Vegas and rob people he will remain free.

Once again a BS statement is made.. So Blacks are always charged with every possible offense and Whitey well he might get a parking ticket for robbery or assault.. You must not be aware that if the police can avoid arresting anyone that is what they prefer to do in most cases of petty crimes with no one willing to press charges.. Most people given prison time are repeat offenders or militant types that are a danger to society in general.. Just because charges are brought against someone does not make them guilty of them.. Plea bargains and other tools help to speed up the legal system and keep costs down.. Inner city crime is at epidemic proportions and no solution has ever been effective so far..

I would like to comment on Mr. Rightnow's first post. If we are so entitled! We, I qoute"The white entiltled race that has inherited its fortune from our previous generations" unqoute, sure have taken that prosperity to a whole new level. We as the united states as a whole are a beacon of rights for all mankind, too many human rights that would be too large to list. Not only have we been able to shape this country into a global melting pot of cultures, we have also and are still learning to share all rights that every man should have. If you are willing to work hard to prosper, YOU eventually will prosper. Now take Africa, just for an example, there are many nations but when do you see people plan their vacations to Africa. To go visit their nice cities and quant little towns, and enjoy the cuisineor culture. You don't hewar anything about that, because for generatios they have squandered their entiltlements away and have done nothing to help their fellow human biengs. They trample on their civil liberties there, they subject people to their will by threat of death or dismemberment. And most of the most horrific stories, of modern times, of a persons right to live and have their civil liberties being taken from them are from the heart of Africa. So to go with your line of thinking, what are you doing to help your fellow black people, to use their inheritance to prosper and gain basic human rights?!!!!

RobGC What you describe as the current state of affairs in African Nations can be seen in the streets of urban America.. Areas ruled by gang violence and intimidation with little regard for the neighborhood or infrastructure.. I know that many Black people who have made successes or small fortunes have tried to give back to those areas.. The worst part of it is that once you are forced to learn that dog eat dog survival lifestyle you are doomed to repeat the same missteps over and over.. A poster here who claims to be a school administrator states" but in order to address a problem one usually has to identify it...Then through revolution and dissidence and effort can the problem be ameilorated" how sad is this..

A group of men were arrested for a homicide in Cleveland which was caused by a gunfight in the streets.. A stray bullet struck a woman in the hip causing her to bleed out and die.. The neighborhood marched in protest of the EMS service but not in protest of the violence of the black community..

You may need to go to Africa to see how most Africans live but all I have to do is go to New Orleans or Detroit to see how most blacks live. Most blacks think they are entitiled. There are many that do help themselves to improve themselves but their image is not good. Blood and Crips gangs from all over the U.S. Corupt cities where majority of blacks live and govern. Blacks think they deserve what they get and not work for it. Their image is not good and groups like the Panthers does not help. Fools like Jackson and Sharpton make blacks really look foolish. Lets take the law into our hands and kill Zimmerman. The Black Panthers are no better than the Klan. Both are racist.

If you go to Africa and see what arbitrarily drawn borders and 100 years of colonialism leave in their wake. You can't go to one African nation that is involved in the horrors you cite and not see Catholic Churches.. Belgian and German statues..or in the case of Idi Amin.. U.S. Air Force bars issued by the nation who trained him as a pilot. These societies were uprooted, exploited, and destroyed .. some of these areas were made into giant plantations and the people worked as slaves to European corporate interests. The africans fought a decades long battle for liberation only to end up as pawns in the cold war... with dollars and arms sales distorting and feeding the internal fighting that has led to the crises you refer to.

And yet you SMUGLY reference the killing of a few million in Africa while not 60 years ago Germany, France, England, and Russia slaughtered 50,000,000 people in their "highly civilized" war of "prussian aggression"! The black panthers were a political party started in 1964 because the Democratic Party of Mississippi refused to register them to vote and the founders wanted an independent party to register the voters they were dealing with under. The state election board told these students that the symbol of their party must be a visual symbol and not a word.. so instead of FREEDOM party.. they chose a drawing of a black panther. Those students went on to carry their independent party into their eventual flirtation with black nationalism and radicalism. But most of them.. Stokely Carmichael, Eldridge Cleaver, Huey Newton, Rap Brown... moved on into various politics or radical movements and many are dead now.

This "NEW black panther party" is the brainchild of a man in his 40s named Malik Zulu Shabazz.. it has nothing to do with the OLD black panthers who are defunct. They trade off the reputation of the panthers as a radical violent organization from the late 60s and early 70s.. I don't think there are as many as 30 members of this entire organization. Fox News keeps showing a clip of two men standing outside a voting place... NEVER shows 2 minutes after the clip where the police show up and ask the man holding the club to leave.. and has never shown anything about WHO, WHAT, and WHERE the New Black Panther Party is. The KKK is a terrorist organization with a 145 year history of murder, destruction of property, bombings, even the RAPE and murder of white women.. one of which occured as recently as 2008 in Lousiana... it has committed financial fraud and even ripped off members(the dragons and wizards and klegels who had to pay a fee to get thusly named) as a multi level marketing pyramid scheme. It is a thoroughly criminal enterprise. supreme court justice Hugo Black and Senator Robert Byrd were former members. The New Black Panthers are unlikely to even be able to raise the $10,000 reward they are claiming to offer.

As for Sharpton making blacks look foolish.. he absolutely does.. and then he goes and bravely leads protests and marches in the face of unabashed white racists who give lie to the belief that a "mountain is being made out of a molehill". and jackson is indeed an ambulance chaser.. but the guy in the ambulance IS really injured so sometimes that ilk is required.

As for you going that extra mile and blaming blacks for being lazy, entitled, criminal, and governing only in corrupt cities. I guess you COULD look at that and think that is the truth. So nothing I could show you about hard working, highly ethical and moral, churchgoing, skilled and educated blacks who fight against corruption could ever sway you. the facts are though.. that blacks who challenge corruption often lose out to black who are willing to make peace with evil .. who go along to get along. That's why you don't get Al Sharpton.. who is indeed swimming in the corrupt sea most of the time. He could easily stay in New York and make plenty of money and have plenty of power and just talk about Trayvon Martin from afar... The fact that he goes to the scene and assists the families.. bucks up their strength and endurance to fight the system. That's like a purifying bath .. you don't DO that kind of thing because you're a fake or a charlatan. The Martin family is going to be put through hell before the system touches a hair on Zimmerman's head. Even law enforcement who knows what zimmerman did was wrong will stand firmly by him to protect the unwritten law that says that a cop, law enforcement official, or guard private security can use their discretion when deciding to shoot a black man and that is not to be questioned. The family is standing firm in their decision to resist that and I hope they are successful!

Good Heavens... I would like to give you an example of what i speak about, take in the story of Sierra Leone. Here are the freed slaves of Europe and Americas, and they were given all the modern emenities and then the country was turned over to them. Now READ and investigate, and you will see how their dis-unity, and Civil Wars have made it a unpleasent place to live and visit. That seems to be the case with about 60% of the black people in the United States. They blame everyone for their problems and make excuses for their violence against others. When the fact is they refuse to get off their asses and become a functioning member of the society called THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA! If you are all going to unite against something and pickit and march, do it against the detiorating neighborhoods that are controlled by violence and intimidation of the African American Dissent. The other huge 40% of the African American, are a hard working industrious people that have a place in this wonderful melting pot of a nation we all live in. STOP, living in the past and become an advanced and forward thinking intelligent human bieng. Learn from the past, but leave it in the past!!!!

rich

As for Martin I doubt if his face changed much. These are facial pictures the face doesnt change that much in two years.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2120504/Trayvon-Martin-case-He-suspended-times-caught-burglary-tool.html?ICO=most_read_module

Care to update your comment about his looks not changing?

Of course George is looking a bit better in suit and tie vs jail jumpsuit

http://www.theadvertiser.com/article/20120331/NEWS01/203310315/Trayvon-Zimmerman-photos-misleading

And i am still waiting for this guy Zimmerman to face charges.

Barring some significant change in evidence you will be waiting at least 10 days still and I wouldn't count on anything then either.

Nice to read a blog from someone with such an open mind. (Sarcasm, in case you're too stupid to get it.) My guess is you've decided Zimmerman should get a fair trail and then be hanged on the courthouse steps. There's an old saying that applies to this case, "Don't believe anything you read or hear, and only half of what you see." You have only heard from a media that sells sensationalism (not necessarily anything to do with the truth of an issue) and a herd of civil rights people and black lawyers (whose bias is always that blacks are the victims, never the perps). If that's the way it shakes out, fine. But we don't really know anything yet. Would you really want someone to go to jail primarily because his opposition was able to get the most media attention and scream the loudest. That would be a very scary environment to have to live in.

Paduki:

"Believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see."

Benjamin Franklin.

Amanda:

nice quote , but you may want to add to it this how can you trust a Media who job is to sell stores for money? none of us here know what really happen on that day in FL. we can only hope the fact come out and we stop trying to us the media as a court room. we must not put a price tag on justice.

yep...most of them ain't figured it out yet...LOL...

Trayvon just turned 17 on feb 5. how much did you change when you went from 14 or 15 to 17? not much

3 times Zimmerman was arrested for violent charges. yeah i think that is worth repeating . and it is a pattern of violent behavior

Well I guess they took their cue from wanted posters we saw during all the teaparty rallys'. Did you ask Holder to do his job then? Your thinking is reministic of your name gunner, it seems you suffer from tunnel vision!!!!

Gunner, the Pink Panthers are pussies.

And their head pussy, Hashim "Fahrvergnugen" Nzinga, was just taken down on felony firearms charges, accomplishing his life long goal of becoming the title subject of a Rodney Carrington song about inmate romance.

I want Eric holder to do his job for once and arrest the new black pather leader for allowing a wanted dead or alive bounty on Zimerman.

The Panther member who posted the bounty offer was arrested, albeit for an unrelated weapons charge. If it's illegal to post a bounty (and it should be, if not), he'll probably have additional charges filed.

Gunner: I dont think the photo chages the fact that this man shot down an unarmed kid, who was doing nothing wrong. People are so concerned about the photos, but pictures dont change the facts of what this story is really about.

Rich, where do you get this arrested 3 times for violent crimes? There was ONE scuffle with an officer that was dropped. The restraining order was against him by his girl friend and he had one on her also. Doesn't mean there was any violence involved in those but maybe to prevent any by either of them. Or it could be just to keep one from calling the other. Restraining orders do that also. The other contact was a traffic ticket. One traffic ticket at 28 is not too bad! If you can't stick to the truth, people will have a hard time believing you when you do tell the truth!

Robert Eagle said:

Rich, where do you get this arrested 3 times for violent crimes? There was ONE scuffle with an officer that was dropped. The restraining order was against him by his girl friend and he had one on her also. Doesn't mean there was any violence involved in those but maybe to prevent any by either of them. Or it could be just to keep one from calling the other. Restraining orders do that also. The other contact was a traffic ticket. One traffic ticket at 28 is not too bad! If you can't stick to the truth, people will have a hard time believing you when you do tell the truth!

According to the Orange Co FL court records, Zimmerman has been in there five times:

7/18/2005 Resisting officer with battery, 7/18/2005 resisting officer without battery. Criminal felony, case closed--Written plea of not guilty entered 8/05/05, Defendant not present 10/27/2005, PTD program agreement for supervision 6/15/2006, Nolle Prosequi 7/28/2006

And here's this from the DOJ website about that PTD program:

The U.S. Department of Justice has a Pretrial Diversion program (PTD) which basically allows a potential defendant to avoid criminal prosecution for lesser crimes. The person has to sign an agreement with the Department of Justice or U.S. Attorney's Office and agrees to be supervised by a Pretrial Services Officer for a period of time not to exceed 18 months. The subject will have to report to pretrial services and be booked, ie, fingerprinted, photographed, etc..., so the government can monitor the subject's behavior during the diversion period. It is important for the subject of the PTD program to not violate any laws during this time because doing so can result in the PTD being terminated and the original charges being prosecuted. Once a subject has successfully completed the PTD program, the government agrees to not prosecute the original charges.

So what all of that boils down to is that Zimmerman pled not guilty, was going to go to trial, instead of being tried he was shuttled into PTD, a sort of parole monitoring situation and the case was dropped. Thee were originally two charges; resisting officer with battery (fought a cop in a bar according to some accounts) wen the cop called another to arrest Zimmerman Mr Zimmerman resisted the other officer but did not assault him. Both those charges we combined to one case. In this case I do think hat his father being a former judge most likely did have something to do with the way this turned out because the PTD program is supposed to be for misdemeanors and assaulting a cop is a felony. If that trial had gone on and he had not been shuttled into the PTD program, he would almost certainly have been found guilty.

8/9/2005 Domestic violence, case now closed-Temporary injunction issued 8/10/2005, permanent injunction issued 8/24/05. He then filed a counter-case in which he sought an injunction against Ms. Zuazo, which was also granted.

12/14/2006 Speeding, case closed--officer did not appear.

12/14/2006 No vehicle registration during stop, case closed--officer did not appear.

The use of "menacing" or perception based news reporting has been in wide use by the mainstream media for years. If you are a minority or working class you know the practice well. New's reporting, on face value, is presented to grab your attention. In 2011, Connecticut put together a state assistance program to assist people who desired to make spoiled food claims caused by a 14 day power outage. Many of my "white" neighbors went down to fill out the paperwork. Once fraud was discovered by state workers, the TV news organizations went out of their way to show footage of "blacks" waiting in lines to file for relief with "white" security guards overseeing the line order. Many non-minority american's who try to wrest control of the masses will always attempt to refute any perception that everything is not fair if they are "calling the shots." I used to watch CNN's "Black in America" series at my jobsite and a non-minority coworker saw the video expose' of the subjects being treated unfairly in it's entirety and stated "those things don't REALLY happen. Now that the image of the aggressor is mixed-race, some of you want to claim him and his innocence bases on unsubstantiated claims by the survivor of the confrontation. Now we're focusing on photo's? Look into your local obituaries and notice the recent practice of placing flattering, younger photo's to represent the elderly deceased. Just about everyone wants to be perceived as newly born and without reproach. @ED Ryan-853533. Yes, President Obama has been tagged by the media as "mixed race." Much ado was spent scaring voter's they were going to lose a "perceived" position of stature on the world stage if the President of the United State's of America wasn't a seasoned caucasian males. Wait'll you get your first Woman President. The obvious is the "Stand your ground" law will never work in this american society and in this case the disparate impact of the law left a young life wasted. George Zimmerman was actively attending college, supposedly improving himself, when this went down. Trayvon Martin will never get that chance.

Many of you contributors are so polarized you should never be allowed to carry pen or a weapon. Wait for the facts. Not claims.