E-mail updates
Follow on Twitter
Subscribe to RSS
Freedom From Religion Foundation
This banner was stolen from a park in Streator, Ill.
When the city of Streator, Ill., allowed three wooden crosses, a nativity and Christian signs to be displayed in a city park, an atheist group asked to put up its own sign: “Nobody died for our sins. Jesus Christ is a myth.”
The city agreed. After all, the city attorney had told the group, Freedom From Religion Foundation, that the city park was a public forum.
The atheist banner was mailed from the foundation’s Wisconsin office to a volunteer in Streator, who put it up on Friday. By Saturday, it had been yanked from its posts. Now the group is offering $1,500 for information leading to an arrest and conviction.
Patrick Elliott, an attorney for the atheist foundation, told msnbc.com that he’s never heard of three crosses staked at a city park. The banner, he said, was “our form of protest.”
The atheist sign, which cost more than $200 to make, was a response to a particular Christian sign at the park that read, “Jesus died for our sins.” That sign was illuminated by lights from the ground.
City Manager Paul Nicholson, who observed the atheist sign missing Sunday morning on his way to sunrise service, said there has been little controversy about the signs, Christian or otherwise. The park is the urban center for Streator, he said, which has 14,000 residents.
“Most likely there will be some dialogue between the council and the citizens,” Nicholson told msnbc.com. “What this has done now is raised the issue of the propriety of public forum versus public forum at all, anywhere in the city.”
Ed Entwistle, the president of Streator Freedom Foundation, which put up the crosses, said the atheist group should be allowed to post their sign.
“I may not agree with what it says, but that’s why we are blessed to live in the country we live in today where we have these freedoms,” he told MyWebTimes.com before the banner was stolen.
The foundation plans to post a new banner on Wednesday, which will stay up through Friday, Elliott said. The group advocates separating church from state and has launched various campaigns around the country, notably, “This is what an atheist looks like.”
The foundation has about 650 members in Illinois and has had lost signs before. In 1992, an atheist banner was stolen by a Sunday school teacher, according to a press release on their website; another was defaced by a man dressed as Santa Claus. Both crimes resulted in convictions.
More content from msnbc.com and NBC News:
Leave a Comment:
Oh my God, they stole the sign! You bastards!
hahahaha funny
more sad than funny. They have become what they have always claimed people of religion are..Self Rightous and Bigoted. Attacking ones belief system is something i would expect from Nazis or the Klan, not those who are proclaiming to the "enlightened"
I think it was the so called christians that gave us the dark ages. Now the American christians are trying to return us to the dark ages.
All religion cannot end soon enough.
Amen to Brother Grover....
At least this isn't about Religion it's all about Hate and all about we need Jobs.
Oh no, and they have no one to pray to for the sinners who stole their little sign. Too bad. I think it sucks that they put it up anyways. They raise hell if there is a mention of religion, a nativity scene, etc., but claim 1st amendment protections whenever they want to raise peoples hackles. Can't have it both ways.
And praying to get a stolen sign back would accomplish what exactly? If prayer did anything, Lotto winners would get less than the money they spent on tickets.
"Thou shalt not steal"? Hmm...religion, thy hypocrisy knows no bounds.
Atheist quoting the bible toooooo funny.
What's so strange about remembering something from the brainwashing of our youth? What I find funny, being an Atheist, is that I am more christian, by my actions, than most christians are, and all without the threat of eternal damnation to keep me in line.
@arguesforsport!
You sound like one crazy and confused atheist Christian. You may want to speak with someone about that. :)
No need. I know what I am. I'm Atheist. Just because I happen to follow common sense laws of humankind and see the hypocrisy of those that profess to be good christians, doesn't mean I'm the one that needs help.
re to Robbob-1667446
Most atheists are more knowledgeable about the buy bull than are most so called christians.
As a book, it can be interesting and entertaining. Some parts are “inappropriate" for anyone under 18.
If you read it with an open mind, and without the preconceived notions given to you the money grubbing priest, rabbis, and preachers, you will be an atheist when you finish.
to Grover, that is probably because you grossly misinterpreted what the thematic messages were. And I challenge that anyone who does will become an atheist. You did, for whatever reason. But can't claim that you speak for all.
Arguesforsport & Grover Syck
Reading, studying, memorizing something and understanding it are very different things, without the help of God you will never understand it you can't.
1 John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
Proverbs 28:5 Evil men understand not judgment: but they that seek the LORD understand all things.
John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
Robbob, you're confusing "understanding" with "not questioning". Atheists tend to know and understand the bible better than christians. We know that it's a book of myths trying to prop itself up by pre-emptive criticism of anyone who thinks critically about what the bible is actually saying, as your quotes demonstrate. Those quotes are nothing but a circular arguement in an effort to show their stories are true without having any actual proof. All those claims about "misinterpertation" are worthless unless you can prove your interpertation is correct, which (of course) you cannot do. How can you be sure which interpertation is correct? Are the parts of the bible you're suppose to ignore (like forbidding blind people in church) highlighted in pink while the passages that no longer apply are in green?
If they allow crosses put up then the Atheist have every right to put up their signs..It's only beliefs anyway on both sides..
If we have to take down our crosses and the ten commandments and nativity scenes from public places, they shouldn't be allowed to post their signs! I'm glad they stole it! Good Job!!!!
bchnut, had you read the article you would have realized that they were allowed to put up crossses, nativity and christian signs! Bad job reading!!!
Two cents from another good christian.
stealing, sounds like the christian thing to do
There was a young man from Cape Cod
Who didn't believe in God
When mauled by a beast
He asked for a priest
Don't you think that's rather odd?
So there it is:
Christians stole.
Not to feed a starving child, or for self-protection, or even self-enrichment, but solely for the noble purpose of silencing people they don't like.
Other Christians applaud the crime.
...and atheists get called immoral.
I surmise that you are assuming that it was stolen by a Christian.
Where is your proof?
Did you perchance take it just to stir up stuff?
God only knows
God, plus the Christians who stole it.
And yes, I'm going to go way, way out on a limb here and take a wild guess that it was Christians who stole the anti-Christian sign. I also suspect that the person who stole my beer was a beer-drinker (despite the possibility that he stole it to re-sell it) and that the animal that left a pile of crap on my lawn was a dog (despite the possibility that it was a Christian on his way to steal a banner).
Hey equal rights the atheists need to go tear down the "wooden crosses, a nativity and Christian signs". I am a Christian and I go for that...don't even put out an reward. Keep it between the Christians and the atheists...all for that too. Just them and us.
OMG , What a bunch of whinny butts . These damn atheists are acting more like christians every day .
No. These cry babies are acting like SOME Christians. Don't categorize all Christians as being anything like these @!$%#s. SOME yes, ALL no.
They had a crime committed against them. Why shouldn't they report it?
The athiests are allowed to be free from religion, no problem. However, I don't believe that our constitution was written to guarantee freedom from religion, rather that each individual may worship in whatever way he or she chooses, without government mandates or inquisitions designed to coerce people to belong to a given religion. That does not mean that religious holidays can't be observed. This nation has always observed the Christmas Season, but now the government and media just say Holiday Season. I say to you that this is forcing Christians to give in to athiests, because the government no longer allows Christ in the holidays, and the media is afraid to say Christmas, because the athiests would sue. That means that the athiests have taken over the government already.
Mike Dickson --
"...the athiests (sic) have taken over the government already.
That's right! We totally rule the United States Government. For example, in congress atheists enjoy an absolutely overwhelming and irresistible majority of...well, .002 percent. (One atheist out of 535 members of Congress.)
But the media is afraid to say Christmas (apparently), so we win!
If atheists actually took over the government, Thomas Jefferson and several other of the founding fathers would jump for joy, but that is not the point.
By the way, it is spelled atheist.
Since the government was founded as a secular institution, how would atheists be taking it over? Are they trying to close churches? Are they trying to dictate how a religious person dresses? In what way is our secular government under attack by atheists? Because they do not want the government to use public reources to promote a specific religion? How does thwt close a church?
It seems that Evangelicals are upset because atheists have been stifling their attempts to take over the government, given their advocacy of recent legislation limiting access to contraception, the attempts to stifle public school teaching of accurate history and the teaching of prevailing scientific theory in several states.
Besides, Christians are supposed to avoid stealing.
I guess that is what happens when a person's moral foundation is based upon an invisible deity that arbitrarily makes the rules, not a humanistic philosophy that recognizes that humans universally benefit from compassion and reason.
I guess the devil made him do it.
the "Christians are supposed to avoid stealing" cracked me up!
If you do not believe in God then I presume that you believe in science and the theory of eveloution. In that case you have far more faith than a Christian. Christians believe that everything was created from nothing by God from. Evolution however teaches that everything was created by nothing from nothing.
Ignoring reality does not make it go away. Ignoring God will not make him go away, however at some point those that ignore God will go away.
No, evolution does NOT teach that "everything was created by nothing from nothing".
I'm not going to suggest that you go learn something about evolution, just quit making stuff up about it, OK?
Alen Rose is 100% right, evolution does not propose that everything created from nothing, it does very clearly and concisely say the everything descended from a rock, or more precisely rock soup.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_SYqBBiA7aG8/RpBSiU8sJ5I/AAAAAAAAAFE/34xLAedkAFU/s1600-h/000_souper.bmp
If you do not believe in God then I presume that you believe in science and the theory of eveloution. In that case you have far more faith than a Christian. Christians believe that everything was created from nothing by God from. Evolution however teaches that everything was created by nothing from nothing
Actually, I accept that scientific method has been shown to reveal new knowledge about the workings of the universe. That is a little different than "believing" which you equate with faith. Acceptance of scientific principle led Galileo to use evidence to establish that the Earth revolves around the sun. The Catholic church used religion to deny this theory until the last decades of the 20th century.
The theory of evolution is not a position concerning the origins of life, or creation of non-living existence. It simply posits that organisms change over generations. You are referring to abiogenesis. Abiogenesis is a prevailing theory concerning the origins of life.
If you are speaking of creation of the universe,taking the common assumption that all things are caused, then any theory that posits a god as a cause is equally logical than one that posits that an unknown, not god is the cause. One requires manufacture of an omnipotent, omniscient, entity who exists outside of creation, somewhere, somehow, but nothing is yet created. The other explanation accepts an unnamed first cause, but does not speculate on its nature until evidence indicates its nature. The second is superior to the first, because by Occam's razor, the simplest explanation is generally superior.
The other explanation posits that the universe was not created, that it has been in existence as long as time. This explanation eliminates the need for first cause.
So either God is irrelevant, or he is unnecessary.
But as I said before, that has nothing to do with the theory of evolution. I am still not clear as to why evolution is perceived as such a threat to religion. A round earth, a sun-centered solar system, and other scientific discoveries now co-exist with religion. Evolution is one of the most well-supported scientific theories in existence. It has been proven experimentally numerous times, and the fossil record supports genetic change over time, including speciation. Unless you are one of those who thinks the Earth is 8000 years old, then I have wasted my time trying to inform you concerning scientific theory.
Mike, you pretty much have it completely wrong. First christmas was not always recognized as a holiday. Sure it was celebrated but it wasn't until christians demanded it be a federal holiday did people actually get holiday pay for it. And the instant it became a federal holiday, it belongs to everyone christian and non-christian alike so the government can't endorse your cult without violating the first ammendment. For christians to insist it's "their" holiday is misleading at best.
Rec, to say it takes more faith to be an atheist is like saying it takes more effort NOT to run a marathon. I'm going to go against Alan and suggest you do learn what evolution is and what it is not so you'll quit lying about it.
It is funny that the Christians want to stop others from expressing their beliefs. It seems there was a lit sign that said Jesus dies for our sins so why is it ok for that and not the other? I call that hypocricy. And those that applaud the theft how very christian of you. We are free in this country to believe any way we want. Not everyone believes the same. So if you want YOUR signs up you must allow others to put theirs up.
An athesist stole it to wear at the next Gay pride march.
Sharon, that is because the lit sign is not lit with electricity. It is miraculously lit through the glory of god. If atheists did not want their sign stolen, they should worship a spiteful, and more importantly smiteful god, who punishes those abscond with his stuff.
$1,500 reward for $200 sign. Go figure!
I'm catholic, and my sister is atheist...so I agree, if Christian items can be put up, then so can atheists'. However, I don't support putting the sign up simply in spite of another religion.
"The atheist sign, which cost more than $200 to make, was a response to a particular Christian sign at the park that read, “Jesus died for our sins.”
I'd rather see the sign go up for a "spreading the word" purpose, or something like that. And really? $1,500 for a $200 sign?....It is no longer about who stole the sign, but about making a statement with that.
Of course it's about who stole the sign. The $1500 isn't for the return of the sign, no questions asked, it's for information leading the arrest and conviction of the criminal.
He made his statement; they'd just like to get his signature on it.
Theft is wrong no matter what. However, the atheist's sign was insulting and meant to inflame. The atheist group who put up the sign knew it wouldn't last. It got them the publicity they wanted.
"Meant to inflame"? It would make as much sense to claim that the original sign was meant to inflame atheists, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Jews, followers of Shinto, Jainism, Sikhism, the Baha'i faith, etc., etc.
I knew you or someone would reply with that. The difference with the other sign is it doesn't purposely try to insult Buddhists, Muslims, atheists etc., it only states what Christians believe. It's interesting that that is the only part of my comment you disagreed with.
The inquisition was not purposely trying to insult heretics, it was intended to save them. I'll bet the stake was still hot for them. African slavery was only condoned by the church when it was to save African souls. Both good intentions. Sometimes intent is less important than content. Intention is sometimes less important than action. The space is public, and taxpayer maintained. Therefore it should be secular. Then everyone can use it unimpeded by someone else's propaganda. Put a sign outside the church, put one in sympathetic businesses, put it anywhere else. I can think of a place or two.
If it's OK for christians to insult everyone else by saying their religion is wrong, then why can't Atheists tell christians their religion is wrong?
Who would want to steal something like that> Its trash.
If they wanted to steal trash, they would have taken one of the other signs.
They can't be "our sins", because if you are an atheist, morality is relative, hence sin is meaningless - there is only man's law, and even then, only if you are not also an anarchist.
Jesus did die for my sins and those of all others who believe. May God have mercy on your souls, assuming you have them.
Is relative morality any worse than arbitrary morality? Either killing your son is wrong, or it is not, so why would God say Abraham passed the test when he was willing to kill his son? He clearly was failing from any self-consistent moral rule.
That is the rub, either the benefits of morality are self-evident because the outcome betters the human condition, or not.
A moral code followed simply because it is underwritten by God is arbitrary, capricious, and irrelevent. It is not then morality, it is blind obedience.
The way i see it is this. Do i belive there is a god yes and i think that it is wrong whoever stole the sign. It is not are job to judge people it is gods job. If they do not want to belive in god then that is something they will have to explain to him when they meet him. In order to beat the atheist is to not steal the sign but let it sit there and move on. Stealing it just proves there point.
All an Atheist would need is a bible and a book of history. Hand them to your god and say, "Justify yourself!"
You will be happy to know that the sign will be replaced as well as follow up stories in the media proving what scandalous hypocrites ye Christians can be. I appreciate your helping the FFRF get more national attention. Keep up the "good" work.