The whole issue of injuries is moot if they were caused by Trayvon defending himself from an armed assailant who had been following him.

But...what if a curious Zimmerman was following a suspicious, hooded thug-looking individual throughout his neighborhood to see where he was going, while also relaying the information to the police. What if Zimmerman was intent on seeing where he went so that he could inform the police. What if as he turned a corner, Zimmerman was suddenly jumped from behind, put on his back, and got punched in the face repeatedly by the 6'3" Martin? What if you could even hear Zimmerman on a 911 tape screaming for help. What if he felt his life was in danger? How much should he have let Martin beat him until he was justifiably allowed to defend himself? Should he have waited until he had a fractured skull? Broken teeth? Needed 30 stitches? 300 stitches? Waited until his brain was leaking out from his skull onto the ground? How much is enough to justifiably defend yourself against what could be death?

Dare to dream I guess. If that theory makes you feel better.

@Dave3537810 -- "What if" Zimmerman had done as he was told to do by the 9-1-1- operator? Had he followed directions and stayed in his car without getting to confront Trayvon, no broken teeth (alleged), no broken nose (alleged), broken bones, etc. ad nauseum. Right now Zimmerman would be sitting at home instead of in a jail cell terrified for his life. He used very poor judgment and is now suffering the consequences.

They probably wouldn't be happy of anything less than having Zimmerman's father sitting on the bench.

the judge should have rec-used herself, without being asked, her husbands partner was hired by CNN, to analyze, brief and make comments on the case.

Saxon,

Incorrect. There's no conflict of interest as the husband's co-worker is not being paid by one side or the other, only to report the facts. Unbiased. This motion will be denied.

VirginiaDemocrat78

Saxon,

Incorrect. There's no conflict of interest as the husband's co-worker is not being paid by one side or the other, only to report the facts. Unbiased. This motion will be denied.

You are missing the requirement. ... there does not have to be an actual conflict only the appearance there COULD be. If for no other reason this is a way to preserve an option to appeal later if the judge does not recuse herself. The "appearance" is that Zimmerman(s) went to the firm and MIGHT have presented some evidence one way or the other.

With the innuendo that Zimmerman SR is somehow influencing the case it would be best for all concerned so IF George is granted immunity or found not guilty the public can't make further claims along that line.

So Dave, what brilliant reason do you have for why Trayvon would jump poor little George when he was on his way home from the store with snacks? Oh, I guess it's because he is black, and that's what black people do because they are all thugs, right? And since you have it all figured out, please explain how George could have been screaming for help RIGHT UNTIL THE VERY MOMENT OF THE SHOT if Trayvon had is hand over George's face to smother him. You see, in Robert Zimmerman's 2nd or 3rd version of the story that he told CNN, we now have Trayvon smothering George, and George felt he was about to pass out which is why he had to shoot. You see, in the earlier versions, George was getting his head bashed in and THAT is why he shot. But when Robert was called on the fact that Georgie barely had a scratch on him, now all of the sudden he was being suffocated. After all, everyone knows that when men fight, they often will try to muffle the screams of their opponent. Give me a freaking break. Unlike the wingnut racists around the internet, I actually have more than two brain cells to rub together.

Interesting relationship found, does merit scrutiny.... Will be interesting to see how this plays out. The lawyer is going to have to work really hard to get a non-biased judge and jury.

Too bad we can't do the same with Kagan on the Supreme court. She absolutely has a conflict of interest in the Personal Mandate case due to being on the legal team that created Obamacare. I hope she has boned up on the Constitution and discovered how un-Constitutional the Personal mandate really is and votes appropriately.

Nope, sorry Dave-3537810. Look at the satellite image of where Martin was shot. In the open; no corners anywhere around, at least not close enough to support your scenario. The map, below, supports Zimmerman catching up with and confronting Martin.

Map of shooting of Trayvon Martin

also:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/04/02/1079894/-George-Zimmerman-Unidentified-Officer-With-the-Saftey-Off

How convenient to add a little more drama by putting bandages on after the fact. He wasn't bleeding when taken to the police station, but for some unknown reason, he started bleeding once he got released from police custody. Give me a break!!!

Sedna1

Neither of your maps shows much and the location of where the shooting occurred was several units down the path/walkway. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/04/02/us/the-events-leading-to-the-shooting-of-trayvon-martin.html is a map that Trayvon supporters have agreed is accurate as to locations including the shooting.

The picture of Zimmerman arriving at the police Department show NOT one bit of injury to his head at all. His booking picture will be adequate so show whether he had those injuries he claims. I believe there were also two eye witnesses to the shooting on the phone to police as the killing took place. But I am waiting for the trial to move forward and to let the FACTS come out. What I do know that none of this would have happened if Zimmerman had followed the statement the police dispatcher made.
"We do not need you to follow him". But Z was the follower and that may obliterate any justification on the Stand your ground issue. We shall see;

Mari2JJ

"The picture of Zimmerman arriving at the police Department show NOT one bit of injury to his head at all." " ... But I am waiting for the trial to move forward and to let the FACTS come out."

I have read the original article, and the neighbors not only mention the bandages, they also mention that Zimmerman's nose was swollen. Also the police department mentioned that before taking him in (after the fight) he was bleeding from the nose and the back of his head and was treated by medics (this is also on Reuters, want to deny that too?). So much for the theory that he put the bandages there himself.

These facts DID come out, Zimmerman was indeed wounded. Trayvon Martin on the other hand, had no visible wounds (at least this is what I read about the autopsy).

Just wanted to clarify this: About Trayvon, I meant wounds from a fight of course, obviously he did have the bullet wound.

Anna, the autopsy and coroner's report have not been released to the public, but the funeral director that prepared Martin's body for burial said that he had no wounds other than the bullet wound.

If Zimmerman was "fighting for his life," like his brother has claimed, wouldn't Martin have other wounds on his body?

Dave-3537810

A step toward you with a verbal threat of death or harm should be enough. It would be for me.

Misscreant

If Zimmerman was "fighting for his life," like his brother has claimed, wouldn't Martin have other wounds on his body?

Misscreant, well I guess it just means that Trayvon didn't get hurt much during the fight (of course I mean other then getting shot), and didn't get punched either, maybe he threw one punch, pushed Zimmerman on the ground (he did have grass in his back), and after that was holding Zimmerman's head (not punching).

About the funeral director, that's probably what I read then, the funeral director's comment.

Also look at the enhanced video, Zimmerman does have a pretty big gap in the back of his head

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/02/trayvon-martin-case-enhan_n_1397022.html#s791954&title=Trayvon_Martin_Photos

Anna, so you don't think Zimmerman was physically fighting back? He just laid there like a dead fish until he pulled his gun and shot? You don't think that Zimmerman laid a finger on Martin? Not exactly "fighting for you life," huh?

DLux

What possible set of circumstaces can you envision that would cause Martin to scream fo help for forty-five seconds as he straddled Zimmerman and pummelled him while Zimmerman lay there and quietly taking his beating waiting for the police to arrive? And how do you know what Daves political leanings are or that he's a racist by what he said in his post? Or is everyone who disagrees with you a right wingnut racist?

1ad-1602146

If Martin decided to answer Zimmerman when he asked "What are you doing here" instead of assaulting him , They'd both be home tonight. It's not illegal to ask a question. Assault is illegal. I would have said "I'm staying in that apartment right there, seventy yards away. If you don't believe me let's go ask the people who live there." He had a cell phone why didn't he call 911 the operator could have introduced them to each other.

How convenient to add a little more drama by putting bandages on after the fact. He wasn't bleeding when taken to the police station, but for some unknown reason, he started bleeding once he got released from police custody.

Almost like showing a picture of a 12 year old when you're talking about a 17 year old.

His booking picture will be adequate so show whether he had those injuries he claims.

His booking photo taken 7 weeks after he sustained the injuries? Really? You know that even most broken bones heal in 6 to 8 weeks right?

Nope, sorry Dave-3537810. Look at the satellite image of where Martin was shot. In the open; no corners anywhere around, at least not close enough to support your scenario. The map, below, supports Zimmerman catching up with and confronting Martin.

Or it could just as easily support that Martin attacked Zimmerman where Zimmerman had parked his vehicle.

-anna-

These facts DID come out, Zimmerman was indeed wounded. Trayvon Martin on the other hand, had no visible wounds (at least this is what I read about the autopsy).

Maybe I missed further clarification here but I was not aware the autopsy had been made public. Link please if you have it so I can add to my collection of factual citations. My understanding was the funeral director/mortician was the one who stated no injuries on Trayvon.

Zimmerman never said he was jumped. Zimmerman said he was confronted by Treyvon. I.E. Treyvon turned around and approached Zimmerman. That could be out in the open. That may be why Zimmerman hung up with 911. We don't know the whole story, and everyone likes to be a detective to prove their point. Funny how people always add their own interpretetation to the story.

I think the term "Jumped him" was added by the masses passing the story around the internet. furthermore, Zimmerman said that Treyvon struck him in the nose and he fell to the ground. Meaning a face to face confrontation occured.

The same thing with the displacement of "autopsy report" and "funeral director". BTW In some localities a funeral director is often also the coroner and does not have to be a Medical Doctor. Suspicious cases are often sent to a county with a better qualified or have a consultant come to verify conclusions.

WOW!! most of you people seem to know all the facts, sheet, by the way some of you sound you were there. Maybe you should go to the prosecutor and tell them what you know....oh wait, you don't know sheet!!

In A-M-E-R-I-C-A you are INNOCENT until PROVEN guilty!!

The funeral director who oversaw slain teenager Trayvon Martin's burial says the body bore no signs of a fight.

Richard Kurtz says there were no notable marks on Martin's hands, face or body other than the gunshot wound that killed him. Kurtz says he expected to see some marks if Martin had been in a fight

The same thing with the displacement of "autopsy report" and "funeral director". BTW In some localities a funeral director is often also the coroner and does not have to be a Medical Doctor. Suspicious cases are often sent to a county with a better qualified or have a consultant come to verify conclusions.

While that may be the case in some locations in THIS case the funeral director, as noted by thinkaboutit, was the one commenting about apparent lack of fight related injuries. The Coroner, to the best of my knowledge, has NOT released the reports to the public. It won't be released until trial most likely under FL Law.

@Thinkaboutit

The funeral director is not a medical examiner in this case for starters. For another being involved in a fight does not always result in both parties being injured. There IS ONE GLARING indication he was in a fight and that is the hole in his chest. While Kurtz may have expected to see marks it all depends on whether George swung back or was purely defensive. Hitting a nose and lip would not necessarily cause injuries to someones fist.

WildBill-544481,

I taught my children not to tak to strangers, so if someone comes up to them that they do not know they are to walk or run the other way.

As far as Zimmerman goes, if he would have stayed in his truck like he was told none of this would have happened. I don't understand how some people think, they keep say that zimmerman had the "right" to follow trayvon and ask him questions. Zimmmerman did not know who Trayvon was and Trayvon did not know who Zimmerman was, in my opinion Zimmerman did a retarded thing why would you put yourself in a possibly dangerous situation?

Until all the facts come out, I do not believe that what George Zimmerman is saying is true. He is saying he was attacked to save his own behind..

Hitting a nose and lip would not necessarily cause injuries to someones fist.

While lips and noses are relatively soft tissue, there are bones behind them that would cause cuts/bruising, especially if hit hard enough to knock a person down as has been reported. Even if by chance there were no blood from Martin himself, there would have been blood on his fist from Zimmermans "broken" nose.

trust_verify

Maybe I missed further clarification here but I was not aware the autopsy had been made public. Link please if you have it so I can add to my collection of factual citations. My understanding was the funeral director/mortician was the one who stated no injuries on Trayvon.

@ trust_verify, Yes you're right, as I told Misscreant (she mentioned that too), I was referring to the funeral director's comments, not the autopsy, sorry about that.

@ Misscreant, I have no idea, maybe he was trying to grab his hands or arms, or maybe he realised that Trayvon was stronger then him and was trying to grab his gun.

Thinknaboutit

there would have been blood on his fist from Zimmermans "broken" nose.

Not necessarily, unless it was an open wound on his nose, according to the description I have read his nose and the back of his head were bleeding. I understood that as a nose bleed, I could be wrong tho of course. People have noticed that his nose didn't seeem very hurt (I mean posters here, by looking at pictures), and unless it is a big fracture and/or gap/wound on the nose, after a month your nose looks pretty normal, its not swollen anymore and doesn't look bruised either (at least according to my own experience, after my crazy ex broke my nose).

Well since we're on the topic of 'injuries'...this is what I stumbled across:

The Seminole County Sheriff's office said Zimmerman underwent a series of physical and mental health tests after arriving at the jail Wednesday night. He was then sent to protective custody where he was isolated from other inmates and under constant watch

There was no sign of scarring on the back of his head and the booking photo shows no indication that his nose had been broken in his confrontation with Martin, as Zimmerman's former legal team had claimed.

Unique - There is no mention that I heard identifying whether Zimmerman was in his truck or on foot while in contact with 911.

Once again, take a look at the police garage video, the one view from front of police car to back. After cop puts his coat into trunk and walks away from Zimmerman, watch Zimmerman quickly take one step back with both feet, lean his back(jacket) against wall, while doing this he quickly moves both feet forward putting pressure on his back then when cop says come, Zimmerman lunges off wall forward, which now will leaves marks on jacket looking like his claim of laying on his back on concrete getting pounded. However, the garage wall is painted white and forensics will show the white paint and not the concrete Zimmermans claims. Only took about 1 1/2 seconds to do this. FBI agrees. Video on U tube.

ethnic - over 4 weeks passed before Zimmerman turned himself in, most wounds heal in just a couple of weeks.

Starsailing. The police report at the scene described that zimmerman's coat was wet on the back and covered in grass.

Yes that is the report, however Zimmerman in one of his claims, said that he was laying on his back on sidewalk and Trayvon was pounding his head on sidewalk. If that was the case there would be scuff marks big time on the jacket..... He will have 10 more new stories by trial time. Video is what it is, contaminating his jacket on garage wall,..... back of seat in squad car.......

Too bad Trayvon couldn't be the judge. Zimmerman made himself prosecutor, judge, jury and executioner.

DB - yes, most do. However, if you claim to have had your head pounded on a 'sidewalk' I would think there would've been some kind of scarring even after initial healing. Also, be mindful that he's being examined by a trained physician that could detect the difference in an injury having been healed vs not occurring at all?!

ethnicbutee

DB - yes, most do. However, if you claim to have had your head pounded on a 'sidewalk' I would think there would've been some kind of scarring even after initial healing. Also, be mindful that he's being examined by a trained physician that could detect the difference in an injury having been healed vs not occurring at all?!

Not all wounds/cuts leave scars. Surprisingly the ones I think would don't but others do. It has been 45 plus days since the injuries. Simple cuts to the head may bleed profusely but not scar at all and heal quickly. A broken nose can be "busted" in many ways not necessarily actual bone damage and they rarely put a cast.

I don't know about a "physician" so much as a medical person at intake and an officer to notate injuries and existing scars that are obvious.. they most likely don't list papercuts. They would note injuries that need treatment and anything that could be claimed to be done by police as abuse later by the prisoner.

But again back to injuries.. there is not a requirement to BE injured or a severity of injury to claim self defense.. only the reasonable belief one might be seriously injured or killed.

there is not a requirement to BE injured or a severity of injury to claim self defense.. only the reasonable belief one might be seriously injured or killed.

Then it's time for civil war? I'm sure both the left and right fringe would argue that the other side is trying to seriously injure or kill them or the entire country. When you use the possibility of a "self defense" scenario as an excuse not to treat the situation as a crime and investigate it accordingly then there is a big problem. Justice is supposed to be blind, not comatose.

trust - thanks for your input. However, the Zimmerman's (George, father, brother) account of what happened that night would have you believe that George was being 'severely' beaten, and smothered to within an inch of his life. One would think, to be able to claim self-defense that the injuries you sustained would need to be consistent with the beating you claimed to have received. Yes, I'm aware of the police report citing that he was bleeding from the nose and back of head...but only the EMT report will disclose if it was actually broken, and the true severity of his injuries. Chris Serino, lead detective, didn't believe his claims of self-defense.

Also, EMT's treated George at the scene and he's seen on 'enhanced' video in police station with what appears to be blood on back of his head. I wonder, why if these were some type of contusions that could possibly continue to bleed, would they not bandage that area?

One would think, to be able to claim self-defense

There is the misconception or misunderstanding. The LAW says only a reasonable belief of death or severe injury is imminent. I don't have to shoot you for you to reasonably believe I am going to kill you. If you just saw me ax someone and I still have the ax or you saw me beat a guy to a pulp and I am now coming towards you what would your immediate thought be as to my intentions and how soon I was going to act? THAT is all the law requires. Prior to SYG you were required to "retreat" and once cornered or pursued and could retreat no further then and only then could you defend yourself without fear of criminal or civil liability. The intent of SYG was to allow you to defend yourself without the retreat necessary and without fear of the criminal or their family suing you simply because you defended yourself. It also put the onus on the prosecution to show you were not defending yourself. They just forgot to put in the part about you can't create the situation.

Chris Serino, lead detective, didn't believe his claims of self-defense.

More power to the detective. The law states he can't make an arrest until he can prove there was not self defense based on the evidence and has to be a normal investigation not based on the statements given by the one claiming self defense.

EMT report will disclose if it was actually broken, and the true severity of his injuries.

I am not sure of the qualifications of the EMS. Even a DR would rely on X-rays. But again degree of injury is not a requirement. Yes it will satisfy some that he was actually injured or they will argue he was not in fear for his life because he wasn't hurt that badly.

I wonder, why if these were some type of contusions that could possibly continue to bleed, would they not bandage that area?

It could be that after he was "cleaned" up he refused further treatment. They MAY have made him sign a waiver, maybe not. I haven't seen the enhanced video. any darkness would standout on his shaven head.

Calendar of events

Judge recusal decision

Bail hearing

Assertion of Self Defense under 776 to judge. Not sure that would be a public presentation or a judges chambers thing. More than likely before there is a jury selected

Judge decides if 776 applies. 1 to 5 days for a ruling. If it does, not much else comes out and nothing more can legally/civilly happen to George. He will have to move of course.

That motion probably happens before may 29. If not look for May 29 to become august by time it all gets moving.

The judge is the one who informed them of the potential conflict of interest last week.

Jack... I know that... that's what surprised me about her NOT recusing herself at that time. It really should have been a no-brainer.

The judge is under no obligation to recuse herself unless she knows her objectivity would be compromised, or unless the appearance of a conflict would irreparably taint the proceedings. It is common to wait until there is a request.

Misscreant

The judge is under no obligation to recuse herself unless she knows her objectivity would be compromised, or unless the appearance of a conflict would irreparably taint the proceedings. It is common to wait until there is a request.

Actually the judge IS under obligation to remove even the appearance that there could be a conflict, as you alluded to. The judge does not need to wait if they see a potential conflict whether apparent or actual.

The judge is under no obligation to recuse herself unless she knows her objectivity would be compromised, or unless the appearance of a conflict would irreparably taint the proceedings. It is common to wait until there is a request.

If you still don't understand, look up the definition for "unless."

Now that the motion is before the Judge, the judge herself will decide. If the answer is not satisfactory to the Defense, then Mr. O'Mara will appeal and we'll all have a firm answer.

Mario 69

Now that the motion is before the Judge, the judge herself will decide. If the answer is not satisfactory to the Defense, then Mr. O'Mara will appeal and we'll all have a firm answer.

REALLY???? is that how it works... we had no idea. (sarcasm)

The Seminole County Sheriff's office said Zimmerman underwent a series of physical and mental health tests after arriving at the jail Wednesday night. He was then sent to protective custody where he was isolated from other inmates and under constant watch
There was no sign of scarring on the back of his head and the booking photo shows no indication that his nose had been broken in his confrontation with Martin, as Zimmerman's former legal team had claimed.

Gabriel..

I just don't think the police would release what they have in a murder investigation but maybe I'm wrong.

You are so correct. Unfortunately, most posters would prefer to post rumor, innuendo, hyperbole, speculation, and supposition. They afford themselves the opportunity to prove, at least to themselves, how much they know nothing about.

These are opinion boards. That is kind of what they are here for.

Seriously, what else is this vine for if not to speculate and conjecture? Are we supposed to just say "oh, hey, look at that, I have no opinion on that whatsoever."

It would make for a pretty boring conversation.

Funny how someone comes here to post his opinion about how pathetic it is to come here and post our opinion. The irony.

@Misscreant: Of course, use the internet for a tool to fabricate stupidity instead of productive logical discussion. Yep. Bravo. *slow claps*

@VS78: You'd rather lie and manipulate facts to make a circumstance more emotional and entertaining, than to attempt to evaluate information objectively? Have you renewed your subscription to the Enquirer yet?

@Anna: My statement isn't an opinion, it's very true. It's highlighting the sad state of people believing the crap they read to be true, just because someone says it is without providing actual evidence. OR, in many cases, creating a story to validate their claim surrounding a circumstance they know very little about, but fool themselves into thinking they do. The fact is, many people are creating outrageous possibilities and hard-wiring them as the truth, then becoming irrationally defensive about it. Which is incredibly sad.

@All: Opinions are one thing, but writing a statement as though it is the solitary truth without evidence is another entity altogether--it's called BS. It truly is pathetic that you confuse the two.

@Anna: My statement isn't an opinion, it's very true.

No Sir, its not "very true", it is indeed only your own opinion, not mine. Personally after reading an article, I often read people's opinions about it, I find it interesting, often more so then the articles themselves, and I think we are very lucky to live in a country where we are allowed to voice our opinions, while in some countries people are silenced and can't post their opinion in a message board without being taken to jail.

Thank God for our constitution.

Why? Is that why he deserved to die?

A lot of us would be dead if we could be shot for merely silly, immature things we have done in our lives. Still does not warrant shooting an unarmed teen walking a public street, minding his own business and not involved in any criminal activity.

Not saying he deserved to die for it, but don't make him out to be a choir boy either. He was known to possess buglary tools, drugs, and flash gang signs. That's not the sweet little boy they paint the picture of. You say he was not involved in any criminal activity? How do you know? Were you there? How do you know he didn't just meet his friends to sell them a bag or two? Again, he didn't deserve to die for that, but neither you nor I were there. What I do know is that the media sold everyone a bill of goods from day one and now Zimmerman probably will not be able to get a fair trial, which means justice cannot be served whether he's guilty or not. I would hope that every biased, race-baiting, "rush to judgment" zealot would be able to get the fair trial that they are so willing to deny Zimmerman. Especially the ones who publicly committed conspiracy to kidnap. (I'm talking about you Jackson, Sharpton, Lee, NBP, and the others who played along)

The "burglary tool" was a screwdriver.

The "drugs" were an empty baggie that tested positive for marijuana residue.

The "flashing gang signs" was a picture of a Treyvon Martin from Chicago.

The police reported Martin had no criminal record, nor was he the suspect of or involved in any investigations.

If O.J. Simpson and Casey Anthony can get fair trials, so can George Zimmerman.

The screwdriver was in the bag with the jewelry.

The empty baggie was accompanied by a pipe (in the original school report that was released but not included by msnbc)

Any criminal record by a minor would likely be sealed.

The police and the Department of Juvenile justice did not report his having a sealed record. They reported having no record at all. There is a difference.

A screwdriver is still just a screwdriver.

Not all media outlets reported the "pipe," and I have not found direct confirmation from the school or law enforcement. I am not saying a pipe was not found, just that it may be up for debate.

And I'm not saying he was a bad kid for sure either. What I am saying is that all any of us have is what the media has vomited up and that's been proven to be false in cases. Admitted. By the owners of this very site. He was for sure not the law abiding, squeaky clean 12 year old every outlet showed the picture of.

The media has, with the permission of the majority of America, corrupted our judicial system. They're not the first, but damn it, why can't they be the last?

Jim, I can agree to that sentiment.

A sealed record does not have to be reported. They may have legal obligation not to mention it.

A screwdriver with stolen jewelry is a burglary tool.

The school report obtained by the Miami Herald included the pipe.

There may not be a legal obligation to report it, but I'm sure, if Martin had any type of record, the Sanford police would have said he had one.

There is no proof the jewelry was stolen, or that Martin stole it.

Why do you Zimmerman supporters have to try and make out that Martin was a criminal? Why can't you just use the SYG law, and be done with it? You could say Martin and Zimmerman got in to a confrontation, it turned physical, and Zimmerman feared for his life, and shot. Why does Martin have to be a violent, drug dealing thug out to rape, pillage and plunder to you? Why can't he just be a teenager, going through a rebellious period, getting into some trouble that many other teenagers do? Why can't you acknowledge that Zimmerman may have made a mistake? Not admit guilt in a legal sense, but admit to a mistake?

I think character is important when looking at this case. Is TM the type of person that would be acting suspicious, be on drugs as GZ suspected, take a swing on GZ? It seems the answer may well be yes to all those questions.

As far as the jewelry - sometimes the truth is obvious even without proof - if you can't see it, that's okay, no need to waste our time with it

So then we can look at Zimmerman's character? The arrest for assaulting a police officer. The arrest and restraining order for domestic violence. Reports from former co-workers about his tendency to fly off the handle violently. Obsessive 911 calling showing control issues and a bias toward young black males, and trivial issues with his neighbors and neighborhood. These are important facts in judging Zimmerman's character to get an idea of why he did the things he did that night as well, wouldn't you agree?

In regards to the jewelry, innocent until proven guilty, right?

Yes, it is important to look at GZ character as well. But be sure to include his big-brother volunteer work that pretty much proves he is not a racist.

I would not say he was obsessive calling the police, it is just what a neighborhood watchman is supposed to do. He was not acting like a wanna be, he was watching and reporting.

I am not trying to convict TM of theft so legally he is innocent. Sometimes you just have to accept what is obvious though.

I never said Zimmerman was racist. I said he may have a bias, possibly justifiable, but having a bias and being racist are two different things.

One of the most racist people I know works with underprivileged minority children. It reenforces his sense of superiority. Zimmerman's work was most likely honorable, but that alone does not prove he was not biased, or racist, and does not outweigh his violent tendencies.

In the Martin case, what is obvious seems to depend on your point of view.

If you discovered a teen with a bag full of jewelry (wedding bands, ear rings, etc...) and a screwdriver what would you think? Then he says it is not his but won't say who it belongs to... Come on now, you can't be that gullible. You may not be able to convict him but you have to know the stuff is stolen. You seem like a smart enough person misscreant, why play dumb on this issue?

Martin has a girlfriend which explains the jewelry and screw driver is a screw driver.

I carry a leatherman multitool in a pocket all the time. If I happen to have my GF's necklace in my pocket....... Am I a thief too?

It is a possibility. I never said it wasn't possible. I said we have no proof that it was or that Martin stole it.

In the school reports, Martin claims a friend gave him the jewelry and screwdriver, but he refused to name the friend, not wanting to rat them out. It is possible he was telling the truth. The police in Miami were informed, and could find no evidence that the jewelry was even stolen at all.

Look, Martin may have used marijuana. He may have stolen that jewelry, but by all accounts Martin was doing nothing illegal that night, and if Zimmerman wanted to call the cops on him, fine, that was his right, but he didn't need to follow him, and confront him. If Zimmerman had never gotten out of his car, this would not have happened. Zimmerman was content to "observe and report" all those other times he called 911. Why did he get out of his car this time?

It included wedding bands. If it was his girlfriends, he would have said so. Seriously, we have to argue this?

He got out of his car to observe and report. He had to go around the corner of the building to observe. That is all on the taped police call.

My point is, he didn't need to get out and observe anymore. The police were on their way. All Zimmerman had to do was stay in his car, tell the dispatcher which way Martin was headed, and make arrangements to meet police somewhere. That's it. Why push it? Zimmerman said he thought Martin was on drugs, and Zimmerman had no way of knowing if Martin was armed. Why put yourself in harm's way?

I guess he is just brave and wanted to assist the police by being a good observer.

Brave or stupid? Again point of view. In this case, it was also tragic.

WW2 Vet... That picture Martin posted on Twitter is not of himself. He posted it as a joke and has been verified that it is NOT him. Here's the link explaining it for you:

http://www.wtsp.com/news/topstories/article/247194/352/Fake-Trayvon-Martin-picture-circulates-on-the-web

kat

That picture Martin posted on Twitter is not of himself. He posted it as a joke and has been verified that it is NOT him. Here's the link explaining it for you:

We are getting conflicting statements on the "flip off" photo. You are saying it is on his twitter others have seen someones facebook. There is a golden grille photo associated with #NO_LIMIT_NIGGA that has NOT been disputed and at best was trayvon goofing around. Is the "golden grille" Trayvon or not?

All I know is there have been claims of the flip-off photo being seen on Twitter and Facebook. My guess is that he posted the photo in both places. I do that sometimes and I know others that do, as well. I've seen a "golden grille" photo and it's kind of a joke. Not sure if it's what you're referring to. People are saying he looks really mean, but he still looks like a 17-year-old to me. If you go to that link, look lower on the page on the left hand side and you'll see a more recent photo of Trayvon with earbuds. It's his current Facebook profile pic. There's a link below that with all of the other current photos of him.

People are saying he looks really mean, but he still looks like a 17-year-old to me. If you go that link, look lower on the page on the left hand side and you'll see a more recent photo of Trayvon with earbuds. It's his current Facebook profile pic

He may be acting like a 17 year old but from what I've read he was portraying himself as a bit of a anti authority type..(thug seems perhaps strong). Typical 17 year old perhaps but not everyone appreciates the attitude that can show up as. We've all seen that attitude and seen it get folks in trouble. Especially when two of them get in a pissing match and don't know when to back down.

I no longer trust ANY of the facebook instances. Some are not him at all.. either other Martins or gimmicked impersonations. If his actual facebook has updated then it is gimmicked as well and no longer represents "Trayvon" but what someone else wants to portray.

I'm willing to discount the flipoff all together. I saw it early on, on one of the facebook profiles that has since been identified as someone else by the family.. I'll accept it on that one.. but they have not denied the twitter golden grille. If the twitter #NO_LIMIT_NIGGA now has the flipoff photo then the other facebook profile is his as well and THAT one protrayed the person as a thug(wannabe).

Just another reason I don't join facebook and post photos of myself, family or friends.

I re-read their posts and I don't see any racist or hateful remarks.

They are bantering against the common knowledge and facts then commenting that the evidence doesnt exist. Their pure racism comes from the fact that they are speaking from the Sharpton/Jackson/MSNBC Bullshirt that was spewed by many commentators that there wasnt any evidence of harm to zimmerman, the kid was a 100 pound 12 year old (purported in the portaits) instead of a 6 foot 3 man, that zimmerman "offered up race in the 911 call (MSNBC go caught in that little editing LIE). It's quite simple to follow the comments from the ignorant zombie's to the true racists in this episode.

What "common knowledge" are you speaking of? Both Connie and thfan are correct. In the video, Zimmerman does not have bandages on his head, nor is there visible blood on Zimmerman's shirt or jacket.

Stating facts that seem to go against Zimmerman is now racist, apparently.

Thomas, please explain how George Zimmerman became a victim, when he was the one that did the shooting? The real crime here was the lack of investigation. That is what all the stink is about.

generally next in rotation. makes for difficult judge shopping but it is slightly possible.

Sounds like this "rotation" could be played with in a number of ways, especially if a new judge has been anticipated for the last week or two.

Sounds like this "rotation" could be played with in a number of ways, especially if a new judge has been anticipated for the last week or two.

Thus my couching my response with "slightly possible". The challenge is the rotation is based on cases coming in. I don't know if they publish the rotation but I am sure looking at cases assigned could give a clue who MIGHT be up. With a case like this I can see them going to drawing straws just to cover everyones concerns. Hopefully a no nonsense type. Judge Ito was too busy playing to the media. The one in Casey Anthony seemed to have a clue. Personally I think he should have locked that one jurist up for a LONG time.

Trial judge is assigned by presiding judge of the court, on a rotating basis.

It's likely, however, that this motion will be denied, and the current judge will preside over the case.

I doubt it Virginia, she is the one that brought the question up in the first place.

It's not really necessary as there's no real conflict. Her husbands co-worker was only hired to report facts on the case and maybe speculate. He won't have any more access to information than any of us and he isn't working for the benefit of one side or the other.

Chap

Pursuit negates defense.

in MOST states except Florida. There are already cases, in Florida, where the victim chased down a thief and killed them over a stereo. They were held immune under FL SYG.

That is not standing your ground; that is murder.

This article cites the stereo incident and several others where the individuals who used the SYG defense successfully were much more aggressive than Zimmerman.

http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/article1222930.ece

Trayvon Martin did not steal anything or commit any crime.

Thanks wild bill I couldn't refind the link.

eroy brown

Trayvon Martin did not steal anything or commit any crime.

Until he committed battery, even in defending himself. The only requirement to begin self defense under SYG is reasonable belief of death or serious injury from your opponent.

Trust, it is very questionable that Trayvon "committed battery" at all and if he did, I don't see how he can be blamed for it. Zimmerman had no reason to stalk him in the first place.

Chap...This is exactly what the authors of SYG have said. They do not believe that it is a valid defense in this case.

Trust...You are talking the word of a desperate man!

Trust...You can not provoke the attack!

leroy brown

Trust, it is very questionable that Trayvon "committed battery" at all and if he did, I don't see how he can be blamed for it. Zimmerman had no reason to stalk him in the first place.

Battery is unwanted deliberate touching. In some jurisdictions a kiss meets the legal requirements of not only battery but sexual battery. In Florida battery is defined under 784.03

1. Actually and intentionally touches or strikes another person against the will of the other; or
2. Intentionally causes bodily harm to another person.
That they were hitting each other so they each were committing battery.

Rick-997559

Trust...You can not provoke the attack!

I presume you are referring to SYG. Most other states you would be correct. FL SYG does not appear to have that restriction unless you are committing certain crimes or you know the other person is law enforcement. While the INTENT may have been one thing, what they WROTE and signed into LAW is what the courts have been using since 2005. It has even been applied when someone gave chase to a thief and the law specifically requires threat to a PERSON not property.

LOL taken literally though. I seem to provoke attacks all day on newsvine.

Trust

I seem to provoke attacks all day on newsvine.

Forgive me for bragging but I think I've got you beat on this. Righties are easily provoked and I have a big mouth!

hmmm Not sure that is a title that should be bragged over but OK the title is yours LOL.

Speaking of provoked and bigmouth :) you never did get back to me on "reasonable" gun control laws or are you still working on the theory that an out right BAN is the only reasonable control?

I have given that some thought Trust and you'll be happy to know that I have come up with the Leroy Brown Gun Control proposal. As you may guess, it contains some serious restrictions but it also features some surprising freedoms that may not sit too well with my fellow gun control advocates. I'll lay out the basic guidelines on the next gun article that garners high interest from posters.

I'll lay out the basic guidelines on the next gun article that garners high interest from posters.

I look forward to reading them. Probably poke at them but you know I do that in the spirit of debate not attacking you (much lol).

food for thought.. and I am thinking of the same thing... newsvine has a function where we can publish "articles" and I am thinking of doing a few. It might be a place to put a LOT of details and then just reference out. Saves the mass copy paste and allows readers who are interested to read without taking up a large chunk of thread space.

Exactly...and they are all innocent as well!

Seems kind of fitting considering old Zimmy did the same to Martin.

We don't know what Zimmerman did, or did not do. At this point, being charged and going to trial is in Zimmerman's best interests; it gives him his day in court. And for now, he is safer in custody than he would be on the street. Given the amount of scrutiny this is getting, it will be as fair as any trial can be. People need to remember that we live by a system of laws; this does not guarantee 'justice'. It only guarantees that he will be tried under the laws of the stat of Florida. It may not produce the result that some people want. But it is better than people taking 'justice' into their own hands.

Feb. 26, 2012 (night of Martin shooting) – 7:11 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: Black male "late teens lsw dark gray hoodie jeans or sweatpants walking around area" … "subj now running towards back entrance of complex"

44. Feb. 2, 2012 – 8:29 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: "BM lsw: black leather jacket, black hat, printed PJ pants, he keeps going going to this" location

43. Jan. 29, 2012 – 5:38 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Disturbance
Report: Children "running and playing in the street"

Dec. 10, 2011 – 5:29 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Disturbance
Report: "At the club house" … "Male subject [arrived on scene] that thought he was employed by" Zimmerman … "Subj is expected to get paid for serving food." … Zimmerman "said that he didn't wish him to serve at the [event]" … Zimmerman "hired someone else, subj sounded upset and wants to get paid"

Oct. 1, 2011 – 12:53 a.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: Two black male suspects "20–30 YOA in [white] Chevy poss Impala at the gate of the community." Zimmerman "does not recognize subjs or veh and is concerned due to recent" burglaries in the area

Sept. 23, 2011 – 11:08 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Neighbor/Suspicious activity
Report: Zimmerman reports "open garage door" … Describes "neighborhood watch mtg last night with Sgt Herx who [advised] to report anything [suspicious]" … Zimmerman "is part of neighborhood watch" and is concerned because of recent burglaries in the area

Aug. 6, 2011 – 10:20 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: Two black males, one wearing a black tank top and black shorts, the second wearing a black t-shirt and jeans … "Subjs are in their teens"

Aug. 3, 2011 – 6:45 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: Black male last seen wearing a white tank top and black shorts … Zimmerman "believes subject is involved in recent" burglaries in the neighborhood

May 27, 2011 – 9:18 a.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Alarm
Report: Zimmerman "has a self responding alarm that just notified him of" an alarm at this location

April 22, 2011 – 7:09 p.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Suspicious activity
Report: Juvenile black male "apprx 7–9" years old, four feet tall "skinny build short blk hair" last seen wearing a blue t-shirt and blue shorts

March 18, 2011 – 9:26 p.m.
Type: 911
Subject: Animals
Report: Zimmerman requested an officer meet him regarding a pit bull in his garage

Nov. 26, 2010 – 2:54 a.m.
Type: TEL
Subject: Alarm
Report: Zimmerman was out of town and a motion alarm he monitors himself went off

There are the twelve most recent 911 calls Zimmerman made. Seven are about "suspicious black males."

And any honest person that lives in an area like that will tell you that young black males DO commit the majority of crimes... Call me what you will, but the facts speak for themselves across the whole country. The black family and community is broken and for too long it has been easy to yell that it is the fault of everyone but their own portion of this society that has caused it.

Listen to the black culture of todays "hip hop based rap BS"... it is glorified and emulated by the black males in both their language, dress and actions.

As for Travon...

* He was not a kid. He was a seventeen year old man that would almost certainly have been held accountable as an adult had he been caught committing a violent crime.

* He was not some "sweet young boy"... he had been caught just recently with a screw driver and stolen jewelry in his back pack along with an empty bag of weed.

* He may very well have been the great kid that his parent speak of at the time of the photo that the biased media keeps posting. But those same parent own some of this. Who paid to have his teeth grilled in gold? is that the sort of thing a respectable seventeen YO does that isn't thinking he is wanting to have a bad boy street appearance? What kind of parent promotes that kind of look?

You can yell bigot, racist whatever you want... I've lived long enough to realize that most of the time someone is yelling those things, it is they that are the true racists and expect everyone to walk around blindly without looking at the realities of life. The statistics of problems within the black communities speak for themselves and to blame it on the rest of society is a bunch of crap.

1. Young black males were committing crimes in this Sanford, Florida community. There is no proof that the black males Zimmerman called about in these 911 calls were committing any crimes.

2. Seventeen is still a legal minor in this county.

3. Wow, when did screwdrivers become illegal?

4. Neither the school, nor Miami-Dade police had any proof the jewelry was stolen. Martin said it wasn't even his. His friend gave him the jewelry.

5. The "gold grille" pictures are in dispute if it is "the" Treyvon Martin. If he did have a grille, those are removable, and you can buy a cheap, plated one for under fifty bucks online.

6. There is no proof Martin was doing anything that night that should have gotten him killed.

Misscreant I follow all black males in my area they are no go and can not be trusted, And I tell you this if he is found not guilty all hell may break lose in the black community but if he is found guilty god help america I will be one of the one out there protesting and the white men do it better.

Why is it that when white rage overflows, it's a protest, but when black rage overflows, it's a riot?

When you steal and burn that is a riot and I do not want it to be a protest and I support the full thing civil war it is time to get it over with it is coming and is needed the white man is tired of thirty years of civil rights for blacks that give them special treatment making them better then whites in schools and collages and jobs and screwing the white man and making him live the getto lifestyle in america where ever you live. Yes even in this case a up scale gated community and still a ghetto since blacks moved in

Misscreant

1. Young black males were committing crimes in this Sanford, Florida community. There is no proof that the black males Zimmerman called about in these 911 calls were committing any crimes.

Except Black males were arrested with stolen property from the community shortly after reports of suspicious Black males in the neighborhood on bicycles. Whether it was Georges call or someone else the FACT is Black males were the ones found to be committing the crimes. Much like calling reports of KKK activity would be reported as White males. Don't use race to distort the fact of who is committing crimes in a particular area.

2. Seventeen is still a legal minor in this county.

17 year olds can and have been tried as adults in this country and in Sanford.

3. Wow, when did screwdrivers become illegal?

When they are discovered with stolen items. or on the person who has stolen items in their possession.

4. Neither the school, nor Miami-Dade police had any proof the jewelry was stolen. Martin said it wasn't even his. His friend gave him the jewelry.

They must have had enough proof or Martins parents felt it was true as they did not fight his suspension for that possession. He never did identify the friend. So either he lied or was an accessory to a crime.

5. The "gold grille" pictures are in dispute if it is "the" Treyvon Martin. If he did have a grille, those are removable, and you can buy a cheap, plated one for under fifty bucks online.

The grill was associated with the twitter account that belonged to Trayvon #NO_LIMIT_NIGGA. No one has debated or denied the twitter was his account. It doesn't matter WHERE the grill came from only that Trayvon was portraying himself as a hip punk... whether he was or not... he projected that image in is poses, actions and perhaps attitude.

6. There is no proof Martin was doing anything that night that should have gotten him killed.

I have to agree on that point short of any physical altercation. No such thing as a fair fight. Even 9 year old girls can kill each other with just their hands.

They must have had enough proof or Martins parents felt it was true as they did not fight his suspension for that possession.

Martin was not suspended for the jewelry. He was suspended once for tardiness, once for graffiti, and once for the marijuana baggie.

As was already stated, there was no proof that a crime had been committed.

Martin was not suspended for the jewelry. He was suspended once for tardiness, once for graffiti, and once for the marijuana baggie.

Other reports included the possession of jewelry and screwdriver as part of either the tardy or graffiti suspensions. Proof of crime? Which do you want? He stole or he was an accessory after the fact? It was HIS backpack. The items didn't just jump in there on their own did they? But again it isn't the crime we are concerned over there so much as the ongoing discipline challenges and response to authority.

Are you acknowledging the other 4 points?

No, I am not conceding the other four points. I have made my position on those points known, and, in my opinion, backed myself up with known facts. I feel no need to rehash those issues.

I am not conceding on the jewelry issue either. If the police could find no evidence of a crime, I'm not going to concede one was committed.

Innocent until proven guilty right, or is that only for Zimmerman?

Not that I'm a racist by any stretch of the imagination...I'm cautious of young males (black and white) walking in my development that appear to be up to no good and are not known to me.

For those of you bent on making the case of "blacks" committing majority of crimes, recent headline news I've seen has been: "Kingpin drug dealing granny", "Million Dollar Lottery winner, also welfare recipient still collecting food stamps and medical", "The Woman Who Wasn't There", Tania Head, claims to have been a 9/11 survivor"...all of these "white".

We can all agree that there are criminals of all races, that shine an unfavorable light on that particular race/culture.

ethnicbutee

We can all agree that there are criminals of all races, that shine an unfavorable light on that particular race/culture.

True they,criminals, come in all shapes and sizes. The sensational ones you listed though are rarely encountered by the average person/victim and other than the drug dealer I don't see harm/violence.

As far as the profiling though.. you admit to doing it in your development as well. Each area has the "usual suspects" Those where this happened happen to be Black. Anyone who lives in an urbanized area knows that in one part of town certain elements cause problems and down the block is another group. Just like certain parts of town are where one goes to score drugs or get "discount" electronics or car parts.

Misscreant

I am not conceding on the jewelry issue either. If the police could find no evidence of a crime, I'm not going to concede one was committed.

Innocent until proven guilty right, or is that only for Zimmerman?

Agreed on the innocent til proven guilty for all. My understanding was the school "police?" had found the jewels and his suspension was based on that. Depending on the school they may or may not have reported it as a criminal act... especially if the evidence was weak but good enough to suspend on.

The jewelry was found at the same time Martin was busted for the graffiti. It was confiscated and turned over to Miami-Dade police, who could find no evidence that it was stolen, and concluded that no crime had been committed. Martin was suspended for the graffiti alone.

trust

As far as the profiling though.. you admit to doing it in your development as well.

I didn't realize taking precautions as it relates to my personal safety by being 'cautious' and paying attention to what's going on around me, whether it's in my neighborhood or if I'm running errands, as profiling. If I were making repeated calls to 911 reporting the 'usual suspects' and any 'suspicious' behavior, then I would have to agree. Otherwise, it could be said that everyone at some point, has 'profiled' someone else.

there is no requirement to make phone calls to profile people. What you call being cautious and observant and situationally aware is what George may have been doing and is being called profiling. Yes everyone at some point or on a regular basis has profiled people. If you are aware of your surroundings just how do you determine who you concern yourself over? Bag lady, pan handler, kids on skateboards, long haired, shaved head, business suit, ragged clothing, dew rag or bandana of certain colors? Remember George is a concerned citizen, neighborhood watch. He simply took it to the next level and reported what he saw. In a few cases he reported alarms activated or doors open. What is funny is many on here are using the fact he made those calls in the past instead of confronting the individuals on his own yet now that it appears he asked Trayvon a question he should have just let the police deal with it. Can you imagine the uproar of a single male approaching an 8 and 9 year old and asking them where they live?

TheEnd

A 9mm doesn't kick that hard. .45 .44, .357 .50 but not a 9mm. There is a witness who saw the fight in progress with Trayvon on top and winning.

The older Zimmerman was a federal MAGISTRATE in VA and his mother was either a law clerk or a translator. Please provide a link to any proof you have that the DA was in contact with the elder Zimmerman between the shooting and Georges release.

George was entered into a "diversion" program that upon successful completion expunged the record.

You should PRAY that the judge does get booted or the defense has the perfect excuse for an appeal if one is necessary.

I do not like black people and would like them out of america period, why did the corporations leave america because the government forced them to hire blacks they are evil, so the housing collapse did one thing forced america to stand it's ground against blacks and a another civil war is coming.

I'm white and people like "the truth you will not like it" embarrass the hell out of me. On behalf of normal, non-hate-filled whites everywhere, I apologize to all people of color for this horror of a human being's appalling comments.

the truth - you are a RIOT! Gotta hand it to you...so original in your thinking! LORL

ethnicbutee

the truth - you are a RIOT! Gotta hand it to you...so original in your thinking! LORL

The truth and a few others come across as trolls and race baiters.. or are they just baters? Few in real life would spew the hatred and vitriol they do except skinheads or those in prison. That applies to some of the supposed Black racist in here as well.

trust - you have made a valid point.

thanks.. I may not be popular but I call it like I see it and generally everyone knows where I stand, sit or fall on a topic.

The community was racially mixed, so there is no reason to assume that they didn't live there, or have family and friends there. One of Zimmerman's "suspicious black males" was, in Zimmerman's own estimation, "seven to nine years old," so I would guess he certainly had a reason to be there, like an adult brought him.

Nothing that I could find indicated that any arrests were made from Zimmerman's 911 calls.

There is reason to assume they didn't live there: Zimmerman lived there and he knew his neighbors and the usual visitors. If they were acting suspicious, he should call police regardless of their race. There may not have been arrests made because the police were alerted before a crime was committed.

Really everyone? You know everybody that lives in and visits your neighborhood? That's ridiculous. And Zimmerman didn't call about people "regardless of their race," he called about black males. He may not have been racist, but he had a bias. Possibly a justifiable bias, but a bias nonetheless.

I could at least recognize everyone on my street, the usual cars, the usual visitors.

What about unusual visitors? Out-of-town family? What if someone buys a new car?

Zimmerman was overzealous. His idea of "suspicious" was "I don't know you, therefore you have no business here, must be up to no good, and I'm calling 911 on you." It shows a lack of good judgement on his part.

Why do you think that was his idea of suspicious?

I think that was the case because in all these calls, all these guys were doing was walking, or riding a bike, or driving. In one case he called to report two black males had driven up and down his street more than once. Maybe something nefarious, or maybe they were just looking for an address. Most people would think they were looking for an address. The call about the "seven to nine year old" riding his bike? Real criminal mastermind, I'm sure. Like I said, lack of good judgement.

maybe lack of judgement or maybe averted crimes because he was observing and reporting

Misscreant bull I seen seven year old blacks used as holders of drugs in Baltimore starting at birth black men are no good. I think we should hire enough cops that all black men are followed at all times.

The blacks in america hate the truth and will fight for evil everytime if it has black skin

At least you freely admit you're a racist. I give you points for honesty.

We are not the same and yes I am I do not like any blacks and I was not rasied this way I learned how much the blacks hate the white man and this case proves it but Blacks can hate the white man and that is not racism.

Misscreant

Really everyone? You know everybody that lives in and visits your neighborhood? That's ridiculous. And Zimmerman didn't call about people "regardless of their race," he called about black males. He may not have been racist, but he had a bias. Possibly a justifiable bias, but a bias nonetheless.

Actually living in a "gated" community... I don't see actual gates in the depictions so far.. you get to know most of your neighbors and the regular visitors. Unfortunately EVERYONE knows everyones business even if they don't want to know.

Also note that everyone here is upset that George would "challenge" Martin being present so should not have approached to ask who he was... so that leaves the choice of approaching a child and asking where they live or calling 9-1-1 dispatch (they keep saying 9-1-1 but it is documented he dialed the non emergency number most of the time and including the night of the shooting). We already KNOW the reaction of a male approaching a child and asking questions.

Misscreant didnt he have like 46 calls into the police?

MN NATIVE

Misscreant didnt he have like 46 calls into the police?

That was the first "story" being promoted. Then it turns out he only made 8 since August of which SIX fit the agenda of him calling in only on Black males. As a neighborhood watch it sort of goes with the territory to contact police about things. What is most annoying about the view on the 46 calls or even the 8 is that those not liking George make an issue over all the times he contacted authorities then are on his case for NOT letting police handle things. They have issue that he called police on some 8 and 9 year olds playing in the street yet are upset he spoke to a 17 year old asking him what was going on. Damn it's easier to nail jello to the wall on a hot summer day than to pin some folks down on what they want.

It was 46 calls since moving to the neighborhood in 2004.

shaking head in negative.. so he made 7 or 8 calls a year? I manage 2 or 3 myself, including accidents and such.

I am 35 years old and I never have had to call 911, non emergency or emergency. Two or three a year seems excessive, never mind seven or eight.

Did you really look at what he made those calls for?

Did you really look at what he made those calls for?

He called for any number of reasons and it is unclear whether he dialed 9-1-1 or simply dispatch. Some calls were for children playing in the street, animals, alarms, suspicious people, doors ajar. What I don't see is medical or auto accident on the list

I am 35 years old and I never have had to call 911, non emergency or emergency. Two or three a year seems excessive

I live where we get weather. Car accidents are not uncommon. flooded roads are not uncommon. downed wires happen. I learned quite some time back that having police respond to suspicious activity/persons is generally a good idea and they prefer to deal with things over having citizens get involved.

That said I can see myself in Georges shoes that night. I can't say I would have stayed at my vehicle with or without a gun. I do know that I would have kept the dispatch on the line until the officers arrived.

I have both listened to and read transcripts of Zimmerman's 911 call, and no where on the tape does he indicate he is returning to his truck.

Misscreant you will cause race wars in america if you keep on using lies to defend this kid who was a burglar a thug and got what blacks deserve.

If anyone starts a race war, I'm pretty sure it will be you.

I have no problem with helping my race when a war starts and prepared for it to start and openly support it.

It is because of people like you that Sharpton and the NAACP get involved in cases like this. I am not a fan of Sharpton but I am starting to understand. I find your posts offensive and lacking the topic of conversation.

How about you getting sources for what you call facts, fyrboss?

Yes I am seen interesting article George Zimmerman killing Trayvon Martin

When it was done, there was a dead one, and the other one was in hiding, on the run?

You can get all above question answer on above article.

Forget about Z not having any of his own blood on him, how can you shoot someone straddling you and not get any THEIR blood on you? He was far enough away not to get any splatter on him.

If a 28 year old black guy had killed a 17 year old white kid, latino kid, or a white latino kid, he'd have been charged by the SANDFORD POLICE DEPT. that night.

Wade Waters

Forget about Z not having any of his own blood on him, how can you shoot someone straddling you and not get any THEIR blood on you? He was far enough away not to get any splatter on him.

Been answered elsewhere but ok... At point blank range the 9mm entry would be the size of a dime. The powder charge would cauterize the would to a degree. Trayvons body would not explode like a watermelon. The heart most likely stopped before the next beat. The hoddie/parka/jacket trayvon was wearing would catch most of the initial splatter. George would waste no time getting out from under. The bullet may not have gone straight in but may have entered from the side or below the ribs.

It has been established that the two were in a physical altercation with one on top of the other.. debate of who was on top. Had the evidence that night shown they were not intertwined George would not have been released when he was.

If a 28 year old black guy had killed a 17 year old white kid, latino kid, or a white latino kid, he'd have been charged by the SANDFORD POLICE DEPT. that night.

You throw out your entire arguments potential credibility by making it about race. Especially when you make it that only a Black would be arrested. While it MAY be true of SPD we don't have evidence of those facts.