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Jim Pickerell / AP
In this January 1973 photo released by the U.S. National Archives, trash and old tires litter the shore at the middle branch of the Patapsco River in the harbor of Baltimore, Md.
Patrick Semansky / AP
And now...
WASHINGTON -- A polluted drainage ditch that once flowed with industrial waste from Lake Charles, La., petrochemical plants teems with overgrown, wild plants today.
A light-rail line zips past the spot where a now-defunct Portland, Ore., gasoline station advertised in 1972 that it had run out of gas.
A smoking Jersey City, N.J., dump piled with twisted, rusty metal has disappeared, along with the twin towers of the World Trade Center in lower Manhattan that were its backdrop.
Photographers revisit sites of EPA's Documerica project to see how things have changed over 40 years
Forty years after the Environmental Protection Agency sent an army of nearly 100 photographers across the country to capture images at the dawn of environmental regulation, The Associated Press went back for Earth Day this year to see how things have changed. It is something the agency never got to do because the Documerica program, as it was called, died in 1978, the victim of budget cuts.
AP photographers returned to more than a dozen of those locations in recent weeks, from Portland to Cleveland and Corpus Christi, Texas. Of the 20,000 photos in the archive, the AP selected those that focused on environmental issues, rather than the more general shots of everyday life in the 1970s.
Gone are the many obvious signs of pollution — clouds of smoke billowing from industrial chimneys, raw sewage flowing into rivers, garbage strewn over beaches and roadsides — that heightened environmental awareness in the 1970s, and led to the first Earth Day and the EPA's creation in 1970. Such environmental consciousness caused Congress to pass almost unanimously some of the country's bedrock environmental laws in the years that followed.
Today's pollution problems aren't as easy to see or to photograph. Some in industry and politics question whether environmental regulation has gone too far and whether the risks are worth addressing, given their costs.
Republican presidential contender Mitt Romney has called for the firing of EPA chief Lisa Jackson, while GOP rival Newt Gingrich has said the EPA should be replaced altogether. Jackson has faced tough questioning on Capitol Hill so often the in past two years that a top Republican quipped that she needs her own parking spot.
"To a certain extent, we are a victim of our own success," said William Ruckelshaus, who headed the EPA when it came into existence under Republican President Richard Nixon and was in charge during the Documerica project. "Right now, EPA is under sharp criticism partially because it is not as obvious to people that pollution problems exist and that we need to deal with them."
Environmental laws that passed Congress so easily in Ruckelshaus' day are now at the center of a partisan dispute between Republicans and Democrats. Dozens of bills have been introduced to limit environmental protections that critics say will lead to job losses and economic harm, and there are those who question what the vast majority of scientists accept — that the burning of fossil fuels is causing global warming.
In the 1970s, the first environmental regulations were just starting to take effect, with widespread support. Now, according to some officials in the oil and gas and electric utility industries, which are responsible for the bulk of emissions and would bear the greatest costs, the EPA has gone overboard with rules.
For instance, Documerica photographers captured a wave of coal-fired power plants under construction. Republicans and the industry now say environmental regulations are partly to blame for shuttering some of the oldest and dirtiest coal plants.
Jim DiPeso of ConservAmerica, a group that recently changed its name from Republicans for Environmental Protection, says the EPA is caught in the center of a perfect storm. "This time of greater cynicism about government, more economic anxiety and the fact that the problems are not immediately apparent, has created this political problem for EPA," he said.
In an interview, Jackson said she believes that people in the United States still want to protect the environment. "There's a large gulf between the rhetoric inside the Beltway to do everything from cut back on EPA to get rid of the whole place, and what the American people would actually stand for," she said. "It's very easy to make rash statements without thinking about what that means to the health of everyday Americans."
A 2010 Pew Research Center survey showed that 57 percent of those questioned held a favorable view of the EPA, compared with a 1997 poll that showed 69 percent with a positive view of the agency. A CNN/Opinion Research Corp. poll taken last year found that 71 percent of people surveyed said that the government should continue provide money to the EPA to enforce regulations to address global warming and other environmental issues.
"We are not done. We still have challenges we have to face," Jackson said.
The agency last year began a volunteer photography project called State of the Environment. More than 620 people have participated and submitted 1,800 photographs, but only a few are at the same sites at the 1970s project.
Images always have spurred environmental consciousness. A 1980s satellite picture of the ozone hole helped lead to a ban on the chemicals in aerosol cans and refrigerants that were responsible. Underwater video of oil spewing into the Gulf of Mexico in 2010 opened the public's eyes to the gravity of the largest offshore oil spill in U.S. history.
But a second Documerica project, with professional photographers, would be impossible today, given budget cuts facing the agency and the wariness of industry barring access by photographers.
Lyntha Scott Eiler, 65, shot photographs for Documerica around her then-home in northern Arizona, as well as one of the early emissions testing sites for automobile exhaust in Hamilton County, Ohio. At the Navajo Generating Station in Arizona, Eiler got right down in a strip mine "where the shovels were."
"They weren't afraid of the EPA, so it was, 'What else you do you want to get a photograph of?,'" Eiler said. "You probably would have a hard time doing that today."
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Leave a Comment:
It's nice to see the before-after pictures. People so quickly forget what it was actually
like prior to the EPA stepping in to begin to regulate environmental pollution.
I remember all the yelling and screaming that went on during that time
regarding how expensive and difficult this (cleaning up the environment) would
be. Like any mandate, some groups will fight it just because the can. Do you
remember Allstate Insurance Company and their stand against air bags? Bet not.
Politicians count on public amnesia when it comes to "how it was" and
play the same old tired "It'll cost jobs!" card again and again. One
of the nice things about Federal laws is that they apply to all players
regardless of location. Theoretically a refinery in Texas has to be as clean as
a refinery in Colorado. Of course, in Texas all the "winking and
nodding" that goes on with respect to environmental pollution means that
even with decent air flow over the land places like Houston find themselves
under an ozone watch in the Spring. How does that happen? Can you say
"Grandfathered to the old standards"?
I'm all for the EPA but corporate polluters the politicians on the right and they hang any one that desires to insure that our water and air are : "tree hugger." Fine label in my opinion--imagine what the air will be like as we continue to deforest the planet and allow toxins to find their way into the aquifers.
Let them do their jobs as watch dogs and enforcers.
The EPA has done good work, and will continue to do good work in the future. Having said that we need to balance what we are doing based on the technology available today with the results desired for tomorrow.
We do need clean air and water for today and for tomorrow. We have made great strides on doing both as shown by the picture in the article. Can we please take some credit for it?
While we have done wonders with transportation particularly with the automobile. It would be I feel beneficial to do these improvements at a pace that will allow more of these vehicles to be purchased in a given year. Right now our fleet average for cars is 10.4-10.8 years. We need to balance the improved emissions with the overall cost of the vehicle. What we want to do is have more new cars being purchased to replace older vehicles. I fear some of the policies would actually slow the pace of this replacement.
Coal power plants have waste problems even with scrubbers you end up with waste material.
http://www.ucsusa.org/clean_energy/coalvswind/c02d.html
My question is this, what has been done in research to harvest this material for other uses? The metals that are listed are things that we need for battery production. Can that be used?
Would it work to put this waste back where they mined the coal from?
Natural gas,
Fracking has made the news a lot lately. Natural gas is also found when drilling for oil.
http://www.sjvgeology.org/oil/exploration.html
Since they are usually found together we can recover them together. Maybe we should work on better ways of doing that?
Nuclear power.
I do not have to provide a link for that. Personally I am less enchanted with that solution than I once was. We would have to do it differently than we have in the past. If we have reactors set up in series we would end up with waste that is a lot less radio active then the way we are doing it now.
Solar,
The trade off on this is how much land is needed to deliver enough power to be worth while. They are working solar panel windows. To me this may be a very good solution. Cities have a lot of windows, so your surface area is already present. The other limitation with solar, it is a use it or lose it energy source. We do not have a practical way of storing energy that is not used at the time that it is generated.
Wind Power,
I have worked with a local wind farm. There are many unreported issues with generating power using the wind. They have talked about birds being killed, bats being effected, false signal on radar, but have not given total numbers.
They are also designed to work at a specific wind speed. While they do have transmissions that allow this ideal speed to be widened, there is still problems. If the wind is to strong the blades have to be locked in position. There is also problems in cold weather and hot weather. Also peak production is usually when demand is at it weakest. Spring, fall and at night are peak production periods.
Until we can generate power in space and beam it down, we have to make trade offs. In order for us to make educated trade offs is to explain in detail what they are.
Saying something is clean is not enough. We need to mine for the metal to make the supports for wind turbines. Solar panels require harsh chemicals during production. Natural gas might be are best option once it is at the plant, but recovering it has environmental impacts.
Way to go Grounded123 great post and you hit the nail on the head. Didn't have to have a multi-billion dollar tax payer based bureaucracy giving us 40+ blends of gasoline either.
Grounded:
Interesting comments. You brought a lot of perspective to the discussion. As for getting you mad....
Wow grounded123, you made my day. I hope it is okay with you if I print your post and show it around to my friends who think I am a nut for being concerned about the enviroment. Hopefully it will make them think.
Kids used to play outside all day. Mother would say "go outside and play or I'll find something for you to do". When you got thirsty you went to the side of the house and turned on the hose to get a drink. When the street lights come on it's time to go home. Life was simpler then.
Yeah, I've read that story before In fact, here's a terrifying version of these same told through primitive CG video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJbdHg3hpmI&feature=plcp&context=C4b8d88aVDvjVQa1PpcFNIYkxLS0u1nZTeiTMcNf_m68SNAXpRX9M%3D. Where did this happen exactly? Notice that no source is listed anywhere.
I highly doubt that this chain of events occurred anywhere. It sounds like a completely fictional story written to stroke the egos of older people who have some weird resentful feelings towards younger, environmentally conscious individuals.
Get over the generational divide. No one is blaming older Americans for being, stupid, or destructive towards the environment. Many of my generation (30ish and younger) already look towards to the solutions of our parents and grandparents to reduce waste and live healthier lives. I feel no anger towards my grandparents' generation, and I have known very few people my age who do lay all of our blame at their feet.
Oh, and life was never simple. Think about it. My grandparents lived under the threat of World War 2 and the Great Depression. The generation before had to deal with World War 1. My parents (the Boomers) had to deal with the Vietnam War, the Civil Rights era, gas crises, and the Cold War. My generation is in the middle of an endless war on terror, the Dot.com bust, the current economic crisis, the horribly corrupt Bush Administration, and the destruction of all social safety nets. No era is ever simple and carefree. The only reason our parents and grandparents were allowed to run around by themselves outside was because their parents didn't have sensationalist 24/7 news stations screaming that an army of pedophiles in vans are waiting outside to rape every child in America. In fact, if you look at the statistics modern America's crime rates are lower than just about every previous generation's crime rates. That when your grandparents told you about how they used to keep their doors unlocked at all times "back in the good old days", they were actually taking far greater risks than you would be if you kept your doors unlocked today.
Great Post, Thanks for a reminder of the Good old days....
The EPA has become nothing more than a cult, intent on destroying the economy and redistributing global wealth based on the hoax of man-made global warming.
Liberals have this idiotic notion of all or nothing. Either they do everything they want, destroying jobs and the economy, or they accuse conservatives of wanting to do nothing. If you could be 99% there without destroying the country that isn't enough, they want 100%
Your ignorance and lack of outdoor life experiences is baffling. Everything you said is a feeble-minded lie I guess you heard from Fox "News" brainwashing propaganda. Just because you live in a garbage dump, drink toilet waste water and prefer to smoke GM automobile tailpipes, doesn't mean the rest of us who have our eyes open prefer to do the same.
Everyone who thinks that the EPA is bad for this country is living a VERY SHELTERED LIFE! The EPA is protecting some of the most beautiful places this country has to offer from very IRRESPONSIBLE, selfish and greedy lowlifes...but you wouldn't realize that living as a flatlander or in the south where people dwell in their trash.
Global warming is real, you just gotta spend some of you life living and working in the outdoors to notice it. Its about responsibility, not politics and the media circus.
Typical lib response. Call names, denigrate and show yourself to be a small-minded follower of fellow brain-donor, Al Gore.
Obama Lover:
Typical teaparty response. A lot more "all or nothing" coming from the right this cycle.
All or nothing? RIght-wingers today are trying to UNDO pollution regulation that has been in place for decades. Their rhetoric seems to be "nothing or nothing" when it comes to the environment.
You right-wingers spew the same garbage lies over and over. "Global warming hoax, redistribute wealth" blah, blah blah. Same old tired bumper-sticker nonsense. They're afraid to talk about the facts, so they resort to chanting phrases. Then, when you call them out on their stupid nonsense, they accuse you of being a "typical liberal" who is brainwashed by Al Gore, as if Al Gore invented global warming. They still can't get over him, and have to mention him and demonize him every time global warming is mentioned, as if attacking Al Gore (a non-scientist) will disprove a very well-established scientific theory. This provides insight into their lack of scientific understanding.
Let's discuss something modern conservatives fear most (and I say modern because conservatives of the past used to be FOR protecting the environment):
Facts.
The rate of warming we're seeing today is unprecedented. Temps have been rising sharply since the industrial revolution, with most of that warming in the past 30 years. The ocean is acidifying faster today than it did over 10 million years ago in one of the biggest mass-extinction events in earth's history. This is due to the ocean absorbing massive amounts of man-made CO2. If this continues, 50% of marine species could be extinct within this century. This isn't limited to the ocean. By the end of this century, if we continue warming like we are and don't slow CO2 emissions, 30-70% of species worldwide could become extinct. Temps are changing too fast for species to adapt, so they simply die out. Steady increase of temperature extremes, over 10 thousand March heat records were set, some places surpassing their previous high by over 20 degrees.
98% of climatologists and climate searchers agree on 2 basic facts: global temps are rising, and that rise in temps is a result of man-made emissions.
STOP listening to fossil-fuel funded lies. This is a real and major threat, and if it doesn't affect you in your lifetime, it will surely affect your children or grandchildren.
LOL.. i have to believe you going for irony
Excellent post, Zach. Unfortunately, it is too many words for these neo-cons to read. Oh how I long for a true conservative party.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2093264/Forget-global-warming--Cycle-25-need-worry-NASA-scientists-right-Thames-freezing-again.html
I'm not a "climate scientist" but it appears that the sun has a lot to do with temperature.
Who knew? Right?
"Climatology" is a new science with room to grow.
As for the article. The EPA has become a weapon for a certain ideology. That's not saying that haven't done some positive work.
So let me just absorb this. You think cleaning up our planet is bad because its a liberal ideology? If you have anything negative to say about the EPA doing a good job then you really are a partisan right wing nut! I mean do you really think you will win the lottery someday and have as much money as you wish you had? You are a FN idiot. Good luck with your fantasy and in the mean time I have three words for you... Good little peasant!!! The Rothchilds will reward you with clean up duty and a psionide pill you stupid can of @$$ holes...
Anyone that thinks the EPA hasn't served a purpose need only look at the before and after photos. They "speak" more to the point than a million rational arguments. They also show that humans don't tend to clean up after themselves without pushed, prodded, and poked. Most of the time we aren't even concious of how selfish we are being in the moment - myself included.
Oh and the EPA isn't "a weapon of idealogy" they are a pet whipping boy of an alternative (self-centered) ideology. If the EPA isn't perfect that's because it is an organization comprised of people - who aren't perfect (or we wouldn't need an EPA). So provide constructive criticism instead of grandiose and intentionally inflamatory statements like "The EPA has become nothing more than a cult, intent on destroying the economy and redistributing global wealth based on the hoax of man-made global warming."
Stating that anyone is intent on destroying the economy is just ideology run rampant. Nobody except a terrorist with a death wish sets out to destroy the economy. Try to at least be constructive instead of a talking mouthpiece.
What a joker you are Dude, or are you really that stupid???? Typical Repuk response to anything good for the planet.. Sad the world has fools like you who can't see what the EPA has done for America....
Up to your usual Right wing rants, Valley boy Phil???
How come you guy's never advocate closing down the DEA ? That particular agency has wasted more taxpayer money for less result than the EPA ever has !
We need the EPA to return to it's original mission, clean up pollution. The moment they began worrying about carbon it seems everything else went out the window. Stop trying to control CO2 and get back to lead, mercury, arsenic, dioxins, etc.
So true the current generations don't have a clue, they are far bigger polluters than their elders.
Why can't they regulate CO2? There's ample evidence to allow them to do so. We're one of the biggest contributors worldwide of this pollutant, and science tells us if we continue, there's going to be significant risks to our way of life. For example, states in the southwest could become desert permanently, Sound crazy? Go look up what scientists are saying. This is a very real threat.
Zach
You do know that when mammals breathe they exhale CO2,don't you? Aren't we mammals? So will the EPA regulate how often we and other mammals breathe? Will we be required to put rebreathers on our animals and ourselves?
What amuses me about people that scream about the very idea of CO2 regulation ignore this little sequence of logic:
Or to put it another way higher CO2 levels are already showing significant, documented impacts on the ecology of our oceans and it would be an extraordinarily ignorant person who would say that the ecology of our oceans doesn't effect / impact man's well being. (Since as an example at least 15% of animal protein consumed by humans world wide comes from ocean sources).
Whether you believe in anthropogenic climate change or not CO2 level discussions shouldn't be limited to climate discussions alone and thus it might just be that your EPA argument doesn't hold water...
Shame on US News and PMSNBC for repeating the outright lie: "...and there are those who
question what the vast majority of scientists accept — that the burning of
fossil fuels is causing global warming."
There is no 'vast majority' but there is a huge, growing pile of evidence that contradicts anthropomorphic global warming.
Hogwash
Dennis:
What I don't understand is whether you are just someone trying to stay consistent with your current beliefs and win an argument or interested in solving problems.
Where were you in the late 70's when we accidentally discovered that CFC's were destroying the ozone layer, the one that protects us from UV radiation?
Were you protesting the science then? Thankfully, the international community got together and came up with a solution, versus, waiting for 1/10th of 1% of the better informed portion of the world's population to agree with "the science."
While your 1/10th of 1% (probably far less than that at this point) continues to vote for anti-science leadership, other nations are leading the way, and will likely be in complete control of all the opportunity that the science of global warming represents.
America in decline thanks to a tiny group of bloodyminded people, your call.
There is no question that man-made emissions are contributing to an unprecedented rise in global temperatures. If you dispute this fact, you probably need a CAT scan.
The arguments against global warming are political, not scientific. Subscribing to a political ideology blinds anyone and everyone from the facts; it becomes emotional.
The science leaves no doubt that we're elevating global temperature at an unprecedented rate (beyond natural causes). But since I'm not good a politics, and its clear science can't win the battle until it's to late, there's no point in continuing the discussion.
I'm only going to be around for another 40 years or so, and don't have any kids, so I give up. Lets let the neo-cons phuck the planet and destroy the future of our species. Whatever.
Its political because the liberals adopted environmentalism after the failures of communism and socialism became so glaring. It is no longer based on any real science but belief and indoctrination. What do they intend to do about carbon emissions?-tax them, yeah that will solve the problem.......
Informed, you're as uniformed as it gets. Pathetic, irrelevant, and totally out of touch with reality. Why don't you dig a hole someplace and bury yourself in it.
Thanks for the death wish....as you can see I disagreed with you below but did so in a more civilized and grown up fashion. What reality do you believe me to be out of touch with or uniformed about??? Please enlighten me if you can do so in an adult way this time.
Informed you must have missed Bill Gates in a documentory the other day proclaiming the goal for CO2 to be 0% emissions. Hmmmm my guess is we will never see that day. Not as a carbon based life form anyway.
"Its political because the liberals adopted environmentalism after the failures of communism and socialism".
Out of touch? Need I say more?
Which part of that statement exactly do you consider incorrect?? The liberals in europe admitted to adopting enviromentalism.
The idea that man made CO2 is causing the Earth to warm is just assinine. CO2 makes up .05% of our air and has not seen a .001 increase since readings began being taken. Yes CO2 can cause warming if it is 97% of the atmoshere like Mars and Venus but a small fluctuation, which has not occured..... wouldn't change anything. Plants and our ocean absorb CO2. There is no historic correlation between CO2 levels and temperature in our history. The last ice age had some of the highest CO2 levels why??? Frozen ocean....
I just figure Gates and the rest of his Lib bunch have figured out how to exist without it why else would they proclaim a goal of 0% CO2. After all goal as supposed to be attainable and measurable.
Where in the hell did I say ANYTHING about CO2 or anything else about warming????? Look at your statement and tell me that you're not the one politicizing environmental issues. "Liberals in Europe....".
Your lack of response to my question about the 'after' photo in this article speaks volumes about your lack of concern over our environment. If you want to live in a Super Fund site someplace I'll be happy to provide you with a downpayment on that house of your dreams. Sheesh
P.S. Europe is spelled with a capitol E.
That just shows how riduculous he and his ilk are 0%??? There would be no life of any kind if that happened. All life forms that breath air would need to be exterminated and plants would die from the lack, what a dimwit- he just upset that steve jobs is not around to steal ideas from anymore.
They can no longer afford the big E anymore, sorry...
Oh sorry the lack of a capitol letter was what you found incorrect about my original statement....my bad.
uniformed, so why don't you tell me: Do you prefer the 'before' or 'after' picture at the head of this article. Are you ashamed to answer me? Btw, your last statement really tips your hand. "They can no longer afford the big E anymore, sorry....". In your mind it all boils down to cost, doesn't it.
If you had enough intellectual curiousity you would have read that I challenged your bringing up issues about CO2. I also challenged you to respond to my question about the two pictures in this article. And yes, I did respond to your own dumb attempt at linking communism and socialism to liberalism and, probably, environmentalism.
For once you should try to straighten out your 'ism's'!
I actually read the article and didn't just look a the pictures. I didn't think that warrented a response. Are you actually trying to say that their is no link between liberalism and communism/socialism and had the nerve to call that dumb??? Communism is the very embodiment of all things liberal. I would provide links but you can check that anywhere....
uniformed, please provide me with some links. I need to know where my inclination toward communism and socialism has come from. PLEASE. PLEASE!
Btw, which picture do you prefer? I do believe it warrants a response because without it, you're commitment to a clean environment is called into question. Then again, I can see where you wouldn't give damn.
INFORMED;
You are so belligerently uneducated it is very, very baffling! You don't know the tiniest fraction of what you think you know.
Websters dictionary 4th ed "communism: any politacal ideas or activity thought of as being leftist or subversive; a classless and stateless socielty based on equal distribution; a hypothetical stage of socialism." Have you ever opened a book before or are you still working on your spelling? Do you honestly need posts from the article to show where global warming is brought up?
arron-it doesn't sound like it takes much to baffle either one of you.
uninformed, it's 'political', not 'politacal'.
INFORMED, You must have a special issue of the right wing dictionary. I don't know what edition of Webester's (pocket edition) I have, but it defines communism as "government directing all production and consumption". By the definition in your dictionary, everything not hard core US grade ultra-right capitalism is communism. Seems sort of a general definition to me, but very convenient for political purposes, eh what? Oh, and when they're talking about 0% CO2, they mean from industry, not eradicated from the planet. But I can tell you're ideas are fixed, so no big deal. Have a nice, calm day.
Websters New World College Dictionary 4th ed. 2004. My dictionary has nine definitions and yes I picked the ones which most matched my point. I just picked the most obvious source......the connection between liberal and socialism/communism is well known, I didn't really think anyone would attempt to try to refute that but its truly amazing what some don't know.
Even by you definition "government directing all production and consumption" it still sounds like the democratic party. What do you think "reform" is??? Controling production and consumption, the liberal thinkers in berkeley now think we ought to regulate the sugar industry as well.
It's a shame that the republicans continue to demagogue EPA and many other attempts at either cleaning up the environment or keep it from being ruined. I've never understood why it is that they've chosen to politicize something that is in everyone's best interest. Just sayin'....
The left politicized it....remember Al Gore and his phony computer models?? Funny how political insiders and their companies simply bypass the enviromental hoops that the less well connected have to stumble through, paying at every turn. How can you say what everyone's best interest are??? That kind of thinking is the problem..... Don't get me wrong some changes have led to less polution but the main reason for it is to be used as a polical tool to bypass due process.
Uniformed, you're really uninformed. Look at the two pictures heading this story. The 'clean-up-the-environment' movement began well before Al Gore was old enough to be a politician. Check out the history of Sen. Gaylord Nelson to inform yourself of the genesis of clean earth efforts. If you can look at those two pictures and not admit that the 'after' is something that is in everyone's best interest you're more pathetic than I first thought you to be.
One more thing. Look in a mirror to see who's politicizing environmental issues. Gore was not in office when he associated himself with that movie, and like the rest of us, as a private citizen can speak out on any issue he chooses. You republicans see everything from a political slant and that's a damn shame because it colors your views on so many important issues.
"Green Energy" is a good plan when it is ready to become actuality. What in the meantime we are supposed to haul food to the market in a truck paying 5, 6 7, 10 how many dollars to the gallon? Or cook with electricity that cost 5 or 6 hundred dollars a month?
Sure develop the alternatives but continue the development of our existing sources from our own reserves until solar, wind and Odumbos algae are actually viable.
john, you've cited a perfect example of how easy it would be to wean ourselves of a portion of the oil we import. Good ol' country boy T. Boone Picken's has been lobbying for several years for natural gas as a substitue fuel for the millions of trucks in America. Yet where has the auto industry been on this? Where has Congress been in taking a position on this? If we can't even gain consensus on something like this how will we ever be able to create affordable alternative sources of energy?
Yes the article reads that the orginization has become politicized but did not start out that way. And yes the regulation of chemicals and toxic waste were improvements to be sure. THIS ARTICLE IS ABOUT POLICAL SLANT!!!! I never said I was a republican... The government uses the EPA to play polical favorites thats what I said!!! Yes I also said that the liberals have used enviromentalism as a way to attempt to implement their ideology. That was a statement of fact which they themselves will admit to.
Someone will need to design a natural gas engine that can develop the same torque, fuel mileage and horse power that you get out of one of today's diesel engines. Which by the way when tuned and running properly are fairly low on emissions.
If switching to natural gas was attempted today for trucks you would not only use more fuel but you would create more of that nasty CO2. That is the problem everyone wants the cart before the horse perfect the new stuff before you obsolete the old.
You don't need to tell me that you're a republican. You close-minded like a republican, your rhetoric smells like a repbublican's, and your choice of words and labels ARE republican.
The government uses EPA to play favorites? REALLY? And who are the favorites and what is your evidence. Also, since when is a clean environment an ideology? And if it is, can you give me some names of people other than yourself who embrace the ideology of a dirty environment? I'd suggest you seek some counseling before it's too late.
You infer a great many things.....maybe you need some counceling. I never said enviromentalism is an ideology i said that the left uses it as a tool to further their ideology....big government.
johnQ, you've made my point for me. "Someone will need to design a natural gas engine that....". Where there's a will there's a way. What I said is that IF industry and Congress got behind the program there would be millions of natural-gas fueled trucks on the road today. As long as republicans diss the need for any change in the way our cars, busses, trucks, cabs, and any other engine driven means of transportation we'll be buying oil from abroad in ever-increasing amounts. What's so hard to understand about that?
uninformed, what you don't get is that the Left realizes the importance of a clean environment and is willing to champion it whereas the Right has chosen to politicize it and is willing to reject the notion. Is that so hard for you to understand?
Btw, it's spelled 'counseling'.
P.S. So which picture do you prefer?
The left doesn't give a damn about the eviroment (or the taxpayers) it is just a means to an end. Spelling really??? Why don't you go back to the Bee little susie and let us adults talk ok.
Without the Left giving a damn about clean environment your end won't be pretty.
Btw, it's spelled 'environment'.
instead of working on the problem, the problem destroyed jobs..government sch- ells out huge amounts for saving housing track foreclosures & the banking/ insurance industry..what good does that do if Vast amounts of people are unemployed..Backward thinking has sure put us in a Pickle Jar.......
Ah yes, the atheistic, anti-human holiday celebrating Lenin's birthday, disguised as "helping" the environment. Clueless sheep continue to buy into this notion, along with the 2 party dog and pony show crowd. It's all about control and money, as usual.
Gee, Mad Dog, I guess we should get rid of Christmas, which happens to be on the same date as the old pagan "mid winter festival" and Easter, because it falls on the evil pagan "spring festival". When do you think earth day should be, in the middle of winter? Oh, of course, you don't think there should be such a thing, because anything that doesn't turn a profit should be ignored or broken up by riot police.
Mad Dog:
You really need to get out more. In fact, I would challenge you to find a single Russian migrant living here now who would have made some ridiculous connection to Lenin's Birthday. In truth, they are most grateful for Reagan's mention of "tearing down" that stupid wall in East Berlin, and you are insulting their intelligence if not your own, by suggesting that there is any connection.
What news source is feeding you this garbage?
nightwalker, good ideas. We don't bother with those holidays with the pagan ties anyway. Just another day to us.
Kasey, wake up and do some research on the founding of "earth day". Laughable that so many are clueless lemmings, led around by the nose by the media. Ignorance sure must be bliss. Thanks for the laugh. Off to harvest some more of mother gaia's children to burn in the wood stove. Enjoy the rest of the day comrade.
I was around in '72 and working in industry. For all his faults, Richard Nixon was the Environmental President. Under his watch, EPA was formed and major legislation enacted, chief ones being Clean Water Act and Clean Air Act. Those led to significant cleanups.
Today, I'm dismayed when I see the TV ads by the American Lung Association with those heart-tugging pictures of asthmatic kids who can't breathe because the air is so dirty. Oh come now!!! I was born at a time when coal was burned to provide heat in homes and Pittsburgh's skies were red at night from the many steel mills and coke plants in the area. These days, virtually every home is heated by natural gas and the steel mills and coke plants are mostly gone. Those that remain have pollution control. In my lifetime in this urban setting, the air has never been cleaner.
So, I wonder...why is there an explosion of asthmatic kids as the TV ads suggest. How did we ever survive the bad old days? Maybe there is another agenda at play. What is at work here is the law of diminishing returns. Removing the first 95% of pollution was relatively easy. It's the last 4% that will be ever so costly. And the final 1%? It will never happen.
Maybe EPA needs to answer this question... why are we evolving legions of asthmatic kids?
Perhaps when the EPA funded the lung association they decided to work together.
junkscience.com/2011/03/23/epa-pays-american-lung-association-to-attack-gop/
When your trying to regulate CO2 a plant food you have to wonder?
Especially since the global temperatures have not increased since 1997. But Co2 has. Another point the US production of CO2 has decreased since the crash. Seems the US EPA should move to China and give them a hand.
www.real-science.com/arctic-ice-area-approaching-abnormally-high-range
By the way the ice caps are both fine. Has nothing to do with the EPA
anna, you obviously haven't seen satellite views of the ice caps recently, have you. One thing that's common to you deniers is that at certain times of the season the Arctic cap appears to be larger where in fact it's thickness has been dramatically depleted. Oh, I just remembered that people like yourself will reject any science, regardless of how much research is put in front of you. Have a nice life.
Actually I have. You need to quit looking at 2005 my friend.
Unless your telling me NORSEX is now lying. If you bother checking out the link it is your own sat data.
Get a life move on every prediction made by your green camp has failed miserably. Time for you to find a new religion. Leave science to true scientist and not those that claimed global cooling in the 70's as your founders.
By the way Funding for this UN championed global warming farce was thousand of times higher then any skeptic scientist ever received. But like all religious Zealots you have not and will not understand the truth untill it hits you in the butt. What they taught you in school was a lie. What they didn't teach you was how to use critical thinking. Try it sometime it will do wonders for your life.
This planet will have a far worse time dealing with the coming cooling then your fake warming. Cooling limits crop production and will cause famine. As it has done in history before. Warming on the other hand is great for crops as is a increase in CO2 a plant food. Because plants were starving for CO2 they left leave pores open to get more. This cause them to lose more water. This stresses plants. An increase in CO2 allows them to close pore size losing less water and less stress is a result.
Look up Maunder Minimum and learn some history. Learn what is coming to your planet.....
Then if you want to know why read this link.
ajw.asahi.com/article/behind_news/social_affairs/AJ201204200075
Enjoy the cold and do not toss your winter coat....
Be glad you do have fossil fuels to warm your house.
Anna, here's your inconvenient truth. NASA photos taken in 2012.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57414522/as-arctic-ice-cap-melts-a-new-cold-war/
Anna:
That's the best you have? Global warming is good for plants? The Swede who discovered global warming in the 1880's was just like you. He had some notion that somehow, Sweden would make out well because of it.
Talk about narrow perspective. The rest of us plan on hanging out here a while longer, and you are not helping.
Anna is repeating nonsense she read on denier websites. They're big fans of misrepresenting data and taking quotes out of context. The very fact that she's saying the ice caps (including arctic summer sea ice) are not melting is an outright lie. There's absolutely no question that we've seen a dramatic reduction in arctic summer sea ice.
Anna, CO2 is needed for plant growth, but so is water. However, nobody argues that a massive flood would be very good for agriculture, and that's ironically what's happening and will continue to happen with greater intensity around the world if we continue on our path.
I have a solution, let's keep the EPA and get rid of the republicans.
tooelemom, I think you've hit upon a great idea!
best idea i've heard in ages...
Such hate you have. Perhaps you should burn all the skeptic houses down also?
That was already suggested by your side.
The EPA "jumped the shark" a few years ago by climbing into bed with the leftist radicals who took over the environmental movement 20 years or so back.
They should stick to regulating toxic emissions and punishing those who fail to follow existing environmental regulations and illegally dump poison into the environment, instead of seeking to regulate a natural substance (CO2) and expand their reach beyond any reasonable limit.
Xray:
So there is the rigged science argument, and the scandal argument, which you are trying tonight on this little chalkboard. Too much fun for a Saturday night....
Try breathing CO2 in large quantities. It would kill you, hence it is a toxic substance to you. There is a reason our bodies expel CO2 instead of breathing it in.
Around 20,000 years ago an ice age ended. That's an eye blink in earth/geologic time. Science has been unable to explain to me how such an ice age got started, or why it went away.
But take the last 250 years, from the first water wheel to the last Toyota to leave the assembly line, and somehow science has picked up a pattern. Rising CO2 levels. Answer: give EPA a CO2 meter and shut down the remaining industry on this continent.
So as I sit typing here in my house made of sticks, I find that I miss the forests. May be we could put the forests back. I think we're smart enough now to have industry and forests. And who knows, CO2 levels might fall.
The last 5000 years of historic record show that every place we used to live is a desert. We never put the forests back, we just move on to greener places. Now that we've run out of greener places...We can debate whether the ice caps melting, is just the last part of the ICE AGE falling away or that we have a more personal problem. But the forests must be replaced. Without this one sensible act, the debate is without merit.
Earth Day is about getting the message out to people that we can help our environment recover from the harm that people, industry, and corporate policy are causing to our environment. I pray that they take this message to heart before our planet becomes a barren wasteland and the cities that stand upon it our tombstone.We must find a balance that allows both us and the planet to benefit one another and thrive instead of mankind acting as a virus that leaves nothing but death and destruction in our wake.
Wow did you cut and paste that all by yourself?? Oh it will go up 200 parts per million (we think, based on phony computer models that do not take into account 1000s of other variables)....the sky is falling...quick raise taxes and give us more control over everything. You poor brainwashed fools. There is not one shred of real data in your articles where did you get it?? Its bs you sheeple just go on believing whatever you are told without questioning it once. Just a bunch of false, blanket statements....pathetic. Even your "scientists" refer to the connection between CO2 and temperature "complicated" (which means they can't explain it in any terms) There is no historic connection with CO2 levels and temperature check it out for yourself.
http://www.sciencebits.com/IceCoreTruth
uninformed, the truth hurts, doesn't it.
Smoking guns for human contribution to CO2 in the atmosphere:
-Isotopic analysis of carbon shows that the source of increasing carbon in the atmosphere is primarily from human emissions.
-There are no other known plausible arguments to explain modern carbon levels without humans being the main cause of the increase.
-About half of the emitted carbon by humans is taken up in the oceans and in plants.
-When climate models consider only natural causes of climate change, the actual recorded climate cannot be predicted.
-When human forcing is added to natural forcing observed climate across the globe is accurately modeled.
-The climate observed today could NOT have happened if humans did not exist - it is impossible for natural forces to have caused today's climate.
-Tropospheric warming with stratospheric cooling is essentially another "smoking gun" for anthropogenic global warming.
-Solar forcing, cloud cover, ENSO, PDO, NAO, etc. cannot explain a cooler stratosphere. Increasing greenhouse gases explain this coupling very well and climate models predict a warmer troposphere and a cooler stratosphere with increased greenhouse gases.
More cut and paste time...I guess spelling time is over. I am not impressed!! The temperature of mars has increased as well. How do you explain that Martian SUV's?? The Sun is reaching a thousand year high point in activity, Its not CO2, they cannot even definitively prove that it has increased at all. CO2 is a molecule....it doesn't have isotopes. Stop regergitating nonsense.
uninformed, it's spelled 'regurgitating', not 'regergitating'. How can anyone as dumb as you ever begin to understand solid science when you can't spell beyond the third grade level. Here's something for you to consider: You'll find fourth grade even harder than third.
You are out of things to say and are just making yourself look ridiculous and childish. Better luck next time. "Isotopic analysis" ....LOL Please provide a source for the above material.
I'd be happy to. Pick out any one of the statements and I'll cite the source, which is a damn sight better than you can do with all the idiotic jibberish you write about.
Its only sounds like jebberish to you because its way above your head... Let me explain it to you really slow. Atoms can have isotopes........ molecules can't otherwise they would be something else. Please I would like to see the source for the "isotopic analysis" so I may publically laugh at them as well....
uniformed, sources listed on post #25. And now give me your list.
INFORMED, read the IPCC 4th assessment report.
What a great lesson Professor BNimble! I'm going to forget it though because I did not have a pencil to take notes. Sorry.
Signed,
Jack BQuick
Websters dictionary 4th ed "communism: any politacal ideas or activity thought of as being leftist or subversive; a classless and stateless socielty based on equal distribution; a hypothetical stage of socialism." Have you ever opened a book before or are you still working on your spelling
uninformed, I know you don't realize it but you're repeating yourself. You'd do well to check your previous posts before making a new comment. And btw, it's spelled 'political'. You're a slow learner.
When did the discussion turn to political ideology? I thought we were talking about science and our responsibility to preserve a livable world for ourselves? Oh, wait, that's right. Right-wingers use politics as a scape-goat for inaction.
There is a false belief that acting on climate change will hurt our economy, or create a burden for families, etc. This is all a lie. States in the U.S. that act on climate change have 20% better GDP growth than other states, and are creating lots of stable jobs in the clean-tech industry. Imagine if we did this nation-wide?
Oddly, the first Earth Day was dominated by talk of the coming Ice Age caused by the Greenhouse Effect.
Oddly, the first (1970) Earth Day was dominated by dire warnings of the coming Ice Age caused by the Greenhouse Effect.
#v=onepage&q=earth%20day%20warning%20of%20ice%20age&f=false
Another very inconvenient truth the left chooses to ignore. They took to calling it "climate change" a while back as warming or cooling numbers were not definitive depending on the location of the readings. But hey who needs proof they have a consensus of 2500 scientist (many have since withdrawn or denounce any involvement) who say that its real (I bet I could find 2500 people who believe in bigfoot tomorrow).
imacdaddy: You don't have a clue as to how Earth Day began. Sen. Gaylord Nelson (WI) founded Earth Day and I was a resident of that State at the time and never did he base his approach on such a ridiculous, fear mongering thought. Stop spreading such baseless nonsense.
uninformed, leave it to you to not know that 97% of the world's climatologists agree that global warming is real and of that group, over 95% agree that humankind has contrributed to it. You'll learn all about it once you get to 5th Grade.
Really??? I didn't know that 2500 was 97%, please provide the source for these alleged statistics.
Jack..... you seriously didn't know they thought the Earth was cooling in the 70's and that another ice age was on its way. That's when this whole thing began,that was the prevailing "consensus" of the time. If you had been around then you would have believed it too.
The National Academy of Sciences of the United States. For a change, why don't you give me the sources you base your baseless claims on? Despite the overwhelming number of the world's most credible science organzizations you buffoons refuse to accept their research as fact yet are unable to provide any viable sources for your unsupportable beliefs.
The National academy of sciences????? Wikipedia-
The National Academy of Sciences (NAS) is a private corporation (as in not directly government afiliated) in the United States whose members serve pro bono as "advisers to the nation on science, engineering, and medicine." As a national academy, new members of the organization are elected annually by current members, based on their distinguished and continuing achievements in original research.
Its nothing but a phony political action group. Man your worse than I thought. Is that your "most credible organization"? LOL......
uninformed, as I suspected you would, take lazy potshots at legitmate sources. That's the rule for you deniers. For once, give me your sources, pal! Now why don't you start attacking the sources I list under post #25. It's going to take you one hellava lot of time.
Modern Day Climate Change
warmest years globally were 2010 and 2005 with the years 2009, 2007, 2006, 2003,
2002, and 1998 all tied for 2nd within statistical certainty. The
warmest decade has been the 2000s, and each of the past three decades has been
warmer than the decade before and each set records at their end. The odds of
this being a natural occurrence are estimated to be one in a billion!
increasing trend and the rate of warming has increased in the past few decades.
accelerated rate in the past few decades.
according to Milankovitch cycles until very recently. The cooling trend was
reversed during the 20th century, with four of the five warmest decades of the
2000-year-long reconstruction occurring between 1950 and 2000.
ice thickness.
observation series around the world continues to decrease.
oceans while only a fraction of this heat is stored in the atmosphere.
Therefore, a change in the heat stored in the ocean is a better indicator of
climate change than changes in atmospheric heat.
underscores the point that ocean heat content is a better indicator of global
warming than atmospheric temperatures.
African drought, especially in the Sahel.
in areas that already have drought and causing more rainfall in areas that are
already wet.
the increase since 1970.
more than the past 500,000 years and has done so at an exceptionally fast rate.
activities.
evidence that they took place at a faster rate than the present warming.
Earth will have experienced the same amount of global warming as it did at the
end of the last ice age.
temperature increase over the last 50 million years!
increased rate, after a period of little change between AD 0 and AD 1900. The
trend is 50% greater than that reported by the IPCC in 2007.
20th century estimates of 1.7 mm per year.
sea levels.
levels.
observations show that sea levels have risen faster than previous projections.
cyclones to shift towards stronger storms, with intensity increases of 2–11% by
2100.
expected with increases of the order of 20% in the precipitation rate within 100
km of the storm centre.
hurricane strength remains unchanged.
Yawn
Go back to sleep.
uninformed, since you seem to claim to have so much understanding about the debate on global warming what scientific research are you basing your opinions on? Please provide a complete list of all the credible organizations on which your opinions are based on or shut the hell up.
I have spent enough time educating you, you are blissfully ignorant and belligerently obnoxious. I have provided some links and sources above, you provided none, there are thousands of articles and sites which make a laughing stalk of all your cut and pasties above, go look them up yourself. Its called being informed.....better luck next time.
uninformed, it's hilarious to see that you have refused to respond to any of my questions challenging your remarks. Could it be that you don't have any answers? ANY?
Good luck with your life pal, you'll need it.
Jackie Boy. You should probably provide sources as well. Don't you think? The 29 talking points that you have provided are just that. Talking points. By the way. Earth Day is gay!
Jack-What challenge?? What questions have I not answered??? Um OK I never told you that I like the tire picture better are you happy now???
>For one, give me the name of all the sources behind your erroneous claims. That would be quite enough.
You want sources so I'll give you the sources:
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NOW IT'S TIME FOR YOU TO GIVE ME A LIST OF YOUR SOURCES!
Yawn.......Fart
That's probably the most intelligent thing you've said all day.