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Gregory Bull / AP
The Marines say Staff Sgt. Gary Stein will be discharged for criticizing President Barack Obama on Facebook. He has since apologized to the president.
Sgt. Gary Stein, the 26-year-old Marine who learned Wednesday he would be discharged for his online comments criticizing President Barack Obama, wishes he could take it back.
“People ask me, ‘Would you go back and change those words?’ I would most definitely,” Stein told msnbc.com. “I would articulate my point better.”
On March 1, Stein wrote on a closed forum for active-duty meteorologists and oceanographers that he would say "Screw Obama" and not follow all orders from him, according to Courthouse News.
“Obama is the economic enemy,” he wrote in the post. “He is the religious enemy ... He is the ‘fundamentally change’ America enemy … He IS the Domestic Enemy.”
Marine who criticized President Obama on Facebook to be discharged
Five minutes later, another Marine took down his post, but not before someone Stein knew took a screen shot and forwarded the comment to Stein’s superiors.
Stein had already been warned about a Facebook page he had started in 2010, which he named Armed Forces Tea Party.
“They said, ‘All we ask is that you write that the views are not that of the Marine Corps or the Department of Defense,’” Stein said. He said he put up the disclaimer that day.
The Facebook page, which had six moderators, including Stein, included posts about contraception, gays in the military, pundit Keith Olbermann and Obama. One post included a photo of Obama with the word, “Jackass” written underneath. Stein said that was not his post.
Service members are, according to Directive 1344 of the Department of Defense, allowed to express personal opinions on political candidates, but not as representatives of the Armed Forces.
Last month, a three-member military panel recommended that he be booted from the Marine Corps. On Wednesday, Brig. Gen. Daniel Yoo accepted their recommendation that Stein be dismissed for violating military law.
Stein said he repeatedly told Marine Corps officials he would shut down the Facebook page and not speak with the press if they allowed him to complete his contract, which ends in three months, but they refused.
“I think they’re trying to use me as an example,” Stein said. “Senior officers don’t want to hear, ‘You were the person who let this Gary Stein situation get out of hand. I think there might have been peer pressure among the senior enlisted.”
Maj. Michael Armistead, a Marine Corps spokesman at Camp Pendleton, could not confirm whether this negotiation took place.
Stein, an Arizona native, has been a Marine for nine years and was deployed to Iraq from 2005 to 2006. Although he regrets his post, he still believes his online activity should be protected by the First Amendment of the Constitution. Still, he said he would caution other service members to think before posting their opinions.
“I’m not telling them to zip it up or shut up; be conscious of what you post,” he said. He said he believes the Marine Corps should clearly rewrite the rules for social media in the wake of his dismissal.
In a phone interview Wednesday, Stein sounded tired. A former weather forecaster, he lost his security clearance and started working as a scheduler on a rifle range at Camp Pendleton. He said his wife’s grandmother died Tuesday night and he was diagnosed Monday with a throat disease. He said the Marine Corps is waiting to discharge him so that he can go through treatment.
“It’s been a rough day,” Stein said. “I’m disappointed. Not only in the Marine Corps, but in myself.”
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He said he plans to go through treatment and tend to his wife and 4-year-old daughter. He has been a licensed real estate agent for two years; last night he posted a house for sale on his personal Facebook page.
He also wrote on Facebook that he would not accept racist or vulgar posts.
“I will ban you and you will never be on the page again,” he said.
And he said he has also apologized to the president.
“If he was in front of me right now, I would salute him, say, ‘Yes, Mr. President, No, Mr. President,’ and when I walked away, I would still disagree with his policies. But those are two separate things.”
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The problem with the disconnect with many civilians on this issue is that in the last 30 years or so only 1% of Americans have served in the military. Remember that there has been no draft since Vietnam so anyone that has enlisted did it on their own accord and with the knowledge of the rules..You don't have the same rights and there are good reasons... Men and women who have served understand why this Marine is being discharged..and rightfully so...
Not all of the people in the military agree with your opinion PDug19.
There are very good reasons for following orders without question...but all of you say that you don't have to follow "unlawful orders."
Please define that for me; because if you follow without question then you will never NOT follow an order, unlawful or not.
Kathyern,
That goes without saying, but with out a doubt most military past and present would agree this guy went over the line. He is the type that would be dangerous in a combat scenario, if you have never been there you wouldn't get it..
We have heard from many Marines that his actions were unacceptable and none of you would do a similar thing to your employer and not expect repercussions. Why is this discussion still going on and why are some continuing to defend him?
the simple fact of the matter is that you are not allowed to talk bad about your commander in chief if you are in the military. YOU JUST AREN'T ALLOWED. it has ALWAYS been that way. I have a close friend who joined the military; he was as anti-obama as one could possibly be. when he came home from boot camp, he even refused to talk bad in any way about obama. i was shocked. but that is how it is. there's rules in the military, and part of me is glad this is one.
When you join the USA military are no longer covered by the constitution. You fall under the U.C.M.J. [ THE UNIFORMED CODE OF MILITARY JUSTICE]. All Non-Commisioned Officers and soldiers in the Military are made aware of this fact in the service.
This has nothing to do with freedom of speech. Calling your boss a liar will get you fired most everytime and anywhere! Openly stating that you will do as you please and not as you are told is not smart for any employee in any business. The part that bothers me this idiot had access to weapons! Whew, thank God he's gone!!
Would all the O'bama haters say it was cool to say GW was an ass for Afghanistan and iraq and say he's gotta go and I don't wanna do what he tells me to ? More than likely I'll hear you have to because they are terrorists . Isn't PRESIDENT CIC O'bama merely continuing the involvment of this country in these actions because they were initiated by the previous administration ? Did he send the military to the region ? As a 6 year vet if I had told my commander who was ONLY a captain I would expect nothing less than court martial for saying I would not obey him . This is the Commander in Chief ... If you do not understand the heirarchical difference which is measured in quantum leaps you have not served . You do not know . If it was wartime in many eras previous this would be punishable by death in many armies . I myself am pleased with the decision as it makes sense to preserve order and discipline in the military .
Uniform Code of Military Justice.
"Oh yeah, I guess I should have read it!"
This soldier doesn't really know what that uniform was all about when it was issued to him.
maybe because marines are not soldiers.
you sign away your freedom when you join the military, IT IS THAT SIMPLE.
under no circumstances can a person in the militay ever say anything against the president. when you go into the military you are told this.
The problem with the disconnect with many civilians on this issue is that in the last 30 years or so only 1% of Americans have served in the military. Remember that there has been no draft since Vietnam so anyone that has enlisted did it on their own accord and with the knowledge of the rules..You don't have the same rights and there are good reasons... Men and women who have served understand why this Marine is being discharged..and rightfully so...
.
Huuuuuuh! He is a soldier and the President is the Commander in Chief. Which part you do not understand?
What about this discussion do you not understand? No one is saying that he has no right to free speech. What is being said is that he then has to face the consequences of the free speech that he chooses to voice.
Well no. He promised insubordination. He encouraged others to be insubordinate. You actually, under UCMJ, could make a case for shooting him. It has been that way for over two hundred years.
no...he was a marine. another moron whos never served.
Oh it works on you job as well...
Send out a public email at work with ugly remarks about your boss and see what happens...
When in the military, the President, WHOEVER HE/SHE IS, is your boss. Think CEO....
You are not allowed to make disparaging remarks about your boss publicly and keep your job. period...
Its even stricter in the military.
“I think they’re trying to use me as an example,” You think, Sherlock. This so called marine's sorry ass now wants to retrack what he said because as another great sorry ass once said "Check this out bodyguard, you're fired" This has to be the greatest country in the world, one can join it's military and declare one will not follow orders and hide behind the first amendment and not go to jail. Oy bey, Only in America.
He's only sorry he is in trouble, he's not sorry for what he said...You are free to disagree with the President, but as a soldier, especially, you live by different rules. He disrespected his Commander in Chief out right. Called him names and all. So to me, he was not having a productive conversation. He, like most think they going to get away with it. In my opinion he should be put out. The armed forces is about discipline and order...and its for a reason. It's dangerous to have someone like him lead soldiers. And unless you've been a soldier, you probably won't know what I'm talking about. Boot him out..................
this is an example of where our freedom of speech is going so much for all our ammendment rights. if this young man wants to call obama a S O B and an illegal he should have the right to exprss his opinion if obama doesn't like it he can kiss my ass he has no right to be president of the United States as he is not a citizen and Joe Arprio is proving that, obama spends money the American tax dollars on expensive trips and dinners he believes he is entitled to it like he is a king or something. He should be impeached instead of being allowed to run for office again.
Don't know anything about the military, do you Suzie?
Suzie, you don't understand the military. Keep watching Faux!
I have a question, what the h**l has happened to the freedom of speech that this marine has been fighting for ???
suzie and bettdee - please read some of the posts before you comment. Read what other service people are posting.
He still has his freedom of speech. No one said he can't speak - but he lost his position in the military. No one has stopped his speech. That's what so many of you just don't understand. He took an oath as a Marine - he was warned - he didn't heed the warning - and now he faces the consequences - he is booted out with a dishonorable discharge - no benefits.
But, no one said he cannot speak. So, yes, he still has freedom of speech. Get it yet?
We have it. He doesn't when it comes to insubordination.
The freedom of speech we so often defend also demands a moderation of responsibility...you don't yell "fire" in a crowded theater. I cannot, for the life of me, understand why a reasonably educated individual would spew forth such mindless drivel. If you find fault with certain policies at least set forth a rational for your disagreement. This was not a discourse but an anger filled screed...it obviously got out of hand and Sgt Stein paid the price. Personally, I think it's a shame...the service lost a highly trained individual and Stein lost a part of his life. I thank you for your service and wish you well.
Why spew such 'Mindless Drivel?"
Can you spell F-O-X and L-I-M-B-A-U-G-H?
I write this with 21 years in the service - 12 in the Marine Corps and 9 in the Army national Guard.
Everybody in the service knows you can not BAD MOUTH your commander. If you have complaints you can take them up with a higher authority. If the problem is with the president of the US, you could write letter(s) to your Senator(s).
I served under Reagan and Clinton.. Most folks Loved Reagan and disliked Clinton... We did not say we would not follow orders and we sure did not write letters to the newspapers.
Heck I worked with folks that were 1 rank above me that were nitwits... and i never voice my opinion or encouraged disobedience (except to a few fellow Marines of the same Rank as I)
I can't believe that he didn't know better. It was a careless and lack of thoughtfulness. Besides, what was he beef (specifically)?
yes we may not agree on what is said but free speech is key. If you go to Saudi Arabia, Pakistan or many of those middle eatern countries and you talk about Jesus Christ you can be imprisoned or even killed.
I have never been to the Middle East but I have watched satellite TV in Italy, where I saw a Christmas TV special from Syria. I don't know if I'm inclined to believe everything I've heard about Middle Eastern countries.
They are not killing him! He has the right to free speech! Just can't be tearing the President down when one takes an oath as a Marine not to do such a thing. He was warned - he didn't heed the warning - so he is out of the Marines! Dishonorable discharge - no benefits. Like when you are fired from a job if you call the boss names and tell other employees not to follow the bosses lead. Get it?
He still has Freedom of Speech - just not in the military anymore. Now he can yak, yak, yak, and tear anyone down that he wants too - just won't get paid or have benefits. I'd say he got just what he wanted, right?
To all the uninformed folks who are making this a 'free speech' issue, I have some news for you: I was in the military, and it is NOT a democracy. A soldier, sailor or Marine does NOT necessarily have freedom of speech. When you enlist in the military, you take an oath to obey the Commander-in-Chief AND defend the Constitution, however (perhaps ironically), you also essentially waive most of your constitutional rights. Military personnel are considered Government Property, and they are subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice first, and the Constitution a distant second. The UCMJ proscribes a strict set of behaviors and consequences, many of which override the Constitution, so using the Constitution to defend the behavior of military personnel (especially during wartime) is utterly irrelevant.
OH, and since everything these days appears to have become a partisan issue:
I'm no fan of either the President or his predecessor. In fact, I served under Reagan and I was no fan of him either (though I never would have said so at the time). I've pretty much been disgusted with the entire dismal mess that passes for leadership in this country for as far back as I can remember, regardless of what so-called 'party' affiliation they claimed.
BUT I can guarantee that most of the clueless paranoid right-wing Obama-bashers on here would have had an epileptic fit if an active-duty Marine had posted a rant against Bush when HE was President. BET on it.
They have a word for that: HYPOCRISY.
Funny thing is, it wasn't his opinion that got him into trouble. If you read the article, the problem was that he was expressing that opinion as a Marine.
[quote]Service members are, according to Directive 1344 of the Department of Defense, allowed to express personal opinions on political candidates, but not as representatives of the Armed Forces.[/quote]
Contrary to the headline, the guy didn't just criticize the President: He expressed intent not to follow lawful orders. If you're not going to be following orders in, in the military, then you're not going to be doing the job you signed up for and are being paid to do. And furthermore, you're going to be endangering your fellow marines and the Country.
You People defending The Marine, the vets that have posted on this
forum many of them who do not like our President agree that this Marine should
be punished, and that he is getting off way too easy. No matter how hard you
want it to be about politics it really isn't and never will be, The Military
doesn't mess around when it comes to insubordination; he knew the rules, when
he enlisted.
Amazing how so many Americans know so very little about military rules and regulations. Anyone who has ever served this country and worn a uniform knows that you check your politics at door and leave 'em there. You also refrain from any verbal criticism of superior officers or the commander in chief. Simple rules folks, handed down from the Dept. of War (the old name for Dept. of Defense) over 200 years ago. Any responsible marine, soldier, sailor, or airman adheres to and abides by these rules. Violating them can get you quickly discharged. We know that from day one when we begain serving on active duty. If you don't like the rule, no one is forcing you to join up.
I get what ALL of you service members are saying. What I want to know is: Would you follow an "unlawful order"? and what in your mind constitutes an "unlawful order?"
Your playing the hypothetical game... In the heat of a battle you don't have time to know if a order is lawful or not... You best follow orders unless you are talking about your ranking officer telling you to kill another soldier... if your told to arrest a solider you best do it..
It doesn't matter who is President, these Rules have been in effect before President Obama was born and they will be in effect for as long as we have a Military.
The U.S. Marine Corps fired this guy because he broke his Oath, he broke his Word.
President Obama did not fire this guy, the U.S. Marine Corps did...
If there is any lesson to be learned here, it is be very careful what you write down anywhere, especially the Internet and Facebook because it can and will come back to Bite you in the A$$. It is a Permanant Record that will follow you for life and so will the actions Sgt. Stein took!
This will follow Sgt. Stein for Life!
Some Food for Thought...