Social change has its costs. Nobility has its costs. Just because nothing changed doesn't mean you don't try. Better than letting scumbag 1% slide. That said, no reason to allow cops to act like pigs.

You forgot:

Rape? Yes

Drug Use? Yes

Socialist California has become a police state where paramilitary troopers masqueraded as civilian police brutalize the American people. The socialist state, having created greater poverty under the guise of Liberte, eqalite, and fratnite, deploys the paramilitary troopers to suppress, subordinate, and subjugate the proletariats who are struggling to survive.

California's fascist leaders have armed the paramilitary troopers with armor vehicles, helicopter gunships, military-trained combat soldiers armed with heavy machine guns and grenades, and protected by full Kevlar suit. Once called the 'Sunshine State' nearly 50 years ago, California has descended into darkness. California has been insolvent for nearly 15 years. The Golden State has become a fools gold. Record number of cities and citizens have filed bankruptcy since 2007. California's rampant crimes, riots, swarms of illegal aliens, high taxes, and anti-business legislations have driven away millions of Californians to surrounding states. As for the demographic changes, more people have made departures than arrivals.

The housing bust and financial meltdown exposed California as the leader of real estate and mortgage fraud. As the fascist politicians were ripping-off the masses through outrageous taxes and fees, the crooked real estate agents, dishonest appraisers, lying mortgage brokers, and thieving banksters were allowed to scam the proletariates into believing they could be bourgeoisie home owners. Evil California has the highest number of foreclosures, second only to Florida. In the sick California Sacramento 'Let them buy a condo" has replaced "Let them eat cake."

As the number of homeless, jobless, and hopeless increase the possibility of an insurrection, fascist California will resort increasingly to using the paramilitary to preserve the status quo. It is only a matter of time when body parts and blood will litter the streets.

This article is a bit biased:

Oakland police used "an overwhelming military-type response" to disperse Occupy Oakland demonstrators and fired at a former Marine and Iraq war veteran who was critically injured in the clashes in October

and

An Oakland Police Department SWAT team member fired a beanbag round at Olsen, striking him in the head, according to the report.

1. Oakland police used "overwhelming" response to control an illegal mob that had refused repeated legal orders to disperse.

2. The "former Marine and Iraq war veteran" should have used better judgment than "failing to obey lawful orders", something you would think he learned at Paris Island.

3. The SWAT team member fired the beanbag round at Olsen. Yes, that's how "less than lethal" weapons work... YOU FIRE THEM AT PEOPLE. Should he have shot the bean bag into the side of a tree or into a trash can? What a foolish comment by the reporter.

How about this for a Headline... "Report Critizes Vandaouls Mob Creating Havoc"

Nothing like MSNBC trying to shape and influence the news, just like their pathetic reporting in the Zimmerman Case. MSNBC failed to report for a week Martin allegedly assault Zimmerman, simply stating an "unarmed black child was short by a white man", showing misleading photos of a 12 year old angelic looking Martin while ignoring his more current 17 year old thuggish photos. Seems important to report on the proximate cause of the shooting, instead of misleading the public.

While we don't really know all the facts, that key element of information is critical, and was spiked by MSNBC, just as you haven't seen any reports on MSNBC on the Today Show scandal where an NBC Producer improperly edited a 911 tape in an effort to portray Zimmerman as a racists, omitting a key part of the recording simply to fabricate a story the producer wanted to tell.

.

Yes, you have a right to protest. You do NOT, however, have a right to piss and krap in the streets, assault and harass passer-bys on the way to work (you know, those who are PRODUCTIVE and HAVE JOBS), block entrances to businesses, OR destroy private property. IF these fat losers could comprehend that then maybe there wouldn't be a need for police to use force.

Apples and oranges.

The OCW Group was breaking the Law and destroying public & private property. Other Citizens have rights to, not just the OCW Deadbeats. I believe MORE FORCE should be used against this collection of Druggies, Deadbeats and Anarchist. If they don't like working and paying their own way in life they should move to Russia, Iran, Iraq, Egypt or Libya. The OCW should be "FORCED" to pay for the damages to Public & Private Property they destroy rather than expect Tax Payers to pay. The Veteran that was injured, he should have known better than to participate in the destruction of Public & Private Property. I'm a Veteran, but the Veteran in this article doesn't have the "right" to tarnish the service of others by his unlawful acts. Being a Veteran does not give you the ability to break laws and DEMAND Special Consideration, he "Volunteered" to be in the Military. The "Veteran" in this article did a disservice to other veterans by his unlawful acts and thinking being a Veteran means doing what he wants whenever he wants and to whomever he wants. Put him in jail like the rest of the deadbeats.

Well said Richard and Matt.

Overall the Occupy Herd were a bunch of entitlement hungry, immature people. They want others to give them the life they believe they are entitled to. Unfortunately, that was not what America was founded on. It was founded on the principle of Freedom. Freedom to acheive ones own destiny through hard work and good decisions. The rest of us want that freedom to continue, without a bunch of leeches taking from us because they think they deserve what we have, without having to work for it. Time to grow up and see who is really working against that freedom.....

As for this article, John is correct, the article is biased. (Nothing new here) Designed to encourage sympathy for the protesters. Sorry, not working. they choose to break the law, therefore, they chose the consequences.

Hobbes - peaceably assemble includes vandalism, rape, murder, and tresspass? Occupy were all of these things and more..... Sorry, not buying your post.

Social change has its costs. Nobility has its costs. Just because nothing changed doesn't mean you don't try.

Yes, but if something patently does not work, it is time to move on.

The Occupy Wall Street movement excited a lot of positive and negative emotions. It highlighted the large number of disaffected people in our nation.

But it proposed little by way of concrete changes, and it convinced few neutral people of anything, except that the OWS protesters have a profound sense of entitlement, to possess and occupy public and private spaces for their protest encampments.

I don't condone unnecessary police force. But I also felt that after weeks of duration, these protest camps needed to be dispersed and the protests curtailed.

Freedom to assemble is not the freedom to occupy.

*Expect: Definition per Oxford Dictionary. a)regard as likely b)look for as appropriate, "or one's due"

To the Occupiers; Look up people^^^. Reality bites. You get nothing long lasting, nor valuable if it is not earned and fully paid for. In this system you were born into, nothing is expected to be given. You chose your path if and when you went to school and things did not go your *expected {See:^'b'^} way. Either by your own choice of major, or happenstance, it just did not occur. While you were getting educated the ones you thought were helping you {teachers} , did the opposite. They do not work in the real world {by and large},are clueless about what realities awaited you, and you see the result. Your counselors failed to warn you about the tough, unyielding system you were to encounter and again you were let down, plus you got to pay for that experience. So you got pissed and decided your own choices and many of the unintended happenings in this recent history of ours was not to your *expectations.

You then went out and made your "feelings" known, as children do. By acting out, throwing tantrums, and shredding other peoples lives and properties, then blaming unseen others for the carnage. Making your *expectations, these same other people's troubles too. But you do not have that right. Your rights stop at Their Noses, and by laws written to protect all The People, you and you alone forced the police upon you. Peaceful non-violent protest was your right, but you have already proven by your public actions that your *expectations are 'the' prevailing guideposts, to YOU. You brought this purported police brutality upon yourselves. You have denigrated your 'cause', by what We See, in real time.

Think, and then think again about the path you are on. When you commence !**The 99% Spring**! this year, your "Leaders", Van Jones, nor The UAW, will be out in front. They will be 'leading from behind' , like that other failure of a 'leader', B. H. Obama. Once again, you will be failed by those you trusted and thought you could rely on, and you will put your *expectations, in front of reality. But Who will You lash out at, This Time.....,when you are opposed once again by ever-larger, more prepared forces?

Like I asked previously, THINK about what you are doing. Do it for You.

@FatCatGets$700Bil, Errr, California is both socialist and fascist? Look up those definitions. There are similarities, but a pure socialist state owns both the means of production and the means of distribution (like Soviet Russia and the U.S. Veterans Administration), where classical Fascism (as in Mussolini's Italy) is a merger of corporations and state.

Thus, America, at this moment in time, is much closer to a fascist state (pushed there by Reaganomics, the neoconservative's Project for a New American Century, and the conservatives current fight to maintain those policies). The fascist state also incorporates strong domestic spying, a disregard for international laws, a robust propaganda network (such as Faux News), preemptive attacks on sovereign countries (such as Iraq), suspension of constitutional rights at will (as in "emergency managers [municipal dictators] in Michigan, denial of the people's right to peacefully assemble, militant militarism, a robust incestuous relationship between the Military Industrial Complex and government, and much more.

@ willowbrook, No one should condemn a movement and it's message for the actions of a few. Those incidents, if they happened, are often caused by bad people taking advantage of the situation, or by the opposition poisoning the message. Conservatives always see only that which is on the glittering surface and never look below to assess the real message of the movement. That is why Faux News' (the propaganda wing of the RNC) disinformation works so well.

Hobbes' Notes:

the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Yes, you've correctly quoted the First Amendment to the US Constitution. And we saw the exercise of peaceable assembly in the summer of 2010, with the Taxed Enough Already (TEA) party groups. The groups peaceably assembled, petitioned the Government, then left. They requested permits, were often required to pay for police overtime, port-a-johns, clean up cost, and provide an insurance policy.

In contrast the civil and honorable methods used by the TEA Party, the OWS groups simply OCCUPY parks and provoke the Governement to react. These parks belong to all of us, not just for OWS to claim as their own for months on end, preventing anyone else from using them.

The Democratic Mayor of the City of Richmond charged the TEA Party group $8,500 to host their rally, but turned a blind eye to the OWS crowd that occupied the exact SAME City Park, allowing taxpayers to foot the bill to deal with the parasites.

http://www.richmondteaparty.com/2011/11/city-of-richmond-responds-to-our-refund-request/

TEA Party = Peaceful assembly = Sweeping Electoral victories and negative press

OWS= Illegal Assembly and Crimes = Beanbags to the head and positive sycophantic press coverage.

Funny how the Main Stream media slants the news in a negative manner for Republican causes and seems "constitutionally unable" to report anything negative about the OWS movement, to borrow a phrase from the NY Times Ombudsman, remarking on this newspapers despicable one-side reporting

.

Oakland's an example of the coming police state we'll all enjoy if this economy keeps going the direction it's pointing

hobbs what kind of drug trip are you on??? you blame reagan for your problems what fatcat says is right look at california you got nancy pelosi who is an admitted socialist communist you got a state thats so far in the hole it could'nt be bailed out on a bet you think that a bunch of spoiled childern (thats what these occupiers are) can trash public property and not be punished is acceptable Your crazy man or high on THC pally as far as ronald regan goes he hasent been in office in decades... what killed this country is when people were given credit fo houses they could'nt afford and gas prices went high because of the speculaters and online trading.. not reagan not clinton not even bush pal set this country downhill you need to flush out your headgear newbee and stop bashing others and live within your means or get a better paying job sonny or shut up an pay the piper getting into a pee fight with your fellow countryman is'int going to get you far. Its like ol smokie says ONLY YOU CAN PREVENT COMMUNISIM THINK!!!..

@ John-2006106, yes, I recall the Tea Party Express (funded by the Big Oil Koch brothers) rolling to Democratic town hall meetings and fomenting total disruption, disallowing the speakers their free speech rights. I also recall Kristallnacht (may or may not have been tea partiers, but certainly were radical conservatives--pretty much the same thing) where a fascist radio personalty called for the breaking of windows at Democratic Party headquarters, and the little automatons obeyed.

Unlike the right, I don't condemn all the Tea Partiers for such actions, but I do condemn them for being uninformed and allowing themselves to be led by their ideological noses.

I found it quite interesting that when the party was formed, taxes were lower than they had been in the past 40 years. What in the world could have been the difference? Propaganda (Faux News), the Koch Brothers, and a black President. Those were the only differences.

I also recall the holding of the credibility of the U.S. hostage until the President caved and allowed them to continue to their goal of making Wall Street wealthier on the backs of the workers, the elderly and the sick.

It was't the protesters who were violent.

Oh really...talk about DENIAL.

The Right to peaceful assembly?

Where was that happening? It wasn't peaceful and it was an OCCUPATION. Not an assembly.

These Occupy idiots are still around? I hadn't seen them in the news for a while. I was hoping their stupid tantrum was over.

You wanna know the best way to do something about income inequality? GET A DAMN JOB, AND STOP GETTING STONED IN THE PARK WITH YOUR FRIENDS!!

John - Last time I looked we were in America. How idiotic does it sound to say "they got the proper permits to assemble".

What?! A permit to exercise you god given rights? And of course you support that am I right? So I should apply for a permit before I tell somebody to go f*** themselves, yes?

People like you really make me regret my time in the military, What a complete waste of 8 years of my life. Standing ready to defend a bunch of weightless rights for people that only care that the words exist and not the actual guarantee.

@u1022575, You make my case. In the first place, it would be nice if you were to use proper English and punctuation. It's painful to read your writing.

All I can say is that it is obvious that you have no idea what Reaganomics has done to this country. I suspect that you don't even know what Reaganomics is. Look it up. Also, while you are about it, look up the Glass-Steagall Act and the Gramm-Leach-Bliley act and learn why the conservatives are at the bottom of this financial crises. Also, do more homework and learn the true nature and purpose of the neoconservatives (all elected conservatives now follow that philosophy). So, instead of resorting to fallacious ad hominem attacks, learn your history and be informed.

Lot's and lots of rant on here about one sides breaking of the law. People forget there are two sides to the story. Side one the Court Ordered Negotiated Settlement Agreement which would prompt this article. Quit going outside of the small box that that order covers. I am pretty sure if there were reason for someone on the OWS side to be charged the Police would have done that. But apparently there was reason for the overseer of the court order to get involved. That is side two of the story. I am not a fan of shortsighted reporting but must everything be considered shortsighted if it doesn't fit your criterion.

@Bestia Infernale, Ooooh, such shouting. You actually added nothing to the argument against my propositions, but again, made my case.

If you were a real Professor of political science, you would have added a good, thoughtful argument in a civil manner. However, because of your ad hominem, uncivil attack, we can easily deduce that you are simply another low-information Tea-Party type voter.

And, calling someone a "low-information voter" is not ad hominem, it is simply stating a fact from the lack of information you added to the debate.

Hobbes - you certainly must be a troll, since your comments are doing nothing but creating posts to correct your fanciful rhetoric.

1. It wasn't a "few" who broke the law. They ALL did when they trespassed. And no, the other side was not involved. Occupy was showing how stupid they were without outside help. (well except the help of the Unions.)

2. Fox news is the highest rated news channel in the country. I don't think they got there by being the mouthpiece of the RNC.

3. Quite honestly, Occupy was an embarrassement to the American people. They are part of the problem, not the solution. Their actions were childish, and selfish. (It's all about them.) These are not behaviors we wish the rest of the world to assume the majority of America emulates or supports.

4. Their actions do not directly protest the wrong. They should have been protesting the govt. As their "problems" are caused by the govt., no one else. Yelling at your toddler because the dog peed on the floor will not stop the dog from peeing on the floor, and won't do much for the toddler either.

@Hobbes - you might want to research The Creature from Jekyll Island while you're at it. Your crony leftist cabal gave us that which is what we call The Federal Reserve these days. Your crony leftist friends are so entrenched in destroying this country while you pretend you're trying to save it.

Charged with the job of keeping our currency solvent. Doing a fine job of it I might add. Only twenty years after they were established we hit bankruptcy...and we are getting further and further into debt every year.

The only propaganda I see from some of these comments are what was vomited by FAUXNoize and the teabagging Greedy Old Party down their throats. How sad ...

Willowbrook:

1. If memory serves me correctly, the occupiers were on PUBLIC property; not private but PUBLIC.

2. Did you ever see, "Private Parts?" In particular the scene in which NBC radio executives discuss why Howard Stern's ratings were so high? I'm sure you can find it on youtube but, the point being that just because FAUX may have the highest ratings, don't automatically assume that all the viewers are mouth-breathing, knuckle-dragging, drooling cretins like you.

3. Funny, every poll I reviewed showed that most American's agreed with the OWS message while the teabaggers mesages were a big turn-off. And, please - just reading some of the teabaggers signs at their stupid rallies, wearing their cute little Revolutionary costumes and hats with teabags dangling from them, were enough embarrassment to last us a f**king life time; the OWS protesters look like Harvard educated professors compared to the infantile and petulant teabaggers. But, then again, I would expect such bullsh*t from a teabagger who believes that FAUXNoize is "fair and balanced." Dolt.

4. No. Actually, sport, the OWS protests were aimed at EXACTLY who the protests were against. It was Wall Street's malfeasance that cause the economic clusterf**k we find ourselves in. And we bailed the greedy bast*rds out yet, Wall Street still has free reign to continue their greedy ways and all with the inherent blessing of the teabagging Greedy Old Party. You possibly cannot grasp that it was your teabagging Greedy Old Party protectors that aided Wall Street and continue to do so and that government can actually be a good thing. FAUXNoize propaganda at its finest! Blame is so much better to give than receive ...

@ willowbrook,

Trespassing justifies police violence? Yes, some protesters, in my opinion, should have been arrested for damaging property, but violence by police was not the solution.

Your statement that Fox News is the highest rated "news" channel in the nation is an argumentum ad populum--a fallacious argument having the same problems as an ad that says, "more people buy Fords than any other American car." That fact may be true, but the statement implies that Ford is the best car. However, it may be more likely that they simply have the better ad campaign.

So, Faux news is "fair and balanced?" You didn't catch Fox & Friends co-host Steve Doocy asking Romney what he thought of the President saying that neither he nor Biden were "born with silver spoons in our mouths, unlike some people?" The president never added those last words, and he was speaking to a group of college students emphasizing that although he began in a situation much like most of them, he became President of the United States. The point was intended to inspire the students. Fair and balanced?

This sort of "editing" is common on Faux News. These folks get faxed talking points from the RNC. Randi Roads can attest, as she once sent them a donation and let them know she was a talk show host, and she began receiving those faxes.

Occupy was and embarrassment? The Koch brother's Tea-Party Express was/is not? At least the Occupy movement as a whole does not attempt to deny the freedom of speech like the Koch Brother's TPX.

By the movements tactics of occupying command and control of the nations corporations, they are sending Washington a message as well, and a very loud one.

I agree with Howard Zinn that, "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism." I do believe, however, that it should be as peaceful as possible, should never shout down a legitimate speaker, and should never be met with police violence. It is as American as it can get!

@Hakon Montag, as usual, you don't have the full history. Here is what Senator Grassley said after Ron Paul's bill to fully audit the Fed was watered down to protect some corporations:

@Hakon Montag, It wasn't the Democrats who blocked a full audit of the FED. According to Senator Grassley, "Although I would have preferred to include all of the Fed's emergency actions under 13(3), in consultation with Senator Shelby I agreed to limit my amendment to actions aimed at specific companies . . .

"This modified version of the amendment does not give GAO authority to look at all of that additional taxpayer risk. It is much narrower than the one I originally filed, but it is a reasonable step in the right direction, and it does not threaten monetary policy independence."

See: www.grassley.senate.gov/news/Article.cfm?customel_dataPageID_1502=20607

So, you think leftists are protecting the FED? I agree with Ron Paul on this one, as do a great many Democrats. Do your homework.

1. If memory serves me correctly, the occupiers were on PUBLIC property; not private but PUBLIC.

Not true. And even the ones that DID take place on PUBLIC land VIOLATED numerous laws. So what's your point?

every poll I reviewed showed that most American's agreed with the OWS message...

More poilitical BS. First off there was NO CLEAR message. Second NUMEROUS Americans did NOT relate or agree with the OWS. Quit reading polls from your own propaganda machine.

just reading some of the teabaggers signs at their stupid rallies, wearing their cute little Revolutionary costumes and hats with teabags dangling from them, were enough embarrassment to last us a f**king life time; the OWS protesters look like Harvard educated professors compared to the infantile and petulant teabaggers.

Yeah, the way they blocked ppl from going to work. Defecating on police cars and in public areas. Raping and stealing. The drug use. Oh WAIT....that was the OWS not the Tea Party. OWS was the embarrassment.

Your outlook on OWS tells us all how naive you are. YOU ARE SHEEP. The OWS and Tea Party do have some common goals, (stop bailing out WS) but ppl like you are too ignorant to see it.

I note with a grin that faux professor Bestia Infernale had no reply.

Your take on OWS is very shallow, but it is what the GOP and their conservative automatons in Washington want you to be. Propaganda works.

LMAO

Obviously someone can't stand to look truth in the face. People's Park did happen. People were cold bloodedly killed with live fire. They did begin to build concentration camps at that time (actually rebuild old Japanese detention camps...I know, I spoke with the laborers). There recently has been a Halliburton (remember those guys?) construction of what I've read is about 800 new camps. Gov Reagan did finance the birthing of our now common swat teams. You can deny all this if you wish. You can also collapse this post if you wish. It will not magically make the truth disappear.

As I said, we are a psychophrenic nation and your collapsing my post proves it. It was specifically this type of psychoprenia that Rev. Wright was pointing out.

When one's right hand goes about the world doing good, then the ego demands recognition and praise of those actions, while at the same time the left hand goes around the world strangling the innocents and robbing the poor, but the ego denies those actions and gets violently angry when the light of truth is shined on them, I'd say we have one really really sick puppy on our hands.

Hobbes - you have an incredibly large chip on your shoulder and it blocks you from seeing the truth. You really should stop parroting the talking points of the far left, it takes away any credibility you could have in your posts.

If nothing else, Occupy was splashed all over the net, and then it stopped. Haven't you figured out why? Because it was angering too many and they in turn were raking the Media over the coals for their biased coverage. The Tea Party never received the same cushy reporting Occupy did, and when the Media was called out on it, they had to save face. Same thing can be said for the Zimmerman case. When the Media was hyping it as a racist crime, the coverage was extensive. When the truth came out, yet another run out the door with their tails between their legs. This is YOUR Media doing this....and all you can come up with whining about Fox. This type of coverage was on the Mainstream! Even CBS has become a hotbed for Liberal agenda. Walter Cronkite must be rolling over in his grave.

It really cracks me up about "all those polls supporting Occupy." It never happened. You need to read more closely. People agreed they had a right to protest peacably, (as the Tea Party did, despite all the lies by the left.) People, however, did not, support their lawlessness, and that untimately did them in.

1) Hey $%^&*Stein....You seem to forget that these pukes
were DESTROYING Public & Private property along with rape, drugs, harassment,
pooping etc and so on...Helloooo. Did the tea party in their peaceful,
constructive protests destroy anything? No. They even cleaned up after they
left. Why are you such and ill-informed hater? Your obviously one of the few
BSNDC watchers...

2) FOX news has the highest ratings for a reason. They have
as many Lib analysts as conservative ones on their programs. They at least
attempt to give you the opposing point of view. Why don't you watch and get
yourself up to speed with reality you ignorant, far left goon!

3) So you say most Americans agreed with the Occutards? Are
you kidding me? That's a blatant LIE. Why are you so stupid? Do you get out
much? You’re nothing more than a jaded far left whack job! You sound as though you’re jealous of the tea
party because of their success. They made their points about big govt, taxes,
welfare state etc and got people elected to congress to influence change. That’s
democracy in action is it not? Is that what your Occutard buddies are doing???
No, quite the opposite isn't it Stein???
Get real you moron!

4) It's clear from your loony rant that you hate FNC because
most people watch them (hmmm...I wonder why that is) and their ratings are
GROWING every day. That's gotta piss you off huh? Your lies & slanders about the tea party
and "old people" are ridiculous and absurd. They had nothing to do
with Wall Street either way. And the rest of your drivel about them is also not
true. Those are just a bunch of trumped up charges from the haters on MSLSD.
Why would you watch those losers? No one else does. There's no hope for you
Stein! You’re nothing more than a clueless miscreant like the idiots in the
Occupoo movement.

Go away! And please stop voting!!!!!!

@Hobbes - Ron Paul? Oh yea, he's a Republican, one of the real ones. Not a RINO. I support Ron Paul also.

In your attempt to defer my message you completely overlooked that it was the Democrats (socialists) who pushed the Federal Reserve Act into place. Wilson later apologised on his death bed. It was Roosevelt who came up with the "Second Bill of Rights". Which led to where we are today.

But that is what you do a lot of here isn't it? Push blame away from the Democrats and onto the Republicans, whom you apparently actually support via Ron Paul. Go figure, huh?

Maybe you are too entrenched in the whole ""two party mantra" to really see what is going on.

Your take on OWS is very shallow,

Hobbes quote above is very typical of progressive libs. They want to tell me, "I just don't get it....there is deeper meaning that my feeble mind can't comprehend". But they REFUSE to look at the FACTS (ie the lawlessness of OWS). Give me a break.

but it is what the GOP and their conservative automatons in Washington want you to be. Propaganda works.

Yeah...I'm a victim of propaganda, (sarcasm). As hard as mainstream media tried to put a positive face on OWS, I still saw the lawlessness and thug like behavior. Attention Hobbes....pot calling kettle; can u hear me?

People like Hobbes would be better served to denounce the behavior of OWS, and attempt to clarify "the message". Instead, they waste their time DEFENDING the actions and behavior of OWS.

@willowbrook...tell it like it is my friend. You are right on target.

Everyone should read his(?) post above (1.44). Well said and thought out

Dear OWS Oakland, would you have preferred an "underwhelming" police response?

Gee, where did Hobbes go? Just heard that attendance for today's protests have been underwhelming. AND those 5 who were trying to blow up a bridge in Cleveland? Members of Occupy Cleveland. Another member of the Cleveland group, did acknowledge these 5 were members, but in no way did their actions represent the group. A repeating theme, as I remember. They spend a lot of time trying to distance themselves from the actions of other members in their groups. Sheesh!

Thanks Raider.......I wonder if Hobbes knows who Walter Cronkite was?

@ willowbrook, you made a lot of accusations about soft coverage, but backed nothing up with facts. That's normal. You are another low information citizen.

Here are some facts--I know, if facts refute what you want ot believe, you will simply call them "liberal." pewresearch.org/pubs/2116/media-primary-news-coverage-blogs-republican-presidential-race-barack-obama-rick--perry-herman-cain

Here is some facts about your "fair and balanced" Faux News: After praising and even promoting the Tea Party events, Faux News viciously attacks OWS: mediamatters.org/research/201110030017

Fair and balanced? It is shameful that so many on the right have no idea what is going on, but are being led by their emotions and their ideological noses. You are good at RNC-Fox Talking points, but never vet the information.

@ Space Captain, Good points but you really need to provide evidence (direct us to an objective source, or any site that points to an objective source). Righties, of course, will say anything coming from Media Matters or other sources are leftist lies, but these sources give the original source--thus, the right is known by their own words (but sometimes someone else's words when they plagiarize).:D

While I believe the overall Occupy message is absolutely correct, the execution and explanation of it are terrible. Which I believe is a large reason for the venom towards it.

But I will say this to anyone complaining about it, America wouldn't exist without civil disobedience.

Slavery would still exist without civil disobedience.

There would still be gross civil rights violations in the South if it wasn't for civil disobedience.

I'm not a member of the Occupy Movement. I work 50-70 hours a week. I don't think I'm entitled to anything not in the Constitution.

But I do know that this country's foreign and domestic policies are shaped by the corporations and banks that "donate" the campaign and lobby dollars. Which are astronomical BTW. I do know that the only products made in America off American sweat are trash and weapons. I do know that a private central bank (The Federal Reserve) controls our economy, and sets all the pricing and cost of living for Americans. This same bank does this off of credit and speculation. This same banking system make enormous profits off OUR deposits, using that money for investing. At the same time the depositors can't get a decent interest bearing account, AND has to pay all kinds of ridiculous fees and penalties within this system.

I do know Americans are over taxed on the federal level. I also know the Supreme Court ruled the federal income tax un-Constitutional.

It's all right in front of our faces, we're just too lazy to see or too busy arguing over meaningless things like "I'm a Democrat and you're wrong because you're a Republican." or vice versa.

@Hakon Montag, regretted having created the FED? I wasn't aware of that, but if he did, he was correct in saying so. But, you and your fellow righties on this blog are wrong in calling it a "socialist" system, because it was one of the things the conservatives actually like, i.e. a joint government and private cooperation). I've been calling for the federalization of the FED since the turn of the century and especially since the current recession.

I do understand why the conservatives in Congress are against a full audit of the FED, however. I believe it would uncover some serious crimes against the economic stability of the U.S. that would go all the way to Wall Street's biggest power brokers. Thus, a full audit will never happen if the conservatives have the power to block it (along with some blue dogs).

Bottom line: The government should be in full control of public dollars.

Not taking sides or anything, but Hakon Montag, you do know and realize that Nelson Aldrich was a Republican, right ?

I really enjoy reading the comments from folks that are like...kill the poor...screw the hippy bastards..get a job..or they're breaking the law.. hey wake up..inform yourselves about what this movement is about..believe in something other than the John Wayne mentality comments I've been reading..It's like your saying.. Im like a perfect citizen, cuz I've had the same job for like twenty years. I pay more in health insurance, haven't received a cost of living increase..ahhh GFY. Try to actually care about someone else besides yourself or your narrow minded POV.

Hobbes,

People's Park? Long involved story but here's a link:

http://www.strike-the-root.com/massacre-at-peoples-park

South Campus area was a community of highly intelligent but also counter culture students. The infamous Telegraph Avenue bordered it. The "powers that be" wanted to get rid of it but couldn't use the most common community destroying tool, that of building a freeway through the middle. (New Orleans is a good example of that, but there are more) But there was available what was called "urban renewal" where if an area was shown to be crime ridden the state had the option to buy it out and redevelop it. So suddenly there were cops everywhere writing tickets and taking people to jail for anything even if there were no laws against the action. Jaywalking, for instance. Building up the necessary "paperwork" to go lay on the city council's desk. But the South Campus, as I noted, was highly intelligent and knew what their game was. So law students began patrolling the cops. Anytime a cop was hassling someone there was a law student taking notes. The cops gave it up, went home crying with a bloody nose.

But wait, there was a trump card available. The University had imminent domain if they could show a need for the land. So, and this is what really showed me who our media is, suddenly there were stories in the papers and TV about the "overcrowded dorms" and the need to build more dorms. People on the street said WTF, no one wants to live in the dorms. They were about 25% occupancy.

So about 4 of those huge city blocks (much larger than the normal city block) were bulldozed to the ground, but wait. They never had any real plans to build dorms. They just wanted to tear the guts out of this community of longhairs. And so it became a mudpit.

Then the people decided what the hell, at least let's make it pretty and have a park for the children to play. People donated their time and materials and soon there were walkways and swings, etc.

Then in the early dawn before the sun came up the sheriff's dept. surrounded the area and started putting up constantino fence. The people said WTF and decided to demonstrate. And that is when the "troops" came out with force. They say only one person died but I heard more. The spraying of the gas happened. It drifted into kindergarten schools and hospitals.

About the concentration camps it was somewhere between 1968 to 1971 that I knew a man who was working on rebuilding an old japanese relocation camp just outside of Oklahoma City.

I think there is a story here by Jesse Ventura on the more recent camps being built. http://www.jesseventura.net/conspiracy-theory/s02e4-police-state/

One of the ways Reagan came to office as gov was to promise to deal with the counter culture movement that was growing in California. Damn hippies must have been keeping the big boys awake at night. He gave the local sheriffs depts a gold credit card and told them to buy the latest high tech riot gear and basically created little county armies or militia if you will. This was the beginning of what we now call swat teams.

Hope I covered all the points you were interested in.

@ Hobbes

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2011/10/18/poll_nearly_13_of_ows_demonstrators_support_violence_to_achieve_agenda

This isn't exactly what I was looking for, but sure is an eye opener....and doesn't say much for the claims that OWS are peaceful....

http://www.verumserum.com/?p=33085

Here is a rebuttal of your Media Matters drivel...

http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/poll-ows-least-popular-among-lower-income-groups

Here is one with a lovely chart that show OWS more UN-favorable than favorable across various income levels. But, as a side note, you will find as income level falls, there is also less knowledge about the OWS in the income level.

OWS had support at the beginning, and that support has faded, just like I said, as more saw them for who they are.

I think yesterday's violence is ample proof of my opinion. You can keep yours, and the brain-washed folk that make up OWS. I prefer to work with people who understand how an economy works and want to make America strong again. Nothing OWS talks about will achieve that goal.

P.S. I knew you didn't know who Walter Cronkite was. Pity

Thank you.

Was the last administration better ? No.

Just a little different because they always do whatever we will currently put up with....

And I tell you what, the last guy and his crew would not have put up with protests of this type at all.....

They would have called all of it terrorism and there would have been Olsens in every city and more of them....

I think people feel their freedom and are expressing it more because we aren't afraid as much without that damn terror threat orange fear mongering.....

Remember if we didn't vote republican since 9/11 we would be weak and get attacked again......

Now the bad guy is dead and GM is the number one automaker again.......Of course who knows how many are made here anymore.... It is complicated, but I know they are all not made at union wage in Detroit anymore..

I fail to understand how the banks have control over me. I get up each morning and go to work and have my paychecks direct deposited in my credit union checking account. These protests are directly aimed at Obama and his failed policies, which is why the liberal mayors have been cracking down on them.

We all get up each morning, but most of us don't put our pants on backward, Wally.

Why do righties not remember that it was the conservatives who gutted the Glass-Steagall Act which allowed banks to speculate with their assets, exactly one of the major things that led straight to the Great Depression and now has taken us straight into this Republican Great Recession. It was unfortunate that Clinton signed it into law, but because of total conservative control over Congress, he would have been overridden anyway.

Sorry Hobbes, don't let Clinton off the hook for that disaster. I consider myself very liberal, but both Clinton and Obama share the blame on deregulation. I believe even more o than the republicans. We expect the republicans to cater to big banks and corporate interest, I thought the people still had a voice to stop them in the democrats. We were wrong, both parties have sold us out.

OWS was a disgusting shame perpetuated by our president and congress...Just mobs with no real organization trashing city areas...rioting,, using drugs..costing hundreds of thousands in tax payer money to clean up, rapes, burglary, beatings, vandalism....OWS was a disgusting joke....I dont consider myself liberal or conservative but I don't recall the Tea Party ever getting press forbeing a distructive mob

Sorry Dem in Texas-2291575, it was a Republican bill signed into law by Clinton. It was an unfortunates case of either sign it or be overridden by Congress, which was solidly Republican. I think he should have vetoed it, but to his shame, he did not. In any case, it was one of the main causes of the Republican Great Recession. Clinton should have been more honorable and let the Republicans take full credit.

@Hobbes - the entire concept of the "Second Bill of Rights" which included such concepts as everyone has a "right" to own a home...came from Roosevelt. History betrays your side time and again.

So, you don't believe that all people who can afford it have the right to own a home? You didn't qualify your statement, so this is what it means.

@Hakon Montag, again and again, you righties get history wrong. Rooselvelt did not say everyone had a right to own a home. He said that every family should have a right to a decent home. That does not mean owning a home, that means all families have a right to have a roof over their heads (which includes children). I am sure, of course, that you do not agree.

Okay, I must depart this blog, as I must get my exercise. Next time you righties come to a battle of wits, please do not come unarmed.

Space Cappy,

If we are a Jekyll and Hyde nation, and we're split between repubs and dems, which one would you consider the Jekyll and which the Hyde?

I for one would stand up for Rev. Wrights statements. Anyone who can't face the wrongs they have done is in trouble. We as a nation have done some dastardly deeds (for starters just take the biological warfare on the Indians or the enslavement of blacks and the recent one of invading Iraq under cover of lies), and I do believe in God's judgement. It was written in "the book" that the judgement can go down ten generations. Let's just hope the good outweighs the bad in the long run. We have also, as a nation, done great good in the world. Don't be forgetting that.

Glass Steagall (history lesson)

The footage of him speaking on the Senate floor has become something of a cult flick for the particularly wonky progressive. The date was November 4, 1999. Senator Byron Dorgan, in a patterned red tie, sharp dark suit and hair with slightly more color than it has today, was captured only by the cameras of CSPAN2.

"I want to sound a warning call today about this legislation," he declared, swaying ever so slightly right, then left, occasionally punching the air in front of him with a slightly closed fist. "I think this legislation is just fundamentally terrible."

The legislation was the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act (alternatively known as Gramm Leach Bliley), which allowed banks to merge with insurance companies and investment houses. And Dorgan was, at the time, on a proverbial island with his concerns. Only eight senators would vote against the measure -- lionized by its proponents, including senior staff in the Clinton administration and many now staffing President Obama, as the most important breakthrough in the worlds of finance and politics in decades.

"It was more like a tidal wave in 1999," the North Dakota Democrat recalled of that vote in an interview with the Huffington Post. "You've seen the roll call. We didn't really have to deal with push back because they had such a strong, strong body of support for what they call modernization that the vote was never in doubt... The title of the bill was 'The Financial Modernization Act.' And so if you don't want to modernize, I guess you're considered hopelessly old fashioned."

--- Senior staff of CLINTON and many who now are under OBAMA supported the repeal. oops!

FDR (his words)

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or
shops or farms or mines of the nation;

--- Yes you have a right to go out and FIND a job. That doesn't mean that any job you apply for should be YOURS.

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and
recreation;

--- Yes you have a right to EARN as much money as you can. That doesn't mean that any job that you have should PAY what you WANT to earn.

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a
return which will give him and his family a decent living;

--- Called FAIR MARKET VALUE. It also goes with being able to produce enough on your farm to actually support your family.

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an
atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at
home or abroad;

--- Called an open and FREE market. Certainly not NAFTA.

The right of every family to a decent home;

--- This is indeed a big one. Since it doesn't really speculate as to what MEANS this family is going to use to acquire their "decent home". Nor does it speculate as to what DECENT HOME really entails. Note here that nowhere here or in previous posts have I said that any family that CAN AFFORD a home should be arbitrarily denied purchasing said home because of some "issue" such as race or religion or even sexual orientation. Which is what HOBBES implied that I had said earlier.

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve
and enjoy good health;

--- Adequate care is almost always available. But sometimes even people with money do not have access to "adequate care"...what then?

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old
age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

--- Old age, sickness, accident I can easily agree to. Even unemployment, to a degree. But at some point it is assumed that the "able" should WORK.

The right to a good education.

--- Yea uh huh. K-12 is pretty much free. Some people still don't avail themselves of this opportunity since they grow up as a stupid angry adolescent and simply want to party hardy all day.

As for college? Go ask Harvard why they have $31 BILLION in the bank and still ask for people to pay to go to school?

Yale, $22 Billion; Stanford, $17 Billion...

Say Hobbes...maybe you could come "armed" to the next discussion...just a thought.

The spin on the right will never end. First, you plagiarized www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/11/glass-steagall-act-the-se_n_201557.html in your first reply above. Plagiarizing is pure deceit. You can't put it in your own words or at least credit the source?Shame on you!

Second, if you look hard enough, you will see that Brian Dorgan voted AGAINST Gramm-Leach-Bliley. See www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/106-1999/s105 , as did almost all of the Democrats (one Blue Dog crossed the isle).

Yes, Clinton signed it as I said, and I think it was to his shame. I don't, however, know what were his reasons. In the finial analysis, Clinton was the best center-right President you guys ever had in recent years. The only difference between most of your presidents and Clinton, was that he brought about a surplus by raising taxes won the wealthy (a good move).

I needn't address the rest of your postings because I don't have the time to find out where you plagiarized it. My statements stands (in my own words from my own research), it was a Republican Bill and the Republicans passed it. It was Reaganomics on steroids and was a major contributor to the Republican Great Recession.

Next time, do your own work.

@ Hakon Montag, I will say one thing more, you are mistaken if you think the right of a family "to a descent home" means ownership. One can RENT a home. Go back to school and study critical thinking. You seriously need to, and be careful you don't get kicked out for plagiarizing. Intellectual honesty is a virtue, but obviously not a family value to the right wing.

bubbling...they did nothing. They demanded nothing. They had no goal except to say pretty much "life sux". So how does that impact social change? How does that change anything? If they want to protest, then come up with a goal. WHAT do they want changed? WHAT do they want the government to do? WHAT is the end game for them?

Just going out screaming the 1% make more than me is not going to help out. I have been to the DC occupy camp, it is literally a rat infested tent slum. They are accomplishing NOTHING.

Also just going after the 1%...well is not really a great plan. There are part of the 1% who got there from rags to riches, who worked hard, who continue to work hard, who are the product of the American Dream we all would like to believe in. Sending the message, "work hard, make money, and we will slander you and knock you down" is not the message I would reccommend.

If occupy wants to be relavent then they need to FOCUS on their message, FOCUS on their goals, FOCUS on what they want and what steps they believe need to be taken to get there. Until they do, they are just anarchists screaming into the wind.

Gouranga---You will never get it if that is what you are looking for..Everything is effed up for 99% of us....

It is the House of Representatives that need to initiate policy,not a crowd of diverse Americans.....

And the Supreme Court thinks they should rule for the Corporations.......Who are five of them? Ayn Rand's Kids or what ?

The President Is a figure head and gets the final say if they don't disagree with him in a extreme plurality with the over ride power...Which hasn't happened much now has it ?

Gouranga - they only demanded nothing if you were reading the MSM news reports. It's never been about the fact that there are wealthy. The biggest whine I hear about Occupy is "they all have Iphones and Ipads, why aren't they protesting people like Steve Jobs?" The answer is, unlike Jobs, the people they protest against do not create, they plunder. What do the heads of financial firms create? Higher oil prices and fraudulent paper?

You say you have been to the DC occupy and they did nothing. Why didn't you talk to them? You are 99% too. They are trying to make a difference, you are just projecting your own flaws onto them.

The OWS's demonstrations are an inappropriate response to being disappointed with our current situation !

These protest have been anything but peaceful. They are protest manned by confused and delusional members who have a mosaic of confused ideas as to why they are protesting.

I for one commend the authorities for their excessive restraint used in controlling the destructive and combatant mobs. OWS members that are hurt because of this rebellion can just suck it up, it is their own decisions that put them in danger !

Everything is effed up for 99% of us

Hardly. I'm no where near being in the top 1% of earners, but that doesn't mean things are "effed up" for me. Life is what you make of it. The real truth seems to be that OWS is the 1%...... that are disillusioned.

The problem seems to be that the Corporate deregulation that have been made are things that take away from the 99% and make what use to be criminal now legal for the 1% thus taking the 99% out of the playing field to be able to achieve the American dream. It was unlawful to charge over 18% interest for credit cards that were not delinquent and up to 21% for those that had become delinquent but have you looked at them lately now over 50% we have allowed our government to legalize loansharking. We have allowed our government to be our adversary instead of our partner. Changing this is going to take some work. Time to wake up.

Changing this is going to take some work.

And by "work" I assume you mean camping out in a park in New York city? That'll sure show em......

Honestly i can't say that taking up space in a park is going to work but different strokes for different folks.

Most of the OWS protesters were coddled, entitled college kids who didn't even know exactly WHAT they were protesting. There are plenty of pictures that show these nasty brats defecating on police cars, destroying public property and living in absolute filth along with plenty of stories of rapes, beatings and other illegal behavior while the MSM talks about how honorable they are! The Tea Party protests were as peaceful as the OWS protests were violent and yet every night the liberal MSM was talking about how "angry" the Tea Partiers were which just goes to show you how profoundly biased the MSM really is. I have more respect for the Tea Partiers (even if I don't agree with half of what they say) because at least they were hardworking people who protested without being violent, disrespectful and vandalizing public areas.

I am a middle class working mother who will never be a part of the "1 percent" and I don't care. I work hard and live my life and don't worry about who has more than me. It is time these whiney OWS people learned that LIFE ISN'T ALWAYS FAIR!!! Why should you be pissed off at people who went to school, got an education, worked hard and became wealthy....isn't that what the American Dream is all about???? Since when has it become a crime to become successful and enjoy the wealth that comes with that success??? I know there there are some spoiled little trust fund babies out there (Paris Hilton for example) but there are also plenty of the "1 Percenters" who worked their @$$es off to get where they are today! Stop your whining and complaining go to school and get an education. Start at the bottom, work hard and then maybe you can be a....gasp..."1 Percenter" too one day!

I can only pray that average, hardworking, Americans are not taken in by the MSM, Obama and his liberal band of fools, and the OWS idiots who are trying to start some kind of class warfare in America! As for me....I am going to keep working hard and be happy with my middle class life.

Looting? Don't you mean what the banksters and the government are doing to the Amercian people?

Alan, in what way does Occupy do ANYTHING to stop that? They have no plan, no goals, no demands, no nothing. They are just people yelling that rich people make them mad. Want to make a difference?

Buy stock in these companies and VOTE the board out. Look at what Citibanks stock holders did in rejecting their CEO compensation. THAT is how you effect change in this system. The system can be changed it can be turned around but yelling at people in their limos from the street will do nothing. They will sit in there and laugh at you. The day an Occupy group buys a large stake in a company, THAT will be the day these same guys in their limos feel a cold shiver run down their spine.

Same goes for the politicians, you can effect change in a voting booth. Bring in the number and vote out those who do nothing. Do it enough times the rest of them will fall in line.

Sitting in a rat infested tent in a park in downtown DC (or pick your city of choice), with signs all over the place, and yelling, that will never change a thing.

Buy stock in the company and that will change things, ahahah!

Gourange - you mean those non-binding votes where shareholders can deny a raise to the CEO and the board does it anyway? Yeah, that's effective.

We do keep voting the corporatists out.....And then Sarah Palin's cousins and those like that vote them in just enough to block things up.....

And if you don't understand that pissing is some humans form of protest and everyone is not exactly like you......Well your hate will consume you.......Piss can be cleaned....I would call that job creation....If they won't pay people to build stuff and make stuff then the government is on the stick for that one.....Raise the taxes on the rich to pay to clean it up......

Even though vulgar it would garner attention if everyone protesting really did piss at the same time....We could call it Piss Across America like hands across America back in the 80's.....

But everyone doesn't act like that, so stop saying it..........................

If the occupy movements really accomplished anything, there might be some merit to them. However, I see nothing good coming out of these protests. Perhaps its time for each individual to take control of his or her own life, get a job, and get on with life.

Protest is what made America to begin with. If you really want to point at destruction as not being a good thing that leads to change might i point out that the Boston Tea Party. That was over taxation by the government the cargo didn't belong to the government but by an or group of individuals. Everyone in the country at the time probably didn't agree with what was done nore would they have done it themselves but it lead to the forming of our country,

sw philly - "And if you don't understand that pissing is some humans form of protest"

Really? Tell me exactly what pissing in public parks where families bring their children is supposed to accomplish? What form of protest is that and what are you (or occupy) hoping to achieve?

Funny that to a person virtually all of the "occupy" people are avowed haters of anything from the Tea Party. But when you look at it, both want the same thing. Now try and tell "them" that.

If rich people can contribute to lying super-pacs,poor people can piss in their parks..............Like I have said charge the rich higher taxes to clean it up and the pissers become job creators....The poor have spent the last 8 years cleaning up the rich's poo-poo in Iraq or would that be boo-boo or just a plain old Lie by the GOP..

I didn't say I would piss or camp in the park but I believe everybody is free........Unlike most fascist right-wingers.....Look up the words liberty,liberal and the Latin liber......

And if you don't understand that pissing is some humans form of protest and everyone is not exactly like you......Well your hate will consume you.......Piss can be cleaned....I would call that job creation....If they won't pay people to build stuff and make stuff then the government is on the stick for that one.....Raise the taxes on the rich to pay to clean it up......

Why do those who already contribute more to the system than anyone who would ever consider pissing in public have to be punished for the illegal actions of others? Urinating in public is pretty much illegal everywhere, in case you weren't aware. Freedom is wonderful, but this is also a nation of laws.

When taxes are raised in the manner you're proposing, those who have the means to will leave. Your tax base disappears, and you struggle to cut public expenses for those unionized piss-cleanup jobs you've gone and created with good intentions in your 'protest.'

My most basic take away from your post is that because "rich people" have money and you don't, that they should give it to you. Is this correct?

Protest---protest---Speak up---march for your rights--go Occupy...

Occupy a job all day all week!

You think they can just walk into a plant and get a decent paying job? What world are you living in mmhmmdsux? Minimum wage @ 40hrs a week is $300 a week... Why are employers so afraid to pay people a decent wage? If they did there would be more mney moving around and that benifits everyone, instead it gets horded into offshore accounts that do nothing for anyone.

You think they can just walk into a plant and get a decent paying job?

YES. Besides, quit making it sound like many protesters ONLY qualify for low level or factory like jobs. A great deal of the protesters were college educated. So YES...GO GET A JOB.

Minimum wage @ 40hrs a week is $300 a week...

More BS. You're NOT supposed to STAY at minimum wage. It's a starting point, and you should work hard and ADVANCE your career from there. And guess what?....WE'VE ALL BEEN THERE.

Why are employers so afraid to pay people a decent wage?

They aren't. Last summer, I overheard someone at the gym commenting on how their kid couldn't find a decent paying job before heading to college. The father goes on to say, "my son can't find anything that EVEN pays $20hr. Everything is like $12-15 an hr". I wanted to scream..."that's right, bc your son has zero skills and will likely need training. Take that $12hr job and shut up".

There are numerous vocational and blue collar jobs out there, that in addition to paying the bills will also train one for a more prosperous career. Unfortunately most of them are taken by recent immigrants who speak english as a second language bc American youth is so damn entitled and spoiled.

Too many Americans are unwilling to WORK HARD to advance themselves.

Raider you apparently are out of touch with people trying to make ends meet. My wife has been at the same job for 3 years now and she still receives Minimum wage. She is and has been looking for an new job but the problem is around here that is all she can find. I know of young people who have good collage degrees and can only find minimum wage jobs how are they supposed to support themselves. This on top of being single so they also pay a higher rate in taxes. Not all Americans are unwilling to work nor do they feel entitled.

Watch it Gene. I'm on my third job in 3 years. I'm making less now then I did the previous 20 years. So careful with your comments. I have no idea what your wife does and/or is qualified to do. Qualified being the KEY. But if she's at a job for 3 years that STILL pays min wage....MOVE ON. It will ALWAYS pay min wage. Not all jobs come with annual raises.

My point is there are still many jobs to be had that pay ABOVE minimum wage. Maybe your wife needs to get some education or training for a specific field. Again...what is she QUALIFIED to do?

Career opportunities are not that good now granted...of course Obama is largely to blame for that. His failed policies and SPENDING has driven this country deeper into depression.

As for college grads....comes with the bad economy. But I KNOW THERE are MANY JOBS that pay above $7-10 hr. Hell, waitresses make more than that.

Raiders the comment's you just made are ironic as i am myself presently looking for work. Entry level jobs won't hire me because i have to much experience. The jobs my wife qualifies for and has worked in the past aren't here right now either. You think waitress's makes more then minimum wage and there you are wrong. Here waitress's are paid less then Federal minimum and is only caught up with if tips don't catch them up. Don't know where your from and personally don't care I fail to see what jobs are doing has to do with what this article was about. The OWC movement is about Cooperate greed which is hurting the economy there is no overwhelming study that these protesters are all jobless in fact the guy that got shot in the head was working days and protesting nights. The Article is about the findings of an oversight review board that say the police actions were without need and overboard.

Gene...see we have much in common. The difference is I don't place blame on corp America. IMO, our govt is to blame. We have grown the Fed to the point of bankruptcy, and yet OWS wants to blame the very ones employing a vast majority of us. I didn't agree with bank bailouts. But I also don't blame them for taking it. Our govt has failed us there. I didn't like seeing Executives getting huge bonus after being bailed out. We paid for that. But what FOOL in DC allowed that? I mean the politicians are the ones loaning the money. They could have prevented that. Or better yet...allowed them to face the music.

I have no idea how many OWS were jobless. That's not really my point. My issue is the arrogance and sense of entitlement many (not all) seemed to display. Had OWS conducted themselves like Tea Party rallies did...they would have been better served. And their message SHOULD be directed to Obama. But many are too preoccupied with Obama as an iconic figure instead of holding him accountable as President.

Yes, I know the article is about the police force at OWS Oakland. Don't want excessive police force? Then obey the NUMEROUS warnings you were given to VACATE. People who choose to remain in violation of the law will endure the consequences.

Laslty, hang in there. My wife and I have also had a VERY tough go of it the last 3 years or so. Yet, I still stroked a check to the IRS in April. That's part of the craziness.

Yeah cause nobody protesting works....SIKE!!!!!!

Yeah cause nobody protesting works....SIKE!!!!!!

I struggle to understand what one does for "work" if they spend 24 hours per day trespassing and willfully ignoring public order to the point of provoking police action.

"yolk of tyrany"

Don't egg them on...

Philly - Those are the same people that fall for the Left/Right seesaw every four years. I'll agree, they should be extinct however, the government will have it's day too. Once you've played the long long enough, eventually you'll lose. If you really think those kind of people (the government) will give up power so easily, you're mistaken. Nothing short of an all out war will knock them off their pedestals. It's going to come down to the integrity of the military and whether or not they know what they are supposed to protect (the constitution and freedom - not the president, government, or corporations).

This is in no way a threat, not even close. Just an observation based on history and the current state of things.

@John Doe - absolutely.

All out war would be faster....But I believe that war was already fought in 1776......What about Gandhi and King and Mandella ? That is why I said some in the 99% will have to die....They almost killed this veteran with a less than lethal round( That is a joke because you can die from a beanbag,teargas,baton or taser...

"You are getting shafted too but it is not Obama it is Greed." hahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahaha

Your generation is cooked.

Bush's foot soldiers never use spellcheck

Bush? What has he got to do with anything? Caught up in the past and can't let it go?

What he has to do with this is reminding everyone how much he screwed up....He is a member of the greedy old party and we must remember history forever......I will not be doomed to repeat the past.....

I will not be doomed to repeat the past.....

And yet, from the tenor of your comments I would postulate that you will do just that........ and vote for Obama again.........

Phillydude,

The don't use spellcheck, but they certainly use post collapse.

And who needs the 1st Amendment?

Allow me to help you Letusreason:

Make a traffic stop when there's a murder and rape being committed. Arrest a pot smoker when a meth cooker is baking some goodies in his house with 2 children. Half a** respond to a domestic violence call. Worry about someone shi**ing in the street or a drunk college kid streaking when half a block away a child is being molested or abducted. See a pear in a mans hand and shoot him claiming it was a 'grenade'. Take bribes to overlook crime. Break the law themselves but get away with it because they're 'officers of the law'. Get lax punishments when they are caught. Think you're an 11B in the army when you're really some skittish wannabe who thinks it's just cool to be a cop and loves power trips.

How's that? To serve an protect, right? No much protecting going on when a woman is raped or child is abducted and killed but over 90% of the police force is out looking for people doing 5 over the speed limit.

John - you've simply proven my point. Take your meds.

You've obviously been trained in the use of hyperbole.

Billy dear, where exactly were these riots? Did they precede or follow police violence?

Ricky dear, no riots, no police.

Bill - Please explain the 'riot' taking place at the college where police pepper sprayed the students...

Short and skinny of the matter is. People have a right to protest. The police have a duty to serve and protect according to their oaths the laws and Constitutions of the Municipalities, Counties, State and US. You cannot uphold the law if you are breaking it yourself. Basic principle of the US Constitution The Government Shall make no laws against it's people that dose not apply to it's self. Therefore where as most counties and cities have banned the carrying od guns by it's citizens the Government entities of those counties and cities should have no guns. The state and federal governments haven't done that. You can't enforce the law when you are breaking it yourself.

Looks like to don't have to be in the 'Army' to be an idiot...

Dept. of the Army, Dept. of the Navy - hmm, I can see how it could be hard for some....

Referencing the incorrect military nomenclature does not make one an 'idiot' rather just someone not educated in the finer points of military language and organization. I'll bet you'd take offense if he called Olsen a "soldier" too...

sooo...if it's not a news story, then why did you feel compelled to register your distracting comment? The story isn't about what you think news is or should be. Next time, Jax, perhaps stay on topic....or don't comment.

MSNBC didn't write the report it was by a source directed by the court. Please be productive with your post.

this country is full of fools

They "bean bag" fractured his skull and he almost died. Then as he lay there with several people screaming for help, the cops, instead of renering aid, threw a flash bang right in the middle of them. He will live with the affect of that brutilization for the rest of his life.

The acts of OPD in that incident were shameful and dusgusting. I am so glad I don't live in your America. Oh wait...

If the people were breaking the law at the time then why did the prosecutor not find any reason to charge him or anyone else with a crime? The other question is why would the courts have ordered this cities police department to have an outside agency review committee to oversee their activities? Think maybe they are one of the departments that have the we are cops therefore the laws don't apply to us mentality?

Bean-bag rounds have killed..........

can you please tell me what Oppression you are talking about?..because i woke up today in a great mood, drove to work and didnt have to go through any checkpoints and show a passport or have some Gestapo show up in my house in the middle of the night and take my family away...There is real oppression out there in the world today please do not compare what you feel to be "corporate oppression" to some real oppression that is taking place around the world

Oh yee of short memory - I believe the teaparty held their protests as well. With, I might add - a whole lot more people. Yet, they were able to be peaceful and law abiding, and did affect change through voting. Stop being an angry chump and really do something that matters - invent, create a business, help someone.

Yes, yee of short memory... They were also called Terrorists by many top Democrats, along with their so called "Journalist" sympathizers.. in a way that would have made Joseph Goebbels proud.

Point is Mark - no violent tear gassing was warranted. And yes, the Democrats hated it and lost control of the House. Now that is hope and change.

Mhmmdsux... That was not directed towards you...it was directed towards the yee of short memory..The one who forgot the UnAmerican Democrat's Intolerance of Protest..

The only reason the OWS'ers protests are considered violent to start is they are not an organized political party. If they were taking over the parks like the teaparty did wouldn't be considered violent. The problem is they aren't Democrat or Republican they are undecided and want change. As with any protest someone has to clean up in most cases it's the taxpayers. We did it for the teaparty and there were no complaints and now it's the OWC'ers and there is complaints.

Funny...the Tea Party isn't Republican or Democrat either...just people who are fed up with too much taxes and not enough freedom.

Actually the Teaparty is a group within the Republican party. So yes they are Sarah Palin is a Republican teaparty member.

@gene - no the Tea Party is not a group within the Republican party. This is simply your "co-opted" version of what you have been told that it is. The Republican party for sure has tried to co-opt the Tea Party, but they are as separate as cream and sugar.

It's like saying the OWS is simply part of the Democratic party. They aren't.

Gene - the fact that Palin happens to be Republican does not mean that the Tea Party is Republican. By your logic, all Reverends are Democrats..... since both Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are Reverends and both are Democrats......

bloodthirsty bitch aint ya..people that say that killing is the answer are animals of the lowest order

...would that make people who say "rioting, burning and looting is the answer" the 2nd lowest order? Not that I agree with "killing is the answer"

Now try to understand that the Federal Reserve isn't any more FEDERAL then Federal Express. It is a PRIVATE bank.

wow I am impressed that they are getting internet in the concentration camps now....let me ask you this one question...do you own any produtcs by these so called "corporate masters"? and last time I checked a Fascist society is ruled by one man usually called a dictator and not by a group of evil corporations out to enslave you...

Wait for "his" re-election...

Well then, thank goodness for the 2nd Amendment...

plant false evidence and never be prosecuted - already plenty of cases proved (but never prosecuted)

Exactly. I've been asking this question for years, to judges, lawyers, and even cops:

When a cop makes a traffic stop, you don't like him or his stop, so you give him a hard time, of course the cop doesn't like that, so, he plants drugs on you, or in your car, where does the cop get the drugs? Are they on his possession, in his patrol car, when it's proven the cop planted the drugs, why is he NEVER charged with possession of illegal drugs?

"when it's proven the cop planted the drugs, why is he NEVER charged with possession of illegal drugs"

Can you name a case where this has happened? That it is proven a cop planted drugs and was not charged..

Here I got this from the NY Times: "Nov 1, 2011 – Detective Is Found Guilty of Planting Drug" I mean, does that totally blow your world apart? Something that you just knew as fact, something that shaped your whole view of cops and the world as you knew it, being based on a false premise...

Where do even you get an idea like that in the first place? From an OWS protester? Maybe you are right....maybe he was never actually charged with drug possession...

Mark to answer your question that was the reason that the courts ordered and outsid commitee to oversee the Oakland Police Department.

If it was proved (in a court of law) there would be no reason for an Outside committee. The statement that Proved cases where cops plant drugs (Proved) and are Never charged (as per Moshuluu), is ridiculous at best...

Of course it certainly must have happened...but proved and not charged with anything? How many times, never?

Yeah...we've seen you before. If you have to explain, it really isn't that witty or interesting...sorry.

Stop drinking the kool-aid people

LOL Talk about drinking the kool-aid!!!

Hey, look behind you, theres a cop, time for YOU to bend over!

maybe you should put down your own cup of kool-aid first. you missed the point of the protests. try listening to more than rush during your day.

Just because they ordered them to disperse doesn't mean the Police were acting within the bounds of the law that question wasn't raised by either party in this matter. People seem to take sides of issues without their particular issue ever being raised. The Police are there to protect and serve according to the law not political motives which is what happens in most city and county issues. People seem to believe that because the police are there to enforce something that there has been a law broken but that isn't always the case in allot of instances there isn't a law but an order by someone in charge ( Chief of Police, Mayor, City Counsel Member of City Manager). Because no one knows there isn't a criminal complaint filed Politics equal Corruption.

I don't trust cops all that much. But if the Occupiers trespass they have broken the law, no need to summon the Supreme Court to get a "reading" on that. If they destroy public property, same thing. I realize the world has not turned out the way some of these people were assured it would by their professors but surely you didn't buy all that BS while working on your BS, did you? Many of the Profs have never been in the "real world" how the hell would they know what's out here? They went from MS or PhD to tenured instructor/professor. They kept the gown and they use it every year when a new crop of poorly educated and gullible fools cross the stage. Keep protesting while I get in line for a job, good luck. You'll need it with your MS in Candle Making, and undergraduate minor in Basket Weaving.

The republiCON mantra. Stupid is as stupid does.