Now you know where not to send you kids after high school. How is it that these colleges open after all these rapes? That's like 26 rapes a year. Send them out of state if you know what is good for them.

Agree with you, unacceptable! This ridiculous mindset of putting college athletes on a pedestal does little to stop this type of behavior. I'm all for athletics, but not to the point where our daughter's are at risk of being raped due to caveman mentality regarding women.

Rape is the tool of the coward. In prison, the rapists are the lowest form of life, and we had some low forms of life in there.

Sounds like some really lazy ass police in Montana. Get off your asses and do some police work. Catch these disgusting pigs before they come after your own daughters.

I'm willing to bet that the majority of the offenders are student athletes from out of state who are attending the university on athletic scholarships. The school doesn't want to acknowledge that it's recruiting people based on their athletic skills rather than their intelligence.

The closest college town in size that I found in a quick scan of the FBI's UCR was Lansing, Michingan since they apparently do not do the stats for population centers under 100,000. Lansing's population is about 114,000 and in 2010 alone there were 62 reported rapes and another 48 in the first half of 2011 which are the latest stats available. And the DOJ is conentrating on Montana? WTF?

With a wee bit of extrapolation, we have 110 rapes in one and a half years in Lansing with a population of 114K. Assuming a relatively constant trend, this would be 220 rapes over 3 years. So over a span of 3 years, the incidence of rape in Missoula is about 1 in 1,000. In Lansing over the same time frame, it is almost 1 in 500. Now, with this information, where would you prefer to send your daughter to school?

This may also entail violations of the Campus Security Act (federal requirements for reporting campus crime) as well as Title IX, which can certainly justify federal investigation. -

George, I agree with your first statement but that whole other thing is very difficult for any thinking person to even begin to absorb.

YELDARB27, I'm not sure if you're referring to Missoula or the entire state as a "backwoods, hillbilly environment," but for the record Missoula is the liberal capital of Montana.

In regard to the article, there has got to be a better way to comment on the number of rapes in a community than to say "we're on par."

While I agree its unacceptable, isn't there a few pressing issues the DOJ really need to concentrate on right now, like "Fast and Furious," voter fraud , etc?

The most telling part of the article is that the football coach and athletic director were dismissed after two of the football players were accused of rape.

College football is big $$$$$$, and the school or the community want nothing that will delay or upset the gravy train. No doubt that the coach and AD had to have done something to warrant being fired. If there were 11 reported cases on campus, you have to know that there were probably many more that were not reported. Particularly if the administration of the school is actively working to maintain the $$$$$$$$$$.

Parents would do well to teach there daughters that they can say NO. And maybe get them into a self defense class. Also, a personal use tazer as a going away gift for the college freshman is not a bad thing.

Skiddy: just because the GOP doesn't want to believe that women matter, doesn't mean that the justice department can't investigate real cases of women being attacked. The only fraud that has happened has been in Republican primaries.

What are you going to do now that Ron Paul has the majority of delegates in 5 states (guess who really won Iowa ?)

There is a busy perv or pervs out there somewhere.

YELDARB27

Absolutely intolerable. Not only is this a damn shame for the State of Montana, it is way past time that outsiders step in and fix whatever is broken in this backwoods, hillbilly environment, that allows for such behavior to exist and continue to exist. Heads should roll.

"Backwoods, hillbilly environment"?? THAT couldn't be further from the truth. Have you ever ever set foot in the state of Montana or spent any time in Missoula, for that matter? It's pretty obvious you haven't. Why would you think that it's okay for you to give such negative commentary about a place you know nothing about, aside from the few paragraphs in this article.? Yes, there's obviously an issue with sexual assault on campus. I lived in Bozeman for several years where Montana State University is located. It's about 2/3 of the size of the University of Montana (maybe a little less), and the population of Bozeman is also about 2/3 of the population of Missoula (about 55-60K). There were nowhere near 2/3 of the amount of sexual assaults at MSU. The issues in Missoula aren't about Montana being "backwoods and hillbilly", as you assert. They're about a police force not taking sexual assault seriously, which unfortunately is a tune sung by law enforcement all over the country. Take your ignorance of elsewhere, please.

Bruce, You are comparing the city population of Lansing to the whole metropolitan area of Missoula....Lansing's Metropolitan area is 5X that of Missoula. You might have better luck comparing it to Clearwater or Provo....but there are so many variables it is really hard to tell what the numbers mean. What I find most disturbing is the fact that he doesn't know if charges have actually been filed in any case.

80 Freakin rapes in 3 years?? And that's just what was reported! Dumb asses can't get a real date so they have to force a jolly out of the girl. Blech!

Administrators and business leaders say they worry about fallout from the justice department probe and six months of news about sex assault investigations tied to the university.

You would think the "business leaders" and "university" would be more concerned about the victim's! My god what are we becoming as a people when business and college reputation is more of a concern then basic human rights and dignity?

Only one player has been charged with rape. The headline and story are misleading at best. The problem is the University of Montana informed a rape suspect that he was going to be charged. The suspect was an exchange student from the middle east. The student got on the next plane, and headed back home. There was a public out cry against the university's administration. Out of no where suddenly the US department of justice is doing a civil not criminal investigation into local law enforcement. Good guess is that Pat Williams former Democrat US Congressman used his clout toget DOJ involved. Why toget the heat off of the UM. Local law enforcement had nothing to do with UM's coverup. A sane person would think the department would have better things to do than do a civil investigation of rape crimes. Like get to the bottom of who sold guns to criminals in Mexico.

@ Dirp... Please pick up a dictionary and look up the word "rape". Saying "no" has nothing to do with rape. The very act of rape REQUIRES the rapist to IGNORE the victim saying NO and begging to get away from unwanted sex.

THIS is why women get raped. The psychopathic mindset of men that make them blame their victims ... AND that cause them to support, enable and defend all men who rape by saying the fault lies in the females who did something that got them raped.

The act of blaming victims and saying the criminal is the true innocent victim here is indicative of antisocial personality disorder. It means you have a dysfunctional emotional capacity. Lack of empathy, remorse, guilt, morals or a sense of right and wrong, coupled with consistent denials that anything is wrong AND blaming victims while claiming the aggressors are the real victims... THAT is the clinical definition of PSYCHOPATHY (aka antisocial personality disorder).

Psychopathy is running rampant like a plague in this country. Why? Because parents are forcing children to repress their healthy normal emotions during critical times when the human brain is forming emotional synapses (during puberty). Parents teach children to have no emotions and that showing emotions is a weakness. They allow the "Lord of the Flies" lifestyle in schools where the kids get reinforced to have no empathy, sympathy, regrets, remorse, guilt, or any sense of what is truly right and wrong. All kids learn today is "how do I get what I want". Then these little dysfunctional sociopaths go to college and TAKE what they want from weaker girls who are taught that they are equal in society and people respect when they say "no". Parents fail girls by teaching LIES to them about their place in the world. If you raise dysfunctional kids who live in two opposite states of DENIAL about themselves... THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

Teach your girls that men only pay lip service to our being their equals and then go about doing what they want and treating women as lessers.

Teach your boys that they must feel guilty for their bad behavior, they don't deserve to get everything they want, and teach them to have & show proper healthy emotions for others BEFORE they reach puberty and their brains stop growing synapses.

YELDARB27:

I have never fully understood why people seem to think it's a backwoods hillbilly issue, especially since Montana is so far north! This would be more of an uptown high society blue-nose keep-it-hidden-in-the-closet sort of thing, doncha think? After all, they ARE worried about the reputation of a University, complete with high standing educated perfessors and such.

But we both agree; intolerable.

Police are too busy looking for pot heads and have no time for real crime .

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2010/09/14/most-dangerous-college-campuses-ranked.html

Those who are "excusing" this by making comparisons to other towns are misusing the information. This is not about what is happening "in town" but rather "on campus." The above link has a breakdown of college campus crime statistics. If you scroll down and look at the "rape" column, you will see that a university of similar size, like Fordham University, has only 9 rapes in three years... that is a far cry from 80.

What is even more alarming is that the rape incidents were NOT used to determine a school's safety ranking. So those who look at these stats and note that U of M was not at the top of the list may be fooled. The site explains:

Though incidents of forcible and non-forcible rape are available, they were not ascribed a point value for the rankings. Rape is obviously a most serious crime, but the data often punishes the schools that are the safest (encouraging victims to come forward) and rewards the most hostile (where culture or policy suppresses reporting).

Anyone that calls the seperatists in Montana "uptown" hasn't been there. This is a state where residents supported a poacher for brutally killing a local cop and a fed while he was poaching on federal land! Uptown?? blue nose??? The only top list U of Montana makes is the top ten in Montana.

Montana just took a major drown grade in my book... before this I was worried about grizzly bears eating me for lunch.

Any rape is a disturbing crime I agree with that. The thing I don't get is why the DOJ is going to this school/town as there are other's with higher rates than this one................I wonder what the real motive is?

If this is happening on campus as I think it is, it could be a combination of things such as reporting to campus police instead of the local police which nothing is done by the campus police (it is not clear in the story which authories got the 80 reports), the administration could be using the campus justice system which may not be sentencing the accused, or if it is reported to the local cops, they may consider it he said she said, the rape kits if they were taken may be sitting in a locker not tested. This is typical college attitude and it's a shame. I wouldn't be surprised if it is athletes and frats who did this. I wonder if some of the frats are off campus as in many towns now.

Oversomething

this happened on a university campus , and as we all know , universities are bastions of liberal ideology and left wing indoctrination centers , remember only liberals are capable of "critical thinking" because they may have attended a university

Missoula County's chief prosecutor, Fred Van Valkenburg, fiercely defended his office and the local police, calling the justice department probe an "overreach by the federal government."

"I have no reason to believe (police) violated anyone's rights," he said, adding that his office had no choice but to cooperate given "the heavy hand of a federal government that refuses to tell us what we supposedly have done wrong."

Yeah, right. And no doubt the Missoula police and Sheriff are totally honest and forthcoming when a suspect they've busted asks them what he's accused of. Spare me the crocodile tears, pig.

@Bruce

Lansing's population is about 114,000 and in 2010 alone there were 62 reported rapes and another 48 in the first half of 2011 which are the latest stats available. And the DOJ is conentrating on Montana? WTF?

According to the article (perhaps it's been updated since you commented?) it was not the number of rapes that prompted the investigation but rather how the accusations were being handled by local law enforcement.

if you have to ask, are you saying all university campuses are liberal? Gee really? So Bob Jones U is liberal? so sad. I bet you that the accused are either athletes or frat boys who are not liberal exept when it comes to screwing a woman without permission.

Any rape is a disturbing crime I agree with that. The thing I don't get is why the DOJ is going to this school/town as there are other's with higher rates than this one................I wonder what the real motive is?

As is mentioned in the article, the DOJ is there because they received complaints that the local authorities were not handling the problem appropriately. The DOJ is sort of like the "manager" that you speak with when the lower level "employee" is not performing satisfactorily. They get involved when they receive enough citizen complaints.

I realize the written communication skills of most posters on these boards are poor at best but the clueless vapid responses above beggar belief. Maybe you people missed the fact statististics in Missoula are NO WORSE than any similar sized towns! Moreover, for those ranting about the sexually assault statistics in the USA, I assume you are using the numbers bandied about by womens advocacy groups (you know the ones wanting money for their cause). Have you ever looked at the questions they use in developing their statistics? They use questions like "have you ever felt uncomfortable in a relationship with a guy". Crap no wonder they get such ridiculous numbers! If we used the same questions a NORMAL survey would use the USA is an utter mecca for women. Eric Holder is trying to get his boss reelected and he is picking on a solidly Republican state with few voters or Electoral College votes to pander to the woman vote. He could care less if he upsets the Montanans, they aren't voting for Obama anyway! After the election and much false posturing by concerned Democrats, everything will be dropped with a stern warning to local officials and Eric will get back to selling assault weapons to Mexcian drug lords. You people need to get an education into how the world works because right now you have not a clue. Go ahead bash me, I base the value of the bashing on the value I place on the intelligence of the basher. Guess how much I will care.....

@ scooter.... that's probably the attitudes of the security force at the school and the reason for DOJ being involved. By the way, you're probably a rapist yourself if you can just throw 80+ accusations in the same bucket. I have no respect for you, you are scum. Maybe your past girlfriends or girlfriend should be investigated to see what you are hiding.

Someone important's daughter was raped and the crime was likely not prosecuted. That is the only explanation. Missoula is not at all like Lansing, size is not a good comparison. Missoula is fairly isolated and not anywhere near a large city with a diverse population. It is mainly white and has only one industry....U of M. Crime itself is fairly low so a lot of rapes is startling. And it is likely the main culprits are other college students.

SMAME ON MSN!!! Once again, the MSM is using scare tactics and false information to create a sensationalist environment. The issue is not that Missoula had 80 rapes in 3 years - that is well below the national average. The issue is that a Middle Eastern football player was notified early that he would be prosecuted, giving him time to flee back to his homeland where that kind of action would allow him to marry the victim. It is sad to see that this made national headlines and that so many people are up in arms about the numbers, when the real issue is that we need to seriously rethink how we go about prosecuting foreign nationals

It says in the article that the local businesses and university boosters were concerned because of the potential for decreased enrollment rates. So they brush rape under the rug, the Sheriff can't even say how many reports have led to prosecution, all because they don't want to lose local revenue and standing?

Pathetic.

And for all you people that are arguing about the statistics not being that much higher than other similar towns, etc. - so I guess then that it doesn't matter? "There are high instances of rape everywhere, so who cares?" But if you actually read the article, you would see they are not investigating the high statistics, they are investigating the inadequate handling of these reports by the authorities. Giving people a chance to flee, sweeping things under the rug, that's the issue. NOT how many rapes there have been.

I gave up on the vine as a place where folks intelligently could talk issues some time ago, more recently get on for the entertainment value and to see how good I could be at predicting the responses to given topics before opening the comments area, on the permise that the majority of comments would be politically motivated, slanting all info the author's political view, or judgemental and naive, with folks indignantly jumping to conclusions and ranting about how intolerable some situation is, based on a whole two or three paragraphs of (often slanted) information.

Have been coming close for some time, many of the responses here are bringing me very close to the point where don't need to see any more. Have lived in many parts of the U.S., the references to UofM as backwoods and country is way out of line. It is a very liberal school, and even with the low population of Montana is a quality institution, probably in part because of a significant number of attendees from other countries and other parts of the U.S., in part due to the great recreational opportunities in that region. If it weren't so sad, would be funny to compare the residences of many of the posters w/their comments, as I have lived in many U.S. locations, can guarantee that there are a lot of places in the U.S. that could claim the title of the most back-country in terms of being closed-minded and intolerant. Folks should look in their own back yard......

As far as deciding that UofM and Missoula and its law enforcement officials are guilty of all sorts of shady, inadequate responses or other atrocities from this one article...... talk about jumping to conclusions.... If in fact there is an epidemic of rapes going on there, they need to do whatever necessary to get it dealt with, ASAP. But all we know from the article is they are citing 80 reported rapes. From what source? What were the definitions used? How do the numbers compare to other similar environments? Are there one or two serial rapists not yet caught in the area driving that number? Are there political motivations framing or driving this "probe"? A probe should be to get at the facts. When the facts are known, an appropriate evaluation can be made of past and present response, interpretation and future course of action.

One thing I DO know about Montana given years of experiences there is that because of the low population, people are held accountable for their actions. In other parts of the U.S., people cut each other off on the highways, throw temper tantrums at services people just doing their jobs, etc., with impunity, because they can do so then fade away into the masses and not be held accountable. In Montana, it is very difficult, there are small enough numbers that if you do something similar, odds are you will be recognized and remembered. What I see too much on the vine is essentially the same thing; people can anonymously and without accountability (or sufficient information) judge or assert, without the need to ever really be held accountable, intellectually or otherwise.

cat...Once again, please get your facts straight. The law does not require the woman to say no or to try to get away if they are incompetent to consent eg. drunk, drugged, mentally challenged, underage, or in fear of iminent bodily harm (as in threatened with a knife). Your opinions would hold more merit if you would site the facts with less emotion and a knowledge base that is factual.

If this were the DOJ probing into Companies selling the old style light bulbs. Now that's overreaching. Probing into local law enforcement is not. Someone has to keep local law enforcement from becoming unjust. Both for victims of crime, and for victims of law enforcement itself. This college town is most likely just one of many that does not investigate rape enough.

I hope it leads to more arrests for actual rapists.

I heard that they have some openings at Penn State. Just someting to look into......

Say, maybe the DOJ should be looking into the following as well:

1. Rampant administrative cover up of a major, international gun smuggling initiative. I think it was called "Fast and Furious"

2. The use of social media, public protests, an advertised bounty, and various death threats on audio/video against George Zimmerman's life. Last I heard those could be considered civil rights violations as well as insighting violence.

3. The use of intimidation (seen on video) at polling places. Last I heard that might be considered harassment and violates voter protection laws.

4. The use of intimidation, confiscation of materials, and threats of action against a domestic manufacturer while no charges are filed. Last I heard the DOJ went to Gibson Guitars and confiscated their manufacturing materials (suspect wood), are threatening actions against the company, yet no charges have been filed against the company (and the company provided forestry documentation in support of their wood as well as other companies using the same wood). Last I heard there was a clause where the DOJ could get an order to search and seize a property/business if they have reason to believe that charges can be filed against a party. Well, they've had the goods of Gibson for over a half a year, but no charges have been filed. If they had a search warrant, grabbed the goods and the books, wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that charges could be filed in a timely manner?

Just a few thoughts.....

What I really cant believe is: There are some folks on here posting that are more upset with my generalization and characterization of their fine state (and state of affairs) than they actually are angrier over what is taking place there. For God's sake people, I know that not everybody in Montana is guilty of rape but do something for yourselves and clean up this kind of in-bred behavior and you wont have to worry about what others think about you or your state. Stick to the subject, clean up your own house or these atrocities, and then there probably wont be as many criticisms concerning it.

YELDARB27, I was disgusted with what was happening in Missoula at the U of M months ago when I first heard about it. I've never been a fan of the place. It's nice to have you caught up with the rest of us. If it means you'll never come here, maybe it's better that you remain ignorant about the rest of MT. Have a nice day.

Uh...cat...Synapse is a verb. It is something that happens in the brain, not something that is grown. It occurs when nerve impulses pass from one another via neurotransmitters like Dopamine and Seratonin. Just saying "Grow the hell up and quit using your dick as a weapon." would be more accurate. Facts, cat, just facts. Makes you much more credible when you rant with facts. Just sayin....

@Darrel B.

I'm willing to bet that the majority of the offenders are student athletes from out of state who are attending the university on athletic scholarships. The school doesn't want to acknowledge that it's recruiting people based on their athletic skills rather than their intelligence.

Why don't you just come out and say what you really mean and stop being a racist coward.

Just say it. Inner city or poor blacks. Just be honest so your friends don't have to find out later all you really are is a racist pig coward.

@SmartyCat comment #1.19 Did you just pull those numbers out of your backside? Where do they come from? How do you know what the ratio of adult women to girls are in a large COLLEGE town? Are the demographics even remotely similar to other towns that have no college campus in town?

I have a suggestion for you before you get too much more hysterical and pop a vessel somewhere. The incidence rape in the town in question is LOWER, do you understand that?... LOWER than the average in other college towns. Yes, there are way too many sexual assaults on college campuses everywhere. But maybe you should be directing your anger at a place that has a problem that is more severe before you start screaming that no one should ever send their daughters there. Look up statistics for sexual assault in Michigan college campuses. Try that.

"are you saying all university campuses are liberal"

don't see where I infered "all" , but I will "infer" that liberals are indeed at "Bob Jones U" crawling around on their bellies like reptiles trying to get a foot hold , ya that's about right

Montana...."BIG SKY" country, where the men are men and the women live in terror and in submission....and where RAPE is considered to be High Sport......YeeeHa !

It has been estimated only 10% of rapes are reported, if that is true, then the number of rapes would be about 800 not 80.

A police dept. that fails in investigating rapes is a crime in itself. The majority of rapes occur against females and although we are intellectually equal to men; the majority of us are much smaller and weaker than most men. Unless you want women carrying pepper spray, tasers and/or handguns to protect themselves.... then the police need to do their jobs and investigate every report and pass all the information on to the prosecutor.

What is appalling is that they think just because the numbers are in the "normal" range in the country for RAPE its no big deal! I can bet that the police would think it a big deal if someone rammed a baseball bat up their butts! Then lets see if they think rape isn't worth the time for them to find the perp who commited the crime.

Eighty rapes in three years averages out to twenty-six rapes per year. That's one every two weeks, or to be more precise almost one per week while school is in session (taking into account fall break, Christmas break, and spring break). I'd say that's a real problem with a very psychotic perpetrator.

You stated the following:

"this happened on a university campus , and as we all know , universities are bastions of liberal ideology and left wing indoctrination centers , remember only liberals are capable of "critical thinking" because they may have attended a university"

!

#1.35 - Wed May 2, 2012 11:13 AM CDT

yep , that's what I posted ,you aren't a vine posting parrot are you? , because that would be pretty cool

There are a couple of posts on here commenting and speculating on racial aspects. Does anyone on here actually have the facts on the percentages of rapes committed by minorities compared to the actual percentage of minorties living in the state? If so, great, post those numbers, the data can't be racist can it? But, if no one has that data, what the hell are you speculating and making veiled comments about???? Without the data, both sides of this pissing contest look stupid.

My daughter attended Missoula for a year. Drugs everywhere.

So many disgusting posts wanting fake things investigated over a real concern to those of us who have and love our daughters and our wives. Fast and furious was started by Bush and you never mention that. The sample on voter fraud is .000001 so statistically it doesn't exist. Those who posted these ideas instead of concern for a violent crime against women need to re-examine their thought process. I also think those folks are all republicans-what about women, folks, don't they matter at all?

I think that they know it was started under Bush, thats why the hard --.

YELDARB27

What I really cant believe is: There are some folks on here posting that are more upset with my generalization and characterization of their fine state (and state of affairs) than they actually are angrier over what is taking place there. For God's sake people, I know that not everybody in Montana is guilty of rape but do something for yourselves and clean up this kind of in-bred behavior and you wont have to worry about what others think about you or your state. Stick to the subject, clean up your own house or these atrocities, and then there probably wont be as many criticisms concerning it.

More ignorance from you? Geez, how much of this are we to put up with? "In-bred behavior"?? Committing rape has nothing to do with one's genetic pedigree. Rape is a crime of power and control, it's not something that someone's genetics would predispose them to. Although, I'm pretty sure that you just used "in-bred" as substitutes for your previous descriptions of "backwoods and hillbilly". Wow, you're smart! <<sarcasm>> You know what else, my friend? Not one person who responded to your ridiculous and incorrect assessments of Montana and the people who live there said that this was okay. None of us just shrugged our shoulders and said "Oh well, it's just rape". You need help with your reading comprehension (and obviously your intelligence level as well). What a dolt. Rape is a crime that occurs everywhere, and at higher rates in larger cities. I'm willing to bet my left arm that you live in a city with a higher population than any city in Montana and with a higher rate if rape on a per capita basis. How about you "clean up your own house" before you criticize others?

Darthfrodo

My daughter attended Missoula for a year. Drugs everywhere.

Yeah, it's called "college". No different from any other similar campus. You think there were a lot of drugs at UM? Try checking out the University of Colorado where I went to school.

(And yes, I lived in Montana for several years. I'm intimately familiar with Missoula and UM).

Here we go again. No one here has to wonder any longer why there is this whole culture and lifestyle of rape. It appears the only ones able to speak up are the ones that are also in complete denial. It is mentalities like that, that allow this rapist culture to thrive. That's right keep burying your head in the sand about the real issue here "RAPE" and keep trying to twist this story into something different like outsiders just don't understand. The story here is about the high number of rapes and total failure of law enforcement and the citizenry of Montana's failure to act on it or at least demand change. It is not about rape numbers in other states and cities. Quit deflecting and deal with the real story. Keep doing what you have always done and you will always get the same results, of course that might be just what some people want from those areas anyway.

You are "spot-on". Maybe if they focused some of their efforts they are using up on trying to defend the so-called good name of their state on actually preventing and prosecuting rapists, they wouldn't have a reason to have to defend it.

Well, isn't it being taking care of internally? I would say that's the problem!

Read the first paragraph again. The town had over 80, but the school had "at least 11". This headline is painfully misleading. Lets play with numbers!

80 rapes over 3 years in a town of 86,000 is: 0.31 rapes per 1000 per year.

"There is an average of 207,754 victims (age 12 or older) of rape and sexual assault each year[in the US]" (1)

That works out to: 0.66 rapes per 1000 per year. (US pop 311 million)

Maybe the police there are worthless, don't know, but wouldn't surprise me. We will have to wait on the DoJ probe to know for sure, but It seems Missoula's problems are not any worse than rest of ours. Which reflects poorly on the rest of us to be sure. That is a high incidence rate. But at least dig a little bit before we call for blood.

1 - http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/frequency-of-sexual-assault

I'm not saying that the women are lying or that even most of the women are lying, but let's be clear. These are reported rapes not necessarily rapes. If they were adjudicated there would be no need for DOJ involvement. It's dangerous to equate accusation with guilt.

Remember the Dyke and Hofstra rape cases. In the Hofstra case, she had sex with 4 guys. Police assumed that it must have been a gang rape because a woman wouldn't have consensual sex with 4 guys. Turns out she was just a slut. I'm not sure if it's the same case, but I remember another supposed gang rape was only found to be a false accusation because one recorded it on his phone. That would have more than likely resulted in a conviction had he not done that.

I wonder if it wasn't investigated because the police didn't believe it. We've all seen incidents where someone will cry rape and either never get prosecuted, receive a slap on the wrist or face less jail time than their innocent victim received. A false rape charge can really ruin a life. Especially since the accused is not protected by rape shield laws. Your name could get out on the internet and everyone thinks you're a rapist.

Every rape report should be investigated. All victims (including men and including men raped by women) should feel confident enough in the system of justice to report it. Rapists should be prosecuted and incarcerated. False rape claims should be prosecuted also and the penalties should be increased to adequately reflect the damage that could have been or was inflicted on an innocent person (normally a man. I haven't heard of any false rape cases where a man has accused a woman). I'd say that the punishment for rape should be increased except that I often see the sentences exceed the sentences of people convicted of homicide and even murder in some cases.

@robtzu: Thanks for the statistics - sadly, comment sections here are woefully lacking in facts. The latest numbers for 2010 are 0.61 per 1000. www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cv10.pdf

The problem here, however, is not the number of rapes, but the failure to prosecute them.

robtzu

While your analysis is accurate, the story was so poorly written that it's hard to be sure. The author failed to differentiate between the school population and the general population, and the 'at least 11' related to just a few months.

What passes for 'journalism' these days is setting new standards for vagueness and unprofessionalism.

All we know is that these rapes were not investigated. I think people are assuming that no rapes were investigated. There may have simply been an issue with these reports.

I think campuses have to report (to the feds) rape and other crimes even if there is no criminal prosecution or conviction. That comes under DOE stuff I think. At University of ND a guy was forced to leave school as a disciplinary consequence for alleged rape even though police /prosecutors eventually concluded the allegation was not only false, it was a deliberate fabrication. The "victim" was convicted of making a false report. The guy appealed the disciplinary decision but there is a deal about prompt response to alleged assaults plus this was a civil proceeding with a lower standard of proof.

@ robtzu Don't quit your day job. First of all the total population includes the rapists as potential victims... fail. Secondly, the entire population isn't female, nor is it all at a higher risk for rape. Infants, children, elderly, disabled are all LOW RISK groups. So first of all you have to reduce the population in half for females, then you have to realize that there are more infants and children that post-pubescent females. Women typically have more than one child. Then there are the elderly. So after you decrease your risk group appropriately then apply the math you get an alarming rate of rape in that tiny town. When you realize the rate PER YEAR in that one tiny town... and factor in what your odds are of getting raped over a 20 year period of time living in that small town... It's appalling and disgusting.

You can't simply use their entire population and apply math to people who are at almost no risk of being raped during this year. That's not logical or realistic.

@ Partly Cloudy

Get your facts first. Most women who are actually raped never even report it. Why? Because of you. Because of what you just said... that women are lying about rape. Fact: The vast majority of women who report rape are NOT lying because they realize they are going to be called liars, called a slut, told to drop it, and generally put through hell in order to prosecute the criminal who raped them. Only a total idiot would welcome the onslaught of abuse that happens when you report a rape. It's like being raped over and over again for YEARS if not for life. In a small town the pressure to not report is even greater because everyone knows everyone and you will be abused publically for as long as you keep living in that town. So... get your facts right... the number of women who lie about rape are VERY FEW.

Also... Sluts don't give up their human rights by having sex with lots of people. If they are having sex with 10 men at once and decide they are tired and want to leave after #9 but #10 forces them to have sex... THAT IS RAPE and it's a crime. Sluts have rights to say no too.

Now stop dragging your knuckles, go crawl into your cave and think about it.

Smarty_cat you are completely 100% wrong. Men get raped, infant are sexually abused, ederly people get sexually assualted so no you can not throw out the groups that you do not want to consider to make your numbers looks good this is poor stastitics. You make assumptions based upon your own personnel belief not upon fact. In your eyes there is no prison/jail rape, there is not child abuse and there is no elder abuse. As I am sure you are unaware rape is not about sexual satisfaction, rape is about control so does it matter whom is being raped????

Justin...I would suggest that you look into more recent studies on rape. It is about sexual satisfaction--fantasy. It is also about domination, control, and (in some cases) humiliation....but that is what gives them the sexual release. To say that rape is not about sex, is to say that fraud is not about money. Studies have shown that most known rapists begin with a lot of fantasizing about the raping of a woman. The control and domination over another human being are part of that fantasy and cannot be separated entirely from the sexual satisfaction that they receive from the act. There are times when it is just about opportunity as well--a girl passed out in the wrong place at the wrong time doesn't deserve to be raped. These are likely the rapes that go unreported because the woman feels that she was responsible for the rape because she was intoxicated or in some way guilty of putting herself in a position to be raped. Totally untrue, but that is the way many feel. Sad. Never understood why so many men will sacrifice so much and put so much on the line for an illegal sexual encounter--just mind boggling to me.

The DNA of all the police near this school should be tested against that taken from the victims, then you might find out why they can't see a problem...................

Yes, attack the issue of rape & sexual assaults immediately. I've lost a lot of respect for college athletics due to rape allegation coverups.

One case in particular comes to mind a couple of years ago. A young girl at Notre Dame committed suicide when a Notre Dame football player was not arrested after she went to college telling them she was forcibly raped. Athletic Department should be brought up on rape charges too for sweeping it under the carpet.

Businesses and the university are concerned about the negative fallout? They should have been thinking about that all along.

Right you are and yet it happens quite often and worse. I'm not sure if murder is worse than rape or not. In a way it is, in another way, rape is worse. But in Knoxville,Tn, they pretty much worship football and the UT team. Back in the late 80's (I think) there was a case of a football player named John Rollins, a senior starting fullback. He and some thug buddies were party hopping during rush week- the week before the season started- and one of his buddies got into a fight and knifed a guy to death. He dropped the knife and ran. Rollins picked up the knife and sauntered away. Rollins was the only one recognized and identified. The Knoxville police turned it over to the campus police who swept it under the carpet and no one wanted to investigate this murder. Finally, 60 Minutes or 20-20 got hold of it due largely to the family of the murder victim having to hire a private detective to get justice. Once the cameras and news crews came in, everyone was scrambling to cover their butts and the culprit was ID'd but I don't think Rollins was ever charged as an accessory. That is the insane addiction our society- and many parts of the world- has to sports. If it were my son killed, I might have just gone wioth a gun to confront Rollins and everyone who protected him. Outrageous. But no one in Knoxville seemed outraged by the cover-up. They just wanted Rollins on the football field, even though he wasn't really a key

Just to clarify, the 80 rapes in three years is the ENTIRE city, not just the University of Montana.

In this day + age the 'rationale' is this? .... that the incidence of rape ......'is on par with similarly sized college towns, and the county's chief prosecutor questioned the justice department's rationale for its inquiry.

What part of humanity and decency don't they comprehend? One reader pointed out that the school only had eleven (11) rapes. If that is the case, that is 11 too many rapes.

As the saying goes, "It's not the crime, it's the cover-up that will bury you."

EXACTLY Northlite! Which goes a long way to proving that the USA is suffering from a rampant plague of psychopathy (antisocial personality disorder).

Failure to have empathy, failure to face consequences, failure to admit anyone was harmed or is being harmed, and diminishing the human rights of victims as inconsequential...

Those are the hallmarks of clinical psychopathy.

cat...Better go back to the DSM...psycopathy and antisocial personality disorder are not synonimous. Psychopathy and sociopathy are linked, but not all antisocial people are psychopaths or sociopaths for that matter. A personality disorder and a mental illness--both with very poor prognosis for successful treatment--still are not the same. Your analysis could also include narcissitic personality disorder and borderline personality disorder. Can't put everyone in a little box and label them a psychopath--must examine the individual. People have different motives for what they do--and don't do. Still, I agree with you in concept and support your over all assertions.

And it would enbolden the rapists.

Yes, these "good old boy" networks in small towns out in the rural country side enable, embolden and protect each other. I grew up in a town just like this.

One time we had a beach party that got pretty wild and lasted all day & night. The band majorette who was an upstanding, popular, daughter of an affluent local family was peer pressured into drinking hard liquor by her boyfriend and his buddies. Then they spiked her drink with drugs. She was hidden in the back of a pickup truck and told she was having sex with her boyfriend while they all took turns. Many other decent kids passed by and heard her screaming her boyfriends name and saying hot things to him so everyone was shocked & walked the other way... then spread horrible rumors about her.

Nothing ever happened. She was out of school for weeks. By then the girl network got the truth out about it and we all shunned the boys we thought had done it. THAT was the only thing that ever happened to these criminals. Everyone vilified the girl saying she shouldn't have drank so much and that maybe she was secretly not such a "girl scout" and virtuous as we all had thought. It took a long time but eventually the girls of the town repaired her dignity and honor the best we could by voting her for honors in school and showing our support of her. She never reported the rapes. The whole town knew she was gang raped. She was ridiculed and treated like crap for years. Obviously since I remember this after 32 years it was bad enough and scary enough for me to fear that something would happen to me too. And her boyfriend who was the ring leader of all this... A top student we all loved and respected and would have NEVER suspected he could ever do anything like that.

Any time the girls talked about this unfortunate thing we heard girls say they would never have reported it either and say "look what happened to her and she didn't report... just think how much worse it would have been if she did report it".

This is exactly what men want. Not all men... but enough men to say that men in general. We really are not much different than the Middle East. We only dress it up and pretend like it's not there.

Maybe thats where the Sanford PC went.

Exactly, Sharon.

What have we become as a nation? Just the average number of rapes....??

even one rape is to many,these are mens sisters girlfriends moms grandmothers, rape should get real life in prison

Having the same statistics as other towns doesn't make rape OK, but it does lead one to wonder why the DOJ picked on this city, instead of the countless others with the same or higher rates? Is there something about the DOJ probe that this article isn't discussing?

Barry, I believe if you read the story carefully, you will find that the DOJ isn't investigating because of the number of rapes, but because of the lack of investigation and prosecution and an accusation that the police and University ignore sexual assaults.

differnet - thanks

It not the number but how were they handled.

Muir, who said his department would cooperate with the inquiry, said he did not know how many of those reports had resulted in criminal charges being filed.

And the moment he found out that they were being investigated by the DOJ he should have made it his business to find out.

Never be satisfied with being ignorant.

I agree with both 2Sense and differnet, these crimes were not investigated or prosecuted properly because it happened on a college campus where the sports teams are worshipped like gods. Everyone in the town has a finanical stake in the college, so their players are allowed to do anything they want including rape. No matter what title a woman has, she is never seen as important as there male counterparts. The officals both on and off campus failed to do their jobs and they will be scattering like lice during this investigation

@differnet: "because of the lack of investigation and prosecution and an accusation that the police and University ignore sexual assaults." -- Actually it's only the latter--the accusation that the police are ignoring the problem. There has been no evidence that rapes have not been investigated or prosecuted. Read the local Missoula paper; there have definitely been prosecutions over the last three years.

Kind of like constantly telling us that we were under an immenent threat of another terrorist attack. I think we can all recall how it was "Code Orange" for months up to the 2006 election.

Paranoia?

because you are affflicted with the paranoia that is common to those on the right. It's a tough malady - it keeps a person from processing information correctly. Look posts on articles about President Obama's handling of Osma Bin Ladin if you neeed proof.

Why do I feel that this has come to the fore as part of the democratic strategy to control dialog in the next election.

Because it is. And they surely wouldn't go after a liberal state like mexifornia or a college in a city Gay Francisco.

because you're stupid

Montana IS a liberal state.

Yup - Missoula is very liberal and Montana has a Democrat Governor and U.S. Senator so the "liberal campaign agenda" argument is nonsense. As for controlling dialogue, both parties try to do this - it's called campaign strategy. Why do so many people have opinions and assertions before they have actual facts? People must think accurate information is irrelevant. Oops, "think" is a stretch. Vague notions based hearsay and talk radio is perhaps more appropriate. We are doomed with so many "informed" voters running around.

Well, if you want to play it politically...

Montana supreme court ruled that the "citizens united" law was contrary to Montana laws, and therefore it was not allowed.

Montana passed laws against voting with money many, many years ago, when a major mining corp called "Anaconda Co." tried to use their money to change laws in their favor and profit. Could this be a case of "how dare you say no to big money votes? Then we'll get the LAW on you" . A favorite tactic of ultra-conservatives when they have (passed) laws in their favor. And, oh yes, the University of Montana (Missoula) is considered a liberal university.

I haven't heard what happened about the Montana laws, after hearing that big money was pouring into the state to try to overturn those laws.

Maybe not, ( not everything in the world is politics) but like I said, if you want to get all political.... how does this post suit you? LOL

@ Bill... To answer your question "Why do I feel that this has come to the fore as part of the democratic strategy to control dialog in the next election"

Because like the rest of your party you live in a bubble holding etch-o-sketches and think that only your party has the right to dominate everything we talk about.

And so it has happened...as on every thread. Whether it be about a car accident, child abuse, or rape; the conversation turns to politics and right/left slamming. Don't you people ever get tired of that crap? There are so many political threads that you can go to to aspouse your opinions appropriately, why must you turn every thread into a political debate and forget the victims and the families that are sufffering? I don't get it...seriously. Is it all you think about? Are you so filled with hate for the opposing views that you feel compelled to inject your vitriol into every conversation?

Look carefully if you think that MT is overall a very liberal state. It is not. A couple of currently elected officials and a liberal university town are kind of the exceptions. Look how reliably Red the state is w/Presidential elections and a lot of the laws on the books.

If anything, the state has more of a libertarian attitude, w a lot of registered Republicans.

7 out of town? 70%?? I have a very hard time believing that statistic. Granted, one rape is too many but that number pushes the boundary of believability.

Michael, I too have an issue with that 70%. Perhaps you are combining sexual assaults with sexual harrassment. When looking at rape statistics, the vast majority of rapes happen to women between the ages of 16 and 24 (prime college and military service years). So, there is a correlation between the age group that would be in college and those that would be in military service. Very disturbing is the percentage of females raped between age 9 and 16. Once a woman hits her mid-20s, the odds of her being raped plummets. This is probably more a function of the lack of access rapist have to women as they age. They are more likely to be protecting themselves.

The reason why there is so much college rape:

1. Most male children are brainwashed into abandoning the majority of healthy human emotions that other males call "sissy" or "gay". By the time a boy reaches 12 -13 he is lacking the synapses in his brain that transmit emotions like empathy, remorse, guilt, regret and a general sense of right and wrong. The brain stops creating synapses by 13 years of age and you never have a chance to make any more. So they are emotionally dysfunctional narcissists.

2. Most female children are brainwashed to believe they are empowered & live in a fairytale world that doesn't exist. They are told they can do anything that males do. Females are taught that only bad girls get raped and encouraged to engage in risky behavior like dating strangers alone, jogging alone, traveling alone and so forth. They are taught that it can never happen to them by telling them to just never think about the ugly & nasty things in life because it's not positive and it's depressing. Females are groomed to be perfect victims right down to teaching them to feel stupid and guilty when they do get raped. Reality has very little to do with a typical American girl's life. She think she's safe until she's not and then she thinks she deserved what she got... or goes into denial.

A friend told me one time that she had sex with her date but she didn't like it. After some talking I found out she was date raped. When I said she was date raped and she needed to report it she said she wasn't date raped because she let him kiss her and invited him inside her apartment. She said it wasn't that bad and he didn't hurt her MUCH so it wasn't really rape. She decided in her head that it was just like she had willingly went to bed with a guy who wasn't very good in bed so she wasn't going to date him a second time. She actually got very angry at me for saying she was date raped and she told me that was a deal breaker for our friendship because I was stupid and trying to make her ruin her reputation and create drama for her.

THAT is what is going on in our colleges. That is what is wrong. Let's put the blame where it belongs... The parents who raised these dysfunctional people and the agencies who crucify victims thereby sexually enabling the whole criminal culture against women.

cat...I agree..."Let's put the blame where it belongs." Squarely on the person or persons committing the act. Personal responsibility or the lack of it is to blame and nothing or no one else. A concept that does not seem to exist these days.

Just because there are similar numbers elsewhere, DOES NOT MAKE IT OKAY FOR THE POLICE NOT TO INVESTIGATE. Any rape is one rape too many. It totally destroys the victim's life. She (or he) may be able to move on, but it is never the same again.

Colorblind, I agree that taking steps to stop psychopaths & holding them accountable is important but that doesn't solve the problem. For every one you put in jail 1000 more are being created take their place by parents who repress the emotional development of their children.

When you have so many antisocial people of varying degrees in a society they will flock together in order to advance their antisocial agendas and have more power in society to run things their way. Law enforcement is a career that attracts antisocials because it places you above others in a position of ultimate power. While many antisocials never commit violent crimes that doesn't mean they don't wish they had the courage and could get away with it.

So when you have a town where rapes are being ignored what you really have is a brotherhood of antisocials supporting those who have been bold enough to commit the crime they secretly would like to be committing themselves. Using their positions of power they create a blanket of immunity for other antisocials that they secretly identify with.

The only way to stop ALL of it... Proper parenting that teaches a child to enjoy a full range of human emotions including grief, empathy, remorse, regret, and a distinct sense of right and wrong that isn't hazy and based on excuses for bad behavior. Unless we instill a healthy set of human emotions in children they will grow up apathetic and harm others... either violently... or indirectly by supporting those who commit violent crimes.

cat...And how do you suggest teaching emotions to a sociopath that has no conscious? Modeling the behavior just doesn't work. Many sociopaths have wonderful parents that are very attentive and responsible. There are as many theories out there as to why people commit crimes as there are criminals. I, for one, believe that it is a mixed bag. No one thing causes this type of behavior. One that I am particularly drawn to is the sense of entitlement that some people have. If I want it, I deserve it and I should have it. Doesn't matter if they earned it--it is all about "me." There are no simple answers or solutions to the problem of violent crime. You can't just call everyone a psychopath that commits a crime and be accurate. I wish life were that simple, but, sadly, it is not.

“Most male children are brainwashed into abandoning the majority of healthy human emotions..... So they are emotionally dysfunctional narcissists. Most female children are brainwashed .....to be perfect victims right down to teaching them to feel stupid and guilty when they do get raped. Let's put the blame where it belongs... The parents who raised these dysfunctional people and the agencies who crucify victims thereby sexually enabling the whole criminal culture against women.”

Putting those points together from the above post is a bit scary. Apparently most parents are at fault for raising a generation of mostly dysfunctional children that results in an entire criminal culture directed against women? Led by emotionally dysfunctional narcissists in conjunction with complicit brainwashed women apparently.

Does this apply to all societies? If not, how explain rapes in other cultures? How does it explain prison, same-sex, child or women "raping" men or in other species? Sorry, but I don't buy it, hope that life really doesn't have to be quite that dark and am not ready to place "most people" in a mutually exclusive us vs. them, narcissistic or brainwashed victim gender-based box.

Because we as a nation treat women as nothing but objects, not people. Pornography treats women as nothing as pieces of meat for men's pleasure only. Not saying that all men treat women that way, but I think its part of the problem.

Even the best parents who teach respect to their children to respect each other can have their message overwhelmed by the culture that we live in.

Here in Bozeman, Montana we recently had two rapes occur near the college (Montana State U) where the man pretty much jumped out of the bushes, raped the student right there, and took off into the night. He has yet to be caught, but the strange thing is that the incidents received barely any coverage. You'd think if there was a serial rapist running around town that the public would be warned and pictures put up with the caption, "Have you seen this man?" I wonder how his two victims are feeling about that? I know I'm very uncomfortable allowing my daughter to walk around town at night anymore. What are our local police doing, collaborating with Missoula?

I've read in several places recently that men raised by single mothers are the most likely to become crooks later in life. Wonder if there's any truth to that? I hope not. Personally, I agree with fredystairs that all the good teaching a parent does can be undone by cultural persuasion. And America definitely has a culture and tradition of treating women like second-class citizens or pieces of meat. We need to put an end to such caveman ways of thinking, both in MT and the rest of the country. The men obviously aren't going to just stop, so it's up to us women to make it happen.

WorkerBee, went to school MSU, lots of great memories.

As for men raised by single mothers more likely to be "crooks", hope is not true but not surprised if children of single parent households have more issues, and if true doesn't bode well for the future given the number of those children out there these days.

they would not have fired the coach unless something was covered up.

Wade, (WHY) do Men need to respect all women???

larry...Men do not have to respect all of anybody or anything. They don't have to prey on them either.

Pardon me, but your record is stuck.

The statistic you mention would be the most telling one about how the DPS operates in that town.

Sounds as if Muir is in a Psychotic state of perpetual denial.

I wonder how he would react and what he would do if he, his daughter or wife were raped? (Yes men can get raped too.)

Would he push their cases under a large pile of papers, or just ignore his daughter's/wife's screams for help and justice. Sure hope neither of his women were to get pregnant and have to raise that memory as if it was nothing happened---no big deal right!!!!!!!!!!! men??????????!!!!!!!!!!WRONG

Sadly, joe, Montana has traditionally been a red state. If this is nothing but politiking, I sure hope it works. He's already got my vote!

Sorry Joe, but are you an IDIOT for your remark sure was pretty ignorant!!!!!!!!!!

Joe - You're absolutely right. 80 reported rapes doesn't make 80 actual rapes; 80 reported rapes probably means at least 200 actual rapes. Of course, in your mind, women are absolutely willing to make a false report, go through the humiliation of a rape exam, have defense counsel intimately examine every move they have ever made, rip them to pieces in court because they wore a tank top, etc. The reason women DON'T report being raped is to avoid going through these things; they don't lightly invent them, and those who do - very, very few - usually recant almost immediately.

DOJ only investigates when there is evidence of a pattern of behavior or when a single event is so egregious that it become notable. Rape is so commonplace in our society that you would have to find something of a pattern. Note what the Police Chief said about the frequency of rape in Missoula being no more than normal for a community their size.

DOJ only investigates when there is evidence of a pattern of behavior or when a single event is so egregious that it become notable

Unlike the illegal guns that the DOJ trafficked to Mexico that got a US citizen murdered?

Geesh... Get your stories right. The DOJ did not do the trafficking. In fact, it was an INFORMANT of the FBI/DEA. Do you guys even read the news?

Uh, sorry xbonz, but the men are men and the sheep are scared in WYOMING. Get it right. And what women of color? We don't have color in Montana. We're mostly whites, with a few illegal Mexicans thrown in for variety. If it had been women of color, no one would bother posting it as news.

Let's face it... The only difference between the USA and the Arab nations is that American men have learned the benefits of patronizing women so that they believe they are equal when they really are not.

That way the women happily go around trying to actually prove they are equal to men by doing men's jobs, all the while engaging in risky behavior that makes them easier targets for male aggression and manipulation. Then the "good old boy" network marginalizes women & sees to it they have no legal footing.

When women protest and say they aren't being treated fairly the men can say women are given due process under the law and simply lose legal battles fair and square.

This leaves women without a way to argue back and feeling diminished. Rather than deal with the reality that men will never treat us with equality...

Patronized women feel even more compelled to do everything that men do AND still have to do everything women have to do to be a woman... All at the same time... just to prove we are equal to men.

Then men laugh their heads off at how they manipulated women into thinking they are making progress when really they aren't. They still feel just as dominant and superior as any man living in Iran, Iraq or any other Middle Eastern country.

So why are you all surprised when they diminish the rights of raped women? This isn't really news.

cat...I hoped that rant felt good. Most of it was pure cr@p, but if it made you feel better then I guess it was worth it. Most women can do what most men do--not all. Some--let me reapeat that--SOME men may feel and act the way you describe, but not all and not even most. There are some fine men out there and there are some very talented females that work and live in male dominated fields and do quite well--are given respect and not objectified by the men around them. Some may feel dominant and superior, but abolutes are rare. Most are just trying to get by like everyone else. Some males are actually victims of domestic violence on a regular basis and too embarrassed to admit it let alone report it. Come on cat! Get real. The world is not entirely full of bad guys. There are some good guys out there and this thread shows that. There are some bad women out there as well. Not everyone is a psychopath. Not every man objectifies women and not every man is an animal. You need to get a better circle of aquaintances if that is your opinion.

Racist MORON! I live in Washington DC in a low income community that had serial sex assualts for years before the police decided to even put up posters letting women and girls know that there had been more assualts than they thought and with similarities.

WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU HEARD OF A PROBLEM WITH RAPE HAPPENING IN BLACK OR HISPANIC NEIGHBORHOOD? DO YOU THINK THAT'S BECAUSE WOMEN AND GIRLS ARE SAFE THERE?

Colorblind... Obviously you are not a woman or you would know that women cannot do what men do.

When women are ALLOWED to be equal or given PERMISSION to be equal... then they are not equal.

If I walk down a street alone and safely make it to my destination... I did so with the assistance of all the men around me. Male predators are not afraid of me. They fear retribution from the other males around me or by the males in prison if they get caught. So I didn't walk down the street as an EQUAL to men.

Men in general do not see women as equals. They may be forced to behave themselves to seem like we are their equals but in their private lives and when they are talking to other men they do not believe women are their equals. Covertly men act together and separately to undermine women in subtle ways. When they get caught they squeal the same diatribe you just squealed. They say not all men are like that... then they say women are welcome to do their jobs for them any time they want so that proves they think women are equal. Women can't just perform the gender role assigned to them by nature and be your equal. We have to earn our equality by performing male roles or else we are not treated equal. Of course we still have to perform our full duties as women on top of bringing home an income from a full time job. No wonder kids aren't being raised properly then going to college and raping girls.

Your comment proves my point. All a male has to do is be born & do what comes naturally his whole life... Women have a long list of requirements we have to achieve before we EARN equality. That isn't true equality.

And if you think that law enforcement isn't stacked with male chauvanists who secretly wish they were the ones doing the raping... then you are just a liar. Men covertly act both independently and together in order to keep the status quo and keep women in check. The game plan is "Let them think they are equal because that serves our purposes much better than keeping them in the house." But when it comes to the crime of rape... well... the rape kit got lost, they don't have enough evidence, it's heresay, the guys buddies say he was playing poker with them that night, the victim's reputation is questionable, or any other lame excuse they can invent to dismiss the whole thing. It happens all the time everywhere.

Here in Houston they are YEARS behind on processing rape kits. Same crap... just a more metropolitan excuse. Women aren't equal... we are prey animals. Plain and simple.

cat...Once again you are painting all men with the same brush and making statements that are absolutes and absolutes are very rare. I am a woman and spent most of the afternoon using a chain saw to cut trees. I don't have the body strength or shape to use a larger saw--one as big as my husband's--but that is more about biology than "permission". I hunt and have done as well or better than most of my companions--most are men. Still, I need their help to process the game that I harvest. I don't make 50 mile shots for my husband, am considered a "shooter" , friend, confidant, and companion in camp--We share meal preparation. I fish as well as the next guy and clean what I catch. I was a nurse for 38 years and find women much harder to work with and gain acceptance from. SOME men are exactly as you describe--but not all. My male friends would do anything for me that they could and I would return the favor. I was raised with three sisters and learned to hunt, fish, and fall from my husband. It was my choice. I could do or do not. There is no try. I'm not disagreeing with you entirely. Some people are crappy parents and some men grow up to be monsters. Not all, cat. Not nearly all. There are some things we can do that men cannot--breast feeding is an example. Pushing something the size of a watermelon out our vaginas is another. Your statements are too all encompasing and you seem very sure that you have all the answers. I know that I do not. After returning to school for a degree in Criminology and working with male and female inmates, I realized I didn't evern understand some of the questions. Nature vs nurture? Biology vs psychology? Durkeim's Theory of Anomy? Phrenology? The environment? Still think that crime and criminal thinking errors comes from a mixed bag--and some men turn out to be decent law abiding and respectful human beings. Some do not.

Couldn't agree with you more. This behavior should be unacceptable to everyone. Can't fathom the lack of integrity of those who wouldn't want to protect our women.

concerned and Con....Great posts. Couldn't agree more. Good job.

The question is will Obama be as good at using the bully pulpit of the presidency as Reagan or Bush 43 were during their own relections. Both were excellent at ginning up false flag crisises to stir up the electorate.