Panetta restricts F-22 flights due to oxygen system complaints

Defense Secretary Leon Panetta has ordered all F-22 flights to remain near an airfield in case the pilot suffers from oxygen deprivation due to the aircraft's oxygen system. NBC's Brian Williams reports.

Defense Secretary Leon Panetta has ordered the Air Force to restrict flights of its new F-22 stealth fighters because of continuing problems with the aircraft's oxygen system.

At least 22 pilots have suffered from oxygen deprivation while in flight since April 2008.

Panetta on Tuesday ordered that all F-22 flights remain within a "proximate distance" of an airfield in case a pilot should suffer from a hypoxia event and be forced to land. That will force an immediate end to F-22 patrol missions over Alaska.


Panetta also ordered the Air Force to accelerate installment of a backup oxygen system in all F-22s and provide monthly progress reports on efforts to identify the problem with the current oxygen system.  The Air Force does not expect to begin installing automatic backup oxygen systems until December of this year.

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Handout / U.S. Air Force via Reuters file

A F-22 Raptor fighter jet flies in a training mission during Red Flag 12-3 over the Nevada Test and Training Range.

The Air Force has been unable to determine the cause of the 12 incidents of hypoxia suffered by pilots of the F-22. Pilots have reported wooziness while flying the supersonic jet, considered the most advanced fighter plane in the world.

Some of the military’s top aviators have refused to fly the radar-evading planes because of the oxygen system problems.

The supersonic plane has also been criticized in the past for its high-maintenance costs. 

The Air Force reports that each of the aircraft costs $143 million. The U.S. Government Accountability Office, however, estimates that each F-22 cost taxpayers $412 million, if upgrades and research and development expenses are included.

Jim Miklaszewski is the chief Pentagon correspondent for NBC News. Courtney Kube, NBC's Pentagon producer, and msnbc.com reporter Jeff Black contributed to this report.

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Rip out the OBOGS system, throw a basic LOX system in.....or as we say in the naval aviation community..."take 20psi our of the port strut, change a check valve, any check valve add holy water, duct tape....check hyds...launch it it"...just kidding but I am serious about the LOX

any one that has been a wrench turner on the birds built by 10 pound brains know that the fix is going to come down to some airman finding the 20 cent repair....or as prefer to say..it take a GED to fix what a college degree messed up

AME's always hated the OBOGS system when i was in hornets...went to the E-2/C-2 community the never had an issue with the simple plain Jane LOX bottles

  • 2 votes
Reply#52 - Tue May 15, 2012 6:38 PM EDT

I wonder what John Boehner has to say about this in relation to blocking defense cuts.

    Reply#53 - Tue May 15, 2012 6:42 PM EDT

    F*cK the Military. Time to have a bake sale to build a death machine.

    The AF needs to be cut by 75% in fact all military cut by at least 50%.

    This should please the Republicans as it makes for a smaller government. IDIOTS

      Reply#54 - Tue May 15, 2012 6:54 PM EDT

      throw a couple more billions of the tax payers money at it, and everything will be all right. in this day and age do we really need manned fighters? and what the h**l the U.S does not have any intention of winning any war its involved in any way, scrap the thing and give every U.S citizen a cool million for all the crap they have done to us hard working middle class people.

        Reply#55 - Tue May 15, 2012 6:59 PM EDT

        "At least 22 pilots have suffered from oxygen deprivation while in flight since April 2008."

        Most members of congress appear to have gone without adequate oxygen for YEARS, how big an issue can this be?

        • 3 votes
        Reply#56 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:00 PM EDT

        Over $400 million for each (defective) plane. Wow. Remember a few weeks ago when an investigation was launched and heads rolled because of the GSA's $800,000 convention expense?

          Reply#57 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:01 PM EDT

          Made in China.

            Reply#58 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:07 PM EDT

            Lockheed Martin sychophants gorging at the sacred Pentagon feed trough.

              #58.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:50 PM EDT
              Reply

              I can't imagine why our government is always broke and wanting more taxes.

                Reply#59 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:11 PM EDT

                Here's my point.. WE put the P 51 mustang in service in 117 days. We got a problem with 02 then call the boys at the skunk works they will figure it out and make it work at little to no cost to the tax payer. we've been putting people in the air. faster farther and longer than anyone else. quit bitchi'n and find a solution!

                  Reply#60 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:12 PM EDT

                  We do not have the Skunkworks anymore. Read the book by Kelly Johnson, "Skunkworks" where he talks about integrity and how to control costs in military projects. That was the last person I knew having high ethics in aerospace business. He would build planes within the proposed cost and return unused project surplus money to military!

                  But today's military aerospace business is a greedy business. It is about winning huge contracts from Pentagon to build overly expensive weapon systems under paranoid assumptions and to create employment in the States having the Boeing, LMT and Northrup-Grumman, Honeywell et .

                  We have "Stinkworks" in Pentagon business now...

                  • 1 vote
                  #60.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:32 PM EDT

                  The Mustang was first used by the British RAF. Its design was completed before the USA was even in WW2. Germany's land forces were falling back all across the East by 1944. The Russians saw to that.

                    #60.2 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:57 PM EDT
                    Reply

                    We borrowed money from China to build fighter jets to protect us from the Chinese. Is this country F***** up, or what ? We cant build new railroads and highways and take care of our elderly, but we can piss money away on fighter jets.

                      Reply#61 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:15 PM EDT

                      The manufacturer says there is no problem...there is a problem!!!

                        Reply#62 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:16 PM EDT

                        You pay 143 million dollars for one stinking airplane,yet you dunn me for $300 back taxes you @!$%#s.

                        • 1 vote
                        Reply#63 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:21 PM EDT

                        AMEN

                          #63.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 8:19 PM EDT
                          Reply

                          America should wake up. Why do we need an airplane nearly $400M a piece to fight a war that is yet to come? Deterrent? I can not buy it--You can create all the deterrent you can with nuclear missiles.

                          To fight conventional war, upgraded F-16, F-15, F-18 will do the job. As someone who researches about military fighter jets, these planes are damn good to fight the middle east wars or central european wars.

                          I think all should begin to critically think about cost, performance and why we have all these weapon systems. Just drinking the superpower cool aid and living in the past dreams would not help us...

                          Do you honestly think that China and Russia unilaterally go for war with us? They know better. Russia's capabilities are poor after USSR break up and the Chinese military power is still growing.

                          But wake up, chinese are winning the Economic and Manufacturing war! The future war is not military war in the conventional sense of occupying land and people, but economic and manufacturing war. Whoever has the low cost, skilled manufacturing base is going to be the growing power, like China is now. We just lost all that power we had because of our obsession with superpower and advanced weaponry etc. Do not get me wrong, I support the military but some of these weapon systems are way into the fantasy land like Avengers movie...Let us get realistic and think about the un employed, poor and the eroding manufacturing base and the greedy wall street investment baking system..

                          • 1 vote
                          Reply#64 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:24 PM EDT

                          that's why they didn't buy and make very many..but you better have a coupla wings of "sh!t charlie don't got"..just in case they pull a Luftwaffe and suddenly outta nowhere they got an ME262

                          • 2 votes
                          #64.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:34 PM EDT

                          China has its' own problems to worry about ! China must find 1 million new jobs for people coming out of universities,people coming into the cities from the surrounding rurals areas demanding jobs and new and increased competition from India! The Chinese see their economy slowing and will have to spend all that reserve capital on feeding and caring for thier citizens!I think the USA has a way to go before someone pulls the crown off our head! Of course,after reading some of these comments,internal problems in the USA might speed up the destructiom of our country!

                            #64.2 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:41 PM EDT

                            ME262 is nowhere near even the F-4 or the soviet MIG-21 my friend... ME262 was an experimental jet airplane, the first in the world that was secretly developed with Heinkel engine in 1943. Luckily Hitler killed the program.

                            Upgraded F-14, 15, 16, 18s will take care of business for next 50 years of conflicts, regardless of military spending the development anywhere in the world, because it would take that much time for folks to catch up.

                            • 1 vote
                            #64.3 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:42 PM EDT

                            And the world can rest assured, the dysfunctional American gov't will assault some second rate country far away from its own shores, and spend billions of dollars of tax money on expensive boondoggles like the F22. Have to feed the devil somehow.

                              #64.4 - Tue May 15, 2012 8:03 PM EDT

                              Augmort - I think JDDallas was just using the ME262 as an example of us not being prepared to handle an aircraft that we did not know about..

                              actually it's first flight was in 41 and saw some action in 44 but due to small numbers it was ineffective, but it did give us a shock when it was first seen

                              unfortunately we cannot upgrade my old tomcat, 2006 they took my baby away from me

                                #64.5 - Tue May 15, 2012 8:12 PM EDT
                                Reply

                                here's a thought..I'm a diver..why not just have a pony bottle?..basically a reserve tank of simple air..start feeling woozy switch to garden variety "air" (the cockpit is pressurized right?)..and land the plane

                                ..no fancy we're gonna make our own air at 35,ooo feet stuff liquid oxygen nonsense

                                  Reply#65 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:30 PM EDT

                                  Because pilots have died from asphyxiation because they didn't "feel woozy" in time.

                                  This has been a known problem for years - shame it's taken this long to recognize - and it's scary to think how much the defense industry owns the government and its citizens.

                                  This plane is an over-priced boondoggle.

                                    #65.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:35 PM EDT

                                    Good idea JDDallas....but the Pentagon won't buy it because it is inexpensive solution, and it was not created out of a study of the study of the study of an unnecessary investigation.

                                      #65.2 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:36 PM EDT
                                      Reply

                                      Pilots are probably all dimocraps! That would explain the "light headedness"!

                                        Reply#66 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:35 PM EDT

                                        You have to be educated to be a fighter pilot - that would automatically disqualify any right wingers.

                                        • 1 vote
                                        #66.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:48 PM EDT
                                        Reply

                                        This whole issue begs the question; “How can an aircraft such as the F-22 go through OT&E and into production without such an issue arising?” Is this issue a design flaw and if so will Lockheed Martin foot the bill? Was the government review(s) of the design and OT&E parameters insufficient and if so will those within the government, at all levels, be held responsible and their pay garnished until the automatic “backup” oxygen system has been paid for? Everyone does realize the term “automatic backup oxygen system” probably means “we installed/developed an insufficient system” therefore we are going to put a bandage on it for now which the tax payer will pay for and bye the way expect another bill later for a so called permanent
                                        fix. Oversights’ (not following proven process and lack of quality) is nothing new especially when it deals with ANYTHING the government/politicians are involved. Does anyone recall the initial issues with the Bradley Fighting Vehicle and on-going issues with the CV-22? What about the current cost overruns and issues with the F-35? What about the cost overrun issues already surfacing with the KC-46 which is not fully off the drawing board yet? WHEN WILL WE HOLD THE POLITICANS (FEDERAL, STATE, and LOCAL), GOVERNMENT OFFICALS (PROGRAM MANAGERS and their OFFICALS, GENERALS and their EXECUTIVE OFFICERS and STAFF), and COMPANY EXECUTIVES (CEOs, VPs, and MANAGERS) accountable? Be assured if ANY of the above mentioned had to pay for something out of their own pocket there would not be as many issues. The sad part is they have yet to figure out as a tax payer they are paying for it. But they don’t care as long as their pockets are lined. So much for ETHICS TRAINING……..

                                          Reply#67 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:35 PM EDT

                                          Let's see....... How about we limit the F22 to 10,000' AGL or below to eliminate the hypoxia potential. It makes as much sense as some of the fixes already suggested by the so-called DoD experts,

                                            Reply#68 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:41 PM EDT

                                            They should have selected Northrop's YF-23 over the F-22 after the Advanced Tactical Fighter competition back in '91. It was stealthier and faster.

                                              Reply#69 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:43 PM EDT

                                              143 million apiece and the pilots can't breathe. What a piece of crap. Go drones.

                                                Reply#70 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:44 PM EDT

                                                You don't have a clue about why these anomolies are occurring! You and everyone else will likely never know because the plane and its systems are classified!143 million will be cheap once Berrie is through destroying our economy!Hyer imfaltion is a term that comes to mind!

                                                  #70.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:49 PM EDT

                                                  I'm a taxpayer and I can hardly breath - over the cost of flying hardware. Do you know what the sticker price is for a B-2? Over $2B per plane! That's about half the cost of a Nimitz class aircraft carrier! When airplaces get to be so expensive you have carefully consider the kinds of missions to which you commit....

                                                    #70.2 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:54 PM EDT
                                                    Reply

                                                    The problem is likely related to the crafts' unusual capabilities ! It probably climbs faster,certainly accerates at a quicker rate and the speed it actually flies ,combine to create the problem!

                                                      Reply#71 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:45 PM EDT

                                                      Brilliant. A self-appointed expert offering a theory with absolutely no supporting evidence.

                                                        #71.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:56 PM EDT

                                                        Scrap the whole sinister program. End the tax feeder fascism.

                                                          #71.2 - Tue May 15, 2012 8:09 PM EDT
                                                          Reply

                                                          I'm positive there is some political reason behind this announcement! Can't figure it out but I bet in the next few days something will pop up!What could it be! the future production of the plane has already been stopped so Berrie can't claim he cutting defense spending.

                                                            Reply#72 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:51 PM EDT

                                                            Oh, and he's a conspiracy theorist to boot.

                                                              #72.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:57 PM EDT
                                                              Reply

                                                              Add one more chapter to what appears to be a general deterioration of our military. Earlier reports have Marines selling military equipment. Now this. Doesn't it indicate something's wrong when the superior officers of these pilots didn't have the intelligence or foresight to take their word and investigate, especially since they couldn't find an answer and instead just blithely told the pilots to keep flying? It had to take their public disclosure for someone to do something? Bestween the urinating on bodies and destroying Korans and all the other crap going on there is something definitely wrong.

                                                                Reply#73 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:52 PM EDT

                                                                There were earlier reports that mechanics and ground personnel experienced similar 'wooziness'. Maybe it's not oxygen deprivation. Maybe it's fumes from some other material or process in the engine or airframe.

                                                                Anyway, at nearly a half BILLION per copy, the manufacturer can sort this out, and not on the taxpayer's dime, either.

                                                                  Reply#74 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:55 PM EDT

                                                                  Another must have critical weapon system It should fly with the V22 but wait, we need to keep funding these systems to protect our country, the industrial base.

                                                                    Reply#75 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:55 PM EDT

                                                                    I see the hate America and hate the U.S. Military crowd is out in full force on this story. Maybe NBC and msnbc should have ran a follow up on how the money could have been better spent on Jose and his family- free meds, med care, food stamps, free child care, etc,etc,etc,etc. If you people paid attention to such things you would know that all new weapons systems have teething problems that have to be worked out. You all are just showing everyone how simpleminded and out of touch with the real world you really are. Pathetic.

                                                                    • 1 vote
                                                                    Reply#76 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:55 PM EDT

                                                                    Yup. If you disagree with mikea, then you hate America, the U.S. military, apple pie and your mother.

                                                                      #76.1 - Tue May 15, 2012 7:59 PM EDT

                                                                      Mikea- Where is it said everyone has to cheer on the legions of the Pentagon's military industrial empire?

                                                                        #76.2 - Tue May 15, 2012 8:12 PM EDT
                                                                        Reply
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