George got mugged by a thug and had to fire a slug. Most of the Cops there would have just tasered Travon to death for good measure. FL has there share of the redneck PacMan type mentality Sheriff's.....

George is entitled to his opinion. Is this really relevant in his attempt to defend himself against Trayvon Martin?

Good for George for voicing his opinion which was probably accurate and within reason. Most cops are good at what they are there to do and behave with a high degree of professionalism and morality, but a few aren't and he witnessed this and called it as it was. What the hell is wrong with that? If anything, Zimmeran should perhaps be awarded a medal for being a whistle-blower and exposing bad and lazy cops.

does make you wonder if the comments he made about things on the 911 tapes, are about the police and their response rather than the criminals themselves. there's an interesting document that was sent out one month prior to the incident, from the home owner's association. It talked about the recent break-ins and if people see anyone or anything suspicious, they were to call the WATCHMAN PUT IN CHARGE: GEOGE ZIMMERMAN and then the police. This gave him every RIGHT to follow this guy. Why isn't this being talked about? This case is over. It is going to be dismissed.

"Is this really relevant in his attempt to defend himself against Trayvon Martin?" - Uhtred

Ummmm...Uhtred...kind of hard to claim racism against a guy that mentors black kids and is on public record defending the civil rights of a homeless black man, wouldn't you say? Of course, I'm sure many will find a way to ignore these facts.

Another attempt by the media to villify Zimmerman. Whether or not he is guilty, it's strictly up to the courts to decide.

The media needs a case like this every year to have us pissed off at someone. Just like last year's Casey Anthony trial.

MSNBC and US News have no class. Enough of this disgusting rumor crap to draw eyeballs and sell advertising. The guy is indicted for 2nd degree murder and is entitled to a fair trial. Let the courts and jury decide and stop the race bating...

Really Laurie??

How about the fact that Georgie was told by the dispatcher more than once NOT to follow the "suspect"?!

taking the law into his own hands because he thinks they are not capable and that he's a better officer??

He is a dangerous cop wanna-be

He was told not to follow him.

Zimmerman was supposed to call the police and NOT do anything else

Ellis, So are you insinuating that Trayvon was responsible for the break-ins ...or that shooting and killing an innocent young man is a good way to deter break-ins?

"How about the fact that Georgie was told by the dispatcher more than once NOT to follow the "suspect"?!" - PM NYC

This is a lie. The dispatcher said -- only once -- "You don't need to do that". Zimmerman complied almost immediately. This is well known and on the tape of Zimmerman's call to police. When will you all ever stop regurgitating these lies?

Get some butter. He's toast.

PM NYC 1.16

I believe the proper description is, "Control Freak".

I just wonder why the procecution keeps releasing so much info to the media. It seems like they are attempting to try Martin in the court of public opinion. I wonder how they can find jurors that are impartial.

DonKeehaawtee, if I see a suspicious person in my neighborhood -- whatever their race -- I make sure they know I see them. If that means leaving the relative safety of my home or car, then so be it. If that means walking down the alley a bit, then so be it. That doesn't make me a vigilante. It makes me a good neighbor.

"You don't need to do that". Zimmerman complied almost immediately. This is well known and on the tape of Zimmerman's call to police.

You forgot to mention George telling dispatch to have the officers call him so he can tell them where he is at, instead of meeting the officers at the mailboxes as requested by dispatch.

Obviously an indication that George was not going to let this Skittles wielding thug get away.

Mike, it is always the same BS, there is no proof that Zimmerman did not comply with the DISPATCHER"S REQUEST, which he did NOT have to do, legally. The only reason this is still in the news is that Trayvon was black, and Obama's liberals must try to make it a race issue, which it most certainly isn't. Matter of fact Zimmerman had a black ancestor, and we ALL know that anyone with black blood cannot, possibly, be a racist.

Duane, A) Florida has freedom of information laws. The State's Attorney is absolutely not trying Martin in public opinion and in fact they keep filing motions to keep evidence from public view. The problem is that they just have bad evidence...perhaps that's why they don't want people to see it. B) This was not part of the State's investigation...although that shows that they were not attempting to evaluate things in a balanced manner as they are required to do. This was in the public domain, but it was the Miami Herald that "found" it not state's investigators.

Well this just goes to show Zimmy wasnt the racist pig some have made him out to be.

Some of you people posting should go back to school in hopes of learning reading comprehension. It might be in vain however since you cant exactly teach reasoning. This article does more to support Zimmy than showing anything against him.

Dasvet, Zimmerman pursued Martin, then something happened (which only one living person can be sure of) which resulted in the loss of a life. The person who took the life needs to justify the circumstances surrounding the life that was lost.

Where do you see color in that? Why are you trying to drag in race, and the president who has less to do with this than race?

"Zimmerman, rejected by girlfriend, rejected by cops, rejected by neighborhood watch" - starsailing

Yeah...ummm...except he was married and was head of the neighborhood watch. Hey, one out of three's not bad.

Tyler, perhaps you should give him credit for defending the civil rights of a homeless black man, huh?

Laurie in Tampa you are precisely right on all counts. The Prosecutor over reached and he will NEVER be found guilty or better yet even prosecuted for 2nd degree murder. I am team Zimmerman, but feel this is an unbelievably tragic story. The evidence coming out supports Zimmerman's claim though.

Chris, Zimmerman does not HAVE to justify a thing. The government must justify/prove that he acted in an illegal manner. I gather that you, like me, aren't a lawyer. As for my bring up race, have you seen the President, and all those black and white liberals screaming that it is a race issue? Zimmerman was convicted by MSDNC and the liberal media, and it is as apparent as the sun in the sky.

All of the evidence points to a not guilty verdict. The only way Zimmerman will be found guilty is if the entire jury is black.

Talk about an unfortunate event. Sad that Martin is dead, sure. Worse that Zimmerman has so many ignorant people, of the law, of the facts in this case, of Zimmerman's past, wanting to see him hang. It may be true that if Zimmerman could return to that night he'd do something different, but that will be his burden to bear. What matters to all of us should be seeing justice done.

Did Zimmerman do anything illegal? Is it illegal to track someone known or unknown to you in your neighborhood? Are you legally obligated to follow the suggestion of a dispatcher that you aren't need to do that for the police? If attacked, can you use deadly force if you believe your life is in danger? There are lots of questions, and each has a legal answer that our leftist friends seem not to want to admit. Whether Zimmerman broke the law will be determined in court, but I can't see from any of the released evidence anything which shows he did anything illegal.

And, yet, most American leftists continue to want to pretend that carrying a firearm in Florida is illegal. It isn't. Or that following a strange person in your neighborhood is illegal. It isn't. Or that a dispatcher who is repeating rote the instruction to get you away from any situation must be followed else you've violated the law. You haven't. So far as we know at this point George Zimmerman has done exactly nothing wrong. I don't think we can say the same for the prosecutors in this case. In their filings they have shown none of the elements of the crime they allege, and produced none of the exculpatory evidence which exists. Their job is to seek justice, not forward an outcome demanded by race hustlers from the liberal side of the political spectrum.

This case is worse than an embarrassment. Had it happened 50 years ago and the racial descriptions were reversed, we'd be talking in terms of a lynching. It's a bad system which allows prosecutors to do the lynching, under the color of law, simply because they lack the spine to reject public opinion. It was just as bad when the victims were blacks.

Jack Smith-2207765

All of the evidence points to a not guilty verdict. The only way Zimmerman will be found guilty is if the entire jury is black.

I sincerely hope you are not correct; however, since the OJ verdict, it seems to me that the majority of black people in this country are incapable of judging a case like this fairly and impartially and will accept any argument that exonerates Martin - because he is black - and convicts Zimmerman - because he is white

(or whiter than Martin, in any case)

How do you stand your ground when you are stalking someone?

All this proves is that George has an obsession with being a cop and was openly practicing vigilante behavior with a huge chip on his shoulder about law enforcement.

If anything this goes a long way to proving that George was out just looking for someone to shoot so he could be a hero in his own head.

Dasvet, WRONG. Zimmerman is guilty of taking a life. This is where SYG fails. As long as there are no witnesses, you can shoot anyone you like, and claim SYG, and that is NOT justice.

My fear is that the powers that be decide that Zimmerman cant get a fair trial. They could move this to a Federal court. It isnt much of a stretch considering that the DOJ pressured Florida to assign a special prosecutor in the first place.

They may find something to convict him with just to save face.

Leave it to MSNBC to only publish half of the story.... the half it likes best.

By the end of 2011 Zimmerman was praising the Sanford PD.

"Zimmerman's relationship with police evolved, city files show"

"on September 18, 2011, he wrote an e-mail thanking the city's police chief and praising the department's "professionalism.

he said working with the department's community volunteer coordinator as part of neighborhood watch efforts "to curtail the spike in robberies and home invasions in (the) neighborhood within the past two months" had changed his view.

He praised the volunteer coordinator's quick responses to e-mails and phone calls, saying she went "above
and beyond to help launch a neighborhood watch" and calling her "a testament to the highest level of professionalism of (the chief's) administration."

"I have high hopes for, and restored faith in your administration and the Sanford Police Department in its
entirety," he wrote.

Zimmerman's e-mails with Sanford police show a pleasant, even friendly, relationship. In an e-mail dated
September 19, Sanford police volunteer coordinator Wendy Dorival thanked Zimmerman for his "kind words" sent to the chief. He responded, "It was with great pleasure that I sent that e-mail, you deserve the recognition!"

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/24/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

No wonder liberals are always so uniformed and cluless... their media prefers it that way.

Smartycat,

I guess George is a complete idiot considering he called the cops before reliving his own version of "Surviving the Game".

The liberal side, that for some reason is thirsting for blood in this matter, will end up feeling mighty foolish when this is over.

@ robbopaloobop who said "it seems to me that the majority of black people in this country are incapable of judging a case like this fairly and impartially and will accept any argument that exonerates Martin - because he is black"

Martin is not on trial. He's the dead victim. There is nothing to exonerate.

Pretending for a moment Martin is on trial... he hadn't committed a crime. Since when is looking suspicious to someone grounds to be stalked and harassed?

Martin had the SAME right to stand his ground under that law. Just because he was not armed with a gun doesn't mean he didn't try to stand his ground by attacking someone that was following him.

This is exactly why the entire law is ridiculous and illegal. Stupid people scare the heck out of me... but that doesn't mean I get to shoot you.

This "Stand Your Ground" law is great. I can pick fights with anyone and if I start losing I can just shot them dead with no ramifications.

Uhtred 878

George is entitled to his opinion. Is this really relevant in his attempt to defend himself against Trayvon Martin?

Well yes if he had the frame of mind that the police wasn't going to do their job and allow someone that he thought was a criminal get away. If he had the frame of mind that he was the only one to stop this "coon" (or whatever that word was he uttered) he would have definitely taken the law in his own hands and stopped Martin at all cost.

Oh I don't believe he will be found guilty simply because the court system has become a circus and 12 people cannot be found that will look at the evidence without bias. It's already turned into a racial situation with people taking sides so saying you can give a fair verdict as a juror is ludicrous. The only way justice can be served in this case is by a panel of three judges ruling without a jury.

Hey edgewatervince,

The simple answer to your question is that SYG would not apply if, because you stalked someone, a confrontation resulted. Your difficulty would be in showing how this case was a stalking in any way. If you listen to the 911 tape and/or read the transcript of it, you can clearly see that Zimmerman was following to find out where Martin was going, but then lost sight of him, and then began back to his vehicle. Not much of a stalking going on there. And, really, stalking is such a charged word, one you undoubtedly use in order to make it appear a nefarious purpose was its goal, despite exactly no evidence to support your implication. One might conclude you are intentionally trying to mischaracterize George Zimmerman so as to create a justification for your pre-trial bias.

Wow, that would be a nefarious purpose with an immoral goal, you know?

I believe, as I have all along, that Mr. Zimmerman was a man who desperately wanted to be in law enforcement, and either lacked the necessary physical and / or mental skills to qualify or lacked the drive to do what he needed to do to join a Police force. He then became a self-appointed armed security guard for his neighborhood (which may have had a crime problem that was or wasn't made worse by dereliction of duty on the part of Sanford Police), instead of a neighborhood watch.

On the night in question, he saw what he believed to be a suspicious individual and took it upon himself to follow him (instead of calling 911 and letting the police do their job). What followed was a situation that Mr. Zimmerman lacked the skills and experience in police and security procedures as well as armed and unarmed self defense to handle and the end result was the death of an unarmed teenager.

Whatever Mr. Zimmerman's opinion of Sanford Police and whatever the reality of the state of that force in February of this year , the bottom line is the actions of the 911 Operator and on scene officers were among the very few that were correct in this tragic incident. I also strongly believe this tragic incident could have been avoided and that Mr. Zimmerman needs to answer for his actions in a court of law, since Trayvon Martin will never be able to answer for his, regardless of what they were. I also believe that the circus that has followed this case could have been avoided if manslaughter charges had been pressed immediately, which was the recommendation of those on scene officers.

Trayvon is innocent!

Wakehead, you've got the picture. It happened in Miami where two neighbors got into an argument. One neighbor went into his house, got his gun, and shot the guy. Nothing was done to the guy that did the shooting because (1.) he was a retired police officer, (2.) he claimed he feared for his life even though the other man didn't have a weapon, (3.) it was on the front yard of his property. Keep in mind that the man doing the shooting went in his house where he could have just locked the door and called the police but chose to come back out and shoot the man. They ruled that the shooter had the right to stand his ground.

it seems to me that the majority of black people in this country are incapable of judging a case like this fairly and impartially and will accept any argument that exonerates Martin - because he is black - and convicts Zimmerman - because he is white

The reverse has been occurring since Emancipation.

@ pjam09

Agreed... I think this story is only a small bit of Zimmerman's obsession with the police. But the real problem is that Zimmerman had an unnatural mental obsession with police to the point that he acted out the pretense that he was a police officer. Nothing that anyone has said about Zimmerman's relationship with the police does anything but prove that Zimmerman is mentally unstable. His flip flopping about police shows that he idolized them so his emotional swings were erratic and very openly displayed because he cannot control his emotions regarding matters of police business. This is a man with a mental problem. I'd like to see him plead insanity and get some professional help. He was under a delusion that he was an honorary police officer playing super hero. He found out that police training and discipline of their emotions is paramount to actually being a cop. His child like emotional outbursts toward those who don't live up to his comic book super hero idea of how the world works has landed him in big trouble as a killer now. This is what happens when people enable the psychosis of the mentally ill and do not properly understand when someone is showing inappropriate fetish intrest in something that is dangerous and stop them from hurting themselves and others.

So the white, racist, teabagger, who showed no signs of being in a struggle, actually turns out to be someone who is of mixed race, had a broken nose and a cut head, registered Democrat, and now he also turns out to be a guy who mentored a young black kid along with taking on the police for the unfair treatment of a white kid who beat up a black man.

Is there anything you race baitors, and pathetic media hacks got right?

Mike in SA

So Zimmermann was a good neighbor by shooting one of his fellow neighbors guests? I like how you just regurgitate your opinion as fact and then tell everyone else they're regurgitating lies. If he stopped following Martin, this wouldn't have happened. I suppose you also believe he was attacked from behind while getting into his vehicle, too? I'm willing to hold complete judgement til everything comes out at trial, however information from the police reports disputes much of what Zimmermann supporters claim as fact. The first arriving officer stated he saw nothing when he first arrived, got out of his vehicle, and had to walk to an area away from his cruiser between buildings in a grassy area to find them, which is where he found the two. Unless Zimmermann was driving his truck in yards between buildings, that disputes the claim that that Zimmermann immediately stopped following Martin.

And, while I'm not a supporter of Zimmermann at this time I don't see how this further vilifies him. If you actually read the article it says in the past he spoke up accusing the police of covering up the beating of a BLACK man, so if anything that casts doubt on the claim that the shooting was race related.

I don't believe for ONE SECOND, that Martin was mugging Zimmerman... If anything, Zimmerman should be held to the same level of harshness under the law, as he would have advocated in other cases. After all, this whole issue of equal protection under the law, and holding the same standards for all. If he agrees with such measure being metted out, he should agree with being on the receiving end also, when he finds himself on the other side of the law....

It is not unfitting that one should be heald to account, under the self same standards by which they judge others/situations others find themselves in....

I am confused. I have been told that GZ is racist and that he killed TM because TM was black. But, now there are documents demonstrating that GZ was angry that the SPD violated the civil rights of a black homeless person and upset that the white officer was getting off. Is that the behavior of a racist that hates blacks? What do we believe?

There was at the beginning one witness, then it went to four, now the prosecutor has 22; except for the witness on hand all other testimony is irrelevant and non admissible at trial of the merits (not sentencing if found guilty); it does appear the prosecutor is digging deep in the barrel to try to justify her charging and not going to a grand jury; there is no way so far that the Prosecutor can get a guilty verdict.

@BlueBurner

Since you don't know the boy who was killed and you weren't there when he was, I'm astonished that you know with certainty what happened and the kind of boy Trayvon Martin was.

No matter what the court's verdict is, Zimmerman will have to live with the fact that he stalked and killed a young man for no reason. He'll spend his life trying to atone for that.

Don't you mean you're astonished that his assumptions don't match your own? Obviously you don't "know with certainty" that Zimmerman "stalked" Martin or that he "killed him for no reason" but you state these things as if they were proven fact. The hypocrisy surrounding those on both sides of this debate is the truly astonishing thing.

Hey Smarty_Cat,

The obvious problem with your legal theory is that if Martin was simply standing his own ground as the law allows, then Zimmerman would never have lost sight of him and began the return to his vehicle. The only way your theory makes sense is if Martin returned and then Zimmerman attacked. Yet there isn't any evidence Zimmerman attacked Martin, only evidence that Martin attacked Zimmerman. Logic is a real downer, don't you think?

@ Larry... So... essentially then my deathly fear of stupid people gives me the right to go on a shooting spree because I truly feel that ignorant idiots may do some crazy thing like run a red light and kill me.

The stand your ground law also doesn't care who is afraid or why they are afraid... All you have to be is afraid and you get to shoot even in a crowded public situation. What if I'm a bad shot and I miss shooting a guy on my front lawn and the bullet kills a child in my neighbor's window? Was I still standing my ground so it's OK that I murdered a baby?

Vigilantism is illegal for a reason. Let's keep it that way. Now I'm terrified to go to Florida because a bunch of stupid people have the right to shoot me and make up a reason later by saying they were afraid. I'm afraid if I moved there I would have to stand my ground and shoot anyone who even so much as looked at me because I thought they were going to stand their ground against me first.

There is nothing logical about this idiotic backward law or this case that is a result of an idiotic law.

More evidence in Zimmerman's corner discounting the prosecutions contention that his actions were motivated by race. I advocated a wait-and-see policy when this case first made headlines, when everyone else was frothing at the mouth to hang him or (on the opposite side) give him the key to the city. The more facts come out about this case, the more likely it seems that he was defending himself against some sort of assault and that his actions can be best described as self-defense. Let's go over some of the claims that were made initially:

1. Zimmerman was never arrested the night of the incident and walked home a free man.
Truth: Zimmerman was arrested and interrogated for hours by detectives who referred a manslaughter indictment to the DA, who refused that recommendation on the basis of Zimmerman's self-defense claim.

2. Zimmerman had no injuries to back up his self-defense claim.
Zimmerman had a broken nose, two black eyes, a back injury and lacerations on the back of his head consistent with his story and corroborated by EMTs on scene, the responding police and his own doctor the next day. Additionally, one eye-witness reported Trayvon on top of Zimmerman attacking him with "MMA moves" (mixed-martial arts).

3. Zimmerman stalked Trayvon.
Zimmerman followed Trayvon and stopped when asked to by 911 dispatch (on the tape, you can hear him say "okay" and his breathing returns to normal, suggesting that he stopped chasing Trayvon and was returning to his car).

4. Zimmerman is a racist.
Zimmerman volunteered to mentor black youths and stood up for the civil rights of a black homeless man-- all on public record. This narrative, pushed so ardently by black civil rights "leaders," is clearly inconsistent with Zimmerman's actual track record on the subject. It also doesn't hurt that he has several friends of minority ethnicity who vouched for him.

All of these claims, made at the outset of the case, have been refuted. Comment 1.19 has the best shot at any actual prosecutorial success, but that's a slim chance at best (completely circumstantial). With the evidence as presented publicly (I make no claims to know what other evidence may be currently withheld), I would have to vote not-guilty if I was selected for jury duty. Nearly everything supports Zimmerman's version of events. I'm sorry if that fact ruffles certain folk's feathers who jumped on the "Crucify him now" bandwagon, but that's how I see it-- and I think that's how a jury will see it too.

This comment was collapsed by the "community" - what a freakin' joke:

PM, even if he did "follow" Trayvon (it seems he did not, but we may never know) he had every right to "follow" someone in his neighborhood. When Trayvon assaulted him with GBI this became basic self-defense. They don't even need to invoke "Stand Your Ground."

Dismissed.

@ Saxon... you are completely incorrect in saying that no one can testify as a witness but one person. Anyone who heard anything can testify what they heard. Either side can call as many witnesses they want. Only the judge can determine if the witness is allowed to testify or if their testimony is valid. Obviously the judge has decided all these people are able to testify and have something of value to offer to the trial. Actually witnesses who saw Zimmerman's behavior after the incident are also valid witnesses because how a person reacts after they shoot someone is very important to his state of mind when he killed someone.

By the end of 2011 Zimmerman was praising the Sanford PD.

"Zimmerman's relationship with police evolved, city files show"

He must've learned that crossing 'the blue line' leads to a short career in law enforcement.

Visible Truth.

Zimmerman provoked the fight. 911 told Zimmerman to stop following the person. Zimmerman refused and followed the man. I would be to freaked out if a man I did not know was following me and would not leave me alone. In this case I feel "stand your ground " was in Mr. Martin corner, not Zimmerman. Zimmerman was the aggressor.

Hey Rich... you weren't there and parroting the excuses of a mentally disturbed man who is obviously trying to re-write history to get out of a murder rap isn't a valid basis for your argument.

Under the stand your ground law all that is required is FEAR of another person.

Martin had just as much right to use force against Zimmerman because he was afraid.

You just don't like the idea that the law is completely illogical and flawed when TWO people are afraid of each other and try to kill each other based on nothing but suspicions and FEAR.

Zimmerman, in the mugshot with his orange shirt, with wet hair, half-a'd facial hair and fat face, looks rather lazy and disgusting.

Hey Eric, MARTIN had a cell phone, if he didnt like being followed why didnt HE call 911? He had the chance, but CHOSE to do something different.

Objection! Relevance?

Georgie,

This is about yours and TM's actions the night TM was shot and died, not anyone else's.

I never thought George was a bad guy. However I think he made a terrible terrible mistake, and he knows it. I think he will break down eventually and come clean.

Dude you killed an innocent child who was walking home.

@ bandit-3097615 who said:

"How come we're not hearing about all the disgusting things this punk kid Trevon did? he was no Angel..."

Because the victim is NOT ON TRIAL. The dead victim isn't accused of murdering anyone and crimes he may have committed in the past are not something that Zimmerman would have known about therefore it has no bearing on Zimmerman's state of mind. You can't just see a black boy and assume he's a criminal because he's walking at night somewhere that you don't approve of. It doesn't matter if he was a bad kid... YOU don't have the right to assume people are criminals based on their appearance. Nor do you have the right to take the law into your hands and pretend you are a cop.

Zimmerman is on trial here not the victim that he killed.

smarty-cat

I was telling a story that was reported in I believe a Miami paper. I'm not saying I agree with it.

The stand your ground law is a good law but it was not intended to give people the right to shoot someone for any reason. It was intended to protect the shooter if he had no other choice. The elected official that submitted the SYG law to the state legislators has stated that the law did not cover George since he followed Martin against the advice of the 9/11 dispatcher.

The problem with the SYG law is that the law enforcement have become too lazy (just quoting George here) and look for the easy way out when a questionable shooting takes place. It's easy to close a shooting case when you can just claim self defense when two men get in a argument and one shoots the other. I believe in a shooting incident where there are no other witnesses that a polygraph test would be in order. If the shooter passes then case closed. If he doesn't then he would have some more explaining to do.

In response to your statement just above, that was a different Trayvon Martin. The Trayvon Martin that seemed to be the bad dude was in Texas. This one lived in Miami.

Zimmerman will have to live with the fact that he stalked and killed a young man for no reason. He'll spend his life trying to atone for that

Dip@!$%#. He had never seen trayvon in his life (or so he says even that I can't believe) and though he was up to no good.(stalking) Then while on the phone with 911 he was attacked from behind by the same teen he was following.(self-defence...ish)

@ Enough Now People who suggests Martin could have called the police.

Where is that in the stand your ground law? I haven't seen that. I don't see anywhere in that law that says you have to call the police first before you attack the person you are afraid of.

The law is clear. The only pre-requisite is you have to be afraid for your life. Then you get to attack whoever you are afraid of. Period. There is nothing saying you have to stay in one spot or call the police.

So Zimmerman is now a mixed racial heritage, mixed racial home, mixed racial business partners, mixed racial friends, mixed racial neighborhood living, mentored young black children, stood up on public records for the rights of a black homeless man, RACIST? Wow, that is amazing, tell me how that works again?

How anyone can still think this is an issue of race at this point is beyond me.

Enough Now people

Hey Eric, MARTIN had a cell phone, if he didnt like being followed why didnt HE call 911? He had the chance, but CHOSE to do something different.

Martin was on the phone with a girlfriend and never suspected he was going to be killed. I'm sure he would have done something different had he known his stalker had a gun.

@ hiap

It shouldn't be a racial situation but was turned into one when they tried to sweep it under the rug and his black parents got involved.

republicans are the biggest liars and hyprocrites. yes liberals dislike the police for good reason, but republicans say they love the police - We do? I'm a Republican and I don't love or even like the police. There is so many bad cops it's not even funny, and all of them are Protected by their UNION coherts.

and need more but support a man who criticized the police? - We say we need more? I thought Republicans were saying we need less government, and need to cut some of these out of control pensions (LIKE THE ONES POLICE GET). Double dipping is common in the police force and once again it is protect by UNIONS and their DEMOCRAT followers.

so called cop lovers? yeah your only a cop lover until its for politics, then you support a man who hates them for poltical reasons so you can keep a nazi law like stand your ground. - So saying we shouldn't convict a man in the media, we shouldn't edit tapes, use misleading photos, and make wild assumptions with no evidence is now a full on support of Zimmerman? I thought I was supporting our justice system from being taken over by an emotional mob of vigilantes.

I don't care if Florida keeps or does away with the Stand your ground law, I don't live in Florida so it doesn't matter to me, and I'm fine with people getting mugged, or women getting raped not having any rights to defend themselves. (Sarcasm - I am not fine with muggin or rape without the ability to defend yourself.)

@ Larry... The Stand Your Ground Law is beyond stupid. Telling people to act on their fears and kill anyone they are afraid of is just absolutely ignorant and childish.

This case proves my point exactly. TWO people afraid of each other flew headlong at each other and attacked each other rather than RUNNING AWAY. Now one person is dead and the other is a murderer.

Not to mention that there are untold millions of other horrible circumstances that could harm or kill innocent people who just happen to be nearby under this ridiculous and barbaric law.

smarty_cat

@ robbopaloobop who said "it seems to me that the majority of black people in this country are incapable of judging a case like this fairly and impartially and will accept any argument that exonerates Martin - because he is black"

Martin is not on trial. He's the dead victim. There is nothing to exonerate.

Let's take your assertions one at a time:

1) "Pretending for a moment Martin is on trial... he hadn't committed a crime."

Punching someone in the face is a crime, last time I checked.

2) "Just because he was not armed with a gun doesn't mean he didn't try to stand his ground by attacking someone"

By your own admission - Martin attacked Zimmerman - who in turn had a right to defend himself against a much bigger, stronger attacker.

The "Stand Your Ground" Law was designed to allow people to protect themselves against unprovoked, gratuitous violence, the type displayed by Martin when he attacked Zimmerman for no reason. Martin wasn't "afraid" of anything - he just thought he could "whup up" on his smaller, weaker victim with no consequence. Unfortunately for him, Mr. Zimmerman was ready and able to defend himself.

And since when has self-defense needed it's own law? Since time immemorial we have all had the right to defend ourselves as part of our constitutional rights and federal laws.

There is no need to ammend the constitution by making a state law that says essentially:

Kill anyone you want then make up the excuse that you were afraid of them after the fact.

Nothing about that is constitutional. You can't kill people you don't like then say you were afraid of them.

@ robbopaloobop ... Take your own advice... In Florida it's legal to punch someone to death as long as you say you were afraid of them after. So again... Martin didn't commit any crime.

Go read the Stand Your Ground Law again... duh... there is nothing about who is bigger, stronger, or anything like that.

All I got to say to you is... don't quit your day job.

Smarty cat, break into any one of my family's homes in the US and the stand your ground law will be utilized. Even my sweet old mother heard something hit her window in the middle of the night (turned out to be an owl) and she picked up her 38 and took a walk through the house (alone). This was 2 days ago. Does that make me feel like my Mom is safer at home? You betcha. I don't care how stupid you think that is one little bit!

zimmie would shoot a white kid in a hoodie as well. How come no one seems to care that he may have been on presription anti depressants at the time of the shooting. His own doctor recommended that he see his psychologist. To me that is huge

I am confused. I have been told that GZ is racist and that he killed TM because TM was black. But, now there are documents demonstrating that GZ was angry that the SPD violated the civil rights of a black homeless person and upset that the white officer was getting off. Is that the behavior of a racist that hates blacks? What do we believe?

You can think for yourself (since no matter who thinks what at this point, it's only speculation). Just use an itty-bitty teeny-weeny amount of common sense and it'll be clear that this wasn't racially motivated.

Eric,

Stop and think about what you're saying and how irrational it is:

Let's pretend someone is following you. Let's further pretend you are frightened.

What is your instinct? To attack him?!? You don't attack someone you are afraid of when you have the ability to flee - and nobody would possibly argue that a 6' tall, 17 year-old football player could not outrun a 5'7" overweight, 28-year old insurance agent. It just makes zero sense. Come on, dude.

Stand your ground DOES NOT mean you attack someone because you don't like how they are looking at you.

When Martin attacked and pounded Zimmerman, he committed felony assault with GBI (great bodily injury). So enough with this nonsense about he didn't commit a crime.

When the assault went on for 38 seconds while Zimmerman screamed and nobody came to his aid, by any stretch of anyone's imagination, Zimmerman had good reason to believe his life was in danger.

The irony is, this isn't even "Stand Your Ground" territory. It's simple self-defense. Period.

So, GZ was so afraid for his life that he followed TM, so afraid that he called 911 to report TM, and said these guys get away all the time, so afraid GZ followed TM futher, and confronted him, then got into a scuffle. sound LIFE THREATNING to me..........NOT

rc4121998 you have a lot gall, what a crock even in your opinion and that is all that it is...you know about opinions? Liberals always tell the truth...everyone that believes that stand on your head. No matter what persuasion you are lib or cons. people lie, cheat, steal and murder. Hate mongers like you are stereotypical in the libretard movement in the unions and government welfare mentality. Go collect your foodstamps and welfare check b4 you head to the bar to get drunk.

smarty_cat, mackman,

Nobody is saying Zimmerman shot him because he was simply "afraid" - he shot Trayvon because he was violently beating him and he was "afraid" the next smash on the concrete might be the last.

I'm actually having a hard time believing you are real people. I mean, a human brain can't be this illogical, can it? I live in fear for the future of our country because people like you exist.

Personally, I do not considered this a race issue. I have from the very get-go though considered this to be an issue of mental health. Specifically the mental health of George Zimmerman. George seems to have many mental health issues. A prime one of most concern is his inability to do as he is told by persons involved with law enforcement. My second concern is with his idyllic thinking and third his obvious immaturity. George's brain is not firing on all cylinders, hence the reason he is on medication. Anyone taking regular doses of prescription medication for any type of mental illness (no matter the level) should not be given a permit to carry a concealed weapon, let alone be allowed to own one. I am not advocating against gun ownership or the right to bear arms, I have a .44 myself. I am concerned though when someone with a very obvious mental health issue is allowed to possess a weapon of death and use it to end the life a a young person who wasn't doing anything wrong or even criminal.

I must ask all...What would you do and how would you feel if the teenager killed was your own child?

Nobody is saying Zimmerman shot him because he was simply "afraid" - he shot Trayvon because he was violently beating him and he was "afraid" the next smash on the concrete might be the last.

Gunnermann claimed he was about to lose consciousness just before he shot Traygone.

The screams heard before the gunfire doesn't sound like someone who's about 'to lose consciousness'; it sounds more like the scream of someone being held at gunpoint. It was a calculated shot...not one where a struggle took place. After all, how hard is it to wrestle a gun from someone who's about to lose consciousness?

Duane et al.......They are releasing all that info to the media because perhaps the decision has already been made to let Zimmerman go imo.

After all he has met the criteria under the ''stand your ground'' premis... i.e. the other person is dead - and dead men tell no tales - and to the victor goes the spoils in a battle- including being able to say or write whatever story of the incident/conflict/war as there is no one left on the other side to say differently or give a differing point of view.

The spoils in this instance will be Zimmerman's freedom, to roam around the planet doing what ev he choses including being made into a T'con/NRA darling, as was done with that man in Texas that shot 2 men in the back in cold blood and who were not a threat to him or on his property, and although he told the 911 dispatcher what he was going to do and even although he was told to stay indoors and was told not to go out with his rifle/shotgun with him by the dispatcher.

What is happening now is desensitization. The prosecution etc what ev will continue to do this sort of leaks until folks start to not care or have any feeling towards the untimely death of that 17 y/o anymore.

Regarding the Zimmermans statements regarding the police in the past and his stance on the beating of the homeless black(?) man, his outrage at the fact that the matter was not investigated or the beater not being arrested/locked up because of his relationship as a child of a police officer etc, could be interperted as 1. the police do not do their job

2. the police take care of /protect/ cover up for their own

3. therefore he has no respect for the serve and protect folks because of #1 and #2.

thus 4. he (Zimmerman) therefore is the only one with the capacity to and is able to see the law in black and white/ re crime and punishment and act accordingly.

5. therefore if the 17 y/o was of another ethnic group whether white or whatever he would have done the same thing he did that night, as colour was not an issue to him, only whether the law was being broken or not , thus because of that he is better at investigating and enforcing law and order than those Serve and Protect folks who are #1 and #2. because they are simply too lazy and intent on avoiding confrontation to stop criminality (real or imagined) no matter what.

6. Which shows a certain level of contempt for the Serve and Protect folks, thus perhaps that was why he did not heed the dispatcher's warnings and sallied forth to do what he probably thought/believed that they (police)would not do or bother to respond to. (after all he seems to believe that the police are lazy, corrupt etc etc.)

Like the rest of us humanbeings the Serve and Protect folks do have their faults and blind spots too, but that does not give the NON Serve and Protect folks the right to mete out their own justice or to go do their own thing/investigation even after being warned not to do so.

It would have behoved Zimmerman to have reported what he had observed and leave it up to the police to investigate or not, and not take matters into his own hands...immaterial of what ever he may of thought of the police force imo.

What if the 17 y/o killed had turned out to be the son or relative of a Serve and Protect person who was visiting someone in the area? What if the 17 y/o killed had turned out to be the child/relative of a lawyer/prosecutor etc or perhaps some relative of his (Zimmerman) that he did not know about or was aware of? What then? Would the desensitization tatics be waged?

Immaterial of the child's past -real or imagined-, did he deserve to die that night? Had this child murdered someone? So why the harsh punishment and without a trial?

Zimmerman will no doubt go free, if past cases where the other person is dead are any indicator of outcome, he has met the criteria/requirement for the use of 'stand your ground' as a defense, in that the other person is dead.

After all in the case of the abused mother who fired a shot into the ceiling/wall as a warning to her abuser husband, she was sent to jail for 20 years, apparently because she did not meet the criteria/requirement needed for the use of 'stand your ground law' as a defense.... because no doubt 1. she gave a warning shot into the drywall and 2. and did not kill the abuser husband.

One could therefore come to the conclusion - if other cases are any indicator - that the mother did not meet the 'stand your ground' law criteria to successfully use it as a defense, because the other person (the abusive husband) is not dead, and thus now the mother of young children including a baby is gone to prison for 20 years because she did not kill, or even harm or injure the abuser husband. Hope the children are in the care of some other family members or at least CPS instead of in the care of the abuser husband.

Peace ...... justice or what ever semblance there of...... blah blah blah

my opinon...he's just a... over zealous heat pack'n neighbor hoodie watch guy...what did you expect...

DonKeehaawtee

The screams heard before the gunfire doesn't sound like someone who's about 'to lose consciousness'; it sounds more like the scream of someone being held at gunpoint.

You may believe this but Trayvon’s own father admitted to police that he knew the screams were not from his son. Glad you know Trayvon’s voice better than his own father, I hope they put you on the stand to refute the father’s testimony.

It was a calculated shot...not one where a struggle took place.

What evidence do you base this on? The released testimony of several witnesses and the police report proves a struggle did take place and nothing has been released disputing it.

It seems to me that none of this is relevent. I think it was clear early on that this was not a racial killing, but it was a form of profiling, Zimmerman clearly targeted him because of his appearance. Zimmerman wanted to be a hero, I really think he had good intentions. Unfortunately it didn't go the way he thought it would. I sympathize with him, but he needs to face consequences of his actions.

Trayvon had as much right to "stand his ground" as Zimmerman did. Zimmerman wanted to protect the neighborhood, so he took matters into his own hands. Trayvon saw him following and figured (correctly) that Zimmerman was targeting him. This is all stuff there is clear evidence of. The rest is where it's questionable. I personally think Zimmerman lost sight of Trayvon and went looking for him instead of going back to his vehicle. At some point, they ran into each other and something ensued. We don't know what but we know how it ended.

Point is, if Zimmerman hadn't "assumed" Trayvon was looking for trouble and if he hadn't tried to handle things Trayvon would be alive and Zimmerman would be home. Trayvon did nothing to start this, he only reacted. There was nothing he could have done other than try to run, which would make him look more suspicious.

If you go out drinking and you drive and kill someone, you will go to prison. Probably for quite a long time, even though you certainly didn't mean to kill someone. Why shouldn't someone who recklessly used a deadly weapon on another go to prison also. To me there is no difference. Both are irresponsible acts that cost someone else his/her life. I said right away I think a murder charge is too much, but he should definately face criminal negligence or homicide or something.

We need to stop focusing on the irrelevent things that Trayvon did in the past and that Zimmermand did in the past and just focus on the facts.

Romneyismynightmare I struggle to respond to you because of the nickname and photo you use. I tend to think you thrive on shock element. Yes- it is possible he was on anti-depressants, I truly don't know. But if you wish to convict him because of this I urge caution. Antidepressants are used for a variety of reasons, even only for sleep for many. I don't take them but a large population of the country does. It won't matter in the long run unless some very aggressive behavior has been observed by him related to mental issues. I have not heard of any.

ITripleDog, and Trayvon's mother said they were from her son. And a couple "experts" said they were not Zimmerman.

And you can tell whether or not the gun was fired during a struggle by trajectory, whether the gun was moving when fired (I would think during a struggle Trayvon wouldn't stop fighting so Zimmerman could get a clean shot) and distance when fired, etc. We know it was fired from a short distance, meaning it wasn't right up against Trayvon when fired. It doesn't mean there was no struggle, only that you need to look at the evidence of the shot to figure out the position and distance of the gun.

Don't try to twist things to fit what you want to believe.

LA, the experts said they couldn't confirm or not confirm that the voice was either Trayvon or Zimm, it's a wash. In fact, they already said it was about 50/50 that it was Zimm. And of course, Trayvon's mom and Zimm's dad both going to say it's from their kid. Yet another wash.

As for the gunshot, they have already said the distance the bullet traveled is intermediate range from approximately 8 inches to 2.5 feet. I have yet to see anything saying trajectory.

LA99999

ITripleDog, and Trayvon's mother said they were from her son. And a couple "experts" said they were not Zimmerman.

As Gabbo said, the “experts” that you site are mixed on whose voice it was. The prosecution released the FBI’s analysis that was inconclusive. Other experts not connected with the case are irrelevant. I believe Trayvon’s father would be as good of a judge as any expert. Trayvon’s mother as well as Zimmerman’s father are biased witnesses, and even a biased witness such as the victim’s father believed the screams were not his son’s. That will weigh heavily in this trial.

Don't try to twist things to fit what you want to believe.

What did I twist? I stated that the released testimony so far proves a struggle took place and nothing has been released disputing that yet. You call relying on the current evidence twisting things?

I’m humored that you know what I believe. I’m sure you know that I believe Trayvon was innocent and Zimmerman acted negligently. With the current evidence available, I think it will be very difficult to prove 2^nd degree murder but that prosecutors will reduce the charge to manslaughter for a guilty plea. I’m sure you also know that I believe the media completely butchered this case and showed incredible negligence themselves in horrendous reporting, sensationalizing the death of a 17 year old. Talk about twisting things….

smarty_cat

@ pjam09

Agreed... I think this story is only a small bit of Zimmerman's obsession with the police. But the real problem is that Zimmerman had an unnatural mental obsession with police to the point that he acted out the pretense that he was a police officer. Nothing that anyone has said about Zimmerman's relationship with the police does anything but prove that Zimmerman is mentally unstable. His flip flopping about police shows that he idolized them so his emotional swings were erratic and very openly displayed because he cannot control his emotions regarding matters of police business. This is a man with a mental problem. I'd like to see him plead insanity and get some professional help. He was under a delusion that he was an honorary police officer playing super hero. He found out that police training and discipline of their emotions is paramount to actually being a cop. His child like emotional outbursts toward those who don't live up to his comic book super hero idea of how the world works has landed him in big trouble as a killer now. This is what happens when people enable the psychosis of the mentally ill and do not properly understand when someone is showing inappropriate fetish intrest in something that is dangerous and stop them from hurting themselves and others.

Good Lord smarty_cat. All I can say after reading your analysis of George Zimmerman is: LOL

pjam09

Leave it to MSNBC to only publish half of the story.... the half it likes best.

By the end of 2011 Zimmerman was praising the Sanford PD.

"Zimmerman's relationship with police evolved, city files show"

"on September 18, 2011, he wrote an e-mail thanking the city's police chief and praising the department's "professionalism.

he said working with the department's community volunteer coordinator as part of neighborhood watch efforts "to curtail the spike in robberies and home invasions in (the) neighborhood within the past two months" had changed his view.

He praised the volunteer coordinator's quick responses to e-mails and phone calls, saying she went "above and beyond to help launch a neighborhood watch" and calling her "a testament to the highest level of professionalism of (the chief's) administration."

"I have high hopes for, and restored faith in your administration and the Sanford Police Department in its entirety," he wrote.

Zimmerman's e-mails with Sanford police show a pleasant, even friendly, relationship. In an e-mail dated September 19, Sanford police volunteer coordinator Wendy Dorival thanked Zimmerman for his "kind words" sent to the chief. He responded, "It was with great pleasure that I sent that e-mail, you deserve the recognition!"

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/24/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

No wonder liberals are always so uniformed and cluless... their media prefers it that way.

I agree. It seems they "forgot" to include this part. And I see a few comments here from people who obviously either didn't know about this important part of the article, or chose to ignore it.

@Romneyismynightmare

His own doctor recommended that he see his psychologist. To me that is huge

His own doctor recommended that he see his psychologist AFTER HE HAD SHOT AND KILLED A YOUNG MAN. I imagine any doctor would give that advice to anyone in that situation. Duh!!

"I like how you just regurgitate your opinion as fact and then tell everyone else they're regurgitating lies." - zorloc

I'm not regurgitating my own opinion, I'm regurgitating what anybody can clearly hear for themselves on the recording of Zimmerman calling police...if they just took the time to do so. It's not my opinion that he stopped following when the dispatcher requested him to. You can hear it on the recording for yourself. A) You can hear him stop following and B) you can hear that Zimmerman no longer has any idea where Martin was. Even you would have to admit that it's kind of hard to follow a person that you don't know where they are.

"If he stopped following Martin, this wouldn't have happened."

Not sure how you get to this conclusion. Martin was supposedly heading home and would have been ahead of Zimmerman when Zimmerman began to follow. As a 17 year-old football player he should have easily been able to beat the pudgy Zimmerman in a foot race and apparently he did. You can clearly hear Zimmerman say he lost Martin in the call. Do you think Zimmerman somehow magically transported himself in front of Martin -- like in Star Trek -- before the altercation happened??? Did the laws of physics somehow magically suspend themselves?

"I suppose you also believe he was attacked from behind while getting into his vehicle, too?"

Nobody has said Zimmerman ever made it back to his vehicle...nobody...so that's what you get for assuming. However, every account -- including Martin's girlfriend's -- has Martin initiating contact...not Zimmerman.

"I'm willing to hold complete judgement til everything comes out at trial, however information from the police reports disputes much of what Zimmermann supporters claim as fact."

Please, please tell us what information in the police reports disputes the account of Zimmerman's lawyers or family...or anything that I've said for that matter.

"The first arriving officer stated he saw nothing when he first arrived, got out of his vehicle, and had to walk to an area away from his cruiser between buildings in a grassy area to find them, which is where he found the two. Unless Zimmermann was driving his truck in yards between buildings, that disputes the claim that that Zimmermann immediately stopped following Martin."

Again, if you actually cared to listen to the recording of Zimmerman's call, it is 24 seconds between when Zimmerman's car door closed and he lost track of and stopped following Martin upon the dispatcher saying "You don't need to do that". Contrary to the scenario you want to somehow present, the dispatcher did not say that immediately when he heard the car door close...only after Zimmerman had been following for a ways. If Zimmerman ran at a normal pace -- not sprinted -- that 24 seconds would take him about 100 yards from his vehicle, which again if you cared to listen to the recording was right by a cut-through by the mailboxes. The grassy area is about 50 feet from the street. Are you suggesting that Zimmerman was running in place and therefor should have been right next to his vehicle when the incident happened? Use your head. Oh, and actually listen to the recording before trying to draw conclusions from it.

"And, while I'm not a supporter of Zimmermann at this time I don't see how this further vilifies him. If you actually read the article it says in the past he spoke up accusing the police of covering up the beating of a BLACK man, so if anything that casts doubt on the claim that the shooting was race related."

Look at posts #1.10 and #1.37. I've said that from the beginning.

ITripleDog, my point is that we don't know who's screams they were. You would think that the parent would be a better judge than the voice experts, but these experts have samles of the voice and I can very much understand a parent not believing his son could be screaming that way. It seems to me that the one screaming would not be the one with a gun, but I don't know. We don't know what exactly was taking place at the time.

I apologize for presuming to know your thinking on it, but it sounded like you were concluding it was not Trayvon based on his father's opinion, and that just isn't conclusive. And I was only pointing out that you can't jump on Donkeehawtee like that when he was only stating his opinion.

LA99999, that was one of the the problems brought up with the initial findings of the voice analysis experts (who apparently were looking for their 15 minutes of fame). They did their evaluation admittedly without any sample of Martin's voice to compare it to. Still think that should be trusted over Martin's father?

I have friends that are cops.... they would agree with Zimmerman. They think their department should do more to make sure that patrolmen stay in shape throughout their career.... not just in their rookie year!

I'm not sure why this is relevant in his trial or as a msnbc story?

It's like TEACHERS. lol. The good ones get rewarded by having GREAT STUDENTS in GREAT SCHOOL DISTRICTS. The bad ones get away with it because of UNIONS. You can't fire them. We wonder why our kids are such thugs. Trayvon was a thug too. I'm not saying he was meant to die but he was a thug long before this incident. Just saying. From what I see, it started at home and probably at school. He was suspended three times. GOOD KIDS don't get suspended. GOod kids don't have parents that say that kids who get suspended are GOOD KIDS!!! His parents were living in their own world... BIZARRO WORLD.

Laurie, I got suspended once. Guess what? I have no criminal record, graduated from college, and am a productive member of society. One of my good friends got suspended several times in high school, one time for ten days, no for anything violent, just like Martin. He is a decorated Marine.

Getting into trouble as a teenager does not make one a "thug," nor does it guarantee a life of crime.

Laurie in Tampa - It's like TEACHERS. lol. The good ones get rewarded by having GREAT STUDENTS in GREAT SCHOOL DISTRICTS. The bad ones get away with it because of UNIONS.

Please, please, please tell me you are being sarcastic or trying to be funny.

The only reason this is in trial is public outrage at a perceived injustice mostly due to a faulty media. The trial is to find out if Zimmy killed Tray over his race. This article is relevant because it shows Zimmy wasnt a racist as many have said he was.

Misscreant, Trayvon called himself one. Why do you think he was even where he was to get shot? He was suspended from school for bags that used to contain weed, burglary tools, and an abnormal amount of jewelry in his locker. His father didn't trust him to be home alone, so they went to his dad's gf's house. Oh the irony.

He has a youtube channel with videos of him orchestrating his own fight club. His FB page and twitter shows he's definitely a drug dealer, with references to graffitti and assault.

The beginning of the end started because Zimm thought Trayvon was casing houses to steal from. That's why Zimm was following him in the first place.

Gabbo1, it would take far too much time for me to point out everything that is wrong with your statements, and you wouldn't pay any attention anyway.

So the news is now telling us George complained of the same ineptitude cops who does not do proper investigations actually ending up benefiting him. Just that Trayvon's parents campaigned for justice. And, besides the little weed in his system (Tim Tebow might be the only NFL who never at least once toked on a joint) Tray was a good boy. Being lost in all of this hyper-balling is ALEC,NRA and Company.

GET RID OF THE STAND YOUR GROUND LAW AND VOTER DISINFRANCMENT NOW!!!

Misscreant, just because he never really really got busted for selling drugs, doesn't mean he is completely innocent. Write it out, I'll read it.

Did you see his youtube channel? Did you read his twitter account? Did you see his FB page? Trayvon was an open book.

Gabbo1, did you see Martin's real social media pages, or the fake ones? Or, did you just regurgitate information you gleaned from other posts?

I believe you are a drug dealer, you just haven't been caught yet.

This whole situation has become so distorted that it is ridiculous. It has changed from an idiot vigilante chasing down an unarmed teenager and killing him to a white/hispanic versus a black. Since obviously there are more whites and hispanics than there are blacks, the majority see Zimmerman as a hero. If any rational person looked at this situation (and left race out of it) and pictured their child or relative in Martin's place they would see Zimmerman for the thug he is.

Ha, ok, please provide link and I will go look. So Trayvon's real twitter handle wasn't @no_limit_nigga which had years of data? Already verified. And his youtube channel where he was already verified in the videos?

Gabbo1, did you see Martin's real social media pages, or the fake ones? Or, did you just regurgitate information you gleaned from other posts?

I believe you are a drug dealer, you just haven't been caught yet.

Misscreant, this is just a sad reply, next time just use the famous "I know you are but what am I" instead.

@Misscreant

it would take far too much time for me to point out everything that is wrong with your statements...

Sounds like you can't put your money where your mouth is.

true cops most cops are thugs but its hilarious how republicans love cops but they also love zimmerman but zimmerman critcizes cops.

Here's all I needed to know about this case. You can view all the overhead maps. The fight occurred 15-20 seconds walk distance from Zimm's truck. Trayvon's destination is his dad's gf's place that is 1 minute walk distance in a straight line from where the fight took place. Yet Zimm was on the phone with the police for 2 1/2 minutes where you can time stamp when he stopped running and that he has lost Trayvon. After he hangs up, there is yet another 90 seconds before the fight starts. And to begin with Trayvon was running with a head start while Zimm was in his car.

If any rational person looked at this situation (and left race out of it) and pictured their child or relative in Martin's place they would see Zimmerman for the thug he is.

Your statement is pure JUNK! Everyone agrees that this was a tragedy, but tragedy doesn't mean GZ did anything ILLEGAL. I completely feel for the parents of Martin, and even if the kid was no angel he had not done anything so bad that death was a just punishment. If it were my kid I would be outraged as well, but that is why we have a justice system. If GZ did nothing illegal, and it is proven that he was being assaulted and act in self defense he should not be convicted of a crime just to make people feel better. I wish it went down differently, but it didn't, saying this has anything to do with race is the problem. Most of those defending GZ are NOT saying he is not guilty, but they are say he deserves a fair trial, and not to be convicted in the media with flase statements, edited audio, and misleading photos. When you look at it honestly you can't tell me GZ is being treated fairly in the media with that list of BS.

My point is there were fake social media pages created to disparage Martin. His Twitter handle was for a rap song he liked. This is not something nefarious. Also, the "fight club" videos are in dispute. It's amazing how people like you want to take the ramblings of a teenage boy and turn them into a criminal manifesto.

Gabbo1, they are unsure of where Zimmerman's truck was parked that night. The police did not initially realize Zimmerman was driving, and did not look at the truck until after Zimmerman's wife had picked it up,and used it to get Zimmerman's change of clothes to the station the night of the shooting.

Backcountry, I back up what I say, but as I already stated, why bother when you and other Zimmerman supporters would not care what I had to say, or what facts I had to back it up.

true cops most cops are thugs but its hilarious how republicans love cops but they also love zimmerman but zimmerman critcizes cops.

I'm a conservative and I hate cops. Yes, I said HATE. They are too often bullies who abuse their power, and after getting caught beating someone they get PAID leave while unions get them back on the force - TOTAL BS. Yes, there is probably some good cops, but I don't know many. I also don't give two craps about GZ. He is like a lot of Democrats I know, thinks he is smarter and better then everyone else, and thinks his $*!t doesn't stink. Plus if he is considered a white male because one of his parents is white, then Barack Obama must be white as well. All of that being said I'm not for mob justice because it's an election year and a segment of the country loves to fire up racial divisions.

Yes, I will agree, there were fake pages for Trayvon, like fake ones for Zimm. Just look at the maps, where else would Zimm park his truck? There is only one main walkway entrance there. He says Trayvon ran down it on his call. Of course, he would have parked it by this. There are more than a dozen exits to the area between apartment buildings. And remember that the police arrived 3 minutes ish after the fight and there are witnesses, so it's not like he moved the truck.

Let me ask you this. Please provide a scenario of events with all this timestamping where the fight takes place exactly where it takes place. This is why I believe 100% Trayvon instigated the fight after Zimm had already given up. You probably don't want to hear my theory that Trayvon's gf was most likely the one who goaded Trayvon to do it. However, that last part is just my guess.

Just because you claim it's the most logical place to park does not mean he parked there. You can not claim where the truck was parked as evidence when you do not know, for certain, where it was. Zimmerman also never said where or which way Martin ran on the 911 call.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-04-09/trayvon-martin-timeline-florida-shooting/54129274/1

http://globalgrind.com/news/timeline-trayvon-martin-shooting-sanford-police-george-zimmerman-details

Here are several links that show timelines. You are operating under the assumption that Martin had to come back to confront Zimmerman, and completely discount the possibility that Zimmerman had continued to look for Martin. You are entitled to your theories about Martin's girlfriend.

I am not discounting that Zimm continued to look for Trayvon. I am saying that even if Zimm did continue to look for Trayvon, the fight wouldn't have occurred where it occurred. 100% impossible.

How is it "100%" impossible that Zimmerman approached Martin based on where the confrontation occurred? This I have to hear!

... bad ones get away with it because of UNIONS. You can't fire them. We wonder why our kids are such thugs. Trayvon was a thug too. I'm not saying he was meant to die but he was a thug long before this incident. Just saying. From what I see, it started at home and probably at school ...

BS.

Good students, inquisitive and challenging Black students are the first to get a taste of how the system works.

Their constant questions, quick minds and self assurance is a challenge many teachers can not handle. Whne they run into these student - first they attempt control and limit their inquisitive minds, then they lable them - as disruptive... then they try to get them out of h class. If the student is "lucky" he is bundled up and shipped off to an advance class,usually in some Privileged school district, thus depriving his former class mates of an example of what to aspire toward - meaning the less bright can become content with the status quot. The main point is - bright students are actively discouraged in many public schools. In the end - he or she will be have to go, to maintain order.

the direction up or out depends on whether he/she accepts the premise that they are special. Being satisfied with being classified as special means they have no further obligation to their former school mates. That is the way modern society chooses to handle the obviously brilliant child in sub-standard schools. divide and conquer.

I wouldn't be surprised to find out that Trayvon was one those exceptional students. Pointing out that he wanted o be a pilot tells me the he was the kind of kid that was capable of depending on his own skills.

Learning to sail and Aircraft piloting are two recreations which tend to separate kids who need / want to taken care of from those who need to know how to take care of themselves and are willing to spend time to learn how to do it.

When you are on sail boat or flying a plane, your life - ultimately is in your hands. Your skill in make the best use of what is provided are the tools which you use. You can't make the wind blow, but you can learn how use them. A plane in the air, is not th same as a plane on ground. If you load it incorrectly, the first unfavorable incident could cause a shift in balance ...ultimately causing the plane to become unstable,crash.

The hallmark of a good pilot, sail boat captain - are exactly what is needed to get a kid to focus on the future, and understand how to handle difficulties, which - inevitably will arise.

His intrest in flying tells me that Trayvon was not slacker, tug nor easy person to manipulate. He was learning that there are bigger things in the world... not to fear them, just learn how to use them to get where you want to go. Smart kids tend to be difficult to understand and that's not to be encouraged in public schools...so, getting kicked out - especially as teen - is a sign they are learning.

Then he met George... George's answer to enlightened Trayvon was typical, the classic caveman answer to difficulty - hit it with a stick.

man zimmerman was REALLY a cop wannabe eh? judge, jury, executioner.. all in his mind.

The fight is next to the middle of a walkway at a T-junction. The most visable place till the road/parking lot, 10 seconds walk distance in either direction. If Trayvon is truly avoiding a fight and Zimm caught up, the fight would have occurred either between houses or at minimum closer to his own house. His destination is a straight line less than 30 seconds running distance. Yet Zimm is on the phone for approx 2 1/2 minutes and still another 90 seconds before fight starts.

There are a dozen exits from this area. If Trayvon was avoiding Zimm and hid, he would have had to do it between buildings closer to his destination because there isn’t a place to hide closer to the T-junction. So even if Zimm did see him and they decided to fight, once again, not at the T-junction.

Let’s say he was trying to lose Zimm because he didn’t want to lead him to his place. That would be easy, he could go out the back side. There are a dozen exits.

Let’s say Zimm didn’t park at the logical spot, and parked somewhere else. Then he would have had to cut between buildings to somehow surprise/ambush Trayvon. Once again, fight happens closer to Trayvon’s house.

Zimm definitely doesn’t tackle or shoot Trayvon from behind.

The truth is they are both morons

1. This was Martin's first trip to this community, therefore he did not know the area.

2. The fight did occur between and behind houses, not at the "T-junction." If you do not know the exact location of the altercation, you can not claim that it was "100% impossible" that Zimmerman confronted Martin.

3. I will give you Zimmerman did not hang up with 911 for two minutes after he claimed Martin ran, but we do not know when the fight started. The first calls about the fight came in roughly 90 seconds after Zimmerman ended his call, but most people are not going to call 911 the moment they hear an altercation. The fight probably commenced immediately after Zimmerman hung up with 911.

Beoweolf--nice gloss job on Trayvon. The exact same thing could be said about any number of WHITE kids, most of whom do NOT act up in class (possibly because their parents TEACH them to have respect for authority?) NOR do they get caught in the school at a time no student was supposed to be there with a big flat head screwdriver and a baggie full of girl's jewelry (and the only reason that was not prosecuted is that the search the janitor did was not legal.) NOR do most of them get caught with a baggie with marijuana residue, either.

Not saying that Trayvon was a hateful evil person, but DEFINITELY not the angel you would like to portray him as.

As to his stated desire to be a pilot? Just as likely, he got that from playing video games or from watching the movie Independance Day for inspiration. Did he belong to ROTC? Had he looked into colleges near Miami that offered that/a flying program? By Feb of her Junior year in HS ALL of my kids were already applying too colleges.

2. Yes, the fight occurred next to a T-junction walkway. Every map and picture from the scene shows this. It's the walkway that goes down the backyards of apt buildings on parallel streets. Have you even seen the map or pictures?

1. He would have slipped out between the buildings. If he didn't know where he was going and/or was truly scared or worried for his life, this would have increased the likelihood of the fight not occurring where it did.

3. It's less than 30 second run time to Trayvon's destination. Even from the clubhouse/mailboxes, 2 minutes.

I live 20 miles from Sanford. The Sanford PD has been a joke for a very long time. Many, many incidents of poor policing. Too many to list here.

MOmaid, the jewelry was turned over to Miami police, who found no evidence that it was stolen. The janitor's search is irrelevant.

Gabbo1, the fight occurred in the backyard area, about three houses in. It is not "next to" the T-junction.

He would have slipped out between the buildings. If he didn't know where he was going and/or was truly scared or worried for his life, this would have increased the likelihood of the fight not occurring where it did.

This statement makes no sense. If he didn't know, or was unsure of, where he was and how to get back to where he was staying, how would that increase the likelihood that the fight would not have occurred where it did? And if Martin was lost and/or turned around, what does it matter how fast someone who knew where they were going could get there?

The exact same thing could be said about any number of WHITE kids, most of whom do NOT act up in class (possibly because their parents TEACH them to have respect for authority?) NOR do they get caught in the school at a time no student was supposed to be there with a big flat head screwdriver and a baggie full of girl's jewelry (and the only reason that was not prosecuted is that the search the janitor did was not legal.) NOR do most of them get caught with a baggie with marijuana residue, either.

Not saying that Trayvon was a hateful evil person, but DEFINITELY not the angel you would like to portray him as...

No mention of "Angel" (or "devil", for that matter). Do all Students - White students ... Never, ever get caught with marijuana? And for all White students who do get caught with Marijuana, do all get suspended - even if the baggie is empty (just saying, an empty baggie could have been picked up any where ... who knows what was in it before it was picked up). Police (FBI) have documented that 4 out of 5 large denomination bills,American currency, are contaminated with cocaine. That means - if you are looking for drug "residue" on the person of anyone in the general public, carrying more the 5 bills in used currency, it is probable they will test positive for having handled drugs contaminated "objects".

That means regardless of what the school did or didn't find on his person - it has no validity. However, you note that the Martin family didn't quibble over the fine points - they accepted the schools punishment and were in the process of addressing the problem: right, wrong or indifferent the martins were concerned about their sons future - enough so, that they moved him away from the environment so he could re-focus on his shortcomings. Good parents don't excuse their kids bad behavior or deny it or get their records sealed, they fix the problem.

Not to put too fine a point on your excusing bad behavior. But two things come to mind in my community.

A High-tech CEO, parent was informed that his child was one os several who were caught cheating on a test (this was prestigious, elite college prep HS - where students are routinely accepted to go to Stanford, yale, Harvard- etc).

His son was suspended, and a note was placed in his transcript indicating why). The father sued the school to have the note removed. why you ask? Because it would make his record look bad - possibly preventing him from being accepted a school with a good reputation.

You mentioned ... most of whom do NOT act up in class (possibly because their parents TEACH them to have respect for authority?)... was that not correct. What is this father teaching his child?

You opened the floor for White kids verses Black Kids and harped on what is expected. teens are teens, are TEEN's. they make mistakes, how the parent fixes the problem is more the issue than "will" they make mistakes, 'cause, inevitably - they will.

How about what is practised? I would strongly suggest - when you feel he need to generalize...Don't!

It tends to end badly.

Misscreant, considering there are only 3 buildings on each side, the 3rd building is in fact Trayvon's destination, I'm pretty sure you have the wrong map. The walkway is a T-Junction. Here, see for yourself.

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/04/02/us/the-events-leading-to-the-shooting-of-trayvon-martin.html?ref=us

www.wagist.com/2012/dan-linehan/the-missing-230-and-deedees-testimony

@Misscreant

Backcountry, I back up what I say, but as I already stated, why bother when you and other Zimmerman supporters would not care what I had to say, or what facts I had to back it up.

Why bother saying anything then?

FYI I'm a supporter of the legal system and unlike you I have not formed an opinion of Zimmerman's guilt or innocence. You see I'm not stupid enough to believe the little information available in the media is sufficient to do so. You claim there has been misleading and false info planted to make Martin seem like a ghetto thug but you don't think the same could be true of Zimmerman? Sounds to me like you willingly believe what you want to believe and dismiss what you don't.

Backcountry, based on the information released by the police and prosecutor, I believe Zimmerman is guilty of manslaughter. I have read the actual evidence, not just media reports. I do not know if there has been fake social media sites set up to disparage Zimmerman. That is one thing the media would report on, since it is not police evidence relevant to the case, and I have not seen any reports of such. I have seen reports of fake Martin sites.

I support our legal system, and Zimmerman is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. What I post on here is my opinion, and I say as much.

Gabbo1, I looked at and referenced the exact same maps as you from the NY times. I see where wires were crossed. I was speaking of homes/houses, you were referencing the buildings as a whole. His body ,however, was still some distance from the T-junction. None of the maps have a distance indicator on them, I have to estimate, but, using the buildings as reference, I would say his body was roughly 150 to 200 feet from the T-junction, about three homes, not buildings, in.

The trial is to find out if Zimmy killed Tray over his race.

No... The trial is to determine if Zimmerman is guilty of murder/manslaughter. And contrary to the beliefs of Zimmerman's fan club, the evidence at this point is solidly on the prosecutors side. Zimmerman's history of violence along with the prescription drugs he was on will also factor in. Antidepressants are known to cause paranoia and violence. Not to mention the fact that Zimmerman claims to be a neighborhood watch official in his community and violated the neighborhood watch policies by carrying a firearm and pursuing Martin. If Zimmerman had not left his vehicle to pursue Martin (which makes him the aggressor) there would never have been any crime to take to trial.The stand your ground defense will be tossed out.

Amen. This is a positive article about Zimmerman, but of course MSNBC displays a hate-filled headline to portray him as angry and malicious. I hope this guy gets tens of millions in civil court. He deserves it after this baseless lynching.

So true, MSNBC will do anything to make Zimmerman look evil in our eyes. Even reporting totally irrelevant crap like this. But they need to do sumb stuff like this since they have to make up for NOT being a true source of quality news.

What the 81:

you are reading the stories and commenting-just to make yourself angry?

BTW, your photo says it all-

On the flipside, maybe GZ thinks that cops are so unreliable that he feels he just has to take matters into his own hands?

So if you're walking down the street and a black guy armed with a handgun doesn't like the way you look, you're ok with him chasing after you and shooting you dead at point blank range if you look at him funny.

Makes sense to me . . . or not

MSNBC doesn't even try to hide their adgenda anymore

ReaWor1dProgressive......You forgot the whole fighting part.

I know you jumped on the racist high horse quickly....so we forgive you for still trying to defend your racially dominated thought process.

PM NYC

What the 81:

you are reading the stories and commenting-just to make yourself angry?

Yeah, do you have a problem with that?

your photo says it all-

and your screename says it all???

I'd have to say that anyone who posts or reads on a news site that they are convinced is slanted must be a total fool. Do you also listen to music you hate so you can complain about that?

Leave it to MSNBC to only publish half of the story.... the half it likes best.

By the end of 2011 Zimmerman was praising the Sanford PD.

"Zimmerman's relationship with police evolved, city files show"

"on September 18, 2011, he wrote an e-mail thanking the city's police chief and praising the department's "professionalism.

he said working with the department's community volunteer coordinator as part of neighborhood watch efforts "to curtail the spike in robberies and home invasions in (the) neighborhood within the past two months" had changed his view.

He praised the volunteer coordinator's quick responses to e-mails and phone calls, saying she went "above
and beyond to help launch a neighborhood watch" and calling her "a testament to the highest level of professionalism of (the chief's) administration."

"I have high hopes for, and restored faith in your administration and the Sanford Police Department in its
entirety," he wrote.

Zimmerman's e-mails with Sanford police show a pleasant, even friendly, relationship. In an e-mail dated
September 19, Sanford police volunteer coordinator Wendy Dorival thanked Zimmerman for his "kind words" sent to the chief. He responded, "It was with great pleasure that I sent that e-mail, you deserve the recognition!"

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/24/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

No wonder liberals are always so uniformed and cluless... their media prefers it that way.

Obviously being caught editing the 911 call taught MSNBC nothing. Pathetic.

The neighborhood belonged to Treyvon too. He had a reason to be there too. How dare you people that do not know either of these people have chosen to call the murdered child a a "thug". He was unarmed, and, Zimmerman had a gun whose life was more in danger from the beginning?

I don't think Mr. Zimmerman will be convicted of 2nd degree murder, but, to portray this guy as some kind of hero or to justify the death of a child or anyone black, white, brown, or any color is crazy. This is an american tragedy and the idiotic need to carry a gun where ever you go, as if this is the old west is also crazy.

It does disgust me that anyone can see any good from this. We should protect our homes and ourselves but not like this, not by putting ourselves out there to investigate and prosecute something that WAS NOT criminal. I also have to ask what about the parents; which of you could handle this with the dignity these people have shown, for their sakes please, stop the racist remarks and judge this incident for what it is and is not.

@RealWor1dProgressive

So if you're walking down the street and a black guy armed with a handgun doesn't like the way you look, you're ok with him chasing after you and shooting you dead at point blank range if you look at him funny.

Makes sense to me . . . or not

Clearly you only see what you want to make sense to you and just ignore everything else. Gee and you're a progressive, what a shock.

MSNBC can't you come up with something better than this? Really? Anything to further your bias verdict of guilty on Zimmerman. I have crappy cops in my neighborhood as well, big effing deal. What has that got to do with this unjust trial? I hope Zimmy sues the crap out of these biased media outlets and shut them down!

If Zimmie had shot a white kid then all of you Zimmie lovers would be calling him an illegal mexican and demand his deportation

Romneyismynightmare

If Zimmie had shot a white kid then all of you Zimmie lovers would be calling him an illegal mexican and demand his deportation

Actually early on many TRAYVON supporters were doing just that. Had George shot a white person this would have not made more than local news.

Approximately two weeks after this all occurred, a young black lady was shot and killed in a drive by shooting. Two days later a young black man was kiled in a drive by shooting. Both happened in predominately black neighborhoods in Orlando. Where was all the media attention, the NAACP, Rev Jackson and Wright to call for justice ? Where was the community outrage ? WHY just Zimmerman ?

Thugs carry guns, obviously Trayvon didn't.

The parents of Thugs can't, will not or are unable to control their kids. Trayvon was under control, he was being disciplined by staying with his father - something which happens when households headed by single mothers see their teen sons reluctant to follow Moms directions. Sometimes it takes a man to get his son back on the right track.

Thugs don't back down or care how they are viewed. Trayvon - on hidden camera did not show any aggression or swagger to the store clerk.

Thugs, usually travel in packs. Trayvon seems to be comfortable being alone - he didn't need a "posse" to feel important.

Contrast that with George... he needed a gun, a hidden gun - to feel safe in public. He carried it with him everywhere he went? Paranoid? or just uncomfortable, with trust issues?

trust-verify I never once heard that, not saying it did not happen but I never heard that. And hey, even if that did happen you zimmie-heads would still call him an illegal if he shot whitey. Just face it.

Beoweolf,

You're conveniently leaving out the fact that the person who chose the thug/gangsta imagery for Trayvon was Trayvon himself. He purposely protrayed himself as "hard" and "street". How else is someone supposed to view him?

If a person walks down the street wearing a white hood and sheet, it's reasonable to treat that person like the racist and dangerous person he probably is. When Trayvon protrayed himself in an antisocial, gangsta way, he chose how he would be reacted to. He wanted to be thought of that way, according to his own words.

Now, I'm not saying that GZ was right in what he did, but it doesn't rise to the level of Murder 2. Personally I think the proper charge would have been criminally negligent homicide because regardless of what the Left and the Leftist media will have you believe, Trayvon does have culpability here too. It is not the one-sided attack you posit. The evidence clearly denies that, whatever else it shows. What we have here is a tragedy in which there are no innocents.

To anger a Liberal, tell him the truth. To anger a Conservative, lie to him.

T. Roosevelt

@Romneyismynightmare

trust-verify I never once heard that, not saying it did not happen but I never heard that. And hey, even if that did happen you zimmie-heads would still call him an illegal if he shot whitey. Just face it.

Zimmie-heads? Whitey? Clearly you have no business judging others. You are just as bad as those you criticize, you're just sitting on the other side of the fence. It's called hypocrisy if you were wondering.

Has anyone just got tired of this case? The lawyer is good he is going to get off anyway. Why not just throw the case out and let the guy go already. Everything seems to show he wont go to jail. Everyone keeps saying MSNBC is trashing Zimmerman. They are the one ones making him seem like he's done anything wrong. Every news I see talks about him as a victim and the boy caused himself to get killed.

It's a black boy, we know what black people mean to the south. So it just needs to dropped and moved on to something new. It wont mean anything til white kids start to get kill.

MSNBC should have been taken off air a long time ago. they are terrible. What makes me laugh is the term RACISM. It has nothing to do with BLACK AND WHITE. It's about one group of people vs another. It doesn't say anything about COLOR. I guess if you put it that way, I AM RACIST. I HATE CRIMINALS and THUGS. It doesn't matter what color they are. I'm white. I have no issue with color but if a colored guy is a THUG, than call me racist. I'll call a white guy a thug too. CALL ME RACIST. lol. People use that term so loosely these days. Half of them have no education beyond the 4th grade. lol. The high racism that DOES occur in this country probably has more to do with blacks hating WHITES than WHITES AGAINST BLACKS. However, I think we can all agree that people who love everyone equally, are racist against all people who are trying to hurt someone else. COLOR has NOTHING TO DO WITH HIT. People need to put that race card away for good and GET A LIFE!!!

Laurie, I was going to comment on the racist part of your various statements but decided not to lower myself to your level. Now since when can't you be handcuffed first in this country without being formally arrested? Now sure what country or state you live in but it's definitely not in the USA. You do sound a bit frustrated. Additionally, I would not comment on the level of anyones education until you check your facts before stating the law!

Melissa - The same excuse they used from day one ... "he kinda looks white".

If you heard some one say.. I love Black people. I have them over to my house all the time, Joe - my best freind and I sit around on the weekends, watch sports, have a few beers while our wives go out shopping, keeping both of us broke. Our kids go to the same schools, they play on the same teams.

No,I didn't put Joe up for the country club I'm in, he wouldn't be comfortable there. He took me to his church, brought the whole family, both of our families - we even stayed for the social. Food was served,the kids played games.

Joe is like the brother I never had. He is the only black guy in my bowling team. We agree on most everything, never had any needed to talk about any race issues, it never came up.

... Would he be racist?

Laurie from Tampa - Are you kidding me? You are going to talk intelligence and then make a posting this ignorant. Racism comes from being able to deny the rights of other races through power. When have blacks had the power over the whites? Blacks can be bigoted but not racist, even if you did not consider the difference to state that blacks hate whites more is just to absurd to even think of a counter argument.

You are obviously a bigot of the worse kind and are also a little stupid.

Bill,

Not many know the difference between bigotry and racism from what I read here. Glad you cleared that up for Laurie and some others. Some blacks are bigotted against some whites. I've even heard gays claim they are victims of racism. MSNBC and other media outlets use the word racism so much the true meaning is lost.

2 Questions:

1. Can a half white man and half Peruvian man be racist against a black man? And

2. Can a white man be racist against a half black man and half white man?

Who made the color guard colored?

Didnt know the Klan had hispanics in it. Oh wait, he was a white hispanic. Sort of like Al Sharpton is a black african american as opposed to dipsh!t african american.

Love a good Al Sharpeton slam.

Is is just me or does Jackson bear a remarkable resemblance to a catfish?

No. You are wrong. Trey was armed. With a black face, a hoodie, and Skittles.

It appears that Mr.Z hunted this kid and was just itching to be a neighborhood hero.

And as for his slamming of the police-right or wrong. Geeze...he needs to read How to Make Friends and Influence People.

Lady D: Zimmerman was part black. Its hard to be racist against yourself. Since you're so sure about what happened that night perhaps you should make a statement to the police because they are on record as saying they don't know who started the fight.

WilliamOfRites

Yeah, and you are qualified to make the assessment of what Zimmerman really meant. Why don't you shut up and let the courts decided whether or not he's guilty?

Get off the media bandwagon of villifying Zimmerman.

Averon1. It is obvious who started the fight. Was Zimmerman not the one who called the police because he saw a black face boy with a hoodie. Strolling in the neighborhood. I guess to him this was a whites only neighborhood. Had he left this boy alone. This would have never happened. And for the record there are plenty of people that are half black or half white. are the biggest racists folk ever. I bet you if Zimmerman could do it all over again he would not have approached Trayvon. I'm just saying.

tristy - He called the cops because he saw a stranger wandering the streets in his neighborhood which had 5 burglaries in the prior 3 months.

Instead of "just saying" garbage try paying attention to the facts.

@Willofsomething - do you not understand the article? He called the cops lazy for not wanting to uphold the law because of all the paperwork involved.

WilliamOfRights you nailed it!

Cops are people who are to lazy to do anything else period. Now, it amazes me how you liberals keep saying Trayvon was unarmed. So a mans hands cannot be weapons? Hello! Isn't that what the military teaches our solders to do in hand to hand combat? Martial arts? I have heard of many people being killed with a mans hands, so forget the not armed B#@&*^T.

Visible-you sound like an intelligent person as well.

Just goes to show you-appearances can be deceiving.

Just saying.

Anyone with two functioning brain cells and the ability to see past their hatred can see what really happened here. There are three non-mutually-exclusive types of people here persecuting Zimmerman:

1) Black racists who, no matter what actually happened, will flock screaming to the side of the black person.

2) White people who are terrified that if they don't take the side of the black person (again, no matter what happened) they'll be labeled a racist and ostracized.

3) Stubborn idiots who may have chosen a side when the facts were not available, and will never admit that they are wrong.

That's all that's happening here. Anyone who stops foaming at the mouth for 10 seconds can see the truth. This huge "kid" pounced on a pudgy little neighborhood watch guy because he didn't like being watched. He took it too far and, unfortunately for him, the guy he was beating was armed. Case closed.

PS - before you tell me Zimmerman was huge and Trayvon was a small child, read the police report. Zimmerman is 5'7". Then check out the small child in the 7-11 surveillance video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqLOeuBwJOI

So Visible,

You think shooting an unarmed teen who is walking down your street after following him -having been told NOT to do so- is right?!

Please enlighten us as to the circumstances you think were in place for this to be OK!

That the kid was taller than George? That He was black? that he was wearing a hoodie? that the cops(and dispatchers) don't know how to deal with a a suspicious person?

Please elaborate

@Visible, you must be stupid. good try on trolling tho

Who gives a rats azz? I mean really seriously? this is old news, cops got their man stopped the negros from chimpin out and burning down their neighborhood, robbing and looting, which has nothing to do with this, like rodney king, they drug a white truck driver out of his truck and beat him about senseless left him with permanent brain damage, yet the blacks think this is ok, then the young woman they knocked down stood on her and shot her in the chest killed her in cold murder, these innocent people were minding their own business and ended up dead because the black community had to have a legal free for all, well black azzes whats your response to this, all i can say is next time whites arent going to be victims, let the shooting begin, everybody points at the whites and calls us racist, when in fact its the blacks that are, bring it on, if fear your going to start a race war you cant win, and the media is complicit in it as well. By the way the side i choose is right let the courts handle it, wheres jesse jackson and al sharpton when blacks do wrong against whites? aint gonna happen because when a black does something to a white it doesnt matter, but oh yeah it does.

PM are you just stupid or just @!$%#ing blind GZ shot TM after TM attacked him.There is no evidence to support that GZ continued to follow TM after he was told and i quote "we don't need you to do that" from the 911 operator so please shut up with the crap that GZ followed him after being told not too or prove that he did i am waiting so it's time to @!$%# or get off the pot lets have that proof moron.

whatever happened to bringing only your fists to a fist fight. Just cause you are getting your ass kicked doesn't mean you need to shoot.

PM, you are blatantly distorting the truth and you know it. How do you live with yourself?

You think shooting an unarmed teen who is walking down your street after following him -having been told NOT to do so- is right?!

No - I think shooting a huge guy who jumps you, breaks your nose and is on top of you smashing your head against the concrete is called SELF DEFENSE. Period.

It's absolutely astonishing that the chorus here simply changed from "small child running in fear from giant murderer" to "Trayvon had the right to beat George because he got out of his car" without skipping a beat. Change the case, twist the facts, make up words like "stalk", "murder", and "racist" to fit your agenda. To hell with the truth.

You should also try reading a COMPLETE version of the story

By the end of 2011 Zimmerman was praising the Sanford PD.

"Zimmerman's relationship with police evolved, city files show"

"on September 18, 2011, he wrote an e-mail thanking the city's police chief and praising the department's "professionalism.

he said working with the department's community volunteer coordinator as part of neighborhood watch efforts "to curtail the spike in robberies and home invasions in (the) neighborhood within the past two months" had changed his view.

He praised the volunteer coordinator's quick responses to e-mails and phone calls, saying she went "above
and beyond to help launch a neighborhood watch" and calling her "a testament to the highest level of professionalism of (the chief's) administration."

"I have high hopes for, and restored faith in your administration and the Sanford Police Department in its
entirety," he wrote.

Zimmerman's e-mails with Sanford police show a pleasant, even friendly, relationship. In an e-mail dated
September 19, Sanford police volunteer coordinator Wendy Dorival thanked Zimmerman for his "kind words" sent to the chief. He responded, "It was with great pleasure that I sent that e-mail, you deserve the recognition!"

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/24/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

No wonder liberals are always so uniformed and cluless... their media prefers it that way.

Obviously being caught editing the 911 call taught MSNBC nothing. Pathetic.

George-2463560

whatever happened to bringing only your fists to a fist fight. Just cause you are getting your ass kicked doesn't mean you need to shoot.

There isn't but one way to fight. Fight to win. Bring anything you have. Travon showed up at a Gun fight without a Gun..........

If you think differently than this, then I doubt you've ever been in a fight.

The blacks don't like this outcome because now they have to be careful who they pick to mug.......

I still want to see Travon's route that night. Was it straight to the house where his dad was bangin' dad's GF. Where was Travon's mom while all this was going on?

Well said. Someone comes at me and they better be ready for the consequences. You take that chance when you attack someone and little travy lost. I would also ask...where was mommy dearest? We already know where (sperm donor) I mean dear old dad was and it certainly wasn't taking care of HIS son.

AmericanVeteran1

Ever wonder what happened to MSNBC's follow up articles on the fine young man they just caught up to the other day who was posing as a police officer and murdered two other humans?

Kay total BS, your kid never walked to 7-11 by himself?

Visible

Sorry, I am a white person and I am also not afraid of being labeled a racist and ostracized. From the evidence that I have seen I can say that I do not believe GZ was on his way back to his vehicle and in my mind that makes all of his testimony suspect. If he was on his way back to his vehicle to meet the police, why would he need them to call him so he could direct them to his location when they arrived? I also have always believed that it is pretty convenient that there is not one single witness to any part of the altercation except for a few seconds when TM was on top of GZ. They all happened to show up at the same time and not a one of them attempted to help him, they just left the scene to contact the police. Not one person saw GZ following TM. Not one person saw GZ get out or his vehicle and chase TM. Not one person saw GZ going back to his vehicle. Not one person saw who attacked who. Not on person saw GZ shoot TM. But several witnesses just happened to see when TM was on top of GZ "bashing" his head into the sidewalk.

It seems that you might be the stubborn idiot that chose a side when facts were not available and will never admit you are wrong. The facts are not there to prove that TM attacked GZ nor are they there to prove that GZ attacked TM but since I don't believe that he was on his way back to his vehicle as I stated before and why I believed that then I take his whole testimony as being suspect.

So Donna - your contention is that all of the witnesses and the police are in on some big conspiracy? Is that really what you're saying?

The facts are not there to prove that TM attacked GZ

Oh yeah? The witness statements, police report, EMT report, doctor's report, coroner's report, the 911 calls - none of those are facts that TM attacked GZ? What exactly would you consider a fact? I'm dying to know.

Oh, I'm sorry, the entire planet is in on this conspiracy, so nothing really matters (unless it can be twisted against GZ).

CANCEL THE TRIAL! STRAIGHT TO THE ELECTRIC CHAIR!

Based on some mystery evidence - evidence that the prosecutor has admitted under oath they do not have, and evidence that she cannot articulate - Donna doesn't believe Zimmerman was on his way back to his car!

Case closed. Now we can get some rest!

This is actually a pretty simple case, whether or not Z was on his way back to his truck, whether or not not he disregarded a dispatchers instructions (I actually think Z thought he was following a request from dispatch to find out which way Martin was heading), none of this makes any difference, its not relevant, what this will come down to is who threw that first punch. Until that first punch was thrown, neither of them had broken any laws, and each one had a right to do what they were doing, Martin had a right to be where he was, and Z had a right to be where he was. The evidence points to Martin throwing the first punch simply because Z had the injuries and Martin had none. GZ had every much of a right to stand his ground as Martin did. And lets not forget, GZ doesnt have to prove himself innocent, the prosecution has to prove him guilty.

IMO Angela Corey overcharged GZ knowing that the first DA was right in that there is no way to get a conviction, but in order to get Sharpton, Jackson and the rest of the race baiters off her back she charged him with something she knows she cant get a conviction on, and thereby seeing that justice, even if it is backdoor justice, is done.

YEAH! It's up to us REAL AMERICANS to drive down the street killing those we believe to be a waste of space. They would have ended up dead eventually anyway.

(if you didn't figure it out yet... /sarc)

How are those knuckles doing?

proudamericanveteran - How dare you judge the worthiness of Treyvon Martins life. You are a miserable piece of Sh#T. You are scum and just about the most disgusting person I have read in all of these post. I doubt you are the veteran of anything but your own imagination; a person who would defend this country is the kind of person who would defend the life of everyone in this country. Not just those whose lives you feel are worthy.

Is this the standard for conservatism? Well, I am proud to be a liberal and I find very few people who call themselves liberal would say anything as hateful as that about anybody, even you deserve to live your life.

Bill-314065 really because most the post in here call GZ a racist, piece of sh**, murder and seem to be liberal, now I believe people can change so maybe he was not the best person now but maybe in a few years he sees the error of his ways and makes a change, but the fact is he was not a innocent boy he was a young man big enough to do bodily harm to someone and if he was not raised in a manor of not to trust a white man maybe he could of just stopped and asked the what the problem was and he probably would be alive today, I do not believe GZ is a racist he has a past that seems to indicate other wise this was a terrible mistake the cost a young man his life. Not one of us was there and as the evidence comes out it seems to support what GZ was saying all along, if TM was so scared as his girl friend said then why not call the police, in stead we have the word of a girl of what he said for all we know he could of told her he was going to mess this honky up and she is lying to convict GZ out of spite and pressure from the black community.

unemployed, I hope the message is sent to the black thug community that they just might get their head blown off when if they try being the tough guy. A small pistol more than evens up the match. In my case, if someone is beating me on the head, trust me, he will quit doing that as soon as I chamber a bullet. More and more of us have CCW, and please, black or white thugs remember that a pistol barks over here and bites over there.

I love how bill starts. how dare you judge the worthiness of Trey's life then he begins judging the worthyness of Proudamerican's. Sure he didnt say he deserved to die but i would say your are judging him as worth a piece of sh#t that he "is". Lets try this again without all the crazy.

"How dare you judge the worthiness of Trevon Martins life. Who are you to decide who lives and dies?A person who would defend this country is the kind of person who would defend the life of everyone in this country."

That sounds much better but alas your too caught up in your own rage that you just brought yourself to the same level as the person who you berate.

let's laugh and say !!! the fact is he was not a child he was a young man of seventeen and enless you have not been reading the news lately that is plenty old enough to kill a police officer who is just trying to ask a question or plenty old enough to almost kill two British visitors shall I keep going on he was no child and was not a innocent boy from what is being reported by the liberal media, being on drugs having jewelry that does not belong to you. The fact remains he was in an area that had some break-ins recently and he was not from the area so no one knew who he was so yes GZ should have followed him until the police showed up but instead TM decided he was going to protect himself and attacked GZ and since he was bigger and got the jump on GZ at that point if GZ thought his life was in danger then it was self defense.

This whole thing could have been avoided with just a little courtesy. Its been reported (I cant verify one way or the other) that Martin said "why are you following me" and GZ ansered with "what are you doing here", maybe if Martin had said "I live right over there and Im on my way home" this whole incident could have been avoided. Being asked a question does not give you the right to punch someone in the face, and that, by the evidence we have been provided, seems to be what happened, if you think Martin was in fear for his life and punched GZ, fine, but GZ has just as much right to be in fear for his life after being punched, and can take whatever measures he needs to defend himself.

IMHO GZ will be found not guilty because thats what the evidence will show. It has nothing to do with racism, prior bad acts by either, or anything else, it will be because of the evidence, nothing more and nothing less.

Steve I would agree if Zimmerman did it first when he saw him. When he's followed you awhile and you changed directions alot. Only thing your going to think is he wants to hurt or kill me. If you been followed at night it scares you to death if you've gotten a few blocks and the person is following you. If he was doing turns and trying to avoid him you already know your going to be scared.

FACT: one has a criminal record of battery on a police officer and domestic violence

FACT: the other is a teenager. No police record. Period.

Let's laugh and say...

Do you know that Tray had no polic record? He's a minor and thus records would be sealed. He boasts on FB about how he beat up a bus driver and sells weed. He was suspended multiple times - at least once for possession of illegal substances.

Care to revise your statement?

Zimmerman has no criminal record he was never convicted of anything. Sorry, but that's how the US justice system works.

Dida105, the Sanford Police, Miami Police, and the Florida Department of Justice, Juvenile Division have all said that Martin had no criminal record, not that he had a sealed one, none at all. They have also said that Martin was not suspected in any crimes, nor was he the subject of or involved in any investigations.

The "bus driver" story is based off of a Twitter post his brother put up. It is vague, nebulous and unvetted. The Miami Police have said they have no record of an incident like this taking place around the time of the post, plus no bus driver has come forward to claim this happened to him.

There is no proof he sold "weed," and the suspension was for having a baggie that tested positive for marijuana residue, not any actual drugs. Some reports said there was also a "pipe," but that seems to be in dispute.

Dida105, you have not done research, and lack the factual information.

Care to revise your statement?

Dida you are stupid, trayvon has no police record by nice try troll. again another zimmerman supporter who doesnt have @!$%# on this case.

Care to revise your statement?

see what i did there?

TM didn't have a record...but that doesn't mean he was a good kid. It just means he was careful and never got caught.

Jack, going under that logic, you could claim anyone is a criminal, or "bad" person. They just haven't gotten caught yet, according to you.

The police cannot talk about a teenager's record if it is sealed because of his age. How long would an officer have his job if he publicly said that Trayvon had a criminal record. About five minutes, as that is illegal, therefore it is very possible, maybe even very probable that his record is not clean.

Actually they have admitted he was suspended several times but not releasing the reasons in all the cases as he was a minor

Melissa, I do not think it was the police, maybe the school.

Zimmerman supporters are a bunch of fanboys, just looking for the next bandwagon to jump on.

Aren't the people on the opposite side of this case just bandwagon fanboys/girls as well?

Personally I believe this case will be thrown out. If not, then it is up to the jury to decide.

reggie99 - You call it "pro-Zim" yet admit that they completly leave out the fact that he got along well with the officers by the end of year... how is that "pro-Zim"? it is just a pathetic attempt to make him look like a hot-head with an attitude.

MSDNC pleases most liberals, most of the time.

The dominoes are definitely falling. Most likely to this case being thrown out and Zimmerman walking.

How does that make you feel?

Yea being concerned about his neighborhood, incompetent cops, and the beating of a homeless black man by a white officer .... what an awful guy (sarcasm).

Amazing the # of people that cannot seem to comprehend or reason with what is put in front of them.

An aside....your comment really did make me laugh out loud. Thanks!

I think it is Les Miserable that Trayvon was too proud of his ability to punch a 5'7" someone out. He let his fists overload his mouth, and paid with his life. Without the gun, Zimmerman could just as well be dead now. In the long run, many lives could be better because the thugs have been apprised of the consequences of being a wannabe tough guy. A world without guns means the big wins ninety nine percent of the time in a fight with a weaker, or old individual. I think a few black lives have been saved by this case. If not, then some are just too dumb for belief.

MSNBC provides evidence of their worthlessness on a daily basis... somehow they forget to include the rest of 2011 when got along well with the police, I suppose it didn't fit their "Zimmerman is satan" narrative that their sheep so gladly eat up.

"Zimmerman's relationship with police evolved, city files show"

"on September 18, 2011, he wrote an e-mail thanking the city's police chief and praising the department's "professionalism.

he said working with the department's community volunteer coordinator as part of neighborhood watch efforts "to curtail the spike in robberies and home invasions in (the) neighborhood within the past two months" had changed his view.

He praised the volunteer coordinator's quick responses to e-mails and phone calls, saying she went "above
and beyond to help launch a neighborhood watch" and calling her "a testament to the highest level of professionalism of (the chief's) administration."

"I have high hopes for, and restored faith in your administration and the Sanford Police Department in its
entirety," he wrote.

Zimmerman's e-mails with Sanford police show a pleasant, even friendly, relationship. In an e-mail dated
September 19, Sanford police volunteer coordinator Wendy Dorival thanked Zimmerman for his "kind words" sent to the chief. He responded, "It was with great pleasure that I sent that e-mail, you deserve the recognition!"

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/24/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

No wonder liberals are always so uniformed and cluless... their media prefers it that way.

Obviously being caught editing the 911 call taught MSNBC nothing. Pathetic.

And yet, here you are on a media website, in the comments section no less. You know you have a choice whether or not to patronize media sites.....

pjam,

MSNBC provides evidence of their worthlessness on a daily basis

Then why are you here?

stepane and alsophia....Do you own it? You want only crazy liberal posters? We are here to see that doesnt happen. Media already has almost a monoply on what news people hear and you want to carry that even further....Burned many books lately??? I will bet that you think it is a crime that any opinion that isnt leftist/socialist is allowed to be heard or visible. We are here to let people know that their propaganda is phony and a lie......Too bad that you want no other ideas or freedom of the individual to be available....Are you really Americans?? or just socialists? Trials are supposed to be fair and unbiased....apparently you are against that too...

J.A.

You couldn't imagine how many books I've burnt lately. I just about busted the springs on my pickup hauling the last load to the bonfire. And anyone whose opinion doesn't match mine that I could catch I tied to a post in the middle of the fire. Then I took the best parts down to my roadside barbeque stand and sold sandwiches to the dumb rednecks.

You sure are sensitive. You come on this blog and trash MSNBC, someone asks why you're here and you jump back with all kinds of stupid erroneous accusations. What's your prob? Ain't getting any lately? Maybe you should try one of my down home barbeque sandwiches.

MSDNC trashes their own credibility with their campaign for the exalted one, Barack Hussein Obama.

alsop....that was as dumb as I expected it to be....

Do not walk, run to school for an education.

Tracy,

Says something about his character?

how bout you do some research before you bash all cops.... some cops dont have backup 24/7 some cops ride alone to work everynight and are all alone on shift. you really want these cops (who are in fact people too with families) to go out and start a war on drugs on there own? talk about major expectations. not saying the lazy ones need to just quit and do something else, im just saying that sometimes they dont have the manpower to go after "real criminals" btw last time i checked kids smoking pot are still breaking the law...which makes them coincedentally REAL CRIMINALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Smoking Cannabis (a plant and natural herb) does not make one a criminal. The sad thing is, is that due to this stupid drug war we have ridiculously high numbers of people in prison for what I call victimless crimes.

The funny thing angrywoman is that tens of millions of Americans smoke marijuana, likely many people you know. Would you throw them all in prison? Wake up.

The prohibition on Marijuana will be repealed soon. And much the better.

Have a magnificent day :)

Angrygal,

Yeah, ok, pot is illegal. But if there is a drug culprit in this case it is probably the prescription drug adderall that Zimmerman was taking. Study up on it. It has strange side effects. Like out of the blue for no reason anger and aggression. Pot, on the other hand as almost everyone realizes by now, tends to make one a little more laid back and peaceful. Sounds like you might need a good doobie. Might calm you down some.

Exactly. They are too busy stopping tax payers for stupid stuff like no right turn to drum up revenue for the dept. Catching real criminals doesn't pay as much. One more reason for the 2nd amendment! If more peopled carried, I guarantee thugs like travy would think twice about attacking someone.

Pantera,

Until such day happens smoking Marijuana is ILLEGAL except for California. So possessing, distributing or smoking it is STILL illegal until IF and when the law is changed. Possessing, distributing or smoking marijuana is NOT a victimless crime. Just ask that soldier who just returned from Afghanistan about how smoking Marijuana is a victimless crime! See if he/she agrees with your illogical statement! I doubt very serioulsy they will!

As for MSNBC and their printing only half the story about Zimmerman's speech in front of Town Council...Seriously does anyone really believe that this was just an oversight? Not hardly, their agenda (and yes they have an agenda just as every news organization does now) is to incite racism, and incite hate for anyone who does not tow the leftist democratic party line or speaks ill of their President. So all along since this incident happened this has been MSNBC's Agenda. They have done everything they can to make this about race and hate on the part of Zimmerman. They have ignored countless evidence to the contrary and have actually FABRICATED evidence to suit their agenda! To make matters worse they have made it nearly impossible for Zimmerman to get a fair trial as they have been spewing their lies over the Internet and over the airwaves for months. As a result the Jury pool is so tainted it is pitiful. There is not a human being on this earth that has not seen an article or heard someone spewing the MSNBC hate. If they have not then they have been living under a rock and probably would not qualify for jury duty anyway!

Now that the evidence is slowly being released it is disproving the story line that MSNBC created! It leaves me to wonder why on earth is the prosecutor releasing all of this evidence to the media? Maybe they realize they have no case and the only way out is to taint the jury pool and get the case tossed so they can save face. Based solely on what has been released so far it seems that if they had gone to a Grand Jury they would have gotten a "No Bill" and the case would be closed. However, instead they have bowed to the pressure of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton and filed charges that they can't support.

Keep smoking that Marijuana and listenting to MSNBC and you can dumb your slef down with the rest of America!

Sounds like quite a few liberals indulge way to much in a doobie, my son is a police officer and goes out when he is on duty to calls where he does not know what is waiting for him behind a door is 17 year old man with a gun and a attitude because the white man keeps him down or is a homeless person trying to find a place out of the weather the fact remains when you idiots who criticize the police when you need them expect them to be there in a hurry like when your boy friend is betting your a** while he is tripping on crack the fact is most try and do a good job but the fact that people just want to make it hard on them to do there job. The fact is you arrest the young doobie smoker to get him to roll over on his dealer then you try to get his dealer to roll over on his dealer that is why they arrest the young because they can use this going to ruin the rest of your life including going to college so they will turn on the dealer the fact that some do not have a clue about how the police work just proves how wrong you are about the police.

Some intrepid reporter ought to take a closer look at Zimmerman's career as the Retreat's only member of the Neighborhood Watch, and the police record on what he achieved while doing it. According to another article, someone credited him with a single arrest and a "solving crimes", yet there are no actual details on any of those things. Inquiring minds would like to know more.

Why?

Because with all these crimes, burglaries, thefts and break-ins, and such a zealously loyal neighbor as Zimmerman on watch in the 7 months before he killed Trayvon, it stands to reason that he must have accomplished something POSITIVE, right? If he hasn't, one might wonder exactly what his purpose was.

After all, someone who spends a lot of watching the neighborhood and making an extraordinary number of calls to the cops with no results might be suspected of casing the joint and social engineering.

So, how about it, MSN? Forget this killing controversy for a moment - how about some real investigation? Give us the scoop: was Zimmerman a crime-solver or a crook before he killed Trayvon?

Actually no, if you have it from the hospital and its under the government you can get it. They bring it to you already wrapped and everything. Just not many people can get on that, you have to be really bad off to get onto that. I think its only 100 people in the US that are on that list to get it that way.

You mean a current picture of him dead on a slab at the morgue?

That picture would be alright with me, at least it would not be a five year old picture of tiny Trayvon. When Zimmerman walks from this, he should sue the ass off MSDNC for slander.

I'll bet you voted for Obama.

Gary - I didn't vote for Obama and I agree with lady-d.

I tend to think you're spot on there Gary Gordon!

yeah what an excellent forensic detective you are.. she points out even one fact thats supportive of the black kid so "she voted for obama."

anybody ever call you a dispicable racist before? stereotypes are the best you can do.

Lady D,

Continue drinking the Koolaid and smoking weed with Pantera. Not one single thing you have posted in your post is based upon any fact! You were NOT there and all you have to go off of is the half truths that MSNBC and the rest of the Liberal Media put out! You obviously believe everything you are told and read...So sad!

There is PROOF that Zimmerman was attacked and beaten and had every reason to believe that his life was in danger! Therefore "Stand Your Ground" applies! He had a reasonable assumption that his life was in danger! Yes getting beaten repeatedly counts!

As for those who are talking about the witnesses that have changed their story after the media started filling in the blanks with hearsay information and for the ones who say Zimmerman's demeanor after the shooting was not that of a man who had just been assaulted and was in fear for his life...grow up!!! Who the hell made you an expert on how someone should react after a shooting?

Just recently there was a 24 hour restaurant that 2 teenagers decided to rob with a gun. One yells for everyone to get down and the other brandished a gun. A patron in the restaurant who had a valid CWP pulled his gun and shot both. No charges filed he was within his rights of not having to retreat. He was LAWFULLY in the place of business and a right to be there and he felt his life and the lives of others were in jeopardy. Afterwards he was not all freaked out and sobbing not did not curl up into a little ball and start sucking his thumb. He placed his weapon back in his holster and awaited the Sheriff Department. So just because you felt your life was in danger and you stand your ground does not mean you should exhibit some signs of emotional distress!

Lastly he had NO OBLIGATION to mitigate the circumstances. He felt his life was in danger as his assaulter was not showing any signs of relenting and he felt his life was in danger and he was LAWFULLY there and had a right to be there (Zimmerman lived there). No the dispatcher did NOT tell him to leave (point held up by evidence, just listen to the tape) NO the dispatcher did not tell him to leave, that he had no right to be there. Therefore SYG was fully justified!

All that is left now is the grandstanding for Obama, Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton by the Special Prosecutor. If this woman had such a great case it would make since that you not play it out in the media and release evidence; that is unless you knew you were in over your head!

Lastly this is another smack in the face for Obama! He opened his trap and made a comment of support that he had no business doing so! The POTUS is the ultimate enforcer of the Constitution and to be commenting on a case that is not close to going to trial and has no bearing on Constitutional Law nor effect on US Policy is purely a bias and personal opinion! It is NOT his job to make personal opinions!

ladyd what you say to a certain point has some merit you are leaving out the hoodie which covers his face so GZ could not tell he was a young man and when TM is on top pounding his head in to the concrete he was in fear of his life. The other fact is I'm happy that no one on your watch group would ever follow any one so why do you have watch group that goes out on patrol, so if you see someone you don't know walking between your neighbors house you are going to walk away and hope the police show up sometime in the next 10 to 15 minutes what if your neighbor was inside, you just going to walk away because if you watch then you are following him and you wouldn't want to step on this persons rights,so now you have left this person out of your site so he can maybe break in to your neighbors house and hurt them or do what ever he wants. So again why do you have a neighbor hood watch group.

I'm not sure I understand your post. I am not speaking in hypothetical terms. You suggest vague, worst possible scererios to me and this debate is not about my neighborhood. This is not about the "what ifs?".

This is a debate about what did happen.

"these @!$%#s always get away" when martin wasnt committing a crime. sweet profiling bro.

oh i dont know, but i'd go with "extreme feelings of inadequacy." but i'm no forensic phsychologist like our friend above.. he even knows whom people voted for.