A lot of people think he is guilty of a crime. Many think he is innocent. It is time to set back and let Justice take it's Course. Let the man go through a trial and whatever decision is made we should say "It is what it is"

What a crock. If Zimmerman did not disclose the ammount of his defence fund it was his lawyers doing. The laywer is calling the shots. It is for the court to to decide his guilt or innocence. The idea that he could take the defence fund and leave town is a crock. Betting he has no access to a dime of that money!

Why is this even a story ?? So what he few back to Florida.I was really expecting to have more information (new) but most of this is the same as the last one that was up for comment. Oh well

stevepalm said:

Martin was a drug punk, no loss there with that dirtball.... Zimmerman should have not drank coffee that fateful day... move on too a real story.....

First off, it's disrespectful to refer to the dead, who can't defend himself, as a 'drug punk' when the medical examiner said the amount of THC in his bloodstream was below the level 'considered to cause impairment'. And no child should be referred to by anyone as a 'dirtball'. Martin, had he not been shot and killed that night, had an entire life to turn himself around and reform, and while it may be likely that he would not, it is also equally likely that he could. Olympic medal winner Michael Phelps smoked a bong when he was younger--does that diminish the fact that he decided not to be a drug addict and now has seven gold medals to show for that decision? To kill Martin before he could exercise that option is the tragedy.

If you're going to consider Martin as being under the influence of drugs (even though the pot in his blood was too low to cause impairment) then you have to append that to Zimmerman as well, who was being treated by a psychologist with benzodiazepines and amphetamines--which, according to wikipedia can have the side effect of causing 'aggression' and 'lack of control over socially unacceptable behavior'.

And...what does coffee have to do with all of this? A morning cup of coffee would have been the last thing I would think of as being a causative agent of that day's tragedy--I credit that to Zimmerman's decision to even take his gun out of the house that day when he was simply running to Target on an errand. I live in a neighborhood that is border territory for five different gangs--two sects of Crips, two sects of Bloods, a Mexican and a Salvadoran gang--and don't take my gun with me every time I leave my house. In fact, I've never once needed to take it out of my bedroom.

If you don't have anything constructive to say, by all means, please move onto a 'real' story. There has to be a zombie eating someone somewhere today...

LOL. Yerrrr right.....

Can't figure out if steve palm is an idiot or a troll. Perhaps both based on his ignorant, brainless excuse for a post. Nothing personal, I'm sure he's a cool dude and all, just says some jack @!$%# stupid drivel.

I can assure you, the person who wants him out on bond the most , is the County Sheriff; he will have to keep him in isolation, post extra deputy's near his cell, double check on his food, and he will be alone with a guard in the exercise yard; the prosecution wants to keep him in jail, the longer the easier to make a plea deal; they well know that they cannot get a conviction; the prosecutor at the hearing even said, they are considering trying to move the case out of Florida.

killroy, you ask why this is a story, let me ask you this, when is it okay to lie to a judge. Seriously, why would you like to a judge. You have to be a moron if you think it is okay to lie to a judge.

Another point is that George has continued to not listen to anyone and that is why he will go to jail. He didn't listen to his first two attorneys and imo he is not listening to the current one. Also should he have not learned that the jails in Florida records every visit and conversation. We learned that in the Casey Anthony case and that is why she stopped her parents from visiting.

Saxson

I think You are on to something there,trying to force Zimmerman to cop a plea seems to be the only hope those incompetents have left of salvaging whatever is left of their reputations, because if the stunning lack of evidence that has been," presented", so far,in order to charge Zimmerman, is not greatly increased in the near future, why should the prosecutors themselves not be put behind bars for causing a false imprisonment, and be charged with misleading the court, and wasting the people's time and money?

Trevon was a typical teen. lots of teens experiment. The THC level in his body only means he was not impared. to call teyvon a drug addict is to call all teens, includung your own, the same. I think I can reasonably guess we all expiremented with something.

Addressing Zimmerman, as was said on World News Show, the Court was not aware that he had such an account and when they found out about it and how much money there was the court took action accordingly. Lawyer don't always volunteer information they don't have to. Judges are people to and they watch and listen to news shows.

But JD, can you explain to me why George keeps doing the stuff he is doing? He is endangering himself by not listenting to his attorney. He is the one who is doing all of this to himself. 6dogs, you are right to know that the court did not know. I knew about it because it was posted on the news before his bail was set because his two former attorneys stated that he stopped speaking to him and they told him not to set up the account and that they were no longer going to be his attorneys. Now if the judge watches the news, he could have seen it, but it is the job of the defense to let the court know these things.

Valhallaarwen

Read David's post below,(3.12), he gives an excellent explanation concerning Zimmerman's actions with his passport and defense funds.

And the only way he will "walk" is if the jurors are all white/hispanic.

@Wiz-3385151,

Trevon was a typical teen? He attacked a guy, if that's being a typical teen then our world is doomed. Teenagers have to follow the law just like everyone else, and Assault is a crime. and I know someone is gonna bring this up, Zimmerman didnt harass Trevon, Stalk? well stalking is part of being a neighborhood watch(which no one disputed him having that position). So he was allowed to stalk.

You're absolutely right, Trayvon Martin was a typical teen but where things got fuzzy for you is when you said he assaulted Zimmerman. When did that happen because last I looked Zimmerman was ordered hence the word ordered to stop following that kid and he didn't. Now listen up because this is where it gets tricky, not only did he NOT stop following Trayvon like the cop asked him but now he gets out of his car and stalk him even more on foot. At this point according to his girlfriend Trayvon was scared because he didn't know what this man was up to (not to mention he didn't know this fool had a gun to kill him with) which gave him the right to defend himself because Zimmerman was stalking him for a while. Now who looks suspicious? And that same law that you so graciously say Trayvon has to follow well Zimmerman is no exception to that law either. Zimmerman's day is here now and all those lies that he thought would save his a** are now catching up with him. Listen closely in case you haven't heard there's no law against walking in the rain with a hood on with snacks in your hand so don't go shooting up every"TYPICAL TEEN" as you put it because of that. Just thought you should know.

Wiz, you are incorrect, stalking is a crime. Any neighborhood watch knows their job is to watch and report suspicious activity, period. For your sake remember stalking is a crime should your wife or girlfriend leave you, do not stalk her.

All the Hatred against Zimmy here, and No One cares about the abuse of the court. What the court is saying, is "if you had more money, you could have still been granted bail, we just would have made you pay more. " Thats punishment before conviction. You dont think for a minuet that this wasnt a planed set up by the court for the very purpose of destroying his credibility? If you dont see that your hatred is too deep in your souls.

But i know all of you haters are more interested in hanging an innocent man. Your blood lust is showing.

That 135k was all over the news, long ago! WE knew - but the State and the Judge didn't? Really?

Then shame on them. This a game by the DA - they have no case - so this is their best shot.

thanks JD

Zimmerman will walk. Assuming this case even makes it to trial the only way he will be found guilty is if all of the jurors are black.

the only way he will "walk" is if the jurors are all white/hispanic.

He might walk, but even if he does he'd better change his whole appearance, get a completely new identity and move to another country, because if he stayed here his life would be a living hell.

Hear the Black Panthers' comments on him? That should tell you everything you need to know.

I see some people are accusing Zimmerman of "lying to a judge" for not being psychic. Some people laugh at holding an innocent man in jail for who knows how long without bail. The purpose of bail is to ensure that the person shows up for all his court appearances. There is no indication that he is a flight risk. The only reason anyone wants to hold him is because they want him to plead to something of which he is not guilty to make to torture stop.

HEY MO.....he set the account up....amnesia is a wonderful thing..

THank you to all the contributers to the Geroge Zimmerman defense fund....

But the real thanks goes to his lawyers, his wife, and George himself...

You are the liar we all know you to be....

if you know you have a defens fund and you know people are contributing to it ...all you had to say was just that and that you did not know how much was there at the time or give an estimate....

Who does not know how many passports they have...this is such an involved task that you had to know, you have to fill out an application for a new passport, it tells you that if yu locate the old passport to return to state department....

SO what he did not take advantage of the money and passport....he was in hiding, which could be looked at as I am waiting for more donations (NOT TAX DEDUCTIBLE) and when i have enough i will skip town with my forgotten passport.

I see to many reports about PTA members and other people incharge of money take money that does not belong to them and skip town....

Hey there Frankie Boy, think you might be in hiding also if the Black Panthers were looking for you?

@Pvblivs,

I see some people are accusing Zimmerman of "lying to a judge" for not being psychic. Some people laugh at holding an innocent man in jail for who knows how long without bail. The purpose of bail is to ensure that the person shows up for all his court appearances. There is no indication that he is a flight risk. The only reason anyone wants to hold him is because they want him to plead to something of which he is not guilty to make to torture stop.

Ummmmm, That's where you are wrong it's not up to "some people" damn what we may think. "Some people aren't accusing him of lying to the judge the JUDGE himself accused Zimmerman of that. And guess what now his little plot that he and his wife had going has blown up in his face. And at the end of the day George Zimmerman made his bed hard now he has to lay in it. He's the reason of his own demise. This is that Karma everyone was talking about.

Unfortunagely, the bottom line for Zimmerman, he should have stayed in his vehicle and waited for a patrol car to investigate. Too bad he didn't think it through. He could have saved himself all this mess, and prevented a death.

And on top of his troubles, he's now accused of concealing assets from the Judge that is trying his case. Another example of poor judgement.

This case is a shame all the way around. No matter how this case turns out, he is responsible for the chain of events that occured.

steve palm Comment collapsed by the community

Martin was a drug punk, no loss there with that dirtball.... Zimmerman should have not drank coffee that fateful day... move on too a real story..... 41 people shot in Chicago with 10 in pine boxes in Obamaland..... this all in 48 hrs....

trayvon martin was not a "drug punk". he was more or less the average teenager as far as behavior. have you ever carved anything on a desk in school? did any of the lockers in the school you attended have anything written on them?

Amanda-2017567

First off, it's disrespectful to refer to the dead, who can't defend himself, as a 'drug punk' when the medical examiner said the amount of THC in his bloodstream was below the level 'considered to cause impairment'. And no child should be referred to by anyone as a 'dirtball'. Martin, had he not been shot and killed that night, had an entire life to turn himself around and reform, and while it may be likely that he would not, it is also equally likely that he could.

amanda, trayvon martin was an "a" and "b" student who was getting ready to take his psat's

from the orlando sentinel

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-17/news/os-trayvon-martin-shooting-tension-20120317_1_shooting-death-english-teacher-uncle

"He was extremely creative," said Michelle Kypriss, Trayvon's English teacher at Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School in Miami. "He just loved building things. He really was intrigued by how things worked."

She described Trayvon, a junior, as an A and B student who majored in cheerfulness.

and this is a little incorrect

Olympic medal winner Michael Phelps smoked a bong when he was younger--does that diminish the fact that he decided not to be a drug addict and now has seven gold medals to show for that decision? To kill Martin before he could exercise that option is the tragedy.

micheal phelps was caught on a cell phone by a "friend" after the olympics hitting a bong

http://www.naturalnews.com/025489_smoking_Michael_Phelps_food.html

Olympian Michael Phelps Caught Smoking Bong, Media Pressured to Kill Photos

He has a huge amount of uncleared cash, an extra passport and apparently had to be contacted about his revocation of his initial bond.

Out of state, loaded with money and a real passport plus an attorney who thinks the vast majority of us are stupid with this statement

O'Mara said in a posting on the defense team's website that he would seek a new bond hearing, at which he would argue that "the vast majority" of the donated money was in an independently managed trust and that neither "Mr. Zimmerman or his attorneys have direct access to the money."

Could O'Mara please cough up the name of this independently managed trust which I think are only code words for assets in his wife's name or one of her relatives. Nice try, but it still doesn't pass the sniff test.

No, Manns, Zimmerman didn't make his own bed. Oh, a corrupt judge may also be part of the chorus that wants Zimmerman to plead guilty to something just to get the torture to stop. But that doesn't invalidate anything I have said.

There is no evidence that supports that he continued to follow Martin if you listen to the tapes from 911 you clearly hear him say ok after the 911 operator says "you don't have to do that" please stop spreading misinformation.

td49 - 'this guy nothing wrong?' What do you call taking a life and where is your moral compass? He murdered Trayvon Martin and will have two more years to think about it as he sits in the slammer!

AngryWhitemale - 'please stop spreading misinformation'. No worries, he'll have his day in court to prove otherwise.

William,

Trayvon was shot because he jumped Zimmerman.

Penelope,

He must be an idiot also considering he called 911 before he shot the prey he was stalking.

__________________

Now concerning this new twist in the case. It would be nice to know when he setup the Facebook page and when the funds were deposited into the Paypal account. I am no accountant but I am pretty sure his lawyer will argue that the funds were donations for his defense fund. It is logical to not consider it personal assets.

Probably why he kept it in the Paypal account and didnt withdraw it. There is no secret Paypal accounts, as this story insists. This is not Switzerland or the Cayman Islands.

It will be interesting to see what the bond is set at now. Probably $197,000 more than the original bond.

This is clearly harassment by the judge.
Zimmerman isn't going to run off because he knows there isn't enough evidence to convict him.

America Today-Anthony - he and his wife lied to the court. Try = Zero bond!

Mike Fillmore - "This is clearly harassment by the judge." What kind of reasoning is that and why are you seeking ways for Zimmerman to get off when he hasn't had his trial in a court of law? He could have clearly run, but he couldn't hide the fact that he and his wife lied to the court.

Time to thank all the right wingnuts for their contributions to the defense fund, which allowed the judge to see what a real liar this guy is. He lied to the cops about self defense and he lied about his personal economic status, that's two right there, and if he's such a law abiding citizen, why did he commit perjury?

Of the topic, but why the hell does the Cayman Islands have to be the go to place for secret accounts? And no most are not held there.

His lawyer will argue that these were contributions to a defense fund and not personal assets.

Steve,

How do you know he lied to the police about self defense? Are you witness number 8?

The only pieces of evidence that are relevant are forensics from the gun shot wound, the 911 calls, and eye witness testimony.

Everyone wants to use any bit of Zimmerman's past as proof that he is guilty. Mental disorders, medication, etc, but if you even whisper anything about Trayvon's past and you are labeled a racist, right wing, nut job.

ViVa America!~

Of course Zimmerman did something wrong. We cannot allow a person to carry a loaded gun, start a conflict with another person, and then shoot the other person to death and claim self defense.

How do you know he lied to the police about self defense?

He seems to have lied about a great many things. At this point, I do not believe anything Zimmerman says. I don't have to be a mother-@!$%#ing witness to figure that out. Once a liar, always a @!$%#ing liar.

Harassment by the judge? Yea judges do get a little harassing when you lie in their courtroom.

America Today-Anthony When you carry a concealed weapon and you pursue someone without a good reason, except he "looked suspicious", then its not self defense, its a direct attempt to provoke a confrontation, and its was obviously threatening to a teenager, it is not a stand your ground case, but of course this is my opinion, I am quite content to let this be figured out in court.

the fact is...if he had remained in his car and waited for poice nothing would have happened...he had an itchy trigger finger and was poised to use his gun against an UNARMED youth...what part of that is difficult to understand?

AgryWhiteMale:To believe that Mr.Zimmerman did not stalk Treyvon Martin you will also have to believe he shot him from his car.I believe your anger is getting in the way of you rationally evaluating the 911 tapes as we know them.

jonbad got it right. Zimmerman is claiming self defense because he was on the losing end of a conflict he initiated.

Brave Zimmerman hiding in an undisclosed location? what else is new? I do not have a black gene or Peruvian gene in my body ( that I know of ) I am of Irish Scot descent, so don't go calling me names. This boy is guilty guilty guilty. He left his car to follow treyvon AFTER the 911 operator told him we don't need you to do that. He has an attititude problem if he thinks he is the only one in the state of FLA that doesn't have to abide instruction from authorities. He went after Treyvon. If Treyvon got the jump on him, then good for him!! He was standign his ground! Difference is Treyvon had a bad of skittles as his only weapon, Z had a loaded gun.

And thats exactly what happend. The other thing that is suspicious is that Zimmermans DNA was not found on Trayvon Martin. I cant believe the number of lies Zimmerman told that people want to ignore. Are they really that afraid of Black/Brown skin?

Frankly I am surprised at all the people that are making a decision on this case by what they read on MSNBC news! As it is, MSNBC has shown they are not interested in the truth, but in keeping this news in the forefront and keeping the pot stirred! NO ONE reading any of this KNOWS what happened that night! I know I sure don't. Anyone who thinks they do know is deluded! The racism on both sides is overwhelming! Don't let the media rob Zimmerman of a fair trial, because today it's him, but tomorrow, it may be you that they are trying in the press! Time to sit back and wait for ALL the testimony to be shown, and then for an accurate verdict based solely on the evidence presented, and not on suppositions!

Robert Eagle I could not have said it better. You know, the only, and I mean ONLY news agency who has been fair during this whole ordeal, telling people to hold thier judgement is,,, drum roll please,,, FOX. Hilarious...

Anthony - You are fighting a loosing battle against some of these folks by trying to counter doctored 911 tapes, hysterical rage and outright lies with facts. The way the public has been conditioned to only listen to that which fits their own narrow view of a situation is pathetic.

If you dare to defend Zimmerman, you are a right wing nut job. If you dare to mention Martin's past you are a racist. If you dare to suggest that we let the courts decide this case, you are considered delusional. You can not win, no matter what, unless you wish to join the lynch mob after Zimmerman.

him being revoked is BS tammi smith walking, dahlia dipolita walking, this man hasnt even been tried. i have a sexual violent preditor against children living in my back yard you think for one min i would hestitate....not the kid was on dope and around the neighborhood zimmerman didnt get those cuts from himself JUDGE IS TRYING TO SET A EXAMPLE AND IT STINKS

Robert Eagle: a sane voice in the din.

American Today, there is no forensic evidence that Zimmerman and Martin were struggling over the gun at any time. Neither Martin's DNA, nor his fingerprints were found on the gun. There was also no gunshot residue on Martin's hands.

During the 911 call, it does sound like Zimmerman stops running, but there is no evidence that he stopped walking, and possibly looking for Martin. At no time during the 911 call does Zimmerman say he is returning to his car. We have only Zimmerman's statements for that.

Martin was also not shot anywhere near where Zimmerman claimed his truck was parked.

You are entitled to your opinion. If you believe Zimmerman is innocent, that is your right, but it would be advisable to have the proper facts to argue your point with.

@ROLDOC

My anger is not in the way i unlike so many of the mouth breathers on this blog have an open mind as i don't really know for sure if Zimm did in fact keep chaseing Martin or if he did stop as the 911 tape suggest.

TM Supporters=Zimm did continue to chase Martin

Zimm Supporters=he stopped and no longer chased Martin

There is NO evidence that really proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that either of these happened yes you can clearly hear Zimm on 911 tape say ok when told he did not need to chase Martin and by all accounts it does sound as if he quits running but no one really knows what he did after that.

Whether Zimm stopped and returned to his car and was attacked by Martin(as he states)or if he continued after Martin and confronted him is really unknown.Along with who started the fight will be very important to both sides of the case.

Too many people here are making assumptions on what they think happened that night,there is enough misinformation already no need to pour gas on a fire already burning.

CREDIBILITY is key in this case because the shooter is the only person who really knows what happened that infamous evening of February 26, 2012 where an unarmed teenager was shot and killed. GZ has claimed to have shot TM in self defense. There are many reasons why millions of people all over the globe do not believe GZ. Now the fact that he willfully, with the assistance of his wife and parents misled the court to believe he was indigent, knowing full well he had accumulated in excess of $135,000 in his online PayPal account has only added to our distrust in his account of why TM is dead. I think GZ is an accomplished, menacing, calculated liar who will do or say anything to avoid accountability for his actions. He's had brushes with the law in the past and managed to wiggle out of each one. All of those events were of a violent or aggressive nature. Although TM was far from angelic, he has no arrest record or history of involvement with the law. He experimented with drugs like many, including myself have. He slacked off in school, just like we all have at one point or another, but TM did not deserve to die that night just because GZ deemed him suspicious. If GZ had reported whatever suspicions he had about TM to the 911 operator and NEVER left his car, TM would still be alive today.

Thank you, this is what I have been saying all along.

Forensic evidence released to the public so far favors Zimmerman's account. Apparently that burns the craw of some who wanted him crucified without trial, so they leap onto this rather innocuous ruling as "proof" that Zimmerman's account is a lie (all forensic evidence and eye witness testimony be damned). This is little more than a procedural issue, but any little thing to tar and feather Z, right?

And you know, when OJ was on trial, you didn't see the KKK issuing bounties for his head, did you? Didn't see masses of white folks marching in "unity" and demanding their own brand of "justice." But ol' Z? Yep-- Black Panthers pounced on him as quick as anything, didn't they? And were there any criminal charges filed for this attempt to solicit murder? Nope.

It "sounds" like Zimmerman stopped running(pursuing Martin)?

How about Martin's girlfriend saying she heard Trayvon say "why are you following me" , and then a male say "what are you doing here"?

She has no reason to lie. Zimmerman has a very good reason to lie. He doesn't want a murder rap or to go to prison.

First......... pro Zim people say he did not have to obey the comment "we don't need you to do that"....and now they say he complied with it as it was a direct order he complied to.........taking lessons from Mitt the flip flop huh?....Zim and family just lied...he was caught........sure I believe his story...wink wink.....

A stopped a kid a few months ago walking through my own back yard!

How is that even remotely similar to the case involving Zimmerman. If you stopped this kid and he attacked you in your yard, you'd have every right to use deadly force. Zimmerman followed Martin around on public streets and then confronted him. He created and then escalated the encounter himself.

I should point out, as well, that when this whole thing made the news I advocated a wait-and-see approach. Let's see the evidence. Let's see how it plays out. The more I read, the more it seems that Zimmerman told the police a pretty accurate accounting of what happened. For all of those folks on here that say he stalked and killed TM in cold blood, can you please explain why (if that was his motive/plan all along) he would call 911 and tell them exactly what he was doing, exactly where he was and who he was and asked them to respond as soon as possible? Your fantasy is exactly that. This was a confrontation that spiraled out of control, but it seems Trayvon may have initiated criminal contact with Zimmerman. There is circumstantial evidence that supports that assertion-- Trayvon assaulted his bus driver and bragged about it on his twitter account-- so we know he had violent tendencies. There's also the eye-witness who saw Trayvon beating the tar out of Z with "MMA moves."

There isn't a chance in hell of a conviction. This will be a "Not Guilty" or mistrial case. Anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves.

This forum is a good example of the people that sit on juries and authorize the execution of innocent people in Texas.

No one on this forum has sufficient information to convict George Zimmerman. And he may be guilty.

alberewa, is using the same fallacious logic to declare Zimmerman guilty as Zimmerman used to decide Trayvon was suspicious.

ZGunnmann didn't have faith in the Sanford Police Department ("...they always get away...") so he took the law into his own hands.

America today Anthony said:

The only pieces of evidence that are relevant are forensics from the gun shot wound, the 911 calls, and eye witness testimony.

I'd respectfully like to disagree with you here.

Important pieces of evidence:

Police reports

EMT reports

ME's reports (Autopsy, toxicology, etc.)

Ballistics

Forensics

911 calls

Voiceprint analysis

List of medications either victim or suspect was taking

Eyewitness testimony

That last I'll admit but won't put too much credibility in. Eyewitness testimony is unreliable at times, and several have reportedly changed their story. When the Titanic sank some survivors said the ship went down in one piece, some said the ship wen down in two. It's now been conclusively proven that the ship snapped in half prior to sinking, so eyewitnesses who said they saw the ship go down in one piece were wrong--and they were THERE!

The forensics evidence suggests the two were struggling over Zimmerman's gun when it went off.

If they were struggling over the gun when it went off, there should be gunshot residue on Martin's hands. I haven't heard anything about it yet but I have no doubt it'll be looked at in the forensics after the trial--and please remember he was found by the respoonding officers lying face down on the ground, hands under his body, and the only mark on his hands is a nick on the ring finger which may have been caused by a class ring digging into the skin.

If you listen to the tape, which most of you have not, you can hear him running after Trayvon, the operator tells him to go back to the street and wait for the officer. You can HEAR him stop running and say ok to the operator. A minute and 20 seconds later Trayvon was shot. So are you trying to tell me that he stopped running, lied to the operator about going back to his car, hung up the phone, and then started sprinting in the direction Trayvon was running, found him, dragged him back towards his car, banged himself in the head a few times, jumped on top of Trayvon, put Trayvon's hands on the gun, and then pulled the trigger? All in a minute 20 seconds?

Zimmerman's story is that he called 911 about a suspicious person, then per the dispatcher's instructions he stopped following and returned to his vehicle, at which point he says he was jumped from behind by Trayvon, punched hard enough to break his nose, had his head slammed into the sidewalk multiple times, at which point he pulled a gun and shot the teen. Another version of the story recounted as hearsay from his family states that he was 'only a few minutes away from being in diapers the rest of his life'. Yet another version says he returned to his truck when he was jumped and managed to get his gun out of his truck and turned to fire on Martin.

Here are my problems with these versions of the altercation:

1) The Skittles and iced tea were apparently found at the scene, as that has been the major consistent portion of all the stories currently circulating except Zimmerman's version and the witnesses who said they saw Martin attack Zimmerman. Wouldn't Trayvon have dropped those items in the process of running away from Zimmerman, then coming back, punching Zimmerman and bashing his head into the sidewalk?

2) The timing:

1917 hours (7:17 PM)--Zimmerman calls/officers dispatched

1921:21 hours (7:21:21)--Zimmerman's call to 911 ends after 4 min 21 sec; at this point Martin is still alive.

1921:56 hours (7:21:56)--911 caller is on the phone saying two men are fighting outside her back porch. Sounds of a struggle and a person calling for help is heard, and then one shot rings out 45 seconds into the call (approximately 7:22:41). By the time the caller hangs up with 911, police are on the scene, as attested to by the caller stating that she has seen a flashlight. That would have been the first officer on the scene, as neither Zimmerman nor Martin reportedly had flashlights when found.

1930 hours 7:30 approximately)--Paramedic Brady declares Martin dead after Officer Ayala, Sergeant Raimondo, and Sergeant McCoy, and Paramedic Brady himself have attempted to revive Martin unsucessfully.

3) If Zimmerman indeed shot the teen after being jumped while trying to reenter his vehicle, why is the crime scene in the middle of a grassy area between two residences identified in the report as 1231 Twin Trees Ln and 2821 Retreat View Cir. and not by Zimmerman's vehicle? Did he shoot the boy, then drag the body to the grassy area? I think the cops would have noticed drag marks and blood, and I also think there wouldn't have been enough time for Zimmerman to have done so. The police report I quoted above says Trayvon is 6'00" and 160, and Zimmerman is listed as 5'09" and no weight is given, but I doubt Zimmerman would have been able to do this according to the timeline above.

Anthony:

No, I don't think Zimmerman would have had the time to do what you were suggesting in your post in the timeframe allotted. But I also don't think it happened in quite the way he's testified either.

At 7:21 and 21 seconds, Zimmerman hung up with 911. At this point he had lost sight of Martin and Martin was still alive.

At 7:21 and 56 seconds--35 SECONDS after Zimmerman hung up with 911, a caller calls 911 about two men fighting in her back yard. 45 seconds into that call a single gunshot is heard at 7:22:41.

So the question here is: what happened in those 35 seconds of unaccounted-for time? Is 35 seconds really long enough for everything Zimmerman has said in various accounts to have happened?

WMG, there is no proof, aside from a vague Twitter post, that Martin "assaulted" any bus driver. The police have no record of any incident like that occurring, nor has any bus driver come forward saying he was assaulted by Martin. Also the witness who claimed Martin was beating Zimmerman with "MMA style" moves, has since recanted his testimony, saying now that he saw no punches, and that Martin was only "pinning" Zimmerman to the ground.

Martin may have spoken to Zimmerman first, per Martin's girlfriend's statement, but that does not prove that Martin used physical force first. In fact, Martin's girlfriend's testimony claims the exact opposite.

I love how people keep saying the dispatched recording will be key in this case. How so? Just because it sounds as if GZ stopped following Zimmerman does not mean, once he hung up, that he did not go after him again. Likewise, the same people keep suggesting "if he wanted to kill TM, why would he call 911?"...it is entirely plausible it was all a plan in his demented mind. It is also acceptable that he was trying to do the right thing and lost it.

Personally, I think GZ was a frustrated man out to stop people he thought were bad...on his meds, his reality was totally skewed. He was tormented by the idea that he thought someone was doing wrong and that they would get away. So he reacted the only way he could think of and it got a person killed.

MSNBC...sorry but I gotta say this. This case did not divide me along racial or ethnic lines. I'm a white blue collar worker with a college education. I believe in our right to defend ourselves and have no problem with the responsible gun ownership. So why do I care? It is pertinent to me because of a stupid law that allows people to do bad things and claim that they were in danger---when by all accounts, even his own, GZ was never in danger until after he left his vehicle.

All I know is none of us were there and I think the "facts" of the case all point to GZ having very poor judgement and TM is dead. Is it second degree murder? Maybe, maybe not. GZ definitely had issues with blacks, and really, as a watch leader, should have known the rules better than most. Is it at least manslaughter? Absolutely. You can't even begin to follow someone down the street and if they defend themselves, then claim you were the one attacked even if you really were. By that logic, here is to hoping you are never followed because if you defend yourself, you'll be killed and no one will care.

@ApacheRosePea00

If they defend them self? Trevon didn't defend himself, he ATTACKED Zimmerman, there's a difference.

I say lets let the jury decide and IF he's found innocent, All the people that been calling him a racist outright should be sued for slander and character defamation.

If court cases relied on public opinion, anyone accused of a crime would be hung by a vigilante mob of bloggers... Folks, you DON'T KNOW all the facts so just stfu!

WMG21: Nobody said it was his plan to stalk and kill Martin, it was his plan to become a cop, he failed. He failed at every occupation that involved him carrying a loaded gun and being in a position of power over civilians therefore, determined to have this power he got certified in Fla to carry a firearm (easier than a mail-order clergy certificate) and volunteered to be a neighborhood watch guy WITH a gun. He PLANNED to impose his will on a fellow citizen whom he had no right to attempt to impose his will upon, when that citizen defended himself against this gun toting, wannabe rent-a-cop vigilante, that's when Zimmermen had his last shaming (being beaten up by a teenager HE had PURSUED) and snapped: pulled out a loaded gun (because he was getting his nosy, busy-body vigilante azz whooped due to him not actually being physically fit/trained to fight hand to hand like ANY GOOD security guard is) and shot and killed an unarmed teenager. He did not commit "1st deg murder" or "special circumstances" but he clearly is guilty of at least "criminally negligent homicide" if not "2nd deg murder" for initiating a confrontation with an equal whom he had no legal power over, then killing him. People who initiate fights sometimes get the worst of it and when those bullies/morons have guns handy, they use them "spur of the moment" to "get even".

Trevon didn't defend himself, he ATTACKED Zimmerman, there's a difference.

You nor anyone else has any proof of that at all beyond Zimmerman's statement.

There are only two things we know for certain:

1) Zimmerman initiated the chain of events

2) Zimmerman shot Martin.

For those of you who say Zimmerman had no reason to follow Martin, you are sadly mistaken. Many homes in the neighborhood had been burglarized. He was a neighborhood watchman who was trying to protect his and his neighbors homes. He was NOT ordered by the 911 dispatcher to stop following Martin. The 911 dispatcher said we do not need you to do that. BIG difference. and probably the main reason that the 911 dispatcher advised Zimmerman to not follow was that they did not know anything about the suspect. When Zimmerman gave up following Martin and decided to return to his vehicle he was confronted by Martin and then attacked. I have to wonder how many of you would like on your back and allow someone to kill you without trying to defend yourself? None of you would. Your survival insticnt would kick in. That was Martins first mistake. Confronting Zimmerman, the second was trying to take Zimmermans gun away. Anyone of you, in the same circumstance would have shot too. You are the ones lying, if you say differently.

Everything you just stated about the case is a movie completely made up by you.

None of us have any idea what actually occurred.

For those of you who say Zimmerman had no reason to follow Martin, you are sadly mistaken. Many homes in the neighborhood had been burglarized.

You are sadly mistaken if you believe it is legal to pursue an individual you have not witnessed commit a crime (with a firearm no less). Neighborhood Watch rules are very strict and simple. Watch and report. There is also a very strict no weapon policy. So where in this scenario would it be legal for Zimmerman to pursue Martin? He had witnessed no crime being committed which means the point at which he left his vehicle to pursue Martin he was the aggressor and lost any claim to a "Stand Your Ground" defense. You may want to look into what Simple Assualt means, which is the crime Zimmerman first commited by pursing Martin. Intent is an essential element of assault. In tort law, it can be specific intent—if the assailant intends to cause the apprehension of harmful or offensive contact in the victim—or general intent—if he or she intends to do the act that causes such apprehension. In addition, the intent element is satisfied if it is substantially certain, to a reasonable person, that the act will cause the result. A defendant who holds a gun to a victim's head possesses the requisite intent, since it is substantially certain that this act will produce an apprehension in the victim. In all cases, intent to kill or harm is irrelevant. And shooting someone is certainly homicide regardless of how you look at it. Now Zimmerman has to prove the homicide was justified, which he can not do. The prosecution has a slam dunk case here. If Zimmerman doesn't plea to manslaughter he will be convicted of 2nd Degree Murder.

There is no evidence that supports that he continued to follow Martin if you listen to the tapes from 911 you clearly hear him say okay after the 911 operator says "you don't have to do that" please stop spreading misinformation.

Whitey is right. If anyone wants I can even try and find a link with the entire 911 call non edited but the way people are today it doesn't matter what the truth is. And the sad thing is. The media finally got a hold of this money scam after I noticed it. That's an entire month apart. And one more thing. HE WAS NOT PART OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH! He was never part of them but claimed he was. All it takes is a single lie and a pool of blood to distort the truth.

Chris82mil - Ur FOS - I can legally follow (or pursue as you seem to like to call it) anyone I want. There is no law against following somebody. Using your logic, if I just happen to be behind someone walking down the sidewalk in the same direction, they could charge me for assault. HUH?? What a crock of BS. Didn't know the thought police had such sophisticated equipment.

@thewhitejudge - your full of BS. He was a part of a neighborhood watch unit. The police helped set it up, but a failure on their part did not register it with the neighborhood watch system. Since your so certain of your facts, please post a link to them. Or is this another media BS story to hype up the case so that they can sell a few more ads. Either way, until your able to prove your statements, please for the love of anything, STFU.

@ American Lobo -- his girlfriend "had no reason to lie". You're kidding, right? This was her BOYFRIEND!!!!! Lie? Oh, yeah, she has every reason to lie. She wants this guy in prison for shooting this kid.

Continuing what hearts2004 said...

The girlfriend WILL certainly lie!! She's playing for the team that is "her people". Don't you think that good ole Mom (with a different last name...SHOCKER!!) won't have a few gifts lined up for the poor grieving girlfriend after all this is over?? She'll probably be knocked up w/some other brotha's spawn anyway by then. Trayvon who??

Britt you should take your own advise and I don't think they have the recording anymore because I spent all night searching for it and couldn't find any one of them that I had in my favorites bar. Still searching but now I'm starting to think the recordings are gone. Oh wait found some but none are unedited. Still here are the links

youtube.com/watch?v=YOt1wEDy0SI youtube.com/watch?v=kL84rHwIuKg&feature=relmfu youtube.com/watch?v=mOpGAOXL5Uk&feature=related

those are about the only ones you can find on youtube that havn't been deleted. Still searching though.

Empirate It would seen you are FOS with your false equivalencies. Walking behind someone on the street does not indicate you have any untoward intentions. Following someone in your vehicle, then pursuing them on foot once they attempt to get away from you is simple assault my uneducated friend. Learn the law, it could someday save your ass.

But Zimmerman had no control over the funds and they came from others. That's a lot different from having a million stuffed in your mattress.

You either have money available or you don't.

That fund money was his to access, so yes, he lied about how much money he had.

I wouldn't give him a cent.

All we have is Zimmerman's story that he was returning to his car and that Trayvon attacked him "for no reason". Martin can't give his version of what happened.

By the past evidence of violence, mood swings(he takes medication), and disregard for authority.................

it points towards Zimmerman being the likely instigator(starting with him following someone he did NOT see commit a crime), of the shooting. That would make him guilty of manslaughter at the very least.

More...much more important than any funds in an account set up for Mr Zimmerman's defense is this fact he withheld from the judge that he possessed 2 that is TWO passports he was ordered as a condition of bail to turn in his passport he only turned in ONE and kept the other secret clearly a violation of the judges order and a fact that must call into doubt any credibility Mr Zimmerman has

Mike,

Zim did have control over the funds. He told his wife to transfer them out of the paypal account and into her checking account which she did. This was done a couple of days before the bail hearing and he sat mute before the judge and let his wife lie about their assets.

This is marvelous to watch America disceminate before my eyes. I am pretty certain Mr. Zimmermann is guilty, but I am 100% certain a judge and jury need to figure that out. To all my fellow supporters of the Martin family only love can heal this. To all those ardent Zimmermann supporters I offer the same. But be warned accepting something freely may cause you to revisit your own values, not try to justify Mr. Zimmermann's. Is it too much to agree that the real tragedy is that we are reacting this way over something the legal system needs to sort out, and that the legal system needs to continue to be beyond reproach in its zeal for the case. I don't think it is asking too much that the same justice which put a black woman in Florida with an MBA, in fear of her life, and who killed noone in jail for 20 years; after 12 minutes of deliberation also apply itself zealously to Mr. Zimmermann.

The problem is we don't see neighbors, we see political adversaries. We don't see a tradegy in a teenaged boy's death, we see miscarriage of justice (left or right). We don't see a culture in desperate need of correction, we see a country failing us. The President promised we could have change if we did the work, are we doing enough. I know I do not want myself or my child shot accidently, nor do I want to be responsible when someone else is shot.....Bottom line is this story sucks, but I don't see anyone collaborating to heal the illness. Lets raise ourselves up together and apply our values to the only one's theycan change, ourselves..

amindmvr you are restoring my faith in mankind

"Is it too much to agree that the real tragedy is that we are reacting this way over something the legal system needs to sort out, and that the legal system needs to continue to be beyond reproach in its zeal for the case."

Exactly right am.

Thanks amindmvr. Good point!

@ amindmvr:

I agree with your sentiments.

The problem is, a court of law doesn't always work like it's supposed to.

Innocent get found guilty, and guilty go free or get slapped on the wrist.

Sometimes it's only about what you can prove, and sometimes it's about making the jury believe your story.

The judge/jury in this case will only hear Zimmerman's side. Martin can't give his version.

It will come down to whether the jury wants to believe Zimmerman, or not.

If Zimmerman goes free...next time he calls 911 when he sees someone walking and dinking ice tea and eating skittles....and Zim says to dispatcher..."they always get away"...he will be talking about himself and not the person he is stalking.

I have a hard time believing that Zimmerman can be found guilty of 2nd Degree murder. He is guilty of gross stupidity, as someone that has, in the past, carried legally it is always in the back of my mind that having a concealed weapon means obeying a higher moral authority. In the same situation faced by GZ I would never have left the car. As for those bringing up the passport . . . the judge threw that one out because you are only required to turn in passports you have access to, one of his was lost and federal records show that the second was a replacement. Having a daughter that has one of these PayPal accounts set up for her in order to receive specialized medical care I can tell you that we do not consider that money a personal asset. None of us, least of all her, can access that money and it can only be released after a group of fund managers assess a specific need to ensure the money is spent on the intended purpose. This is done to protect the people that donated. GZ has had a special account set up for his defense. Whether you agree with those who donated or not I am sure that he and his family have no access to those funds without going through his lawyer(s). The lawyer KNOWS that money is his/her/their fee so it is unlikely to the extreme they would allow GZ access in order to flee the country. He has turned himself in twice so far. I remember the judge at a bail hearing asking the defendent about readily available funds and net worth. Funds to which you have no legal access are not readily available. This is done to determine flight risk. Zimmerman 'disappeared' for months until an arraignment and then appeared as required. If Zimmerman was going to flee he should have, and most likely would have, months ago when threats started pouring in. He apparently believes in his story enough to not worry about staying for the trial and that usually is factored in by a bail-hearing as well. Going strictly by my own past observations of such hearings I would say that revoking bail in this instance is very unusual and could almost seem to be harrassment. I also worry that things like this infer a fear on the part of the state that they either cannot prove their case or that they are being influenced by politicians (far more likely) in order to create an environment that ensures the court will ensure the correct political outcome rather than a just one.

This entire event is horrible beyond belief but the level of poltical and racial division resultant from it is embarassing even more. We are supposed to be Americans and our legal system is built on the premise that an individual is innocent until proven guilty, in capital cases it is "guilty beyond reasonable doubt!" Our system is flawed, it makes mistakes, it is the best and most fair system of law and justice on the entire planet (yes I did say that). So to all you armchair jurors, judges and executioners I can only say this . . . shame on you, shame on all of you. You should all look into a mirror and see the racism and hate each and every one of you is displaying with shame. You are all entitled to opinion but not to pronouncement and if you don't know the difference then I can only say that you get the media you deserve because you have decided that excitement is more important that the lives of the individual.

Trayvon Martin's family lost a son, regardless of his real age the picture of the innocent 12-year old IS the Trayvon they knew and loved and he is gone. We don't know anything of his motivations that night beyond a trip to a convenience store for Skittles and iced tea. Anything else is conjecture and I do not rule out that he may very well have turned on Zimmerman and attacked him which ended up costing him his life. Does standing up for his right to be where he was make him a thug? No, he was where he should have been and we cannot give him motivations. Was Zimmerman justified in asking him what he was doing in the neighborhood because he was a new face, at night, during a rain storm and on foot? Yes, he was a member of a neighborhood watch and my spouse and I have been similarly questioned when going through a gated community until after a week or so when our faces are known. The problem here is that Zimmerman was carrying and he knew he was carrying. He had to know that if he confronted someone, whether justified or not, there is a chance that the gun in his waistband is going to become a factor. Now is when the court comes into the picture. They will have the ability to use unedited original recordings from the 911 call in addition to eyewitness testimony to construct a timeline that will enable a jury to calculate with reasonable assurance of accuracy the chain of events that lead up to the shooting. Forensic evidence may show whether there was, indeed, a fight over possession of a firearm. Legally, if Zimmerman broke away from his pursuit and then was assaulted by Treyvon in any way then the shooting was justified. If Zimmerman did not break off his pursuit and the end result was a confrontation initiated by Zimmerman due to his pursuit then he is guilty of negligent homicide at the very least. In either case there is almost certainly a wrongful death but this would actually be a civil suit rather than criminal.

I am going to stop here because the truth is that as the situation stands now you could actually write a book on this subject and I am not a lawyer but rather a peace officer (retired). I am tired of all the vitriol being spouted by both sides, I am tired of all the pronouncements of guilt or innocence based on the testimony of MSNBC, Fox and others. The last several times I was in court NONE of those agencies provided a single iota of evidence for any crime and I suspect that none will be forthcoming in this case either. I rather expect that not too many of you care whether I respect you or not. You don't know me and most of you have never met me and never will. But if respect of one human for another is at all important to you then please STOP trying this case in social media. You have no business doing so and the rest of the planet is laughing at you while waiting for the race riot they are hoping will bring our country to its knees.

Create a personal account for yourself by yourself, and claim that you have no access to it. For your illegal actions, you are seeking legal protection! what a sad State!! I feel pity for those who try to think that Zim can escape from his misdeeds.

David Excellent post and thumbs up on that one.

Though I do have one thing to say on it and I think you'll agree. If Zimmerman was unable to break away from a confrontation due to being completely overpowered, then I believe the shooting would still be justified. The simple fact he didn't flee shouldn't be used if there was no option for him to flee. However, I also feel that statement is common sense logic and hopefully people will realize that.

Hey big trouble......if you don't have time to read 1500 words that he wrote, then how do you know it is "diarrhea"?

Idiot.

Looks like some of you missed a previous article where it stated that Zimmerman and wife were talking code over the phone from the jail in regards to how to handle the money.

David-1929375,

All your points are well understood and make plenty of sense. But, why so many fail to see the logic that is so obvious to a few of us, is beyond me. GZ has already been found guilty by those easily swayed by he media. Justice will prevail, and as impartial observer it appears that GZ will be found not guilty as charged.

I can understand Martin punching..as hard as he could..breaking Zimmerman's nose and knocking him down hard making him smack his head on the sidewalk. Martin was approached from the rear on a dark, rainy night by a man in street clothes demanding why Martin was there. After that, it is Zimmerman's story as to what happened. But has anyone thought that if Martin was sitting on ZImmerman's chest how did Zimmerman reach around Martins body to get his gun out of it's holster at his waist? Then, just saying he managed to do this, work it around front to shoot Martin in the chest while being beaten. It only makes sense that either Zimmerman had his gun drawn when he first confronted Martin or he was the guy on top during the fight and able to freely pull the gun. I can't help but think that Zimmerman is an agressive bully who likes to take on authority he doesn't have. No neighborhood watch volunteer is supposed to carry a gun!

GZ was caught by the judge in contempt by not declaring he had funds or funds were in a Pay Pal account for his defense. With this in mind GZ has brought to his case a light of being suspect of not being forthright with the court who by the way was lenient on his bail. The jury will hear this and begin to wonder about his one sided story of self-defense as well. He has done a great deal of damage to his credibility and I suspect the Martin family's attorney will prevail with destroying GZ's credibility. It always is best to be upfront with these little details when you are the accused in a court of law specifically when you are facing second degree murder charges.

David- you added some interesting insight...however, I thought the reason declaring personal assets was important was because that in turn affected how much the original bail was set for...not necessarily all about the flight risk. The judge would've set a higher bail if those assets were known about. I still don't understand why this wouldn't be considered a personal asset? I understand your your daughter's account sounds like a different consideration. If someone asked you how much money you ahve for your daughter's healthcare wouldn't you mention it when in a court of law, under oath? I still believe, regardless of how the money was to be accessed, he had an obligation to report this in court, when under oath to a judge.

Here is a very basic question........why was TM or better yet David 1929375 walking through a gated community?? Isn't the purpose of a gated community to have only those that live there and pay for that service, walk through. People choose to live in gated communities, I don't understand the need to "walk through" them........how about walking around them. Seems like a much safer and smarter thing to do!

misleading a judge in court is called perjury. will or has GZ or his wife been charged? no! if he's as honest as a day is long it's been a short day.

RE: Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin:

No witnesses; No Truth, Hung Jury.

Lobo said above, "The problem is, a court of law doesn't always work like it's supposed to."

But due process was something that both Zimmerman and Martin were deprived of because of the "Stand Your Ground" law--that took away a court of law's jurisdiction and let LOCAL POLICE decide innocent or guilt on the spot, and then release s suspect. How many of you trust your local police department to that degree?

While I don't believe Zimmerman committed outright murder, he did kill someone (and yes, there is a difference between a spontaneous killing and planned-out murder). Had he gone through the usual court system, this would not be as outrageous a situation as it has become. SYG has got to go! Maybe the courts aren't perfect but certainly, if this is the outcome without them being involved, we need to put our faith in them more than a law that lets local law enforcement go, "Oh, no, we've done an initial investigation and that's enough. You're free to go!"

Thinking Always: I believe Martin's father's girlfriend was a resident of that gated community and Martin and his father were guests there.

Even if Martin was "trespassing", execution is not the punishment.

The defense fund is now considered Zimmerman's assets?

It was under my impression that a friend or the lawyer set it up as a trust fund that Zimmerman didn't have access to and people donated to it. Just curious if anyone else remembers that? Ill try to find a link.

Edit: Okay it would seem George was given access to the trust fund:
Mark O’Mara told the court that money raised was put in a trust fund, however he admitted that the defendant still had access to the money. At the time a $150,000 bond was set for which $15,000 was posted to release Zimmerman from jail.

Okay the bond deserves to be revoked.

Right you are Christy Elmasri-5290895.

I wonder what the London bookmakers are saying about all this? As I read comments it seems that people on both sides are just speculating as to whether or not he'll walk. I think most people know he's somewhat guilty (I'm one of the people who believes he is completely guilty and at fault here). But if people are taking bets, I wonder what the odds are. Anybody know?

Its not his fault..its his lawyers fault..that's what he gets paid to do figure everything out. He should replace his lawyer ASAP!

Innocent people don't jump bail.

deweydan

A lot of people think he is guilty of a crime. Many think he is innocent....Let the man go through a trial...

deweydan,

Yes, let George Zimmerman have his day in Court!!!

td49 Comment collapsed by the community

this is pathetic,...this guy did nothing wrong, time to let it go,

td49,

If killing an innocent child is not wrong, then please tell us what is criminal behavior?

Tell us who should be tried in court?

Tell us who should go to prison?

Have the courage to say what you are thinking:

" A Caucasian Hispanic should not have "his or her life wasted" for murdering an African American!"

@Thinking Always,

And here's your answer. In Trayvon's case he was visiting someone who lived in the gated community and as of David, maybe he was doing the same. The community may be surrounded with a gate but people can still get in if they are let in. I mean really "Thinking Always" did you really need that question answered? Looks like you aren't thinking always because you couldn't even find the answer to a question that a 2 year old could have answered. WOW!!! Maybe you'll do better with a name like "THINKING VERY LITTLE". ijs

He's not a flight risk, he's just a lying murderer.

He' s everything above except for innocent!

amindmvr

I don't think it is asking too much that the same justice which put a black woman in Florida with an MBA, in fear of her life, and who killed noone in jail for 20 years; after 12 minutes of deliberation also apply itself zealously to Mr. Zimmermann...Lets raise ourselves up together and apply our values to the only one's theycan change, ourselves..

amindmvr,

It is horrific that an African-American Floridian woman, who was attempting to defend herself against her abusive husband, fired a "warning shot yet, was shipped off to prison for 20 years. Twenty long years.

Yet, it took large protests across this country, to put a focus on the case of a Caucasian Hispanic who shot and killed an unarmed Black child, so that an arrest could possibly occur.

From within a person, the greatest change can begin.

However, when a person, such as Zimmerman, refuses to abide by common sense, takes it upon himself to be the law, and cavalierly takes a human life, then there has to be lawful intervention.

Our system of justice is broken.

It is impossible to reasonably explain why Blacks who make up 13% of the U.S. population, are 40% of this country's inmates. The answer is, racial targeting.

The above facts and events are more than unfortunate...they are destructive and deadly.

Only throwing people of certain ethnicities in prison, such as the woman who was sentenced to 20 years is wrong.

No person on this earth can bring Trayvon Martin back to life.

Zimmerman should not be allowed to walk free.

25 Walker--EVERYONE who has weighed in on this case seems to have an agenda. In your case, you are coming from YOUR personal agenda, as evidenced by your descriptor of Trayvon as both "innocent" and a ''child'', NEITHER of which is strictly true. Trayvon's VERY recent past shows a total disregard for rules and laws, and his video in the convenience store makes it obvious that he was NOT a child.

So I'll posit one more thing that those who seem to feel this is Black v White (or in this case, mistakenly white). Does ANYONE really think that George Zimmerman, even if acquitted, will 'get off scott free with NO punnishment? Can you truly imagine what it must be like to shoot someone, even if you believed you were in danger of your own life, and have them DIE? Especially when as soon as the cop cars/ambulance pull up you can see that that dead person was a teenager? Right after this first went public, Zimmerman's brother, who fairly obviously was NOT a 'family spokesperson', but WAS 'available' for interviews, didn't know much but he DID know that even tho Zimmerman was released by the police after a fairly lengthy interrogation, Z CRIED for days.

And lets be really clear here--I'm ALSO, from the little I've read on this page alone, convinced that the Black woman in question should NOT be in jail either. But putting Zimmerman in jail does NOT 'right the wrong' done to her.

But the vindictive (and yes, I'll say it) RACE based hatefulness on this web site is appalling to me.

Not the least because there IS evidence that Zimmerman's story was, in the main, TRUE. That doesn't make Trayvon guilty of anything but perhaps a little too much machismo, but it does NOT make Zimmerman a murderer.

Zimmerman pursued and killed an innocent man. Whether he made a mistake and now feels badly about it, shouldn't absolve him from the consequences of his actions.

Martin's freedom was taken from him by Zimmerman; thus Zimmerman's freedom too, should be taken.

@MOmaid,

If we want to talk about individuals past well take a good look at George Zimmerman's. Judging from what I have read that man shouldn't even be carrying a gun. This man has major anger issue and put that with the right to bare arms. Not a very good combination, this guy is a walking time bomb. And for the life of me I can not understand how Trayvon's past, future, school suspension, contents in his book bag while in Miami, what he ate the day before, and anything else hasany thing to do with what happened to him on the day of his murder. Regardless what he looked like on a convenient store video camera he's still a child and that has nothing to do with him being murdered. So while you are trying to make a point what is your point? Someone's past has nothing to do with them being shot down in cold blood because someone toting a gun says he looks suspicious walking in the rain in a gated community with a pack of skittles and and a canned drink with a hoodie on. So what Zimmerman's brother said he cried for days, of coarse he said that about his brother, he just shot and killed a kid that did nothing wrong except walked in a gated community that he was actually visiting someone in. He doesn't want his brother to really look like he has those anger management issue that keeps popping up about him. ijs

Debi-1314897Zimmerman pursued and killed an innocent man

thats not whats happened and you know it so stop spreading lies, there is zero evidence zimmerman chased, pursued, stalked, (all show intent to harm) or any other, he merely followed martin and that is not illegal and not a reason for the followed to commit a crime of battery. the only person who committed a crime was the one who threw the first punch, that is how the law works and to say anything else is a lack of understanding of law. martin was a just another roughneck looking for some ass kicking and zimmerman was a over zealous concern citizen who was looking for a crime.

the donated money while yes zimmerman had access, if it was in a trust fund zimmerman cannot just take all the money out without penalties (if zimmerman is claiming the money as personal income or donations the taxes need to be paid, thus why its in trust). i will not believe what the courts or the media says because they have been caught already lying to the public about this case. i myself have access to more money than i personally own or make but its not my personal assets and if someone asks me what my finances are i will say im penniless and not be lying. not sure if zimmerman was lying but i would not consider what is in a trust fund to be his personal assets and that is what the courts asked. as far as the hearsay about what zimmerman and his wife talked about, thats exactly what it is, hearsay, unless recorded and proven to be otherwise.

the bigger question is why do the courts issue bail based on affordability? you do realize that is highly unconstitutional as that constitutes discrimination and extortion(bail should be set by crime, not assets, i would also add bail in unconstitutional but thats a different matter) but you know its not like the american citizen really cares if the courts or government commit crimes or breach the constitution because 'they know whats best' right?

Swagganut:

"...he merely followed martin..."

The word "pursue" is also defined as "follow".

Definition

pur·sue
[ pər sï “ ]

VERB

1. transitive and intransitive verb chase somebody: to follow somebody, sometimes for a long time, in order to catch or capture him or her

And btw, what "crime" was Martin committing necessitating Zimmerman to pursue him?

I am fully supportive of the right to bear arms, but it's always the "nuts" who give that right a bad name. The "nut" had the gun, while the victim was defenseless.

His lawyer will say that money raised independently for a defense fund isnt a personal asset. The second passport and the coded speech is a bigger red flag. I havent heard the coded speech but I am sure we will if it is pertinent to the case.

We have heard the 911 calls.

This is what I dont understand about so many posters. They have resleased the 911 calls and you can hear him stop running. They have the forensic evidence that shows Trayvon was shot at close range, his hand on the gun, while in a struggle on the ground. They also have traced Trayvon's path he ran during the 911 call.

So please tell me how Zimmerman stopped running, hung up the phone, then started running again, caught Trayvon, dragged him back towards his car(in between the two houses), threw Trayvon on top of himself, let Trayvon bash his head into the concrete a few times, then let Trayvon get his hands on the gun, and then shoort Trayvon.

In a minute 20 seconds...

I dont have to be there to recreate what happened. They released the evidence. If some of you that are blinded by hatred would take the time to read the evidence you would be wondering what Trayvon was thinking.

Trayvon didnt believe he was being chased by a stalker. If he did then why double back? Why not just go to the first house and knock on the door?

This is all about an angry ignorant mob wanting justice because society failed Trayvon. No one wants to say this is what happens when kids make stupid decisions. Its all "hang the white mofo."

This is a very sad day for justice in our country.

Good, a voice of reason.

David, I understand what you have stated about the defense fund, but it is my understanding that the first two lawyers he had told him not to set up the account, he did and he stopped communicating with them. They had a press conference, mentioned this and they quit. Then the current lawyer states what he stated. The passport stuff I understand, but as for the website collecting money, it is my understanding that he didn't listen to the previous attorneys and I have never heard recently who is in charge of the current account. So he is continuing to be in trouble because he simple does not listen to anybody.

1917 hours (7:17 PM)--Zimmerman calls/officers dispatched

1921:21 hours (7:21:21)--Zimmerman's call to 911 ends after 4 min 21 sec; at this point Martin is still alive.

1921:56 hours (7:21:56)--911 caller is on the phone saying two men are fighting outside her back porch. Sounds of a struggle and a person calling for help is heard, and then one shot rings out 45 seconds into the call (approximately 7:22:41). By the time the caller hangs up with 911, police are on the scene, as attested to by the caller stating that she has seen a flashlight. That would have been the first officer on the scene, as neither Zimmerman nor Martin reportedly had flashlights when found.

1930 hours 7:30 approximately)--Paramedic Brady declares Martin dead after Officer Ayala, Sergeant Raimondo, and Sergeant McCoy, and Paramedic Brady himself have attempted to revive Martin unsucessfully.

Anthony:

No, I don't think Zimmerman would have had the time to do what you were suggesting in your post in the timeframe allotted. But I also don't think it happened in quite the way he's testified either.

At 7:21 and 21 seconds, Zimmerman hung up with 911. At this point he had lost sight of Martin and Martin was still alive.

At 7:21 and 56 seconds--35 SECONDS after Zimmerman hung up with 911, a caller calls 911 about two men fighting in her back yard. 45 seconds into that call a single gunshot is heard at 7:22:41.

So the question here is: what happened in those 35 seconds of unaccounted-for time? Is 35 seconds really long enough for everything Zimmerman has said in various accounts to have happened?

Zimmerman's original story is that he called 911 about a suspicious person, then per the dispatcher's instructions he stopped following and started to return to his vehicle, at which point he says he was jumped from behind by Trayvon, punched hard enough to break his nose, had his head slammed into the sidewalk multiple times, at which point he pulled a gun and shot the teen. Another version of the story recounted as hearsay from his family states that he was 'only a few minutes away from being in diapers the rest of his life'. Yet another version says he returned to his truck when he was jumped and managed to get his gun out of his truck and turned to fire on Martin.

Is 35 seconds enough for all of that to have happened? Also, the tea and candy were found at the scene. Was Martin holding the tea and candy while he was punching Zimmerman? Is that possible? Wouldn't he have put those items down before he 'doubled back'?

Zimmerman should just kill himself already....

Well if you want to know my opinion this is what happened.

Trayvon came back and confronted Zimmerman. He probably said something like, "Why are you following m***** fu****". He threw the can and skittles on the ground, and then jumped on Zimmerman.

What I typed in the other post was sarcasm. Obviously Trayvon had no reason to come back towards Zimmerman's car, and Zimmerman could not possibly of caught Trayvon and dragged him back.

The only obvious conclusion was Trayvon wanted to kick Zimmerman's tail and he got shot because he made a stupid mistake.

The tragedy was why Trayvon felt the need to confront Zimmerman? I sometimes wonder if his girlfriend knows. She was on the phone with him.

Now as another poster stated earlier. Zimmerman is going to need every dollar he can get because the wrongful death civil suit will cost him dearly.

The Martin family may not get the "justice" they think they deserve, but they are going to get paid.

America, I think that is the goal for both the lawyers and Trayvon's family. Don't you think the lawyers would make sure that the defense fund was protected until the lawyers got theirs first? Zimmerman probably doesn't have direct access to the funds, the lawyers will see to that.

One thing is perfectly clear from the new arresting photo of Zimmerman. He sure has not missed any meals...........like Trayvon has.

I do hope they put Zimmerman on the stand. Then, people can see for themselves that he's just a really bad liar. Nothing he has made up so far makes any sense.

"Trayvon attacked me first." So, even though Trayvon was scared and running away - and Zimmerman was the one following him - Trayvon suddenly turns around and starts pursuing Zimmerman? Makes no sense.

"I was screaming for help." So, even though Zimmerman had a gun, Zimmerman was the one for screaming for help? Makes no sense.

"Trayvon was beating me up, I was scared for my life and I had to defend myself." If Trayvon was beating Zimmerman up, why does Trayvon have only one small mark on his finger? Was Trayvon beating Zimmerman with his elbows? Makes no sense.

What makes more sense is that Zimmerman continued to chase Trayvon, caught up to him and confronted him. Scared and in self defense, Trayvon pushed Zimmerman down and his head hit the sidewalk. Zimmerman pulls out his gun and, seeing it, Trayvon starts screaming for help. Zimmerman then has a decision to make: Let the police handle it or shoot Trayvon in cold blood while he's screaming for help. Zimmerman chooses the latter. Zimmerman must stand up and pay for his actions like any grown man should.

Some stranger following me for some nefarious purpose because he isn't law enforcement. If I can't get away from him and I believe I can double back and take him, I would. Zimmerman has no authority to follow or confront anyone. Martin has no duty to answer to Zimmerman. Zimmerman, who decides to follow and confront Martin, is liable for anything that occurs due to his actions. There is no way this can be a Stand your Ground defense. The fact that Zimmerman called the police to say he saw Martin, makes him the initiator of this confrontation.

"The fact that Zimmerman called the police to say he saw Martin, makes him the initiator of this confrontation."

Absolutely, a fact many choose to ignore or forget. If Zimmerman would have let the authorities handle the "suspicious black man wearing a hoodie, drinking ice tea and eating Skittles", this tragedy would have never happened.

The other had no business or right trespassing in a gated community. It works both ways. Neither of them was right in what they were doing.

Let's understand how we got here in the first place. Martin's parents were trying to get answers about teh circumstances surrounding the death of thier son. The stories they got from the police department did not ring true to them and tehyhad a number of questions. They were stonewalled by the Sanford police department and were at thier wit's end. They contacted their attorneys who told them that the only way to get answers would be to bring national attention to their case. It was then that they contacted Al Sharpton and asked him toget involved. He actually interviewed the parents before agreeing to get involved. Sharpton's objective from the beginning was the arrest of Zimmerman and a trial to get at the facts. Sharpton clearly denounced any display of violence.

The racial element came into play because these types of things happen far too frequently to young black males who frankly have been profiled as criminals, guilty or innocent. There was some feeling that Zimmerman may have been motivated by race and that teh Sanford police were complicit in his virtual on the scene exoneration. Add to that the fact that Martin was just 17 year's old and you have the makings of a sensational case.

Now, some on teh right have said, why not more concern with regard to the countless slayings of black males by other black males? Valid-yes and no. Valid because we clearly need to do something to address the violnce among some black youth towards each other. Invalid because this really has nothing to do with the facts of teh Martin death. It is kind of like why is there more concern when a young white, blond and blue eyed female goes missing? Typically, there is substantial media coverage. However, there are countless children and people missing everyday of teh year that we never hear about. Doesn't make the young , white, blond, blue eyed feamles disappearance less compelling, but why more compelling? Because that is how this society responds and places value on certain people.

In the missing female's case the value is on the missing female. In Martin's case the value is on the racial difference between the shooter and the victim.

By the way, many young blacks are killed by other young blacks and often no suspects are ever found. The Martin case suggests another systemic entity, stand your ground, that will allow blacks to be killed without retribution. This is why it takes on political implications.

Okicize Wicasa Yata Pi:

1. He was a guest of his father's girlfriend, who is a resident of that gated community.

2. Even if he WAS trespassing, since when is the punishment for trespassing in a gated community death? Where is your moral compass?

Momaid,

EVERYONE who has weighed in on this case seems to have an agenda

Advocating for justice, for Trayvon, is a moral goal.

YOUR personal agenda

Momaid, your personal "agenda" is injustice.

You are finagling for Zimmerman, a killer, to walk free.

your descriptor of Trayvon as both "innocent"

Enlighten this forum and tell us:

While walking to his father's girlfriend's home, what crime was Trayvon committing?

a ''child''

Absoultely.

Trayvon was a minor. He was a person under the age of 18. He was a child.

If Zimmerman had "only" injured him, Trayvon would have been taken to a hospital. At any hospital, by a doctor, he would have been seen in the Pediatrics emergency room. While he was alive, his parents would have had to legally give their permission for him to even participate in a school's field trip.

Trayvon's VERY recent past shows a total disregard for rules and laws,

"[His] past?"

Here is George's rap sheet:

- He assaulted a police officer, a felony.

- Because of his violence against her, his former girlfriend obtained a restraining order against him.

- Because of his pattern of hostile anger, his former employer fired him.

So I'll posit one more thing that those who seem to feel this is Black v White

Within a short span of several months, George made 41 calls to 911. He claimed that there were "suspicious Black men" in the neighborhood. No suspicious Black men were ever found.

Does ANYONE really think that George Zimmerman, even if acquitted, will 'get off scott free with NO punnishment?

Without provocation and justification, Zimmerman murdered an innocent human being.

He should not get off "scott free."

Can you truly imagine what it must be like to shoot someone, even if you believed you were in danger of your own life,

People who are in actual fear of someone, run away from that person. They do not run toward the "threat."

Especially when as soon as the cop cars/ambulance pull up you can see that that dead person was a teenager?

A neighbor that was a witness to Zimmerman's actions after he had shot Trayvon, stated that George's demeanor was cavalier.

Z CRIED for days.

"Z" recognized the foolishness of his deadly actions. He was crying for himself. He realized that he had made a huge mess for himself and his family.

But putting Zimmerman in jail does NOT 'right the wrong' done to her.

Zimmerman is being tried for his own actions in the death of a minor, not for the woman who fired a "warning shot."

RACE based hatefulness on this web site is appalling to me.

Momaid, your post is replete with twists of common sense and the facts. Your mindset is appalling.

Zimmerman should be tried in a court of law and sent to prison.

I've looked at this whole thing and I'm on Trayvons side, his death was wrong, but I also know that Zim will not walk free, he could beat the case but he will never walk free, his life as he knew it is over, he can never walk in public without that Fear that someone will KILL him, Who would or could live like that, no matter what, he will be punished, this could have been just an accident I doubt Zim killed him in cold blood and I doubt it was racially motivated, the problem here is if it was an accident he should have said it was, he might have spent some time in jail but life for him would have gone on, now no matter what happens in court he can never shake the thought of someone out there will kill him. That is not living by any means.

@25Walker.. go watch the video of the convience store. That is no child. Trayvon was not the 12 year old kid that the picture post him to be. He would not have been seen at the pediatrics department, he would have been seen by the normal ER. He would have been released into a normal room.

Want to talk about something check your facts first.

Britt Carter,

You have removed yourself from reality.

We all have seen the inside of a hospital's emergency room.

When have you seen human beings under 18 sitting inside of an adult emergency room?

The answer is NEVER.

If persons under 18 are seen in the adult ER, that is a hospital and state violation.

Because Trayvon was tall and thin does not make him any less of a child.

Legally he was a minor. He was a child.

Your ridiculous claim that this minor-aged victim of murder would have been seen in the adult ER is a Big Lie.

Check with your local hospitals.

Ask the hospital staff if persons 17 and under are considered adults.

Ask the person you speak to if minors are seen in the adult ER.

Your sludge stinks.

Zimmerman benefited from a lower bond than he might have been granted had he and his family told the truth about how much money they really had, Lester said.

So in other words, the court is admitting they are out to milk every last dime they can out of an innocent man? (I say innocent here because, remember, in America we are innocent until proven guilty, although the media would have you thinking otherwise.) This money was set aside for his defense budget, that means it's going to the lawyer, it's not Zimmerman's money. This is complete bull@!$%#!

Seems that all the Conservative and Far Right supporters of Zimmerman who donated to this fund, to see their boy get off, could all very well be his very undoing and keep him in jail!! HOW IRONIC!!

Seems that we're all on the same page after all! This Zimmerman belongs in Jail! Thank you!

heck, with all that money flowing in his wife was probably pleading with him to go shoot another unarmed black teenager.

After reading most of the comments, down to this point of the page.... the only thing that I gather from them, is that there is a serious need to begin... "thinning the herd" ...!

All I can say is YEAH! YAH YEAH, YAY, HAHA. We all know the racist in Florida are going to let this IDIOT get off so the least he can do is cool his heels in jail and do SOME SORT of time. WHile it won't bring the poor boy back perhaps it can bring a small measure of comfort to his mother,father, and siblings that the man who took the life of their son and brother CAN'T at least for the time being do harm to anyone else or their signifigant other.

Zimmerman also held 2 passports which is illegal, turned 1 into the court and had his wife hiding the other in a safety deposit box.

Lies, lies and lies! Sad. When will lies end in this Zimmerman family. Claiming that he was crying for help, while the person who was crying sounded like a teenage's voice, not a grown man's voice. If it was hin screamming, why did he stop screaming as soon as the gunshot when off. I wonder what would have Trayvon done, other than fighting back, this strange adult approaching him in the dark. I bet Zimmerman was very excited that he caught a thug, and he will make sure he does not get away with it. When Trayvon fought back, instead of breaking loss and run away, due to his anger issues and poor judgement, that we already noted by following Trayvon, he went ahead a shot this poor child who has a future ahead of him.

Now we're trying to bring down the President b/c the system wants to convict a Killerman? WOW!!!!

AlwaysThnking, what is the shortest distance between two points? If you can answer this question then you will know why people walk across a gated community area. Which by the way might be gated to keep vehicles out but that does not necessarily mean it is fenced like some communities I have lived at in California that were intended to keep trespassers out of. I believe you already knew the answer to your question, but were hoping to start a volley of turning the tide against the deceased. Good try but weak debating skills.

Mother's bond--you DO know that the FBI's top forensic team went to work on the audio of 'someone' crying for help, and could not determine WHO cried for help, but pretty much eliminated Trayvon?

The the 'ear witness' who ''claimed it was a younger voice'' doing the crying, retracted her "testimony'' on hearing that?

That my two sons are Zimmerman's age or older, and that BOTH sing tenor? and that EVERY high school choir has "kids" Trayvon's age who sing BASS?

As for "Trayvon fighting BACK", there is NO evidence that TRAYVON was attacked. There IS plenty of evidence that Zimmerman was. Remember, there were NO marks on Trayvon other than on his FISTS, and of course, the bullet wound.

Zimmerman, however, had PLENTY of marks on his face and head to verify HIS story.

Sounds to me like the one LYING here is YOU.

Well let's remember Killerman went to his private Dr and not the emergency room,and who's to say his wounds are not self inflicted or had someone else to do it for the matter? Let's see that makes too much sense!

@MOmaid - the marks on Trayvon's fists were on his pinky finger of one hand. Doubt you know anything about hand to hand combat so I will educate you. Anyone who is a trained fighter hits with the first two knuckles on their hand - call the "Ram's head". The reason being, those knuckles are strongest and it does the most damage to the other person while protecting your own hand. If you hit a person hard and don't know how to punch, there is a good chance you will break your pinky knuckles. Happens ALL the time in bar fights.

Trayvon did not have broken knuckles or bruises on his "ram's head". Which tells me three things:

1) he wasn't a fighter and didn't know how to throw a punch- hence the bruised pinky knuckle.

2) he didn't hit GZ very hard - otherwise, he would have broken his hand

3) he didn't beat on him - otherwise he would have broken his hand and had many, many, many more bruises on his knuckles.

There's a very good chance Zimmerman got cold-cocked by the kid, fell back ward, then got up and shot him. How else would he grab his gun if Martin was on top of him punching him? His reaction would be too cover his face, not calmly un-holster his gun and then somehow free his arm to shoot him in the chest.

You want to believe Zimmerman, I get it. Martin smoked weed, and got himself into some trouble. Plus as you surely believe he was just about to become a "thug" (nice word play by racists to get around the n-word, by the way).

The facts of the case unfortunately will remain hidden within the lone survivor - a known liar on prescription medication for anxiety, with a history of violence. But the fact is he pursued and killed an unarmed teenager and then LIED to the judge.

You have provided a good logical description of the bruising that was not there and what would have happened if Martin had boxed GZ's ears for him. Had Martin punched him as GZ claimed he would have had at least one boxer break to his metacarpal from throwing an amateur punch using the side of his fist instead of of straight jab. Plain and simple. How do I know this? Been there and done that as a teenager with a boxer break to my left hand. We did not hear any of this in the autopsy so we could conclude GZ became anxious, pulled his pistol and shot the teenager, Martin.

@MOmaid (these are you words)

"Mother's bond--you DO know that the FBI's top forensic team went to work on the audio of 'someone' crying for help, and could not determine WHO cried for help, but pretty much eliminated Trayvon?"

Then answer this genius, then who's left to say the voice belong to? Don't look now but you kind of contradicted yourself because if they already eliminated Trayvon, then they have determined who's voice it is because there were only two people there. Brilliant though, bring in FBI top forensic team to decipher someones voice because after all how on earth would a mother know her own child's voice in distress. Go figure. I don't care if they bought the queen of England in every mother knows their child's voice. ijs

Do search on .......fox news dumber....see the studies that show you are dumber for watching fox news because of lies and wrong info.......that's...fox news dumber

Alternatively, Redman and Intellect, as I asked on another article about this - is it possible there was not bruising to the extent expected from a fist fight on Mr. Martin's hands because he died during the fight? From the response those more knowledgeable than I gave, no pumping blood would mean no bruises showing up on the hands. It doesn't explain other lack of damage, such as the broken knuckles or metacarpals as you both spoke of, but it is something to consider.

Let's be clear about President Obama's role in the Martin case. He had none. He was asked what he thought about it by a reporter. He responded his concern was with Trayvon's parents and essentially that he could empathize because if he had a son, he would look like Trayvon. A perfectly reasonable response from a POTUS who happens to be black. Race and racism were not created by President Obama. They existed long before he was born.

Hey redman, if your swinging over hand, would the injury be on the rams head or the pinky. How about if your swinging an un-opened tea can. Think about it for a second and get back to me.

if the police were not trying to cover fat boys wrongdoings why was TM body held so long and no one knew where he was this fool should do his time because he did the crime and all the believers that say he was protecting himself should rent him a room in their house to keep him safe because he says he is worried about his wife he shouldnt worry ole girl got over 150,000 she should be in jail also.

Hey redman, if your swinging over hand, would the injury be on the rams head or the pinky. How about if your swinging an un-opened tea can

Britt - either scenario wouldn't support GZ claim of Trayvon having come up and attacking him from behind. All that suggests, is that as a result of GZ's aggressive pursuit of Trayvon, that he was forced to defend himself. I feel it's possible that he swung the tea at him and it landed square on GZ's nose. If you notice in the evidence photos, the tan plastic bag is laying empty on the grass, yet the tea was in Trayvon's hoodie pocket. Now one could summise that, after thinking he'd stopped GZ, that he proceeded to pick up his things and placed tea in the pocket. But then that would mean there had been a period of separation of the two. If that is the case, GZ should've left well enough alone, but nope...he was determined not to let another a**hole get away.

Lets say the tea had fallen to the ground and out of the bag during the initial altercation/pinning down as witness John has now restated, and it was during this time that GZ managed to pull the gun and fire...did the tea grow little feet and crawl it's way into Trayvon's pocket? No, that would mean that GZ during his frantic 'frisking' of Trayvon's body, picked the tea up and placed in his pocket. We know that he did reposition him...remember witness John states in his recorded statement that the body was in a 'sprawled' position when he viewed from upstairs window. However, when cops arrived his hands were under the body.

I look forward to him testifying at new bond hearing, in true GZ lying fashion!

except that the prey decided to stand his ground, that's when the predator took advantage of his superior secret weapon. This sounds more and more like premeditated murder, force a confrontation, then shoot and say its self defense.

Wrong, Steve. It's only stand your ground if someone attacks you first. There is absolutely NO evidence to suggest that Zimmerman attacked Martin. And even if he did, it doesn't give Martin the right to beat the guy after he's down to within an inch of his life.

Zimmerman had every right to shoot that little thug who was beating him.

edub, so if Zimmerman did attack Martin first, you think that Martin had no right to defend himself?!?!?!?!

Wow.....

EDUB,

You're absolutely right there is no evidence that he attacked first, there is evidence he was pursuing, there is evidence that he shot the kid, there is evidence that he lied about his economic standing and his passports. If he's such a law abding citizen why did he perjure himself?

Zim stayed on scene. Told his story. Released. Later turned himself in after death threat from a terrorist organization due to Obama and Holder decideding to jump on the race wagon forcing a warrant for his arrest. Witnesses told their accounts. Zim bonded out. Not a flight risk. No bond revoked. Where is the justice? Seems to be an abuse of power and witch hunt. We need to allow the justice system to run its course. A jury will decide. Hopefully one comprised of Hispanics, Blacks, Asians, Arabs, illegals, left wingers and right wingers. That would gaurantee a hung jury and aquital. You can bank on that!

LOL.

You think Zimmerman was "beaten to within an inch of his life"?

I've seen schoolyard scraps in 8th grade that were bloodier, with broken limbs and eyes swollen shut.

1. Zimmerman was walking fine and refused going to the hospital that night.

2. Head cuts/scrapes and nose injuries tend to bleed a lot, even when damage is minimal.

Of course Zimmerman is going to make it sound like it was life or death. He shot and killed someone and has to make it sound like self defense if he doesn't want a murder charge/prison time.

How about this:

If you don't want someone to punch you, don't follow them around in your car(then on foot) at night, and don't question them with "what are you doing here", as if you are a police officer. Especially when they aren't breaking the law, or were never originally trying to harm you or your loved ones.

And if you do threaten or scare someone by following them around like a stalker, don't be surprised if they fight back.

take your *ss whippin that you deserve, without shooting them, because you bit off more than you could chew.

edub...one was armed one wasn't...the one unarmed is dead...duh...zimmerman was ready and waiting to shoot...it doesn't make any difference if trayvon hit him...the younger man was standing his ground because he was being pursued (in direct violation of the dispatchers order) by an armed provocateur

edub-3853225

Wrong, Steve. It's only stand your ground if someone attacks you first. There is absolutely NO evidence to suggest that Zimmerman attacked Martin. And even if he did, it doesn't give Martin the right to beat the guy after he's down to within an inch of his life.

Zimmerman had every right to shoot that little thug who was beating him

So edud according to your thinking if Zimmerman attacked Martin then Martin he no right to defend himself by beating Zimmerman". . .to within an inch of his life . . ." HOWEVER Zimmerman had every right to shoot and kill Martin because he was beating him? What the hell kinda logic is that??? Martin can't stand his ground but Zimmerman can?

The riot squads better start gearing up. You know that if Zimmerman is found not guilty there will be another riot in the streets claiming how "justice" wasn't served. No matter what comes up in the trial, which all of the lawyers on this post already seem to know, they will find a reason.

Just sayin'

Fletch, you are so right. Al and Jesse will whip up the believers once more and then look out.

It will be Occupy Zimmerman. This case shows how easily the American public can be manipulated.

The people like Ian above who are defending Martin don't understand the law apparently. I never said that Martin didn't have the right to defend himself if had he been attacked by Zimmerman. What he doesn't have the right to do is continue the beating AFTER the threat is over. What he doesn't have the right to do is attack someone just for following him.

This is why people like that pharmacist get convicted of murder even though they were initially in the right to defend themselves. Because, once the threat is gone, you can't keep beating the other person. The pharmacist shot the robber AFTER he had already shot him once and the robber was laying on the ground no longer a threat.

So, after Martin knocked Zimmerman to the ground, he had no right to jump on top of him and continue the beating. At that point, it could no longer be considered self defense if it ever really was self defense. At that point, it became aggravated battery, to which Zimmerman then had the right to defend himself from.

He used a gun because that's what he had to do to stop the beating. You idiots need to think before you speak.

I think an interesting aspect of this is that Zimmerman apparently did things right.

He was not a neighborhood watch person new to the job. He'd been doing it for some time and has a history of calling 911 to report suspicious people. Which is precisely what he did when observing Treyvon. He did not simply "stalk" Treyvon, he called in a suspicious person.

Seems to me that someone who is armed and feels empowered by that would not, first thing, call 911. After calling 911 the "suspicious" person looked perhaps like he was going to disappear into the night before the cops appeared and despite the SUGGESTION he not follow, Zimmerman chose to. There had been numerous break-ins in the area, he was neighborhood watch, he was being proactive.

The thing I see here is a lot of Monday morning quarterbacking. "If Zimmerman had just stayed in his car Treyvon would still be alive." I'm betting Zimmerman did not and could not predict the outcome. In his mind he may have thought that simply following the "suspicious person" would have intimidated him enough to stay out of the neighborhood (remember, at that time and place Zimmerman saw someone who appeared not to belong there). That Treyvon DID belong is beside the point.

"Treyvon was only armed with Skittles." How is this an argument? In effect, Treyvon had no weapon. Period. Would Zimmerman look more guilty if Treyvon had been carrying Gummy Bears? Would Zimmerman look less guilty if Treyvon had been carrying a 6-pack? It's irrelevent.

I picture a scene in which Zimmerman did follow Treyvon, with the intent to keep him in sight until the cops arrived, Treyvon feels intimidated without cause, turns and confronts Zimmerman. When did the violence begin? We don't know. But at some point Zimmerman felt he was in danger and pulled his gun. Did Treyvon wrestle for it and it went off accidentally? We don't know. Did Zimmerman think, "here's my chance, I'm going cap this dude"? Probably not.

From what I have read I'm inclined to think that Zimmerman did not want to shoot anyone. Things simply got out of control and Zimmerman may or may not be justified in pulling the trigger. It may, in effect, have been pulled for him in a scuffle. But this was an event, neighborhood watch following a suspicious appearing person, that occurs every single day. This one simply escalated.

If Martin saw the gun, the "threat" he perceived wouldn't be over until:

Martin got the gun away from Zimmerman or Zimmerman was unconscious or incapacitated.

Zimmerman might have flashed the gun. We only have his story to go by.

Many seem to want to believe Zimmerman, based on their own bias ("Trayvon was a black thug").

If I was being in a situation where I though I was going to possibly die, I would rather die fighting, than on my knees.

Some of you want to disregard the facts.

Facts:

Zimmerman never saw Martin commit a crime.

Zimmerman(nor his family) were never in any danger or under threat from Martin, so there was really no reason for George to do anything more than call the police. The police had already received many bogus complaints from George, which makes him seem kind of paranoid.

Zimmerman followed Martin around in his car, and then got out to continue on foot.

While not under any personal threat(nor his home or family) from Martin, Zimmerman decided to confront Martin while armed.

Zimmerman has a prior history of being violent and short tempered, and takes medication.

Anything other than what I listed above, is just Zimmerman's version of how things happened.

If you want to believe Zimmerman turned around and was heading back to his car, that's your perogative.

Trayvon's girlfriend says she heard Trayvon say "why are you following me", and then another male say "what are you doing here". That suggests a face to face meeting, not Trayvon jumping Zimmerman from behind.

If you are going to believe everything Zimmerman says, then why not take into account what Trayvon's gilrfriend heard? SHe isn't saying things to get out of going to prison, unlike Zimmerman.

If and when Trayvon did start fighting with Zimmerman, it's very likely(taking into account Zimmerman's past displays of anger and his taking meds), that Zimmerman said to himself "f*ck this guy", and decided to shoot him.

Another point I was going to make was the current (relatively) passport issue. It is possible to have two valid passports. It depends on your travel and/or employment requirements. A secondary passport is good for 2 years as opposed to 10 years for a primary. Most people cannot get a second passport. Zimmerman does not appear to be someone requiring 2 passports.

A common way people have 2 is by reporting theirs stolen or lost and getting another. The first is then no longer valid. You should not be able to pass immigration with it if you try.

Possessing 2 passports is not in itself illegal. Trying to use one that has been superceded by another is. Zimmerman apparently did not try to use his superceded passport.

He may not have reported having it because the passport may be, like for many people, a sort of souvenir of travels. In his mind it isn't useful for travel.

I myself have 2 valid passports, primary and secondary. If asked to turn in mine by a judge I'd turn in both. Mention that I have THREE other passports, expired, it wouldn't occur to me to.

Exactly Lobo. I believe Trayvon did just that, he was being followed (not knowing who this guy was) and then the guy chases him, and he turns to confront him.

I believe the one who should be allotted "stand you ground' would have been Trayvon. It was self-defense on his part.

This is also NOT the only case in Florida. There is another case just a few months ago about a Road Rage incident. The person who was being chased in the car by the Road Rage person, stopped his car and got out and the guy in the Road Rage car shot the person dead (said he felt threatened). The person who died had his brother following in the 3rd car and saw the whole thing. They let the guy OFF that killed the guy HE was chasing...The shooter was another "Security Guard/Wanna-be-Cop". ........ Look up Brandon Baker/Road Rage case. Stand your Ground is BS. It just gives ANYONE the right to kill ANYONE, when all they have to say IS "I felt threatened". It needs to be overturned.

jetjoky said:

He was not a neighborhood watch person new to the job. He'd been doing it for some time and has a history of calling 911 to report suspicious people. Which is precisely what he did when observing Treyvon. He did not simply "stalk" Treyvon, he called in a suspicious person.

We have a neighborhood watch group in our community and yes, ours is registered in the National Neighborhood Watch registry. And they stick to the observe and report rule.

I practice Kummooyeh---Korean sword disciplines. When we first moved into the neighborhood a year ago and took my swords out to the field beside the neighborhood church to practice, I was accosted by a cop who said he got a report from the neighborhood watch about a crazy kid waving a sword.

I explained (and demonstrated) to him that it was a form of martial arts, I practiced, and I wasn't hurting anyone and the swords were not sharpened. I asked the cop if it was going to be a problem, should I not practice outside? He said that wasn't necessary, I was free to do as I liked just to not openly threaten someone with the swords.

So a couple weeks later a different cop stops me while I'm practicing and says he got a call from the neighborhood watch about a crazy kid waving a sword. Again, i explained the situation and demoed the forms. He told me the same thing; its fine just don't threaten anyone.

Three weeks later I see someone standing off to the side of the field watching me practice and he's on his cellphone. I sheathed my sword and waited, thinking it's another cop and I have to explain again. This time it was the neighborhood watch captain who had been hearing reports from the other volunteers about a crazy person (hey, at least they didn't call me a kid this time, I'm freakin' 35!) waving a sword, but this time when he called 911 the dispatcher told him it's already been investigated, I was harmless and they would send an officer out to make an official introduction.

So I'm standing there watching him, he stands there watching me, neither one of us has the guts to approach each other. My sword is still sheathed but I can draw it in a moment if I have to, and I don’t know if he was packing (conceal isn’t allowed in my state) but he apparently wasn’t coming anywhere near my katana. Then a cop drives up, talks him, walks over to me, then waves the guy over and introduces me to the neighborhood watch captain. So I explain, for the third time, who I am and what I'm doing and since then I have had no further trouble with either the neighborhood watch, or the police, although they did tell me if I have sharpened swords leave them at home (my practice weapons are not sharpened).

That, in my opinion, is how a neighborhood watch is SUPPOSED to be run! Watch, observe, report, and let the cops deal with issues!

(BTW--when the cops got a call from dispatch some months later saying a female subject had caught someone trying to break in and was holding the burglar at swordpoint, they knew exactly who had called and where I lived and came right over. And then spent ten minutes laughing their a$$es off at the sight of a five-foot-coke-bottle-glasses-Asian-chick holding a stoner at (blunt) swordpoint for trying to break in. My Dad, a Vietnam and Korean War vet, always told me to use the least amount of force necessary to accomplish an objective--had I needed to, I still have his 1966 S&W Model 39 in the house and I do know how to shoot it. A gun was not necessary--two blunt shortswords were sufficient to make the stoner almost pee himself!)

@edub-3853225,

No you're and idiot. Trayvon attacked Zimmerman because he was stalking him and he didn't know what that prejudice liar's intentions were, which at that point he had every right to defend himself.

I would like to jump in right here to ask a question just when did the neighborhood watch get to carry guns? And why did this man with have one? Is it because what is being said is true and that he is a want-a- cop. And because his dad is a judge is that why he got a permit to carry one after a asult on a cop a few years back.

( @ David) And another thing a poster above her stated that GM had put all the money into his daughter's pay pal account for medical needs. What i want to know is when was that talked about and what web site he got it off from? Is his daughter 18 or older and why has the news said nothing.

edub-3853225

Kenster, you're an idiot. Please stop spreading your opinion as fact. Treyvon was shot because he attacked Zimmerman. Plain and simple.

lol. But your opinion is that TM attacked GZ. It certainly is not fact either...

And comments like yours and Mike Filmore's show how easily a group of people can be manipulated as you so eloquently stated about TM supporters. Why? You bring up things like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, as if to suggest they are the only reason GZ ever got in trouble. If you were unbiased and looked at the real facts of this case, the local PD did want to charge Zimmerman with manslaughter but the DA didn't want to take it on. You would also know GZ was never drug tested as he should have been but TM was....long before they knew who he was. Then there are the same people saying if not for a biased media, GZ would be free, etc. As of this piece, he lied to the courts. That is why his bail was revoked. Then people keep saying he had a permit to carry a concealed weapon. Maybe so but the medicines he had been given by a doctor should have temporarily suspended that permit, as well as his duties as a watch leader. But no one wants to focus on those facts. You just keep calling TM a punk who deserved what he got. He may have been a punk and a young man headed down a bad path, but he did not deserve what he got. No one would deserve being shot at point blank range, I don't care if someone is kicking my ass...I'd have to have way more than a broken nose and a cut on the back of my head...if my head was being pounded into the concrete, I would not refuse medical attention, nor would I be fully coherent I suspect. Even if Trayvon got in one good punch as GZ stated he did, then GZ would have been nearly knocked out, probably unable to find his weapon. I know the supposed tough guys won't buy it but it just goes to show what so few people actually know about what a punch really does to someone...further discrediting GZ.

If what GZ said is 100% truthful, he'd be a vegetable right now and never would have been conscious to fire his weapon.

Hey manns.....maybe you didn't know this, but it is not legal to attack someone just because they're following you or because you don't know what their intentions are. If it were, then should I be allowed to attack anyone walking behind me down the trail where I go to walk my dog? I mean, by your logic, they're following me and I don't know what their intentions are, so I should be allowed to turn around and attack them. Idiot....

And quit using the terms "stalking". You apparently don't understand what it means or you wouldn't be using it in this situation.

Edub--Not only is it not legal to attack someone just because they're following you, but it is interesting that the ones who think that Trayvon is an innocent child seem to forget that if Zimmerman should have known that Trayvon WAS a child, that notion would have been knocked right out of his head the minute Trayvon broke his nose.

BTW--according to stories that were printed at the beginning of all this, Zimmerman was NOT on patrol the night this happened. He was on his way on an errand, and saw someone he thought was suspicious.

Also, the concealed carry permit that Zimmerman had was (again according to early stories,) issued because Zimmerman had been threatened by dogs in the neighborhood. So your point is good.

And IF Zimmerman should have been able to tell, in the dark and in the rain, that Trayvon only had a 'tea and skittles', surely it is also true that Trayvon should have been able to know that HE, as a football player/athlete who had several inches of height on Zimmerman, he could EASILY out run Zimmerman on a race to the dad's GF's condo.

Really no need to put all this spin on a fairly simple conclusion, that is, if you answer the simple question: If not for the actions of GZ, would TM be alive today? No need for the racism, politics, or denigration of our legal system. Just answer that one question and the truth will out. Why make this something that it is not? Why use it to support one's personal agenda? No need. Just answer the question.

Colorblind - You state "Really no need to put all this spin on a fairly simple conclusion, that is, if you answer the simple question: If not for the actions of GZ, would TM be alive today?"

Now replace GZ with TM and you got it right.

Empirate...To do so would alter the fact that GZ was the one that pulled the trigger. That simple fact cannot be overlooked.

@The Gateway Bull....YOU are exactly right....George Zimmerman is a " daddy's boy " . . . . . . . . . George Zimmerman has been treated with kid gloves and his Father and Mother have gotten him out of every mess, George has gotten into . . . George Zimmerman HAS a criminal record . . . several offenses George Zimmerman has commited, HOWEVER....HOWEVER, Daddy & Mommy (both) got George Zimmerman's records EXPUNGED !!! EXPUNGED !!!! Not everyone has that type of LUXRY....... ! ! HOWEVER, GEORGE ZIMMERMAN did have that type of luxry, ONLY because of Daddy & Mommy . . . . . . I only HOPE JUSTICE will give GEORGE ZIMMERMAN the punishment he deserves, FOR once in George's life .

Gateway and Bull--you AMAZE me. Zimmerman got into TWO scrapes with the law, ONE when he had too much to drink, and shoved a cop, which was dropped as he was NOT driving drunk, and another where he and a girlfriend got into a fight and the judge issued restraining orders against BOTH.

In the RECENT past, Zimmerman has gotten married, was one semester shy of getting his Nursing degree (yeah--that shows a desire for violence) and due to seeing neighbors frightened and victimized by burglaries, agreed to join a neighborhood watch.

Trayvon, on the other hand, AT the TIME of the evening of his death, was UNDER SUSPENSION for Possession of marijuana, (and had it in his system when he died), and had also been caught by a janitor of his school, AT A time when NO student was supposed to be in the building, and the janitor found burglary tools and a LOT of girl's jewelry in his back pack, and the only reason THAT wasn't referred to the police was that a girlfriend 'claimed' that all the jewelry was hers.

And if you want to talk about whose parents SPOILED someone, Trayvon, while UNDER SUSPENSION FROM SCHOOL (and a two week suspension in MY school is the second worst punishment you can get, and usually means there have been OTHER, lesser suspensions previously) was allowed to go spend the time out of town with dad, and to roam the neighborhood of dad's Girlfriend after dark on a school night, and watch Basket ball games.

MY Kid would have been grounded. NO TV, NO cell phone, NO computer. But then, I as a parent, would have considered SCHOOL to be the most important part of my kid's life, and made it CLEAR that he majorly screwed up.

And by the way, Trayvon had over $40 bucks in his wallet, and yet I have heard NOTHING about him having a job (and you just KNOW if he had it would have been brought up as proof of what a 'good kid' he was along with a tearful boss saying the same) so WHERE did he get the money to buy the tea and skittles, much less the $42 he had left? WHOSE Parents were spoiling WHOM?

Carol,

You are mistaken or a blatant liar. George Zimmerman does not have a record. He was arrested twice but no charges were ever filed. Get it straight before you go off on bold type rants.

George will walk. Given the evidence, there is no way he can be convicted. Get ready for the riots.

MoMaid said:

Zimmerman got into TWO scrapes with the law, ONE when he had too much to drink, and shoved a cop, which was dropped as he was NOT driving drunk, and another where he and a girlfriend got into a fight and the judge issued restraining orders against BOTH.

Zimmerman had an altercation with a cop when the cop attempted to arrest a friend. He shoved a cop and got belligerent, then when the cop called for backup to have him arrested, Zimmerman shoved that cop too. Because it was his first offense he was allowed to perform community service and 18 months probation in lieu of a conviction--but the arrest and two felony charges of assaulting two cop are on his record. Some questions arise here about whether his father's career may have influenced the decision since this pretrial diversion program is supposed to only be for misdemeanors, and assaulting a cop--two cops--is a felony.

Zimmerman and his girlfriend got into an altercation. She had him arrested and asked for a restrainin order/injunction against him. The judge granted it. He turned the next day and filed one on her. The judge granted that one too. There were also two traffic tickets for minor offenses. Look up Orange Co court records. he has five cases in the system.

In the RECENT past, Zimmerman has gotten married, was one semester shy of getting his Nursing degree (yeah--that shows a desire for violence) and due to seeing neighbors frightened and victimized by burglaries, agreed to join a neighborhood watch.

Zimmerman was recently married. I hadn't heard anything about a nursing degree, but he applied to be a FL cop and was disqualified. He attempted to get a job as security officer (former coworkers here had a few comments about erratic behavior) and was fired. Shortly before all of this happened he went to VA, where he was living before his parents moved them all to FL, and asked if his friend could find out what the requirements to be a VA cop was--and if Zimmerman could pass he would move back to VA.

He volunteered to join the neighborhood watch when it was formed. Sanford PD went to the watch meetings, gave them basic training on what to do, how to handle themselves, how to deal with certain situations. At this meeting it was also stressed that they were to observe and report, not pursue and confront.

Trayvon, on the other hand, AT the TIME of the evening of his death, was UNDER SUSPENSION for Possession of marijuana, (and had it in his system when he died), and had also been caught by a janitor of his school, AT A time when NO student was supposed to be in the building, and the janitor found burglary tools and a LOT of girl's jewelry in his back pack, and the only reason THAT wasn't referred to the police was that a girlfriend 'claimed' that all the jewelry was hers.

Martin had an empty plastic bag in his backpack which may or may not have contained pot; the school didn't know for certain and so suspended him rather than expelled him and did not involve the police.

He had a screwdriver in his backpack and several items of women's jewelry, but they were never identified as having been stolen from anyone and no one claimed it. While a screwdriver COULD be used as a burglary tool, simply having one does not indicate that you will commit a crime or that you HAVE committed a crime with one.

THC is the active ingredient in marijuana, and it was trace amounts of this that were in his system. Of note, however, is the ME's report that it was 'below the level considered to cause impairment'. Also of note, THC is the active ingredient in an FDA-approved drug called Marinol, which is used to treat nausea, vomiting and loss of appetite. Researchers are also looking at using it to fight Alzheimers and brain cancer in cooperation with the DEA.

Zimmerman was under treatment at the time with benzodiazepine and amphetamine. The amphetamine is legal in this formula, but not legal in other forms (methamphetamine) and has been banned in every country except the US and Canada because it causes 'aggression' and 'lack of control over socially unacceptable behavior.' So if you're going to bring up that Martin was under the influence, then you have to point out Zimmerman was too.

And if you want to talk about whose parents SPOILED someone, Trayvon, while UNDER SUSPENSION FROM SCHOOL (and a two week suspension in MY school is the second worst punishment you can get, and usually means there have been OTHER, lesser suspensions previously) was allowed to go spend the time out of town with dad, and to roam the neighborhood of dad's Girlfriend after dark on a school night, and watch Basket ball games.

MY Kid would have been grounded. NO TV, NO cell phone, NO computer. But then, I as a parent, would have considered SCHOOL to be the most important part of my kid's life, and made it CLEAR that he majorly screwed up.

Martin's father wasn't a resident, but they were visiting the father's girlfriend, who was, and had done so on multiple occasions over (reportedly) the previous two years. The father's girlfriend had a son named Chad, younger than Martin, who Martin may have considered his 'little brother' and who was obviously trusted enough by both father and girlfriend to leave home to babysit while the father and girlfriend went out to dinner. Halftime of the NBA Allstars game, Martin decides he wants tea, Chad requests Skittles, Martin goes to buy, never comes home.

While nothing concrete has been said, had I been Martin's father and Martin been my son who is hanging out with questionable friends, letting his grades slide to a B+ and being suspended for possible drug use, I would have taken my son out of the neighborhood during his suspension, lodged him with my girlfriend in a neighborhood away from any possible bad influences he may have picked up, and tried to talk some sense into him, instilling in him a sense of responsibility; there is this younger child who looks up to him as a surrogate 'older brother' and he has a responsibility to set a good example. To reinfiorce that sense of responsibility, leave him alone to babysit one evening. Since Chad is not much younger than Trayvon (think the article said he's thirteen) it is okay to leave him for short periods of time but not for longer periods so Martin didn't go far to get the tea and candy. He is 17, he's gotten throiugh school thus far with an A average and only recently has it been slipping and he is not going to get funding for training for a career as an aviation mechanic with lower than an A.

You know what gets to me? Chad probably thinks if he hadn't asked his 'older brother' for candy, Martin might not have left the house that night and would still be alive. It's called survivors' guilt. Chad, if you're reading this...keep telling yourself this isn't your fault. None of it was. A lot of people made some bad decisions that night, and your brother is dead because of those decisions, but it is not your fault.

Amanda - all that background and history is nice, but is largely irrelevant, it comes down to who physically attacked who first at this incident and the evidence shows that TM attacked GZ first.

evidence shows that TM attacked GZ first.

Actually it does not. It may not show that GZ attacked first, but no evidence exists that documents TM as the initiator of the physical confrontation. Evidence is plausible that a physical altercation occurred, but even that is not proven. Is there video footage of the incident that nobody has released yet. At best, it shows that TM was more effective at attacking, but not that he attacked first.

Primate guy - The autopsy report only shows a bruised/ abraded ring finger knuckle on TM. If there are no other marks from GZ on TM except the gunshot wound, there is only one logical conclusion - that TM attacked first.

Empirate said:

Amanda - all that background and history is nice, but is largely irrelevant, it comes down to who physically attacked who first at this incident and the evidence shows that TM attacked GZ first.

I was correcting some of the wrong impressions MoMaid had gotten from news sources.

Yes, it comes down to who attacked who first. THAT is what the whole cases rests on, and that is something we do not know at this point. But also one has to look at the surrounding issue of whether appropriate force was used to defuse the situation, whether other alternatives may have been available to remove threats, and whether deadly force was justified and any laws were broken.

The autopsy report only shows a bruised/ abraded ring finger knuckle on TM. If there are no other marks from GZ on TM except the gunshot wound, there is only one logical conclusion - that TM attacked first.

The ring finger knuckle on the human hand is much smaller and less prominent than the knuckle on the middle finger. I'm not an expert, you'd have to talk to someone who's been in a number of fights, but it seems reasonable to me that if Martin had punched Zimmerman, the large knuckle on the middle finger would have shown signs of trauma. Reportedly it has not. We are going to have to wait and see what comes out at the trial.

Personally? I believe that after he hung up with 911 at 7:21 and 21 secondsZimmerman spotted MArtin again, ignored the do not confront directive established by both the neighborhood watch manual and by the police when they helped set up the watch program and the dispatcher. I believe Martin's girlfriend's account that she was talking to him on the phone as Zimmerman commenced following him, and I believe her when she says that she heard Martin say over the phone to the person who was following him, 'Why are you following me? and the girlfriend says that she heard Zimmerman say 'what are you doing here?' I believe that at this point Martin may have hit or shoved Zimmerman and Zimmerman struggled with him, at which point a female witness saw the altercation, called 911 about two men struggling in her backyard at 7:21 and 56 seconds, and 45 seconds into the call the shot is heard that killed Martin.

The 35 second gap between the time Zimmerman hung up with 911 and the time the female caller called 911 about seeing two men struggling in her backyard is the issue here. What happened in those 35 seconds?

Primate guy - The autopsy report only shows a bruised/ abraded ring finger knuckle on TM. If there are no other marks from GZ on TM except the gunshot wound, there is only one logical conclusion - that TM attacked first.

Only in your mind. It's quite reasonable to suggest that GZ tried to restrain TM, or grabbed at him, because he wanted to make sure he didn't get away. He doesn't have to punch him for it to be assault. There's also the possibility he did try to punch him and failed, or pushed him. None of which would leave any noticeable marks.

Empirate

Primate guy - The autopsy report only shows a bruised/ abraded ring finger knuckle on TM. If there are no other marks from GZ on TM except the gunshot wound, there is only one logical conclusion - that TM attacked first.

The autopsy report does not conclude that that specific injury was particularly consistent with an altercation.

The injuries on Zimmerman are consistent with a fight, but not exclusively.

He could have fell on the way back to his car. He could have caused them himself.

Since Zimmerman is the defendant, any plausible account of the injuries consistent with self-defense is sufficient to cast reasonable doubt. His account in the grossest terms seems plausible.

If Martin had managed to beat Zimmerman to death, then he would himself only be required to establish that it was necessary to do so to defend himself from an armed agressor.

There are many logical assumptions, and a few plausible ones. To claim that an abrasion on a knuckle is the definite cause of Zimmerman's injuries to his face either minimizes the degree of those injuries, or displays an ignorance of human osteology, because the metacarpals are some of the most easily fractured bones in the human body.

Even if additional evidence proved without doubt that an altercation occurred, it does not necessarily follow that TM struck first based upon the injuries.

ZM may be found not guilty. With the stupid SYG law in place, it is even more likely. That does not indicate that he did not commit murder. It simply indicates that his generally pausible account casts sufficient doubt on his guilt. In many cases to claim that forensics alone prove anything more often than not reflects an agenda more than an analysis.

Really? A scratch on a knuckle proves this case? Pair that with reliable and corroborating witnesses and/or an unedited video and you may have something.

I have a few riddles:

Q: What walks around the neighborhood armed?

A: Not a neighborrhood watch volunteer. (They are specifically instructed to both be unarmed, and to never engage or follow a suspicious person_

Q: Who assaults a police officer and does not serve jail time?

A: Someone whose father is a former judge.

Q: What is covered in candy, tea, and a 17 year old's blood?

A: George Zimmerman.

These are jokes, and so is your simplistic argument.

yes, the lies do make one wonder what else he cooked up.

People lie. All people lie.

No - all people don't lie.

Yes we do. If your wife asks you 'does this dress make me look fat?' and you're already late for the dinner reservation, are you going to say 'yes it does' and have her either burst into tears, smack you and let you sleep on the couch, or go through two more hours of her trying to figure out what to wear?

If you're a smart husband, you say 'of course not, dear, let's go, food's waiting.'

If your boss hands you a supervisor's performance review and asks you 'here, fill this out and let me know how I'm doing as your boss', are you going to write what you really think?

Only if you decide you REALLY don't like that job!

We all lie. We have to. The small white lies like 'no, that dress doesn't make you look fat' help you get along with the people you live with (and also keep your wife from doing a Lorena Bobbitt on you.). The big ones like not giving an honest critique of your boss's performance are a matter of self-preservation-you need the job to make money in order to live and eat.

If you want an example of how bad this world would be if we all never lied, watch Jim Carrey's 'Liar, Liar'. It's very instructive.

So Amanda...your solution to lying is.....Don't marry a fat wife?

Your solution to lying reviewing your boss...would be, be your own boss?

I have to agree with tooelemom...even though I understand most people tell white lies, many of those same people would never lie to a court or lie where it really matters. I certainly am one of those people. The fact that GZ did makes me wonder if anything he says can be trusted. I feel bad for his life being ruined over this, even if he is found not guilty....but truth be told, every bit of it was brought on by his actions.

We as a country should be ashamed we act like the people here do toward one another and should instead be finding ways to bring ourselves together to be a stronger nation. The "Stand Your Ground" law should be revised to avoid situations like this and we should also look into why a man was still able to carry a weapon while he was taking medication that certainly impaired his judgement---the laws should be changed there if they are not satisfactory.

starsailing said:

So Amanda...your solution to lying is.....Don't marry a fat wife?

Your solution to lying reviewing your boss...would be, be your own boss?

Lying is essential to continuing a peaceful existence on this planet. Seriously. We all have to do it.

My belief system says if something isn't true, or going to do some good, or spread a little love around, don't say it, do it or think it. I try to live by that, although I am human and I do make mistakes. White lies like telling my wife (in this case, my husband) that no, the clothes don't make him look fat, is spreading some love around. I love him, therefore I don't care how he looks--we've been happily married for ten years and I can't imagine being married to anyone else. I don't care what he looks like, the person inside the shell hasn't changed.

Lying to my boss--well, that will do some good because I'm the only wage-earner in the house, hubby's disabled, and we have two ypoung boys, aged 10 and 9, and my nine year old is autistic. My lying to my boss will help me keep my job, enabling me to keep us off welfare and setting an example for my children that welfare is a hand up, not a handout, and there's no such thing as entitlement, if you want something in this world you have to work for it, and everything has a price, nothing is free.

I have to say I got a good kick out of your story about a neighborhood watch, Amanda. As you stated, that is how interactions with any such watch should be, where the police handle the issues. Not the other way around. Too funny that they kept thinking you were a kid and here, you're married and have children. lol. It just goes to show why this case is all that more touchy for most people. They judge people without ever thinking in the moment, leading to problems that never had to exist in the first place. Glad to see there are people out there like you.

It is well known that Zimm, a wannabe cop, is a big fan of "24" and Jack Bauer.

His minor wounds were absolutely self inflicted.

If his account of events was true, Zimm would have been covered in Treyvon's blood. "Where is it Mr. Fung?"

Maybe, all people do lie...maybe...Those who lie under oath in a court of law are called pergurors. Stupid and a very bad idea to lie to a judge....even if the judge is fat and doesn't look good in a dress.

Tbone--I have two passports. I had a house fire 8 years ago, and according to my best memory, my 'old' passport (which was actually my THIRD, but the old OLD one expired many years ago) was in a file box that burned.

I got a new passport 3 years ago, and lo and behold, last year, I found the other one when looking through a box of old photos.

Did that make ME a liar when I said my old one was burned? Nope, it may have made me WRONG, but it didn't make me a liar.

David--Where is Trayvon's blood? you DO know that Zimmerman called his wife and asked her to bring him a clean shirt and to drive his care home? I mean, they lived in the same neighborhood.

Don't know if the cops have the shirt, but I'm betting the cops AND the ambulance EMT who treated Zimmerman at the site would have seen all the blood on it.

They may even have it.

It will also have ZIMMERMAN's blood on it, if so.

Momaid....If you knew that you had a second passport in a safety deposit box, then, yes, it would make you a liar. You did not. Therefore, you are comparing apples and oranges. He knew where his second passport was and completely destroyed his credibility by hiding that fact and his financial status. How are we to believe anything he says or his wife testifies to after this incredible blunder. Was he lying then or is he lying now and about what?

The new passport was obtained after this case started and now he is lying about his finances. If all you knew about the case was that, if you didn't know names and you were the judge it would like a flight risk.

Rfus- GZ has not lied, otherwise the judge would have added a charge of perjury. GZ didn't even testify at the bond hearing. Not standing up and objecting from the back of the courtroom to his wife's "no" answer to the question "Do you have any other assets that can be reasonably liquidated?" is not lying. How was GZ supposed to even know that he could or should do that?

Empirate said:

GZ didn't even testify at the bond hearing

Uh. yes, he did. There was a fuss about it because he tried to take that opportunity to apologize to the family for their son's death after his lawyer said specifically not to mention it, to just answer the questions.

Nah it's not that easy. You have to make it something really special to bring the gun freaks out from under their rocks and get them to open their wallets.

also the racists.

That's right. We who possess all the guns also possess lots of the bucks.
Have a nice day.

A fool and his money are soon parted.

Amen!!!

Did you know that people own guns to protect themselves and there families from life threatening criminals. Yeah it's something that our country was founded on. Being able to protect yourself from Tyranny and Criminals. Im not a fighter, so I own some guns. And by the way in all the years I have owned and shot firearms, I have never accidentally shot, killed, or had to pull my firearm on anybody. Thank god! But I'm not willing to risk my life or the lives on my family to say that guns are not necessary for ones defense and not own any. That would be irresponsible and foolish. Because Evil exists, and people use deadly force to steal petty things or to prove themselves as "hardened Thugs". Wake up from your Fantasy and come into the real world.

Exactly Another. When the bad guy(s) come through the window or door you can't call 911 and instantly get a cop on the scene. Most likely someone will leave the premises in a body bag. You have to decide if it's going to be you or the bad guy(s).
The Second Amendment was put there for a reason. A very good reason.
In this particular case let us all let justice take its course and just move on.

@Mike Fillmore'

First of all that child was not coming through anyone's window, he wasn't even near anyone house he was walking back from a convenient store. George Zimmerman like most racist saw an African American kid walking through the neighborhood that he lived in with a hoodie on in the rain and decided to kill him. And once the cops got there he felt it was a good idea to lie and say he was defending himself. People always twist things up to appease themselves to try and make sense of something that is wrong. smh

manns.....whatever you say.

Manns,

First of all, a 6'2" young man is not a "child". Yes, he was very near houses. Walking back from the store, iced tea, or Skittles have nothing to do with this case. You have no proof George Zimmerman is a racist. In fact there is ample proof that he is not. It seems GZ decided to kill when he was being beaten. I doubt his attacker's race or choice of apparel had anything to do with the decision to shoot. There are confirmed injuries to GZ and none on Trayvon except for bruised knuckles.

What were you saying about people twisting things up?

For the one million and tenth time, Trayvon was not a child! He was a young adult!

Well if you gun toting maniacs would learn how to defend yourselves properly there would be no need for a gun now would there? A person who knows how to defend themselves properly and like a man can disarm an armed threat with just their bare hands. A person who knows how to defend themselves properly who doesn't need a gun and has a set of balls is called a man. A person who has a gun which any idiot including your own children can use to kill someone including themselves is called a sissy, a wimp, a no balls having walking talking threat to humanity.

Also on the side note look at it from this point of view... If I happen to be in Florida and see someone walking past me armed with a gun and I feel threatened for my life because I don't know what their intentions are especially being that they're armed does that give me the right to shoot and kill that person??? According to your own gun toting gun happy good for nothing laws I guess it does cause maybe that person is a thug.

In America, a 17 year old is still considered a child. A minor. Unless said person is emancipated. What were YOU saying "country" about people twisting things up? What does Trayvon Martin's height have to do with him being killed for no reason. How tall are you?

I'm just sick of all these people who paint gun owners as freaks. Those same people are using this case to attack all law abiding gun owners claiming there is no place for guns in this world. And I say to them, "Then is the only place they belong, in the hands of thugs?" Forget the George Zimmerman case. PEOPLE ARE SHOT AND KILLED EVERYDAY. The media just targeted this case as a means of creating Racial Tension to get people to vote for our current president to prove themselves not racist, again. That is the only reason this case is and ever was heard of. Life has it's tragedies. This being one of them. No body has the right to pass judgment on Zimmerman or Martin for what happened that day, because most anybody blogging about it has never been in that kind of situation and most of all were not there that day. In those situations, you are not thinking, you are reacting and at the end of the day there is regret. He has to live with that, not you, his life is ruined regardless of how it comes out in court. He is hated by a lot of people because he killed someone, that's not easy to deal with. For people who call him a racist, you are foolish and probably quite racist yourself.

Does anybody remember there were over 40 shootings in Chicago on Memorial Day weekend? A little girl was shot playing in her front yard. All of those shootings were by gang bangers, and statistically I'm pretty sure that most were black. Didn't see those perpetrators in the news at all. Nope because Black on Black crime is old news even when thugs shoot innocents. But because one HALF white male shoots and kills a young black male who at the time wasn't doing anything wrong the media paints it as a Racist Murder to provoke Racist thought and division. It kills me because people just keep complaining about being profiled.. I bet those people who complain, look in the mirror and profile themselves as "looking thuggish" everyday because that's how they want to appear. People bring it upon themselves to be profiled whether your white, black, or hispanic. Wake up America, your Government is Controlling your thoughts and feelings through the media and you haven't figured it out.

William cooper, it is evident that you feel you are invincible. Do you watch UFC? I bet you do. Is there anybody who is undefeated? I'll save you the research. There isn't. You see even if you are a highly trained "bad ass" of a "Man" who has the opportunity to study your opponent for months, there is always the chance of defeat. In my eyes, because I am not as well trained others and will never have the opportunity to study my possible opponent (thug/thief) nor do I know if he will be 6' 10" 280lbs, or even if he will have his 3 thug buddies with him, I own a gun because that makes up for that mismatch. Don't be so naive. The last thing you want for yourself and your family is to have intruders enter your house, you get beat unconscious, and you wake up to your wife/gf raped and beaten, your children beaten maybe possibly kidnapped, and least important all sorts of things missing from your house/apt. I will choose a gun, shoot and kill my perpetrators and go to court for 20 years over the mess before my family is harmed. Call me gun crazy, sissy, no balls, wimp, an idiot, or a gun toting maniac, I call myself prepared.

@what country is this?,

Legally if a child is under 18 regardless of how tall he/she is they are still a kid/child, the only thing that proves is that he share the same genes of a tall family member(you know someone else is tall as well) now get you facts straight. Now let me re-iterate on what I said earlier, people will twist things just to appease themselves when someone does something wrong because they don't want to believe the truth. Like I said before Trayvon was not coming through anyone's window he was walking through the neighborhood to get back to his own destination. I also said he wasn't even near anyone's house, yes he had to walk pass some houses to get to the house he was in but he wasn't close enough to even say he look like he was up to no good. And yes that "CHILD'S" race and clothing had a lot to do with what happened according to the dispatchers recording if you listened. And yes there are bruised knuckles on Trayvon but there is also a bullet shot threw his chest which shouldn't be there because Zimmerman was "CLEARLY" told not to follow that kid which he chose to ignore. So if Zimmerman has any marks it because of what he created that kid had every right to defend himself no telling what Zimmerman had in mind(oh, I guess that part is crystal clear) unfortunately. I hope I cleared the whole "twisted" remark up for ya. smh

Sandy--sorry, but in my state you're an adult at 17. Can get a bank loan, can work full time, and can get tried in court as an adult if your behavior warrants it.

Trayvon's behavior demonstrates that HE at least believed he was not only 'grown up' but above the law.

and the REASON Trayvon's height comes into play is two fold--ONE, is that the assumption when you see some one, IN THE DARK, and you cannot see their face, but they are several inches taller than you and YOU aren't that short, that person is ALSO a grown up.

the second reason why Trayvon's height comes into play is that as a HS football player who played one of the skill positions, and was more than 3" taller than Zimmerman, plus younger, he should have had NO trouble beating Z in a foot race back to his dad's GF's house.

Momaid...If we were talking foot race, you might be right. Regardless, of his height, wt, youth or anything else.....He would not be able to out run a bullet. No one knows who started the altercation, but one thing is clear: If GZ had not pursued TM, Trayvon would be alive today and be able to tell his side of the story. He didn't know who or why this guy was following him. He acted reasonably for his age and what he thought may be happening. Why are you so intent on blaming the victim? If it was a female and she was a great athlete and runner, would you blame her for not running home has fast as she could if she had been raped by a stranger following her for no apparent reason? That is ludicrous! TM can not tell his tale....because he couldn't out run a bullet to the chest at close range.

@MOmaid,

Ummmmmm news flash everyone doesn't live in your state. "Trayvon's behavior demonstrates that HE at least believed he was not only 'grown up' but above the law." Yes because only adults carry skittles and ice tea cans". WHAT WAS THAT KID THINKING? At this point you just need to stop trying to make points because you sound more and more ridiculous.

"and the REASON Trayvon's height comes into play is two fold--ONE, is that the assumption when you see some one, IN THE DARK, and you cannot see their face, but they are several inches taller than you and YOU aren't that short, that person is ALSO a grown up." (your words)

Then this is what you do stop assuming. Adults are not the only people that are tall and for you to assume that is just foolish, and then judging in the dark is even more stupid. One thing for sure you're not the sharpest tool in the shed.

"the second reason why Trayvon's height comes into play is that as a HS football player who played one of the skill positions, and was more than 3" taller than Zimmerman, plus younger, he should have had NO trouble beating Z in a foot race back to his dad's GF's house." (your words again)

Ummmmmm why should he be on a foot race again, he did nothing wrong? And what is the point about him being a HS football player, how does athleticism come into play they weren't about to play two hand touch football outside, it was a little more serious then that? Here's how it goes, yes keep some distance between you and the pursuer, since you've done nothing wrong then what's the need to run but make it back safely which is what Trayvon Martin tried to do unfortunately Zimmerman made it a point to approach the kid after being warned not to and he got into it with that kid (regardless how tall he was he can't beat a bullet) and then killed him. Please make sense next time.

Momaid said:

Trayvon's height comes into play is that as a HS football player who played one of the skill positions, and was more than 3" taller than Zimmerman, plus younger, he should have had NO trouble beating Z in a foot race back to his dad's GF's house.

The police report said that the black male subject lying facedown on the ground with his hands under his body is 6'00", 160. Zimmerman identified himself to the officer as Zimmerman, George Michael, white male DOB 10/5/83, 5'09" no weight given and no drivers license.

Reportedly Martin was extremely fond of football, but at 6 feet and160 pounds did not have the muscle mass and build for it and did not play.

The shooting happened 75 feet from the back door of the girlfriend's house, where his 'younger brother' was waiting alone. Given that only 35 seconds are unaccounted for that night between the time Zimmerman called 911 and officers were dispatched at 7:17 and the time Paramedic Brady of Sanford Rescue 38 pronounced a black male subject deceased at 7:30, I believe timing indicates that he ran straight for 'home' but simply never reached it.

Stand Your Ground will stand for ten thousand years.

bob_1003 - 'With his credibility blown what defense does he have?'

Zero defense, as they've two strikes against this upstanding citizen = two passports and he and his wife lying to the court about their finances.

stand your ground should not apply when the person is carrying a gun with the intent of provking a confrontation and using it, its appropriate in cases like home invasion and car jacking.

The evidence points to Zimmerman being attacked, and he has the right to defend himself. No laws were broken by either of them untill that first punch landed, and since Zimmerman is the only one with injuries consistant with being attacked, what conclusion do you think a reasonable person is going to come to.

Steve, you are so right. I want justice and as you say it would be hard for a reasonable person not to conclude it was Zimmerman who was attacked. He may have brought it on himself but he was the one who was attacked.

the AUTHORS of the stand your ground law said in an interview that they thought the law WOULD NOT APPLY in this case, due to circumstances, location, and behavior of Z.

Having 2 passports is not a crime. One can be lost, you receive a new one only to later find the missing one. You obviously the current passport and you wouldn't be able to use the previous at the airports since that would have been cancelled..... but you can physically have 2. Jeezzz....

Let the court and the jury decide.

Something for all the Zimmerman advocates to think about. What if Zimmerman pulled the gun on Martin in a face to face confrontation? In my state threatening a person with a weapon is assualt. What if instead of running Martin pushed back causing Zimmerman to hit his head? Where is the blame? Zimmerman for pulling the gun, or Martin for pushing? I still stand by my original statement, if Zimmerman had not pursued and pushed for a confrontation the kid would still be alive and there would be no legal issues. If you cannot see the trail of actions responsible for the final result, then you are blind.

Steve

When you can prove that, get back to us. What ifs dont count in court, only evidence.

Steve you are absolutely right, the evidence so far indicates that Zimmerman was carrying a concealed weapon, that he had identified Martin as someone suspiciously walking through the neighborhood with his bag of skittles, that he actually followed him, that he is not law enforcement, that he got out of his vehicle, even though Martin had not done anything wrong, that the ran after Martin, that the whole incident was initiated by Zimmerman, and without Zimmerman provacations Martin would still be alive, that is the evidence so far. This isn't a stand your ground issue, its an issue about a nut running around with a loaded gun.

What evidence conclusively proves that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Don't tell me a broken nose and grass stains on his back....because there are other ways that could easily happen. Even the cuts on his head are suspect because his story is he was getting his head slammed into the concrete. Last I checked, that would severely injure most humans if not kill them. Yet, he was completely aware, able to walk, etc.

I'm all for letting the law decide but the GZ apologists keep sharing "conjecture" and calling it fact. It is only fact when it can be proven with evidence. Sadly, there is no conclusive evidence to prove any part of that night past GZ hanging up the 911 call. And he could have easily gone after TM after he hung up. Likewise, TM could have attacked him for feeling threatened. Based on where TM was found, the lapse of just over a minute, etc...I find GZ's version of events hard to believe. Why? Well, for starters, TM would have been dead next to GZ's vehicle. Not in between/behind someone's house. I hope they change the laws in Florida because they are the real issue here, along with all the hate and ignorance that exists in this country.

Nigol66 - Having 2 passports is not a crime.

Having two passports isn't a crime, but not turning both in when you were ordered to do so as a condition of bail is, at the very least, contempt of court.

Ah, but Zimmerman was ordered to "turn in his passport." For the vast majority of people, this means the passport used to travel with. Not old or expired ones.

It isn't clear in the report, but my impression is that Zimmerman's other passport may still have been within it's expiration date. I don't know about Zimmerman, but people who travel frequently and/or plan well ahead update their passport before it is within 6 months of expiration. So it is conceivable he had two passports within their valid dates. But only the latest passport is valid for international travel.

To Zimmerman his "other" passport, which he knows he can't use, is just a travel souvenir. He did turn in his useable one, just as the judge ordered.

Once again, this is not about guns or any other political agenda. This is about the death of a young man at the hands of GZ. Would TM be alive today if GZ had not acted the way he did? Would a reasonable person believe that he was being stalked by GZ under the same circumstances? What would a young man do to stop that threat, if he believed he was being followed by a person--not in any sort of uniform or with any sort of authority emblem on his person? Who made this outcome happen? What started the chain of events that ensued? Why? All of your agendas aren't worth the effort you put into proclaiming them as truth. They are irrelevant. What is relevant is the answer to the one question: If it had not been for the actions of GZ, would TM be alive today? The answer is a resounding...YES, he would be alive today. Fatal encounter.

Colorblind, You and all those labeling Trayvon as innocent make up 'facts to fit your theory'. so I'll make up some too--

Lets just suppose Trayvon, who had a history of being caught with burglary tools while not supposed to be in his school, and who also had a history of drugs, either WAS 'casing' the neighborhood, and when he saw Zimmerman following, was afraid he might get caught, or EVEN better, lets suppose that Trayvon actually went to the convenience store for some tea but actually did so to buy or sell some MJ--and when he sees he is being followed, he thinks the customer/seller is coming after the rest of his money or that he might get caught with the MJ.

IF he had drugs on him, it would explain him "disappearing'' (dropping out of side to hide his stash), and if he had burglary tools, ditto. Reappearing to attack Zimmerman could have been with the knowledge that he didn't want anyone to 'catch on'.

See how fun that is when you "make up facts" that fit what is actually known, but without ANY basis what ever?

Momaid...I didn't make up any facts...you do. I simply asked the pertinent question: If not for GZ's actions, would TM be alive today? No ifs. No ands. No buts. Just answer the question and the truth is clear. Your imagination is getting away from you. I didn't make up a damn thing. Would a reasonable person, given the same facts and circumstances, have acted in a similar manner as GZ and TM? That is what is going to be asked in court--Called the "Reasonable Person Test". You can manufacture all the scenarios you want and you will still have to answer that one final question. If GZ stayed in his vehicle, reported to the police what he saw and left it at that...Would Trayvon Martin be alive today? My guess is that he would be.

Steve

The prosecution is going to have to prove that it didnt happen exactly like GZ said it happened, and with the evidence so far, they cant do it. GZ doesnt have to prove his innocents, the prosecution has to prove his guilt.

MoMaid said:

Lets just suppose Trayvon, who had a history of being caught with burglary tools while not supposed to be in his school, and who also had a history of drugs, either WAS 'casing' the neighborhood,

He was holding a can of tea and a package of skittles for his 'younger brother' and was talking on the phone with his girlfriend at the time (timestamps on her phone records show calls overlappinjg Zimmerman's calls to 911 at 7:17.)

He had a screwdriver in his backpack. While it CAN be a burglary tool you cannot look at a screwdriver and say oh the person who has that is a burglar. I carry a screwdriver in my backpack wherever I go--I use it to change my bike tires when I get a flat on the road as a bike tire lever.

He had THC in his system below the level of what would be considered 'impairment'. THC is also the active ingredient in Marinol, an FDA-approved drug for treating nausea, vomiting, and loss of appetite. We do not know if that THC was from a doobie or if it was from a pill someone slipped him if he woke up that morning with an upset stomach.

Joey, the court is being run by the judge, who didn't take kindly to being lied to and so revoked bail. Pretty simple if you ask me.

What "falsehoods" did the media "make-up" about Zimmerman?

The Judge in my opinion is Bowing down to the Black community. You would think that the Hispanic community would support Zimmerman. After all he IS Hispanic.

Have you seen Trayvon's Facebook page? Wow. He was no choirboy.

you are just plain ignorant suppose it was your kid how much did you donate do you think you will get it back after they close the account you are just one of those who has too much time on his hands do you believe this creep is not guilty? i see i may have joined this racist page every thing black gosh you make me sick................

Joey were you not reading what everyone else read? He was told NOT to pursue Martin and he did it anyway. You refer to a foot chase...I believe it was Zimmerman doing the chasing and Martin then defending himself. Also, has anyone noticed the weight drop by Zimmerman...is this supposed to make him look less threatening and defenseless in front of a jury? You gotta wonder.

Joey-2415010 - 'You race baiting social justice,gun control people are the worst and your citys are because of your limp wristed policys and unfair laws!'

Joey, it's apparent that George Zimmerman is responsible for his fate and has severely altered his life and that of so many others. It's called taking 'personal responsibility', darn it! He murdered Trayvon Martin and that is the beginning and the end of it.

Jersey

He was told NOT to pursue Martin and he did it anyway.

That is not correct.

...I believe it was Zimmerman doing the chasing and Martin then defending himself.

Its not what you believe, its what you can prove in court, and you cant prove this.

Penelope2 -"Yes, he DID something wrong. He was playing cop and even after he was told to stop following the boy, he continued to do so. He has mental issues and is on meds for them. One of his traits is oppositional defiant disorder so he had no intention of following the orders of the 911 operator.

He stalked and murdered an innocent young young man. He killed him in cold blood because he was losing a scuffle that he instigated. He wasn't standing his ground. He was stalking prey and Martin was in the wrong place at the wrong time.

He's a cold blooded killer, a liar, a con artist, and I feel sorry for those who are so ill-informed that they contribute to someone like that. Channel your love toward starving children or homeless pets, but fox noise won't like you anymore if you do that."

Penelope, I couldn't agree more!

Cool it folks. Let a jury decide this.
Know what I'm sayin'?

Joey go back to third grade and learn how to spell.

Crickets on this thread:

@Mike Fillmor,

You can assume whatever you like about Trayvon Martin, because you're only judging from pictures that you see of this kid. Now George Zimmerman, without a doubt we know he's no angle and for certain he's this man is very corrupted. This we know from his actions.

george zimmerman sealed his own fate that 02/26/2012 pm when he decided to become neighborhood watch captain hero; instead he is the murderer of an unarmed 17yr male-Many are not willing to accept that the actions of george zimmerman are wrong and that george zimmerman must be held accountable for his actions-There is no way that Trayvon Martin was pounding george zimmerman's head to the concrete, because his alleged injuries to the head are just a few scrapes-george zimmerman has lied so much that he even believes his own lies-george zimmerman and his wife attempted to misuse the legal system-instead they both are not that smart to talk in code during a jail phone conservation to transfer funds from his paypal acct which he set up initally for his defense, legal and personal needs because he had to quit his job and go into hiding-george zimmerman has a hx of aburpt, irrational behavior-george zimmerman will reap just what he has sown-Justice will be served-I wonder if the many supporters of george zimmerman if that were their child murdered by george zimmerman how would they react?

Do you live in Chicago? If you don't, those of us that do live in and around the city would like you to STFU.

Yeah, where are they???? And no, I don't want Tarzan7 to shut the F up.

Tarzan7 - And, where were you!

@ Tarzan:

Do the police know who the perps are, yet refuse to arrest/charge them?

It's almost guaranteed that an arrest is almost always made. when there is evidence pointing to the culprit.

At one time(it still might be happening), minorities(especially blacks) were singled out as "culprits", even when they weren't involved.

Zimmerman was there with the weapon in his hand. Other than his " I was attacked, and feared for my life" story, the cops still had reason to arrest and book him(at least on manslaughter).

"The case divided the country along racial and ethnic lines; Martin was black, while Zimmerman is the son of a white man and a Peruvian woman."

Sentences like this one from the article is what's dividing the country along racial and ethic lines, not the case itself. The mainstream media is clearly race baiting.

Was Zimmerman's father Irish, Italian, Polish, Swedish or just plain old white?

Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch captain in Sanford, Fla., was released on $150,000 bail on April 20 after he was charged with killing Martin, 17, who was unarmed, in February. The case divided the country along racial and ethnic lines; Martin was black, while Zimmerman is the son of a white man and a Peruvian woman.

Lame stream journalist from MSNBC making remarks like this to keep the racism and biase going strong while subtly playing the court of public opinion. Race still being played time again when it has there is no proof of a hate crime. Fail miserably.

Funny Tarzan and very good point. Where is Jesse and Al.....and Holder? LOL
Chicago? Isn't there were Obama organized the community? Guess it didn't work out so well.

Tad, so right on the media and race baiting....and doing so in a subtle way.

@ Mike:

Again: Did the Chicago PD have suspects that they are refusing to arrests?

No.

Trying to compare other shootings where they don't know exactly who the shooters are, is pretty weak.

It's like comparing ants to elephants.

If we say that Trayvon was black then what do we say of Zimm? Inquiring minds want know since all attempts to describe him meet with dissatisfaction.

Okay Edub...what was he carrying when he was shot? A bag of Skittles and a soda? You can really do a lot of damage with those items? Maybe soak them down and turn them chocolate. What he did the day before he was shot is immaterial when it comes to what he was carrying on him and doing on the day he was shot!! Zimmerman....Mr. Nice Guy....has a lot of anger management and social issues for which he is currently taking medication. Oh, who was carrying the gun and who was chasing who, when he was told NOT TO GET OUT OF HIS CAR??? Zimmerman was looking for trouble and Martin paid the price.

Your post is another example of the inane thinking of your kind. It doesn't matter what Martin was carrying in his hands. The fact is that hands are all one needs to kill someone. Yes, you can beat someone to death using just your hands.........no weapon needed........it's happened plenty of times before. And Martin used his hands to physically attack Zimmerman and cause bodily harm.

Carrying a gun in Florida is perfectly legal with a permit, which Zimmerman had, so Zimmerman was doing nothing wrong by carrying a gun. Get some real facts that actually mean something before you come back on here.

its not a race thing....its a right and wrong thing. idgaf what zimmerman or martin did before the incident or what led either of them to make the choices they made that day. but what i DO have a problem with is them letting zimmerman go after the fact just off of what he said. it is not the police officers job to play judge and jury. arrest his ass and let a jury of his peers decide if it was self defense.

Edub, is that all you can come up with? It seems you might be on the meds too if you think that all black people are thugs. And to be clear there are thugs in all ethnic backgrounds.

EDUB--"The fact is that hands are all one needs to kill someone."

Hmmm.... Zimmerman evidently didn't bother using HIS hands- just a gun. Martin's autopsy report showed "skinned knuckle" no reported evidence that Zimmerman ever even tried to return a punch- just a shot.

who had a good job? irrelevant HOW MANY UNCONNECTED TEENAGERS HAVE JOBS IN THIS ECONOMY Also a lot of thugs have good jobs his dad was connected

Who owned a home and was married?Who had a restraining order against him at one time from the same wife? Who had a legal permit to carry a gun? irrelevant . Who was trying to actually prevent more crime in his neighborhood? I guess murder is not a crime in his neighborhood

Now, who was on suspension from school for possession of pot? Martin. Who was found with burglary paraphanaila in their locker? a screwdriver is only paraphananaila when you're Black. Who had marijuana in their bloodstream? Martin yes and maybe Zimmerman had PCP we'll never know Who committed the vicious murder? Zimmerman

Yeah, you think it's fair to say that Martin is the thug here. I hope your child is shown more compassion than you have

Arique10,

Please point out to me exactly where I said that all black people are thugs. You can't, because I never said it. Please stop putting words in people's mouths to try to make your argument seem more valid.

Hey okie, try using some critical thinking skills before you respond. Just because hands are all that are necessary to kill someone doesn't mean that it's always possible in every circumstance to do so. Zimmerman was clearly outclassed by Martin in the fight, and was being beaten to the point that he was in fear of great bodily harm or death at the HANDS of Martin.

Therefore, using a gun was justified. Period.

edub, if the facts support that then I agree. And Zimmerman should go free.

"All you blacks on here defending Martin need to take off your racist blinders, and all you self-loathing, guilt laden whites on here defending Martin need to stop defending a young black thug in an effort to make sure nobody thinks you're a racist. It's truly pathetic, and all of your rants are little more than emotional diatribes with no basis in fact and no validity."

Bravo, edub.

LOL.

"Vicious beating"?

Who followed/stalked a person he didn't see commit any crime/who wasn't threatening he or his family?

Zimmerman.

Who was on a public street with a firearm(whether permitted or not)?

Zimmerman.

Who was still a minor/student?

Martin.

WHo was on "drugs"?

Zimmerman was on meds. Martin sometimes smoke marijuana(a "drug" that is know for making users passive).

But some continue to think that Zimmerman is some kind of golden boy "protector of the streets".

That's a crock of sh*t.

Lobo, you're the only crock of sh*t on here. It doesn't matter if Zimmerman followed Martin or not. It doesn't give Martin the right to attack. And there is a difference between following and stalking......even an idiot like you should be able to understand that. Look it up.

Zimmerman's possession of a firearm is irrelevant because he was in the legal right to have it. Stop using that to paint Zimmerman as the bad guy.

Minors kill people every day. That's no support for your argument, so grow up.

Zimmerman was taking a LEGAL prescription medication for a legitimate medical condition, which has nothing to do with his actions. Martin was a known user of ILLEGAL drugs.

Please, shut up.

@Edub, you're a very sick person, you should really seek expert psychiatric attention, to think that Martin was the cause of his own death because he smoke marijuana is outright stupidity. Zimmerman initiated the confrontation, here's an example of your flawed logic; let's say I followed your wife or girlfriend around and started chasing them, and they pulled out mace and sprayed me and then I pull out my gun and shoot them, is that stand your ground? You're such a @!$%#ing idiot it makes me want to wretch.

Edub said:

Now, who was on suspension from school for possession of pot? Martin.

Martin was suspended from school under suspicion of having pot--there was an empty plastic bag with residue that could have contained pot. The school didn't know for certain; if they knew for certain he'd have been expelled.

Who was found with burglary paraphanaila in their locker? Martin.

Incorrect. The actual report said that he had a screwdriver in his backpack and several items of feminine jewelry, but the jewelry was not identified as having been stolen or belonging to anyone. And I have a screwdriver in my backpack.

Who had marijuana in their bloodstream? Martin.

The ME found trace amounts of the active ingredient in Marijuana in his bloodstream, but in the report they specified that it was 'below the level considered to cause impairment.'