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Subscribe to RSSCorrection: An earlier version of this story based on a report in The Monitor of McAllen, Texas, described the wound as occurring from a ricochet. But Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino told The Monitor that the 17-year-old victim aimed at a butane gas tank, then put the gun to his head and fired.
Updated 5 p.m. E.T., June 15: A 17-year-old boy in south Texas died after firing a single shot to his head, the Monitor in McAllen, Texas, reported.
Israel Torres, along with his father and brother had been in the backyard of a home in McAllen, and all three had been drinking prior to the incident, authorities said.
Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino said Torres fired the shot with a handgun after trying to persuade his girlfriend to to take a shot, the paper reported.
"All three are pretty drunk when someone pulls a .380-caliber, semi-automatic and shoots it into the backyard," Trevino told reporters. "The 17-year-old gets it and tells his girlfriend, here, look, pull the trigger."
When she refused, Torres pulled out the gun's magazine and aimed at a butane gas tank, then pointed the gun at his head, the paper reported.
"He fires one time and shoots himself in the head," Trevino told The Monitor.
Investigators didn't find any reason to suspect foul play and haven't arrested anyone, but are looking into whether the father bears any criminal responsibility.
The family has been in the U.S. illegally for at least several years, Trevino said.
McAllen is just a few miles from the border.
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Warn't they trying to initiate some sort of statute in Texas allowing shooting ranges for teenage kids?
Was the statue going to allow you to be drunk while shooting?
You can't drive with an open container in Texas... Where did you even come up with that? That said, anyone stupid enough to use a firearm while drinking alcohol deserves whatever comes to them; natural selection at work.
What goes around - comes around!!!!
Obama probably had something to do with it!
"That said, anyone stupid enough to use a firearm while drinking alcohol deserves whatever comes to them; natural selection at work."
Can't argue that he wasn't foolish, but glorying in someone's death like that is tacky.
How about the fact that these individuals are in the country illegally and no one was detained... Way to go failed justice system! Aah and let's just forget that someone of age had to provide the alcohol to the MINORS.
I have to agree with Xaziol. WHY weren't these people deported if law enforcement knew they are illegal immigrants??
You know, whether they were drinking or not, a bullet ricocheted off a tank and hit him in the head. That could happen to someone who wasnt drinking. Although, being drunk makes people think they are super strong, and super sexy, and a good singer, and charming to the ladies, and a bunch of other things.
I have seen a lot of bullets ricochet off metal target plates at the gun range. I have seen lead bullets splatter and pieces fly off and slice peoples faces. That is why you always were protective glasses when shooting. Sometimes, your time is just up and luck runs out. Hell, when I was in highschool, me, my brother, and two friends were out hunting geese and one of my friends shot at a bone on the ground with his .22 rifle and it ricocheted off and lodged in the old cabin I was leaning up against about a foot from my head. It was a creepy feeling knowing that I was a foot away from being hit in the melon with a bullet. I feel bad for the family having to witness something this horrible.
Astro, I didn't jump up and down and clap that this person died. Any death is tragic, but anyone who is stupid enough to fire a gun while drinking alcohol shows that they do not have good judgment.
Natural selection helps prevent the passing of bad genes. A mouse that does not have the good sense to run away from a cat will die before it can procreate, reducing the chance that future generations will be foolish enough to not run from cats. This person's death ensures that whatever caused them to be foolish enough to mix alcohol and guns will not be passed on to future generations, thereby bettering humanity as a whole.
Would I have preferred that he had the good sense to not do something so stupid? Yes. Do I feel for his family, who has to deal with his loss? Yes. Do I feel that the world is a better place with him gone and unable to pass on his genes? Yes. There is a difference between celebrating a tragic event, and accepting that the event in question is most likely for the best overall.
The alternative is that he lives, has children who are granted automatic citizenship, and likely have a tendency towards the same kind of poor judgment he displyed, which will have a much larger impact on me, given that they would be allowed to participate directly in governance and policy-making. A tragic event that results in a better long-run is preferred to a tragedy averted that results in a worse long-run. But maybe I'm just too pragmatic.
That is what you call really bad luck. Drinking and Guns, KILL. So sad that people don't have enough forethought to NOT get wasted and then play with guns.
Yes, it's sad that this kid died, but he's definately a contender for this year's darwin awards. Shooting while drunk PLUS shooting at a fuel container equals not a whole lot of thinking going on.
Hold on McAllen texas is not far from the border and I know they have a check point close to there,why weren't they ever detained in those 7 years? or deported?So many illegals cross through that point daily and are deported it makes me wonder anyhow.
and after a investigation you would think they would deport them hmmm.
Stupid is as stupid does
Xaziol, providing alcohol to a minor isn't always illegal. For example, here in WI, you can serve alcohol to a minor (even in a bar) if the parent or legal guardian is present and has given permission for the child to have alcohol. It's up to the individual bar to decide if they want to do so.
In this case, the son was with his father and had been drinking. I don't know what the laws are in Texas, but again, in WI, this would not be illegal.
Actually in Texas as long as your with your kid you can allow them to drink, but it's never legal or okay to shoot a gun if your under the influence, the crime here was owning an illegal handgun and being illegal themselves. The handgun wouldn't have been illegal if they were here legally just to be clear.
I see we posted at the same time Tom
This is bull@!$%#. A 380 ACP round barely has the power to penetrate the human skull in several ballistic tests at anything but almost point blank range ( less than 10 feet). For the bullet to ricochet off the gas cyclinder it would have lost over 70 percent of it's speed. It would not have the force to penetrate the teenagers skull much less kill him from the blunt trauma. The father is lying, they were all drunk and he or the girlfriend accidentally shot this kid in the head, or the kid accidentally shot himself thinking the gun was unloaded because the magazine was removed from the gun. This story is a complete and fabricated lie by the father. The story even states he changed his statements to the police during questioning.
Clearly the drinking laws in Texas are much different from when I was growing up in Chicago. If my Dad caught me drinking at 17 years of age, I wouldn't need a gun. He'd simply kill me.
This is quite unfortunate. I'm sure the father will have to take some form of responsibility considering he was home.
Good, permanently removed from the gene pool!
Now throw the rest of that clan out, back to Mexico. We don't need stupid illegal aliens, we have enough losers in this country. Where did they get the gun?
"Israel Torres, along with his father and brother had been in the backyard of a home in McAllen, and all three had been drinking prior to the incident, authorities said."
And that's as far as I need to read.
Yeah, that's the rule in most states, if you're on your own property or in your home and YOU'RE the "parent"...
OK, CSI Randy, then please explain why this young man is dead... I know why, a bullet that he shot at a reinforced metal tank ricochet and hit him in the head... but I would like to know what you think killed him... seriously?
Good riddance; too bad the rest of them didn't get it too.
Dang, 1SGFitzsWife4ID. You take the gold medal for the number of times someone can misspell the same word in one sentence. Try looking up the definition of "your". You managed to use it incorrectly two out of three times. Absolutely unbelievable. This country is doomed because its citizens are becoming increasingly ignorant with each new generation.
82all - "OK, MR. CSI, then please explain why this young man is dead"
He did.
"they were all drunk and he or the girlfriend accidentally shot this kid in the head, or the kid accidentally shot himself thinking the gun was unloaded because the magazine was removed from the gun. "
And he is correct, a.380 is a very weak round.
Why do you think the father initially told a different story if it really was simply an accident?
pjam09... maybe so, but he's still dead... and unless its challenged and proven... your "speculations" mean nothing.
Just like yours.
"Teen shoots gun at gas tank but bullet ricochets and kills him.... Investigators didn't find any reason to suspect foul play and haven't arrested anyone, but are looking into whether the father bears any criminal responsibility."
Oh yeah... just like mine.
Why were they shooting at a butane tank? Wouldn't that explode if hit? They could be lucky that only one of them got hurt.
Let's count the laws broken: 1. Illegal immigration, 2. Illegal handgun possession, 3. Underage drinking, 4. Endangering a minor, 5. Filing a false police report....... I don't know enough about the case to add on more.
So, where does this story go? Family deported? No charges filed?
Randy-2190191
Per YOUR claim then someone must have shot the kid... on the other hand...
http://www.chuckhawks.com/handgun_power_chart.htm
would indicate anywhere from a 5 to 17 inch penetration into standard ballistics gel. It would also depend on where the round struck in the head... eye, mouth, temple would allow higher fatality than say forehead.
In any case, ship the body to his country of origin and the relatives with it. They were ALL in violation of the law by consuming alcohol and use of a firearm. As non citizens were they even legally permitted to have a handgun?
Good , now he can't breed and pass along his genes.
It wasn't just the drinking and shooting while drunk that was stupid, it was the choice of target. If that round had penetrated the tank (I suspect propane, rather than butane - higher pressure and thicker walls) it would have triggered a major gas leak, leading to a major explosion and fire that might have killed all of them and perhaps a few neighbors, too.
Perhaps it was a good thing he was eliminated from the gene pool - stupidity like that is dangerous.
@Randy-2190191
You sir are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT! There's several factors to this that just don't make sense. Any remember when mythbusters busted the myth of a shooter getting killed by ricochet? You can absolutely kill someone else via ricochet, but it would be hard if not impossible to kill yourself. It's simple geometry! A bullet CAN'T make a 180-degree turnaround after hitting something and come back to hit you. It would have to ricochet of at least 3 surfaces before coming in contact with you, that will decrease the velocity to no more than a fly flying at full speed into you. Something is very fishy with this story, but I'm not going to speculate on what really happened, just present some facts!
Firearms are not toys, and they do not mix well with alcohol. Sad.
Look at that, some one found a way to fix stupid.
Gotta love a happy ending. Laughed to tears reading this one. Rot in peace.
All gun owners now raise your right hand.Swear I will never drink while carrying my gun! Now you Texans I will never gun while drinking! THERE NOW THAT IS TAKEN CARE OFF!
hmmm, maybe evolution has a point in the evolution of the species...
MYTH BUSTERS... now there's the proper authority for proving anything... but I remember when "Myth-Busters" shot a cannonball through (in one side and out the other by house... BY MISTAKE!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/mythbusters-cannon-ball-accident-caused-by-unforeseen-bounce/2011/12/08/gIQABK68fO_story.html
I'm not saying that someone should play with guns drunk, but that didin't play a part here. He shot an object and it took a bad bounce. Bad luck. He probably should have been further away from the tank when he shot it, but other than that he wasn't doing anything inherantly dangerous. When your numbers up, its up. People get killed doing every-day recreational activities all the time.
Subliminal...
I think you need a drink dude.
@82AllAmericans
It's not just mythbusters I'm basing this on. It is again SIMPLE GEOMETRY!
They haven't charged anyone? Why was a 17 year old drunk? That alone is a crime and he's standing around with his drunken father and brother? Then there is the illegal factor. Get them the hell out of this country, we have enough of our own drunken hicks without adding foreigners who have no right to be in this country.
F Walsh - Good question. Appears some charges are need for at least that.
As far as the boy goes, Alcohol + Gun = Darwin Award. Ok maybe not always but certainly increases your chances, in fact no Alcohol here did it anyways. Solid metal object (gas tank no less) + Gun = good chance for Darwin award. Anyway you look at it this kid was doing everything he could to be a serious contender for an award.
For the family, here illegally, so time to send them back home, same with the others as well if they are illegal (can skip the charges that way). Don't like it, sorry breaking the law and time to enforce it. Believe me though, there are plenty of hard working Mexicans who I would take any day over the lazy trash we have collecting welfare.
It is time
F Walsh
Texas, and several other states, allow a parent to provide alcohol to their own children. Still Texas does have laws about under the influence and possession of a firearm.
Sanctuary state? Texas may have won the battle for independence but apparently some folks didn't get the memo.
thank you, MSNBC, for posting this heart-warming story
Didn't anyone else read the multiple times it said he put the gun to his head and pulled the trigger? "Correction: An earlier version of this story based on a report in The Monitor of McAllen, Texas, described the wound as occurring from a ricochet. But Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino told The Monitor that the 17-year-old victim aimed at a butane gas tank, then put the gun to his head and fired."
THERE WAS NO RICOCHET so please quit arguing over that and bringing Mythbusters in to it. That being said, why are they investigating it? They are all illegals. OUR tax dollars paying for the investigation on illegals. Deport them and the body and be done with it. End of story!!!!!!!
Shooting at a propane tank, or pointing a gun at his head, either way it is natural selection.
this is part of operation fast and furious.
Death is a pretty harsh penalty, but either way, it's one less illegal alien. Maybe now with the police attention the rest of the border-jumping clan will be deported.
In the country illegally.
Having 17 year olds drunk or drinking in your back yard.
Not storing a lethal weapon properly.
No reported charges or Immigration involvement.
Bull@!$%#!
Fire the Feds. Fire the Immigration authorities and hire people who will do the job with consistency. There are a lot of people who are unemployed and would be willing to do the job much better.
It's an election year...that's why the illegals weren't deported. Havent you gotten the memo...Obama doesn't want to deport illegals between 15 and 30. This kid just f'd up the program and self-deported, permanently. 100 bucks says we taxpayer foot the bill for him to be shipped home and buried in his "home country"....
Did anyone even read this article, he didn't shoot at the tank he just pointed the gun at it, then he put it to his head and pulled the trigger.
"All three are pretty drunk when someone pulls a .380-caliber, semi-automatic and shoots it into the backyard," Trevino told reporters. "The 17-year-old gets it and tells his girlfriend, here, look, pull the trigger."
When she refused, Torres pulled out the gun's magazine and aimed at a butane gas tank, (Then pointed the gun at his head, the paper reported.)
"He fires one time and shoots himself in the head," Trevino told The Monitor.
Well if you had read it about two months ago as the other posters did then you would have read that the family was claiming that he aimed and fired at the tank and the bullet ricoheted hitting him in the head. The story changed after the cops called BS on that one.
Why the heck are they reposting something they posted a few months ago? Must have been a slow news day.
And this is some kind of tragedy? More like a Darwin case.
agreed. Why are they looking to the father for criminal charges? It is not the father's fault (not 100% anyways) that the young man did something stupid. Even with good parenting, kids do stupid stuff. Natural selection is working its way back, even though our government has tried to prevent this.
simm, the question the police are likely asking is if the father secured his gun or was he neglectful about it? Gun owners that are actually responsible (not the pseudo-responsible the vast majority are) secure their guns, unloaded, in a locked box; they respect it as the lethal device that it is. If the father left his gun loaded and out where anyone could get it, then he should have some responsibility for what happens.
Without knowing what this propane tank looked like it is hard to say for sure how he came to be killed, but I belive that it is nearly impossible for a bullet to ricochet straight back to the shooter's head with sufficient velocity to kill someone. Bounce straight back?? Maybe, but please, check very carefully the possibility of negligent homicide.
The kid was underage and drinking with his father. I'm sure they are looking at some sort of "providing alcohol to minor" charges at a min.
ssim
I don't believe drinking is legal for a minor in Texas yet? No matter who gave him the alcohol?
It wasn't called a tragedy in the article, nor did any comment prior to yours call it a tragedy.
Looks like the girlfriend was the only intelligent one in the bunch, but still chose an idiot for a boyfriend.
Any time the story includes a teen, alcohol, a gun and a butane tank it isn't going to end well.
@Mymomdidnotraiseafool: Right on! "The idiots are too much among us!"
Wow. Gotta love the internet. A family just lost their 17 year old son in a freak accident, and you ______'s are arguing over whether the article called it a tragedy. Absolutely ridiculous.
The family will get a royalty when they place this on "a thousand ways to die". Summer has not officially started yet and all the bored teenagers will probably think of cooler stuff than this..........
In Texas, a parent can give all the alcohol to a child that they want. I've had TABC training, so I know. You can walk into a bar with a four-year-old and buy alcohol for him, as long as you're the legal guardian.
And as for the father being liable, that's just stupid. How are you going to teach your kids to shoot if you never hand them a weapon? I've gone out to the country with my parents and fired some very powerful hand guns at old toilets, trophies, bottles, cans, and whatever else we could find in the dump that looked like fun to shoot at. Having a bullet pop back right at you from a reasonably safe distance is unlikely, and I'd say this is just a freak accident. It doesn't sound like the beer hurt his aim none.
As a side note, I'm surprised we got this far into the comments without a big debate raging about the family being here illegally.
Styro, you have two different situations which are perfectly fine by themselves, but not when combined. Yes, he can legally give a minor alcohol. Yes, he can legally allow his child to shoot a firearm (immigration status notwithstanding). However, when you give a 17-year old alcohol and then allow them to use a handgun, that is called negligence. It's just as negligent as if you allowed a 17-year old to drive after drinking. They can drink, they can drive, but not together.
Is this what you call blind justice or just stupid as..
Styro you cannot give a four year old alcohol we do have SOME rules (I'm TABC trained too) a 17 year old would be okay.
The illegal part is being in possession of a firearm while intoxicated, and even owning the firearm being here illegally is illegal.
"The family is in the U.S. illegally for at least several years, Trevino said."
Apparently when illegals kill themselves it is O.K. for the media to acknowledge their status, but when they kill Americans it is usually removed from the story.
Crimes involved here:
Violating the U.S. border
Possession of an illegal firearm (you cannot pass a background check if you are illegal)
Supplying alcohol to a minor
Discharging a weapon in city limits (most likely)
Welcome to your new neighbors American taxpayers, courtesy of Obama and the Democrats.
pjam, you and everyone else that keeps blaming this on Obama and the Democrats seem to keep ignoring the fact that Obama is deporting *more* illegals than Bush did. I realize it's inconvenient to keep that fact in mind when trying to demonize the Democrats and push your political agenda, but if you're going to blatantly lie, try to make it about something that there is no quantifiable evidence.
He's dead because he used a gun for a purpose it wasn't designed. I did a through search on the internet, and I couldn't find anything that says guns are the preferred way to destroy butane tanks. I also saw a show on TV where a guy used a running chainsaw to open a bottle of beer. Pretty sure that isn't mentioned in the operators manual as a bottle opening tool. I'll be looking forward to discussing the injury or death of the person when this turns out bad.
pjam- other than supplying alcohol to a minor, all those charges would be on the dead kid, not his dad. It would be a waste of time and money to charge a dead kid.
Alexander....are you too stupid to stay on task? Maybe you'd better stick to watching DWTS.
This is simply a case of Darwinian justice. Now, deport the rest of the family.
No pity here..he's a deleted-dumb azz and family too since there.
What a great idea, give all illegals guns and alcohol, have them take target practice a metal tanks. It will help solve the illegal alien problem. What IDIOTS, drinking and screwing around with guns. They got what they deserved!!!!
7 deleted, cheap political derail from Obama is Osama - banned, flameout, failed audition.
well thats one less illegal. hopefully the feds deport the other two illegal geniuses as well.
Ah, there we go...
I can't believe this didn't happen in La Jolla.
Arrest the father for serving alcohol to minors. The only thing I feel bad about is how utterly stupid. Could have been an explotion and killed them all. Some people cause their own demise.
Texas has a "Grandfather Clause", meaning that you can serve alcohol to a minor as long as you are their legal guardian and are on private property. However, allowing a 17-year old to drink *and* have access to a firearm is sufficient for criminally negligence resulting in death. That's a bigger sentence than serving minors anyways.
How about an illegal alien in possesion of a weapon, getting drunk with his anchor babies? Why hasn't anyone been arrested? Did they give the Mexican his gun back?
Butane and propane do not explode when you shoot them.. that only happens on TV....I know this both from Mythbusters and from personal experience. A regular bullet won't ignite the gas like in the movies because copper and lead do not create a spark when impacting other metals. A tracer round might ignite the gas but it would not cause an explosion because if there is a hole (from the bullet) in the tank the gas will escape and not build up pressure. Mostly they just whistle as the gas escapes the tank. A .380ACP round will not penetrate a propane tank, it doesn't have enough force. It will however bounce off at a low and likely non- lethal rate of speed due to losing most of its momentum on impact with the cylinder. Takes a point blank shot from a 380ACP to penetrate the human skull. Over 10 feet in numerous ballistic test have proved it does not have the power to penetrate the skull. The bullet would also travel at the angle it was fired, not directly back to the point of origin. It's call SCIENCE !
True enough about the angle, Randy, but most butane and propane tanks have curved surfaces. It is entirely possible that the round hit at just the right angle to have a trajectory directly back at the young man's head. They call that a "fluke". As for the penetration of the round, I'm unfamiliar with the ballistic tests you are citing, so I can't comment on the veracity of that point.
How close would you have to be to a small tank where the bullet would ricochet back and kill you? A few feet? That sounds way to close to a tank you believe may explode or shoot gasses back towards you.
As a young eight year old, I made the mistake in using an axe to split open a can of spray paint. I knew it would explode outwards, just not towards me. Let's just say it took a loong time for that lime green Krylon paint to wear off from every inch of my skin. And NO, I hadn't been drinking!!!
OMG, were you alone with that axe ? That is too weird unless you happened to be in the Arizona mountains, and we have not seen or heard of each other in 40 years.
See the linked article. MSNBC was a little too heavy handed in their editing. Perhaps because it would have been an eye catching headline.
Politics doesn't enter into this. Stupidity and evolution does.
Classic Darwin Award.
Nuff said.
He at least deserves an Honorable Mention.
well, maybe dishonorable mention...
Check the rules, Darwin Awards aren't given to sub-18 year olds.
They have been here illegally? Surprise Surprise...... WTF is wrong with our government - if they know people are here illegally - then ship their asses back to their own country. All illegals need to be exported and made to apply and come into the USA the right way. No naturization and no amnesty
So you're saying legal US residents NEVER do anything stupid with guns and kill themselves?
Yes, illegally in a state that has been controlled by republicans for nearly a generation now...who let the illegals in again?
If Texas tried to secure the border they would be sued by the feds.
Jun ki, I agree. Supreme Court is due to rule on SB 1070 sometime either this week or next. The government sued us simply because obama want more illegals so he can get more votes. AZ, NM, CA, and TX are all on the border. We, (AZ) have been known as the pipeline. So where's the filter?
Umm, Amy, illegals can't vote and illegal immigration is down dramatically now than during the Bus years.
I don't understand--how do illegals vote?
Illegals can't vote. Or even be here. or possess fire arms. Did you read the story? They don't follow the rules.
Rick, Republicans didn't take over Texas until about 10 or 15 years ago. Before that, it was conservative Democrats (there is such a thing in places where they have to be conservative).
The illegals vote here because some polling Booth's dont ask for an id to prove they are who they say they are or the illegals just use one of their own ILLEGAL documents i.e. drivers license, SSN Card birth certificates etc...
USA, you seem to have a faulty understanding of the voter registration and polling procedure in Texas. Some facts; Texas is overwhelmingly Republican. You must provide your Texas ID or DL # or your SSN on your voter registration form, which the Secretary of State then verifies before sending out your voter registration card. You must provide some form of ID, such as your DL or voter registration card in order to be signed off on the rolls before being allowed to vote. You can't just walk up, show a fake ID, and be given a ballot without having registered to vote, and I have never, ever heard of a polling place that just allowed you to walk up and say, "Hey, I'm John Smith, can I have my ballot?" and then vote without providing some form of ID.
I could possibly believe that *you* believed something like that would happen if it were New York or California (typically Democrat states), but that you think this happens in a Republican state, given the great lengths they go to to ensure that people are not allowed to vote... it strains credulity.
DarkHouse -" I don't understand--how do illegals vote?"
A. We're not surprised you don't understand
B. They vote just like anybody else does
PJAM: Please read 12.10
Indeed: Darwin proves correct again.. Sad for his family, lack of gun education?
Newton would like a word with the Police. The only way that this story could be true is if it were the plot of a movie.
Ed, his family gave him the alcohol and apparently the gun, or at least didn't try to stop him.
Please deport the rest of the family immediately before they can vote in November.
This makes no sense. Aliens, illegal or otherwise, are not allowed to vote. Even if they were allowed to vote, Texas is not only firmly Red, but also has the lowest voter participation in the nation. So, if you're "worried" that they might vote for Obama, then you're an idiot.
Because we all know illegal aliens in America aren't allowed to vote, or have fire arms. Or be here.
Leroy, in the State of Texas, the voter registration form requires that you provide either your Texas ID or DL # (which is linked to records regarding citizenship status) or your SSN (again, linked to records regarding citizenship). It is extremely hard for illegal aliens to manage to vote. Independent studies have also shown that allegations of voter fraud from illegal aliens is much higher than the actual incidence of said voter fraud. That is, very few illegal aliens bother to attempt to vote, mostly because they try to keep a low profile so they don't get deported, and the difficulty involved in getting the registration. It's considerably easier to get an illegal weapon than it is to get a fraudlent voter registration card.
Of course, if you do nothing but listen to Republicans talk, you'd think that every illegal has a voter registration card in their pocket, ready to storm the polls and overturn the will of the citizens.
RevLucifer:
Have you ever heard of illegals STEALING those documents you stated above with regards to what is required to vote in TX????????? Just like them being here illegally they are also STEALING US citizens identifications and using them for their own selfish gains. The stealing of our identifications, drug activities, slavery, owning guns, not paying taxes because again they are using false ID's by using dead peoples info are the MAIN reasons the US is getting fed up with the Latino ILLEGALS.
They typically steal those forms of ID for work, not for voting. Also, when that information is provided to the IRS for payroll taxes, they are typically flagged as invalid. The Secretary of State is given the task of verifying the information provided on voter registration forms, and we have two departments that have that info readily available; Texas DPS and the US SSA. Unless the illegal aliens have some magical way of knowing how to steal the specific IDs of only those people that don't register to vote, then it throws up a red flag. The Secretary of State can then keep that person off the voter rolls until they can determine who the real citizen is, or, in the case of fraudulent instead of stolen IDs, simply not put them on the rolls in the first place. We don't just let anybody with a pulse walk up and cast a ballot; there are processes and safeguards in place to prevent this type of thing from happening. I'm not saying that it never happens, but it is much, much rarer than the Republican talking-heads would want you to believe, because if you knew the truth, then that would be one less thing to hate about the Democrats.
USA: 14.4: "slavery????????"
Or did you mean USA uses illegals as cheap labor slaves?
He would probably have fathered about 15 kids by the time he was 20 (right before heading off to prison) so this just saved taxpayers a lot of money.
They also need to run the ballistics of that weapon against any unsolved shootings involving a .380, he may have also just helped solve a few cases by supplying the evidence.
LOL. That's it. nothing else to say
Is there any doubt that the average IQ of Mexican illegals is 86?
So just because he is an illegal you automatically assume he is Mexican?
Maybe your IQ equals 86...
Much doubt, Angus. That's like looking at Fred Phelps and saying, "is there any doubt that the average IQ of evangelical Christians is 86?". One idiot does not define an entire group. Otherwise, you'd be the "demonstration" that the average IQ of all the groups you belong to is 86.
you should change your name to foxy anus
sad that a teen lost their life but this is a straight case of Darwinism.
This is a prime example of Darwinism, and we do not need these folks as citizens in the USA. They just don't add anything to our country. Allow them to mourn, but they have got to go home to their home country.
That makse no sense, whatsoever Daryl. These people add nothing, so deport them. If the cast of Jersey Shore, or any of the other multitude of reality shows, were not citizens, I'd want to deport them too, because they don't add anything either.
Why do people make presumptions about other people, and then judge them based on those presumptions? Answer: because it's easier than trying to make a logical argument.
let me guess, Its only "Darwinism" when its not your dumbass or one of your dumbass family members whose dead.
Let me guess, its only "Darwinism" when its not your dumbass or one of your dumbass family members whose dead.
Stupid is (just like Alexander Argentina) as Stupid does Ms Blue
Showed him huh?
I like how the religious right invokes Darwin...you really CANT FIX STUPID..lmao
I'd say a bullet through the head fixes stupid every time.
Nothing to see here folks, move along. Just natural selection at work!
Darwin proven right again
Perhaps the guy who thinks that politics/President Obama somehow enters into this is simply a further example of the Darwinism thoughts.... with him being an example of one of the lower rungs?? Bright boy, there.... almost as the main character of this story!
DemoCraps (Obama) have already deported more than 1.4 million illegal immigrants, compared with the 1.6 million deportations during the entire eight-year Bush administration. If this country's lucky, Obama will have 4 more years to keep fixing the house of cards he bought from Bush.
If you believe real deportations were actually increased by the same man suing Americans to keep illegals in the country I feel sorry for you.
Do you also believe in "shovel ready jobs" and the "summer of recovery"?
I'm a native of Az, 57 years old, and to say the least from what my friends there say, I've lived in Maui since coming back to the country in the 70's, there's still plenty there and growing daily. So much for deporting.
Illegal aliens and illegal gun possession. Shocking...NOT!
Yeah, because legal citizens never have illegal weapons. Sure.
and the Darwin Award goes to Israel Torres and the entire Torres Family.