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Subscribe to RSSANCHORAGE, Alaska — Possible military aircraft debris, along with material that may be bone fragments, has been discovered in the Knik Glacier area, north-east of Anchorage, according to officials.
Alaska Army National Guardsmen on board a UH-60 Blackhawk flying a routine training mission discovered the debris at about 1 p.m. local time Sunday, and conducted a brief aerial inspection before returning to Joint Base Elmendorf-Richardson.
Capt. Tania Bryan, director of public affairs for the Alaskan Command, said the crash was believed to be that of a vintage aircraft and "not recent."
Read the story at Channel 2/KTUU.com
She says details about the crash are being withheld pending possible notifications of next of kin.
A recovery effort for the wreckage is being considered by the U.S. Joint POW/MIA Accounting Command, which conducts search, recovery and laboratory efforts to locate lost service members.
The Federal Aviation Administration has placed a temporary flight restriction on the area, and aviators are being asked to avoid the vicinity as personnel investigate the site.
At the request of Alaska military officials, the Hawaii-based U.S. Joint POW/MIA Accounting Command (JPAC) is trying to plan a recovery mission at the Knik Glacier site, a spokeswoman told Reuters.
JPAC, which focuses on search and recovery missions for missing U.S. service members, hopes to schedule an Alaska trip and line up necessary expertise to work on the glacier, said Captain Jamie Dobson, a spokeswoman for the command.
"We believe that there's a reason for JPAC to be involved," she said.
Reuters contributed to this report. Channel 2/KTUU.com is an affiliate of NBC News.
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The biggest military search mission ever was for then-missing Congressman Hale Boggs, whose plane disappeared while on a trip campaigning with, and for, another representative who was in jeopardy of losing an election. Can this be the second legendary, decades-old, aviation mystery whose resolution is advanced just this month?
Hale Boggs was on a civilian aircraft when he disappeared, the article states the debris is of a military aircraft.
Re: Hale Boggs - Senator Nick Begich was on that plane, too. I grew up in Alaska in the 50's and 60's into early 70's, and back in the 60's, when we travelled, it was not unheard of, and I even did it a couple times, to hitch a ride on a C-130 or C-131. My parents were good friends of Nick Begich and I played with their children. I would be happy if they were finally able to find their father, as well as for Cokie Roberts, Congresswman Hale Bogg's father. If Nick, Jr. or any of the other kids want to talk to me, I'm down here in Atlanta now. My parents were Charles and Amy James, and were fervent supporters of Nick. Regardless of anyone else's political views, Mr. Begich was an excellent father and was always very nice to me - his wife and kids, too.
That was the first thing I thought of when I read the headlines! I knew Mrs.Boggs when I was in High School. I really felt that some day they would find the wreckage. I pray it's that so they can lay him to rest.
Louisiana Native Nawlin's myself, I knew how much Lindey missed him. But she did a great number of things to bring honor to the Boggs' family. We could use people such as they were, TODAY!!
bluedreamcatcher!!! I just read the article and Hale Boggs was the first person I thought about!!!!!! With some of us having the same thoughts...maybe, just maybe it is Mr. Boggs!!!! Louisiana Native here...living elsewhere but I sure miss home and you are perfectly correct is stating that "we could use more people such as they were, TODAY!!!!!" Its called, honor, integerity, love of country and love of the people of this nation!!!
Maybe, just maybe!!!
Hale Boggs and Nick Begich and pilot went down but it was quite a distance from the Knik Glacier. Correct, no trace has ever been found, not surprising with the wildness and forces of nature in the area they went down. Nick Begich was the Representative, not Senator. Even with being missing, probably dead, he beat Don Young in the election. A special election was held and then Don Young won. Young hasn't lost an election since, he is still Alaska's sole representative. Begich's son, Mark, is currently one of Alaska's Senators in Washington DC.
rip to the personel
Another secret spy mission gone wrong?
Big- expand on this please?
Amelia Earhart's castaway island may have been found.
Or, 12 drunken Russians made it to Alaska in a vintage biplane. Plus the pilot, makes 13!
i think phil is right. it was a civilian aircraft, and would only be "vintage" now, because it happened so long ago. boggs was the most powerful man on capital hill. a fixture in congress. he was a celebrity politician who, as was the custom in the day, would go to the home state of fellow party members (he was probably a democrat, since those were the only people elected fom louisianna in those days) and add some muscle where needed to secure an election of a fellow [democrat]. since alaska is so big, they customarily got around by plane. his went down and there were no survivors. there were lots of scandals and mysteries in washington, and boggs was right in the middle of them. much more interesting than the neanderthal name-calling to which washington washington has degenerated since. a search was undertaken, and it was the biggest military search in history. they never found a trace. his son parlayed the tragedy into becoming one of the most powerful lobbyists in washington, based upon the access he had to absolutely everyone -- in both parties -- founded upon the grief and sympathy they all felt. since it is the only alaska plane-disappearance mystery of which i am aware, i just guessed. would be cool.
Alaskan Senator Nicholas Joseph "Nick" Begich, Sr. Also went missing in 1972.
His son Mark is also an Alaskan Senator and his other son Nick Jr. is a world renowned scientist. Sen. Nick Begich went missing in a twin engine Cessna 310. Again this is not a military aircraft. There have been loads of military aircraft that have gone down in Alaska over the years. Alaska rivals the Bermuda Triangle for number of missing planes and magnetic abnormalities.
Stonepipe - Hale Boggs was a Congressman from NOLA and at the time of his disappearance was House Majority Leader. He was on a campaign trip to Alaska to support a colleague when the place presumable crashed. His wife, Lindy Boggs, took his place in Congress andwent on to make her own name in politics. The family went on to be a political dynasty like the Kennedys - sans scandals - the kids went on to political careers as well: the late Barbara Sigmond (Mayor of Princeton New Jersey in the 80s?) , Tommy Boggs who I think is still a lobbyist, and political reporter/analyst Cokie Roberts.
That's the Cliff notes version off the top of my head. I'm sure there's much more detailed/accurate info on Wiki and elsewhere.
You would be surprised of the number of vintage aircraft that still fly Alaska. A couple of the best bush planes built which are still in use were built upto 50 years ago or so. They are the Dehavilland Beaver and Otter
Below is why the twin Otter is still considered the best aircraft. See this super Short landing in high winds
youtube.com/watch?v=JwMlgc1saHs
Well, on the same note, some of the B-52s still in service are pushing the half-century mark, and are slated to remain in service until 2040. I dunno about you, but I'd be a little horrified at the prospect of flying an 80-year-old plane.
I would not be horrified in the least. I had the privalage of flying in a Dehav Beaver several years ago and would do it again without thinking twice. They are some of the best built planes. I also went for a flight in a WWII vintage B-17 and it was awesome, again I would do it again in a heartbeat. Old or new all the planes need to go through routine maintenance
About 25 or 30 years ago an old bush piolot form Castalia Iowa went down and i don't know if they ever found them. He and his wife. They lived a couple of miles away when I was growing up. I have never heard if they found them. He was Roy Schultz
@UncleBen:
Are you referring to this:
http://www.businessinsider.com/russian-authorities-believe-a-missing-plane-may-have-been-stolen-for-a-drunken-fishing-trip-2012-6
I understand that vintage planes (especially military ones, and obviously the active military ones) go through rigorous maintenance. I'm sure the B-52s that were built in the 60s have very few, if any, original parts remaining. But always in the back of my mind, I'd be aware that the machine flinging me through the air at 500 mph three miles above the earth was old enough to be my grandfather.
Yes, AlexG-1904848
Those little bushplanes dont fly nearly that fast, or that high. As a frequent user of the bushplane, I would say with great confidence I feel much safer in a float plane with an experienced bushpilot than I do in a commercial airliner.
My great uncle Mike Tisik was a co-pilot for USAF flight 2469 that flew out from this area and was never found. There were 44 people onboard. They were searched for under the joint effort of the US and Canada under "Operation Mike". "Operation Mike" was the largest joint effort search ever conducted in North America. Their plane went missing on Jan 26,1950........
Thanks, panic moon and big.
There are still a large number of the old DC-3's flying people and cargo around and between various continents.
I remember a situation like this a couple of years ago. Is this a reprint filler piece or a new discovery? No dates are mentioned in the article or the byline. This is really a case of more questions than answers. Pretty lazy reporting.
Pretty lazy statement I would say. This is news and therefore good reporting.
Actually Eric it's not a lazy statement. If this is indeed a story that's years old - it's not news. It's just a rehash of an old story. They could have just rediscovered an already known about crash that was never able to be investigated. If there wasn't much talk about it the first time around it would seem like a new discovery when in fact it's not. That's all canemah was saying.
Maybe have another cup of coffee to get that brain working before you touch the keyboard again.
Then again, this could be a 'new' discovery.
But you have to trash the media every morning before your coffee. Didn't you read the memo?
Why trash the media? They are a great source of humor, especially in the morning. Whenever there is "breaking news" it is hilarious watching them fumble all over themselves trying to sound like professional journalists. So, please everyone try to ease up on the media. It's like pulling pranks on down syndrome kids. It's funny to watch, but probably the wrong thing to do.
Many aircraft have been lost in the Alaskan wilderness. A great number have been supposed to have crashed on glaciers. The winters can be very severe, and it would not take much to cover the debris from a crash. With more glacier movement and summer melt, it is more than likely that sightings will occur.
It's a very sad reality, but it may give the families of the missing some closure.
Historically, it will be interesting to get some more of the back story on the missing (and now found) craft and crew.
Well, it states in the article it was about 1PM Sunday - isn't that a date???
I know, right? Some people don't READ anything.
Yeah What Sunday?? Could have been a Sunday from a few years ago. If I said I turned 22 on Tuesday(really 45) would I be lying as I never said a DATE just a DAY. SUNDAY IS NOT A DATE it's just a day.
Everyone should know that this is the wreck where they find Captian America! Duh!
Damn it husker you beat me to it!
This is one of the positive sides of climate change. Not only are there both aircraft and vessels showing up as the glaciers melt but there will, no doubt, be findings of mammoths and other extinct creatures.
Unfortunately finding extinct creatures because of glacial melting means we're on the road to become extinct creatures outselves...
We are talking about quite an expansive area here, its not that climate change has left this wreck poking out of a glacier. Glaciers are dangerous to fly over, so someone just happened to be at the right place at the right time of day with the right visibility conditions. Im not denying climate change, just saying that it really isnt the case here.
There are thousands of missing planes in Alaska, because flying is a way of life here. Thanks to the Civil Air Patrol and National Guard for helping to keep us safe!
Too bad the details are so limited, I understand why they're withholding most to protect next-of-kin, but don't know why they couldn't give out anything at all . "Vintage" military aircraft - what kind, what vintage, was it a transport, a bomber, a fighter, a tanker? Props or jet?
It was a military aircraft from an alien world.
Fing global warming again, Really?
They have been finding Mammoths for hundreds of years, and Alaska is so huge that wreckage probably has always been exposed, just someone happened to finally see it.
Article said "Training mission", meaning probably not in the normal flight areas, but off in the wilderness. Nothing in that article related this crash site being exposed from glaicer melt. "Sigh"
If someone wants to cry "global warming exposed the aircraft", it would have had to have been warm enough at one point that when the plane crashed it landed where it is. If in fact it was ever buried would just mean that we had cooler weather and are now at the same place we were when the plane wrecked.
*sigh* So tired of the global warming/climate change scam.
Uh-oh. Anyone else thinking The Thing?
"Keep watching the skies!"
How do you know the temperature when the plane crashed? It could've been very sub-zero when it crashed and years of snow covered it, until global warming melted the snow layers.
Of course, this article provides zero details about anything.
Is there any information of a plane being reported missing in that area? If so when and what type of plane? Simple questions you would think a journalist would ask.
If we knew the vintage of the plane, it might help to answer the questions. If it was a WWII-era plane, there are probably a lot of missing planes to choose from. In those days, a plane could go way off its expected course and no one would know it.
It was a flying saucer from the planet Nymphrod. They are neanderthal type creatures that flew their vintage propjet 250 million light years to this planet in search of good earthworms to fish with on their own planet as they are scarce there. Their imaging scanner went kerflunk and they went off course crashing into this glacier. :-)
I was thinking that there was an event where an aircraft armed with nuclear weaposn was lost up there years ago - which would explain why it's become a no-fly zone all of the sudden. But that may have been in Canada and I could be reading a little too much into this.
My hope is that they can identify what type and number of the plane so they can identify any remains there. Those who died on this wreck deserve a decent burial.
The best post I've read yet! And I completely agree.
Well I hope It will give some poor family or families some peace about their loved one or ones. It's amazing really it just took someone being there at the right place at the right time to see it.
It would behoove those news agencies reporting finds such as this, to go ahead and figure out a way to recover the remains and plane debris first. Once identified, their families can be notified and the rest of the recovery can take place.
This would avoid all the looky-loos converging on a sacred space that was the final resting place of these brave pilots and crew.
the media is not in business to wait for more news. they are there to report what they know at the time. more to follow as it happens
Big Picture - the Boggs case was immediately where my mind went, too. We lived in his district at the time. I was very little so I don't remember very much about it. Coming up on the 40th anniversary of his disappearance, I think?
dunno. i was pretty little, too. but, that must be right -- maybe even 50th(?) i am fortunate enough to know tommy boggs and several of his family. they (incuding cokie roberts) are a significant part of what we can all be proud of as americans.
Many Lend lease aircraft were flown to the Soviet Union during WWII through Alaska. Suspect this is the most likely reason for a "vintage" military aircraft on a glacier.
found this online for the southern area of alaska:
fdc notam 2/9070
Search on for military jet missing over Alaska, U.S. Air Force F-22 Raptor 'dropped off the radar', updated 11/17/2010 9:37:43 AM ET
... The new find is 50 miles east of the Elmendorf base, something like 40 ish miles from the (fast?) jet reported location ... [High tech plane unable to find (Double Stealth)?]
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40231873/ns/us_news-security/t/search-military-jet-missing-over-alaska/
Hale Boggs:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hale_Boggs#Disappearance_in_Alaska
Let me get this straight. You found a plane crash but have no details until the next of kin are notified.
So ... why are you posting a story that has no information or facts? Slow news day?
Since there has been a "flight restriction" placed on the area it makes me wonder what they "really" found?
Just kidding, kinda. Was at a conspiracy site before this one.
And I had the same thought. Why a no-fly zone over an old crash site? You'd almost think we don't trust our government, wouldn't ya?
There are numerous aircraft wrecks, military and civilian, all around the world that have never been found. Back before GPS and whatnot, if a plane disappeared over an unpopulated area, and the crew had no chance to radio a mayday call, and there was no flight plan or they were off course, there was a strong chance that it would never be found, and the occupants would be listed as "missing and presumed dead." The desert Southwest is similar. When they were looking for Steve Fossett, they found a couple of other plane wrecks that they weren't even looking for. GPS locators can change this, but of course: (a) there has to be one on board; and (b) it has to self-activate after a crash.
I think it is remarkable that this site was found apparently by chance. The Alaskan wilderness is vast. Hopefully the location is such that a recovery team can be safely flown in to investigate the crash, determine the identity of the plane and those on board, and recover any remains for proper burial.
Years ago, the remains of a WWII American bomber were found in the Libyan desert. The plane had been listed as missing. The best that anyone can figure is that an inexperienced navigator missed the plane's base on the coast when it returned from a night bombing raid and the crew just continued on into the desert until they ran out of fuel. Lost over a desert at night, without visible landmarks, they never had a chance.
Chris: My favorite word for Alaska: "Vast."
Most folks have no idea, whatsoever, as to how big the state really is--and how unpopulated. It's not like one can drive up to any part of a glacier, take a photo op and then drive on. (Of course, there are a few, but very few.) Most glaciers are so far into the outback of Alaska, that the only way to get even close is to fly over. For some areas, it would be darned near impossible to even backpack into them. Some areas are so remote, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if an undiscovered wooly mammoth walked out.
Finding a crash site is a one in a million chance, and this just happened to be the one. I was wondering about the "bone fragments." If it was an aerial reconnaissance, how would they know there were bone fragments? I could understand maybe seeing whole/large skeletal remains, but not fragments. Since it was a Blackhawk, it might have set down and picked up a few things. Just wondering.
I've visited the state a couple of times, and for the tiny bit I've seen, I'm truly in awe of it.
So JPAC gets involved so quickly for a recovery mission? What about the dozens of known sites in India and China that have been waiting for years for such recovery missions. Why do the families of those servicemen get put on the backburner once again?
Money I suspect. I know there is a private organization (the name escapes me at the moment) that has been looking for crash sites for planes that went down over The Hump.
That would be Clayton Kuhles with MIA Recoveries. He does the searches privately on his own and reports all of the information, photos, lat/lons, etc. to JPAC and then goes about finding family members. Yes he does solicit funds for his expensive work but he is a hero to many families for finding their family members who have been MIA since WWII.
That's it. Thanks for jogging my memory!
Well, since your JOB at JPAC is finding out where these men & women are, then you obviously have a " reason for JPAC to be involved" Ms. Dobson. No — — it. That was a brilliant statement.
I'm thinking somebody that lives in Hawaii wants to vacation in Alaska. Just sayin'.
UFO
I had an Uncle that was listed as lost at sea before 1958 (before I was born) What I remember my family saying was he was up in that area when they went missing. Maybe it is his plane. All of the immediately family is gone now but still it would be nice for his remains to be found and returned. I cant remember what branch of service he was with. Its all listed on his marker but I cant remember the exacts.
For those thinking of the Boggs crash, he was on a Cessna 310, which is not a military aircraft. If this is a military aircraft then chances of this being him are slim. There was a crash on the glacier in 73, and one in 93. One was a Csssna 172 and the other a PA-3.