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Subscribe to RSSJerry Sandusky's child sexual abuse trial is nearing an end as the defense begins presenting its case. NBC News' John Yang reports from Bellefonte, Pa.
Updated at 6:57 p.m. ET: Jerry Sandusky's attorneys began their defense Monday in Sandusky's trial on child sexual abuse charges, calling witnesses who testified that it wasn't unusual for football coaches to share showers with young boys at football and youth camps.
Sandusky, 68, the former longtime defensive coordinator at Penn State University, denies having abused 10 boys over 15 years as alleged in two grand jury reports and the indictment. Prosecutors argued over the past week that Sandusky used his connection to one of the nation's premier college football programs to "groom" the boys, whom he met through his Second Mile charity for troubled children, for sexual relationships.
Sandusky was originally charged with 52 counts in the indictment, but prosecutors dropped one count, a misdemeanor, on Monday, acknowledging that the alleged offense wasn't yet a crime when it was believed to have occurred. Judge John Cleland denied defense requests to dismiss many of the remaining counts.
Closing arguments are expected Thursday, and the jury, which will be sequestered during deliberations, could get the case as early as Thursday afternoon or Friday, Cleland said.
Defense attorneys opened their presentation after jurors heard from the mother of an alleged victim of Sandusky, who broke down on the stand as she described her son's withdrawal and health problems after he began spending some weekends at Sandusky's home.
Although Sandusky's accusers are being identified by name in court, NBC News and msnbc.com do not identify victims of sexual assaults.
The boy, identified in the indictment as "Victim 9," who is now 18, testified last week that Sandusky repeatedly raped him during the visits, sometimes with such force that he would bleed.
He said he didn't seek medical attention; instead, "I just dealt with it." He didn't say how.
Full coverage of the Jerry Sandusky trial
But the man's mother testified Monday that she thought it was odd that her son would often come home from the sleepovers with no underwear.
"He'd say he had an accident and threw them out," she said.
When her son complained that stomach hurt him and he "couldn't use the bathroom right," she took him to a doctor, who she said diagnosed acid reflux and "nerves."
Through tears, the woman said she felt responsible for what happened because she encouraged her son to continue seeing Sandusky even though he told her he didn't want to. She said she believed at the time that Sandusky was doing good work.
Prosecutors may use unaired portions of NBC's Sandusky interview
The defense then began by calling former coaching colleagues of Sandusky, seeking to demonstrate that as a famous football coach with many public commitments, he wouldn't have had the time to plan and carry out the sex crimes he's accused of.
Dick Anderson, a former Penn State assistant coach who went on to be head football coach at Rutgers University and an assistant coach in the National Football League, testified that coaches at prominent programs "all had those responsibilities where we had to recruit, which meant getting on the road."
"There were clinics that all of us did at one time or another at various locations, so those were things that we had to do," he said. "There were banquets, dinners, various places we were asked to speak at that went on regularly."
"Jerry had probably more than us, being defensive coordinator and being a national name," Anderson said. "He did a lot of things with speaking engagements — not just Second Mile, but things he did for banquets" and other events around the country.
Anderson and another former Penn State assistant coach, Booker Brooks, testified that it isn't unusual for coaches to share showers with their players and youth camp charges after a day of hard physical work, saying he had done so himself many times.
"Throughout my life as a football coach, I've showered with younger men than myself — throughout my life and even currently right now, since I am a grandfather I take my grandchild to the local YMCA. Since she's not old enough to go into a room by herself, we go in and we shower together," Brooks said.
Sandusky enjoyed stellar reputation
Asked about Sandusky's reputation, Brooks said it was "exemplary, topnotch — other words like that come to mind."
Other witnesses also testified to Sandusky's reputation, including a former fundraising consultant for Second Mile and a local schoolteacher, saying he was widely respected in the community and appeared to have a special rapport with troubled children.
"Jerry had a very unique way, and many of us were inspired by this, how he could relate to youth of all ages and really get to their level and communicate," said David Pasquinelli, the fundraising consultant.
The teacher, Brett Whitmore, a former social worker, said he learned from Sandusky the importance of trying to help hard-to-reach children.
"As I went on to social work and teaching now, I've kind of carried that with me — that people who are going to go on and do great things will always go a step further to make sure the best interest of kids is being served," Whitmore said.
One count dropped
Before testimony resumed Monday in Bellefonte, Pa., the defense asked Cleland to dismiss many of the counts, arguing that prosecutors and the alleged victims had failed to establish specific dates and times when the offenses occurred, making it impossible for Sandusky's lawyers to investigate possible alibis.
Cleland questioned the "very broad representations made by the commonwealth" about when many of the alleged incidents occurred, but he denied all of the motions. He said he believed further information developed during the trial "now meets the standards of due process, though early on I was not persuaded that was the case."
Sandusky now faces 51 counts after prosecutors dropped the misdemeanor charge of endangering the welfare of a child, an allegation that involved a man identified in the indictment as "Victim 7." He testified last week that the offense happened in 1995 or 1996, but the statute, which addresses unlawful contact with a child, didn't apply until 1997, prompting prosecutors to withdraw it.
Three other counts involving alleged victim No. 7 remain.
Cleland last week granted a defense motion to permit testimony from a psychologist that Sandusky has histrionic personality disorder, which might have led him to behave dramatically or inappropriately to get attention. They argued that that could raise reasonable doubt in jurors' minds that Sandusky's unorthodox statements and public actions are manifestations of the disorder, not seeking illegal sex with minors.
Does it matter if Sandusky has a personality disorder?
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WOW down to only 51 counts. Jerry has one hell of a lawyer. Let the excuses begin!!
Hang in there. People with a sense of justice and humanity are in for a rough few days while the defense spins its web.
A grandfather brings his granddaughter into a "Y" Shower? WTF? I don't get that at all. I don't know how old that granddaughter is, but as a mother, it would freak me out to find out that my father/father-in-law was showering with a little girl.
It's "Normal" for older coaches to shower with young boys? There's something totally wrong here. This is just WRONG.
thank you for saying that Janine! i was thinking the same thing! ewwww! i would never want my little one to be showering with her grandfather! that's disgusting!!! obviously this man is as sick as Sandusky! well, almost
Most sports locker rooms have large showers that everyone uses. That's the way it is and the way it's always been (or at least was when I grew up). No such thing as separate showers in locker rooms or dorms. Men and boys showered together but no one thought much of it because it was totally non-sexual. It wasn't "men showering with boys" it was "males showering together" because showering with females would have been "sexual" and inappropriate.
The problem with Sandusky showering with boys is that it WAS sexual. Growing up I was in the same shower with coaches and/or adults multiple times, but no coach EVER touched anyone inappropriately.
Bruce, still the grandfather showering with his granddaughter is just plain weird. Not the best "character" witness for Sandusky at all.
I'll supply a Ruger 9mm and a single round....any volunteers?
Well, listening to some of these defense witnesses, you might need multiple rounds.
I agree Janine there is something wrong with the grandfather and the granddaughter too. my daughter would never be alone with him again. I think I'd flip out on him. I don't care how old she is. She can get a bath when she gets home. I never understood why people take baths with their children. They say it's easier. I am sorry but i think it's gross. give the kid a bath in their own tub. come on people. Well since it's comon for these coaches to do this there needs to be a new law. NO BATHING WITH THE CHILDREN ALLOWED IF YOU ARE NOT THE MOTHER OR FATHER!
I was in school athletics and the coaches NEVER showered with us.
It may be wierd to you but to a male coach growing up in the 60's-80's communal showers were normal and there was nothing wierd about them. Again, I am not suggesting that Sandusky's actions were in ANY way proper, but the fact is that communal showers have been considered normal in the US in many places. What is NOT normal is sexual activity IN communal showers. Some of you have obviously never been to a health club locker room where EVERYONE of a given sex is naked in the same room (including the shower). And nothing inappropriate goes on. It's just how they work.
Agree with Janine, Grandpa showering with little girl granddaughter is gross and wrong. Even assuming absolutely nothing else going on, if I were the child's parent would put an immediate stop to that, and probably curtail future unsupervised visits due to his obvious poor judgment.
OMGosh! Taking showers with kids, as a coach, is normal...but, first of all he was NOT their coach and 2nd of all... is rubbing up against them, tickling them in the shower, pressing them up against the wall and blowing raspberries on their tummy "normal"? I'd say not! Shame on all of these people testifying in his defense when they do NOT know whether he's guilty or innocent, they're just guessing! As for the guy who takes his young granddaughter to the ymca and has her shower with him... if I was his daughter I'd stop that right NOW!!! It sounds to me like pedophiles are defending pedophiles!
A grandfather showers with his granddaughter in the men locker room. Arrest that pervert, that is just sick, take your shower when you get home ALONE.
This is not about showering or about Sandusky's "stellar" reputation. This is about a sick @!$%# raping boys who were at risk due to their economic and social background, hence making good victims that due to the combination of their inability to digest the situation AND their lack of a father figure, were easy targets... Sandusky is the SCUM of the earth and his MO is shared by thousands of abusers like him, albeit less famous and less likely to get caught...
HEY BRUCE - are you WEIRD TOO ?? Of course there are "communcal showers" in ALL athletic facilities, EVERYWHERE - BUT THERE AREN'T 60- F(*&^%& CK'G YEAR OLD MEN BRINGING 10,11,12,13 YEAR OLD KIDS IN THERE !!! AND KIDS THAT AREN'T EVEN THEIRS! WTF ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT
THEN YOU HAVE A GUY CORROBORATING THAT HE!!!!!!!! BRINGS HIS GRAND DAUGHTER IN THE SHOWER - WITH MEN ???????? WTF IS GOING ON HERE ?????
IS ANYONE HEARING THIS SH______________— AND BELIEVING IT FOR ONE F(*&^%K'G SECOND ???
SOMEONE ELSE SAID IT BEST - STOP THIS G'DAMN TRIAL SO WE CAN ALL STOP PUKING !!!
ANY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! COACH WHO SAYS HE SHOWERS WITH HIS PLAYERS ON A REGULAR BASIS IS A DOWNRIGHT F(*&^%&*()K'G LIAR!
I'VE BEEN IN & COACHED SPORTS MY WHOLE G'DAMN LIFE - AND THAT WAS NEVER!!!!!!!!!!! OK - NEVER!!!!!!!!!
AND HERE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PRE-PUBESCENT BOYS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
C'MON WAKE TF!!!!!!!!!!!!!! UP ! KIDS BEING BRUTALIZED & CONFUSED BY THIS M'FK'R - LEAVE HIM WITH ME - AND I'LL RELIEVE THE TAXPAYERS OF THIS PATHETIC BURDEN, ALONG WITH HIS DISGUSTING ATTORNEY [WHO - BTW - HAS DONE THE SAME TYPE OF THINGS!]
Wow, this is how weak and lame the "defense" is. This is stuff you do during sentencing hearings when you beg for Sandusky not to be electrocuted or put in general population. This is not a defense for the specific crimes he has been accused of. It is just that he was a really nice guy and Penn State football program was created by the Lord Jesus and the Pope, folks, so let's excuse Jer-Jer for being a molester.
Well Said. The guy showering with his granddaughter should be investigated for child abuse himself. I think this guy just f--ked his reputation & the defense.
Well, there is also a big difference between a whole group in a communal shower where everyone sees that nothing is going on, and one adult male (or more than one) taking kids into a shower alone. Then of course you add soaping, ticking, touching, or whatever else Sandusky calls it and that is disgusting on his part.
Since I don't have more details on what the other guy meant by saying he takes his gdaughter into the shower I can't say it is disgusting for sure. Our Y has family bathrooms with showers and diaper changing tables, and if he meant that I would say that is what it's for. If he meant he takes a little girl into a men's shower room that is strictly forbidden at the Y and should be. I seriously hope it is everywhere else, too. Even if grandpa isn't a molester the girl doesn't need to be around showering men and they don't need to see her either. I am not a prude about nakedness, but that isn't okay.
I think it's funny there people are so sure Sandusky had a great reputation with kids. If that were true why were Penn State people and others sending emails saying he shouldn't be alone with kids or in the showers? Oh yeah...cover up. Interesting. Which way is it? They didn't tell but they knew? They told and still thought he was awesome? Really, guys, at least make up your minds. Do you really ban people you think are safe with kids? If someone didn't pass it on that he wasn't then they are partially responsible.
There is no defense for this guy. None. These guys who say it is normal for coaches to shower with kids, are not normal themselves. And gramps showering with his granddaughter???? Gimme a break!
No doubt that coaches in college or pro ball may shower after a workout or game. They get sweaty too. But I have never heard of college coaches showering with middle and high school kids. I never saw a coach shower with the guys ever in high school, though we all knew they did shower in the group showers when everyone was gone.
If this is their defense, I think Sandusky is going to have plenty of time to shower with the guys in the future............
I played baseball and football my entire young life, pee wee to High School and I don't remember showering with Coaches. I do remember common showers but I don't remember adults. I do remember in High School our trainer always showered when we did but he was very young and I never thought anything of it.
As a father of a child starting POP WARNER Football this year I would have a serious problem if the Coach showered with my child.
I was just trying to visualize my Son showering with one of his Grandfathers and sorry but nothing about that seems normal. A father sure, but not a non-direct parent or sibling
Rampart please stop typing posts when your drunk. This is not the first time you've done this. Its hard to understand what your trying to say. There is no need for multiple punctuation.
As to most of you freaking out about the whole granddad and granddaughter showering thing, grow up. Your applying a different view and rules to something that was considered normal back in the 80's and 90's. Maybe you do not agree with it. fine. But stop makeing it out to be more than what it is. Its just a shower. Its not anything sexual.
A grandfather showering with his granddaughter? That's disgusting! Men are arrested for "exposing" themselves to young girls, and people are supposed to think there's nothing wrong with this?
I have no idea if this guy is guilty or not. But boys and coaches showering together is common. I have played organized football, hockey, baseball, and basketball since I was 6 years old thru college in 3 different states. It's always been like this. I have never seen / heard of a coach touch a boy.
I think it is sick. I hope you are not in sports
Bobster - Sorry I disagree, I played Football and Baseball every year for 12 years and I never showered with a Coach.
Any atrocity committed against a child should never be a misdemeanor and there should be no statute of limitations. As far as no specific dates, would you remember specific dates? Would you want to? Are we supposed to care that he can't come up with an excuse or an alibi based on no specific date? Does he have a mental disorder? Of course he does! IMO so do serial killers and pedophiles. Are we supposed to excuse him or feel sorry for him? No! He needs to be held accountable for his actions and the long term emotional damage he has done to these young boys. Further, he should not be allowed to remain in main stream society. Only 51 counts against him, begs the question, how many countless offenses has he committed against other young boys who haven't come forward?
We should care that he doesn't have the opportunity to come up with an alibi. It's part of having a fair trial. Do I think he's guilty? Yes. But, I also think that it isn't fair that he has no way to defend himself (in case we are all wrong).
How would you like it if you were charged with a crime & no one would tell you when it supposedly occurred? Wouldn't you want the opportunity to show you weren't in town or at the theater or a big party?
Wow. So he showered with them all the time but only raped them when he thought no one else was around. He's a pedophile. He's not stupid!
Actually he seems really stupid. That and he was caught in the showers with boys a few times, so he wasn't even that careful.
The defense is obviously attempting to make all of Sandusky's behavior seem 'normal'....highly interesting considering they're planning on calling psychologists claiming he has a 'personality disorder' that caused inappropriate behavior.
Actually, as someone who played sports from grade school all the way through college, I can honestly say that showering after hours might have happened, but it wasn't at all 'usual'. Showering with minors...yikes. This guy is trying to justify all sorts of abberrant behaviors!
As far as grandpa showering at the Y with his granddaughter...? No way. That is entirely inappropriate - what about the other people using the women's shower/locker room? Take that girl home to bathe...THAT would be appropriate.
I guess people in Happy Valley just march to a different drummer....sheesh.
hey wryview - have you ever heard of people being downright disgusting liars in a trial - to save their sorry g'damn ass ??? keep you r pants on for the rest of this show pal - these dirty b***tards will try every sick trick they can think of - it's not over!!
and for you to "believe" in some pathetic "alibi" - get real!! will you - or are you some naive "prep school boy" ??
Mental disorders should never be used to save child molestors or rapist from true justice, death penalty for a start and only one appeal to make the constitution was followed not to enrich lawyers billfolds.
Rampant, you made good points..sort of..but your bolded print feels as if you shouting and many won't read your posts.
Oh, wry, I suppose the kids who can't happen to know an exact date should have just known better and marked it on their calendars. I mean really, this isn't even about alibis for particular events at this point. Do you really think the wife or the friends can say, "Oh yes, I was out with him at supper that night all night" from years ago anyway? So sorry that they didn't think to note the date so their alleged rapist could have the convenience of an alibi.
To clear that up for you, how would you like to be an 18 boy who was molested by some pervert many times years ago and have people saying you really should give all the dates so the rapist/molester could more easily defend himself? Even if it was once...unless it was some big event you happened to remember it by you really might be confused on dates. Those things are so traumatic many can't remember much at all. I do see your point, but this is exactly why pedophiles do things the way they do and why they get away with it so often.
Ram--you're right, if it was once it was too many times. BTW, why would he want to remember. I find in times of stress and craziness I tend to not remember what happened. I only hope that none of his victims become offenders.
death is to good for this pervert. he thought he couldnt be touched because of penn state. and paterno knew this man was a sex pervert.!! the penn state board knew a long time ago to. you can bet plenty swept this under the carpet. hope he gets prison. and the prisoners get him.!! especially they hate child molestors.!! this is a real sick nut. watch how he smiles in court. how can a lawyer defend this guy. just listening to these boys tell what happened.!! sorry but i dont get how someone hasnt shot this man.!!
I just read on wikipedia that Jerry has an autobiography out entitled "Touched, The Jerry Sandusky Story". No joke!
Rampart is nothing more than an angry drunk. You wanna be taken seriously, then learn to communicate appropriately.
Derik. Good point.
So, just for clarity's sake, is the defense that he never did it, he has a personality disorder, his body parts have a mind of their own and just slipped in while "everybody showers together?" or exactly what??? AND, how many more lame excuses are people supposed to add to this crap before someone just tells him he has to account for his clearly premeditated behavioral choices??? I mean, do these boys really think we can listen to these ridiculous lies without wanting to lock this monster away forever? There have been lives ruined and people forever damaged by the selfish needs of this psychopath! SOMEONE has to account for this!!! Wouldn't it be refreshing if there were people who just did the right thing, confessed and took their poison for doing this to so many innocents because it was the honest thing to do to admit their guilt, selfishness and responsibility? Honesty: what a concept!!!
Histrionic Personality disorder is usualy a diagnosis given to females. The male counterpart is Narcissic Personality disorder, which I believe if more apporpriate here. Despite a personality disorder, this mans orientation toward boys has nothing to do with it. He is a pedophile and that comes from being abused himself or some as yet unknown brain disorder. The best thing that could happen to him now, is that he dies.
He's a pederast -- there's a difference.
What is a pederast and what is the difference? I've never heard of this before, is this a new or made-up term?
Just trying to understand...
Check out the man/boy leader at the University of Illinois in Champagne. They have him on staff selling his pederast ideas. Sick university....no freedom of speech to encourage man/boy grooming.
Not histrionic PD. Borderline PD has been called the "female narcissist"
Well if this rare psychological disorder causes a person to abuse many children, anyone with this disorder should be confined for life. Anyway you look at the actions, this person should be separated from the rest of us. Oh, will the psychologist then come up with an instant cure and he can still walk the streets, or gyms.
I just have a question, what about those who are diagnosed with this that have not done anything? So we start rounding people up and putting them in prison's for crimes they may commit? Sounds like a movie to me... and what about those who are born with an extra Y chromosome? They say those tend to be killers, not all, but still by your definition we should round them up as well. I am sure this same group hopped on the bandwagon when the Syracuse Assistant Coach was brought under scrutiny. I am not saying he did, or did not, what I am saying is let the process run its course. The fact that we don't know what is being said in the court displays that we have no right to pass judgment on the court of law. He is guilty in the court of public opinion though, that is evident. Look at the wording of stories and see how it is spun, then you have your answer!
The extra Y chromosome has been debunked long ago. One that hasn't is that the vast majority of violent offenders have had a head injury at some time in their lives....The jury is still out on that one because there are a lot of people out there that have had head injuries and have never harmed another human being. There are as many theories as to why people commit crimes as there are criminals and none of them really wash because they can't explain why certain people who have been raised or suffered the same types of abuse go on to be productive, law abiding citizens. No, of course we don't start locking up everyone with a personality disorder. That is ridiculous...Anxiety and depression are personality disorders if they are long term and not situational. The personality disorder is cr@p and I hope that the jury, not only see through that, but gets a bit P!ssed that it was even offered up as an excuse.
Anxiety and depression are mood disorders not personality disorders, colorblind. Educate yourself before running your mouth about something you do not know about.
Its actually not a rare condition and its usually in women, but from what ive read on it, its in no way a defense for what he did to the boys, its just ot defend the sexual love letters he apparently wrote to them. The disorder itself is described as a need attention or to be the center of attention like acting like your best friends with someone you just met or being overly freindly to feel liked. Also to be overly seductive to feel wanted and create an emotional fulfillment. Its typically characteristic in women who use their sexuality for attention or some emotional need. To think of it more clearly think of celebrity sex symbols, i think one of the most common to have been believed to have this was marilyn monroe, so as you can guess he really doesnt fit the bill and to try and use that to defend his actions is nothing more then a shotty defense strategy to try and confuse jurors into thinking some mental disorder is making him do this. Hes a pedophile and nothing will change that he is a predator and should never see the light of day again.
Sandusky is not guilty. These gay men should be ashamed of themselves for accusing him of touching them. They should be the ones put in jail for lying.
Donald Price are you a dues paying NAMBLA member? Thanks for your stellar comment. If the FBI has not opened up a file on you based on this and past comments they will be in due time.
Donald - gay MEN ??? Do you really want to go there? These WERE CHILDREN he preyed upon.
Your stupid arse comment needs to be deleted - and fast !!!!
crawl back under your rock you troll
you're a complete idiot, donald....these were boys, not grown men...to repeat, you're a complete idiot.
DP, are you from another planet or are you just such a die-hard Penn State fan that you have your head up your ass so far you are removed from reality? Idiot!
JohnnieD-
I am a diehard PSU fan, and Donald is a trolling moron. No one in their right mind would make such idiotic comments.
Got news for you Donald, Sandusky is guilty as sin and will spend the rest of his miserable life in prison.
Someone above my comment who used a name & apparently IS a NAMBLA member must LOVE smoking hams!!! Why doesn't he drive to Happy Valley & get in line to spoon w/Sandusky?? Just a warm, fuzzy thought.
HEY "PRICE" - everyone else here seems to be "afraid" to call you a TOTAL @!$%# -
DonaldPrice got you all going? I wondering if maybe he was a victim.
What drugs are you on, DonaldPrice????
No one believed me when I came out with the molestation and rape my father committed against me for 13 years until he admitted it to my mother AFTER I left home and I refused to speak with anyone. It was not until 18 years after I left home did my mom contact me with a letter apologizing for not believing her own daughter!! Only now does she realize all the signs were there as does everyone else. That level of trust one has for family does not exist for me anymore. I have friends I consider my "family" more than my own family could ever be!!
Julieann, that is so sad that no one believed you. You had to go through this alone with no family to support you at all. You seem to be a very strong person. It's a shame that this has to happen at all. So yeah....I think Donald Price is off his rocker.....or he's gay. Whatever the case his comment was stupid! This guy Sandusky needs to go to prison for the rest of his life along with the people that are actually defending his @$$!!
As usual Donald Price is trolling again and seems to get off on this kinda stuff. Careful price frequent commenter's are recognized.
Donald Price are you a dues paying NAMBLA member? Thanks for your stellar comment. If the FBI has not opened up a file on you based on this and past comments they will be in due time.
Sandusky is a PERV. So if the defense is that he has some special mental disorder, then I hope he gets an indeterminate sentence to be served in an institution for pervs where he can play with his tallywacker or enjoy giving or receiving anal intercourse 24/7 - so long as he never gets out.
Maybe an inmate will do the world a favour and give him a particularly virulent strain of AIDS.
Anderson and another former Penn State assistant coach, Booker Brooks, testified that it isn't unusual for coaches to share showers with their players and youth camp charges after a day of hard physical work, saying he had done so himself many times.
"Throughout my life as a football coach, I've showered with younger men than myself — throughout my life and even currently right now, since I am a grandfather I take my grandchild to the local YMCA. Since she's not old enough to go into a room by herself, we go in and we shower together," Brooks said.
FELLOW PERVERT? I have 3 grandchildren and would never shower with any of them. It is just wrong. Sicko!
He showers with his granddaughter at the YMCA??!?!?!?
Why did his attorneys think this was going to help Sandusky's case??
MyBironas
That gave you the creeps too? ewwww
EXACTLY, I hope that's a misprint and its actually his grandson, but even so, I would not as an adult shower at the YMCA with my grandson. Does anyone from MSN actually read what they print before it goes up on the site?
i thought the same thing, how the hell is this suppose to help sandusky, showering with your granddaughter just freaks me out and to have him say that shows his mind is as screwed up as sandusky's.
There is a difference between saying "men younger than myself" and "young men". Men younger than myself implies that the person was over 18 (a man) but younger than the coach. This I can see as reasonable for a college assistant coach, anything other than that is just wrong and the hole YMCA thing is outrageous.
If that was supposed to be some shining example of normalcy with coaches showering with younger kids at football camp, as a parent, I would SERIOUSLY reconsider letting my child attend that camp. And showering with his granddaughter at the YMCA? Honestly, that is an instance where waiting to get home to shower would be the most appropriate thing to do. If I found out my young daughter was showering with her grandfather at the YMCA, I would have MAJOR issues. Talk about setting of serious creepiness alarms!
YUCKY!!!
I can see him taking the girl if small into a FAMILY bathroom with a shower and rinsing her off, but HE showers with her??? Why would he be showering with a child at the Y (not rinsing off in bathing suits, which I understand)? I hope this is just the way he said it and not as creepy as it sounds.
Somebody needs to investigate that man, Grandfathers do NOT take showers with their Granddaughters, particularly in a MENS shower room.
I hope CPS took note of this. The Grandfather should be investigated. Not normal by US social standards and probably is against the law or should be.
There is something ROTTEN in the culture in Happy Valley. All these old pervs playing around naked with young kids. That's not something you find most places. Coaches have their own locker rooms and facilities everywhere I've ever seen. These people are inbred and sick. They're a cult. Sheeplike thinking and slavery to stupid football. The whole place ought to be leveled along with everyone in it. Good riddance to all enablers too. That means YOU, Paterno.
OK - this Booker Brooks is a DEFENSE witness ???!!!!
This guys admits that as a Grandfather he currently showers with his Granddaughter ? A GRANDFATHER showering with his Granddaughter - does anyone else think this is wrong?
WOW - just WOW- I can't even speak.
Wrong is not the word, totally unacceptable & preverted comes to mind. It only shows how many perverts are out there covering up for each others, Such law-biding citizens, teacher, medical personal, the legal system, & the list goes on. The rich ones don't generayl become publically known. In the past our laws & courts didn't even consider rape as a violent crime unless death occured.
As for the grandfather, I would have taken the relative out of this life for doing such a thing with my daughter or granddaughters. No, my freedom is not as valuable as the lives & well being of any child in my famiy. A shower is just the first step.
The whole place is sick. There's your evidence from someone who thinks this kind of behavior is normal! Bulldoze everything. The bonus would be a lot less waste of our tax dollars.
GenEc. Your f*cking mob mentality is disgusting. You need to fry along with Sandusky. The Penn State University did not harm these young boys, you jerkwad, Sandusky did. Other University authority butt wipes covered it up. Punish people - not the University. I am a proud graduate of Penn State and I am terribly disappointed by this entire tragedy just like every Alumni. If all Americans adopted your trailer-trash "justice" we'd have to bulldoze the entire country, and then start heading across the Oceans to other countries. Hell, who knows, we may have to bulldoze your property.
Sorry, Michael Johnson...if I were you, I sure wouldn't advertise that you are a 'proud' graduate of Penn State. The entire school needs to be cleaned up, revamped, and learn how to survive without their *precious* football team (and all the wads of money it generates).
This is what happens when athletics and money mean more than anything at an institution of 'higher learning'...abuses of policy, abuse of the trust of each and every parent, abuse of every student and alumni.
Lay off GenEc; although your 'Rose Colored Happy Valley Glasses' won't allow you to see the reality of the situation and the depth of rot in your esteemed alma mater, luckily, there are many who aren't so hampered by PSU blindness. Do yourself a huge favor, and put down the PSU Kool Aid.
The place stinks to high heaven, and something on a massive scale needs to be done. Bulldozing might be the only way to clean house there.
jet-1017207 Read my comments - and I mean, actually read my comments - or shut your ignorant face.
I'm a little disturbed by Booker Brooks' testimony that he takes his young granddaughter to shower with him at the YMCA. This must mean that she goes into the men's locker room with him and is likely exposed to other nude adult males in the process, and they would have opportunity to see her in the nude too because the showers are not individually separated. He might need to be investigated as well!
I couldn't agree with you more !!!!
I am so sickened by this , I'm not even curious as to how old his grandaughter is - and the thought of her in a men's locker room makes me want to vomit. Where is this child's parents ?
I thought the same thing, and I am astonished that the defense attorney, who had to have known this, would allow the grandfather to offer this information. This entire bunch is making my skin crawl!
Time for another investigation of another coach
I had two young sons...showers were taken AT HOME.
I am seriously creeped out by this man admitting that he takes his granddaughter into the showers WITH him.
I found coach showering with his grand daughter mind boggling and nauseating. I wonder if the little girl's parents know their young daughter showers with her grandfather. Ugh!
Agreed, bluewave. If Brooks' testimony is some feeble-minded defense attempt to paint adults and children showering together as "the new normal", I can't wait to see what else they have up their sleeve.
You all bring up good points. Not only is she in the locker room with her naked granddad, she is around other men in all stages of undress. Even in a best case scenario, thiat is just HIGHLY inappropraite and there is no reason that shower can't wait until he got home.
Just plain EWWWW and I hope that child's mother gets read the riot act. I am in SHOCK!!!
I've been searching for other media sources regarding Brooks testimony. I can't find anything other than this article that has this statement.
Unfortunately, we are all at the mercy of MSM when it comes to this case. Unlike the Casey Anthony trial...we do not have access to the court proceedings.
everyone needs to calm down. the coaches granddaughter was 16 when the showering took place she wasnt a toddler relax.
16 is old enough to go into a Ladies Locker-Room on your own.
http://www.statecollege.com/news/print.php?article=1069825
OMGosh showering with a 16 year old girl isn't any better! She's even more developed! How is 16 not old enough to shower by herself?? How did she NOT feel uncomfortable showering with her grandfather...who THEN put dry clothes on her?! That's just icky!!!
The grandfather/granddaughter story is truly disturbing. And the comment about her being 16, if that is true, makes it much more concerning. I am not sure how that story is going to help his defense, not that I actually care, I hope that he is sent to prison for the rest of his miserable life.
16???? You wouldn't have caught me in a mens shower room at that age, why couldn't she go into the womens shower? Why would she even NEED to shower at that age I don't even remember sweating enough to have to take a shower after working out at 16 other than to pretty up after. That is so not right...take her home to shower. People are dimented.
"Uncle Henry" you're stupid & fk'd up! read the freakin article - you perv A___hole
16 is plenty old enough to shower by yourself. Cite your source, Uncle Henry, me thinks you are full of bovine manure.
Uncle Henry. hahahahah. Funny as hell. I can't believe that all of these idiots "bit" on your obvious humor. Hook - Line - and, the proverbial, sinker. LOL !!!! Damn good. Hahahahah
So the defense is planning to call Sandusky's on air interview gafs a symptom of this histronic personality disorder so we should pay no attention to what he said. Then he wants the judge to dismiss the victim's testimony because they cannot give the precise date and time when the abuse occured. Good Lord, this is a demented defense.
Most rape & child molestor trials are based on demented defense & the attorneys don't care if they help free these preditors to continue preying on our young. Winning, money & power is what motivates our legal system not Justice, now that is reality.
All those people that knew what this monster was up to over the years need to stand & did nothing to stop him should receive the same sentence their beloved coach. Mental Defence, is used when one is guilty of the crimes.
WOW, now they say it is common for coaches to shower with young boys....they sound worse than the Michael Jackson stories..... I would NEVER allow my little boy to shower with an adult male who is not related, much less alone without other team mates present!!!
I am a mother to a 2 year old and 5 year old. I cannot see myself showering with my kids (naked) at that age. Worse, shower with someone else's kids. Really? Who does that? Apparently it is a going theme for football coaches. Now I have another reason not to have my kids do football just because of this (sorry, I am just appalled by the "oh it's normal" defense on this.
Additionally, if I was the prosecution, I would just leave one question to the jurors - "Would you let YOUR son spend a night with Sandusky?". If they say no and/or hesitate with the question, then they do believe he is a pervert and should be locked away. If they cannot in good conscience let their kids spend time with Sandusky, why should any kid be allowed to if he's not locked away?
You should be the prosecution attorney !! Please call them down in "crazy town" -
Your comment is EXACTLY what they need to hear!
Better make sure your kids do not live in college dorms. Some of them have a tiny curtain just to seperate or no curtain at all in those showers. The fact is your extremely over reacting to the whole shower thing. Yes it was a common thing back in the 80's and 90's. In those days, child molestation from your coaches was not a big threat. Still isn't. You can't judge every sports coach just because of Sandusky. A good 99 % of these team showers are just showers. The worst thing most get out these is foot illnesses.
@derik - I'll take my chances being an over reacting paranoid mom than have the "risk" of handing my kids over to the wolves. Just personal choice.
Having a personality disorder does not make you write love letters to children. Even if that disorder involves acting out in a seductive or sexual way and makes you demanding of attention- it doesn't mean you're wired to write LOVE letters to CHILDREN.
Dude whenever adults took showers with me like at the pool they were always in their swimsuits they NEVER got naked with us. That is like BEYOND inappropriate.
Booker Brooks confession that he takes his grand daughter into the shower with him at the YMCA is yet another insight into what is acceptable at Penn. State. The situation needs to be investigated, until then the grand daughter needs to be protected.
Jane. Try to stop being an idiot. Penn State University does not find any of these activities acceptable. Jesus. Use your freakin' brain. People are to blame. NOT an institution. Damn! Have you no common sense.?
@Michael, I guess you are not aware of the email exchanges between Penn State Administrators documenting their decision to not to report these so called "allegations" against Sandusky because it is the humane thing to do. If the "Tone at the top" is to turn a blind eye and not hold their employees accountable, then management is pretty much saying it is acceptable as no one gets punished. Penn State, as any other university in the country has the responsibility to reprimand, report and not tolerate such behaviors. But since they didn't, they should be help accountable for that, as an institution and as individuals. They have to live with that.
Also, message boards are not to attack somebody for their opinions. You can disagree with someone's ideas but that does not give you the right to call somebody names etc.
Am I the only one who just gagged at the comment by one of these "esteemed" coaches that he showers with his young granddaughter? And they just can't see how their good buddy Jerry had the time to sexually assault young boys? They all deserve to share a cell with him.
Nope - you aren't. Scary, scary stuff.
No, you weren't. That made me sick to my stomach too. That man needs to be investigated!
Public functions took up too much of his time? He wouldn't have had any time to commit these offenses? Really?
I knew the Y shower thing would come up, but I'd like to know if that grandfather that showers with his granddaughter does so when the facility is CLOSED.
Seems to me that's exactly why the prosecution shoud point out to the jury (is) why Sandusky brought the boys home and had them stay over night??? This just gets better and better ...
The posters on this site are just molester vigilantes. They support a TX father for murdering a family acquaintance/ alleged child molester - with no witnesses. He was angry, and that's OK with most posters. The same posters ridicule the American justice system by demanding Sandusky just be found guilty and executed. These same posters would be also be whining if their own family/children were railroaded by the same vigilante justice that they are suggesting. These forums are dranched with hypocricy.
Whats wrong with finding him guilty? I think the death penalty is appropriate for destroying the lives of so many innocent young men. I'm sorry, but as parents we should all be "molester vigilantes". We can disagree about Obama, the war, the economy, gun control laws and even the death penalty, but there is no room in a decent society for men who would prey on young boys. It is worse than murder, it is more cowardly than treason, there is no grey area, if given a fair trial and found guilty by a jury, he should be held accountable, not held for observation in some psychiatric hospital.
I would echo MMC(SS)'s thoughts and add there's no room in society for any adult who preys on young children, regardless of the gender of the adult OR the gender of the child.
A parent walking into a situation where they SEE their child being abused probably isn't thinking rationally. He beat him with his fists. Too much? Probably, but others have been acquitted of murder when walking in on a spouse having sex with someone else and SHOOTING BOTH. It has to do with one's mental state at the time they witnessed the offense.
I guess you haven't read the Grand Jury Presentment, or read ANY articles regarding the testimony of the victims and witnesses, or you'd be thinking that Sandusky is one twisted perv...right along with the rest of us. There isn't a railroad track or a train...just the sick actions of a pedophile. Now the defense is putting questionable witnesses on the stand that is just as stomach turning as the prosecutions case.
There are no reported witnesses to the alleged molestation of the father's daughter in TX. When any witnesses did arrive, the Mexican barn worker was already unconscious/dead. So it is just the father's contention that a family acquaintance - not a stranger - was molesting his 5 y/o daughter who had just left her home to feed the chickens out back. The daughter was treated in the hospital for minor injuries and released, but what exactly were her injuries, and what exactly did she tell the cops? ( or maybe what did her father tell her to tell the cops) None of this has been reported by the media. I guess because the victim wasn't black, there is no national groundswell of support from the black community - as there is for Tayvon MArtin - for proof that the murder was justified. The victim was apparently an immigrant from Mexico, so TX cops could care less. Stay tuned.
SAndusky is allowed to present a proper defense.
@Raddbrad - You are making a grave mistake in comparing Sandusky to the Texas murder you are talking about. The Sandusky case has overwhelming testimonies and evidence against him vs. the Texas murder you are talking about. I don't even understand how you can talk about the same thing in this boards, when you know for a fact, as you stated, that there were no evidence in the Texas murder, which is the total opposite for the Sandusky case.
I don't disagree with your statement that he should be given proper defense. I have to say though that his lawyers are not doing him a favor...they're not even saying that he did not do any of these things, instead, oh he has a personality disorder which is why he is doing all these inappropriate behavior. Also, now they are saying that it is the norm for PA coaches to shower naked with kids so he's not guilty of anything....
And you, raddbrad, sound like a pedophile or a pro-pedophile person. Shame on you thinking that protecting our children shouldn't be the most important thing!
I believe suspects are innocent until proven guilty. The defense has barely presented its defense, but ignorant people on this site are already ridiculing the defense attorney and his witnesses. Shame on the people who believe that Sandusky's legal team doesn't have the right to defend him and explain his behavior. No one on this site has any idea whether the testimony against Sandusky is valid or fabricated. That is the jury's job. Most of the posters on this site would be disqualified as jurors on this case because of their strong bias and presumption of guilt. Most of the posters here have the mentality of a lynch mob. One of the great benefits of living in our society is the existence of a justice system that allows every defendent to present a defense.
HEY RADD - you're another person who thinkks our "justice system" is so "perfect". Take your damn head out of your dark hole - PLEASE!
There is nothing "pristine" about this guy - his circumstances - the prevailing history - the incredible files kept by PENN STATE ADMINISTRATORS, which are ABOUT TO BECOME PUBLIC
Stop the BS that this "Justice System" is so legitimate. These folks have already ABUSED that as well.
Right now, this "defense" is another necessary "evil" - and a total [sickening] process that should have NEVER reached this point - IF the LEGAL SYSTEM were not abused and manipulated by the very people who are putting on their "defense" - SICK!
radd you're just making yourself look worse and worse, with every post you put up. If our society "condones" a defense wherein grown men say it's ok to take showers with little boys...well there's something highly wrong with our society. I'm just very glad you do NOT work in our criminal justice system, how many pedophiles would get off scott free, if you did. You have the mentality of someone I would never, ever wish to know.
radd, you're absolutely right.The pedophile, child rapist Jerry Sanusky is entitled to a defense. He deserves a defense and judging by the actions his defense has taken it appears Sandusky is getting exactly the defense he deserves, which is weak because they have no defense for the sick behavior of their client.
And since I'm not a juror I can say on this message board that I hope Sandusky is found guilty on every count and is sent to prison to rot.
I agree with Radd. And I mean that sincerely, unlike RRuin's twisted support. All of you mobsters suck up every ounce of tripe that is fed to you by the media. If you are an American, it really is quite simple: if he is determined to be guilty by a jury, then punish him. If he is determined to be innocent by a jury, then release him. Unfortunately for any person suspected of wrong-doings - in this country or any country - there are always enough mobsters foaming at the mouth to take matters into their own hands.
Radd's point about the tragedy in Texas was to make a point to you pinheads about how mobs feed on each other solely based on their thirst for unfounded revenge. The key word is "unfounded". Not circumstantial evidence. [ Look it up ]
Read the novel "To Kill A Mockingbird". Or if reading is beyond your attention span, watch the movie by the same title.
I am from PA and the mother of 4 adult children. I am disgusted at the the thought of what Sandusky has supposedly done to this boys. However, I think most people on here are overreacting to defense testimony about the rpacticve of adults in communal showers when minors are presents. First, I think back to my high school days in gym class taking communal showers. While the teacher did not shower with us, she would stand at the entry way to the shower and look in to make sure we all actually were taking a shower - back then hygiene after sports was taught. Back then, when I went to the Y and showered in the communal shower, there were women of all ages in there together. And as far as the Y, I am told in the olden days that men (of all ages) used to swim in the pool naked. As a parent, I admit when my kids were young, daughters or sons, I did shower with them before they were able to shower on their own. I have 3 sons who played both high school and college level sports, and they will tell you the communal shower the players used were often used by the coaches as well. And just last year when I took a water aerobics class at the local high school pool, there was a children's swimming class at the other end of the pool. When the the classes were over and odler women like myself would shower in the communal shower, often times the young girls from the swim class would come in to shower as well. I have never felt that anything was wrong with any of these showering incidents and I still don't ! People need to get a grip here and quit making the act of showering in a communal shower something that it isn't! Having said that, it appears that in Sandusky's case, he used the showers to further is perverted agenda with these boys.
I don't see where anyone is freaking out over communal showers. Although, the grandfather showering with the granddaughter causes concern. In that case, the young girl can take a shower at home.
It's the after hours...facility is CLOSED showers that peeks the freak meter.
I don't believe you.
You are trying to tell me that you would be ok with YOUR Father or worse YOUR Father-in-law ( the Grandfather ) taking a shower ( being naked) at a YMCA communal shower with your daughter ?
Like I said , I just don't believe you.
Starduster54 You are so right about back in the day when after gym classes we as students would shower, and our gym teacher would see to it that we did this; however she didn't touch any of us. Speaking only for myself, no teacher or coach did anything of a sexual advancement to me, but I don't know about my classmates. If it did happened, I'm more than sure that they would have never told, because no one would have believed it and secondly it would be so shameful. As far as these men swimming naked back in the day at the "Y" is pretty sick. I don't believe 30 or 40 yrs ago there were enough brave soul to come forward. This has been a slow process and because of that it has also taken time to be able to understand and study this form of sickness in people. Over time we have come to find that all of things that we did back in the day is just not happening in this day. Innocents we have lost. Sickos live right next door or just across the street.
Showering in close proximities, both naked and in Sandusky's case having their bodies "touch" is the issue for me. Would you let your 10 year old boy shower naked with his gym teacher and goof around or "wrestle" in the shower naked?
I know everyone is emotionally charged up about the thought of what Sandusky did, but again, I think everyone is overreacting to communal showers with both adults and kids present. Yes, Sandusky got too close and suppoedly did things he dhouldn't have done - he is a sick person! Normal adults are not like him. Normal adults would not think of that as sexual! Please try to think rationally. Around here, coaches showering with players is normal practice and nobody even gives it a thought. Obviously, based on this case, we as adults have to think more carefully about these thigns going forward.
@starduster54 - Don't get me wrong, I am fine with kids and adults showering together IF, they are both clothed, there is enough space between them, there are other people around and they do it when the facilities are open. If any of those is missing it is inappropriate for me. Sorry, but if you will allow your child shower with his/her teacher naked with some "physical interaction" (I'll leave that open as it can just be "tickling"/"wrestling" or whatever physical) involved, that is your choice and you as the parent will have to live with that. I on the other hand choose not to allow my kids to be in a situation where they as kids, wouldn't even understand what is inappropriate or not. This will let me sleep better at night and know that I am doing everything I can to protect my kids. Call me paranoid or maybe overreacting if you will, but I'd rather be called those than be the parent who is untouched with reality, that there are some people out there who will hurt and take advantage of your kids, and the parent who didn't protect her kids enough. I'll live with paranoid and overreacting any day.
@starduster54
Overreacting? No...I don't see the overreactions to normal circumstances in communal showers.
Your thought process is EXACTLY what pedophiles rely on. Let's work out for 10 to 15 minutes and it's SHOWER TIME. A 10 to 15 min workout session wouldn't require a shower. Maybe for a man his age, but certainly not for a child. Normal people shower after workouts. The workout is not the pedophiles goal...the shower is.
Showers with Sandusky were common for the victims. That's where witnesses attest to things other than showers occurring. A shower is where it is acceptable to be naked. Told by police that it's not so acceptable...Sandusky agrees and yet continues. Why? Because that's who he is.
I don't find it acceptable for a grandfather to take his young granddaughter into the Men's locker-room to shower. While HIS intentions may not be 'sexual'...he cannot assume that other men seeing her in the shower feel the same way he does.
Starduster: I was involved in different sports during my entire childhood and teen years. AT NO TIME did a male teacher shower with female students nor did female teacher/coaches shower with male students. This witness in the Sandusky trial has tesified that he showers with his grandDAUGHTER in a public shower. And you really think that is appropriate? As has been said, if this child was too young to go to the women's shower on her own, she still was exposed to other men taking showers. I'm sorry but I just don't think that is proper.
I am the grandmother of a 2 year old, and although I implicity trust my husband and know for a fact that he is no pedophile, I would never ever let him take a shower with our granddaughter (nor would he ever want to)! That is just plain wrong, no young child should ever see their grandparent's privates. I also do not shower wtih her, she takes a bath with my assistance but I am never in the tub with her.
There is something that nobody here wants to acknowledge and it's the 60s. It was not a big thing, then, for children to shower with others in the common grounds, communas they all shared. I also saw, while stationed in California, teenage girls and some pre-teen going to the barracks to do whatever and every thing, heck even sex they had and nobody then gave a rat's ass. I saw a young girl, about 12, 13 showing her tattoos in, you got it, genitalia and there were about 10 hippies looking at her "tattoo." Jerry L. Lewis married his cousin and she gave birth at 13, so why now it has become a lifetime sentence, specially if it pertains to a priest. This is hypocrisy to the nth degree and witch hunting at its best. Why some get probation, others life in prison? There is no way in hell that could be justice. I saw a police officer who had sex with a 13 years old and he got probation. Some teachers got house arrest. Where in here is this justice? and war crminals raoming free. Go figure!
It is inapropriate for any adult to shower with a young person whether in a sports setting or any other setting. It may be common practice and therefore acceptable as Mr. Brooks is implying, but I seriously doubt that parents of young children who do participate in sports programs, whether they are school related or Little League or through the boy Scouts or college or whatever, would agree. I wonder if the parents of Mr. Brooks granddaughter are aware that he showers with her. He sounds like a pervert also.
So it is common for Penn State coaches to shower with young boys? That argument by the defense only supports the prosecution's case. The defense witness testimony implying that Sandusky had such a busy schedule he would have been too busy to find the time to molest the boys is ridiculously funny. Will there be one or more idiots on this jury to believe this ridiculous defense?
They are BETTING on the inherent PERVERSIONS they have within THEMSELVES, that the MAJORITY shares their DISGUSTING TWISTED aPPETItes of EATING children! 40 years of intense SEXUALLY Manipulating and STIMULATING Entertainment and Games - make for a pretty disgusting world where animals PRETEND THEY ARE HUMAN.
Don't go over board on us here ... We're not on the jury LOL ...LOL...
In India's 'legal' because it is not stopped child prostitution market, 70% of all ADULT Males want little children....NO I AM SURE THE MAJORITY OF MALES WOULD love to get NAKED and SHOWER with little kids!!! How FUN!!!! Isn't that the NATURAL ORDER OF THINGS????
In India you have more people than you have space to shower them ... Also, is that your child in the lap of Jesus, or someone else's child? Believe me, no matter what you believe; Sandusky is no Jesus ... You should never want your child to sit in Sandusk's lap ... In or out of a shower! ...
Thanks! Mentally picturing three little boys flying through a ladies locker-room made me chuckle!
In our HIGHLY CHARGED pornographic WORLD!!! There are very few clean consciousness supported in the flesh - We have Mafioso at the top, and this reality looks like Hugh Heffners WET DREAM come TRUE!!! Only 40 years of intense televised PROGRAMMINGS and all order of NATURAL for thousands of years - wants to come to a SCREAMING halt - and the backflush TURNING the turdy TIDE. That is today.l
We all would have been better off if you never touched your key board to begin with ...
Agreed eagle. Looks like Roberta needs her mind washed out with soap and water...
Time to shut that cesspool down! Another freak asst. coach who takes his grand daughter into the shower with hime at the YMCA????? Are you effin' kidding me?? Since when is it OK for a female child to shower with strange men in public naked or to see strange men naked when they shower??? Or a male child to be in the women's show seeing naked strangers? Is that whole town effin' insane?