I thought the same thing. But then when she was pronounced dead at 11:16 PM, I realized there was no way they would make the same typo twice. The 7-year-old was out way too late, especially when the mother already acknowledged that the neighborhood was violent.

she was shot in the street and ran into the house....

....out after 10 selling candy in a violent neighborhood makes no sense.

Another point to remember is most of these homes have no air conditioners it is nice and cool at night and has been extremily hot in that area lately and let me ask can U go outside your home anytime U want? She was with her family the issue at hand is getting the guns out of Felons hands and taking control of our neighborhoods.

Ashley, time matters. And the story said she ran to the house and was found in a hallway, meaning she was probably hit on the porch or in the doorway and ran inside to the hallway, where she died. A 7 year old shouldn't have to be RUNNING FROM GUNFIRE towards her home at almost 11PM, she should be in her home, most likely asleep. While stray bullets do hit houses, it's extremely far fetched to think that if the girl was in bed in her home at a reasonable hour, she might not have fallen victim to this. This is furthered by her mother stating that she knew how bad the area was. Really? Put your kid to bed. I have NEVER heard of heartless gangbangers stopping by the neighborhood candy shop to buy candy from a 7 year old at 10:45. Shady shady shady.

Yes, ashleyaddams, I did in fact read the story. Apparently you did not. Please read the VERY first line of the story.

A 7-year-old girl was fatally shot in the back Wednesday outside of her family’s home in Chicago.

People SHOULD be able to be out and about in their neighborhoods - even late at night. I can remember all the neighbors outside...kids playing under street lamps. The biggest disaster was a skinned knee.

I'm tired of gangs shooting up neighborhoods...killing innocent children...tired. Time to change some laws. Gang affiliation should be a crime. Period. Let the gangs work it out in prison...not on the streets.

(Duplication error)

Well neither of us know what is correct since MSNBC said 2 different things in the article but it is regardless I have a pool and my 6yrold and my 15yrold swim at night I know it has been late but it is the summer and it shouldn't matter everone should feel safe in there neighborhoods no one should have to worry about getting shot by anyone.

I grew up in the '50s and at age 7 in the summer I had to be in bed by 7:30 or 8 p.m., no matter how hot it was, no matter that the sun was still shining. I didn't have to sleep; I could lie there and read if I wanted (and I often did) or look out the window that was right by my bed, but I had to rest.

I don't get why parents nowadays let their kids stay up so late; it's really not good for their health.

This is such a trajedy, however, why in the world is a 7 year old outside playing at 10:45 at night? I feel sorry for the family and their loss but feel this could've been avoided. If you know your neighborhood is prone to gang violence, why would you allow your child to play outside so late? Common sense people. Unfortunately, these days, common sense is not so common.

I'm almost 50 years old. I remember being outside with my parents that late. Of course, it wasn't a violent neighborhood, but guess what...just because you don't tuck your children into bed at 8 pm every night doesn't make you a bad parent.

America, we live in America people. You should be able to walk anywhere you want, anytime night or day. America is no better than any third world country. Freedom, you don't know the meaning.

Knowing your neighborhood is not safe....why on earth would you have your child out selling candy at a "candy stand" even if it is yours.. at 10:45 at night?? I know it is hot and a lot of people do not have AC, but be responsible and do not have your children out, even with you at that time of night. These criminals do not care how old you are and if you are with your mom..they only see someone to shoot, or they see no one at all and just shoot because that is what they do. That poor girl, it just breaks my heart.

It's incredible that we are debating, in America, whether or not it was appropriate for a young girl to be out with her mother at night time-NEAR HER OWN HOME. What we should be concerned about is gun violence and the fact that these thugs are holding residents hostage.

I thought the same thing. Sad story.

I live in chicago.I grew up in the wild west (austin area)then it was predominately polish italian.but once the riots of 68-69 burned down most of madison-roosevelt road the white flight started.everyday on my way to work I see them standing in front of liqour stores beggin for change,waiting for god knows what?the hand out that will never come?the days winnin lottery #?Or the next welfare check?this will never stop untill you eliminate welfare and programs of the like .it destroys self respect and the need to get up in the morning to get work or make work.we can go on and on but I can tell you this right now watch the first 10 min of wgn news and you will see this will not stop anytime soon..I dont care what gangbangers from ceasefire you bring in that is just another welfare check.

I agree that people should be able to walk about at all hours any time of the night. (Same thing, if you are drunk, you still shouldn't be raped.) HOWEVER, my concern is that normally children should be asleep and maintain a good sleeping pattern, aside from special occasions (like swim party, sleepover, etc.), but not selling candy bars. I would think just that if it was an unsafe neighborhood that maybe bringing children in at a certain hour would be a good idea. =/

Yes...It was not wise to have a child out that late...but ppl should be able to go at any time they feel and not live in fear. Some ppl dont lock their doors in certain neighbors...not speaking of Chicago...I guess you all think they are not smart when someone comes in their home and kills them? The point is not what the person did that led to the crime...the point is the crime. Senseless...my prayers go to her family. The lil girl looks like my great niece, whose mother use to live in this area and have her kids out late. I really hated that she did that and even more so that they lived in the area. Something needs to be done about this...ASAP. No more...

It's time to flood those neighborhoods in blue.

Change being a gang member from a common crime to an urban terrorist and prosecute as such

here's the problem - if anyone actually tries to address the gang problem, and sweeps them off the streets...there will be cries of racism, PERIOD.

the only solution as I see it - go door to door, find the people who wont out and want to live in a safer neighborhood and are willing to fight for that safe neighborhood, and help relocate them.

It would be HANDS DOWN CHEAPER.

anyone who wants to stay behind and live a gangsters paradise, have at it - and then we just blockade off those blocks, and let them be animals in a zoo...but we have check points and they dont get to come out without full body searches.

i dont mind people living thug lives as long as they are only endagering themselves and those who want to partake and in that lifestyle...but they shouldnt be allowed to subject others to it.

Draw a line, and keep em on the other side of it.

So, um, I guess a little girl that just lost her life is less important than some of you people's political views and idealism. That's pathetic to argue after the fact.

The child may have been shot at 10:45 a.m. and died more than 12 hours later. I don't trust MSNBC to keep such details straight.

In any case, my thoughts and prayers are with her family and her friends.

Chicago police are searching for two men seen fleeing the shooting. No arrests have been made.

And no arrest should be made. These POS' don't deserve any rights or a trial. Shot, shovel, and shut-up!

I'm tired of playing by the rules and seeing innocent people paying for it.

Dont blame the mother or the daughter shooting a gun inside of the city limits is against the LAW. THE MOTHER AND DUAGHTER ARE VICTIMS. SOMETIMES people have to do things different. so dont judge. we dont know why they were outside. when i go outside my house getting shot is the last thing i would suspect

20 kids under the age of 17 have been shot are twenty moms at fault i dont think so. Time to spend more money on the streets to make them safe so that 20 senceless murders dont happen. we need to make so it so uncomfortable for these gang bangers that they will be the ones to be scared of walking the streets at night.

Very sad!

Chicago police are searching for two men seen fleeing the shooting. No arrests have been made.

Interesting, no description of the men seen fleeing the shooting. I'm assuming that they are evil middle class white males. They are, after all the reason for all of the woes in certain "communities" according to most of the pulp so-called PC news these days. /s Better get Al and Jessie in to call for an investigation since nobodys been arrested.

@ jessica -1 relocation -who pays for this ? 2 who decides who stays and who goes ? 3 check points- this is America not post-war Germany

What we should be concerned about is gun violence and the fact that these thugs are holding residents hostage.

If thugs are holding residents hostages and the cops are at a lost to stop it, then the responsibility falls back to hostages. Time to take action and do what yo have to do to make your area safe. Hire George Zimmerman

Some of the people here actually want to charge the mother--as if she hasn't suffered enough! She'll probably wrestle with her feelings for the rest of her life! Leave the neighborhood if it's violent? What if he next place you go is just as violent? People just can't up and leave if they are poor. No one knows what they were doing or why at that time of night. Bottom Line: don't blame the victims! Get rid of the gangs--murderers, drug dealing cowards! You can't let them win by letting them have the run of this or that neighbourhood. Every inch of America deserves just as much protection and a sense of safety as any other.

ashleyadams most people did feel that their neighborhoods in the 1970's and before were so safe that anyone could wander around at any time of the day or night.

But people do not want life to be like it was in those times, there was no 'freedom'. So what is it that you are really stating to us that you want?

Hire george zimmerman? Shooting innocent children with candy in their pockets is the problem, not the solution! Too many guns means they can shoot back you know.

Alright, where did most of you people grow up? Your rich parent's gated community? This lady obviously has the candy stand not only to keep the kids safe but to make a little extra money to support her family. Her daughter was with her as paying for child care at night would cost more than she was making. My mother worked night shift at a gas station and I would have to go sit with her until midnight or 1 am many nights during the summer and we would walk 8 blocks home afterwards. The worst thing I can remember happening in my town of 11,000 people was a drunk man almost running us over on his way home from the bar. Here, this poor girl gets shot while on her way home with her mom from her mother's income maker, and you people are debating on whether or not she should have been out at this time? You're morons! Sorry that not everyone in this world comes from high income dual parent homes where the father could watch the child while the mother was at work. This point shouldn't matter. What should matter is that some worthless punks are out there yet able to keep shooting other people's children for NO REASON at all. It's not a gun control issue or a political issue, it's a character issue. Let's stop spending money on worthless crap and spend it on educating some of these kids that the worthless way their parents lived their lives provides them with nothing! My family was poor as dirt, but we made it without government assistance or outside assistance of any kind. Why? It's called pride! Now I see people asking their employers to pay them partly in cash so that they can get on government assistance! What a joke! Stop worrying about why this girl was out at this time and start worrying about the direction this country is going as a whole. Violence in Chicago today WILL lead to violence in your small quiet neighborhood too if you aren't looking for it!

out after 10 selling candy in a violent neighborhood makes no sense

It makes perfect sense in a "free" country.

So how you going to stop this with candy? If the 2 that were doing the shooting were both shot dead on the spot, then this kind of activity would slow way down. We kind of proved this in Iraq. They had to get sneaky and switch to IEDs

Or csm5, or any others who are worried about being able to do what you want in your neighborhoods. What do you think is the reason that before the 1970's; middle '80's in Los Angeles, people did not even fear enough to lock their doors or windows?

How nice that everyone can just sit and talk about what a lousy mother she is and what a great parent they are or their parents were. We don't live in the 50's any more. Kids don't go to bed at 7:30 anymore. In the summer, most kids do stay up late and enjoy the summer time. It doesn't get dark till 10:00 and in the inner city, many kids are out on their porches trying to keep cool. Why is everyone so darn perfect they can blame the mother for her daughter being murdered by gang punks? Blame the jerks with guns who think they are men because they can kill a little girl. It is not the mother's fault. Her heart is forever torn and will never be whole again because she is burying her child. Who made each of you so damn perfect that you can sit in your wonderful air conditioned homes and throw blame at her?

Horrible tragedy; this is really, truly sad. I can see both sides of the coin here, and although I agree that kids that age should be in bed, no one in America should ever even have to worry about this happening on the chance that their child is up and outside in the back/front yard at 10:45 PM. No one's truly to blame here except for these evil monsters who are gangbangers, drug dealers, hit men, whatever they profess to.

Rahm Emmanuel needs to get his ***t together and do something, and fast, to clean up his city. Send out trucks and cruisers and evn SWAT teams with air cover, night after night, and start taking these guys down & throwing them in prison, or if they resist, take them out with sniper rifles. He needs to devote the same attention, resources, money, and manpower to this as did the Washington, D.C. police when the 2 snipers were going around killing people at random. Instead, he is asleep at the wheel. This is really going to impact $$ inflow to Chicago, especially with tourism, and is already causing so much trouble, bloodshed, and heartbreak. Need to go in there and clean out the gangbangers, and, as someone mentioned above, hold them accountable on federal terrorism charges instead of a slap on the wrist.

I kind of like @Jessica's idea but instead of relocating the law abiding citizens invite them to a neighborhood watch seminar somewhere outside the City do full search of each person as the enter then seal up the rest of the neighborhood and gas it this will eliminate the roaches as well

• I wonder what kind of "candy" they were selling
  at 10:45pm? Little girl rest in peace baby the boogie man can't get you now.

out after 10 selling candy in a violent neighborhood makes no sense

I may need to consult the new urban dictionary. Is "candy" Crack, Meth, Heroin...... Just good old fashioned Ghetto entrepreneurs trying to support their familys.

It's not a "gun thing" or a "poor neighborhood thing" or even a "black thing." It's a cultural thing. There is a certain culture that romanticizes "tha thug life" and that culture is the root of the problem. It historically has been tolerated in certain communities and even glorified. Look at the statistics with honesty and don't try to cover up the problem with cries of "racism" and you'll come to a workable conclusion. However, changing a culture usually requires change from within, not forceful change from outsiders.

People SHOULD be able to be out and about in their neighborhoods - even late at night. I can remember all the neighbors outside...kids playing under street lamps. The biggest disaster was a skinned knee.

I agree. What's all this BS about she shouldn't be out so late? She was with her mother. I'm out with my four year old late all the time if he doesn't have school the next day. I do live in a safer neighborhood but not everyone has that option. This is just a sad situation. I see no reason to chastise the mother.

For 'argument's sake' let's try something else here. Let us just temporarily agree that this shooting happened at 6:45 p.m. (Unfortunately, so many of these incidents have been happening in Chicago, even with children, that there is probably another earlier in the evening.)

So then the question of why people cannot enjoy their leisure in their neighborhoods can be addressed.

As for when children should be in bed, then we must ask, or find out what time they were being routinely put to sleep during the fall-winter-spring, i.e. the school year. And on that last note, I would state that I would hope that the children were not up past about 9:00 p.m, at the very least, on school nights. I must add that if I know someone with young children who did not have a routine bedtime for them, I would find that to be somewhat neglectful. After all, one should not be expecting everyone else to raise their child. They should be able to expect help from others if needed - they should not just be handing over their responsibility to anyone.

People should be able to be out late at night. However, in Chicago, for your safety you should not be outside. There are less police officers, and more gangbangers and criminals out at night. Almost 90% of the shootings happen after 10 pm in Chicago. Why risk it? Why jeopardize the life of the police as well, when they have to race from one district to another at high speeds to be able to respond to a crime where there are no police available?

That's the main reason there is a curfew in the city. Not to catch or punish the bad guys, because they will never obey the law. But to protect the citizens, while the small amount of police catch the shooters, and gang banger filled vehicles.

For example, in my neighborhood, which neighbors many of the crime filled ones, police tend to stop me alot. Why? They see my car with tinted windows, driving through my alley, and sometimes up to 3 individuals inside at 11pm, they assume I'm to no good. They stop me, 3 officers in a car, check with their flashlights, and see I'm not a gangbanger and leave me alone. They go off to stop the next possible gang vehicle off to do a drive-by.

motegaze

"Hire george zimmerman? Shooting innocent children with candy in their pockets is the problem, not the solution! Too many guns means they can shoot back you know."

Just a real stupid comment. What does "Too many guns mean they can shoot back you know" mean? I understand you thought you were being witty dragging Zimmerman and candy into this, but you're not. Are you suggesting there are too many guns on the streets or too many guns in the hands of the law abiding citizens?

You know, if take the guns away from the law abiding citizens, the gang bangers, other criminals and the police, which there is a serious lack of on the west side, will be the only ones left holding them.

Do you think the police are in a position to stop these thugs? The police say they are, but the truth is they aren't and the gang bangers know it.

May Heaven's family find peace somehow and the triggermen found and put away.

Our systems are based in competition and greed creates violence amongst ourselves and poverty. How can we expect anything less than lack of respect with life? Early in the morning it was news on Sierra and now on Heaven. Is this really the World and reality we wish to create?

Everytime something in a community happens, alot of people go straight political. This has nothing to do with the left or the right on the immediate surface. This is a simple situation of a growing problem of criminal activity in america. The court system is bogged down with loopholes as is all other forms of government. You receive less time for killing someone than having a bag of drugs in your hand. Things have to be reset and place upright. It is not a black thing or white. We need to hold others accountable for what they do. Not judge them for who we may think they are.

Everything else aside - it's the perp's fault - individually - any hour of the day or night.

ashleyaddams, being in your pool (probably in your backyard) at night is a far cry from selling candy on the street after 10 p.m. Yes, I can go outside anytime I want, but common sense tells me not to hang around outside after dark if there's no need. I live in a relatively safe neighborhood, but I don't invite trouble.

Poor young girl. Makes no difference what time it was when she was shot. I've read stories where children - and adults - were shot through the walls while they were in bed sleeping.

Hey Rahm, I have a solution for you, because it looks like your strick gun control laws aren't working......this is a sure fire fixer for ya , free of charge. Instead of restricting guns you need to BAN ALL PEOPLE from being anywhere within the Chicago city limits any time of the day and night, that way there will be no more people killed by guns in Chicago - problem solved. This'll work better than any other stupid law regarding guns you can come up with.

It's summer vacation. I know in our neighborhood (which is in a little mostly american/russian community), kids are usually playing in the cul-de-sacs until about 10pm The streets are well lit and the neighborhood is mostly safe.

I feel bad for the woman and the girl. Sounded like they were actually trying to do something good for their neighborhood and be social.

Making guns easier for gangs to get won't do much good will it? But if law enforcement have more powers, they can clear out these gangs. Or what, are we going to make the mother into a murderer as well?

How can it get this bad, really? drugs, guns, and violence ruling entire neighborhoods. Where the hell are the cops? --Japan by the way has powerful law enforcement and almost no organized crime. People can't carry guns everywhere and they feel perfectly safe day or night in most places. They don't put up with cowboy crap either.

out after 10 selling candy in a violent neighborhood makes no sense

It makes perfect sense in a "free" country.

It doesn't make sense in Chicago- which is where this happened. Free country or not- just the same as a rape victim isn't responsible for being assaulted but they are responsible for being in the situation. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

Makes no difference what time it was when she was shot. I've read stories where children - and adults - were shot through the walls while they were in bed sleeping.

This is true- however these are not anywhere near as frequent as other shootings.

Everything else aside - it's the perp's fault - individually - any hour of the day or night.

You are correct. This is entirely the shooters fault.

Different discussion- whether it is intelligent to have a 7 year old out at 10 something at night, on the street, in Chicago.

I also think it is really dumb to drag zimmerman into this. that's why I said what I did--because someone wanted to hire zimmerman for that neighbourhood. I disagree with the reasoning behind it.

On the other hand, both incidents involve guns in the hands of the wrong people resulting in tragedy. Whatever the underlying social cause, the gang members were to blame for the girl's death. They and those like them need to be brought to justice.

Ashleyadams, it has been in the 70s all week in Chicago. Last night it was not all that hot that you could not be just fine with a fan. So your it's too hot to stay inside is BS. It's hotter than hell today but it has been quite mild the last few days.

Yes it's an antiquated thought and your thought is extremely heartless. Black people trying to earn a little honest money and you pissed about what time it was. As if to say "After dark, gangbangers own the streets." What's your next stupid thought? You gonna blame a 7 year old child for getting shot in the back and killed? That was the only decent, constructive thought to come out both sides of your mouth? You couldn't possibly blame the gangbanging animals who without provocation walked into the middle of the street and started indiscriminately shooting could you? What are you gonna next? Blame Heaven and her mother because of the neighborhood they live in? Why don't you blame that incompetent white Chicago Police Superintendent Garry McCarthy? I'm very very familiar with McCarthy. You know why? Because he was the so called Newark Police Director where I live before he ran off to Chicago to also ruin that city. He told us the same lies that he's now telling Chicagoans. And every weekend while he lived in New York City, Newark was turned into a shooting gallery. No solutions and plenty of unsolved murders. Then when the heat got too hot, he ran off to Chicago leaving behind what is presently the 23rd most dangerous city in America to live in. Where are the cops in Chicago? All that so called intel yet all those people shot to death and it's not even July yet in the Windy City. While you white folks love to turn your head and blame Black folks for everything, this problem is not just confined to Newark and Chicago. Detroit, Baltimore, Miami, Los Angeles, Oakland, New York City all have the same problem in their Black neighborhoods. Dwindling police presence in direct correlation to a skyrocketing increase in crime.

I don't think they meant "candy." I think they meant "CANDY." Nawmean?

This is my main problem with White folks. Not all but definitely more than some. Seven year old Heaven is shot to death in her back and right away it's "Why was the child outside at that time of night?" Uh, school is out and her mother was there and they were trying to earn a little extra money. Yet, these racists have nothing better to do than to blame this innocent 7 year old girl for her own murder. The racists who come on this forum contribute nothing every day but their hatred of Black people. And those white people who claim not to be racists, are even worse than the overt racists because they keep their happy mouths shut rather than speaking up. If this was 7 year old Johnny shut to death at the same time of day and one of us Black folks came on here and asked "Why was he out?" etc., we would be vilified and our comment blocked. Why are racist comments not blocked on here? Why aren't white folks on here demanding that Heaven's murderer be bought to justice? For the residents of that neighborhood, this Black man don't wanna hear $$$$ about you being scared to snitch. The streets always talk meaning everybody by now knows who pulled the trigger and fired the shot that killed 7 year old Heaven. Instead of us Black folks counting on white people and Black politicians on the take to clean up our own neighborhoods, it's time for hardworking, lawabiding Black folks to take back our own neighborhoods and run the gangs and the crime out of them. We can't count on Obama, Black politicians or any silver tongued preacher to save us. We damn sure can't count on white folks to help us. We have to do it ourselves UNLESS we're perfectly all right with 7 year olds being shot to death in our neighborhoods on the regular. Either you're part of the solution or you are the problem. Time for Black people living in these neighborhoods to pick a side. Everybody has forsaken us: white folks, Black folks with money, white media, politicians of every stripe. Either we better start doing for ourselves or gangs will take over and start charging residents taxes just to live in their own neighborhoods.

mortgaze,

I agree there are too many weapons in the hands of ther wrong people, however, more gun laws is not the answer. Criminals do not typically go out and purchase firearms legally. At least there is a way to track firearms bought legally and to hold the owners of those firearms responsible for crimes committed if they are used during a crime.

Japan does have a formidable police force, but they do have organized crime too. The Yakuza, for example. The Japanese seem to hold their own in higher regard than, unfortunately, alot of Americans do. They seem to respect the lives of their neighbors as they do their own families. They are trditional, almost ritualist people. Even entering the home and removing your shoes is a sign of respect. Here we have way too many people who rather $hit where they live, than live peacefully among the rest. It's a real shame the innocent, all too often, become the victims for this kind of ilk.

Just remember... It is always better to have a firearm and not need to use it, than to not have a firearm when you need to use it.

How sad!!!! The fastest growing industry in the state of Illinois is PRISONS, most of which are used to hold those thugs from Chicago and surrounding counties. Another horrible example of the misguided direction of our once great nation and society, again How sad!!!

This is HORRIBLE!!! Why can't these idiots with guns just shoot each other and leave the innocent alone? Instead of thinking WHEN I grow up, these kids are living with IF I grow up!!! My sincere condolences to her family and friends.....

My first thought like many... She should have been in the house at that time. But why are we being forced to hide indoors. We must stop this violence. I am sure the mother regrets keeping her child out late but we do not want to live in a society feeling like prisoners. My condolence to the mother. No parent should suffer losing a child to filth of the streets.

Champ,

I agree that the morons who can't see past the "why was she out so late?" BS. It doesn't matter what time of the day or night the gangsters decide to go out and murder. If they want to kill at noon they would have done it then too. They have no regard for another human life.

And for all of the other heartless people who ask why the mother allowed this "poor judgement" (their words, not mine) to happen, they're just wanabee parents' of the year. And I'm sure and practically guarantee if little "white" Johnny was murdered, they'd still be looking down their noses and try to blame Johnny and mommy too, just to make themselves appear superior in some way.

But it does make me wonder why you assume they are all white and racist. You're angry rant, however sense most of it makes, only paints you as another biggot who blames everything on whitey. I'm sorry, but that's how it reads.

People are right in that you should be allowed to be in your neighborhood whenever you want without fear. But, this mother knew to be fearful, she even admitted how bad her neighborhood was. This doesnt make it her fault, but she was dumb to let the kid out that late. Its like taking your kid to a NAMBLA meeting, then being suprised they were rapped. Again, it is the gangs fault, but the mom was stupid for what she did.

And it would be impossible to make being together and wearing "colors" a crime due to the whole first amendment thing and freedom of assembly. IDK the solution, but more needs to be done so that children can be out at 10:45 if they want. I did when I was younger, but I grew up in one of the safest neighborhoods in California. When I visited family in a bad area, we never went out past dark, and that's pretty @!$%#ty.

It's funny that I read through all the comments up to yours and didn't read anything even remotely linked to race being an issue in the questions about why the child was out so late. It is irrelevant. It is people like you that continue crying racism. Not a word was mentioned about race in the comments I read. They mentioned a child, a mother, gang related violence, rough neighborhoods, temperature and things of this nature. The most racist group of people seem to be the people crying 'racism'.

Get over yourself and the feeling that anyone owes you anything. I'm not saying racism doesn't exist. What I'm saying is use your intelligence to see outside of your own skin color. I don't care if you are black, brown, yellow, pink, or polka dotted. Violence begets violence. Ignorance begets ignorance. Are you racist because hundreds of years ago people with black skin were forced into slavery and the country took far too long to get past that? Well if that is the case, Chinese people were forced into slavery too. You don't hear Chinese people crying racism whenever something happens that is not in their favor. Jews were forced to live in concentration camps or shot in the middle of the street just because of their religion. I haven't heard of a Jew crying religious persecution because something didn't go the way they wanted.

There was less of this nonsense in previous decades because family issues were generally handled within the family. There was an order to everything. People knew their neighbors. Drugs were not sold on every street corner, and in many cases, hadn't even created yet. Sadly, we don't live in those times anymore.

Regardless of someone's skin color, things need to change in this country. You, sir, are not helping by spewing your racism venom. Children should not have to die. People should not have to live in fear.

Rest in Peace and sing with the angels, little one. My prayers go out to her family and all that love her.

Champ if it was a white kid out that late they would also be screaming bad parents, I've seen it all the time, it's always so easy for some of these people to be the parents of other people's kids. Something has got to be done in Chicago, twenty kids killed and it's only half of the year? This is the saddest story I've read in awhile but they have got to do something, not just there but everywhere, they shouldn't be cutting down on cops at all.

And the carnage continues....and what is Mayor Rahm Emanuel busy doing ???....Why he's busy doing most important job of decriminalizing Marijuana.....way to go Rahm......First, institute Stop & Frisk, like in NYC....the Feds haven't Sued NYC to stop that Tactic, so safe to say they won't bother you in Ch!tcago.....

Oh wait....isn't that home to Jesse Jackson,Sr & Jr. ???....They might not like that.

White, latina, black, or mixed (as I am), whatever, no child should be out that late. Especially to sell candy to other young poor children at that hour (now the risk is increased.) Also, it gets dark at 9, not 10, in the summer as someone noted above. Sometimes it might still be a bit dusky around 930. Notably, gang problems persist mainly at night. I'm just putting it together. And children should be going to bed before 11 o'clock-especially seven year olds. Curfews are mandated for under 18 crowd at 10/11 on weekdays/weekends in Pittsburgh. Does that mean it is always followed? No. It doesn't stop gang violence, but we also don't have nearly as many young children dying.

Because another point is made does not also negate the tragedy of the situation. We can also talk about what happened, the circumstances, and how we can be smarter in the future.

Why can't Chicago once and for all come up with it's own Mayor Gulioni, regardless of political affiliation. This needs to stop NOW and the people wanting to make it into a racial and/or political issue just flat don't get it!!!!

This issue is all about politics. Chicago, due to a far left influence, has the toughest gun laws in the country. This has had the effect of making many innocent people victims because they aren't allowed to protect themselves. It was recently noted that Chicago has a higher murder rate than Kabul, Afghanistan. The answer is to reverse the overly harsh gun laws and make some that use some common sense. Allow the people to arm themselves in order to protect themselves. I'm not advocating that they just give anyone who wants one a permit, but law-abiding citizens should be allowed to protect themselves when the police obviously can't. It's a simple matter really. It's nothing more than proof that when guns are made illegal, nobody but the cops and criminals will have them. Hell, when the cops confiscate one and there's not a body on it, give it away to legitimate citizens to protect themselves. You arm these citizens and I would be willing to wager anything you wish that the murder rate would drop within a couple of weeks.

First off, I can't imagine anything worse as a parent. Nothing can undo that. My heart goes out to the woman.

Second, I agree on the issue of being out so late with the child. Yes, one SHOULD be able to be out as late as they want and walk safely with their kids. SHOULD being the key word, but the facts are we aren't safe to do that. But then you add some factors in and then it seems, at the very least, irresponsible to be out there. Knowing that it is a violent neighborhood and knowing that criminals operate when they feel they have the most advantage over being seen/caught one would think night time would be the most dangerous time to be out and, guess what? It is. Well-intentioned as this mother may have been it's like she turned a blind eye to all common logic. I know I sure as heck wouldn't be on the street at night in any neighborhood known for gang violence of any sort. Gangs have no ethical code, no morals and certainly don't care who gets hurt. How many kids shot before this incident already proved that point?

And the other part I don't understand about these incidents is... why stay in a neighborhood like that? There are SAFE, affordable houses outside places like this. Why stay? If you're in a neighborhood like that and have children, here's some advice: move out.

Again, I really sympathize with the mother here. I can't imagine a greater loss.

I have to agree and comment on two things as well. First I had to reread multiple times the hour in which that poor girl was outside. It wasn't a safe neighborhood to begin with and a 7 year old playing outside in the dark so late is just a recipe for disaster. Maybe if this where a perfect world our kids could be out playing at all hours of the day but it's not. Second, Chicago has been in the news lately with multiple murders and problems with cowardly gangs. Shooting kids in the back? Yeah that take a real 'man' to do that. There needs to be some serious steps taken to make the area safe again and some of these steps need to be very very harsh. Gangs need to be taken down and stomped to the ground. Easier said then done I'm sure but I like most people are getting sick of seeing Chicago in the news for however many murders happened that week.

My sympathies to the mother, I can't imagine a greater loss or guilt that she must be going through.

Lay off the anti-gun control platform will you? If you think about the situation for more than 2 seconds you will realize it makes no sense. Even if everyone on that block were packing heat, those f***ing punk-a$$, little cowards made a surprise attack and ran away like the little b!tches they are.

When someone is arbitrarily shot it doesn't leave much time for defense.

My sympathies to the family of the young girl. Very sad. I want to say that commenting on the fact that the girl was out at that late hour doesn't make a person a racist--it just means that different people have different views on child rearing. We know there's a lot of racists out there but we also know that a lot of blacks who see racism in everything instead of seeing it from the other race's point-of-view. Someone said that no one can be relied upon to help these communities that are suffering from gang problems. I'm afraid that's true. The locals will have to find someway to take their streets back. It may not be pretty, or legal, but I don't know of any other way.

I grew up in the 70s and we stayed out til later than that catching lightening bugs etc BUT it was safe. I doubt any time of day is safe there.

As to the plan to relocate the "good" people gangs often spread because parents relocate to get their kids away from gangs not realising they are carrying the contagion with them. I know speaking of gang membership as if it were a disease seems odd but to me this sort of anti-social self destructive behavior is a form of transmittable mental illness.

The tirades against being out after 10pm is shameful. I have allowed my children out past 10pm, it's not typical but there is sometimes you can't be stuffed up in a house that says 96 degrees on i'ts thermostat. I have always taken kids to the store with me when I have had no one to watch them after 10pm because I have had to get something for the next days dinner I was cooking that night or one of the kids is sick and needs medicines. I use to work graveyard. During the summer around here the humidity is high. I wasn't able to sleep at night because of my body use to working graveyard and the heat. I would load my daughter up in the stroller in her light pjs and i would wear boxers and a tanktop. We would walk around the neighborhoods just taking in everything. Safest idea, no. By the time we got home my the kiddo was fast asleep and the house felt much cooler and I had burned off some of the energy I was typically use to burning off during work.

Everyone looks to blame someone else for the criminals actions. It was the two morons faults the kid got shot.Period. The mother didn't pull the gun, the child didn't cause her own demise, seriously stop trying to say it was anyone elses fault but the idiots that decided to assert their masculinity with a gun.

It's time to declare cities like Chicago, Detriot, Miami and New Orleans war zones and put them under martial law

...send in the troops to clean things up and restore order

I agree here...but what I don't understand is if this kind of gang warfare is a result of poverty...how do they get those guns?? and it doesn't seem like they are robbing people and getting money because they need money if they are poor...they just shoot people. How does that make things better? When I read things like this I think of Escape from New York.

Poverty means you can't pay for things like social events and other things that make you feel like you contribute to society. Guns are cheap (or free, if you know the "right" people), and using them on people definitely makes society notice. Kinda like kids acting out when they want the attention of their parents, whether that attention is good or bad.

Sorry but I don't buy poverty pushing you into gangs. I grew up in the projects in the late 50's and we found other things to do, of course our parents were more involved in our lives. These parents don't even know where their kids are at most of the time. It's always blame everyone but themselves.

"I know that gang warfare is usually a product of poverty"

No it's not. Being in a gang has nothing to do with poverty and everything to do with being a p3$$y.

Chicago has turned into the killing fields since that community organizer left town.

Product of poverty? Oh yeah, that's right, I always hear about gang warfare in Appalachia. Wise up already.

Gang membership is rooted in the break down of the family and community. The vast majority of young men in gangs have grown up with NO fathers in the home. They crave community and family and attempt to recreate it through the gang.

From and evolutionary psychological perspective they are also carving out territories and attempting to accumulate wealth to keep and attract females. They feel they can not compete for females by legal means (i.e.; education, work ect) so they resort to the quick methods of robbery, drug sales and extortion. They quickly come into confrontations with rival groups and are forced to defend their positions, territory and reputations with violence to maintain status. Lower status means less access to females, higher status more access. This is why seemingly minor incidents can lead to violent confrontations. The need to defend status against "dissing" or being disrespected is paramount to maintain your street credibility and again allow access to females. It has nothing to do with poverty and everything to do with impulse control, a society that glorifies gang violence as away to move forward and the serious lack of positive male role models in these neighborhoods.

This issue will never be solved by police action, legislated laws or increased spending. Only the community can end this by encouraging men to be Fathers to their sons and stop making children they have no intention of raising. The media needs o stop glorifying the gang lifestyle in music and movies and begin showing the realities of this lifestyle. Maybe then the tide will turn and this culture of death will begin to turn around.

This sort of thing has absolutely nothing to do with poverty,cries for help or attempting to alert the world to the social injustices they are living with! All that sort of misconcieved notion does is empower these jerkoffs with one more excuse to explain away their choice to live a life of violent deviance at the expense of the common wellfare and saftey of everybody else who live normal and responsible lives. We have glorified and romanticized this sort of behavior from music to media as if they are some modern day Robinhoods fighting for their lives under the "injust yoke of the man" for being imprisoned in these communities by some social and financial injustice they have no control over... when in fact they could walk away from it anytime they want...this is America. No one is holding a gun to their heads forcing them to stay in those streets. They are holding their own guns to their heads... playing the victims while all the while they are the aggressors and are because they chose to be! They enjoy that life,they aspire to it. They've intentionally created a system no different from the archaic design of middle age Asian,and modern day African warlords,who use intimidation,violence and murder to control the population of their chosen area with fear while they rape and pillage at will. And you want to give them some politically correct soppy eyed accountability for being the murderous pieces of sh!!t they have willingly chosen to be! And people wonder why we can't do anything about all this other than to impose all out martial law and a South African style "shoot first ask questions later" mentality.

Tim, I absolutely love your post! Very well said!

It's time to declare cities like Chicago, Detriot, Miami and New Orleans war zones and put them under martial law

...send in the troops to clean things up and restore order

There's no money for that. People prefer tax cuts.

I'm not so sure that absence of father figures is the problem. Maybe they have abusive fathers/parents, or maybe their fathers are in jail. I think the biggest problem is finding out how to give good education to these kids while keeping them away from drugs and having parents cooperate with educators instead of being douchebags all the time. There is no simple answer, but there is a lot of work that needs to be done here.

Just a couple of quotes to ponder:

"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it." Albert Einstein

"We must be the change we wish to see in the world" Mahatma Gandhi

This one's for you, William: "When people who are honestly mistaken learn the truth they eill either cease being mistaken or cease being honest." It's not for you to judge these people. A beautiful little child is dead. That's what matters, not your (un)feelngs. BTW, snarky doesn't cut it.

Amen, Tim Cropley!

Ben I agree with you that something else is wrong here. I personally think the problem is the lack of jobs. A lot of these teens and young adults who are gang members would actually work if they could find a decent job. When we ship all our manufacturing jobs overseas and only leave low paying service jobs for young people then we are going to have a lot of problems.

Look at the last time crime was extremely high, the late 80's and early 90's. We had the same jobs problem. When the economy improved in the mid 90's crime fell like a rock.

I saw a story about a business in chicago that was opening and hiring abound 200 people. They had lines of applicants for blocks trying to get hired on. They finally had to stop taking applications because so many people showed up.

We have to bring back blue collar manufacturing jobs that built our middle class. If we don't we are doomed to become a third world country,.

So, Tim C, what you are saying is that this is all the FEMALES fault. Brilliant.

Yes, that was a tongue in cheek comment but there is a basis of truth in it as well.

Tim Cropley, dead spot on. Brilliantly put.

they are also carving out territories and attempting to accumulate wealth to keep and attract females.... They quickly come into confrontations with rival groups and are forced to defend their positions, territory and reputations with violence to maintain status. Lower status means less access to females, higher status more access.

....sounds a lot like someone describing the behavior of apes in the wild...

Like monkees? People sometimes refer to African Americans as 'monkees' in a racist manner. Perhaps the apes are more like humans than we would like to admit.

motegaze, as far as psychological counselors go, a father that is incarcerated or a father on drugs also are considered the same as an absentee father, because the reference is to the image.

sam adams

It's time to declare cities like Chicago, Detriot, Miami and New Orleans war zones and put them under martial law

...send in the troops to clean things up and restore order

There's no money for that. People prefer tax cuts.

hmmmm....that didn't seem to stop Bush when he was "Decider-In-Chief"

Like it or not, the academic point of view is that all humans are apes. Though Charles Darwin started this, the '60's author, Desmond Morris, popularized this belief in the scientific community with his book The Naked Ape.

I'm sure you've spent a lot of time in third world countries analyzing the neighborhood dynamic. Nice uninformed statement.

Sam Adams , my tax's are just fine , if you want to pay more go right ahead no one is stopping you. BTW I'd be willing to bet you don't pay more then what you owe

robbopaloobop,

Hang on awhile longer. Martial law is definetley on its way.

Rest in peace, precious angel. You truly are home now. Having been to Chicago and lived in New York it gets very hot and humid, even at night. It's not at all unusual to see people out and about at night as a way to try and escape the heat. Her mother was with her, she wasn't neglected. May God pore out a spirit of healing, peace and forgiveness on everybody who's been effected by this tragedy.

Peace and God's blessings to all this day.

Thank you missy alot of people do NOT have air and after being hot all day the only real relief is at night I am from Jersey very few air conditioners unless you were wealthy

You would think tho..knowing you live in that kind of neighborhood, hot or not, AC or not, you would stay in your home. Selling candy at 10:45 at night, encourages the kids to still be outside.

Yes well air conditioners are not expensive anymore -- you can pick one up at the local rite aid or walmart. Of course, you must be working to both pay for it & the monthly bills. And yes, most certainly, inner-city parents must work muuuuuch harder in order to keep their kids safe from their own neighborhoods. It's the reality. You can blame whomever you want for the undrelying causes but today, tomorrow & the next day, it is the parents' sole responsiblity to keep their children safe from harm. I grew up in bklyn but not in the inner-city. Friends that grew up in poorer areas and got out, educated themselves & pursued careers ALL had super-vigilant, super-protective parents. Most of them were not allowed outdoors after sundown. Period. Good parenting makes all the difference in the lives on children. There is no public policy that can make-up for it. Rest in Peace, Heaven Sutton

I'm from the south side of chicago, born and raised in hyde park. And to all of you people making the "10:45" argument......shut up.

You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. This could have just as easily happened at any other time of the day. The majority of you sound like rural or suburban dwellers getting all of your 'information' from these articles. A child should feel safe to be in front of their home with their parents at any time. I have plenty of memories growing up in the city in midsummer, and if the adults were still out and didn't mind, you better believe us kids were out playing. And as rough of a neighborhood as it may have been, no one was cowering in any corners..Living in fear is no kind of way to live at all.

Just like others have said, it's possible they had no air inside. This is chicago we're talking about. It may be a scorcher this year, but it's very possible to live in chicago without A/C. It's warm(sometimes hot) only 3 months out of the year. Just as it's probable that they very much needed they money they were making from selling candy. The majority of you could never understand their circumstances, especially the particulars of poverty and desperation.

Please just keep your big mouths shut, and save your snobby ideas of parenting for someone who cares.

Unfortunately life is cheap in Chicago.

"What on earth was a 7 year old doing out "selling candy" at 10:45 PM? Do these people have any brains at all?"

I bet you cried every time you spilt milk too. So did you not have a brain then as well?

man people cant read who said the little girl was out at 1045 selling candy

man people cant read who said the little girl was out at 1045 selling candy

...the article says it. Read the first paragraph.

It doesn't matter what time the little girl was out. She does not deserve getting killed. Secondly, the girl was out with her mother and it is the summer. My son and I go out all the time after 10pm. I don't think we should be shot. Wow you are a real peice of work!

I'm on unemployment and can afford my AC (and the rest of my bills) just fine. Stop blowing your bill money on scratch off tickets and booze and put your kids to bed at a decent hour.

Lol@ the people saying it's too late for her to be out... So it's ok to go out shooting randomly after a certain time of night? Maybe if you couldn't get a gun for a pack of smokes in your country a few (thousand) people would be able to live their lives out.

Bilbo- you are right; who says she was selling candy; I mean who buys candy at 10:45 PM.Her and her mother were probably runnin' from the drug supplier they just ripped off.

it's 10:45 pm in the ghetto:

momma be sellin' crack

babies be sellin' candy

nobody be sleepin'

I'm appalled by some of the comments here and the lack of concern I see here for a 7 yr old. Even IF (and that's a big if) the mother was buying drugs, that is no justification for shooting a 7 yr old. I see no reason not to believe the mother. As for the child being out so late, while I don't recall ever having my children outside after 10pm, I couldn't swear that it never happened, and what if it did? The problem is not with this praticular mother and her parenting skills. The problem is the parenting skills of the parents who raised the hoodlums with the guns. Nor is this just a black problem, nor a problem just in the inner cities. The general lack of respect of and caring about others is a problem that this whole country is facing. Our young people have been raised to be narcissitic. This was illustrated very well by the recent events Karen Klein endured. We as a nation need to rein our youth in and teach them manners once more. As it stands now, the parents that do teach this to their children are putting their children at a disadvantage when we turn them loose on the streets. The bullies will walk all over them, or worse yet kill them with no remorse.

There are no ratings in black on black violence. As far as they're concerned a black life only has (political) value when killed by a white person.

You are right skup. Sickening isn't it. No photo ops for black on black violence. not sexy enough

You mean this is just a black on black killing?
Why bother reading it then?

@Honest Abe Lincoln

It's people like you who keeps making sure al and jesse stays relevant.

The difference is that the police are actually investigating this little girl's murder. If the cops decide that they don't want to arrest this girl's killer, Sharpton and Jackson and the rest of the black community would be protesting in the streets.

They will be burdened by caseloads and this will go unsettled as it always does in black violence. Yes, there needed to be outrage over Martin's case, but there needs to be some d*mn outrage over this gang violence BS.

Let's also not forget the snitches get killed too for even saying anything. The culture is just poisonous. Even in the rougher schools I teach in, if I write up a kid for hitting another kid or a guy touching a girl when she says no, I get told that I am snitching. That. Needs to stop.

Apparently most of the commentors have never lived in a city with a heavy gang presence. Community watch organizations are hard to keep active since that is the last thing a gang would want going on while they are trying to sell drugs on their turf. Many times, if a person, church, or other organization gets too involved in cleaning up their own neighborhood, they are intimidated and threatened by the gangs. The police won't even patrol gang infested neighborhoods on a regular basis due to the same fact.

problem is - the same familes trying to escape the violence inadvertently bring it with them to other neighborhoods (those doing the violence are someone's kids)

education, jobs and a respect for other people and their belongings is what is needed; not prayer vigils, candle and teddy bear altars, preaching against violence (but only media covereage ones, then they get their preacher face on the news too, sad how they all disappear after that 10 second tv spot)

and stop talking about 'stopping the black-on-black crimes' - - - - - just stop the crime!

Extremely poor people who only have extremely poor family members can't just pack up and move. I understand your point but I grew up in extreme poverty and I know first hand how your options are very limited when you have absolutely no money. Remember hurricane katrina and all the poeple who were on roof tops. People wondered why didn' they leave?. Most of them were so poor they couldn't leave. It just wasn't an option.

You all stop pickin at the momma. She was just trying to supplement her welfare check and food stamps by sellin some candy and it was probably one of her kids daddies down the street doin the shooting. When obami is re elected and raises welfare and food stamps then she can afford to be gettin some ac and the rest of her kids wont be out on the streets.

Yeah. Keepin' it classy, I see. Yeah the "act out your stereotype" crap was a LOT more popular on the Fox News anonymous comments section before that got shut down. Please return to a Right Wing blog of choice for any future postings. K, thanks.

Why are you blaming the victim?

Remember parents, enforce bedtime, it keeps your kids from being killed by random street violence! No bedtime means you're killing your kids!

Not true MSpielman. About 14 months or so ago we had a 9 year old girl shot in the head and killed in her bed as she slept when a stray bullet from a drug deal gone bad in the alley behind her house penetrated the wall of her bedroom. That is just the facts of the drug war. Collateral damage always results from unlimited warfare and make no mistake about it the cartels are going to fight over every inch of turf there is in this country at the same time that they are going to fight law enforcement. This is alcohol prohibition all over again except that the heads of the snakes reside outside our borders making it that much harder for us to put them out of business and take them down.

Now I live on the Ohio river so this is not some lawless border town. I have been told that most of our hard drugs are now coming in from Canada since it is closer and cheaper to import via that route. Also the Mexican border is pretty tightly patrolled. It is also becoming increasingly popular to smuggle in via the East and West coastline from ships off loading onto fast runner boats in the dark of night. Lately they have recovered tons of marijuana dumped in the Pacific that I suspect were supposed to be picked up by these boats but they realized that they were being watched so they just radioed to the supply ship to dump it. Cannabis is a high profit low cost commodity so they can afford to lose tons of it now and again.

Realize it or not but we are in the middle of a perfect storm when it comes to our national welfare. Our economy is in the trash thanks to our governmental mismanagement and wasteful unnecessary wars. Our employment numbers are in the pits leaving thousands of families struggling just to put food on the table. Our drug war is making drug trafficking very profitable and almost worth the risk. Also prostitution is becoming a viable option for single moms trying to feed their kids. We have more homeless people now than any other time I can remember in my lifetime. So what else do you expect to happen? People turn to crime who would never think of it otherwise because they really have no other choice but to die.

When very difficult times struck in the distant past there is some evidence to indicate that the Anasazi Indians may have resorted to cannibalism. Frankly we are quite a way from that but it could eventually come to that if things get desperate enough. People instinctively do what they have to in order to survive. When they are pushed to the wall they become desperate and then very unpredictable so you can expect just about anything from them and the power brokers seem to be blissfully unaware of just how bad things are becoming in parts of America.

If you want peace and tranquility then you have to make sure that everyone has a piece of prosperity in their pockets because without that they have nothing to lose and everything to gain by just taking what they need by what ever means they can. Legalize, control, tax, and regulate and the violence goes away. We have done so with gambling and alcohol so the drug and prostitution issues are all that remains. Now that we are about broke the time has come to quit jousting at those windmills too. LOL

shepardo, you make some excellent points but I disagree that our government (democrats & republicans alike) is to blame for our econonmy being in the pits. It's our system, the capitalist system that is to blame. You have corporations, like the one i work for, outsourcing like crazy. We used to have over 40,000 workers in california but now we have less than half that. Do you know where my company is hiring? Not even India anymore. They now have employees in the phillipines, canada, egypt, columbia, etc. doing the work that U.S.A. citizens used to do. The only way that our government could help is if they would tax the hell out of corporations outsourcing so that it would cost less to hire U.S. citizens. But then some might say that that wouldn't actually be capitalism... We're headed for third world status and I don't know what's going to get us out of there. Thank the ceo's and businessmen of the U.S.A. for that.

JoeCal I see your point and to a certain extent I agree with you. However you must remember that our government was responsibile for creating the environment that made it possible for our "system" of runaway capitalism to get away with it. They were the ones who enacted the deregulations and they were the ones who signed the Free Trade Agreements without any protections in them to prevent a mass exodus of American jobs. In effect they became turn coats and sold out to the money men and treasonously enacted legislation that totally favored the goals and ambitions of these representatives of the military/industrial complex that we keep hearing about. We were warned long ago but we didn't listen. So to be perfectly honest we have gotten just what we deserved. We are to blame really and have been the architects of our own destruction thanks to our complacency and lack of attention to details politically. Sigh...

However you must remember that our government was responsibile for creating the environment that made it possible for our "system" of runaway capitalism to get away with it

There isn't really a fix now either.

In effect they became turn coats and sold out to the money men and treasonously enacted legislation that totally favored the goals and ambitions of these representatives of the military/industrial complex that we keep hearing about.

I wouldn't necessarily say it was the military/industrial complex, it's business. The agreements and such they were paid off to pass have just opened up a global business market. The only way to ensure total fairness at this point in time is to have the same rules no matter where they go- which would require, at the least, a global business law, and likely a global government to regulate them.

A business doesn't care about people, they care about the money. The only way to ensure they don't relocate for cheaper labor while keeping their prices high, is to ensure there is nowhere for them to go that they don't have the same laws dictating their conduct.

Shepardo, that is true but in my opinion it was bound to happen anyways due to human nature, the nature of the beast called capitalism, and specifically to corporate greed. The government could have stopped it but they didn't and I don't know if they ever will. And since there's a lot more people in the world today than there was back in the 60s when I was a kid then relatively, the pie has gotten smaller. There's just no way that everyone can get a piece of the pie, there's simply not enough to go around. We're headed for chaos. It's not a question of if, just of when. Like my father used to say, what goes up must come down.

Zanilth personally I believe that there was a 'fix' that needed to be implemented before we began trying to play humanitarian for the rest of the globe. Ross Perot warned us about runaway capitalism and tried to tell us how to deal with it but we failed to listen. A number of respected economists have pointed out that neither unrestrained capitalism nor unrestrained socialism will function entirely on their own. Strong government requires a balance of the two concepts.

Also when I refer to the military/industrial complex that includes business by definition. Neither can exist without business and financial management. What you seem to be refering to is a "one world government" or what some call the New World Order. That is, to me, a naive notion that will never really come to pass on this planet as long as we are divided into factions called nations. No one will ever simply cede their control and power to a higher authority without a fight. I don't think we need another world war unless you are talking about Armageddon. LOL

JoeCal yes you are right about our population actually working against us. That is why I am utterly amazed at those who oppose all measures aimed and any kind of population control and regulation. While I don't agree with those countries who practice late term abortions and infanticide I see nothing wrong with prevention and early term abortion in certain circumstances. If you look at the history of our species we, like many other wild creatures, live relatively peaceful existences until our tribe or group encounters others from another tribe or group. Then there will invariably be conflict and competition for resources. So our real enemy here is our own success as a species.

Therefore it only makes sense that we use the intelligence that we have evolved and start using the tools and technology that we have been given to manage our population world wide. We are running out of food sources, running out of clean air and water, running out of energy sources, and in some cases just plain running out of space. So in that regard you are quite right. We are indeed headed for chaos and ultimately our own self destruction unless we start using our heads and using the knowledge that we have attained. We tend to be very contradictory creatures. On the one hand we develop great things scientifically then on the other hand we believe in fairies and do totally stupid things in our societies while often totally ignoring the science and technology. Go figure!

Daley's Chicago.........Rahm will hopefully fix things

Was crime this bad when Obama was still in Chicago and not in the White House?

Really Beth? Here's what Rahm thinks is a good idea:

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/06/27/12423957-chicago-police-to-partner-with-anti-violence-group-ceasefire-to-curb-shootings?pc=25&sp=25#discussion_nav

And to think WilliamOfRites's comment was removed for predicting the kind of posts like yours.

I guess being correct is a punishable offense by the political right.

mathuin - What does Obama has to do with this story? Everytime something bad happens people always bring up Obama.

This is a sad story. I grew up on the West Side of Chicago and I have to admit, the violence get worst throughout the years. More children are being raised by single parents who don't have time or the knowledge to teach their children right from wrong.

When I had my first son, I moved to the suburbs. There is no way I would be in that city at night. Its a shame that I won't walk the same streets I did as a teenager.

Since she was out with her mother, I can't blame them for thinking she would be somewhat safe, but who buy candy at 10:30pm?

Rahm couldn't fix diddley.
Obama left Chicago in a mess.

Pathetic thread.

No jobs=poverty=crime.
Obama=no jobs=poverty=crime.

Pretty simple.

Obesity is already a problem, especially in the black community and with younger children. It is even more disappointing. =(

Too funny.
Wonder if she also sold cheese puffs.

"Obesity is already a problem, especially in the black community"

Yeah.........You know this because you're just a smart guy, right?

Now relax everybody. We are all together in the same country. All we need is more guns, lots more guns. Now, if the seven year old had been carrying her concealed 22 caliber semi-autormatic pistol, she could have defended herself thanks to the free classes offered to children by the NRA.

It is time to get serious. Virtually any adult, including felons, the insane, and serial child molesters can buy the gun of his or her choice at, or outside of, any gun show (these are called 'private sales'). Since folks do not want to pay taxes, we are getting rid of our prisons so it makes little sense for police to catch any evil doers. Since folks do not want to pay taxes, we are getting rid of our police, so there is nobody to catch evildoers. Since we can not, and will not, be able to protect our children, our kids need to be able to protect themselves. Certainly our 7 year olds need to be armed and trained to protect themselves.

I wonder if she was selling Skittles and wearing a hoodie.

There seems to be something inherently dangerous about late night candy runs.

Glen Scutt... I love the sarcasm, but please, you're only encouraging them.

Glen Scutt

Why dont you check the facts and see that areas with stricter gun laws have more mass shootings.

These gun shows are mostly fed regulated, and the ones that are not sell other combat and hunting items like coats, knives, vests, etc. They dont just sell guns to anyone.

People dont mind paying taxes, as long as it goes to beneficial things. Giving money to welfare leaches and other entitled people is not what we want our taxes going to. More tax is not the answer, smarter spending is. You really think this issue would be addressed if we increased taxes, and not just whatever either sides feels like spending that month for their friends?

Stop making it other peoples fault. Its the fault of the community and parents. They raise their children to be gang bangers. My step mom lived in a @!$%#ty neighborhood with her son (my stepbrother) for years, and he never joined a gang or did any crime. She was a single mother with no welfare making it on her own while doing everything she could to raise her son right. She is more tired than anyone else of people always blaming everything else. @!$%#ty parents raise @!$%#ty children, plain and simple.

post proof it was blacks killing blacks...

remy730

post proof it was blacks killing blacks...

I'll bet you next week's paycheck it was "blacks killing blacks"

Hey, this is right in Jesse's backyard.

Yo, remy730, just wait 24 hours and I suspect you'll have your proof. None too bright are you?

@Woody-1065787

Sounds like you care a whole lot too.......

Jesse & Al were buying their candy from a different dealer.

... and once again... if the police know who did it, but decide not to press any charges, yeah it would become a MUCH bigger deal, a la Trayvon Martin. As for blacks killing blacks, I take it you've never actually LISTENED to what Jesse or Al have said, since they regard that as a real problem, too. Both men have their faults, and do love attention (all politicians do), but that's just crap to say they only care when it's whites doing the shooting.

You have no sympathy for a 7 year old girl who has NO control over her circumstances. I bet you kick puppies, too.

And she wanted to get out of that neighborhood. I blame the mother.

"No sympathy for these people."

Understandable, as I couldn't care less if you took a bullet to the head too.

Your pointy hood is showing.

No sympathy, blame the mother....

How about blaming the scum shooting the gun?

Where was your god before this girl was shot? I guess he was too busy not helping starving children in Africa to not do anything.

In all seriousness, saving lives from violent crime is not God's MO; life and death is not a meaningful division to Him. You may be thinking of Batman.

Not Penny's Boat: awesome post!!!

MIKE, it is questionable isn't it.

Chicago is a hell hole as are many big cities. Move into the suburbs if you have any sense.

Any sense and a bunch of money. :|

yes...so bullets flying had nothing to do with it..??

Wow you are desensitized for sure. No matter if it was her or an adult or you on the street that night, the outcome would be the same. All gang members need to be hunted down and locked up or thrown in front of a bus. Too bad communities just did not have more balls to purge the losers from their neighbourhoods. If that was my kid some people would be dropping one by one.

Gang members are the main group supporting Obama.

@GrampaSImpson --- Correct sir! It's not about flying bullets. It's about lawless, uncivilized behavior. Bullets can not fly by themselves and spoons don not make people fat.

Bullets cant fly by themselves and spoons dont make people fat...... candy does.

Mark Taft

Gang members are the main group supporting Obama.

I thought it was illegal immigrants...

MARKTAFT, don't leave out "illegal aliens"

Cmon Grampa,

Chicago has the most restrictive gun laws in the country. What more do you want? None of these a$$holes is a legal gun owner. You have to have an FOID from the state police just to own one in IL and then Chicago makes it damn near impossible.

Yo Gramps, when they take all our guns only the bad guys will have them.
Is that what you want?

We already have gun laws and Chicago has the strictest of any U.S. city. It is also illegal to shoot people as well as being illegal to murder someone. Any reasonable person can deduce that the offenders are not concerned with the laws or this tragedy would not have happened. What you propose, then, amounts to more government control and regulation to penalize the law abiding citizens that clearly had nothing to do with this. This type of mentality is sadly all to common these days and is stripping the freedoms of the people while accomplishing nothing in regards to the problem that is supposedly being addressed.

People need to stop reasoning with knee-jerk emotional reactions and use a little logic while looking at the far reaching implications of any new legislation. This is a problem for both sides of the isle, the loss of freedoms under Bush starting but not ending with homeland security is only rivaled by the freedoms stripped by the current administration. Oh, and thanks for hijacking this thread and making it go there. May this poor child find the peace in heaven that these monsters would not allow her in life.

Grampa- Guns are not legal in Chicago at all, the have some of the strictest gun laws in the country. California also has strict gun laws- LA is a mess too. It would seem that the more gun control laws there are, the more gun violence there is. This is because law abiding people in "gun control" areas don't own guns, but the gangs do, illegally since they are so cheap easy to get.

WOW

Too many guns? De-evolutionary? Guns sometimes kill the wrong people? Spewing the 'gun' message doesn't change anything. Disarming the honest masses only makes it easier for the gang bangers.

ALL gang members should be seen as domestic terrorists.

damn right. that is a form of local terrorism . we should put a task force on them.

Yeah, I'm sure the shooter went to a licensed gun dealer, filled out the necessary paperwork, passed the background check, and had his weapon properly registered. Criminals are real sticklers for making sure their weapons are legal.

what does that have to do with treating gang members as terrorist? make it fair game for any terrorist task forces to detain arrest or kill due to gang affiliation.

@Rene278

Your sarcasm is still dripping off of my monitor!

goitalone wrote "It would seem that the more gun control laws there are, the more gun violence there is."

Then why are murder rates in general so much lower in countries with strict gun control? Did stricter gun control areas in the US come first, or AFTER there were already some out of control murder rates?

I'm a gun owner, but agree they are WAY to widely and easily available. The toughest part about putting up strong restrictions now is that for decades they have been cheap and widely available, so there are TONS on the street already.

State with the fewest gun laws = Vermont (you can carry a concealed pistol without any form of license).

State wih the fewest gun deaths = Vermont.

In Switzerland and Israel, virtually every home has a fully automatic weapon in the closet. They also have some of the lowest domestic gun violence rates in the industrialized world.

There's no correlation between gun availability, gun laws and gun violence. It's a societal factor.

How? Profiling? My guess is the perps look like they belong in that 'hood.

LOL. Funny. Cops refuse to go into this neighborhood.

ha cops dont stop @!$%#. they just show up after the fact and act like dicks to all that were there.

you are soo right. proud to have that badge! cant jump off their ego long enough to truly help some one

Jon, get real. If there were such a shooting on your street, especially at night, is it likely you would recognize the shooter, especially if you were throwing yourself on the ground to avoid being shot? And, if you knew the shooter, it is likely he would know you. If you reported him, you would be next on the gang hit list. Do you know what it is like to live in this kind of fear? Of course, the first question anyone from the outside asks is, "Why don't THEY do anything to help themselves?" I'm sure they would do something if only they knew what to do. Remember, too, there is a great deal of mistrust of the police in these neighborhoods. The resident of these communities have seen so much, way too much, of killings, beatings, etc. Please, everyone, have some compassion. This darling child was killed through absolutely no fault of her own. May she rest in peace.

Mary, any other excuses you would like to make absolving everyone of any personal responsibility. I refuse to live in fear and even if I did I would not sit by and allow it to consume my children without doing anything to try to change it and before some jackass puts it out there, no, I would not try to change it with an all night candy stand on the local gangs shooting range.

ive always felt the same way . people use they livie in the ghetto to be a reason to act like dumbasses. you dont like the way your housing project looks, get some tenants together and fix it. same with gangs , you dont like them being there, get a group together and do something. idol people solve nothing.

When re elected Obami will knock all the projects down and build the tenants new homes in the country and every neiborhood is going to have its own candy store.....and welfare office.

these cities did have ghetto areas, aka projects. they were knocked down and the occupants scattered. now they infest all areas, and along with a crummy job market are far worse off. you cant just build nice places and expect low income ghetto families to afford them. you cant expect low income housing and high income housing to co-exist (high income doesnt want to be around them, for obvious reasons).

the smart people leave, moving to better places before their kids grow up to be thugs. those who stay fall into the same behaviors. you need jobs and stuff to keep people busy, or gangs will thrive.

Problem is once you turn them in their buddies come looking for you and your family.

The community will never name names. Not going to happen. LIfe in the jungle continues as it always has.

The Point is this: a little girl is dead, a mother lost her child to ridiculous violence, the time of night, place where they live, or color of their skin has no bearing on the degree to which this is horific and will forever change a family's world. No more birthday's, kisses & hugs, dreams of a better future for an innocent child. Gun's are evil no matter what your perspective is, their deemed use is to control, harm, and procure power. People can not always leave where they live for numerous reasons, and how many of us have fabulous memories of being outside on a summer night long after our bedtimes or letting our own children stay up and hang with older kids/adults when not in school....It shows complete lack of compassion and humanity to point out deemed "flaws" of the parents. Violence proliferates all faucets of society that is where the problem lies, until it steps into your home nobody wants to help the "others".

nonomore: guns are not evil. people are evil.

You've never lived in a bad area, have you, OP? It's easy to sit on a computer and say 'name the shooters.' It's another to know perfectly well who the shooter is, and know that if you DO name the shooter, chances are you or other family members of yours will suffer the same fate as Heaven..only they'll make sure you're not just an innocent bystander.

Pick up the phone an leave an anonymous tip. The gangs aren't going to subpena everyone's phone records to find out who snitched.

Adam Chappelle

I find your admonition of me humorous considering you are using a photo from a fantasy land. You hear TV "factoids" on your favorite cop show and think every gang banger thug low life slug is a genius outsmarting the police at every step until they make that one little mistake.

Here's a little reality for you. Unless there is specific evidence leading to one particular individual that is found at a crime scene, video surveillance, DNA, etc., more often than not, the police don't "solve" a crime without information from people with knowledge. And while there is the occasional "retribution", it is few and far between. More often than not, tips are anonymous (as "noobster" pointed out) and only provide the police sufficient information to concentrate on building an evidential case against an individual.

As to whether I've lived in a "bad area" or not is immaterial. However, to sate your inquisitive and accusatory mind, is the East New York area (part of Kings County, that's Brooklyn to the uninitiated) sufficient? It's not quite as bad as it once was, but it's no walk in the park.

While I agree with the sentiment, there is that little thing called The Posse Comitatus Act.

I would prefer the troops get deployed along the borders, North as well as South.

But let's stop playing games with the dirtbags. Use a firearm in a crime, ANY crime, and it's a MANDATORY 10-15-20 or 25 year sentence served CONSECUTIVELY and not concurrently with any other sentence. NO time off for "good behavior" or any-other bleeding heart nonsense.

You left out no plea bargaining

wlee-950886 Sorry, my bad.

And NO PLEA BARGAINING!!

I kinda like Retired SFC's idea better....

XDm9mm, good idea, but first you would have to get rid of the God awful ACLU before any good could be done. I mean with the ACLU it is a crime to SPIT on a known terrorist for crying out loud. The ACLU is a bunch of terrorists.