First off, unless you're a Union worker for ConEd you have no idea what they are offering their employees. More than likely the offer is less than what they already get and are being told everyone needs to give up something while everyone of their bosses gets a big fat bonus every year.

Second I doubt you have even considered how hard it is to try to restrain someone half your age and the risk you take at 55 trying to save someone's house from burning down or life. These jobs are not for the old or out of shape like most of you that seem to think your couch is your best friend. If it was me and I was asked to save a million dollar home after being told I need to give up what I worked for I'd let your home burn and would probably throw a little gas on it to make sure it burned. Romney claims he shouldn't pay tax on his income because he makes it from risks he takes. What a joke!

I thank union workers all the time. They are the laziest untrained POS workers I have ever worked with. I get called constantly to come in and fix what these idiots screwed up. I have more work than I can handle because of their incompetence. Best thing I ever did was quit the union and start my own business. Now I get 3 times the money and still doing the same job on the same sites. I just come in after them to repair their mistakes instead of doing all the work while 10 lazy @!$%#s sit around and do nothing.

Give it a break. Trying to compare guys that fix power transformers to over-paid teachers in Wisconsin to what police and fireman do in the line of THEIR work is ludicrous. First responders are basically worth MORE to society, just like the military, than a bunch of whiny teachers and public workers who have benefit packages FAR better than the average private worker and rarely have to put their life on the line. THAT is why Walker won in Wisconsin. The ConEd union statement "we walk and the lights goes out" says it all. It'a about time the union get's the fact that taxpayers are not going to subsidize their paychecks any more via collective bargaining hostage tactics when they themselves are struggling to make a living, and you can take your "class-warfare-Robin Hood" BS somewhere else. As for the owners and stock-holders getting "fat" bonus's. Get your ass out and start your own business, hire thousands of workers, and then decide how much of YOUR money you want to spend on a renewable resource versus the people that make the machine work.

Tony Ballone, a union delegate, told Reuters the main issues were pensions, wages and health care. "They (ConEd) want to take everything we have fought for 50 years."

Yes, you fought for it for 50 years and now it has become unsustainable as the economy can't support your out of control demands. It is not someone elses' responsibility to pay for their own health care and pension and pay for yours too. Considering all that money you make, it shouldn't be that hard to set some aside for retirement like us in the private sector have been doing for years.

"We're the first responders, we come out in rain and snow, we keep the lights on. All we want is a fair contract," he said.

There are lots of people who are first responders, who are not Union members who do as good if not much better than you do, and for commensurate wages and bennies. You are not "that" special.

(BTW, sitting here on generator power for now the third day as the Friday storm that plowed through Ohio took out our power. Might get it back tonight, but I'm not holding my breath. We got out there and cleaned up the trees ourselves, except those tangled in wires, they are still sitting there. Not seen any of those 1st responders for the last 2 days. We will get by until they do, because we are used to taking care of ourselves. The point is, don't act like you are more than what you are.)

So many business have left the USA over the last 30 years

because unions got so greedy! I bet the electrical company can fill all of the postions and pay the people half of the unions members pay and the new workers would be very happy with their pay!

What are you smoking earthgirl? Unions are NOT the Christian way, let alone Obama or the Democrats. Christians don't unfairly (and greedily) take advantage of others, especially those less fortunate than them. So no, stop insulting real Christians, ESPECIALLY on a Sunday!

PYTHON is correct. maintenence schedules lessened, USED equipment brought in to replace old stuff.think duct tape and bubble gum. and 277v crossing phases is equivalent to 18 sticks of dynamite. get in there everyone. lets see what ya got.

All those anti union rants have no idea what they are talking about. I have said it before and I will say it again, without unions companies will take away all benefits and cut wages. It has already begun in states that have corporate Republican Governor's and other corporations. I have also heard the anti union and corporate puppets rant about union workers being over paid but have you ever thought that maybe your under paid. BTW, the average union worker earns $50,000 a years and if you think that is being paid to much then you definitely being under paid and you probably have no health care so you everyone else to come down to your level instead of bring you up to the union level. Eliminating unions will take us back to the living standards of the early 1900's which seems to be the corporate Republican agenda. Get real America, FORWARD not BACKWARD.

ConEd customers who can't afford dry ice by the ton, enjoy... Don't worry... Be happy... Be happy, now.

The Pubs will take good care of you. They promise (to trickle on you). Now act appreciative!

@ willowbrook: if you're not seeing the service you'd like, thank greed- possibly your own, if you're running a generator while your neighbors are courting heat stroke.

Thank some fat bastard making 8 figures who's decided "lean and mean" is the way to boost his own income, even if it means denying people what they pay for, and sometimes what they need to live.

When unions prevailed, the economy was robust, the velocity of money was high, and everyone had enough to get by- and so what if the guy at the top only made 20-40 times what the guy at the bottom made?

You really need to start asking yourself: just what does anyone do to justify a $14,000.00 an hour salary?

Oh, that's right...they're willing to rape their employees and their customers to maximize stockholder profit.

Enjoy the benefits of the system you helped create- and quit whining about the unpleasant side effects of the destruction of the middle class and the American job base that you have the audacity to defend.

While you're at it, quit complaining about ALL "first responders"- the tax cuts you probably endorse for greed and personal profit once funded what you now decry as inadequate.

Finally....most of those supporting the right are hysterically unqualified to discuss Christianity, having abandoned charity, humility, brotherly love, and filial piety to embrace avarice, arrogance, scorn, and hatred.

@ Kevin and some of these other commentators-Are you serious? Or are you trolls? Rich and greedy private utilities that are morally bankrupt have good little soldiers in you! Do you remember Enron? You spout the usual republican mantra- try to divide the working class and inspire jealousy that others even have benefits. That way the guys who actually do the work can attack each other while the big guys sit back and suck on their cigars. Have you even looked at what some of these CEO's make in just stock options alone?? You should look into what deregulation did and how a lot of these private utilities shed the line infrastructure to suck more money up to the top, because the infrastucture is costly.

WHY are they locking out the employees ? This looks like an effort to make themselves look good, the union look bad and to break the union once and for all.

btw; why is it they never report what the actual details of the disputes are??

"ConEd took the extreme measure of locking out its unionized workforce putting the city of New York and Westchester county in peril during a heat wave."

Of course the flip side of that rhetoric is;

"Union workers threatened to walk off their jobs just when a heat wave strikes to force ConEd to capitulate to their demands".

There are two sides to each story, but only the pro-union one get reported in the media.

************************************************************************************************

Just like a corporation ....... Stall labor negotiations and then blame the union.

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Willowbrook, why are you not cutting the trees from the wires? Is it because there is a high risk of danger in that job?

OK everybody, the economic theory is 1/3 for management, 1/3 for employees and 1/3 for the money (stock holders or whatever.)

Why do people always blame the repubs when it comes to unions? I bet I can find democrats who have the same union issues of not having enough money but unions want more? I didn't see anywhere in the article that the ConEd bosses were republican, they are guys trying to come in on budget. As for Coporate leaders in general, I'm sure George Soros made many decisions, maybe not George directly in some cases but his other managers, of who gets down sized so he can increase his billions. My thoughts are agree to their demands and then cut the workforce to save the necessary money or put in the contract that after this date your benefits are reduced.

I meant to say those hired after a certain date would have their benefits reduced but leave the benefits for current employees alone.

FeO2Dreams, I don't know Your math. The fearless leader only gets $5,500.00 an hour before bonuses. I am sure that He earns it buy going into the tunnels and checking the work of the union peons.

Here is the economic fact.

If you conservatives, or anyone else of that ilk, want lower prices and believe that lower and lower prices is good for the middle class, then you need to understand one basic tenant of that consequence. Lower prices translate directly to lower wages, or in most cases no wages in the country they are purchased. It's astounding that people can't make this natural step in understanding.

Lower or no wages for the middle class is the guaranteed to deplete the middle class. This is exactly what has been happening for the last 12 years.

Unions may not be perfect. However, they are the only ones powerful enough, which right now is not saying a lot, to have a collective voice to keep jobs here in America. EVERY union is fighting to keep jobs here as their number 1 priority. But let's face it, they are a dying bread, but not yet dead.

Conservatives especially can't make that leap of logic. Perhaps they drink the Cool-Aid a little too much.

No matter what party you are in, if you want to be a good American, you should be buying American made products. They do not necessarily cost more and when they do, they are only a few percentage points more (noted below*). Well worth putting an American to work. Do you do that? Most of you would be a resounding NO. You go to Wall Mart (may as well call it China Territory) because you think you are saving money. But what you are doing is feeding the monster that lowers all our wages. Making it so you can afford even less next year.

Indeed that is the trap.

* In the case of Levi's products. All their products not made in America are cheap. However, they do have a very limited line of products made in America. They are 5 times the cost of the other products. It's not union labor and all the workers are under $10 and hour. So, $194.99 for a pair of Shrink-to-Fit 501's clearly shows that Levi's is artificially trying to profit on the "made in America" schtick.

* In the case of Harley Davidson stores. Their leather jackets are ALL made in China. Yet they charge a premium. For example: Their top line of leather is FXRG, very expensive for a jacket at over $800, made in China. However, the best made leather jackets in the world is Schott and their top motorcycle jacket is under $700. ALL of Schott's products are 100% American and Union made. I own both and the Scott is far superior in durability and quality. Schott is the primary outfitter for leather garments in the movie industry.

All you anti-Union posters, do you even know what congresspeople get????!!!!!! And talk about not getting any fn work done.....These Union people are just trying to get by, they are not getting rich, like the Congresspeople are, like the Wallstreet bums are, like the CEO's are...get real. Sure, we understand you 1%'s would like us 99%'s to turn on each other.....Prats!

@ FeO2 Dreams- Nice try but no win for you. All of us but one in our neighborhood have generators because that's how unreliable our power can be. The one who doesn't is elderly and we take care of them. Like I said, we take care of ourselves.

@ Bill Craig - are you stoned like earthgirl, leaving a comment like that? We don't have the proper equipment to take care of the wires. You know, the equipment owned by the electric company, since it is their job? Even an elementary child know how bad an idea that is.

Con Ed had better be alert as these union thugs have historically been known to sabotage equipment/facilities to get their way.

The one thing no one has talked about....Con Ed locked them out. Obviously Con Ed is very serious about this. Has to be a reason why. Could it be they simply cannot afford their demands? If this were less important, I'm sure they would have a contract by now.

Willowbrook, I have the necessary equipment to remove wires so I can cut fallen trees. Why don't You. I also have enough expertise to do it safely, don't You. I have a disability retirement which slows me down. You go ahead and wait for the trained and equiped workers, which if the electrical company had hired enough You would have electricity. But You and I know that would cost too much. Those workers are not sitting and laughing at You but they wish had more help. Big Job.

So this is where NYC stands on it's budget:

The most populous U.S. city has a $65 billion budget projected for fiscal 2012, which begins July 1. Bloomberg last month cited increased pension costs and loss of $850 million in federal school aid in proposing to reduce the city's 300,000-worker payroll, including more than 6,000 firings. About 4,000 cuts will be accomplished by attrition.

Governor-elect Andrew Cuomo, a Democrat who takes office Jan. 1, has until Feb. 1 to propose his first budget. Last month, state Budget Director Robert Megna said the New York state deficit for fiscal 2012, which starts April 1, may reach $9.3 billion.

The state gap may increase to between $10 billion to $12 billion in the event revenue and spending projections prove too optimistic, Page said today.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-06/new-york-city-budget-gap-may-widen-by-2-billion-next-year-official-says.html

So....what is the Union asking for ?

willowbrook....."Could it be they simply cannot afford their demands? If this were less important, I'm sure they would have a contract by now."

Lots of Flashbacks: Mr. Obama says "Everyone should pay their FAIR SHARE". Uh oh.

Looks like NYC is going to follow the path of Stockton, California.

Unions are useless and have no place in the 21st century. Their demands are unrealistic and are not in every-ones best interest but in theirs.

Don't kid yourself folks. Those union jerks will take and take, and take without a thought about anybody else. Most important, they want control over the company and how things are run. Yup, the Commies are coming. That was always the goal of those bloodsucker unions. Too stupid to make it on their own so they band together and are not any smarter anyway.

Unions are antiquated and ineffective. Throw them out for good!

Hmmmmm...possible job openings..plenty unemployed still.

Willowbrook, I may have been a little hard on You. I dreamed of farming and ranching. A place You have to be self reliant. It is probably that ConEd wants to fire people. When everything goes well, ok. When You have a storm, not so good. They need to have more employees than is necessary when everything is working right. You can see that sometimes more is better. Good luck.

How much money did Con-Ed make last year, how much is management paid? You think management is really going to go out and try to do what the linemen do, most of their fat asses could not even climb a utility pole much less repair high voltage transmission lines and generation equipment without getting themselves killed. When the CEO, and other executives tell me their outrageous salaries and bonuses are bankrupting the system, I will start to listen to them, until then I will stand in solidarity with my union brothers and defend their right to bargain for a decent wage and fringe package that allows them to make make a decent living, pay their taxes, pay for their own health-care, provide their wives with a pension and some security in their old age in exchange for a lifetime of dedicated, hard, and extremely dangerous work. If people in new york suffer just remember this was not a strike by the union members this was the company, the executives who steal the big money, locking the union members out.

So tell me why these negotiations were scheduled now? And if the union strike deadline was Saturday at mid-night and the company planned to work without them as of Saturday at mid-night Just who is bullying who? If the union walked this would somehow be better for the customers than if the company decided to run without them at the same time? Duh.

Contract negotiations are set far in advance and depend on the length of the previous contract, contracts are generally negoiated every two or three years, and so everybody knows full well when the contract will expire and the next one needs to be worked out. The effect will be the same for the customers, but is was the company who told the union members not to return to work, the workers did not strike the company and the union could have agreed to disagree and continue to work under the old contract while negotiations continued, it is done all the time during tough negotiations. The company chose not to do that, they made the decision to put their customers at risk, they locked out the union members, they are solely responsible for any suffering of service to their customers. The company broke off the negotiations, not the union members, who is bullying who?, why it is quite clear that the company is willing to bully it's customers to get what it wants, rather than to continue to bargain in good faith. If people in NY wind up sweating their asses off, with no refrigeration for perishable foods, and (God forbid) no TV, they should call and thank the wise decision makers at the Conn-Ed offices, who BTW will never give up their health-care and pension benefits, and put the security of their loved ones in jeopardy.

Con Ed has a lot of money. American working people ARE a resource. Con Ed will ALWAYS have a lot of money. These workers retirement is pocket change to Con Ed. Corporate greed is at work here. Nothing more, nothing less.

@ Bill Craig - thanks for clarifying. I live on a farm, and we are used to taking care of ourselves whenever possible. We don't complain about it, we just do it as that is our tradition. But I'm also about safety, which is why I responded as I did to your post. Unless loss of life is involved I would never take the risk with electricity. I also know the repair teams have to prioritize, and even then it doesn't always work out. Our local Kroger store lost tons of food, despite bringing in reefer trailers and working around the clock moving food. The need was so great, there were not enough reefer trailers to go around. I think Ido's post is the best toward seeing the problem they are facing out there. Yes it would be nice to have enough crews available to take care of these problems, but the problems are few and far between and the company needs to have something else for them to do when there is no storm damage. Have a Happy 4th!

You must be from one of those RIGHT TO WORK FOR LESS AND LESS states.

How's it FEEL to be used?

Do you get up every morning and go in to work to tell YOUR BOSS that he is absolutely paying you WAY TOO MUCH MONEY ?? And that you REALLY DON'T NEED THAT HEALTH INSURANCE HE GIVES YOU because it keeps HIS margin too low ?? And that paltry 401K that they provide you with is just WAY TOO GENEROUS and that YOU WANT TO TURN IT DOWN so that THE BUSINESS WILL DO A WHOLE LOT BETTER???

There are FOOLS born every minute who FALL IN TO LINE TO SLIT THEIR OWN THROATS because of the NOISE from Corporate shills and RIGHT WING RADIO that spews the ANTI-WORKER CORPORATE IDEA that "workers are being paid too much and have way too many benefits".

Look in the mirror....and YOU will be looking at a fool....BTW, NICE PHOTO OF YOURSELF....

iheardthis.......Nice well thought out rant. I was in three unions, each more crooked than the previous. I AM in a right to work state now, after my wife lost her UNION job as a teacher in NYS through layoffs. They go by seniority, you should see what they had to keep!! Now we're in a right to work state (and a battleground one to boot!! Maybe my vote will FINALLY matter!!), and it was like a 300 a week raise, just for moving, and no change in income just in income and property taxes (we have a nicer, bigger, more expensive house now too).

I won't buy union made goods and services whenever possible. It's tantamount to giving money directly to democrats, something I am not willing to do.

They cry of unions is gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme. Bunch of thugs, that's all.

YES!!! Lets all depend on untrained, low IQ, labor for our energy needs, That'll teach those well trained electrical workers!!!!

What kind of bonus's, Healthcare, and Pay do the CEO, Board members, and Managers at ConEd get??

I see 8,500 new jobs created in NY. These leeches think that they are the only Electric Utility workers out there, WRONG. There are many Electric Utility job hoppers out there willing to have a job at a fraction the pay that ConEd pays. All yous UWUA weenies stay home, there will be plenty of non-union folks there ready to fill your space in a few days, maybe some of those people that the Prez. just blessed.

Electric Utility Workers are not 1st responders! Their job is to keep the system up and running. Oh, in all kinds of weather, you say. It is weather that causes most of the problems so, if it wasn't for the anticipated weather problems, many of those workers wouldn't have jobs anyway.

If Utility workers are 1st responders, then so is the Mailman, Garbageman and the Donut Shop Attendant.

I agree, union wages are the best and they keep up with cost of living.

Well said, and exactly the view of abouit 80% of most Americans that have had it with Unions, their forced participation, their stranglehold on public sector goverment, and their disregard for most Americans that are non-union. If they keep up this crap, I predict Unions will be a thing of the past in about 10 years! Once they were the lifes-blood of the American worker; now they are like a Vampire sucking it dry.

IHeardThisBefore - Other than some humor from reading your rant; I see nothing of substance in your rather myopic tirade against the rest of us that see Unions for what they are. Useless, and of NO benefit to most Americans or business growth in this nation. The kind of people you are describing are more akin to those IN unions than anywhere else. They follow their Union bosses and stewards like a bunch of lemmings off the cliff why they live in mansions like Hoffa and others. Have fun in the unemployment line, because Americans have had enough and that's where you and about 8500 ConEd workers are heading if they don't get their heads out of their behinds.

Just gotta love those Union workers. No one can do their job, except them. Everyone else is retarded.

Fact of the matter is if you are any good and an expert in your field, don't need a union.

People will never get paid what they think THEY are worth, unless you own a company. Then you can pay yourself whatever you think you are worth. People get paid what the market will bear.

I was in a union, got a decent wage. Moved to a right to work state, got paid the same amount. Because I had a skill that was marketable.

It's funny though, some of the best cars made are made by non union workers, but only union workers are smart enough, Right BO-1925019?

@ Paul....almost all of these supposed "electric utility job hoppers" are UNION. i am one of them. and i have repaired a LOT of sub par Non-union built substaions and switching stations.i have made a career out of traveling(mostly in the right to work states mind u) the country FIXING brandy new work that was built by UNQUALIFIED persons. this is electricity we are talking about....not an assembly line.Con-ed has other elements added in to the mix. their services are UNDERGOUND. in a manhole system that is almost 100 years old. the cabling down there is still encased in lead. the gasses in those manholes are DEALY. ask the Con-ed workers how many times Con-ed has tried lowering the time it takes to purge a man-hole? nice huh. the risk and skill involved demands higher wages.

In your dreams, Tom! Really doesn't matter that it is electricity or assembly line, the union BS is the same. Yes, I am aware of the hazards, many other professions have equal or greater hazards.

FIXING brandy new work that was built by UNQUALIFIED persons. i have repaired a LOT of sub par Non-union built substaions and switching stations.

but to design specifications of an Electrical Engineer and adequate for the time period and demand for which they were designed and built.

how many times Con-ed has tried lowering the time it takes to purge a man-hole?

with new improved equipment and technology that they to invest in to offset the high cost of labor.

But I will let you continue to dream, go back to sleep.

@ jr11: I hope you're engaging in a bit of sarcasm...because what Reagan did to the Air Traffic Controllers was the beginning of the end for the American middle class- and also reduced air traffic safety substantially- until Clinton reversed the hiring ban on former PATCO members and restored the experience Reagan petulantly dismantled.

What was the economy like during the Clinton Era when unions prevailed?

What was it like during the Bush Era, during which they were aggressively attacked?

There's a correlation- and given the FACT that the economy has done so very well under the stewardship of state and federal governments suborned by corporate citizens, I think you boys have had your turn at the wheel.

What's funniest is the way you complain about Obama- when you've all spent every dime you had to keep him from hauling out and repairing what you fools drove into a ditch.

iheardthisbefore our right to work state is sending utility crews to the East Coast to get the lights back on there. I'd be a little more grateful if I was you. We still remember how people like you said you hoped our houses would burnand you didn't care if we died during last years Texas fires. 12 out of 14 people on this vine were saying that last year so why is it again we should give a f--k about you.

The median income in Texas is $11.20 an hour, that is $22,400 if they work 40 hours a week 50 weeks a year. Republicans in these right to work for less and less and less states incessantly complain about high taxes but they do not earn enough money to even owe any federal taxes, why complain about what you do not pay. At $11.20 an hour your problem is not high taxes, your problem is low wages. How many of these people are working and not paying federal taxes and use government programs such as medicaid to get by? How many do not have any health insurance at all? They rail against unions, federal taxes, "socialism" and government handouts and yet anything the federal government does for these people is a matter of charity, now isn't it. These people should wake up and smell the coffee, they better figure out that union busting hurts them across the board, everybody lost earning power in those states not just the union members. Point of fact, I made $11.80 an hour plus full health and retirement benefits as a union grocery clerk for the Kroger company in 1982. Do people in Texas pay thirty year old prices to go along with their 30 year old wages? The federal reps from Texas and everywhere else, make $174,000 a year in salary, for less than 20 weeks a year work, have a lifetime pension at full salary for only five years work, and the best health-care coverage possible for life, they have a deal that makes the best union contract look shabby, but they will tell you a living wage and some benefits is far more than you or any public employees are worth. You have the right to work for less and less and less and you most certainly are. Bottom-line, united you can bargain, divided you will beg.

To some that argue that utility workers are not first responders just remember that the police, fire, and medical services have to call the utility, if there are downed lines, to see if the power is on or not because they can put them and the people they are trying to get to in danger. Don't believe that's fine but you can look it up for yourself.

@ya1133300

Ya and when the toilet runs over, a plumber has to be called before you can take a dump. Plumbers must be 1st responders, too.

Paul, thank you. Thank you for showing me again, when I was on the verge of giving men another go, thank you for providing me perspective, for showing me again why I prefer, on all levels, to be single.......bet I'm not the first woman you've had that effect on.....

That's OK, Obama still loves you. What makes you think that you would be released from the zoo anyway?

Point of fact, I made $11.80 an hour plus full health and retirement benefits as a union grocery clerk for the Kroger company in 1982.

Thank you for providing the proof of the damage that unions have done to this country. In 1982 the minimum wage was around $3.75/hr for most people median income jobs were $5 -$5.50/hr but the cost of living was fairly inexpensive. Every time you union clowns got a raise in Michigan or where ever the cost of your raise was passed on to the whole country. The cost of a new 1600sq.ft. home was $75K in Texas but in in unionville the same home cost was around $210k. I remember visiting Pelham,NY in 1961 a shack (by our standards) maybe 1000sq.ft. was over $200k. My Uncle was a Barber in NYC, he charged $12 for a haircut then, I only pay $10 now. You keep your union State, I'm happy where I'm at. We have a decent economy and JOBS.

It is a FIRST of July, The heat is just starting

@ bany6124: if Con Ed would have negotiated....a two weeks extension wouldn't be needed.

Exactly, the union is the culprit in this issue. What was wrong with agreeing to an extension?

Bo-xxxxxx, go back to your union bench.

Lets all depend on untrained, low IQ, labor for our energy needs,

Low IQ, is exactly what a union worker is. That is why they are highly trained (hours & hours) to put a bolt through hole while another trained individual puts a nut on it. The real reason why the negotiations broke down is ConEd refused to pay for a 3rd person to hold a wrench on the bolt while a 4th tightened the nut.

Just think, now the door is open, they can hire one person with a normal IQ, to put the bolt in the hole, add the nut and tighten the nut on the bolt, plus add a washer to each side for a better product.

Do you get up every morning and go in to work to tell YOUR BOSS that he is absolutely paying you WAY TOO MUCH MONEY ??

You know the Union worker does, Doesn't Bo?

Safety is the main issue. Maybe Rhodes scholars like Paul can go down a manhole and do a better job putting nuts and bolts on a power cable, or a gas valve. All talk and no action. Who needs a mask. That's just kids stuff. I can't see. gimme your lighter. Spend your day in the hole, then tell us, Paul, how you can do it for much less, and without benefits.

They offered a two week extension with the guarantee that the union will not call a strike. Which is, if you did not know already the only weapon they have to counter a corporation with. When the CEO gets paid 11 million a year before bonuses and the board of directors votes themselves a 20% raise just a month earlier. It's a little hard to swallow the whole austerity argument at the barganing table.

Yes Rachel42561, they offered a two week extension with the stipulation that unions wouldn't strike in the middle of the heat wave. Since the unions refused the extension and the stipulation of not striking, the company has to plan to work the heat wave without them.

They can't afford to have to restructure their response force in the middle of an emergency, and they can't afford to pay people in an emergency who might not show up.

Hey it MEEE you don't mean if ConED woulld have negotiated you mean if ConEd would have caved in to the demands. Negotiation is a two way street my friend. Each side has to give some to get some.

Yeah and obviously the company did not wish to rescind their right to call for a lockout of the union employees, now did they. The union did not call for a strike they simply held on to their right to strike, the company held on to their right to a lockout and in fact exercised that right. If any of their customers suffer for lack of services it is the company who is directly and solely responsible.The company clearly made the choice to put their customers in jeopardy during the hot season, instead of extending the existing contract and continue with negotiations in a good faith agreement to reach a new contract. They wanted the union members to relinquish their rights, but they certainly were not willing to relinquish theirs, and it was their decision to break off negotiations and put the city at risk of losing their services, the union members did not walk off they were locked out. You think if they permantly replace the union workers they will lower your electric bill?, you think management will give back the across the board raises or benefits they recently gave themselves?

@ Lonereb...No, that's not what I meant, because that's not what I said. Twisting someones words can be silly, but either juvenile or desperate when adults do it; which are you?

...the company notified unionized workers not to report for work...

I agree that negotiations are a two-way street. It's too bad Con Ed didn't know that.

It's called COLLECTIVE BARGAINING....but then YOU already knew that.

COLLECTIVE BARGAINING is LEGAL form of NEGOTIATING WITH A CORPORATION or other entity.

There are in fact SOME FOLKS who don't want to give away their pay checks and benefits to the CORPORATION THEY WORK FOR just because the CORPORATION wants them to do that.

Are YOU one of those apple polishers that kiss your bosses behind every day? Giving back anything or EVERYTHING for the GOOD OF THE CORPORATION???

No, it's called extortion.....but then YOU already knew that.

A worker should be paid what he's worth, not what he thinks he's worth.

One small change. Stop the forced deduction for union dues. Let the unions bill their workers directly, so they can see the bill and write the check. It will sit in the pile with the electric bill, mortgage or rent, food, etc. When they see the bill every week / two weeks / month, they'll look at it a little differently. The unions would fight that because they know it would be the end of their sorry lazy butt scam.

If you have marketable skills, you won't need a union.

Colllective bargaining units are exempt from Anti Trust legislation. Read the Tadthartley Act of 1947 and you will understand and I quote form the Act " therefore it is declared the policy of the United States of America to encourage the practice of collective bargaining. "

No one person can stand up to a corporation. Thats why unions are necessary.. When Unions were at their peak, the middle class was at its peak.

They say corporations are people, then I say people are corporations also then and entitled to the same tax shelters and grants and government subsdies that corporations enjoy.

How many hundred million $$ was the CEO bonus from ConEd last year?

i have marketable skills...and i do need my BROTHERHOOD.because without the union i would have to fight constantly to keep my wages from going down.some guys will do anything they are asked (safe or not,)just to keep a job.i refuse to sacrifice safety (mine or the public's )or quality, to make up for planning mishaps or so the boss can bank the hours he saves.but in all walks of life, you are only as strong as the weakest link. and unfortunately for all of us. there are some pretty weak links out there.

it seems that many posters here just hate unions. bTW i mail my dues check in to my hall every 3 months. so i know what it costs me.i also know that money spent is well worth what i get in return.

@Bo-1925019

YES!!! Lets all depend on untrained, low IQ, labor for our energy needs, That'll teach those well trained electrical workers!!!!

What kind of bonus's, Healthcare, and Pay do the CEO, Board members, and Managers at ConEd get??

Why don't you go and get an MBA and then you can get that bonus the CEO, Board Members and Managers get. Or maybe you think the company's should hire untrained low iq managers to run the company?

You spew your hatred of management's compensation out of one side of your mouth, then tout how much you should get paid for being a trained worker. Hypocritical don't you think?

Mr. Kevin Burke was compensated 18 million last year placing him in the top 5 of utility CEOs, not to mention his bonuses on top of his salary. The board of directors last month approved a 20% pay increase for themselves. Con Edison's stock has jumped from $38 to $62 per share since the last contract making it the most profitable utility industry. Last year Con Edison made $46 BILLION in revenue. They want to preach austerity to the 8,500 hard working men and women of Local 1-2. Stripping them of their pension and benefits, lowering their salaries and severly limiting if not eliminating their sick time completely. Large corporations should not be able to continually go unchecked, grossly profiting of the backs of thier work force. Everyone deserves a fair living wage.

Rachel, wonder how much of that profit went to the stockholders? Maybe if you are tired of them

profiting of the backs of thier work force

you should buy some of the stock and share the profits and the risk.

Again, here we have person talking about a living wage. What the hell is this so called living wage? The so called 1% is not destroying the middle class, it is the cannibalism within the middle class that is destroying it. The government raises the minimum wage, the union says their worker are worth more, so they adjust their pay scale proportionally and the price of everything goes up to offset the new cost. What has changed other than a higher cost of living.

A living wage is what ever it take to sustain your existence. It does NOT include a house, a car, a big screen tv, game box, motorcycle, boat, etc. It is funny that all those undeveloped countries seem to understand this but we don't.

Rachel says "Mr. Kevin Burke was compensated 18 million last year", wonder how much Tyler Perry was compensated last year? It doesn't matter his was producing entertainment for us to enjoy. Mr. Burke however is a low life scourndrel because he insured that millions of people had electricity to keep their home comfortable and lite, those movie theaters had power to make Mr. Perry's productions possible, Hospital functional, etc. that doesn't matter he is a CEO and they don't deserve anything. I think they should do away with CEO's and make them all producers.

For one I DO own ConEd stock. Two, the average worker there makes 50,000. That 50,000 needs to be spent in one of the most expensenve areas to live in this country. So please let me know how much a flat in the NYC area or a mortgage, taxes, insurance, monthly utillities, daycare, food, clothing should be. Obviously, you haven't a clue. But then maybe you would retort with something to the effect of live in a cardboard box, don't have insurance don't have any kids, eat less and walk around wearing a barrel. The fact of the matter is everyone wants to progress in this world. Leaving worker wages stagnate only contribute to the declination of the middle class. The only canabalism going on now is big business profiting from anyones expense. When is enough, enough?

A worker should be paid what he's worth, not what he thinks he's worth.

Then I can pay the incompitent plumber or eletrician ten an hour instead of the 125?? He's not in a union and still a thief.

No doubt Con Ed's profits are at record levels and they want to keep it all. United Water did the same thing and every time there was a water main break, it took days and not hours to fix because they got rid of all the decent workers and replaced them with a shadow staff.

Let's see how ConEd handles the next few weeks. No doubt their media rep will be out there working.

Interesting. Of all the movie producers out there you would choose Tyler Perry. Anyway, please correct your statement of Mr Burke insured the millions of people had electricity. I do believe that was the 8,500 some odd workers he is locking out. That is responsible isn't it. It is quite apparent you just can't have a discussion with ignorance. No one is talking about CEO's not getting paid. He is NEGOTIATING his salary with the BOD.

Paul...you ask "what has changed other than a higher cost of living". The answer is...management and investors are getting more...and the average worker is getting less. That is a simple and verifiable fact.

50 years ago, CEO pay was only about 50 times what the worker pay was. Now CEO's make roughly 400 times what the average worker makes. And you want to pretend that's caused by workers fighting amongst themselves?

And it is exactly your thinking that is destroying America. Ask any company today why they are not expanding...and the answer is that their is not enough demand. You support policies that divert the disposable income from 100 workers and give it to the CEO...and then you are shocked when the CEO doesn't use that extra money to buy 50 new BBQ grills, 20 new swimming pools, etc? Gee...do you really not understand why demand for BBQ's and swimming pools has gone down?

When the US economy is 70% consumer spending...and you reduce the disposable income of the average consumer by cutting their pay and benefits...is it really still a mystery to you why demand is down?

iheardthisbefore I am a Union brat. They can't save your job if the company outsources 1965 to Mexico long before Mittens was out of school. That GM car you drive that you bailed out the company the eletronic parts are made in Reynosa Mexico and have been for almost forty years. Your refrigerator the parts are probably made here and shipped to Laredo crossed into Mexico assembled there and shipped back where a Made in the USA tag is put on. That @!$%# started while Mittens was still in school too. And the switches on your B&D drill and on US military jets and most commercial jets Condura SA Matamoros Mx. Moved from Milwaukee between 1960 and 1965 while Mittens was still in school. So did Mitt outsource jobs or did unions force companies to go where they could compete.

lonereb

Do you understand that the main company is American. Toyota is built here, but who owns it? Who gets the biggest chunk? Who builds it for less than their American counterparts? Why are we sending our jobs overseas, while they are bringing theirs here? Basically, we are working for them, not us. By working for less, in that Toyota plant, the workers are handing Japan the profits that they could have kept here.

Also, by having the mindset of working for less, the American worker has given up their rights already. All we need is Mitt to wipe the sketch clean and start over at, let's say.....@4.50/hr. Any takers?

Mexico's auto unions agree to cut wages:

Wage concessions were apparently key to persuading Ford Motor Co. to direct many of the 4,500 new jobs involved in building Fiestas to the Ford plant in Cuautitlan, on the outskirts of Mexico City. Union leaders at the plant told The Associated Press they had agreed to cut wages for new hires to about half of the current wage of $4.50 per hour.

"We agreed to it," said Ford union leader Juan Jose Sosa Arreola. "We need to be more competitive. That's the truth. That's a reality."

The United Auto Workers union had hoped to preserve American jobs by offering a two-tier wage system last fall, cutting starting wages for new U.S. workers by half to about $14.20 an hour. But it hasn't worked -- the jobs are flowing to Mexico, where starting wages at some plants also have been two-tiered, to as little as $1.50 per hour with a lot less of the related pension and health care costs of U.S. workers.

With labor costs like these, Mexico is staying competitive with China, where an average worker at a foreign-owned factory or joint venture can make $2 to $6 per hour. While Mexican benefit costs run higher, Mexico may have already won the low-wage race

The Race to the Bottom is on, with the ultimate low wage workforce being a surf or slave class.

Most of the people on this thread complaining about the union members income at Conn-Ed in NY could not afford a parking space in NY with their yearly income much less afford to live there.

Ok, all you pro union people are right. Let's make every job in this country a job a union and paid at scale, then we can see what a living wage looks like. Now, I know you are thinking that the hamburger flipper at McDonald's doesn't deserve the same wage as you because you are highly trained, so are they.

Looking at thing from a liberal point of view; the burger flipper may not have been afforded the same opportunities as you but is still entitled to the same quality of life as you, therefore in this new living wage world of yours everyone should have the same opportunities. In this new world, I guess it will be permissible for one individual to blow their income foolishly while you spend responsibly and save so it will be OK share some of yours. Sounds like the prefect world.

By the way, how much does a Hamburger cost in your new world? Damn, that's a little high maybe payscales should be adjusted.

I forgot to ask, will anyone be allowed to make a profit in this new world? If so, how much will be allowed before they are greedy?

P.S. Rachel, I chose Tyler Perry because I just saw "Witness Protection" and he came to mind. I think he is great, just using his accomplishments as example.

Paul, who said that hamburger flippers are not deserving of a union? I would like to see as many union people as possible, but people like you want to be above somebody. It might as well be a flipper. In your world, you have the education, therefore, you are more entitled to a job. Is that it? I sense that you are trying to refer union people to welfare recipients. Maybe you have more education, but you may be an a--hole and unload your work onto the lower paid workers. Does that still qualify you? Do you think, working doubles, during the evening, and on weekends, serving tables is not professional? My new world?. It's your new world that has people working for beans, because they have no backbone, and nobody who's willing to stand up for them. Would you stick your neck out for someone who did a good job, and either got fired, or replaced, or got less hours? Or wanted a raise? How about the old lady that worked through her break so the chain smoker could go out and have another. I'll bet you won't even answer. Read # 4.17 and find out what pay is like in Mexico. That's what you'll get here, talking like that. You don't know jack about unions. Only the tvbots talking points.

demmie-1555521

I believe you are fine example of who I was talking about in #3.4! Maybe you should learn to read, instead of listening to that pro-union brain washing crap from the union hall. After you learn to read, maybe you should take a little arithmetic and basic economics.

#4.17 tells me that more and more production will move to Mexico. Ford and Other Auto makers will have to find what ever means available to keep the cost of a car down to compete in the marketplace. You wouldn't know anything about that. Union Mantra 101 says the greedy corporations don't want to pay you anything, they just line their pockets off the backs of the workers.

Paul-2539759

You still don't know jack about unions. I don't know where you get your knowledge of unions, but it isn't from working in a union shop or any other manufacturing/assembly areas. I got mine through my company.Would you take your turn in a manhole? You didn't answer, like I thought. You're all talk and no skill. Guys like you, get their heads and fingers smashed or blown up from lack of experience or safety. Maybe that's why most electric companies don't hire non union employees for dangerous work. They don't want to pay out big settlements.I don't know any unions that don't push the company for safety on critical work. That's something you evidently know nothing about. Arithmetic and basic economics doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of why someone would pay 1.50 an hour for assembling a car. It has to do with control and less safety. I'll repeat it again, because you don't listen. Read Lean Manufacturing.

dummie-155521

Keep dreaming your dream. Just because you are in some crappy union doesn't make you more skilled or safe than I am. I have probably forgot more than you will ever know. I have done my time in a manhole. I'm retired now thank you.

What was it that you asked, that was worth my time to answer? Nothing I saw. I did say, I think burger flippers should be paid the same wage you are. They are probably worth more. Hope you learn the like the taste of beans, they will be the biggest part of your diet before long.

P.S. Better be keepin an eye on your pension plan, the way the unions are throwing that money at Obama and other crap causes there won't be any pension $$ left. You know them union bosses ain't spending their money! Maybe a raise in union dues is coming>

Pual

What dream are you talking about? You don't really have anything constructive to say about your life, do you? Attacking me says that you are not the kind of person that belongs working with others. Just because you couldn't get a better paying job, doesn't mean you have to twist any facts. Far as retired, so am I, and I retired at 56 with a good company pension that I paid into.I hope you have enough money saved for the future.I have that too. With RMoney in town, you may have to go back to work.

I have probably forgot more than you will ever know

I don't doubt it.

I agree. Suddenly, both sides realize, or each will soon realize, that companies cannot pump enough money into the pension and long term healthcare accounts, and still remain in business. Public Utilities have a bigger problem; their customers are asking why management continues to receive huge bonuses and salary increases, which spurs the unions to fight even harder for their members. At the end of the day, both sides are going to lose unless they agree to restructure everything, including management's salary and benefits packages.

The company might want to reconsider the BILLION's in bonus's for management they gave out last year

You are correct. However, the flip side is also true. If you don't support strikes then you can't support lockouts. If you think that union workers that threaten to strike are the "ogre" then why isn't the management when they lockout?

Strikes and lockouts are viable, yet heavy handed, negotiation tools. The tool itself isn't necessarily good or bad it's all in the implementation. I have no idea where the negotiations were (just like, perhaps, everyone else on this board) so I can't know if this is strong arm or last ditch. I can't demonize ConEd for it, but others shouldn't demonize the union because they threatened to strike even though ConEd actually did a lockout.

Unions time of control is coming to an end.

Yes, elimination of the middle class, is important to republicans.

so instead...let allow these corporate entities to hold us ALL over a fire. cause thats better.

Do you honestly think that companies are going to pay workers a fair wage when unions no longer exist? That's a pipe dream. Just because the RTW states pay ok wages, but not the greatest, doesn't mean they will continue to, when union influence on workers rights and pay, go away.

Minimum wage laws? Soon gone. Health benefits? Soon gone. Worker protection rights( that are posted on all bulletin boards by law) soon, gone. 40 hour work weeks? Poof! Equal pay for women?Ha-ha-ha.

demmie...it's already happening.

In Maine, republican Gov Paul LePage wants to roll back restrictions on the number of hours kids can work that were designed to ensure they are not too tired to stay awake at school the next day.

Newt Gingrich advocated school kids becoming the janitors at schools.

Missouri republicans wanted to allow kids under 14 to work, and to roll back restrictions on they hours that minors could work. Apparently they have too many jobs for their adult population.

demmie All those minimum wage laws are federal and the government enforces that under the commerce clause. Any business in interstate commerce of anykind is subject to minimum wage laws. Go read the bulletin board at work they are required to post it by law. If you make something and it never leaves your state and nothing involved in the manufacture or packaging of said product comes from another state you just might be exempt from the minimum wage laws, maybe.

Did you read what I posted? I know very well about the posted laws.The GOP can't stand anything that doesn't benefit big business and helps the poor working man.That's their intentions. To repeal all those pesky anti-work laws. Listen to Mitt RMoney. That's all that comes out of his mouth. John Boehner,the same, Mitch McConnell, same. Less Government....What part don't you understand about the GOP?They don't want any laws protecting workers. Show me one law that they are for. I know. No rights or benefits for LGTB couples.

"Missouri republicans wanted to allow kids under 14 to work, and to roll back restrictions on they hours that minors could work."

Yeah, why should kids in China have all the good jobs.

Woofy, Public Service Employees still have not got that message..... ConEd I know that you can find new emloyees so the move makes sense.....

I agree, but it was management that kept kicking the can down the road. US companies think quarter-over-quarter, and most Wall Street Analysts focused on ROI and held the can being kicked down the road. General Motors knew the bubble had burst when the company needed billions of dollars a quarter for pension and healthcare benefits. It was management that agreed to those high pension benefits, and now management cannot deliver. If you analyze the salaries and benefits made by management over the last sixty years, all the unions were doing was trying to get a fair share of the profits for their members. Both sides ended up losing, because greed and profits drove management's thinking.

Not sustainable except for the top management level, and their golden parachute.

"So yes, a worker should be paid what he's worth, but he's usually NOT paid that much if he has no union"

This is an opinion, not a fact.

I assume your relative was a business owner. Ask him about the early years of the business, and who paid his bills during lean times. Ask him if he had risked his money trying to get his business going, and where the union was while he was trying to do so.

What happens with a union, is they come in like the mob and take over. I was in three unions in the past. Now I negotiate my own salary and benefits. If I owned a business and there was a sniff of a union, I'd send everyone home and close the doors.

Keep in mind that President Stinky (-bo) is all about big business, big unions, and big governement. Stinks would LOVE it if there was one bigcompany, one big union, one big government with Stinks on top of it all.

Stevejc: It appears unions have tried working with management in times of need, but the upper levels feel the need to maintain their high economic standard - and only the workers have to keep giving. Check it out.

Yep. Wasn't it American Airlines who's management argued that they needed to trim a few hundred million in labor costs to survive. But virtually every dollar of the few hundred million in concessions they got from the union ended up going into management bonuses for "cutting costs".

And Steve...do you really think that the employees didn't share the pain in the lean times? Wouldn't they be out of a job too if the company went under? Do you think the employees still received pay and benefit increases when the company couldn't afford it?

For you to completely dismiss any sense of employee contribution to the success of the company is just plain disgusting. I have no gripe with a business owner making a good living. But when that comes by screwing his employees out of fair pay...then you shouldn't be surprised when the employees have no reservations about screwing the employer back.

Or he could have said the hell with it and got rid of 6 jobs that paid 40k.

"Would someone please post all of the salary increases and benefit package upgrades received by ConEd Management, and compare those increases to what the union is asking for union workers." (sic)

Or, Terry, you could research it yourself.

Terry: Great post!

Don't forget to include those management, who made some lousy decisions in the contract negotiations, are now getting huge bonuses for lousy work performed.

Years ago, management worked at a firm for many years, and was capable of doing the job of the worker. Now, they are green,quickly replaceable, with college experience, and no more. Many can't even tie their shoe, yet alone run a power grid. The experienced workers usually show them the ropes, and the boss is suddenly replaced with someone even less experienced. So, the union worker is doing the bosses job, and his own job, and only getting paid for one, while the replaced boss continues to climb the ladder.All my bosses were younger than my boys.

demmie the experienced union workers also get to teach the kids that will be teaching the offshore workers their jobs too. Right before they lose them. My mother. You can't stop outsourcing until the job market becomes competitive. The market is not all in this country anymore. I remember trying to get the building in shape for the BRC inspection a European group whose inspection you must pass to export to Europe. We kind of thought of them as somewhere between a mafia enforcer and the Cali cartel enforcers.

We had Japanese bosses, supervising our bosses, who were supervising us on Lean Manufacturing. Take a look at what we put up with, just to compete with them.

Imagine a foreigner watching you work, while you know full well that some day they will take your job and reduce it to a cheap version, with cheap parts, most likely made by them.

What my partner and I did in one day, is now done by several people, at several different work stations. I was reduced to standing around,and waiting for my next job. Some of us were eliminated, while others got stuck finishing up the work of slower, less efficient newer workers.

Things that I subbed up for me to put in the final assembly, were now done in other areas, by lower paying workers, leaving me to do the same 3 fial assembly jobs, twice a day. It got to be very boring.

So check out Lean Manufacturing, where your boss is basically the devil in disguise.

I love liberal losers!! shaakree......do you know where pension money is invested? Or do you (like most libs) not concern yourself with such things, as they are inconvenient truths? Your retirement (if you have one) is invested in companies like ConEd. To think that the shareholders are all ultra wealthy is absurd. Dividends are what my Grandparents lived on (modestly) in retirement.

I don't buy union products and services whenever possible. It's like giving money directly to President Stinky (-bo) and the rest of the lazys.

Stevejc42 You haven't a clue, Sounds like a paper pusher to me, First off I'm in a Union, have been for 32 years (not a greedy one) My total package per hour is about 70 per hour that includes, retirement, health benefits and the whole ball of wax, the company I work for charges a customer 265.00 for 1 hour of my service.....now who's greedy? If I made less of a package do you think my company would lower their price???? I'll answer that for you......No, I work in an extremely high skilled field and My company would love nothing more than to pay us 12.00 an hour. Now in our union when I retire there is no ties to the company, the company has no further commitment to me in retirement, health or anything. Tell you what Stevie put down your pencil for a day and come do my job and lets see how long you last if you don't get yourself killed in the first day. These guys work around 22000 volts, safety for them and others around them and the customers they work around is a must, They get called out in emergency in the middle of the night in rain, sleet, snow or any natural disaster and work under extreme pressure to get your heat, A/C and lights back on, so until you know what the F@%k your talking about I think you need to pay your mind on your pencil. Find out your facts before you hold a grudge on your dissatisfied career.

FYI Jay its amperage that kills not voltage. Can these jobs be dangerious as times sure, just like so many other jobs. But the companies provide the workers with proper tools to perform the work safely and they are taught how to be safe in the environments they work. Bottomline is there are many, many folks out there ready to step in, learn their jobs, perform them better and with more pride for the companies they work for, with very little training. There are so many other jobs that work in the same types of weather, hell a window wash on sky scrapers is a far more dangerous job and they arent making what this folks are. Bottomline is as a taxpayer, I do not want any Unions in public sector jobs as Unions do nothing but increase the cost of each and every single product, service and tax we purchase and pay (for the 85% of the folks not in Unions). As far as the private sector Unions are fine, provided we do not have whole industries Union such as this industry because it just cost the users more money. This company is a private company and should have every right to move their employees over to 401k's, is the workers don't like it go start their own company, perhaps even a power company.

Right On Jay1660872. !

Steve42 -

I don't necessarily disagree with your points, but your repetetive use "Stinky-(bo)" makes you sound like an elementary school student.

Adults only, please.

UAW...Sure...the company's first priority is worker safety. I'm sure the guys working on the Deep Water Horizon thought the same thing. I mean...it's not like the company had skipped safety steps or were using equipment that had failed safety inspections...right? Yeah...the CEO was really irritated that it took some of the fun out of his yacht race.

And I imagine the guys at the Upper Big Branch mine thought that too. 29 workers get killed, and the manager who falsified safety records and had safety systems "rewired" gets a whopping "5 years".

If corporations are people"...then Massey Energy should be executed for murder.

Lose the Unions and we lose paid holidays, 40 hr work weeks, overtime pay, paid vacations, healthcare, safe working conditions, ad 1000 other perks Unions created ad non-Uion employers now give simply to avoid being Unionized.

$30K Union pensions are killing corporate profits? What about those $10-20-100 million bonus'd CEO's are raking in??

BO save your breath, He is one of the ones that will be looking for government assistance when his company restructures one day and knocks his pension down to 1500.00 a month before tax,s and can't survive without help and also throw his burden on his kids to take care of him. He doesn't realize that the reason he's going to be enjoying his family this forth of July is because Unions set the standard and fought to get that Holiday for him 70 years ago, and he doesn't realize that if he does work that day he gets compensated for his work which was fought and won by union member. He's to ignorant to realize that 90 % of his perks, Comp time, sick pay, vacation pay he has on his job is because a union worked fought for it 70 years ago.

Bo stop with the Union talking points, these folks are not banking 30k pensions, they are probably near 3 times that for those who retire now.

Bo go read your company bulletin board all that is covered by the Feds and enforced under the commerce clause. It is the posters with the blue borders that say US government on them. Your company is required to post them.

Agreed but not knowing the circumstances I will not comment other that I did find that odd but also since I don't know the circumstances there may have been previous extensions. I've been a union worker for 32 years and have never went out on a strike and hope my union continues to negotiate reasnable contracts for us.

All you Union people, take a look at your kids' school books. Corporations are held to high esteem, the country is great because corporations have built it. Minimum mentioned about Unions. That's why these younger folks have no idea how important Unions are, they're getting their knowledge from Fox. We see here the dumbing down of Americans.

What are you talking about earthgirl, the teachers teaching the young folks are Union. They are seeing first hand how Unions perform, thus the reason why the children of this country continue to fall farther down the education charts when compared to many other countries. Did you not hear of that teacher that was taped, who was forcing Obamaism upon that one teen who are standing up to his beliefs? The kid was calm and cool and the teacher was blowing a gasket, should have lost her job and should never teach again but she has already been reinstated, sad, so sad who the public schools have become.

My moms company and her union never in my childhood ever had a strike over two weeks. After two weeks the company couldn't make up the losses on contracts they couldn't bring in on time and the employees couldn't make up the lost wages. Both need lessons in the art of negotiating. Of course they are just acting like their leaders our politicians who won't compromise on anything either.

...or how to purge the manhole before he goes in and dies of gas inhalation.

Purging a manhole can be taught in one day, that includes using all the proper safety tools and actually going out in the field and doing it a few times. But because this is a Union job in the article, some like NY Tom, have to make it sound like everything they do is so technical and difficult even when its not. To the both of you, Im saying, the jobs in question can be performed by many, many folks in this country, who could and would do it the same or better with some training but please lets not make it sound so hard when there would be lines of folks ready and able to do it in a very short time.

Your ignorance amuses me. The fact of the matter is once purged, utility workers have to work in those manholes for hours on end. Moving cable often leads to gases migrating through the wooden ducts they are in. This in turn displaces the oxygen in the structure causing a hazardous atmosphere. I myself was in a structure like that. I suffered from oxygen deprivation even before the detector alarmed. I have also been partnered up with new and trained recruits who have balked at the idea of entering a structure that is 2'wx4'lx4'd' and energized with 3 phases of unforgiving electricity. Next time you are in one please elaborate at how non complex being a splicer in NY can be. Thank you.

To UAW:

I have seen contractors going into our (telco) manholes without purging, nor using a gas detector before or after entering the hole. Also, they have been with me when we popped a lid on a hole and I've had to tell them to extinguish their smokes. They all laughed at me for being so "safety" and I would always explain that I could be fired or worse: DEAD for violating a safety rule. Then one day we popped a lid that was opposite a gas station. As soon as we did you could see the vapors coming out of the hole and the detector went off from 2 feet away and was so strong it blew the sensors out of the detector. It turns out the gas station lost 5,000 gallons of gas the last month, and not only contaminated that hole, but every hole in that manhole run. The contractors had another crew working several holes down, we called and told them to quit going in the holes. We went down there with another detector and even though you couldn't smell gas the detector was going off. When we told the contractors what was going on, they said; "No wonder we both got headaches!!!"

Now, when they are with me, they don't complain about the "safety rules." I follow the rules for 2 reasons: 1.) They are put in place to keep me and those working around me and observing safe. 2.) I can be fired for violating these rules and the union cannot keep my job for me in these circumstances. I can't find another job with the pay or benefits I have very easily; however, the contractors aren't paid very well, and no benefits and can find something else with the same pretty easily, so they just don't care. I guess the moral is: You get what you pay for.

Union strong, Union proud

I thought union workers respected other working people.
So you disrespect a person who makes a living by push a broom.

What he's probably saying is that you need experience to go down that hole. UAW seems to think anyone can do it with minimal training. That's why UAW is a paper pusher, instead of a ConEd employee..

They didn't strike the company locked them out. They threatened to strike, but a threat is not the same as actually doing it. You can say you think they would have went on strike, but that's an opinion since we can never know now that ConEd has forced them out.

The company locked them out only after the strike deadline was met.If you can't be sure your workers will show up you need to make sure someone else will be there to do the job. So they scheduled salary people to do the job and locked out the workers in reality to protect the people doing the job from having to deal with people calling them scabs etc.

Agree with everything. Excellent post. Every time I hear someone in government say they won't compromise (Boehner, for example, said he wouldn't do it and wouldn't even use the word) I think about the founding of the country. The constitution was the ultimate compromise. The anti-federalists wouldn't have passed it without the promise of, what is now known as, the Bill of Rights. The constitution is better because of that compromise. I wouldn't eliminate either part.

LEFTISTREPORTING

Your missive illuminates the conundrum voters face. Vote for the evil you know or the one you don't.

The vast majority of the people haven't yet realized that both major political parties are in reality nothing more than flip sides of the same corrupt coin. BOTH parties bow down to the very same powerful money and special interests. The primary difference in the political system as it currently exists is which night the party holds their fund raising dinner on. The GUEST LIST IS THE SAME!!!

The true "LOSERS" are the voters who actually believe their "candidate" is better than the other. As they say, "Ignorance is bliss."

I agree. I think a good clear example is campaign finance reform. About 80% of Americans want CFR so why don't we get it? Why doesn't Congress even talk about it? That's where they make their millions. Strict CFR would eliminate the flow of lobbying (legalized bribery) cash. You think your representative cares what you want? No way. They do what the people with money tell them to do.

But don't worry, everyone. The parties tell us if we vote for the correct letter everything will be fine.

For them.

I retired from management of a major midwest utility

Yet you didn't state if you came up through the ranks. Every bitches about the saleries and benefits yet how many would climb the poles or go down into the manholes in winter or summer conditions. These same people can.t stand it without their convinences yet bitch when those that will get them back on line want payment for it.

Today's big businesses want nothing more than profits. they will cut back anything and evetrything to get better profits regardless of the result.

I watched Uniter Water in NJ cut all their workforce back to the bone. today they have a major multi day water main break that they can't repair quickly.

Enjoy the heat people. The leaders of big business is looking out for you. No Like in the past the utility companies will not pay overtime to have the work done as quickly as possible to save a buck. They could care less about the customers.

Great rant, Smoke, but not very helpful to the discussion.

Union - non-union is one of those topics that has emotionally-controlled adherents; much like democrat-republican, liberal - conservative arguments.

Your use of "flame" terminology (Tea-Publican, Fox Noise, Dopes - all "color/emotion" words) doesn't help your argument. It only tells the reader where you stand. You could have spoken succinctly and just said: "I am a liberal union member."

Smoke: Good post. It appears the tbaggers posting here have missed the history of growth in the U.S. and how the middle class rose to have quality in life. If history is not studied, it's repeated.

Mpa-4893349I understand my use of inflamed rhetoric,isn't your cup of "TEA",but I'm sick and damned tired of the TEA-PARTY NATION and the distortion of facts ,as related to unions and their HISTORY of helping to creating the GREAT AMERICAN MIDDLE CLASS,and all the BENEFITS to our CULTURE and SOCIETY,derived from those UNION ACTIONS.I am AM a PROUD LIBERAL DEMOCRAT and FORMER MEMBER of the USWA.The idea that because union members are more educated in our work place environment and will not be pushed to the trash HEAP of CORPORATE outhouse status,without a fight,or expression of HYPER emotion,makes us thugs,well BooHoo.I don't apologise for my posting and the name calling,when all i see from the Right Wing is absolute lies,and distortion and vile disgusting names for the President and organized labor leaders and members,of gov.unions.Why not look at the REAL causes of this financial mess,instead of kow-toweling to the corporate puppets, and repeating the same distortions and lies???

Why not look at the REAL causes of this financial mess,instead of kow-toweling to the corporate puppets, and repeating the same distortions and lies???---- Because if neo-cons did this their entire being would shatter like a mirror.

Dennis very well said, And when middle class thrive there's job growth, Its middle class that creates jobs not the presidency but presidential policy and companies outsourcing to undermine the middle class will add to job losses, the middle class is who pulls the weight of this country and as it goes by the wayside so will this country.

What you 2 do not get is that only, I repeat only 15% or so of this county is Union with about 7% of that being the Gov. The problem is that that 15% is in near everything the 85% of the people who are not in unions have to pay more for. Those 7% of the Gov are creating a false middle class as the taxpayers are being overburdened by the overcompensated wages, benefits and pension we are force to pay. Paying more for substandard service is one of the many points on why the real middleclass people are suffering these days. All you have to do it look at your property tax bill, compare 5 years ago to this years and what I see is an increase of $1400 a year. How nice of the police, firemen and teachers to take more from our household while our household income has dropped. Now onto the private sector, this company is private and so they should have the right to move to a 401k should they feel the need. Bottomline is Unions are writting the papers, doing the news, making movies, building cars, trucks, building our roads, doing our plumbing and electric, they are in all areas and they are increasing the cost of each and every single product, service and tax we purchase and pay which is making for a non-competitive country on a global scale. What this means is these Unions and those jobs are actually overburdening the majority of middleclass people because as mentioned above Unions are only 15% of the people that work in this country yet they effect the cost of everything in this country, thus the Unions have created a false middleclass.

Dennis.... one question.

Where are the clothes you're currently wearing made?

I can honestly say everything I'm wearing was sourced and made in the USA. Can you? Oh, and it was made in Union and Non-union shops.

Dennis, you nailed it.

@ UAWwhatever: Substandard service is a management issue (not enough people). Bad design is a management issue (cheap Chinese crap made by slaves).

I point to GM: their management team was scrapped- but not the workers, and not the UAW- yet they are now kicking ass with their products.

Gee...I wonder where the problem was?

You know this, and I know it too- so why this empty sophistry about an artificial middle class?

You're not going to convince anyone who isn't already brainwashed into agreeing that unions- a nearly dead institution- are the core of all evil; and we're all doing so much better with multinational corporations holding the reigns instead, aren't we?

Union members are not just the few remaining elements of a once prevalent middle class- the tattered remnants of a once robust economy- but are now scared to death that they'll lose a century of progress as folks like you attempt to reinvent slavery amidst the ashes of the American Dream.