because there's a web of trip wires? maybe that's it

has anyone on the vine heard about the phone call, this person received right before he started shooting, it has been reported that two people outside of the theatre saw him take a phone cal, listen for several seconds, hang up, put it in his pocket and then calm ,cool and collected walk in and start shooting, if this is true, something may be going on here.

I'm sure they could get a neighbor to allow them in; however I'm pretty sure they are thinking they would rather have a robot blown up, rather than a human, since there is no way of knowing how good this guy is a booby trapping.

honestly i would think the same cut a hole in the wall and look thru im sure there are lazer beams to detect movement because when they ripped the window blinds out nothing happened,, i know they want to be safe but when there is a bomb in the building anywere else the bomb squad goes in to get it!! its like they are dragging this out..

just sayin..

what do all those links have in common or are related to this?

They should just chain Homes up in his apartment and slowly continue the deactivation.

OK so your saying since those games are crude and violent thats what made him commit these crimes? Then what do you have to say for the millions of people who play those games daily and commit no crimes whatsoever. If a person is gonna snap do to an untreated mental issue he can watch sesame street all day and it still does not matter if hes gonna kill hes gonna do it!!!

We have been told for decades that certain types of music, or movies, or television, or video games, or ... whatever ... are behind such atrocities. This is bunk. It has always been bunk. While fortunately very rare, such things have happened since human civilization began and unfortunately, they probably always will happen.

dmatthews3

".... If a person is gonna snap do to an untreated mental issue he can watch sesame street all day and it still does not matter if hes gonna kill hes gonna do it!!!"

Yes, but then the question becomes at what point do we warn Elmo, Big Bird, Cookie Monster, et al, that they are at enhanced risk?

Isn't Oscar grouchy enough already without the additional worry?

And when Big Bird gets upset he ... molts (and nobody wants to see THAT!)

It's a conundrum.

Brad,

"Have the perp walk into his own apartment! That would be justice, that he would die by the results of his own hand."

That would be justice, but I don't think this guy planned on returning home. He probably figured he would be killed, and he decided he would booby trap his apartment so that, in case he was killed doing his dastardly deed, he would take as many people with him as possible when they went to search his apartment. His planning was truly diabolical. I'm sure the apartment owner and his insurance company are not going to appreciate this.

Seems to me like this guy has created an elaborate puzzle. Just like the actual Joker does against Batman. If so, he may have accomplices who have not been identified yet. Holmes apparently spent a lot of time thinking about this evil caper. There may be trip wires and mechanisms connected to much larger buildings and adjacent structures. If I lived in any building near his apartment or on that campus, I wouldn't feel safe until they 100% debugg his evil plan. The theater was just an obvious trip wire. Because he apparently was patiently waiting to be apprehended. This guy seemed to have another"Final" target Destination in mind by the way he rigged his apartment. Scary stuff.

The authorities are absolutely correct in preceding very cautiously with Holmes. At least until his complete puzzle is unraveled. In the interim, maybe they could use a few "enhanced interrogation" techniques on him like they used on his terrorist kindred spirit (Khalid Mohammad). At least inject his azzz with truth serum to make him answer the questions correctly.

JohnnyB,

"Holmes apparently spen a lot of time thinking about this caper."

Yes, he did, but it seems to me that with such meticulous planning on his part, it is going to be hard for the defense to claim insanity. He clearly knew exactly what he was doing, and it was obviously premeditated murder.

Just one more thing. Based on Holmes Biological and Neurological science background, I would be very afraid that his trip wires lead to some kind of bio terrorism weapon were I the authorities. I hope they truly proceed with extreme caution against this evil, genius maniac. Assume the worst case scenario possible until proven otherwise with him.

@ Mickey:

That's the scary problem. He doesn't seem to be concerned at all about a defense. He was just waiting to be caught. I have only seen that kind of eerie detachment in movies. Or with real psychopaths like Charles Manson.

Hmmm...

I urge all news agencies, all news sources, and all news people, to never mention this evil cretin's name again. He and his name should be shunned. Instead of using his name, it woudl be okay to use the term gunman, or shooter, or coward. That would be like letting the air out of his balloon.

@clwyd-2621393...

While I agree that more guns on the street might not (OK probably wouldn't have) prevented this, making guns illegal definitely would not have helped either!

Explosives are illegal but he still had them. So it just proves the point that if you make something illegal then only criminals will have them. We don't need to make guns illegal, WE NEED TO MAKE THE LAWS PUNISHING THOSE WHO ABUSE THEM MORE STRICT AND FEARFUL!

I've said it a million times here on newsvine:

Drugs... Illegal but I can get them ANYWHERE (even in jail/prison).

Prostitution... Illegal but I can go to ANY city in America and get a $20 blowjob.

Cigarettes... Illegal to anyone under 18 but you can see minors smoking cigarettes at any highschool in the USA.

Alchohol... Illegal to anyone under 21 but underage drinking takes place in all areas of America.

My point is that gun control advocates don't put enough thought into the things they say will end gun violence.Bring back the cruel and unusual punishment of stoning/hanging/beheading. make the punishment so haneous(don't really know how to spell that word) that it dishonors you and your family name that it will make people fear committing the crime.

When I was a child it wasn't fear of a timeout that kept me from breaking the rules! It was the FEAR of the phrase "JUST YOU WAIT TILL YOUR FATHER GETS HOME" and the beating I would recieve when he did that kept me in line. The "rule" had nothing to do with it.

Definitely agree that the media needs to not put the shooters name into the news reporting. Or even put his picture out. They need to keep this sick guy from getting the media exposure he wants. Report on the actual facts. Give us stories about the victims. But leave this sick man to stew in his juices.

I too don't agree with alot of what the NRA preaches, but I am against anything that takes away my right to own a gun. Or anything that gives a corrupt government official the right to decide weather or not I can own one! In my town its the police chief who has final say as to who gets a pistol permit. Members of his force have family members who openly commit crimes and punish others who commit the same crimes. I don't want someone like that having the final say over weather or not I can own a gun.

So yes ridding us of the NRA may be good in some ways but it would also be bad for others. I feel the same way about most organizations, religious,racial or political!

If we got rid of the NRA i would not be long before ALL guns would be illegal. Most organized groups fight blindly fo their own cause. Is wrong but there really is no other way.

We don't know what is in there. A bomb squad just busting thru may end up dead. The a-hole was a graduate student, going for a PhD, so there is no way of telling what sort of chemicals, gas or explosives he may have known to brew. Plus, there is no telling what type of fusing or trip wire system he could have used. He's probably not talking about it either except to tell them it is booby-trapped. Probably wants to take out more people if he can. Let them work the problem out, even if it takes days. No sense in more dying just to speed up the process to disarm the traps.

Yes. All guns would be illegal! How wonderful and to H with the 2nd Amendment which has been abused by the NRA.

clwyd-2621393 That's your Governors problem. He should not have backed down from the NRA. I am a card carrying member of the NRA and I have a concealed firearm license in Texas. I had to pass an extensive class on it and had to qualify at a range with the weapon I would carry. There are many things one who carries should know, such as, if the police enter the picture, drop your weapon and assume the position on the ground, arms and feet spread, until the police can verify you are not the suspect. Many things a carriers needs to know are taught in these classes. Your governor is spineless for allowing the NRA to convince him otherwise.

Also clwyd-2621393, do you really think the NRA supports gun rights so people can go out and kill other people for the hell of it. They are there to protect our right to protect ourselves, our families and others if the need arises. To provide the freedom to hunt is another reason. And, do you think that making guns illegal will stop the criminals and mentally ill from getting weapons? The only thing it will do is leave us defenseless against the criminals.

Thank you! I agree that Scott Walker and the republicans are spineless wonders controlled by big business, big corporations and the NRA.

johnny you suggest they torture a man, but you won't say ass?

Sorry clwyd, but it will never be illegal to own a fire arm in the United States of America. The 2nd amendment was designed to provide the public with a means to protect itself. To protect itself from an abusive government. Just look at Syria, Lybia, Iran. The people wanted a change, and they were killed, because their governments had nothing to fear. I own three side arms. One is a replica of a 1850s era cap, and ball black powder revolver. I have no supplies for it, and it is completely useless as is. One is a small .380 pistol. It is small enough that my wife could use it if she needed to protect herself, and our three children. The last is a .45. They will not be removed from my control, except by me. Look at the incident last year, when a young mother was at home alone, and two men broke through the door in an attempt to attack her. Had she not been able to access her shotgun, she would have been killed, or more than likely, raped and killed. Guns do serve a purpose, and are only as dangerous as the person holding them.

That would be justice, but I don't think this guy planned on returning home. He probably figured he would be killed

Either that or being sent away to some nice comfy cell with fluffy walls and Barney to keep him company. Either way this fruit loop has NOTHING to lose now. Twenty thousand bucks says that's where he'll end up.

We must reject the idea that every time a law’s broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each individual is accountable for his actions.~Ronald Reagan

Always it is someone else's fault, never the fault of the criminal. How many dead in Mexico? 55,000? Guess what, Mexico bans guns. So, let us not look at the criminal, let us instead ban guns. That will be perfect, because then only criminals with criminal intent will be able to kill you and you, gunless, witless wonder, will be a sitting duck. You may as well paint a target on your forehead.

Sheesh, the anti-gun people are going to protect themselves how? Oh, they won't need protecting because guns will be illegal and no one will have a gun. Yes, and after Cinderella married the prince they lived happily ever after....in a fairy tale world. Enter the REAL world and see how long you last. Knives kill people, bats kill people and, are you ready? Bombs kill people. Bombs can be made with mothballs and karo syrup and a few other household cleaners. You gonna protect yourselves from everything and anything? Really?

Joe Johnson,

"Sorry clwyd, but it will never be illegal to own a fire arm in the United States of America. The 2nd amendment was designed to provide the public with a means to protect itself. To protect itself from an abusive government. Just look at Syria, Lybia, Iran. The people wanted a change, and they were killed, because their governments had nothing to fear."

Except that's not quite true. In Syria, at least, people were allowed to own hand guns as long as they had a license. Check it out here:

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/syria

The same is true of Iran. Only Libya prohibited the ownership of guns.

It's really pretty simple...If you go through a wall, you don't know what you are going to disturb on the other side. If you go through a window you can see what you are up against.

Well, he was clearly an evil genius, with a captial E.

Thank God we have equally brilliant members in Law Enforcement to counter nuts like these. Kudos to the State and Federal authorities for their skill and bravery.

@Clwyd OK Clod lets say all guns should be illegal, if the public is dis armed then the police should have no need for guns either so they should give up their guns as well right! right so now who does that leave with guns. Pencils can't spell right should we get rid of all the pencils.

now there is a conspiracy theory developing because the perp was seen outside the theater and received a short phone call, after the call he calmly walked in and did his dirty deed, suggesting he was not alone or he was programed to do this, was he? who is it that claims to have seen this, can phone records be researched? I have my doubts about it being so but I suppose its possible, now lets eliminate the guns and this freak still wanted to do this, what would stop him from booby trapping the theater or a mall, or simply walking in with some home made incendiary bombs and killing everyone? you cant stop someone like that from acting out the act of terror that they want to inflict on others, so guns really have nothing to do with it. besides this same thing is happening all over the world even in countries that have strict gun control laws, and lets not forget now days bombs are the chosen weapon for terrorist and they kill more people faster then guns. eliminating guns won't stop the killing it might even make it worse. remember Timothy McVay, Richard Speck, The Manson Family, the Green river killer, and a dozen other killers with the exception of one incidence involving a .22 in the Manson murders all the victims died extremely horrible deaths by other methods, ropes, swords meat forks, knives, clubs and bombs. and those of you that claim America is the most violent country in the world haven't been around much have you, take a little trip to Mexico, or the ME they have us beat 1,000 to 1, try Africa all you have to do to die there is show up. if you take away the 2nd amendment you throw out the whole constitution, is that what you want? the constitution will unravel without the second amendment, and the bill of rights will only be a memory. and that is exactly what some people in high places want, not that it makes the world a better place but it gives them control.

My deep heart felt condolences to Victims, their Families and Friends for this atrocious and cowardly act.

@Joe Johnson-438582

"....The 2nd amendment was designed to provide the public with a means to protect itself. To protect itself from an abusive government."

Joe, that's an interesting opinion and creative rhetoric, but is not in any way supported by fact.

The Second Amendment was in response to Congress' recognition that the United States of America, a then just 2-year-old infant nation and Republic of United, but individual states, did not have either the functioning institutions in place, or the wherewithal (financial and otherwise) to support a standing army for National and common defense. For this reason our Nation's defense against an invader would lie in the citizens keeping (in their homes) and bearing arms (when called to defend the states and nation).

The individual states were expected to raise "well regulated militias" which in a time of National emergency could be called into service to defend the Nation, and to defend the several States. The states' National Guard units still use the image of the Revolutionary War Minuteman as their symbol.

This rhetoric suggesting that the Second Amendment is intended to protect you from your own government is hog-wash, and is a cynical and unworthy perversion of the founder's intent.

The text of the Second Amendment, as passed by the Congress:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

As ratified by the States and authenticated by Thomas Jefferson, Secretary of State:

"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.^"

You are of course entitled to make up your own mind, but you are not entitled to make up your own facts.

I'm just sayin' ....

If you say we should amend the Constitution to outlaw guns (which is certainly possible, if there is enough popular support for it), then we should also amend it to outlaw violent video games and movies. The vast majority of people who use guns and/or violent media are responsible, law-abiding folks who have no criminal tendencies. So liberals who would place more restrictions on our second-amendment rights should be discussing limiting our first-amendment rights as well, as both of those rights do contribute to certain disturbed individuals carrying out murderous sprees such as this one. I'd be willing to bet that even the Batman movie these folks were gathered to see contains quite a bit of gratuitous violence. No, I'm not blaming the victims for anything, I'm merely pointing out the inconsistency of the lefties' arguments.

Actually, believe it or not there is something to that old "violent video games cause violence" argument. You see back in the '80s I got really into Tetris, like REALLY into it and before I knew it all I could think about was fitting blocks together. I finally decided to become a brick layer so that I could do it all the time. It was a pretty good job and I would still have it today if I hadn't discovered Breakout.

@GAdude

"liberals" .... "lefties"

Do you honestly think that using such labels as pejoratives defines your own rhetoric as sound and well reasoned? Intelligent individuals read such silly pejorative labels and quite rightly immediately disregard whatever else the user has to say as being juvenile.

Your, slippery-slope argument is unworthy of any real discussion on any subject because it is diversionary and counterintuitive. It presumes the inability of human beings to limit and contain. Just stay on topic and deal with the issue at hand, rather than attempting to say that the reason 'a' is a bad idea is because it will inevitably lead to 'b' and 'c'. Hogwash! That's just rhetorical fabrication.

I'm just sayin' ....

Joe Johnson,

You can never convince me or others that the 2nd Amendment ever was meant to put AK-47's in the hands of the public for protection. Nor the semi automatic that Holmes had that had a clip for 100 rounds. Get real! Stop the NRA! Use them for target practice!

I don't think it should be a defense. But, I have no doubt in my mind that Mr. Holmes was mentally ill. That people can't get help for mental illness is part of the tragedy. Charles Whitman's spree required detailed planning also. It turned out he had a large brain tumor that caused his behavior.

Joe,

I have read not one story the past week about someone being saved from a crime by owning a gun. I have read about 100+ people being killed by people in their own families, a neighbor, in a movie theatre etc. Your argument doesn't hold water and comes right from the NRA Magazines I've read! They did a good number on you!

So my last comment was a joke. Maybe a poorly timed joke, but I thought it was funny none the less. Anyway, to everyone ripping on Joe: Yeah, he got some stuff wrong about the second amendment, that's true. But he was absolutely right about one thing that is hard to argue with. "Guns do serve a purpose, and are only as dangerous as the person holding them." This is absolutely true. A gun is an object which can be used to hunt, target shoot, murder, defend or hold down paper in a windy office. What the user does with it is his decision.

Robert in Oregon: "Liberals" and "lefties" is pejorative? I thought I was being polite by using fairly benign terms. If you think those labels are offensive, you obviously haven't been reading these comment threads for very long. I've seen labels used, by both the right and left, that I'd be embarrassed to repeat. But you misunderstand my point; I'm not saying that A is a bad idea because it will inevitably lead to B. I'm saying if A is a good idea, then B is a good idea too because they both played a part in this tragedy. To advocate A but oppose B is being hypocritical. And if you consider the talk of amending the Constitution to be "off topic," don't blame me, I'm only responding to what a previous poster--an apparent lefty--suggested.

You people are wrong that the right to bear arms is only for defense of the country. In fact, the founding fathers were proud that they could let the citizens of the US keep arms. One of the reasons was to keep the government in check.

"And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms....The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants" (Thomas Jefferson in a letter to William S. Smith in 1787. Taken from Jefferson, On Democracy 20, S. Padover ed., 1939)

"The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." -- (Thomas Jefferson)

It was also for general well being:

"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise, and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks. (Thomas Jefferson, Encyclopedia of T. Jefferson, 318

Also for self defense:

"The supposed quietude of a good mans allures the ruffian; while on the other hand, arms like laws discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside...Horrid mischief would ensue were one half the world deprived of the use of them..." (Thomas Paine, I Writings of Thomas Paine at 56 [1894])

This quote from "The Prince"

"You are bound to meet misfortune if you are unarmed because, among other reasons, people despise you....There is simply no comparison between a man who is armed and one who is not. It is unreasonable to expect that an armed man should obey one who is unarmed, or that an unarmed man should remain safe and secure when his servants are armed. In the latter case, there will be suspicion on the one hand and contempt on the other, making cooperation impossible."

"Stop the NRA! Use them for target practice!"

Thank you. You make the case for responsible owners so easy.

So, where does a poor grad student get the thousands, if not tens of thousands, of dollars to organize this level of chaos. An arsenal of weapons and ammunition, body armor, intricate explosives and triggering devices in his apartment? Unless mom and dad were just sending him money without regard to how it was spent, it seems funding would be an issue.

Regardless of his mental status, this money had to come from somewhere. He will obviously try to plea insanity and with his neuro-science education he may be able to bolster that argument. But the fact that it took weeks, if not months, to construct this rampage must have been funded somehow.

The most aggravating part is that it will take years to finally try, convict and sentence this deviant.

ArchStanton ... Insightful post! .... I hope more people view the links and think ....

It's interesting that either the "Ostrich" community or commercial interest, target such post to be " Comment collapsed by the community" The fact that this happens does not speak well for the community or NBC news intellectually for practicing tolerance regarding Free Speech!

"All men were made by the same Great Spirit Chief. They are all brothers. The earth is the mother of all people, and all people should have equal rights upon it. You might as well expect the rivers to run backward as that as any man who was born a free man should be contented when penned up and denied liberty..." Chief Joseph said this a long time ago, and liberals are always reminding us of what "we" did. Now I am going to remind liberals what happens when only those in power have power. I am a free man and shall remain so. If mr. whack job would have locked the doors and pumped poison gas in what would you blame then? Let me guess, guns.

White people seat down and plan to murder other people months in advance and they all seem nice next door neighbors. At least you can identify and avoid black thugs.

romilio what? i think maybe you might need a little time on the couch!

jimspence how many times do parents send their kids away so they dont have to deal with them. its easier to spend money than to deal with issues. dont know if this is such a case but you see it all the time. outta sight outta mind

Roodles

"You people are wrong that the right to bear arms is only for defense of the country. In fact, the founding fathers were proud that they could let the citizens of the US keep arms. One of the reasons was to keep the government in check....." (I will not repeat the rest of this garbage post from above)

Roodles, your posted quotes are utter nonsense, made up out of whole cloth, and you know it (or you should know it).

It is downright shameful for you to perpetuate fictitious quotes supporting your political position(s) and assert that those statements were made by the founding fathers of our nation. You should be ashamed.

Lies and fabrications are a disreputable way to argue a point. If you have a point, make it. But don't invent your own facts and argue that they are expository of the validity of your argument. They are in fact only expository of your willingness to deceive.

I suggest you might want to give honest rhetoric a try.

http://www.guncite.com/gc2ndbog.html

f hill

Well, I hate to judge a parents motive but you have to wonder about this "genius" James Holmes. Was he the typical nerd that was bullied and picked on? While he was at home he may have felt some level of safety and reassurance, and then when out on his own the wheels began to come off, as they say. I have a nephew who was the quietest, best student you could ever want until he went off on his own to college. One disaster after another, drinking, car wrecks, assault and today he's barely getting through his local community college. This case seems similar, although my nephew didn't take his problems to this level by any means, he only hurt himself. Holmes seems to have just gone south, quitting his PhD program, being the almost prototypical "quiet shy guy next door". In the meantime planning one of the most horrific massacres in our history.

This seems awfully similar to the Norway massacre where Anders Behring Breivik detonated a huge home-made bomb before shooting 69 people at the Labour Party's summer camp. I'm not saying it’s a copy-cat case but you have to wonder after the elaborate booby trapping of his apartment whether Holmes wanted his to be a little more dramatic and devious, like the Joker.

But what also concerns me is that Holmes mother allegedly said, "You have the right person" almost immediately upon learning about the identity of the shooter. What would drive a mother to say that with hardly any hesitation? The usual response should be "Oh my God, no, it can't be my Jimmy" or something like that. Now, I read somewhere that she said "Are you sure you have the right person"? So it may just have been histrionics during the unfolding of this atrocity.

It seems this story will have quite a few twists and turns before we find out what made an otherwise normal appearing 24 year old snap so violently.

Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde must be watching this one quite closely.

has anyone on the vine heard about the phone call, this person received right before he started shooting, it has been reported that two people outside of the theatre saw him take a phone cal, listen for several seconds, hang up, put it in his pocket and then calm ,cool and collected walk in and start shooting, if this is true, something may be going on here.

And if it is true, it would have been verified by an MSNBC reporter and we would have read it in a news article, on this and other sites. In the news section. Not a comments section. Please don't start rumors.

If I later read about it in a news article, I will apologize in advance, but till then, really. Please don't.

Except that's not quite true. In Syria, at least, people were allowed to own hand guns as long as they had a license. Check it out here:

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/syria

The same is true of Iran. Only Libya prohibited the ownership of guns.

And the Egyptians overthrew a government with a massive military machine without any firearms. Can you imagine what would have happened if everyone in Tahrir square was carrying a machine gun? The tanks would have rolled in, every protestor would be dead, and Mubarik would still be the Egyptian President.

It was the moral authority of NOT HAVING FIREARMS that allowed the Egyptians protestors to succeed.

And that was not the only time that has happened. Ever heard of Gandhi?

Byron Raum,

"It was the moral authority of NOT HAVING FIREARMS that allowed the Egyptians protestors to succeed."

I wouldn't argue with that. I think you misunderstood by post. My post was in opposition to Joe Johnson's post. He was arguing that we have to have firearms in order to fight the government if it ever becomes tyrannical, and he pointed to Syria, Iran and Libya as examples of people who could not resist the tyranny of their governments because they have no weapons. I said that was not true, and that people in both Syria and Iran are allowed to own firearms. Only Libya prohibited them from owning firearms. I further gave a link to support my position. That kind of undermines his position that firearms are necessary for overthrowing a tyrannical government. Just the opposite appears to be true. Neither Syria nor Iran, both of which allow their citizens to own firearms, has been overthrown (at least not yet), whereas Libya, which was the only one of the three governments to prohibit firearms, was overthrown. So Joe Johnson needs to rethink his position.

A well thought-out and civil post, Mickey (Will you give some thought to allowing us to clone you?)

;-)

One recurrent theme we have seen played-out during the so-called "Arab Spring" is the inability for tyrannical governments to hold their military together for long once the weapons of the state are directed on their own people who are rebelling for the purpose of freedom from tyranny. Those weapons used for repression are eventually are turned on the government.

@Byron Raum

" ... And the Egyptians overthrew a government with a massive military machine without any firearms. Can you imagine what would have happened if everyone in Tahrir square was carrying a machine gun? The tanks would have rolled in, every protester would be dead, and Mubarik would still be the Egyptian President. It was the moral authority of NOT HAVING FIREARMS that allowed the Egyptians protesters to succeed...."

Byron, that's a very interesting insight. I am old enough to have still vivid memories of the Tienanmen Square protests in 1989, in Beijing, China. The world watched with fascination as unarmed peaceful protests against the totalitarian government proceeded day after day. Probably the most enduring image from those protests was the young man who stood before an advancing column of tanks, and stopped them. That image said as much about the courage of the commander of that lead tank as it did about the courage of the young protester.

The protests were eventually put down with extreme violence, by military units which had no knowledge of the real nature of the protests, only what they were told by the government and their commanders. Those military units which had intimate knowledge of the real nature of the protests in the days which proceeded the crack-down had all been sent back to their barracks, and other units brought in from regions outside of Beijing.

The free world was well aware of what was occurring in Tienanmen Square, due to western journalists sending their stories out of Beijing. But the citizens of China outside of Beijing were not aware of what was occurring. There were no state televised images, no state radio broadcasts, no state-controlled newspaper reports. For the people of China there was information blackout about the freedom movement of their fellow citizens.

Just as access to information unlocked the shackles of repression in Tahrir Square in Egypt, the blocking of access to information laid the groundwork for the defeat of the freedom movement in Tienanmen Square in China.

The events of Tienanmen Square in China and Tahrir Square in Egypt suggest to me that the emphasis by some in America that the Second Amendment is the protection the American people have against the rise of a repressive and tyrannical government is off-base.

I would argue however that it is the First Amendment in the Bill of Rights which contains the potent and unstoppable weapons against government repression and tyranny:

Freedom of speech, freedom of the press and the right to peaceably assemble.

As long as the freedoms contained in the First amendment in our Bill of Rights are protected in America, no government repression or tyranny will ever take hold in this nation and be allowed by the people to succeed.

Mickey, if I recall correctly, the Libyan uprising was a "shooting war" almost from the very start, so the revolutionaries must have had access to weapons from somewhere. And you're conveniently glossing over the fact that the Libyans eventually succeeded in ousting the regime only because NATO intervened, providing even more lethal weapons--air power, specifically. So the Libyan uprising really doesn't fit into Egypt's "peaceful revolution" mold. I believe the non-violent overthrow of Mubarak in Egypt was the exception rather than the rule. The ruling regimes in Syria and Iran aren't going anywhere, unless forced to by armed insurrection. Iran has proven this in the past, Syria is proving it as we speak.

Brad-727901 Comment collapsed by the community

This well educated kid grew up in America, was educated by our values and social attitudes. I think one could argue that this kid, aside from genetic mental illness...

Holmes was well educated and grew up in a "normal" America. There is no excuse for the mayhem and carnage that he has caused. This guy did not have mental illness in the usual sense.

Holmes was angry, narcissistic and felt that the world owed him more than what he had.

Mental illness should not be a "legal cover" for Holmes to escape accountable for his horrible acts!

GADude,

"Mickey, if I recall correctly, the Libyan uprising was a "shooting war" almost from the very start, so the revolutionaries must have had access to weapons from somewhere. And you're conveniently glossing over the fact that the Libyans eventually succeeded in ousting the regime only because NATO intervened, providing even more lethal weapons--air power, specifically."

I never said the Libyan revolution was not a "shooting war". I only pointed out that among Syria, Iran and Libya, Libya was the only one that prohibited its citizens from owning firearms. So the weapons they used during the revolution were obviously obtained illegally. Now, as far as the intervention of NATO is concerned,, you have a good point there, and anyone who thinks that the right to bear arms gives him the ability to overthrow the government if it becomes tyrannical should keep that in mind. The government will always have you outgunned and outmanned, no matter how many weapons you own, and you can't count on NATO to come to your assistance, either. The right to bear arms, as recently interpreted by the U.S. Supreme Court is more or less a palliative for the feeling of impotence that many people have. It gives them a false sense of power against what they perceive as a tyrannical government. In reality, the only benefits of the "right to bear arms" are for hunting wild game and protecting oneself against burglars and other individual "bad" guys rather than against a tyrannical government. On the other hand, the "right to bear arms" also allows deranged people like James Holmes to engage in mass shootings of innocent people as just occurred. One thing more, you forgot to mention Tunisia where the "Arab Spring" began. That was also a peaceful revolution that succeeded.

Their just mad, and want revenge. At the end of the day though, most people are probably glad we have due process. I admit, it does suck that the tax payers will be paying for his defence, room and board, and all appeal costs from her on out... I see how people sometimes wish that in open shut cases like this, they would just kill the guy. If we did that though, we would move back two hundred years... No good answer.

whatever evidence is in there needs to be preserved. When a seemingly "normal", albeit brilliant, student suddenly decides to withdraw from school and had his grades suddenly plummet, there has to be a reason.

He wore total body armor to make sure he wasn't stopped; he willingly surrendered to the police after the incident. In almost every case of these types of shootings, the shooter either kills himself or goes down by police bullets.

I'm certainly not buying into the conspiracy and terrorist theories, but something is not making sense about this whole thing....

It's obvious from her posts that Shandril is the kind of person who would get out of her car and sweep the roadway ahead so that she wouldn't run over and kill an ant or something! Seriously though I agree, put the sob who has killed all these people in front of his door and tell him either get in there and clear that crap up or you're not going to make it back to the jail! It's clear he doesn't want to die, he turned himself in!!

Force Holmes to stay in his apartment during the deactivation.

Doug...What we sometimes forget is that the youngest among us are also the least experienced and the least possessing of wisdom only age can grant. Shandril has easy, glib answers that don't work with maniacs who long ago went undetected in our society. We have become a society that is conditioned to brutality, violence and the desire by some who lust for blood, guts and their entrails displayed as "art"...this is civility? We have to start clearly identifying mental illness and that includes extremisms we all try to ignore. The more we ignore it, the more outrageous their need for attention and their moment of glory becomes. Ergo..Holmes and the rest of the misbegotten youth who need 10 minutes of fame the fastest way.

Markus, a witness described a second man who took a phone call and then opened the emergency exit (starts around the 4:00 mark on the video)...

**edit**((okay my link didn't work, so just look up "Witness describes 2nd accomplice in Dark Knight Theater Massacre" on Youtube))

The big mainstream news outlets (both liberal and conservative) are conveniently leaving this out. Something is fishy for sure.

MarkusBWolf - My best guess is he thinks he is smarter than anyone else around him and he wanted to stay alive to hear the media and the police say how smart he is. that's why the body armor, that's why he surrendered quietly. If he killed himself, he couldn't hear how great & famous he is.

And just so we're clear, I don't think he is great or smart. Just guessing at why he didn't kill himself or challenge police to kill him.

I don't think this guy would care, then again, he did give up quite easily.

Shandril

"Move to Afghanistan. Such attitudes have no place in the United States".

I normally do not agree with some of the things you say Shandril but in this case I do. We are a much more civilized and moral people then many other countries.

This 'person' is more than what appears on the surface. Looking into his education and educational choices he is more than a 'rogue killer' out for revenge or someone who just snapped. This required lots of planning and lots of money. Ammo ain't cheap, ditto the guns and other items. Where did he get the money? He collected unemployment and that is going to pay for several thousand dollars worth of equipment?

There are these people who are anarchists, they seek the destruction of society, the disruption of society and the Black Bloc groups that tied into the OWS are examples of this mindset. The Weathermen, the SDS, hell, most radical anarchists would indeed pull something like this off and have done so in the past.

As other posters have noted, there is more to this than a killing rampage. The booby-trapped apartment is an indication as is the fact that someone like this perv would delight in setting bombs and incediary devices in other highly trafficked areas. Not too many people are aware of how readily certain biological agents there are that can be purchased from the internet, and the person doing the buying could pretend to be connected to a university (which this perv was) and get hold of some rather nasty stuff.

Mygirl, I wondered about this too. A guy like this can apparently go unnoticed, and get all the goodies he needs. If he were an extremist muslim, we might have stopped him in his tracks, or not. Perhaps our main enemy comes from within. 21 people shot in Chicago in <24h.

One more reason to stay home and watch the DVD. Way too many wackos anymore.

shandril do you need help packing

Shandril, you are a pathetic idealist. I think people have a right to be mad, angry, over this senseless act of horror and violence. Should we not be mad at this? Is there something about this act that is rational? You call Poor-man an animal by his statement of anger? Who are YOU to judge??? Get over yourself. This young man who committed this gross act of violence pretty much reminds us , AGAIN, that we have plenty of "animals" right here in our own neighborhoods, cities and towns. If this young man enjoys killing innocent people, maybe we should strap him onto a drone and send his a$$ to Afghanistan where innocent women and children can be massacred! I think you need to open your eyes to the truth of violence, not only in Syria, but right here in our own communities and on our own TV and cable programming.

Brad what are you? Twelve years old? There is no "right to be mad." Thruout history people have used upsetting events to get rid of democratic rule of law. Then a leader who will grant the people desire for revenge in exchange for power arises. This is the difference between us and the middle east. All you mention here is some emotional talking points that are common in the media but have no validity. Get an education and get control over yourself.

Brad,

Not doing what you suggest took us hundreds of years to accomplish. Summery executions and public displays of violent killings of criminals were the norm until we built a justice system that prevents us from acting on our worst momentary emotions. Count to ten, Brad, and take a deep breath...don't become the monster you are trying to kill.

Mike4703 and culheath..... I am not saying anger is "a right" politically, but it is a natural human instinct, not unlike eating, fear, reproduction, etc. Have you had someone you loved killed in cold blood??? I have. I understand the feelings of gut anger and the depth of sadness in cases like these. I am saying there is justification for anger in the face of gross atrocities. There is justification to be angry when acts of gross injustice and violence in perpetrated. Yes, if we could all be robots and control our anger and "do the right thing," history books would read quite differently. I have lived through numerous wars to know that countries avail themselves to revenge. 9/11 ring a bell??? So your desire to uphold me to YOUR veneer of "civility" rings hollow and unrealistic. Rule of law? Seriously? Does Guantanamo Bay represent a "rule of law" and civility? People, innocent people, have been held for years by our "civil" rule of law. Executions happen every day in our "civil" land behind lock down facilities and barbed wire. "Civil"??? You both are deeply naive.

Brad,

You do have the right to be angry, however even criminals have some rights. Taking revenge on a murderer voids their right to due process, a right that everyone in the US has a constitutional agreement to. Revenge is never the answer, hate and violence should never be answered with hate and violence. This is why the Middle East is so mired with internal conflict. The tribes continue to fight over things that happened hundreds of years ago, they want revenge for those past actions.

It would be synonymous with us going to war with Britain or Japan of Pearl Harbor or the Revolutionary war for the next fifty years. At some point you have to learn that if you want a peaceful society where the majority of the populous does not act violently then you need to stop acting on some of your emotions, you have to treat the desire for revenge as you would a bomb or any other dangerous weapon. You also have to accept the fact that criminals do not lose some of their rights when they commit their crime and that only a court can remove their inherent right to life *through the death penalty).

That does not mean you bottle your emotions up or disregard them, instead you try and keep yourself from acting on that emotional state. Thinking about killing someone in revenge is fine and legal so long as you do nothing because of those thoughts.

Some rights need to be voided. OR, send him overseas to his special friend that they built a special prison cell for and advertised for volunteers to befriend him.

When your kids die revenge is sweet compared to the law and five years in prison.

Brad-727901 Would you be singing this same tune if this guy was your brother. Yes, we have a right to be angry but we do not have the right to turn into the same animal as he is!

Brad---true, during the past fifty years, politicians have created mountains of rights for criminals.

I wonder if they will make a movie of this next?

Some rights need to be voided. OR, send him overseas to his special friend that they built a special prison cell for and advertised for volunteers to befriend him.

When your kids die revenge is sweet compared to the law and five years in prison.

That's kind of the whole point. The law isn't about revenge. The law is about justice.

There are many convicted 'murderers' who are actually innocent. This has often been proven. Should we allow every aggrieved parent to take revenge on anyone they think is their child's murderer?

Not all so-called murderers are as clearly murderers as this guy. There's lots of times when there's lot of reasonable doubt. We cannot make rules based simply on what this guy has done.

Because the next innocent guy wrongly accused may be YOU.

Think about that. Too many times, people only think about being on one side. There's always more than one side to almost any situation.

LOL! Best post ever.

Way to lighten up the mood... lol

yeah what will they do with that? I know landlords are a B@#$C about nail holes, wait till they find out he got bombs in that apt.. HE GONE..literally

Depends on the incendiaries... some, like thermite, contain their own oxygen and can burn in any environment. Some can even burn underwater.

And thermite is easy to make. all it is is a pyrotechnic composition of a metal powder (aluminum, iron, etc.,) and a metal oxide that produces an exothermic oxidation-reduction reaction known as thermite reaction. And the scary thing is this stuff is available to anyone on the open market. (P.S. I worked with explosives in the military for 25 years).

Yeah..really. To hell with the concussion and fire. Don't let that loud boom get you.

I don't think everyone would know what to expect in a controlled detonation, so maybe she just wanted to put it out there. Some people might think controlled, very little noise or something like that. She has a community she is trying to calm.

No, everyone knows that bombs go boom. She's an idiot.

"In my expert opinion, bombs go boom."

Because the lame stream media will wet their pants if they aren't expecting it.

Earthie, are you really that stupid? Who do you think taught the soldiers how to disarm the IED's. Most of the time, the IED's are blown in place. You did know this right? And if you owned the apt building, you would not want part of it blown to pieces either. The FBI does know what it's doing, so does the NSA and the CIA.

I still don't understand how ONE guy walks into a full theater and no one makes an attempt to stop him.... ONE guy.... Everyone just sits around or trys to run away, why is it no one stands up for themselfs?

I agree Miss Jami. Maybe they're not trying to scare the crap out of us (and themselves)and cause hysteria.

I hope they take EVERY precaution, are light-footed and quick!

Entertained...Try walking through a smoke bomb. The first reports in the early hours from victims was that the perp first set off a smoke or tear gas bomb to incapacitate the victims and make it easier to kill them. This guy planned this for months. Even if there were 10 people armed in that theater trying to see through the smoke would be an even worse blood bath.

Entertained Onlooker

I still don't understand how ONE guy walks into a full theater and no one makes an attempt to stop him.... ONE guy.... Everyone just sits around or tries to run away, why is it no one stands up for themselves?

Terror and panic...most people are not trained to override their immediate emotional responses in such emergencies...not mention that anyone approaching him would be shot before they could get to him.

And let's say someone in the theater was carrying, do you want them to just start firing at him through the smoke and confusion with a hand gun and possibly killing other people without even hitting a guy armored to the max ?

Ewent:, was typing as you posted.

culheath...I so agree. When Gabby Giffords was shot in a state that has far less gun control, one of the reasons no one armed on that street that day fired back was because they feared being seen as the second shooter. So much for that band aid of arming the entire country. That's not the answer and never has been. You don't use a weapon to encourage peace.

It was a dark theater. I don't know how long before the lights came on, some theaters are automated these days.

He also set off tear gas. Very few people can shoot or fight with tear gas in their eyes.

The only guy in the room who was both armed AND had a gas mask was the perp. If he had a light on his gun, pretty much the entire theater was little more than a shooting gallery. He had nothing but time and a helpless audience.

I still don't understand how ONE guy walks into a full theater and no one makes an attempt to stop him.... ONE guy.... Everyone just sits around or tries to run away, why is it no one stands up for themselves?

I also thought that with the fact that there were a group of navy men there, but think about it there were a bunch of teenagers there and parents, so the parents tried to save there kids so they could get out and the teenagers ran out also I do not think there were too many adults to take the guy down they were helping others, factor in smoke screaming and hysteria, it would have been hard, to all who were there you did the best you could, I hope you all recover from this nightmare!!!

just sayin..

I'm sure they are considering the possibility, since they are much smarter than you.

Entertained Onlooker Imagine this: It's a dark theater, there is loud audio coming from the movie, someone starts shooting and you think it is fake then you see people fall. There is a dark figure at the front of the theater shooting real bullets at you, wearing a gas mask and all the garb of a military man. Do you run towards the bullets or run the opposite direction? Split second decision here Entertained Onlooker. What do you do?

Unless you have ever been in a firefight, with brothers around you protecting your ass, the natural human instinct is to run the other direction and survive.

Join the military, get shipped to Afganistan and run towards the bullets in a firefight! Oh, and good luck!

Seems that these things bring out the NRA's trolls and their talking points are highlighted in every dialogue.

No-one, outside of the military needs an assault weapon. If you hunt, you should have a rifle. If you want to defend your home/family, go ahead and get a handgun. Just lock it up at home and keep it away from ME and my family. I support having guns for ONLY the two reasons outlined above, by non-military personnel. How would that affect you?

But if a person needs a drum to hold 100 rounds of amo, whether for personal protection or hunting, I would say that person must be a very lousy shot and everyone around him/her better run for cover.

UWS,

To clarify:

The shooter did NOT have an assault weapon. He had a semi-automatic rifle.

No, he had a weapon that, with a minor modification, could be made fully automatic and thus be classified as an assault weapon. But we're just splitting hairs here. The NRA which is primarily a gun manufacturer's trade association wants NO laws regarding gun ownership. NO laws regarding ammunition. NO laws regarding who may own a gun. NO laws as to how many guns can be purchased in any time period. And NO laws as to what kind of weapons can be made or sold in this country. Thanks to the NRA there are millions of fully automatic weapons floating around this country, more guns than humans in the USA. If the Founding Fathers could be alive today to see what the second amendment had become, would they have decided to place it in the Constitution anyway?? Doubtful. That is, doubtful to everybody but a true NRA apologist.

Uh, no genius. The news media are not responsible for this. The person in police custody is responsible. How dare you put this on people you do not know, that are out there doing their job of informing the public to keep us reminded of the issues we face in this country. You don't like it, stay ignorant. How dare you attempt to place the blame on my profession.

Bluelake....no amount of gun control can stop someone from mass murder. Remember his apartment is rigged with explosives; he could have just as easily detonated a bomb or released a chemical agent and killed hundreds. Something broke in this guys mind, but he is extremely intelligent; whatever his motive, he would have found a way to carry it out...guns or no guns.

pccrawford...VA Tech, Birmingham, Oklahoma City...and you don't want Americans to know about these insane individuals? No amount of gun control will stop mass murderers? Well of course not. Not when there are so many loopholes in gun control laws it poses a mass threat to the rest of society. Holmes proves one thing...there's a fine line between genius and insanity and anything can tip the scales at any moment. He had the money to stockpile an arsenal most poor people and the Middle Class don't. Watch how Big Daddy come to his rescue as he likely always has and uses mental defective as the excuse for Sonny getting off with "mental insanity". Sorry, this guy planned this for months. It took that long for him to amass his stockpile to create his own personal "entitlement" to his own Armageddon. There are too too too many others who think they have the right to stockpile their arsenals in their homes and then when they snap...the rest of society is supposed to condition themselves to this kind of brutality? In a civilized society? BS.

Actually Bluelake, the civilian AR-15 isn't easy to convert to full auto. It requires changing several parts, which require registering with BATF. It is a very costly alteration. The rifle itself cannot be altered without changing the upper, and lower sections, which require a number of permits, and licenses through the federal government. The rifle cannot just be altered through filing pins, or through machining, as it was required to be difficult in order for it be available for civilian purchase. It is actually a number of very major, and expensive modifications.

Joe,

Give up. The "experts" on "assault weapons" have probably never fired a BB-gun. TV shows are their main source of information about guns.

So what I'm hearing from you, PCCrawford, is the US should be more like communist countries that control all media outlets and nothing gets thru to people except very sterile, non-contiversial news such as garden parties or soccer games...???

If the Founding Fathers could be alive today to see what the second amendment had become, would they have decided to place it in the Constitution anyway

Bluelake: The second amendment is not in the Constitution itself, but in the Bill of Rights. I'm not a member of the NRA, but it's aims not what you say, It's really needed because of people like you who want to take this right away.

Wally, I cannot believe the amazing ignorance of "people like you". I mean did you just totally sleep through all of your civics lessons??

"The second amendment is not in the Constitution itself," Really? The Bill of Rights are the first ten amendments of the American Constitution and are thus part of the Constitution. Preamble, amendments, they are all part of and inseparable from the Constitution of the United States. No amendments, no Constitution Wally!!!

Joe--- I'll defer your gunsmithing knowledge, but tell me, how difficult is it to but an "illegal" fully automatic assault rifle (any type) in the USA? I don't know, can you tell me?

I am a liberal and I don't know anyone who is pro gun control...not one

rwalker-2504195, I too am a liberal and I really don't know any liberals who are pro gun control... But I do know a few conservatives who are... I think the BS about liberals being anti-NRA or pro gun control is a smokescreen. I know more conservatives who want to accuse liberals of this or any other crazy stuff. It is bad when you can't win an argument without pushing the other down. I always thought you should raise yourself up..

But if a person needs a drum to hold 100 rounds of amo, whether for personal protection or hunting, I would say that person must be a very lousy shot and everyone around him/her better run for cover.

Are you talking about Dick Cheney?

its seems like these booby traps are getting this guy lots of extra news coverage.

The way I see it is, the bombs were supposed to be the primary attack and while all hell is breaking lose back at his apartment he has a better opportunity to use up as many of those 6000 rounds he had at the theatre and maybe else where.

This is how I think it shook down:

Irritated neighbors report hearing very loud music from his apartment around midnight then it stops.

• Maybe, he was testing his cell phone to see if it would activate a remote switch (and get neighbors initially irritated as they said they were) to turn the music on or he triggered the switch at the theatre (he was seen on his phone) and for some reason the music stopped on it's own.
• My guess is he was hoping someone ( or a particular person or cops) would become irritated by the music and go to his apartment. The door might even had been left un-locked. The trip wire would do the rest.
• Cops and rescue would be occupied allowing him more time to kill.

The cops say he is not cooperating with them.

• Then why would he volunteer info about the bombs? I don't think he did. I think he merely asked the cops probably as a matter- factly about the planed explosion as the cops responded to the theater quicker than he expected.

I think his night of terror actually failed to reach completion (thank God) and the devastation in fact was designed to be much larger than what he was able to get away with.

vigilante behavior is not encouraged. Have you heard that violence breeds violence ? how violent was that movie ? enough to push a demented kid right our of his element ? possibly it was the last straw.

alumette...Not true. Holmes planned this before the movie was shown. Next excuse for his Lord of the Universe behavior?

I agree he should be made useful in terms of helping with disarming his flat. He did it, he should be made to un-do it. The problem is that he cannot be trusted. He may blow himself up with several other people. I wonder how long his psychotic behavior will last ? I think he is on a variety of meds/drugs and that affect will surely change. It may be a week before he can recover his original "identity" and behavior. He will then be on suicide watch after he evaluates what disaster he created. The snag here is that he was planning this event for some time since he had to purchase so many items, not easily available and that may blow the temporary psychotic behavior out of the water. We see some chronic, long term issues here and no one stepped in to fix it. Who knew he was a time bomb ? anyone ? his parents ?

I'm still wondering about that comment from his Mother????

Maybe because it felt like a cool thing to do until he was in custody. Imagine killing cops while in their mitts. I hope you are right abut the rest of it though. The thought that he faked the booby trap crossed my mind.

I asked where and how he got the mortar and aerial shells, not why he did it.

As for where he got the shells... No clue. Most likely he found a dealer online. Probably black market style.

My husband and I both thought the same thing about the traps possibly being fake. Who knows? Maybe the guy thought it'd be fun to see how many precious hours and resources he could make the authorities waste on nothing. Or maybe he could have used fakes in a diversion for something else. He did call himself the Joker, and that does sound like something the Joker would do. It just doesn't make sense (not that any of this makes sense, but still...) that, after going on a shooting spree in such a way as to assure a high body count, he would willingly tell authorities that his apartment was rigged. He had to have known that they would search his apartment after he was in custody. If he wouldn't have said anything - assuming the traps are real - he could have doubled both his body count and the amount of fear in the population. (Typical goals of individuals who commit similar crimes.) But, by telling them about it, I am sure he knew that the authorities would clear the area and carefully dismantle everything. Why go through all that effort for nothing?

peachesncream...that's part of the problem. We insist that drug manufacturers, the agricultural industry and auto industry produce safe products and then allow the gun manufacturers to sell online to just about anyone with little or no regulation. The VA tech shooter was the same high intelligence level as Holmes. Until gun manufacturers and the sellers of these weapons of mass destruction have their feet held to the fire of accountability, we can expect more of these mass murders. Guns are big time profit.

Yet, the NRA is chief among those who want absolutely no references to accountability for the sales of these arms online. That means any nut who obsesses over the glory of killing masses of men, women and children in some bizarre sport, will do this again and again.

ewent

Why don't YOU try to buy a gun online and see just how easy it is.

He purchased two weapons locally, all the rest and ammunition online. I they said he had purchased 6000 rounds of ammo online recently.

Actually, any gun you buy on line has to be shipped to an ffl dealer who then has to do the proper background check and paperwork before you get to take possession of it. Also to another post, you can not own a fully automatic weapon legally unless it is on a registered list with the BATFE and those go for around $20,000 and up along with a full background check and 8 to 12 month process of going through the BATFE before you can take possession. So the NRA is not what you claim it to be but an advocate for gun rights for people who do obey the laws of the land. When you outlaw guns only outlaws will have them.

Wouldn't expect the gun haters to know anything of what they speak.

So instead of educating them in a concise and decent manner, you deride and denigrate Wally. How special you must be. Try giving the information and then if they still don't get it or are being obtuse, IGNORE the poster. I know some people deliberately "misunderstand" and it can be annoying. Try for a tad of civility. If one does not know something about guns, and can only repeat what they may have been erroneously told, then that does not make them a hater, it makes them uniformed. Use the occasion to educate.

These post don't do anything to boost my confidence in the average American's ability to maintain themselves. Brian here instantly jumps on the media as causing the problem while neglecting the obvious fact that millions of other people had the same information and did not go on a rampage--the problem is with this particular person--as for sensationalism, that's been a part of the American media for a hundred years, it's just more intense now with video and internet technology. But how could this be changed? Government regulation? What about free speech especially now that the Supreme Court in the Citizens United case give corporations the same rights as individuals? Going off on your own emotional rampage when posting to a discussion doesn't really help anything either. How about thinking first?

i understand your thought but when he bought the guns he was not a maniac, untill he went to the theater and shot those people thats when he became a maniac so the places that sold the guns should not feel bad only in the since of people dying in this tradgedy..

just sayin..

I doubt. The gun shops owners never seem to care what crimes are committed with the guns and ammunitions they sell. They claim they are only making a living . These people have minimal conscience. They should all be arrested and their shops liquidated. Crime would go down.

Proof of concept, the guns work!

A state trooper shot himself after he realized the stolen gun used in a multiple homicide was the same gun he checked at a routine traffic stop near my home town........(he ran a check on the weapon and mistyped one number of the serial number of the stolen gun and felt responsible)....

Some people can't deal with being even remotely attached to horrific crimes.......some can...

Should not bother him one bit.

He was in business, he followed the law.

Would a person in Walmart feel bad about selling a baseball bat to someone who later used it to kill?

Not hardly.

Please don't drive!! You may hurt someone while texting and the salesman would have all this guilt from selling you your car!! What an idiot!!

Builders844

THAT was good!!

AND the guy who sold the cell phone could be traumatized for life too!

They should all be arrested and their shops liquidated. Crime would go down.

Dumb comment, alumnette...then only criminals will have guns. Is that what you really want?

He is a sick and demented kid, not a terrorist even though his actions appear otherwise. There is a big difference.

Timothy McVeigh was also sick and demented as well by exploding a bomb. He got what he deserved.

@alumette you're right he couldnt be a terrorist he is white.

We talk about disaster preperation but how many people plan for the " police action" where you can be out of your home for hours or days . In this case it involves 5 buildings.

@alumette: Maybe you and Shandrill can get together in the perps apartment building and have a "PETA party! Sheesh!

How would you collect the guns? The government can't even figure out how to remove illegal aliens, and you expect them to take firearms away from the people?

On the other side have you ever seen the Constitution?

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

Notice where is states "the right of the people" this was even confirmed by the Supreme Courts.

You Loose.

OKC Bombing

Federal building destryed by truck bomb ergo..

trucks = bombs

no trucks = no bombs

thats how easy it is!

McVeigh = no guns

Unibomber= no guns

Are you really this much of a simpleton Volker? You must be a liberal progressive lefty.

Wally-1853299, not all liberals are against guns! I am a liberal and own several guns for protection and the fact I like to hunt and target practice. Don't generalize so much. It is very insulting. Just call them what they are dum. They don't realize that all of us can't afford to live in gated communities with 24 hour security.

Thanks sheepdog, wally and his broadbrushing was getting to be just a tad too much.

He had no history of any mental illness or police record...one speeding ticket.

He wasn't mentally ill, he just wanted to do it, plotted for MONTHS and carried it out.

There was a profiler on the news yesterday who stated people who do these types of things are either mentally ill or it's for revenge.

This guy was brilliant, many have said so, which is how he carried all this off, unfortunately. He graduated in CA with a degree in neuroscience but couldn't find a job so went to Aurora to do his graduate work.

I'm going with the revenge angle as he was not happy about not being able to get a job, probably lots of anger, lots of stewing and obviously planning and executed this devastating event to get even at whatever he thought he should get even at.

Has any republican ever said that. Name one.

To I'm Not Voting for You - Behavior like this is certainly tied to mental illness issues. Inability to constructively deal with intense anger, rage, feelings of inadequacy, and the lack of remorse for the victims (sociopathy /psychopathy) are all mental illness issues. The fact that he is highly intelligent made him even more dangerous by giving him the ability to plan and plot this and carry it out. Intelligence is not an antidote to mental illness. ANYONE can suffer from some form of mental illness. And this man is one of them - his ability to do well in life and school for some time but then completely unravel is a significant symptom. Don't get me wrong, I don't believe that mental illness is an excuse for killing and violence. It is an explanation. We all still have choices to make and consequences. Legal definitions of "sanilty" or "insanity" are not related to mental health but to a legal definition of knowing right from wrong and whether a person can assist in their legal defense. Thus, you may know that what you did was wrong and be legally sane, but still have done those deeds as a result of mental illness - because you just don't care. I do not agree with verdicts of "not-guilty be reason of insanity". We should have a legal option of "guilty by reason of insanity" which would still require protecting the public from persons like that but also require appropriate treatment for their mental illness such as medication.

Wally,, Ronald Wilson Reagan. And he did cut services to the mentally impaired. What he said was that there was no reason that the state should take care of these people and that their families could. They were sent to their families (who could not control them before hand, and then they were turned loose into the general population of the US). This is one of the reasons that we have so many fruitcakes walking around as it is.

So it seems like Reagan DID help supply the Democratic political machine with voters! (LOL).

God and the NRA have absolutely nothing in common....

Witnesses said he stopped and reloaded; no reports actually said he had a hundred round drum on the weapon, only that he had purchased one.

Actually you can't Rob.

And certain Government-supported groups (ie, Planned Parenthood) can kill MILLIONS of UNBORN BABIES! because it is LEGAL! ( I figure that this comment will be collapsed because certain individuals can't handle the TRUTH !)

You want to blame victims for other victims' deaths? The nut threw tear-gas canisters before he started shooting. It was dark. A shooting scene was playing loudly on the screen at the time. I can't think of a more chaotic background, except for maybe an actual war skirmish.

To bad you weren't there to take care of this for us.

And where are you talking from? A quiet room somewhere, far away. How brave of you. What kind of @!$%# are you to tell people caught up in this sudden deadly chaos what they should have done?

Fear, shock, confusion...the adrenalin rush turns off a lot of brain activity. I had the same thought initially, but my common sense prevailed.

It's dark, the gunman wearing black, smoke from a gas cannister, people screaming. At what point do the folks in the theater get into a huddle & plan a take down...???

Dumbazz made this same comment previously, too bad he wasn't there.

I suppose you also think that if more people owned guns or carried guns this could have been stopped. What about the innocent audience - mostly children? You expect law abiding people to shoot at or try and take down a madman dressed in full military/police protective gear? All those people needed was for more guns to be blazing.

Remember the shootings in Arizona (Gabbie Giffords, etc.) - there was an armed off-duty officer at the event. He said he thought of using his gun but figured the spectators would think he was also a shooter - maybe being killed himself. He also said his use of his gun would have caused more confusion and chaos.

One person stated get rid of the 2nd amendment in the constitution - I want to see that!! you would have and war you have never seen before - 12 dead would turn into several million people before they got took the guns away... you can take that to the bank and that is not the answer to the problem...

martindmm, agreed! Automobiles kill thousands each year. Are they going to ban those next? Prescription drugs kill thousands each year, and I am talking about people just taking their doctor ordered medicine. Do you all want to ban those next??

No you can not get a hundred round clip off the internet, you can't get a fully automatic AR-15 without going through hell and high water with lots of money. There are a lot of gun owners who are never going to do something like this. Yet it happens sometimes, just like a train wreck, just like an airplane crash, and just like a 20 car pileup, just like the drug companies are paying fines for dangerous drugs and no warnings. Did you know that almost all prescription medicine has very dangerous side effects? Did you know you could possibly die from taking a medicine that counteracts with another of your medicines? Did you know that out of 1000 people a few may be killed by taking a drug and the FDA won't tell you that? Think about it!