Oh please! What person wouldn't do that for someone they love? It isn't "heroic." It's human nature.

Shandril... no its not. human nature is to fight or flight for survival. If you cant swim you end up pushing those down so you can stay up. That is human nature and sometimes love does or does not trump that. When love does... its courage. And you my dear are a douche.

yes, remember him and his selfless act .. he loved her too. i am sure and wanted to protect her..god be with her and his family,am so sad we lost him and the others.those children that were there to see their hero, america is behind them wanting them to know to trust in us..we are there for you..god bless america..

Oh please! What person wouldn't do that for someone they love? It isn't "heroic." It's human nature.

Of course it is human nature. And human nature is often heroic. That's kind of the whole point.

Shandril, I find it interesting that you troll every Colorado tragedy article... and every comment you leave is cynical and borderline ridiculous. Why take the time out of your day to put this guy down and what he did to save his girlfriend. I don't get where your coming from, the fact that you even have the nerve to put him down like this blows my mind. The problem with society today is we have too many people like yourself and not enough people like Jon.

Your pathetic... Many people wouldnt do that. Its not human nature to give your life for another, its human nature to take care of yourself first especially in these types of situations. This man is a hero and should be honored for giving his life for someone else. I'd like to see you do what the man, the military, police officers, and fire fighters do and go risk your life for others and then say its just 'human nature'... Heroic isnt even giving him enough credit for what he did. Have a heart.

Shandril Comment collapsed by the community

Oh please! What person wouldn't do that for someone they love? It isn't "heroic." It's human nature.

--------------

I disagree.

Given that I believe we were born into sin, we have a natural sinful nature as humans. We are greedy, selfish(even in relationships), and self-seeking. Just look around if you don't believe me. Goodness and kindness is a rarity today indeed. This was HEROIC in every way! These type of men(and even good women)do NOT come a dime a dozen, so yeah I don't agree with you that it's common or that it's "human nature." Human nature is more often OPPOSITE of what it SHOULD BE. I also agree that you're wrong about EVERYONE doing this for someone they love. I know plenty of couples who are supposed or claim to "love" one another, but I know a for a fact that if it meant saving their own life, leaving their partner behind or throwing them in front of the bus.

My point: It is NOT Human nature to give up your own life. Human instinct is usually to SAVE YOUR OWN!

but I know a for a fact that if it meant saving their own life, leaving their partner behind or throwing them in front of the bus.

This was proven also during this tragedy: people stampeding, injuring, and unfortunately I believe, killing people on the ground trying to get out. Let's wait and see how many were murdered by bullets, and how many were murdered by others in the theater.

@YesIDid, a bit extreme, don't ya think? There is way more good in this world, than evil. "All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke

No, I don't think it's extreme given that's I see all around me.

Shandril, I would have pushed you in front of me assuming I would have even taken you to a movie, not!

The difference between a hero and most of us is that a hero unlike most of us acts out of her/his values and conviction - whereas most of us generally would act out of our instincts.

This young man clearly is a hero.

@Jewels:

I don't know. Maybe I'm just a: "The cup's half full kind of person" or it's because of where I live or maybe I've lost faith in humanity, but I notice more greed, selfishness, etc... more often than I do kindness(I do think it's rare. That's my opinion, regardless of what others think. They just see it differently I guess.). We live in a very "face-paced, it's all about me" kind of world. I noticed a lot more kindness and goodness growing up, I don't see that nearly as much anymore.

Extreme? No, not at all.

come on people Shady shandril is just trying to stir us up lets not focuss on her like she wants lets focuss on the story.. just by ignoring her it will actually make her more peeved...

IGNORE THE IGNORANT

just sayin..

Utmost respect for this man for doing what he did. Would everyone do it. It is not known until you are faced with the same circumstances.

What I find to be really sad is that people can't even acknowledge a selfless act without ripping into each other. Everyone of these blogs turns into a huge fight or disagreement and people trash talking other people and calling people childish names. It's sickening. Anyone else think that may be part of the problem in the world today. NOBODY has respect for anyone anymore. NOBODY can disagree with someone without being attacked by the other person. Grow the *$&( up people. Learn a little respect. Sometimes it's okay to just keep your pie hole shut, even if you don't agree. You have heard the saying better to keep one's mouth closed and let people think your an idiot, than to open it up and remove all doubt.

Come on. Get a grip. This was a national tragedy. Stop beating each other up behind a computer.

@ YesIDid believe me I've been there, neighbors barely talk to neighbors, friends are far and few, struggling economy, genocide & hunger, terrorism, rape, murder, etc.. I can not judge what the norm does or doesn't do, for they may not share it with me, so I do not know. Realistically I can say when stories like these hit the news and no one reacts, when we as humans stop showing compassion and empathy, then and only then evil has triumphed over good men.

It's hard not to grow insensitive with all that's happening today, but some things may not be as they seem. For instance the world wide web has only been with us maybe two decades. News confronting us faster, wider range of information from around the world. We hear about things that were never covered in the daily news, or in the paper the next morning. While we were growing up we only knew about major news, and things within our region. So it may seem as though the world is getting worse, or it might just be that we are actually able to hear and read about things that wasn't available before. Plus there's a broader prospective on reporting on the horror, than good.

Call it what you may. Regardless, this brave man placed himself between his friend and harms way. None of us will ever know what was going through his mind during those horrifying minutes. His actions saved another persons life, that's good enough for me to honor him as a hero or just a very good friend.

Hopefully his girlfriend uses this blessing and makes the most out of her life, it's the least she can do for Jon.

Don't feed Shandril the troll

so sad jon. we dont see alot of young heros any more other than our military god bless you

Its amazing to go thru that. I can only imagine something like that and what was going thru the minds of them. Instinct takes over and only when its over do people realize the what they went thru. I feel so much sorrow for those who were injured and killed for what? This is the time when people come together and what sets us apart from others..our compassion for other humans will be the defining moment. Its a very dangerous game that those who speak to us play and cannot be good. We can and should change this by looking deep into our souls. This aint right and cannot be accepted in our society. We must love one another and look out for eachother. At least thats the way I live my life. We live in a time when people are influenced by what they hear by others in higher platforms and the hatred that is spread. We can rise above that and should. CONTRIBUTE TO THE FUND TO HELP THESE VICTIMS AND SHOW YOUR COMPASSION AS A HUMAN WHO CARES..I have and will do more..as much as I possibly can.

SHANDRIL...you are a douche!

Yes,

then you are surrounded by selfish individuals. It is human nature to be selfish, yes, but it is also human nature in a civilized society to care more about the lives of other people who are defenseless in this kind of situation then your own if you can protect them. Not just your family, they may be higher on your priority list, but others, strangers, as well. Anyone that says different is plain old selfish and needs to re-examine their ideology and work to change themselves.

This guy was a hero, but he was also acting on instinct. The strong should protect the weak, those are the principles this country was built on.

geowil very well said!

buerger dont like it move on and keep your stupid comments post on the haters site

sad...kumbaya...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYJMtn6IJeE

I don't like the word "hero". It's cheap, overused, and never appreciated. This kid protected his girlfriend in a flash moment filled with panic and fear. That's it. He didn't know he was going to die for it. He made a split second decision. Any "man" would take a bullet for his significant other or child. That's what I think.

As far as the fighting back and forth goes, it's easy. We are behind computer screens. We don't have to look at each other in the eyes. There are no consequences. Also, sometimes texts can be misinterpreted because it is emotionless. It is a public forum and no one wants to be ridiculed in front of everyone. It's the nature of threads. No need to get excited about it. In fact, mind your business, lol.

a simple 'hero'defenition;scared @!$%#less and thinking sorta logical,not knowing exactly why at the time and living to tell about it.or not...

I sure do feel for those that lost their lives and loved ones, He is/was a real gentleman for the sacrifice he made to save his girlfriend. He should not be forgotten. and I do not care what some of you think He is a hero. Think on it, how many ran for their lives like, every man/woman for themselves. It is easy to say what you would have done If you were there. But they were there, we were not. Rest in Peace you 12. It makes me mad as H-ll and sad, all at the same time.

em129836 stop the trolling

I find that the comments that each person leaves here really only tell one thing...what that one person would do. Not to mention that it say's a lot about the differences in everyone.

I know, and can say without hesitation that if I had been in that theater when this happened with my family that I would not have ran off to save myself as some people are saying. Sure, nobody is saying they would do that in those words, but when you say that human nature is to save yourself...that is (In the context of this story.)what you are saying. If I were sitting there with my child, I would die if needed to save my child. I may run...but I would be behind my child providing some form of cover, but never would I leave a loved one in danger to save myself. I KNOW that. That also includes anyone that I love and cherish. I personally would not accept to be called a hero for doing it.

Giada, of course a mother would save her children and a man would probably save his wife, i know my husband would, but would u give ur life for a boyfriend that you have only been with for a few months knowing that you are going to leave ur babies without a mother. i seriously doubt it. and as far as the news, every single day i hear of several deaths at the hands of others. its every single day all over the world. i hear a story about a hero once in a great while. you need to watch more news and see the truth. you and shandril really should think before u speak because the fact is, u don't know what u would do in this situation. when people leave a comment with a rude tone about an article of this type of course people are going to be mad at you. comment respectfully and we won't think you guys are ignorant.

As a victim-survivor of horrors like this, the media is correct. Those of us who were there and our friends and families don't have feeling concerning the loved ones cut down at the age of 5, 10 or 21. The newscasters able to create in everyone's minds the incredible horror, pain and turmoil that our loved ones must have endured in the final moments of their life, are sure to placate us in our time of grief. We will carry with us every day the graphic descriptions by news video and print repeated over and over of the blood shed, the splatters of blood on those running from the scene and wonder, "Could it have been our babies blood that covers them?"

Thank You. Thank You for reminding us that we can't keep them safe. Thank you for showing repeatedly that they died in agony and pain. Thank you for telling us about the chaos and no one stopping to help those injured. Thank you for letting me know that my baby died with no one there at the final moments. Thank you for giving us images that will last a lifetime of blood splattered seats, blood covered people and pools of blood with no one helping those we brought into this world and loved so dearly.

points to ponder for what its worth im with you nice statement

A brave , selfless act.

Actually, saving a loved-ones life is not human nature. Remember the couple with the 4-month old and 6-year old. All he could think about is if he went back in, then he might get killed. Therefore he did not look for his family nor did he go back in...However Jon's human nature would not allow him to do the same. Let's celebrate the fact that there were and maybe still are people in this world who care more about others rather than themselves and let's celebrate Jon, a true hero indeed.

Shandril, Va Fancullo ! you deserve to be impregnated by Holmes

Too bad my Mom wasn't there. She has a concealed weapons permit. She would have fired back for sure. I bet that little dick would have ran off after receiving a few .40 rounds in his face. This is a perfect example of why we have the right to bear arms. I can't believe that nobody in that whole theater was packing heat. It just gives clarity to my Dad's advice when we were kids in the mountains of Colorado: "Better to have a gun and not need it, rather than need a gun and not have it." That advice was meant for horseback in the mountains. Evidently, it holds true for City folks as well.

The guy was wearing full body armor,and your Mom,Annie Oakley, wouldn't have had a chance,big shot !

The USA is Sparta reborn......the folks who were shot in a theater, were attending a Dark Film which promised extreme violence,death and injury.....America is a nation at War today in Afghanistan and in our streets at home due to economic warfare.....America has been at war every year since I was born in in 1944 during World War II.

America is a dangerous War obsessed empire with military bases on 79 of the nations of the world...79...many of them secret and in places which you would not expect.

TV is full of violence,Movies are full of violence,Sports herald violence and award violence....."You shall reap what you Sow......."

liam have you ever thought of canada?

hero (male) and heroine (female) came to refer to characters who, in the face of danger and adversity or from a position of weakness, display courage and the will for self sacrifice—that is, heroism—

Jansen is a Hero .

Geo, well said. I notice the same thing myself. People cannot help but put eachother down for the dumbest of reasons. Just because you don't agree with someone doesn't mean you need to insult them. If you do disagree, just say so and make your own point. Name calling is extremely immature as far as I'm concerned.

dissapointed and ashamed

I don't like the word "hero". It's cheap, overused, and never appreciated. This kid protected his girlfriend in a flash moment filled with panic and fear. That's it. He didn't know he was going to die for it. He made a split second decision. Any "man" would take a bullet for his significant other or child. That's what I think.

I agree that the word "hero" has been cheapened and overused; the proof is that you don't actually recognize when someone does something heroic. This young man did something heroic. Calling firemen "heros" for doing their jobs is what cheapens it.

Thank you Browenstein, your post sums it up. Every time I hear someone referring to all cops and all fireman as "heroes" simply because that is their chosen profession, I cringe. There are many cops and first responders that HAVE elevated their selves to what most would term hero status by totally putting their own safety aside to save others. Simply being a member of "the force" certainly does not come with automatic hero status. And as you clearly stated, referring to them as such does cheapen the word. This gentleman's actions were indeed heroic.

Seems that many posters can't discern between actions taken under expected fire to those actions taken when hostile actions were never imagined to occur.

Seems that what is missing from these threads is for a combat veteren in hand to hand to weigh in on what actions the military trains them to take.

No doubt, ms young will always remember mr blunk as the one saving her life and therefore her hero, but shandril has also made a point...

What person wouldn't do that for someone they love? It isn't "heroic." It's human nature.

My point in all of this is that today's media in so many ways has minimized the meaning of "hero", turning its meaning into a generic word incompassing many things.

Human nature = flight or fight. With proper training one minimizes flight and maximizes fight instincts for survival. Many commentors appear to want to use only emotion over reason.

Hey, how was that Nora O'Donnell !!! What a way to try and draw every last bit of emotion from her interview with the veterinary lab assistant !!!! I do feel empathy and sadness for these two victims but the utter audacity of MSNBC and their ilk makes me want to VOMIT !!! All for the big dollar sign, and they (News stations ) are all guilty !!! Like Brian Ross at ABC trying to link the TEA Party for a little more sensationalism !!!

Shandril’s cynical comment was undeserved and highly inappropriate. She immediately cheapened a story of a quick thinking young man who put the safety of another above his own to a debate on human nature and the meaning of hero.

I mean really? The guy died tragically and this is what she wants to talk about?? And worse, a few people actually take up her argument and some actually gave her a thumbs up?? It is absolutely amazing.

Ignore the inane comments. Praise the heroic act. It was indeed heroic...

I think what he did was a selfless act, trying to protect his girlfriend. His wife said he was a hero as well. This should give his children something to think about as they grow up without him.

Yes....I refuse to believe that...I know it seems most days that all there is is bad news...but that is what sells...we hear more about the bad than the good. Besides, there are many heroes that don't have their story told because no one knows about it...people that volunter to help a storm victim or a homeless person get a meal...

Don't give up...believe me, I feel that way sometimes, too, but I still have hope for us.

Shandril, it sounds to me you wouldn't mind being used as a human shield. Your ignorance shows why this country is screwed up.

i wonder why no mention has been made of the Ohio brothers who shielded a women with their bodies and 1 died defending her.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Ohio-man-among-Colorado-shooting-victims-3724960.php

"Evil prevails when good men fail to act" As long as there is evil in this world there will always be someone to fight against it. Giada R Sabatini I am glad you are able to see the good around you, I see it too..every day, and in a time when so much violence and hate is in the news it is like a ray of sunshine on my face amidst a blackened sky to hear of such a selfless heroic act of bravery; humanity is not doomed, we have only strayed from the path.

The guy was a @!$%#ing retard to take a bullet for a chick who most likely screwing someone else behind his back... We males have pampered you biotches for thousands of years time for you to pull your weight

Imagine what may have happened if this soldier ahd been allowed to bear arms and had been armed, my quess is that a lot of lives would have been saved and not so many wounded and we might not have to be concerned about this piece of thash going to trial, Who cares why he did this.

Jerry-1927474

Imagine what may have happened if this soldier ahd been allowed to bear arms and had been armed, my quess is that a lot of lives would have been saved and not so many wounded and we might not have to be concerned about this piece of thash going to trial, Who cares why he did this.

Absolutely not true, This deranged person had on full body armament. He had on a helmet, Kevlar vest, leg armor, groin armor, throat armor and armored gloves. Along with a gas mask. In the mass chaos, only more people would have been killed or injured, along with the police department thinking 2 assailants were present because of the different types of ammunition used. It would have further made the investigation unimaginable.

I have gone through a mass casualty when I was in the Navy and no one can say what they would have done unless faced with the situation. Mostly your mind runs to save yourself, me because I had left a 6 month old daughter at home with my parents while deployed in the Navy my instinct was to save myself so that my daughter still had a mother. My situation lasted for over a month before I was taken to safety. Of course the mass casualty situation did not last for the entire month but people were and are still fighting through after effects to save their lives and I stayed in that save myself first reaction for the month. Of course, I was not in the situation where I was surrounded by loved ones, I was with others I worked with for a temporary situation and I wasn't close to them. I would like to think I would have taken my life for another but I was too wussy to save my own life first. This young man obviously loved his girlfriend and he showed it with his final breath by saving her and placing himself in harms way. I hope like the other said she shows it in her life by doing things to show his loss was not in vain. Unfortunately for everyone effected the life long marks will always be with them. Some will now suffer from addiction, some will suffer from depression and many will live the effects of this fateful night for the rest of their lives.

God Bless everyone who is involved in this tragedy and God Bless the people who already suffer from PTSD because this tragedy will trigger many sad thoughts and memories in their lives.

Revelation of the morning, Holmes's rifle was fitted with a drumclip holding a 100 rounds. Even in semiautomatic he could have gotten off 50 to 60 rounds in a minute. Sorry, but the odds that someone with a pistol could have counter-acted an assualt rifle with a drumclip is ridiculous. *sigh* I like shooting, but why in the name of God does anyone need a drumclip. Can we please just stop the insanity. This young man was a hero.

Jerry - "Imagine what may have happened if this soldier ahd been allowed to bear arms" Simple.....he would have got off one maybe two rounds and he (as would have anyone else) would have joined the ranks of the dead.....unless he had on a bullet proff vest, tacktical helmet, leg and groin protection (like this assailant) the prospects of firing back and taking them out - before you are taken out - would be very very low. He did what was best.....try to protect his girlfriend while not getting hurt either. Unfortunately though he paid the ultimate price.

I am all for the Second Amendment. I used to hunt with my father when I was younger. But to think that everybody needs to be "pack'n" all the time is insane. We need some gun limits.....I personally think you should have a license to purchase weapons. We do this for those who want to drive a car. Taking a competency test showing your knowledge of gun safety and gun laws and what constitutes self defense could weed out many who do not need them. Not everybody has Constitutional right to own a gun...the Supreme Court has upheld that felons can not own them.

But no, we cann't have this because the NRA would scream about how evile gun laws are and then gen up nonsince about how the government is tacking you and coming to take your guns. Tracking of sales and owners should be common scense.

Oh, I already know the counter agument....."criminals are going to get them anyway so why have the law"......well this guy bought all his gear, weapons, and anumition legally.....we don't have to make it easy for them.

Steph- In - Illinois, well said..these people and even the parents of survivors as well as those who lost their lives will have a negative impact on their lives and some will deal with it differently. This shooter is a very selfish person to do this to any person. If this shooter couldnt deal with the situation that many other people deal with everyday then he should have picked a bridge to jump off of. After all he has done, now the people in colorado will carry the burden of paying (in some form ) to house and shelter,feed him in prison. What a crock as he should be given a slow painful demise over and over to feel the pain he has given others. Maybe that dosent sound right to some but he still deserves it..this should be affecting the whole country..or at least those with a real human conscience...there was too much of a coincidence with this in another aspect that I will rant about in another post appropriate to the subject. My prayers and donations hopefully help with this.

Well here we go again with the miracle survival stories.

r u wade...thank you. Simply and beautifully posted

I like my chances of being armed than unarmed any day, there was a moment were his gun jammed for about a minute, headshot ? idk, i quess its better than being a sitting duck and die trying than be one of those anti gun guys who thinks the police will protect them on any given moment

Jayman, this lunatic was in full Kevlar body armour with a face-shield and a helmet. How would a head-shot have helped? Do you usually go about with armour-piercing rounds in your sidearm? If you do, there's something amiss in your head...

The lack of reading comprehension is indirectly proportional to the belief in personal arms in the US.

I guess with the tear gas flying and the mass chaos, you would get in a perfect head shot. Dream on.

Who knows how many people you would shoot by accident in all the confusion.

I have to respectfully disagree with Steph-In illinois and the like. Being former Infantrymen in the Army I know quite well all the gear that the shooter was wearing, and a simple .40 Cal or .45 Cal pistol would have shot through most of that gear, and/or definitely put the shooter on his back. I can appreciate the argument of the "added chaos" with another pistol, but honestly, if it had saved even just one life, it was well worth it. I know it’s easy for people to say "well if it was me, I could have done this" but having some military know how, I know that it would take just a second to pop up while this guy is distracted shooting some 50+ odd people, and put him out. Maybe it wouldn’t have worked, but chances are it would have. And look, he ended up being killed anyway, as horrible as that is. I think any of those 12 victims would rather have a fighting chance, than just being sitting ducks.

Just about all active shootings happen in places where concealed carry is illegal, which includes movie theaters if I’m not mistaken in the state of Colorado. One former military guy in this theater with a gun, and this story may not have made headlines. Maybe, but at least there would have been a fighting chance for those 12 victims.

My deep condolences for the families, what a horrible thing to have happened.

I think when people read that he was wearing full tactical gear they think he would be invincible. Just to clarify, kevelar vests are designed to keep out small caliber weapons at a great distance. a .40 Cal or .45 Cal pistol at a close range would easily go through near all protective equipment. Maybe it wouldnt have worked, but at least there would have been a chance.

I heard on the news that you are not allowed to take a firearm into a movie theatre even if you have a concealed weapon permit....So these people making comments that if I was there with my gun or if someone else had one they could fire back - nope. Ain't gonna happen! Anyways, when the police turn up they'd be likely to shoot you too! Also, this 'guy' wearing all the the body armor for protection - it would help or even stop a .45 round. My GF works in a hospital....surgery rooms.... only 2 weeks ago a 300lb boy came in with 3 gun shots, one of which was in his chest. It didn't even get through the fat!!! No joke. Him being overweight saved his life! and the gun used was a .45.....so if body fat 'can' stop a bullet I'm pretty sure the body armor or kevlar will too!

Jayman, this lunatic was in full Kevlar body armour with a face-shield and a helmet. How would a head-shot have helped? Do you usually go about with armour-piercing rounds in your sidearm?

For the sake of discussion,

1. There really is no such thing as 'full Kevlar body armor'. About the closest thing to it would be a bomb blast suit worn by Explosive Ordnance Disposal technicians when approaching an unexploded bomb, and they look - and move - a bit like astronauts in space suits. The body armor for tactical use consists of pieces that help protect critical areas of the body. There is still much left unprotected and there are many vulnerabilities.

2. Come to find out, he either was not wearing a bullet resistant vest, or at least had not acquired it from the source stating that it had sold him a tactical vest for little more than $100. That vest just has a bunch of pockets and pouches for ammunition and equipment. If he also had a bullet resistant vest, the tactical vest would have to be worn over it, so there could be a sizing concern. In any case, a ballistic vest usually starts at about $500 and most places that offer them have a policy of not selling them unless you provide proof that you are a law enforcement or security officer, usually a letter from your boss on company or department letterhead.

3. The other armor was mostly riot type gear, which is not going to stop any bullets, but will blunt impact of thrown rocks, bricks, fist punches, kicks, etc. It would seem that Mr. Holmes wasn't too afraid of anyone shooting back at him, but was afraid of being rushed and pummeled but good.

4. Even with body armor, getting shot HURTS. It will usually leave a bruise all the way to the bone. If you have a helmet that can stop or deflect a bullet, you're probably going to end up with a whiplash type of injury as a result. Also, a polycarbonate face shield and/or a gas mask isn't going to stop a bullet of any caliber except maybe a .22 short, but I wouldn't want to bet on that!

Now as far as anyone else in that theater having weapons goes, I doubt there was anyone. I know many people licensed to carry a concealed weapon, and virtually all of them are over the age of 40. There's different reasons for this, but the people who carry concealed weapons, as a general rule, are not going to be attending a midnight screening of a Batman movie. And those very few who might are most likely going to abide by the 'no weapons allowed' policy posted on the doors because running afoul of that leads to complications people who carry weapons just don't want to put up with.

Just to clarify, kevelar vests are designed to keep out small caliber weapons at a great distance. a .40 Cal or .45 Cal pistol at a close range would easily go through near all protective equipment.

Close, but not quite. Ballistic armor has different performance ratings, but most on the market, meeting the National Institute of Justice Level III or IIIA rating, will stop any reasonable handgun round, even at 'contact' range. In other words, if a lawman wearing it is shot by someone who grabbed his weapon from his holster, this vest would stop the bullet. It would still hurt like hell, though! The bigger the bullet, the easier it is to stop. The smaller ones with greater sectional density have a better chance of pushing through the piles of aramid fabric (Kevlar, Twaron, SpectraFiber, etc.). Soft point or hollowpoint bullets are more easily stopped by body armor since they expand on impact. Full metal jacket bullets do more damage to a ballistic vest...in fact, one of the absolute worst, the Chinese discovered, is the 7.62x25mm pistol bullets. This was a standard issue handgun in their army for decades and many pistols and rounds of ammunition were absconded with over the years, only to turn up on the streets in the hands of criminals. A .30 caliber bullet at 1400 fps was more than most vests could/can handle! The 5.7x28mm was designed to defeat body armor, as was a similar cartridge known as the .224 BOZ. Both were designed for use by antiterrorism forces in Europe to neutralize terrorists in body armor. The .223 Remington, adapted to become the 5.56x45mm NATO military cartridge, penetrates just about any armor a person would find themselves wearing unless the particular bullet is one of the very light, rapidly expanding varmint types. The heavier full jacketed ones, especially with the steel core, will go through pretty much anything one could wear or have handy to jump behind short of a huge boulder.

now i get it from your 3 posts... you are just an angry person and this tragedy just is your medium to get it out. Why not figure out what you are so disappointed with in life and work on it rather than spread your hate?

shandril, you're an idiot. Plain and simple.

shandril is crazy. go away. just because you don't have anyone that would take a bullet for you, doesn't mean you should demean what this kid did for someone he cared about.

just because you don't have anyone that would take a bullet for you

I'd take a bullet for her. There are too few truly great trolls left. It isn't like it use to be in the days when Usenet ruled.

Good, .... then please do so.

Then if you would volunteer to fire it we're all set. BTW Mymondidnotraiseafool I'm glad to hear you have siblings.

Swan....Haha... clever

Sad part is that some poor bastard is gonna lay down with Shandril tonight.

Well, it's the bullets normally. I suppose sometimes you could use the gun to club a person to death, but normally on the battlefield it means your really running low on supplies.

Well, as has often been pointed out, there's always a gun involved in a shooting. People rarely kill people by themselves. People using guns kill people.

Chris .....Nobody likes a smarta$$. Except me......I'd "like" to fatten your lip .

The way the shooter booby trapped his apartment, I'd say he would have killed by the means available. The apt is apparently an EOD/Firefighter's nightmare.

Over in England they just use knives. Use of guns does make it go quicker, with a higher body count. To try and ban them I always point out... Are drugs illegal? Do you believe that no one in the US has access to them because of that fact?

. I suppose sometimes you could use the gun to club a person to death, but normally on the battlefield it means your really running low on supplies.

They don't issue bayonets anymore?

.I'd "like" to fatten your lip .

You a plastic surgeon?

These assaults are tragic, but I do not see how we can prevent them . They also happen in countries with rigid gun control like Sweden or Germany. We cannot know what goes on in the mind of an apparently sane person who suddenly becomes disassociated.

It might help to monitor the sale of certain weapons and certainly restrict the sale of asault weapons to civilians. On the other hand, criminals will always know where to get them. When in doubt, they can always ask our honorable Attorney General.

Is Swan37 an alt for Shandril? sure sounds like the twit.

I can think of a few insects that have evolved that far also. Bees for instance.

Do bees really love? Really? I mean, they do have a lot of sweet honey dripping around the hive, but isn't that more work related for them? Work romances never last.

If he was any kind of hero he would have been in the same state as his wife and 2 kids. Some hero he is. Not even man enough to stay around his kids to see them grow up.

He did a heroic act but he is in no way a hero. Hes a piece of scum. Think of what his kids get to say now. My daddy died saving his g/f while mommy otherwise still known as his wife was in another state watching us grow up.

That's right! I never take any of my kids to movies because I expect at any time someone is going to burst though the door and start shooting random people. Everyone calls me crazy ...... but see.... I was right!

Steve100...I get that there are many people who will shout angry words at these young parents. I can't because I understand what it is to have young kids and to still want to do something special with my darling dear one. It was a midnight movie so the baby would have slept. The older child would have probably slept as well. The parents just wanted to share something unique with each other.

Back when I was a little kid...my parents would put my brother and I in a makeshift bed in the back seat of the car and go to the drive in...that is how young people could afford a date night without the added expence of a baby sitter.

There is little point in condemning the young parents...they were not the one's pulling the trigger. They just wanted to do something together. It should have been safe.

I agree with Steven100, I was also wondering what type of hoosier people take their children to a movie like this!

That's why I don't see movies in Aurora. Parents there ALWAYS take their children to movies, no matter the age, no matter the time, no matter the rating.

I do need to comment like TXMOM I agree with her It is summer and parents need to enjoy their lives too. My mom took me to a midnight roller skating event in the summer of 79 in Philly I was 7. Parents have a right to take a child to a movie whenever they want it is not against the law, I still remember that time with my mom and it was positive unlike this event which shouldn't have happened but it did. Don't condem people for being an American and having the right to engage in legal activities, at least they were taking their children out for something enjoyable they were being good parents they didn't leave them home unattanded like other bad parents have..

I always thought Batman was a super hero who saved humans in perilous situations. I admit I was naive about this new Batman series. I realize that the villians "have to keep up with these violent times", but I was mortified when I saw a clip from the previous Dark Knight movie with Heath Ledger. My God! Racheting his rifle and terrifying a large croud (who I can only assume he shot and killed some). Knowing this was in the PREVIOUS movie, this latest one HAS to have an R rating. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but don't parents or 18-yr. old "adults" have to accompany a minor? I read several instances where parents said they dropped off their children from ages 11 or 13 or 14 to see this GOREFEST unaccompanied?? I just don't get it and I'm never will.

I am still so shocked at the madness of this entire situation caused by one lunatic who obviously had thousands of dollars to buy not only an arsenal of weaponary, but shielded himself in top of the line FULL body armor.

To me that makes the utter coward. His motive was to KILL. And he had no intentions of anyone killing HIM, whether it be another armed patron or the police.

Sadly, he was be lawyered up with "sociopath" as a label and probably never serve any time in prison.

I can't even imagine the shock, horror, sadness of these poor victims. Survivors guilt is a very, very long emotional trauma that can scar for a long time as well.

Barbara,

How do you know the parents were from Indiana?

@txmom32 How do you know the kids would have slept? Have you ever taken a night flight to Europe? I think you'll find that kids can stay awake any hour - AND - even if they're awake for 30 minutes of the movie, what if they're disturbing other people, that's hardly fair.....and by being awake they'll be watching a violent movie such as this one was. Point is, there's a time and place for everything and taking a 3 month old or even a 6 year old to a midnight violent movie isn't right. Next you'll be saying that the 24yr old killer played violent video games and helped drive him to do this......yet it's ok for a 6 year old to watch a violent movie? WTH!

Nigol66...Children tend to stay true to their patterns, particularly young children. I have flown night flights to Europe frequently with my kids, and yes all three slept on the plane usually. I never even resorted to Benedryl. Why would you assume they would disturb other people or that the parents wouldn't exercise reasonable judgement to take them out of the room if they were fussing?

As for deciding what is right or wrong for these parents...you honestly feel like you should judge them? I don't think I can judge them without intrusion into their lives.

I also don't believe I will make a statement to determine what caused the 24yr old to act in such a violent and atrocious way. But it seems you must be dwelling on that whole video game thing. Personally, I think the only person who can explain this sort of deliberate carnage is in custody. Personally, I would have no problem if they water-boarded him 67 times to find out why.

What I find unsetteling about your statement and those who choose to chastise the parent of the baby and six year old is that you are attempting to make the parents, who are actually victims in this tragic event, somehow culpable for the actions of a mad man. People, in the United States, have a reasonable expectation to go to a movie theater to watch a film without dying.

I have a few sentiments to express, and I hope they are not mercilessly attacked. First, 'human nature,' like any concept, is arbitrary and relative; but as a concept, it represents more human behaviors than fight or flight responses. 'Love' is a complex emergent emotion which the standard human has a capacity for emulating---typically a considerable capacity. Emotions are essentially impulses to act, and emotions --- especially powerful emotions like love --- can sometimes override survival instincts. The override of rational thought and self-focused self-interest is not without merit: being willing to protect one's mate or child is part of a survival response (especially when children and women are involved and being protected). Considering this is not uncommon among our species, it can be subsequently argued to be in our nature.

Second, I'd like to address his part in her survival. Cause-and-effect is tricky and complex, but I have an interesting notion to express: if he had not been at the theater with her, she may have been seated in a different area or may have watched a different movie. It may have culminated in her death, but more likely --- given the number of dead and injured among the move population as a whole --- she would have been spared a fatal injury and possibly the encounter with the shooter altogether, respectively.

Third, instincts and values and nature are not synonymous concepts or terms. Instincts are one facet of human nature, and they are not necessarily the most important. 'Human nature' is accurately describable as human propensity for culture, values, internalizing of morality and reflections upon how to live a good life, and other ideas.

Fourth, this man's willingness to protect another's life in exchange for risking his own life is admirable and honorable. Whether or not he is a hero, he obviously considered his self-interest to include and incorporate others' interests and well-being---at the very least, the girl involved---and deserves some amount of sympathy and respect for his self-sacrifice.

As I read this story, that exact same thing came to mind. She's inherited a debt she must honor and she seems like the kind of person who will take up this debt completely and honorably.

I agree that he was/is a hero. I don't agree with "If one person had a concealed weapon they could have ended this madness early on greatly reducing the harm done". It is chaos, it is dark, there is smoke, there is panic, people are running, people are hiding. Unless you are trained to deal with such a situation, and you have taken many classes, a person carrying a concealed weapon might have saved the day. But most gun owners have no clue how to use their guns appropriately. So it most likely would have turned into a Wild Wild West masacre like shooting in which people would have been shooting in every direction. More deaths and injuries would have occured. Yeah, more guns is the sollution.

Voice,

people "could" have been shot accidently by a concealed carrier... Well they DID get shot by Holmes. I'd be willing to take my chances. You don't know what would have happened any more than the very people you try to put down.

Even if all it did was slow him down, distract him for a few seconds because the carrier was the only threat in the room... it would have allowed more people to escape

Shandril's angry about other issues in her life. Whatever they are, she'd rather work herself up here and spit venom here than address them. It's a twisted sort of fun for her. One day she may or may not address her real problems. That would take more strength and honesty than lying to herself as she does now about her real problems. Typical troll background and actions; they're all the same: crying for attention.

May God Bless and watch over the relatives and friends of this senseless act of violence.

If there was a god and he was watching and cared, this never would have happened in the first place.

You started an argument, Barbara. As a mother with children of varying age, I think it is extremely tacky of you to point out that a parent took their small children to a movie that late or that violent. Maybe those parents would explain things carefully after the movie and make sure their child gets a healthy does of both reality and make-believe. Or maybe their 6 year old really wanted to see the movie- I saw many movies released on the 1st day late at night-heck, Star Wars comes to mind. Jaws too. It was a treat for us and I have the best memories of my Daddy taking us.

Swan37

There is a God and He was watching. But remember. We have kicked him out of our country, schools, town squares, courthouses and lives. People worship everything else except him now days. Everything!

So are you implying that God "approved" of these actions, by his (her) inaction ?? In addition when you are making excuses by indicating "we" have kicked God out of everything - please speak only for those who you are absolutely sure of "personally" have kicked God out of there lives. Every other type of broad statement "we" is just another form of political rhetoric. There are hundreds of millions throughout the world who have NOT kicked God out of their lives. I will agree however (even though you did not state it) that "the appeal of extreme violence as a form of mass entertainment" is unsettling. However it does have precedent in the Roman times. It is no surprise to me that given a steady diet of semi real violence (computer games, movies, TV shows, etc.) that some unstable minds are easily swayed to believe this is acceptable. To be commenting as abhorring this violence, and then letting ones children be involved in "make believe" violence is totally hypocritical. Kind of like lamenting the economy and continuing to shop at WalMart.

We have kicked him out of our country, schools, town squares, courthouses and lives. People worship everything else except him now days. Everything!

Right, so what you are saying is that if you are a good church going Christan, you will never die in a horrible accident or an attack by a mad man or die a slow painful death by cancer or die of some horrible disease. You are saying none of this happened in the past because more people worshiped god? I figure that should be fairly easy to disprove.

When I say we, I speak about the country. Have you watched TV lately? Have you seen some of the movies. Batman doesn't shoot, but the shooting started during a scene involving shooting. When was the last time in this country you saw so much hype about a religious service involving God? Why do we have people who want to take "In God we Trust" off of the money. We in my previous means the majority, unfortunately. I myself am choosing to hang on as best I can, but the rope is slowly unwinding itself. And No I don't believe God chose to sit and watch and do nothing. Satan is in control now and this is going to be one of the final battle grounds between the two. And when it is over, there will be no more U.S. That is why it isn't mentioned in the bible in the end times. (I hope you realize these are my personal beliefs, but ones that I do believe will come to pass). Just thought I would put that out there.

And Swan, that isn't what I'm saying at all. Christians die the same as anyone else, some martyrs, some in accidents and some a slow and painful death, which I am currently undergoing. But that has not stopped me from believing and I won't let this senseless act disuade me, either. Ever wonder if that might not be what satan want's?

about an hour ago near Colorado Springs

There is a God. And He is good. What folks do not realize is we live in a spiritual war zone, where there is a great controversy between Christ and Satan in the dimension we do not see. God/Christ is the Creator. He only created good beings. There is a caveat though to this. He created all of His intelligent beings with free will. God will not overstep our free will whether to believe or not to be...lieve, to do good or to do bad. God is the most Humble being in the universe and the most powerful yet He let's us think, do as we wish, whether that is to great good or to great evil. The only time God will intervene is to give each one of us opportunities to accept the change in our heart from sin/evil to righteousness that Christ offers. And yes God will forgive everyone of "all" sins but only if the person wants to repent(to be truly sorry for wrong thinking/doing and be willing to allow God to come in and "change" their hearts) by believing in Christ. That belief is a heartfelt knowledge, trust in God in true love and dependence. You may ask why would God create this, allow this. Well, God didn't create evil but He has allowed evil to come into existence. Why? Because God wanted to create intelligent beings that would give Him love and companionship. Of course our wise God knows that true love only comes from true free will. God loves so much... that He took the risk and no one hurts more than Him when someone is hurt in anyway and/or dies. God takes responsibility for all that happens in His creation good or bad because He has created all but He does hold accountable the bad we may choose. Christ is saving all who would be saved by grace through faith in Him from this evil world to a new world to come with a changed heart that is bent on true love and selflessness not what you see here and now in this world. Christ is working with each person, doesn't matter what religion or whatever, the Holy Spirit is not limited in reaching all who wants to believe by His help. God still exists and He is still good. May we all put our trust in God and let freedom and goodness reign. God bless. :)

Why Did The Killing Happen At The Aurora Colorado Threater? Is It Because People Have Simply Fallen Away From God People Have Broken Every One Of The Ten Commandments No One Even Lives By The Ten Commadments No More Every One Has A Foul Lagguange Mouth Every One Has Fallen Away From God? Is This Another Sign That Jesus Is Comeing Back To Rapture His Belivers Up? Have We All Fallen Short Of The Glo...ry Of God? Have We Sinned And Sinned Terrebly Wrong We Need To Ask For Jesus Forgiveness Turn Our Hearts Back To God? Have We Cursed Disobeyed We Have Let Satin In To Our Lives? Have We Failed God Misserably? Have We Done Every Wrong And Every Sin There Is To Do And That's Why This Has Happened? We Need To Have Every Knee To Bow And Confess That Jesus Is Lord And Ask For Forgivness Of All Our Sins We Must Repent And Turn From Our Wrong Ways Is God So Angery With Us? And Satin Has Currpted Peoples Minds To Make Them Due These Evil Deeds? We Must Ask God To Cast Satin Out Of Our Lives And Ask God To Come In To Our Lives We Know What Is Right And Wrong And We Need To Do What Is Right Not What Is Wrong This World Needs God Back In Our Lives

Shandril, I find it interesting that you troll every Colorado tragedy article... and every comment you leave is cynical and borderline ridiculous. Why take the time out of your day to put this guy down and what he did to save his girlfriend. I don't get where your coming from, the fact that you even have the nerve to put him down like this blows my mind. The problem with society today is we have too many people like yourself and not enough people like Jon.

Why take the time? Are you serious? The answer is obvious. Shandril is a pathetic little loser, bitter because nobody could possibly give two sh/ts about her, and her only solace is to attack those who are infinitely better than her.

@ Chzhead2004 Comparing Dark Knight to Star Wars and Jaws? come on!. A 6 year old has no place watching Dark Knight....far too violent and you saying 'the parents can explain to the child what it all means in the movie'.... the kid is 6!!!! Also, watching a movie on the BIG SCREEN has a bigger impact right?! Isn't that why we go rather than waiting for the Bluray/DVD....imagine the 6yr olds eyes watching a violent movie on a 50 foot screen! not to mention the sound cranked up! This kid should be watching Disney movies or Pixar movies..... or are we to come back to the kid when they're 24 and find they'd dropped outta school and done time.... If the parent really wanted their kid to see this, wait for the DVD and do it in your own home! Well, I'm off out now, I've tickets for a UFC match and I'm taking some pre-schoolers!!!!!

I agree that a 6 year old should not have been taken to see that particular movie or any violent movie like that. Also, I personally feel a 6 year old should not even be up that late at all, they should already be asleep. That was bad parenting.

I cried as well. Some people have their own ideas on what it takes to save anothers life. I believe that you never know what you will you do until it is upon you. I would shield my children and my husband but I dont know if I would have the strength to shield the person sitting next to me. I dont think we are all equiped with what it takes to sacrafice our lives for just anyone....it takes a hero to do that. There were many heroes there in that theater. My thoughts and prayers go out to the victims and their families. To the media who seem to be using this tragedy to their benefit..........I loathe you all. Ive seen how you hurt people and use people. Report the facts, please stop using victims to get your ratings. We have to draw the line at some point

@jonathan92

You are you kidding, aren't you?

Im sure his 4 year old and 2 year old have faith in humanity knowing their father died saving his g/f while their mother otherwise still known as his wife was in another state.

Thats a great person there.

This man was no hero. He was an adulterer. It takes more than one single act to be a hero. Faithfulness to his wife and two babies would have been a good start. Interview with wife:

How do you know she is still his wife? I'll never be able to understand how people can take heroic acts like this and warp them with cynicism.

maybe he has been separated from his wife for quite some time and they just haven't finalized the divorce. He is probably still "legally" married to her but that doesn't mean they have been living together recently...DUH people!!!