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Subscribe to RSSHeat wave continues across much of the nation as more than half the country is dealing with a moderate drought conditions. NBC's Jay Gray reports.
Competing for corn with ethanol producers at a time of sky-high prices and drought, cattlemen and other livestock producers have asked for some relief but their plea has yet to get the needed support.
The help would have to come via the Environmental Protection Agency, which has the power to temporarily reduce the amount of ethanol required to be mixed into gasoline for vehicles. Since ethanol is cleaner than petroleum, its use in vehicles helps reduce overall air pollution.
But the request for a waiver must come from a state or a refiner -- and a day after the plea was made that still hasn't happened.
"Our ears are open and the line of communications is open," Mike Deering, a spokesman for the National Cattlemen's Beef Association, told NBC News. But, he added, "we do not have any definitive news at this point and time."
The Renewable Fuels Association, an ethanol trade group, told NBC News that it "wouldn't be surprised" to see a request.
In a statement, the EPA told NBC News that it was in "close contact with USDA as they and we keep an eye on crop yield estimates, and we will review any data or information submitted by stakeholders, industry and states."
A drought is now gripping more than half of the nation, with the latest U.S. Drought Monitor showing some of the worst areas are expanding. In Tennessee, crops are dying and families are struggling to face the losses. NBC's Thanh Truong reports.
Still, Mark McMinimy, biofuels analyst at Guggenheim Partners Washington Research Group, told Reuters he wasn't expecting any change. "I am not sure if this changes the landscape all that much," he said of the livestock producers' plea. "EPA officials and the secretary of agriculture (Tom Vilsack) have all indicated that they are not considering a waiver at this time."
Texas Gov. Rick Perry failed in his attempt to get a waiver in 2008, and the November elections could make for continued status quo given that President Barack Obama and many other lawmakers are strong supporters of ethanol, which is hugely popular in farm states.
America's ongoing drought disaster is getting worse before it gets better. NBC's Chris Clackum reports.
Corn prices have risen 60 percent in six weeks, Reuters reports, and about a third of the U.S. corn supply is used for ethanol. About as much is used as animal feed.
"The drought-induced reductions in the corn supply means that the mandated utilization of corn for renewable fuels will so reduce the supply of corn and increase its price that livestock and poultry producers will be forced to reduce the size of their herds and flocks, causing some to go out of business and jobs to be lost," the cattlemen's association and other livestock groups said in their letter to EPA chief Lisa Jackson.
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It is absolutely amazing how many misinformed people respond in these forums.. CORN ETHANOL IS NOT MADE FROM A FOOD SOURCE!
Learn the difference between Sweet Corn(what you get at the market) and Field Corn (What Cattle Eat). By the way Cows have a lager menu selection besides Corn! Its up to the farmer as to what they want to feed their Stock.
If a farmer has the choice of raising field corn or sweet corn, but makes more money raising field corn to sell to refiners who make money by selling to gasoline companies because they are forced by government regulations to sell ethanol-laced gasoline, then the farmer will choose the higher profit corn. The shortage of corn is based on government regulations, not the choice of the farmer. Shut down the ethanol requirement and we will have ample corn for food as well as cattle. By the way, corn is the most economical crop, along with alfalfa, to feed cattle.
Henry Ford actually designed his first cars to run on ethanol. Somewhere along the way somebody decided to make Saudi Arabia rich.
Dtroop82--99% of the corn grown in the United States is field corn, and it is indeed a food source, along with the Corn Ethanol source. Field or (dent) corn is used to make corn cereal, corn startch, corn oil, and corn syrup. So your corn taco shells==field corn; your corn flakes==field corn. Sweet corn is simply a sweeter variety that is picked during the milk or immature stage and is only eaten fresh,n canned or frozen. So when your Corn Flakes are 6.00/box it's because 1/3 of the corn went to fuel instead of food!
Storm.. I grow sweet corn.. I make ethanol.. I'm a small farmer in PA.. All of those products that you mentioned can be produced from Sweet Corn.. The question is, how many acres is a farmer willing to give to field vs sweet. Btw.. There is no shortage of land here. The biggest problem is how profitable will farming those extra acres be.. Most of the larger farms in the Mid-West gambled on a larger Corn crop this season. Its not paying off because of the drought. All of these guys have Government backed Crop insurance.. Nobody is going out of business.
Ethanol is not the problem. Speculation on commodities is the Problem.. The same issue with the housing crisis.. Ethanol producers don't need corn.. They can use a varieity of feed stocks. How about BIG OIL giving some of those profits back to the US public!! They are averaging 14 BILLION per Quarter!
any of you sitting here acting like a food source is being wasted. come on over...ill feed you some field corn, then we will have some sweet corn, WHAT YOU ACTUALLY BUY TO EAT!!!
Thanks Dakota- somebody who knows what they're talking about.
Seriously dakota and Mcamom-- the only thing sweet corn is used for is to eat fresh (seasonaly), canned or frozen. Your corn startch , corn flour, corn cereal, corn oil, and corn syrup used to make hundreds of food products are indeed field corn. Your corn flakes and corn taco shells=field corn
storm,
You do know what you are talking about. Don't forget hominy grits is also from field corn.
Road Warrior--I doubt if they don't know field corn is a food source they'd know what hominy grits are! 99% of the corn grown in America is field (dent) corn, you don't think we can feed the world growing 1 % of "sweet corn". Good grief!
hey storm rider....just in case you dont know it all, another set of bi-products from producing ethonal at these horrifying plants...its corn oil, corn syrup, etc...like I said on page one...take a trip to an ethonal plant and see what actually takes place there. Instead of just assuming its a one stop shop, go see for yourself that its not.
besides all that bickering...the difference between now and 1988, is the drought, if you can call it that, isnt nearly as bad or even as close to what happened in 88. the corn stores are still out there, we are going to survive. the cattle industry will be hit a little harder simply because the alfafa and grass they used to feed their cattle is not growing, just like the corn. hay prices are going through the roof.
you go around here parading like you know what your talking about by using google and finding some facts. but until you wake up in the moring, smell the cow crap, hay, diesel fuel, etc...just dont talk. you throwing food source out their like we are losing ears of corn to eat on a saturday night.
if the internet was around in 1988....I am sure we would have been calling for something else to be abolished. Before investing your time defiling the Ethonal industry...takes some real time and figure out what the actual products and bi-products are. I am sure you can google the worlds leader in the Ethonal industry and search around their site to find some much needed facts to continue in this debate...but your tune will have changed....
@Dakota-don't assume you know me, I do daily smell cow crap. We raise cattle in both Iowa (our cow/calf pairs) and 3000 head in Montana, and we currently farm 1800 acres of corn, and 1000 of soybeans. I know we've only had one cutting of hay this year (3 by this time last year), and were having trouble finding hay to buy for the Montana cattle and were having to truck water in every 3 days for the Montana cattle. You see what your beef prices do this fall, and what your cereal prices do after a bleak corn harvest this year, then tell me about how valuable Ethanol industry is....and by the way not one of the semi's we own run down the road using your Ethanol products, nor do the refrigeration units on the trailers.
I see a lot of chat about ethonal being a scam, scam or not the point is the ranchers are bitching about not enough corn, hmmm, free market society is what the republicans are all about, this is the free market at work.you want the corn,outbid the refineries and buy it, if your beef is to expensive we'll all eat rice and beans instead.this ranchers is what supply and demand is all about.
It isn't a "free market" when the government forces gasoline companies to use ethanol. In a free market, the gasoline companies could choose to use whatever fuel mix they want and we could choose to use ethanol if we want it. This system is socialist, not a free market.
If 40% of the corn is going to produce ethanol, and they got rid of ethanol, the price for corn would tank massively. Supply and demand. This is why the farmers, ADM and the corrupt officials they buy are so gung-ho on ethanol.
Of course if the price of corn dropped drastically,the price of food would also drop, and that's bad because...well, its not bad actually.
There is an ethanol plant locally that uses 1,000,000 gallons of water every day they are operating. 1,000,000!!!
So its not just driving up the price of food. Its also messing with the water supply. Yeah, that's a real green solution.
Only a few months ago Obama raised the ethanol in gasoline from 10% to 15% by 2014. Translated to corn, where we now use 40% of our crop for ethanol production, that will rise to 60%. I don't think he has the balls to reascend that order let alone back off the 10% level. He will just raise the food stamp program to protect his base and the hell with the rest of us.
There is no program conceived by government that is so bad that it will ever die.
Yes corn is used to produce ethonal, but the ethonal plants sell the corn back to cattle feeders, and the protein level is higher than it was before the ethonal was removed. So this is just one more step in utlizing a product
That is misleading because there is little protein in corn to begin with. It is mostly starch. It is the starch that is converted to dextrose with enzymes which is in turn fermented to ethanol. The left-over solids that the plant sells back to the farmer for cattle feed has little nutritional value. It is mostly roughage. That's why the plant mixes the left-over syrup with the solids before shipping it to the farmers. It makes it taste good to the cattle, but the only energy value is from the little bit of syrup.
retired,
I take that back. You are correct. The solids sold back to the farmer has about 30% protein. The corn kernel has about 8% protein, but after the starch is removed for ethanol, the protein remaining is a higher percentage of the left-over solids.
A couple weeks ago a tanker left to supply war games in the pacific from Washington. Loaded with 900,000 gallons of biofuel the navy paid $36 a gallon for. They were paying a little of $3 a gallon for diesel. We're getting hosed. Can't have corn at the family bbq anymore.
The ethanol deal has been a boondoggle from the begining. Using a staple food product (CORN) as a basis of making clean fuel when other products are available for use is just foolish. The only reason why corn was used was to subsidize the farmers,not that im against that but when the policy is not working it would be great if elected officials would see the forest thru the trees. I guess im dreaming. It was big agra lobbying in washington that have us were we are today with the ethanol situation, if you ask any driver they woulnt put the stuff in their car either. In brazil they use sugar cane for ethanol with much greater sucess and less effect on the overall food chain,
Wheat will be the next target crop. Then soybeans. Somehow, somewhere, somebody will figure out how to make money from staple crops by converting them to something else. They will bombard legislators with contributions to force farmers to grow and sell crops for purposes other than food. They will divert water in the name of climate control or some other stupid reason. There is money to be made from all this and I'm not getting any of it.
Is there anybody out there who believes that Obamacare won't be as useless and destructive as this ethanol fiasco? Is there any, ANY, government program that produces the savings it originally claimed? Any that cost their initial projections? Any without unintended consequences, like the ethanol fiasco? My dad told me an old aphorism: "follow the money". Someone with the EPA or connected to the EPA and the legislation requiring ethanol if getting rich off this junk. How did Pelosi make $5,000,000 from her investments last year? How much does she get from ethanol producers? How much do farmers earn by selling corn to ethanol producers vs. cattle ranchers and pig farmers?
Ethanol was an unproven solution to a problem that became embedded into law. Ethanol has less BTU than gasoline so it takes more Ethanol to get to the same place than gasoline. The pollution reduction sort of works if only looking at what comes out of a cars tailpipe. The pollution created to grow and then process the corn into Ethanol most likely wipes out most of its advantage of reducing pollution.
I think that it is dumb to use a food crop to make Ethanol because it distorts the food chain. The government should not be supporting the Ethanol makers at the tax payers expense.
well for all the folks that say its not the corn you eat well that may be true but thats less room on the land to grown the kind people do eat and it still affects the price of the corn so for all intents and purpose that its not the corn you eat argument is a red herring at best.
It is the form of corn in numerous food products, and 99% of the corn we grow in the US
For a little knowledge the THC content in Cannibis has more energy than corn. Just saying.
Hey, for some, pot is more important than food. Also, if we burn pot for fuel, there won't be any work done with everyone sticking their head out the window all day, not to mention the air conditioner bills.
yeah i guess i should keep quiet that may wake the big money and then the price of cannibis goes up
No way. It takes way more energy to eat corn that to, wait what we were we talking about??
Our deathanol use will come to haunt us. Already does. Deathanol deystroys fuel systems. turning low polluting cars into skunk wagons. Using food drives prices up and hurts the low income folk. And that hurts us all TAXES to pay for this. Thanks Gubmint, screwing us again. WAY to go guys ...................
But i heard that the cattlemen should also be bitching to the governor and the oil & gas companies who are battling for water to run their operations. Thousands upon thousands of gallons fresh water are needed to process oil & gas nowadays. Texas need to decide. Water for energy (oil & gas), cattle, or crops.
But hey, they could also approach al gore. He predicted the drought. Texas should ask him what they can do so that the drought don't hit them year after year after year. Al gore will tell then that it has to do with co2. Bunk say mr grover, the gop, & the rushbo. Bunk say the oil & gas men of texas. Ok. Al gore will just say that the drought will just get drier and drier year on year. Texas will have to decide water for energy (oil & gas), cattle, or crops. Not to mention people who need water too.
Al Gore, Al Gore, Al Gore, amen!!
A new process using "green waste" to make ethanol is being launched as I write this. We will no longer be reliant on growing corn for ethanol as the process uses any vegetative waste that can burn. The process will extend the life of landfills by decades and created "green" jobs in our area. A win-win.
Special interests indeed. Just like the special interests that keep forcing the armed forces to use a tank that is no longer necessary and pretty much useless in the type of warfare we engage in today. Congress and the deep pockets within which their hands roam, playing pocket pool with the "defense industry." EPA and Congress rubbing the tit of the fuel industry.
All of the arguments that ethanol is the problem are completely ludicrous. The real problem is the federal government paying farmers to NOT grow corn, or indeed to grow nothing at all. The original legislation that started this insane policy was called the Agricultural Adjustment Act of 1933. This was found to be unconstitutional and was replaced in 1938 by the Soil Conservation and Domestic Allotment Act. This law is in place for one purpose: to keep the price of crops where they are by limiting the supply to meet the demand.
the land is supposed to undergo a sabbath rest, anyway. every seven years the land is to rest for one year. i believe that is correct.
Ethonal is going to kill this cournty one way or the other
I heard that natural gas prices have jumped by 70% because of the lack of water to process oil & gas. They say it's because of the amount of natural gas that is being used in place of coal because natural gas is now sooo much cheaper than coal. But I also heard that it's because of the lack of water in many places of the country including oklahoma. 50% of the country is in a drought.
I tell you they need to ask al gore what they could do. He would tell them to convert to solar energy. No energy source and compete with the cost of solar over a 30 year period. No co2 produced and more important - no water needed.
Wrong. Solar energy takes lots of water, lots of ultrapure water. The average silicon wafer plant which makes parts for solar panels uses 3 million gallons of city fresh water supply per day.
You heard wrong.
I see we have a few PETA COWS on here.
People
Eating
Tasty
Animals
Ethanol is for drinking NOT driving!
A real life test performed by Edmunds and their results. They did a round trip drive from San Diego to Las Vegas.....
Gas Result:From San Diego to Las Vegas and back, we used 36.5 gallons of regular gasoline and achieved an average fuel economy of 18.3 mpg.
Gas Cost: We spent $124.66 for gasoline for the trip. The average pump price was $3.42 per gallon.
E85 Result: From San Diego to Las Vegas and back we used 50 gallons of E85 and achieved an average fuel economy of 13.5 mpg.
E85 Cost: We spent $154.29 on E85 for the trip. The average pump price was $3.09 per gallon
Gas/E85 difference: The fuel economy of our Tahoe on E85, under these conditions, was 26.5 percent worse than it was when running on gas.
A motorist, filling up and comparing the prices of regular gas and E85, might see the price advantage of E85 (in our case 33 cents or 9.7 percent less) as a bargain. However, since fuel economy is significantly reduced, the net effect is that a person choosing to run their flex-fuel vehicle on E85 on a trip like ours will spend 22.8 percent more to drive the same distance. For us, the E85 trip was about $30 more expensive — about 22.9 cents per mile on E85 versus 18.7 cents per mile with gasoline.
Also from the Edmunds test (for those of that say the pollution saved makes a difference) here is how they stacked up.....
By relating our observed fuel economy to CO2 emission figures found in the EPA's Green Vehicle Guide we determined that our gasoline round trip produced 706.5 pounds of carbon dioxide. On E85, the CO2 emissions came to 703.1 pounds. The difference came out in E85's favor, but only by a scant 0.5 percent. Call it a tie. This is certainly not the reduction in greenhouse gas emissions we had been led to expect.
Ethanol is a scam.
If only ethanol could be produced from bullsh**. Between D.C. and these forums................................
I'm not so certain about ethanol, but "Methane is doable!", Tom said flatulently. :-D
For those folks who slept through Chemistry class, the fact of the matter is that if you put ethanol made from corn in an oak barrel in the US and store it for a minimum of two years, it meets the legal criteria for being "straight bourbon", although there are a few more requirements in the specification, such as being made from a grain mixture that is at least 51 percent corn; using new charred-oak barrels; and not having any added coloring, flavoring, or other spirits . . .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bourbon_whiskey#Legal_requirements
Drawing on a bit of the history of the Deep South, where NASCAR is the key clue, the virtually mind-boggling reality is that the current transportation energy plan for the future of our great nation is based on powering our transportation system with moonshine (a.k.a. "whiskey", "bourbon", and so forth and so on) . . .
This is not only stupid but also cruel, because diverting corn to make ethanol to use as vehicle fuel makes a significant percentage of the corn harvest unavailable for use in feeding people, and it also restricts the ability of poor people to afford the corn which is available . . .
But then this is what so-called "left" and "liberals" enjoy pondering as they drive their Volvos in the carpool lane and have happy thoughts about how superior they are compared to peasants . . .
Yet another fact is that making ethanol using any type of grain that can be used by people for food is a crime against humanity, because it directly causes people somewhere on the planet to die of starvation, really . . .
Really! :-o
And from this perspective, I certainly think that we might be witnessing a Spritual battle, where the interpretation here in the sound isolation studio is that God is ready, willing, and able to allow every corn field in our great nation to be barren until the patently evil policy of using corn for vehicle fuel is vanquished . . .
Stuff like this is not so coincidental as some people might imagine, really . . .
Really! :-o