Hate crime trial under way in Amish beard-cutting attacks

EPA

Amish community members leave the Cleveland, Ohio federal courthouse on Monday after a jury was selected for the trial of Samuel Mullet Sr. and 15 co-defendants who are charged with committing hate crimes, conspiracy, kidnapping, and destroying evidence for a series of beard and hair cutting attacks.

A hate-crimes trial got under way in a U.S. District Court in Cleveland, Ohio, Tuesday morning for an Amish leader and 15 followers accused of forcibly cutting the hair and beards of religious rivals.

Samuel Mullet Sr., a 66-year-old bishop for a group of Amish in Bergholz, Ohio, and a group of co-defendants including four of his sons, face charges of conspiracy, hate crimes, kidnapping and obstruction for attacks on nine victims.

Prosecutors laid out their case to the jury, arguing that the group led by Mullet spent months planning the hair- and beard-cutting attacks, considered deeply offensive in Amish culture, The Associated Press reported. 

Amish community members appeared in court in their traditional attire — including suspenders and long beards for men, and long dresses and head scarves for the women, the Cleveland Plain Dealer reported

The Amish are known for simple living and shunning the use of technology.


The elder Mullet sat stiffly in his seat as the trial got under way, wearing a blue shirt and suspenders, with a beard hanging down to the middle of his chest, according to the AP. The defendants have denied the charges and rejected plea bargain offers. They could face lengthy prison terms if convicted, it said.

"Every one of these attacks targeted those symbols of Amish righteousness," said Assistant U.S. Attorney Bridget M. Brennan, according to the AP. 

She said that although the elder Mullet did not take part in the attacks, he was the mastermind. 

"Sam Mullet was at the beginning and the end of all these attacks," she said, according to AP.

Defense attorneys portrayed the attacks as family disputes or disagreements over religion that fall short of hate crimes.

Dean Carro, the attorney for Lester Miller, said  his client was moved by concern for his parents' salvation when he, two of his brothers and others went to their parents' house and cut off their father's beard, according to the Plain Dealer. The sons' wives then cut off two feet of their mother-in-law's hair, the report said. 

"He thought his parents had forgotten the rules," Carro said of Miller, acccording to Reuters. "He was trying to bring them back to the fold." 

Carro also told jurors that his client once voluntarily cut off his own beard and slept in a chicken coop in order to correct his own errant ways. 

Judge Aaron Polster started the day's proceedings by giving instructions to the jury, which was selected on Monday — explaining the definition of conspiracy and other charges and the difference between direct and circumstantial evidence, according to a report by the Cleveland Plain Dealer. He also asked jurors to put aside perceptions of the legal system gleaned from television shows such as "Matlock" and "Law and Order."

According to an FBI affidavit, the attacks were acts of revenge in a dispute between the elder Mullet and other Amish bishops who disagreed with his decision to excommunicate eight families after they left his group in 2005. 

Read the affidavit

A gathering of 300 mainstream Amish overturned Mullet’s decision, apparently prompting Mullet and his followers to launch the attacks, the affidavit said.

In the forcible cutting of the victims’ hair and beards with 8-inch horse mane-cutting shears, some of the victims were wounded and bloodied, it said.

The case has drawn national attention because the unusual and violent attacks are at odds with Amish pacifism, and because the Amish community is generally self-contained, handling disputes internally. 

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Wierd Al Yankovics' "Amish Paradise" video is playing in my head right now.

  • 11 votes
#1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:29 PM EDT

I think having to read these stupid articles is a hate crime.

  • 14 votes
#1.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:06 PM EDT
Comment author avatarCon-scienceExpand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

You don't have to read them, although it's a wonder that you actually can.

However that doesn't necessarily mean that you comprehend what you read.

Liberal.

  • 7 votes
#1.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:26 PM EDT

Is Mitt Romney cutting hair again?!!

  • 13 votes
#1.3 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:27 PM EDT

Hey Frank... Funny how only those reporting the story (without any real life accounts) recall any forced hair cutting by Romney. The sister of the alleged victim has already stated that the accusation was false. but hey, why let facts get in the way of your liberal tendencies (posting without any facts), huh....

  • 9 votes
#1.4 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:39 PM EDT

I saw the friends on television, admitting to their part and telling what Mitzy did. So LEW, it wasn't the reporters making things up...................but you made up the part about the sister. Liar.

  • 9 votes
#1.5 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:43 PM EDT

Republicans are only interested in pubic hairs.

  • 8 votes
#1.6 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:49 PM EDT

Been spending all my life

Living in an Amish paradise

Churn butter once or twice

Living in an Amish paradise

  • 6 votes
#1.7 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:54 PM EDT

Yes... any one who forces anyone to do something against their will should be punished... bully is a bully

  • 9 votes
#1.8 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:07 PM EDT

How in the hell did the FBI get involved in this .. are they crazy or very short on business? ...

Why is this in a court of law?

The Amish resolve their own problems ... This is a Amish family problem ... it should be thrown out of court! This is a example of why the government gets involved in all of our lives ...no one wants to solve their own problems ......

  • 6 votes
#1.9 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:27 PM EDT
Comment author avatarNiki-440757Expand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

Oh oh oh Democrats should be charged with a hate crime for spanking the monkey everytime obama excites them.

  • 7 votes
#1.10 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:28 PM EDT

Just wondering.....Is a pair of scissors considered an assault weapon? You know...the ones Romney used back in school when his gang of thugs assaulted that student and held him down while Romney assaulted the guy by cutting off his hair? ....Yeah....that pair of scissors...assault weapon or not?...Why didn't Romney get put in jail for that? Riding daddy's coat tails? ROMNEY THE BULLY!

Fake apology by Romney.......years later....

  • 8 votes
#1.11 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:29 PM EDT

If this is what you live by, than dont cry to our police when it suits you. They are bent because there is a bad apple. When did every ONE become news? Next!

    #1.12 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:23 AM EDT

    The knowingly unviolent are violent now

      #1.13 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:25 AM EDT
      boltonbillDeleted

      OMG - I'm supposed to CARE about what someone did in Prep school, what, 50 years ago??? And for the record, I don't care if Obama smoked pot in college, either - it was a long time ago, NOT RELEVANT. Find something else to bitch about, I'm sure it will be easy!

      • 1 vote
      #1.15 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:42 AM EDT

      I had a girlfriend who hated my beard, but I did not know she could be prosecuted. I should have called the police.

        #1.16 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 11:39 AM EDT
        Reply

        They are in trouble if ZZ top was in the jury pool.lol

        Sickos, they should be thrown under the jail, the terror they brought on these seniors is horrific.

        • 5 votes
        Reply#2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:34 PM EDT
        boltonbillDeleted
        Reply

        Just more religious fanatics believing they have to act and look different to be closer to their God. The things religious ideology drives people to do. The victims got off easy, if they had been in Afghanistan they would have had their heads cut off with the beard intact.

        • 12 votes
        Reply#3 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:36 PM EDT

        And they let people like you out in public? Fool.

        • 6 votes
        #3.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:57 PM EDT

        What the bloody hell are you even raving on about, Skippy? How do the Amish even begin to correlate to Afghanis other than the beard? And decapitation? Seriously?

        The Amish are the furthest thing from being a "religious fanatic". In fact, they prefer it if outsiders leave them alone. They are not out killing people in the name of their religion. They don't practice a "convert-or-die" policy. They don't even interact with people unless it's at a market-place. They form their families and they live their lives quietly.

        Please refrain from speaking when you don't know what you're talking about, ok?

        • 3 votes
        #3.2 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:42 AM EDT

        most people posting here don't even no why Amish have beards . or when they are allowed to grow a beard .

        • 2 votes
        #3.3 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:13 AM EDT

        William you are not the brightest light in the house are you? Amish are probably the simplest people I have ever worked with. I'm sure they have a stronger work habit that you, obviously based on your ignorant comment most are smarter than you, and they definitely can cook better than you. I'd say you should probably stick to hating afganis.

          #3.4 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 8:43 AM EDT

          Actually the Amish are very far from being "religious fanatics." Their religion is pretty much an exact German Anabaptist practice that dates to the late 1700's. It has a small dose of American Calvinism thrown in. They eschew technology for exactly the same reasons that a business might bar employees from shopping on eBay during work hours. They feel it is an unnecessary distraction.

          The Amish are not stupid or somehow primitive. They practice a form of intensive agriculture and craftsmenship that is highly productive and very rewarding financially. But they try to "keep it real" by limiting the amount of technology that complicates lives without actually adding any productivity. But it is a conscious and democratic sort of thing. You might see a hay baler, for example, that is pulled by horses, but has a gasoline engine to run the mechanism.

          The idea is that by keeping their lives simple and extremely democratic and intensely communal, they can have time to focus on their religion, their family, and their work. They do not consider technology evil and do not consider people who have an iPhone as bad people. An Amish family may not own a car, but may hire a car and driver for long trips or a business might have a non-Amish person whose duties are driving and using technology. The Amish make a great distinction between using technology and owning technology. Using technology, such as power tools when doing relief work in Tuscaloosa is okay. Using them at home, however would be forbidden. Their attitude is that a specific tachnology should be banned if instead of a person owning it, the technology owns the person. Things like calculators and flashlights are never considered a threat. They allow roller skates, but ban skateboards.

          And the Amish require that their teens be free from "the Ordung" for a while so that they can see the world and join the congregation willingly and with full knowledge of the lifestyle they are giving up. Pot smoking Amish teens are not the exception as are Amish teen drivers ggetting into accidents.

          The Amish do very well financially, never carrying debt longer than a year. They build houses communally and do a lot of work communally. Their farms are hugely profitable because they are extremely well-tended. Likewise their craft enterprises are also profitable. In times of recession, the Amish are always able to expand their farms and businesses because of the lack of debt.

          The Amish do not prosletize and do not push their way of life on others. But if you ask one about his religion, he will be very happy to tell you all about it. I have always thought it funny that they refer to non-Amish things and people as "english."

          These are just good hard-working people who value family and work in a way that was common 300 years ago. There are still Amish families from Pennsylvania helping with rebuilding from Tuscaloosa'a 4/27/2011 tornado disaster. It is very striking to see several Amish women in long dresses and sunbonnets with a roofing nail gun putting down shingles in 100 degree temperatures. People here are respectful enough not to take their pictures. Religious fanatics? No, I don't think so. Good people.

          • 2 votes
          #3.5 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:05 PM EDT

          Kudos to you :-)

            #3.6 - Tue Sep 4, 2012 2:46 PM EDT
            Reply

            Tell me now, exactly how is this different from Mitt Romney and his pals cutting the hair off a gay guy at school? Did our esteemed presidential nominee commit a hate crime too?

            • 22 votes
            #4 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:42 PM EDT

            he did that!?

            • 4 votes
            #4.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:47 PM EDT

            I would say Obama considering to destroy our country with internal strife is far more of a hate crime.

            • 20 votes
            #4.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:10 PM EDT

            No no you are confused, it was Bush W who destroyed our country with internal strife and it's Romney who wants to get back on track with the Bush W plan. Obama has only been fighting to clean up the mess and it's been a tough road. Nobody could fix in four years what Bush W spend 8 years destroying.

            • 19 votes
            #4.3 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:19 PM EDT

            Begly.................It's no different. Yes, Mitzy committed a hate crime. And now lies and says he doesn't remember it. But the boys that helped him all remember, and came forward to say it was true. I guess when you do so many bad things, you can't keep them all straight in your memory. Or you have to lie about them so nobody finds out how prolific you are at doing hateful things.

            • 15 votes
            #4.4 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:20 PM EDT

            boe-1363655

            Internal strife has been growing by leaps and bounds for the past two decade. No president could stop it or slow it down. Which ever person wins this next election, it will get worse. Democrat or Republican, it makes no difference. But I must say though, that sense 9/11 it has escalated at a dangerous rate, due to no one person, group, or party.

            Your just another person that puts soul blame on one person you do not like for no other reason than personnel. THAT is the strife the is destroying the country. Un-warranted hate towards a person or people or group without any genuine facts or bona fide proof.

            Your comment has created more strife than anything the preisdent has done.

            • 3 votes
            #4.5 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:38 PM EDT

            Did our esteemed presidential nominee commit a hate crime too?

            Yes. And if elected it's quite possible he could do far, far worse to far, far many other people.

            Romney promises to increase the Oligarchy that is ruling America.

            Oligarchy: (noun)

            1) When the wealth and power of a nation is concentrated in the hands of a very small percentage.

            2) Oligarchy frequently precedes Fascism or Dictatorships.

            • 11 votes
            #4.6 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:52 PM EDT

            Yes. And if elected it's quite possible he could do far, far worse to far, far many other people

            And Obama already hasn't? If you haven't noticed, the country isn't exactly united under him. The deficit hasn't been cut in half as he promised. Unemployment isn't under 8% for the last 43 months, despite 787 billion in spending. Obamacare is only wanted by those that hope it will morph into a program that will pay all of their medical costs, and the senate hasn't passed a budget in 3 years.

            The wealth of the nation has already been concentrated into a small percentage: Those in Washington DC.

            If I don't want to business with Sears, I can go to Target or J.C. Penny's. If I don't want to buy from Exxon, I can go to BP or Shell. If I don't want to buy a Honda, I can buy a Chevy. Try not doing business with the IRS and see where you end up.

            Obama is already a dictator: Demonstrated on multiple occasions by just declaring he won't enforce duly passed laws that he doesn't like, or will just ignore them all together. DOMA act, illegal immigration laws, giving waivers to his buddies that don't want to comply with Obamacare, but demand that the rest of us will. Holder refusing to prosecute "his people".

            Liberals make me vomit.

            • 12 votes
            #4.7 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:15 PM EDT

            This divisiveness has been going on since the Clinton years; Pres. Obama has repeatedly, publicly and privately offered an olive branch to the GOP and they have snubbed him each and every time, so don't kid yourself about who's to blame. As far as Obamacare goes, the largest number of participants will be paying for their own or their employees' medical plan. This will be possible because it will be cheaper. It will be cheaper because virtually everybody will be in the pool.

            Those in Wash D.C. are not the small percentage owning the wealth of the nation. Our legislators are not rich, compared to the folks footing the bill for their campaigns, who can live anywhere they please.

            The IRS does not "do business." My government is not a business. America is not a corporation and we don't need a CEO to run it.

            A dictator is a far cry from a president setting policy. FYI, people are still being deported from the US every day, and the White House has not interfered in that process, simply laid down some priorities. AG Holder has prosecuted federal cases against criminals of all colors and stripes (including, and spectacularly, massive Medicare fraud rings), so I don't know what you mean by "his people," unless you are making an unfounded and unappreciated racist crack, and that pretty much explains who you are. Go and sin no more.

            • 10 votes
            #4.8 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:38 PM EDT

            S. Williams

            Obuma has offered an olive branch? How exactly did the swine so that?

            • 1 vote
            #4.9 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:24 PM EDT

            Truth with a fake rant....as if...you give a rip for any answer...as all answers are too far above the level you are at.

            WHY ARE REPUBLICANS RUNNING BUSH/CHENEY/ROVE/NORQUIST FOR OFFICE AGAIN?

            Yes 17 of 24 of Romney's advisers are from the catastrophic Bush/Cheney regime. Why would anyone vote to have Bush/Cheney/Romney in office again? Repubs don't even want Bush to speak at the convention because he tore the country up so bad. What does Romney do? He does what Norquist and Rove told him to do. Hire their crony crooks because war profits were so good for them. Norquist said, all they need is someone to sign papers for them. Romney the strawman. Rove and Norquist are the people running for president, not Romney Ryan! BEWARE! Vote NO to Bush/Cheney/Norquist/Rove/Romney/Ryan! They hired these same people because crashing the economy made them rich. They hired these guys because war profits made them rich and they want some more of that action!

            Vote President Obama/Biden and team Democratic party.2012 ...........Dump Bush/Cheney/ Romney!

            • 6 votes
            #4.10 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:36 PM EDT

            under employed teacher, I can see why you are under employed: "nobody could fix.....what Bush W spend 8 years destroying." If you are an English teacher it is plain as day.

            • 3 votes
            #4.11 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:37 PM EDT

            Truth...haha....you should change your name to something more truthful....like Willfully Blind!

            • 3 votes
            #4.12 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:56 PM EDT

            S. William:

            This divisiveness has been going on since the Clinton years;

            Actually, it's been going on since the country was founded. This experiment called America almost fell apart more than a few times before the Constitution was ratified in 1878. We weren't nearly as united as public education of the 1960's and 70's history classes would have you believe. Now, I didn't expect them to do college level teaching either, so that's not a slam against public education. I understand you have to start with the basics.

            I haven't studied the political campaigns of the early 1800's, but those who have (and in this case, I'll take their word for it) have said that the campaigns of today are very mild by comparison to the rhetoric that was thrown around back then.

            Obama has repeatedly, publicly and privately offered an olive branch to the GOP and they have snubbed him each and every time

            And I would submit that the olive branch more often than not consisted of "do it my way or take a hike". Maybe if Obama has been willing to compromise a bit the first two years of his administration when he knew he didn't need even one Republican vote to pass whatever he wanted, and was using parliamentary measures like reconciliation to pass Obamacare, when it was never intended to be used for bills like that, then maybe the Republicans might be a bit more reciprocal today.

            Before Joe Biden was handed the VP slot he said (paraphrased): "I pray God that if we ever have the power, we will not use it in this manner." Of course, that went right out the window with Obamacare.

            so don't kid yourself about who's to blame.

            And don't kid yourself that the Democrats are always willing to compromise or that they haven't used exactly the same measures which the Republicans have. You see, I have no argument with this point of yours, except to the extent that you imply the Democrats don't do the same thing. They both do it.

            As far as Obamacare goes, the largest number of participants will be paying for their own or their employees' medical plan. This will be possible because it will be cheaper. It will be cheaper because virtually everybody will be in the pool.

            There are several problems with your analysis. 1. You are only looking at the demand side. When you increase demand, as Obamacare will do, but don't increase supply, i.e. doctors who will take care of them, cost's will RISE, not fall. This is economics 101.

            2. My wife happens to be a physician, when they did their semi annual insurance review a couple of weeks ago, their administrator told them to expect anywhere between a 40 to 60% increase in premiums in the next two years if Obamacare is implemented. The administrator further told them that to keep the premiums from overwhelming the business, he recommends that they DROP COVERAGE FOR THEIR EMPLOYEES, and let them go to the state pool to get their insurance. They will probably be doing this. That means they will no longer offer their employees coverage.

            If Obamacare is implemented, you will see this happening on a MASSIVE SCALE in EVERY kind of business throughout the country. In short this will be the next step for Democrats to declare that there is now another healthcare crisis and will demand a single payer system. This is the REAL goal of Obamacare.

            As I said, Obamacare is only favored by those who want the program to morph into a system where the taxpayer will be on the hook for their medical bills. I understand liberal incrementalism very, very well. Social security has expanded to cover far more than retirees, Medicare expanded to include Medicaid. Obamacare is just the next step.

            It is NOT what the program starts out as, it is what it becomes over time. Again, liberal incrementalism. And the bottom line is that there has NEVER been a nationaly implemented government program that has EVER not cost exponentially more than originally projected, nor not expanded far beyond it's original scope and intent.

            But yet, somehow you claim Obamacare will be different?? I've got some swampland in Death Valley for sale too.

            Those in Wash D.C. are not the small percentage owning the wealth of the nation.

            I should have used the word control, because that is the real intent of those on the left who believe that the tax code should be used as a behavior modification, and wealth "redistribution" tool. I'll concede that I probably could have worded that better. So, in the tradition of congress, I'll "revise and extend" my remarks to better reflect what I should have stated better to begin with. Control is the word I should have used.

            The IRS does not "do business."

            Don't read everything so literally. It was a euphemism. The point is that if the IRS wants to "do business" with you, you'd better comply or you may very well end up in jail.

            My government is not a business

            And if you want to see what happens when government is allowed to run wild with entitlements and pay government employees more than their private sector counterparts, you don't have to look any farther than Greece and much of the rest of Europe. That is what will be coming to America in the very near future unless we start getting our fiscal house in order. Unfortunately, neither party is willing to do that. You see, I have no love for the Republicans when it comes to spending, they are every bit as bad as the Democrats. On the other hand, Democrats are NOT serious about deficit reduction either.

            I tell ya what, let's compromise. I'll go along with increasing taxes with two conditions. Every dime will go straight to the bottom line of deficit reduction, and every government program gets 1% less a year in their budget for as long at the tax increase is in place.

            Let's see how willing you are to compromise. We have just increased taxes and put in place a mechanism to reduce government spending. I bet you say no to the spending cuts.

            America is not a corporation and we don't need a CEO to run it.

            We're 16 Trillion in debt, we desperately need to find a way to start reducing that number significantly NOW. I'll take a CEO over a "Chicago community organizer" any day. But, for what it's worth. I'm not voting for Romney because he doesn't meet my standards. I'm doing a write in.

            America is also not a socialist welfare state which is exactly what Obama wants it to become. I do not exist to serve the state. I am NOT the personal ATM machine for a bloated, wasteful, Federal Government. America itself is NOT the Federal Government. I don't sit around wringing my hands worrying if the Federal Government is confiscating enough of someone else's wealth so the can spend it on programs like "Cash for Clunkers", and Solyndra.

            A dictator is a far cry from a president setting policy. FYI

            Obama swore to uphold the Constitution, and by extension, the laws of this land. That includes the Defense of Marriage act and the immigration laws which make NO ALLOWANCE for age. You can not just unilaterally decice to ignore them. But yet, that is EXACTLY what Obama has done; either ignored them, said he will no longer enforce them, or has signed executive orders usurping those laws.

            That is absolutely a dictator in my book.

            so I don't know what you mean by "his people," unless you are making an unfounded and unappreciated racist crack, and that pretty much explains who you are. Go and sin no more.

            Eric Holder, when called before a committee to explain why he refused to prosecute the New Black Panthers in Philadelphia, said this:

            “Think about that,” Holder said. “When you compare what people endured in the South in the 60s to try to get the right to vote for African Americans, and to compare what people were subjected to there to what happened in Philadelphia—which was inappropriate, certainly that…to describe it in those terms I think does a great disservice to people who put their lives on the line, who risked all, for my people,” said Holder, who is black.

            Note the "my people" at the end of his quote. Those are Holder's words, not mine. Furthermore, whatever happened in the past is NO EXCUSE for not enforcing the laws of the land as they stand NOW, unless of course, you have the approval of the dictator who tells you to ignore those laws.

            Eric Holder is the AG of ALL the people, not just "my people". But you'd never know that by his actions.

            By the way, earlier, I said I was doing a write in. The name I'm writing in is Allen West. So please, spare me your false accusations of "racism". That is always a dead give away that someone on the left has run out of good arguments: Everything automatically reverts to "racism".

            Does racism exist? Of course it does, and I have no problem saying those that make judgements based on the color of a person's skin are complete idiots. But if there were as many racists hiding in the bushes as the left would have you believe, then Obama would have never gotten elected to begin with.

            You can not logically make the argument that Obama got elected the first time, and then claim "racism" if he doesn't get elected again.

            It won't be because of his race. It will be because of his incompetence.

            • 6 votes
            #4.13 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:59 PM EDT

            Correction: Should have read "Constitution was ratified in 1787". Think I got my fingers fumbling on the numbers keys on that one. My error, my apologies, now corrected.

            • 1 vote
            #4.14 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 11:36 PM EDT

            I think anyone questioning Obama's birthplace is an idiot, but it is not an unprecedented low. When Mitt Romney's father, George, was a presidential candidate the Democrats took it so far as the courts in questioning his citizenship. He was born in Mexico as his parents were doing missionary work there and were U.S. citizens. A judge ruled George a U.S. citizen. Both parties are out of control hypocrites.

              #4.15 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 1:38 PM EDT
              Reply

              So tell me: exactly how is what these dudes did different from Mitt Romney and his pals cutting the hair off a gay guy at their school? Did our esteemed presidential nominee commit a hate crime by any chance?

              • 8 votes
              #5 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:46 PM EDT

              You are not only comparing apples to oranges, you are comparing a tomato to a donkey.

              The Amish were all adults. Mitt was a minor.

              The Amish brutally attacked dozens of people, defiled and bloodied them. Mitt hazed one person, by cutting of a few locks.

              The Amish kidnapped a few people, which is a felony. Mitt held down a kid on some grass, which wouldn't even be on a DA's radar.

              Advice for posting on the internetz:

              1) Read

              2) Re-read

              3) Understand

              4) Post

              Ya don't want to come across as knee-jerk Leftist with sub-par reading comprehension skills, do ya?

              • 11 votes
              #5.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:02 PM EDT

              "he did that!?"

              Yes Mike, Mitt the prankster cut off a gay kid's hair. Mitt's friends held the kid down and Mitt performed the dirty deed. Severe conservative that he is. I even heard that there was humiliation involved. Of course from Mitt's mouth, he doesn't really recall, and BTW, what's the big deal with some good old fashioned shenanigans? And after all - if it were Afganistan it would have been a lot worse for the gay kid.

              • 5 votes
              #5.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:11 PM EDT

              Lord no! We only want to witness you coming across as knee-jerk Reich wing wanker with sub-par reading comprehension skills.

              • 6 votes
              #5.3 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:11 PM EDT

              Are you 5 years old? Your comprehension of circumstances is highly suspect. Hope you don't get caught burning a quran by your beloved president.

              • 2 votes
              #5.4 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:12 PM EDT

              moonbat - There was no evidence that the boy was gay. that was media speculation. It was just a kid who didn't abide by the "dress code" in the school.

              • 5 votes
              #5.5 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:18 PM EDT

              Walk...........Mitzy was not a minor. He was 18. And other eighteen year old men were dying for our country at that time. And Mitzy is still lying and pulling crap. Someone should have put their foot up his azz a long time ago. If this hateful bully becomes president, woe to the U. S.

              • 9 votes
              #5.6 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:23 PM EDT

              The other boys said Mitzy's victim was gay. And who the hell put Mitzy in charge of the school's dress code? Nobody, that's who.

              • 10 votes
              #5.7 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:26 PM EDT

              The difference he admitted it was wrong and "evolved"

                #5.8 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:27 PM EDT

                He said it was wrong.............but he just can't remember doing it. Right. Fricking liar. And he sure has evolved...............into something even more toxic. You can do lots of harm when you have lots of money.

                • 7 votes
                #5.9 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:33 PM EDT

                Guys, Guys, Relax!How did the conversation about Amish turned into Politics. Lets be reasonable. Each of us did something stupid in our teenage years of life that we are not proud of .Just imagine ourselves being elected for office and have someone come and dig all the dirt out. How will make it us feel?I thing most of us changed since hitting adulthood, and would not repeat same mistakes. We got smarter or better. The difference is Adults aver 21 committing something that makes other asking : "What were you thinking?"I am a medical professional and am dealing with many people that have pshych issues.Theese are usually adults.Some are very religious, from different walks of life and religion. I just lost a mother that felt that in order of reaching total purity and some connection with higher Being she needed to stop interracting with family and fasting. The end of the story, -psychosis and then suicide.Usualy people start with undiagnosed depression and then if not interveined , all of the other stuff.I thing that this Amish guy became to obsessed with religion that he lost his common sence.Hope this comming out in public will help other to check themselves.but throving stones in each others garden would not fix anything, so please stop destorting the story.relax and enjoy life. This country is still better then most of the ones I been to.Start apreciating things.

                • 1 vote
                #5.10 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:51 PM EDT

                even do more when u have lots of power.

                  #5.11 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:10 PM EDT

                  I agree. My goodness people. If you want to say something bout the election, go to a story about the election or Mitt Romney or Obama. If you know something about the Amish or their beliefs, their life style etc. maybe then you will have something worth reading, otherwise find a political forum to trash.

                  As to this article and the Amish. It must be serious for an Amish community to involve the law. They tend to solve issues among themselves and not include Englishers (Which is what people, outside the faith, are referred as). It sounds to me like the defendants have obviously taken a more radical position than is common, for the victims to involve the law. Amish are pacifists. They have a very strict order but I do find the hair cutting a very radical move.

                    #5.12 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:43 PM EDT

                    I'd be happy to, once you got your head out of your posterier. Come on, Sport. Put your brain in gear before you engage your mouth (err fingers on the keyboard). If you can't see the difference, you are in serious need for a transplant. You know, somewhere above the shoulders.

                      #5.13 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:04 PM EDT

                      Common........nice try to deflect the story comparison from Romney. The kid had different hair, no proof that he was gay. Mittster the gangleader had to get a posse to hold the kid down. Yeah, Mitt broke the law. It was criminal then. Mitt damn well remembered it as he started trying to contact other friends than the ones that helped him hold the kid down when he cut the kids hair off. Mitt was trying to find some "friends" to come forward to offset the crime he committed. No dice. Mitt was a criminal that never paid his debt of justice to the guy or the community. Let him serve time now!

                      • 3 votes
                      #5.14 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:46 PM EDT

                      I guess the Romney trolls didn't read the story. It is about an Amish Bishop who got upset because he had excommunicated a family of 8 people and the synod of bishops overturned the excommunication. So he took it into his own hands to defy his own religion and have his "followers" physically attack those he had excommunicated. That Bishop and his helpers are now on trial. Unfortunately for them, the fact that they may have committed aggravated assault and kidnapping for religious reasons nhot approved of by their own religion makes it a hate crime under federal law. Remember that the federal system is the harshest in the world --- mandatory sentencing and no parole being important points.

                      This has absolutely nothing to do with either Romney or Obama. But it amazes me that so many right wingers spend so much time on here trying to crank out their right-wing viewpoints on a site whose motto is "Lean Forward." Why aren't they on Fox's web site patting each other on the back and telling one another how smart they are?

                        #5.15 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:39 PM EDT
                        Reply

                        Sam "Mullet" lol!! Now that's funny.

                        • 12 votes
                        Reply#6 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:46 PM EDT

                        I know, right? that was all i kept seeing! Mullet cuts hair and its a hate crime, of course it is! Its business in the front and party in the back!

                        • 10 votes
                        #6.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:30 PM EDT
                        Reply

                        A man named Mullet accused of hair cutting crimes. Sounds about right. :D

                        • 14 votes
                        Reply#7 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:48 PM EDT

                        An Amish Bishop (who has been held in solitary confinement since last November!) accused of hating his Amish flock for imposing spiritual discipline?! So, why is the Pope not accused of hating Catholics for denying Holy Communion to pro-life Catholics? This sordid case is nothing but a modern day witch hunt by the feds who seek to demonize the Amish, perhaps the most authentic Christian community in the world; that may just be the reason for this witch hunt.

                        • 8 votes
                        Reply#8 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:55 PM EDT
                        plorkDeleted

                        I'm pretty sure the pope isn't spending a lot of time physically abusing, kidnapping or physically altering his followers. Your understanding Christian is stunning limited. Do you really think Jesus gave a hoot about religious tradition and ceremony. He tried to keep some traditions but pretty much said they weren't as important as his 2 commandments. His church is based on people - not buildings or facial hair. Try reading and attempting to comprehend (anything) before posting.

                        • 3 votes
                        #8.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:16 PM EDT

                        What's up Plork, going to the Muslim support meeting at the DNC?

                        • 3 votes
                        #8.3 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:28 PM EDT

                        The pope hates pro-lifers??? I thought he'd shun anyone pro-choice?

                        • 1 vote
                        #8.4 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:38 PM EDT
                        plorkDeleted

                        boe you an alter boy or what!

                          #8.6 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:56 PM EDT

                          The Pope has diplomatic immunity.

                            #8.7 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 1:07 AM EDT
                            Reply
                            Comment author avatarAmber Schultzvia Facebook

                            Whole thing is one extreme on top of another & men whose egos have gotten the best of them. No one stands up to the elders so y should they have boundaries. Just messed up from every angle.

                            • 2 votes
                            Reply#9 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:58 PM EDT

                            The beard is part of these people's cultures! Leave them alone and mind your own business. How would you like your culture to be raped like this?

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#10 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:07 PM EDT

                            It's like the Southern Baptists getting after the American Baptists. Amish vs Amish. No one outside their 'culture' (religion) raped them. They raped themselves. But, when they allow their own stupidity to reign over their common sense . . . let the law run its course.

                            • 4 votes
                            #10.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:12 PM EDT

                            You know why Baptists don't have sex standing up. Someone might think they were dancing.

                            • 5 votes
                            #10.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:58 PM EDT

                            You know why Baptists don't have sex standing up. Someone might think they were dancing.

                            LOL - good one:)

                              #10.3 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 9:51 AM EDT
                              Reply

                              The Amish are a unique community to say the least. But, at their bottom line, they are simply another religion who seeks to control.

                              • 9 votes
                              Reply#11 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:08 PM EDT

                              So. How is this different from the government forcibly cutting off the beard of the Fort Hood horrific killer?

                              • 3 votes
                              Reply#12 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:09 PM EDT
                              plorkDeleted

                              yep...that's right. When you sign up for the military, you give up many of your rights as a citizen.

                              • 9 votes
                              #12.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:20 PM EDT

                              Let me explain, moron. Regardless of religion, or any other civilian culture, the U.S. Army does not allow beards, in accordance with their official grooming standards (for everyone). Period. It is obvious you have never served in the military and would never stoop to do so. Let someone else do the dirty work, while you sit back and spout nonsense.

                              • 5 votes
                              #12.3 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:09 PM EDT

                              seems kinda silly considering the army used to allow beards...ever seen a picture of grant clean shaven? lol...not like someone is gonna grab their beard in one hand and cut their head off with a sword with the other hand...especially when the other soldier has a rifle, lol

                                #12.4 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:27 AM EDT
                                Reply

                                vell in our defense vee vere tired ov dem hafing a better beard dan us, so vee felt der need to start da shearin and next ting ja know der vas hare a flyin

                                • 11 votes
                                Reply#13 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:11 PM EDT

                                lol. Last time I was in amish country i found that i, for one, LOVE amish accents. And quilts. And they do have some awesome furniture.

                                • 1 vote
                                #13.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:32 PM EDT
                                Reply

                                Stay outa my bush!

                                • 1 vote
                                Reply#14 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:11 PM EDT

                                I guess to me the surprising thing about this is that they are going to a government court about it, as opposed to handling it internally within their own social structure.

                                • 6 votes
                                Reply#15 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:13 PM EDT

                                I wholly agree. I always thought that the Amish were very good at handling their own affairs without government interference. Come on guys (I am talking to the Amish), take care of your own affairs within your community. Once you allow the government to handle a matter that your faith claims to own, you give away ownership of your religious rights. Hold on to your freedoms.

                                • 1 vote
                                #15.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:22 PM EDT

                                For one thing, the Amish will not read this, they don't accept technology in their religion. Secondly, your religious RIGHTS are not allowed to infringe on one's PERSONAL RIGHTS. I think that's what religious sects tend to forget.

                                • 4 votes
                                #15.2 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 8:25 PM EDT
                                Reply

                                If you don't think incest is prevalant among the Amish, just look at the foreheads on these guys.

                                • 4 votes
                                Reply#16 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:15 PM EDT

                                The amish kids used to ride our school bus to their school....you should have seen how many of the children were crosseyed, nevermind the foreheads, lol

                                  #16.1 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:29 AM EDT
                                  Reply

                                  is it a joke or is the hair cutter really named Mullet ?

                                  • 3 votes
                                  Reply#17 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:17 PM EDT

                                  In 1968, I was inducted into the US Army. Opposed to my will, they cut of all my hair and, though less-than fully developed, beard. Was that a hate crime? lol

                                  Was the elders actions stupid? Absolutely! Hate crime, I don't think so, just stupid.

                                  • 3 votes
                                  Reply#18 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:19 PM EDT

                                  I feel your pain. I had hair in 1968, and now it all fell out. Now that a hate crime.

                                  • 3 votes
                                  #18.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:02 PM EDT
                                  Reply

                                  "A what for a WHAT???" Simply slice 4 inches off their personal pointers, and we're good.

                                  • 1 vote
                                  Reply#19 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:19 PM EDT

                                  They pay no taxes. Their horses take dumps on our roads. They are the biggest puppy mill people in the country.

                                  • 6 votes
                                  Reply#20 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:19 PM EDT

                                  Uh, yeah they do pay taxes. Ignorance is not a virtue friend

                                  • 2 votes
                                  #20.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:31 PM EDT

                                  Yes, and they are brutal to the animals on their farms. Watch them at the New Holland horse auctions. They bash the horses viciously in the face. These were horses they used to pull plows and carts. Nice thank you they give them as they send them off to slaughter. They are animal abusers as with the puppy mills too.

                                  • 1 vote
                                  #20.2 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:02 AM EDT

                                  but if they keep breeding and doubling their population, when will they overtake the hispanic population?

                                    #20.3 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:31 AM EDT
                                    Reply

                                    These dudes are hardcore. Next time there might be blood.

                                    • 3 votes
                                    Reply#21 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:19 PM EDT

                                    It is a hate crime, these people have always grown beards. We the government are not allowed to shave the muslim terrorist that killed solders from fort hood.

                                    • 1 vote
                                    Reply#22 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:21 PM EDT

                                    Another issue of church and state. When is the government going to learn to keep it's nose out of church/state issues.

                                    • 3 votes
                                    Reply#23 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:22 PM EDT

                                    When these false Amish crossed the line and committed bodily harm to others, that is when it no longer was a church issue, that is when it became a government public safety issue. These heretics committed acts of terror.

                                      #23.1 - Wed Aug 29, 2012 1:18 AM EDT
                                      Reply

                                      We used to use humor and say, "Don't make a federal case out of it." Now it's no joke.

                                      F...k. Hair grows back. Don't use my tax dollars sorting out the problems of a group who doesn't support the United States and would not lift a finger to protect anyone from our enemies.

                                      Scr.w this religious sect. They don't want anything to do with the government, but they are hypocritical enough to use it like a bunch of cry babies.

                                      • 7 votes
                                      Reply#24 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:23 PM EDT

                                      We've evolved to such a high level that we now define "hate crimes" in terms of the length of your beard! Such an advanced moral sensibility! In the meantime we allow murderers and rapists to go free if they can post bail, but this...this...vile, evil, horrible, rapacious criminal stays in solitary for several months. Try this man on charges of assault and unlawful imprisonment and put him in jail if he's guilty. But hate crimes? Oh please. We surely have more serious issues to deal with!

                                      • 4 votes
                                      Reply#25 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:24 PM EDT

                                      think about it for just a minute. He did not just get beat up. He went after his beard for a reason. Not simple assault.

                                      • 3 votes
                                      #25.1 - Tue Aug 28, 2012 7:07 PM EDT
                                      Reply
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