nuff said....

What if all 23 or so million who lost their jobs decided to take this same action, when it gets worse and this country goes broke and all those on food stamps and goverment checks quit getting these hand outs whats it gonna be like then ......can you say civil unrest., hope you do have a gun and ammo, plenty of ammo.

What the hell is wrong with people these days? Why is there so much of this now as opposed to...say....30 years ago? I'm not even being funny when I say......it's time to look into our food supply and water supply and other environmental factors. Something is making this more prevalent today than it was years ago and I want to know what it is!

One of the reasons it's "more prevalent" today than 30 years ago: THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE.

@Agnon Mema... you are right on the money! More people, but not that many more jobs. Even back at the end of WWII, jobs were hard to find. It's only gotten worse.

hope you do have a gun and ammo, plenty of ammo.

Never have enough ammo.

I bought a gun (or ten) for the first time last October. I don't want to be the last fool w/o one. Wish it was different, but I try to keep it real.

(Another D for O'b)

OOPs, forgot to mention my business was robbed at gun-point. By my business I mean ME. Got a gun next day and a CCW soon after.

What will you do when your door gets kicked in?

Another reason it appears that more crimes with guns are happening is the "news" media is rabidly anti-gun and goes for sensationalism rather then factual news, especially MSNBC

Deen how right you are. Playing into the hands of their owners, the liberal gun grabbers who would have us at the mercy of all, just to come in and "rescue " us with more big government cause thats what gets their weenies hard. Insanity is not just rampant among the shooters, its taken our "owners" by storm.

I, for one, refuse to be owned. I refuse to believe the garbage they fill everyone with. There is still far much more good in the world than bad, but they would have us believe otherwise because then we are easier to control.

All good people of the world, please unite and leave the garbage behind!!!

@Jim-Ohioan #1.7

What will you do when your door gets kicked in?

Fire at will, reload, repeat..if necessary.

@ FreedomofSpeechRules:What part do you think internet "discussion pages" such as this one with no moderator,and where everyone who enters is essentially jumping into a vat of battery acid or a den of starving lions-play in getting people stirred up to commit violence?What about Facebook pages that are just blind hate?

IMHO that probably wasn't the primary reason that Andrew Engeldinger did what he did.My guess is that his boss and a few cronies had been workplace bullies for years to a guy they thought wouldn't be believed,and when they ended his employment he snapped.It would be interesting to know whether these "mental illness" issues existed before Andrew worked there.More likely they were major depression and PTSD brought about by years of workplace abuse.

But whatever the reason,here's a collection of gems just from this page of comments on this article, at 7:43 a.m.Pretty hard to believe that being engaged in this kind of stuff for more than the few minutes it takes to write a comment on a news story and get out,has never caused any kind of violence.

Here's what others on this page are saying:

"......can you say civil unrest., hope you do have a gun and ammo, plenty of ammo."

"What a faggot."

"This is Obama's change that we were told we should believe in 2008"

"chuck, you are a moron. I'll stop at that."

"you effing Jack@!$%#, I have relitives there and you sound like the inbred mofo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

There is also hatred in the work place, mind games etc., I've worked in many places where employees were groupies, clicky, lemming..Couple that with a person that is already disturbed and has a history and you get what you get, how well do you know the person next to you.

Fire at will, reload, repeat..if necessary.

Beautiful. You live in a modern society, with an elected government, and you can live where you want. Yet, you have a bunker siege mentality. You are preparing for the worst when there is so much good that is available to you.

I understand the need to feel protected. I can even understand you wanting a gun to be protected. But you do see that the same laws that let you easily get a gun, especially a hand gun (lots of hand gun crime), also make it easy for bad guys to get hand guns? I mean, just about any idiot can get a hand gun. No training needed. Best we can do?

Davey, don't try to psychoanalyze me from a few lines of text. Go troll someone else..

Sorry Dave, I chose to troll you. You are so trollable.

Actually, don't be so sensitive. (Oh great, a sensitive guy with a gun.) I was, more or less, addressing all pro-gun folks, using your comments as a starting point. I'm sure that many pro gun folk share your sentiment.

I can't believe he shot the UPS guy. WTF.... That guy was probably breaking his back, hauling ass, just trying to make service. What a faggot.

Coward killed himself. Not sure it matters now if the cowards name is given.

I'm sorry for you and your family Gary. I just hope he didn't take others along for the ride.

My condolences, but are you trying to say that only men use a gun to murder others?

Gary, I'm very sorry for your tragedy.

My condolences to the families of those who lost their lives and also to the two people who are still struggling for their lives.

Let's also remember the family of the shooter. They seem to feel horrible about what happened and they also lost someone they loved. I can't imagine what anguish they are going through.

Janine the idiot, Did Gary say his son killed anyone but himself? This man lost his son when he commited suicide & you make a stupid comment about hoping he didn't take others with him. I think if that was the case he would have said so. you're just a nasty, illiterate joke of a human being. No one wants to read your stupid comments & I'll be sure to skip over any with the name Janine attached to it in the future.

I was actually thinking this same point while I was reading the article. Those point and shoot videogames are so realistic now it seems there is a certain disconnect between fantasy and reality. So, when someone who is a bit off gets thrown a curveball by life it their automatic answer is to blow everyone away. And my mom chastized me for playing Duck Hunt on the Nintendo NES back in the early 90's...

That's like comparing how many people played cowboys and indians, army and what not when they were kids. A lot did, most have not assaulted someone. I play an online game, although since I play a rogue I suppose pointy objects would be more of my thing. I have yet to stab someone in real life. But if it really matters to you, I have played Halo and I would shoot the other players. I do not own a gun in 'real life'. Games do not make people do things. People's brain chemistry and life experiences play a part in what a person does in life.

Being a gamer doesn't make you a killer. Blame them for making the choice to kill. Screw the imfluences, they're a sentient human being that can make choices between right and wrong, it's not the game's fault, it's not TV's fault, it's THEIR fault for buying the guy, buying the ammo, walking out the door, and pulling the trigger. Stop this special interest crap already.

Frankly, this sort of thing had been going on long before video games started turning turbo violent. They used to call it "going postal", I believe, and frankly, things were a lot more dangerous and even violent several years ago. The difference is we now have safe releases, such as, y'know, GAMES. Bad day at work? You can FUS RO DAH some poor guard off a tower. Kids screanming in your ear all day? Rocket Arena, Unreal style.

Anyone trying to say games are what's causing this forget that before games came along, this sort of thing was a lot worse, and things were a lot more dangerous. Don't give me that crap that games are causing this, don't you dare take a single ounce of blame from the gunman. They took that gun to that location, they opened fire, they took those lives. Blame no one, NO ONE, but them, or you're insulting the lives lost to this monster.

FreedomofSpeechRules: 30 years ago: PCs, though very expensive, were being sold, and the rest is history. I believe some people spend too much time reading "news" and blogs on the internet and take it personally and then feel they have to take deadly action.

chuck, you are a moron. I'll stop at that.

Chuck,

actually the opposite. Playing violent video games is an outlet for natural violent instincts and for relieving stress. Those that act more violent after playing such games have a mental deficiency.

If the murderer had used a car to kill people, I guess we could say "Another proud day for CAR lovers".

The shooter would have had a very difficult time driving a car through the office or up on the loading dock to target people. A concealed gun just takes a slight pull of the trigger to blow five innocent humans away!

A car can easily be driven through a wall and into a building. The reason the murderer used the loading dock to get into the building is that it was OPEN.

Now, when someone uses a car to kill people, I guess we can all say "Another proud day for CAR lovers".

Oh, and we can add KNIVES to the list, as well as baseball bats, chopsticks, chains, rocks, etc, etc, etc -- anything that can be used to kill someone. You don't like guns simply because it "just takes a slight pull of the trigger".

By the time the driver got through the wall the victims would have time to escape. We could play this game all day. The fact is that a gun makes it simple and efficient to stack up a pile of corpses!

Lets take guns away from everyone.......then only the criminals will have them they will always find a way to get guns no matter what , then we will be defenseless , cops cant protect you thats why I call them aftas, they get their after you been shot, or after you been robbed etc only time there any where on time is when your speeding.

The bad guy has the drop on the victim anyway so how is that defensive weapon going to help? You'll still be blown away!

Ban handguns.

john at least i would have a choice and a chance. without one i would have niether

What choice would you have? This is not a shoot out at high noon! The perp has the advantage of surprise and has already accessed his weapon, (in cowboy terms,he's got the drop on you) your toast!

How about mentally ill people who happen to have a valid drivers license -- and unfettered access to cars.

10,000 rounds of ammunition? It's a piddling number, really. That's like a bag of rice to chef; it lasts less than a couple of weeks when a person is serious about keeping their skill level up.

On humans?

Agnon, I see your point but get over yourself. Think of a new example. People won't agree with you 100%, and you're just being lazy with the whole cars-are-just-as-bad argument.

Car, machete, bomb, hammer it doesn't matter! The most accessible, concealable, simple and efficient way to kill humans is with a GUN!

taxpayer

Whats the difference if it's 100 rounds or 10.000 rounds? The perp can only carry so many. If we were to limit the number of rounds one can buy you can just go to several stores.

What do you suggest, Every shrink report his patients to a data bank? That won't work.

But, of course, guns don't kill people...etc., etc.,etc. Until the rest of us tell the NRA to get themselves a private island and shoot it out we will never be able to keep guns out of the hands of the seriously deranged.

10,000 rounds of ammunition? It's a piddling number, really. That's like a bag of rice to chef; it lasts less than a couple of weeks when a person is serious about keeping their skill level up.

With 9mm rounds going for an average of $11 per box of 50, if you're spending $230 every week or 2 ( close to $6,000 a year) on ammo, you have issues.

Duke,,,while I can agree that people with Mental Illness should not be given a gun permit, I just wonder how long a permit is good for. Is it like a drivers license where it is renewed every 5yrs or so? If so, should there be a full investigation done each time it's renewed?

If it's not, things can change after you receive your permit. Maybe your girlfriend cheats on you. Maybe your parents die. Maybe you become physcially ill. Maybe you lose your job/home. So many variables can come into play after you are deemed "Sane" when you get your permit.

You don't need a gun to ruin lives, look at Sandusky.

You might be disappointed to know that Minnesota is actually one of the states that is thriving, along with their neighbors.

Those inbreds with the buck teeth who live in "fly over country" must be doing something right since they have the lowest unemployment rates in the nation and no housing crisis. Kind of makes you wish you were in the same situation, doesn't it?

And just where do YOU live that is so peachy-keen, where nothing ever makes you "crazy"?

Maybe you should put down the blowtorch before someone labels YOU as crazy........

why would I want to live in a state so screwed up that it produces religious lunatics like Bachmann? By the way my state has a lower unemployment rate than Minnesota and a higher per capita income, as wellas more freedoms, we told the religious right to shut up years ago.

Bachmann is from Iowa, she even tells everyone that.

Now, how about you tell everyone WHERE you live so we'll all know just how @!$%#ed up it really is -- so we can all avoid it like the plague.

Bachmann was born in Iowa, but she was raised in Minnesota with Minnesota psycho religious values. Say high to Bradlee for us.

you effing Jack@!$%#, I have relitives there and you sound like the inbred mofo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yeah a lot of mentally ill people in the northeast, midwest states , look who the majority of them voted for in 08, had to bring that up because his stupidty is slowly killing all of us in one way or another and will probalbly lead to civil unrest when the money for entitlement programs run out. Will white trash help Obama stay in the white house ?

You have to be living in the mexifornia state or something because you are totally inbred JA

If we keep that ahole in dc, aka, you butt buddy in office yeppers fkhole

Those Irish really have the gift of the gab!

ever notice how tea baggers assume that anyone they disagree with is a liberal democrat? It's like they just can't function on the higher cognitive levels, I'm wondering if they might have longer than average arms to...

Because the NRA would complain.

Almost all (I mean all) mass shootings these days are related to the easy accessibility of GUNS!

This just in: The MSN.com blogger known as Rasputin-2589057 was killed today in another workplace shooting. It is reported that the building where Rasputin-2589057 worked is another of those "Resistance Free Zones" where guns are simply not allowed. Police speculate that the shooter ignored the signs and brought the gun into the building anyway...........

Now, before any of you MSN netnannies get your panties in a twist, this is SARCASM. It is to show Rasputin-2589057 and all other anti-gun idiots that criminals DO NOT obey laws and they DO NOT care about signs telling them that they are not allowed to bring a gun into a building.

Agnon, is idiocy a family tradition, or are you making a special effort?

Have fun at the NRA meeting.

Seems like Agnon has just a bit of anger in her. Keep her away from the guns!

Why Johnny boy, I am touched that you want my body so badly, but I don't swing that way. And I'm not a she, so I REALLY don't swing that way.

Oh, and nice to know that you're a clairvoyant, too..... Does your pastor know that you've been worshipping Satan on the side?

I think Agnon is one of the inbreds from Ortonville. Maybe she's friends with Bradlee Dean.

What, Rasputin, are you saying that what YOU said about the NRA is not idiotic?

Well, have fun getting a cop to show up in the 30 seconds that you'll REALLY need one..........

Hey blowtorch, where do YOU live? I'm betting wherever it is there's plenty of missing teeth and rolls of fat........

Rasputin-2589057, Your a dork and not very smart, if someone else ignored the rules and were carrying a defensive weapon, don't you think the results would be a little less traumatic, I mean like, you hit him in the leg and advise him to stop, then if he didn't you'd have to do him. Oh I forgot, the guy that saved people would be breaking the law and deserves a life sentence for trying to stop somebody from killing a lot of people, because he didn't obey a sign. I ask you, how smart is that? But you won't get it cause in your tiny little mind, everyone should obey the signs, regardless if they're on drugs or have mental heath issues or feel they were wronged in some way. Good point of view for someone who has no clue. Yes, let's get rid of all the guns, that way we'll know who the bad guys are, only side effect is we'll be dead.

Danny. The bad guy will always have the drop on you so your gun will be useless.

Poor agnon, getting more and more desperate to find anything to make her state look like it isn't a serial killer factory.

I'll give you a hint, in my state, the last mass murder was committed by someone from Minnesota.

I loved all the gun whackos who were puffing out their man cans and saying how they would have been a hero in Colorado to when all they would have accomplished is shooting an innocoent person and adding to the chaos.

I know you won't look because it doesn't suit your agenda but you can look on you tube and see several examples on surveillance cameras of CCW holders fighting off bad guys "who had the drop on them".

I'd be willing to bet for any case where someone with a CCW stopped a crime without hurting any innocent people, there's at least one where it wouldn't have worked.

But here's the thing, and I'm a gun owner myself. The NRA would say it's the robbers fault if I were to try and stop him and ended up shooting a bystander, I'd say I need to go to jail for manslaughter. I want a law that says all these idiots shooting themselves or others accidently lose their gun rights, the NRA says we can't do that, so the moron who used a piece of plywood for a backstop and put rounds in the down range neighbors house get's to keep his guns.

That's whats wrong in America, people want their rights regardless of anyone elses.

Are you saying that the MURDERER Andrew J. Engeldinger was a "good shooter"?

No I am saying he was a good person who had to find justice his self.

Andrew J. Engeldinger is a hero in a world that loves making people victims and complains when the victim seeks justice.

Oh, what a trip you must be on, to think that the MURDERER was a hero. Abusive and anti-social towards his co-workers, abusive and anti-social towards his neighbors -- and you say he was a hero. Maybe you should become the same kind of hero he was at the very end....when he shot himself.

Heroes save lives, they do not take them.

First your on a trip you sick @!$%# he was not convicted of anything and yes users like the police always call the other people evil when they do there evil this guy was a hero who stood up to evil and gave his life fighting it.

Yes heroes save lives not only the physical life but life from economic slavery too, see your cheering for Satan and this guy stood up to his evil.

Just look at your Photo You are not of God You are of Satan and his earthly system.

Andrew J. Engeldinger was a hero who stood up to oppression, you support oppression and the oppressor.

Let's look at the civil war 2/3 of all Americans died for a purpose and they where heroes Just like this man is.

You believe it to be or you know? This is not news reporting this is guessing.

In over 2 million times a year a firearm is used for personal protection,and many of those times a shot isn't even fired to prevent a crime...Why is it where most of these kinds shootings take place there's a "no weapons" ban ???

What a moronic statement! How are they responsible? "They knew he was dangerous." is just another idiotic and baseless statement. He was an adult. Any lawyer who thinks they could be sued is an idiot who should be disbarred immediately.

How does becoming quiet and withdrawn make him dangerous? Can't wait to hear this explanation.