Indeed it is a very slippery slope. Laws that criminalize non-violent behavior inside of ones own private residence can't possibly be constitutionally sound.

It would make more sense if this was an apartment complex that includes no-smoking anywhere on the premises as part of the lease, but here they are saying the government can tell you what you can/can't do in your own home. Not good news, not good at all.

Think about this, what are they going to do if people do it anyway? Put them in jail? Aren't the California jails already overrun with non-violent offenders?

Agreed, but we have been sliding down that slope for a while and it's getting steeper.

I'm mostly liberal and I agree with Chris. To say what someone can and cannot do in their house is exactly what was used as the legal basis to overturn a number of laws (most recently sodomy laws). If you want to ban smoking in a multi unit house where the tenets don't have control over the air they breath then that makes sense. Going further into single family dwellings is a step too far.

Oh, on the West Coast you'll see it impossible to smoke anywhere. They will pass and upheld. Entire campuses are smoke free, why not your home, or your car.

Absolutely right.

What galls me--and I'm not a smoker--is that these laws don't seem to be based on any proof that secondhand smoke is dangerous to people living in adjoining homes.

Legislation for the sake of pandering to public opinion (and votes) is an expensive way to bolster a "nanny state".

And I'm all for banning smoking in enclosed public areas (areas owned by taxpayers), but I've always disagreed with laws that make it illegal for restaurant or bar owners to allow smoking in their establishments. Don't want to be exposed to secondhand smoke? Don't go in.

I disagree more with banning a legal substance from someone's home.

One of these fine days we will stand up and tell those fools to F@#$ OFF.

What I chose to do in my own home is none of their business !!! To damn many bleeding hearts out there. If I want to smoke or drink or eat myself to death in my own home what is your problem ????? Smokers and drinkers pay more in taxes ( because they enjoy smoking or drinking= consumer user tax ) than you do. So shut up and leave us alone !!! What is next ??? A law against stinky farts in public !!!!!

This busy

OBESE people cost the health care industry more money to keep alive than smokers. That is a fact and look it up for yourself !!!

Very slippery slope indeed.

The Liberal state of California with Liberal lawmakers is going to tell you what you can do in your home?????

This must be bizzaro world as I thought only Republicans do this?????

The do as I say not as I do attitude from the lawmakers is appauling to say the least.

Where is the outcry?????? NOW if this were a woman's body..................

Slippery ? Communism is spreading throughout the land and the People dont recognize it. Whats happening is a further erosion of ownership. A condominium is not a duplex or apt. Its a privately owned dwelling. Now "they" are coming right into your home and telling you how to live. Houses are next. Its a bad law and the proof of that is the fact that any group of American smokers CANT build a condo development for themselves. If everyone in a complex smoked, then who is being harmed? This is why its a bad law. Where is our freedom? Its being usurped by people we dont vote for. Show me one time where an insurance company has reduced rates after getting society to do something to save lives. Its not about saving lives, its about putting more money into the pockets of those who own insurance companies.

You breath in more toxins and poisons just by standing next to a road than what you will ever get from smoking. All vehicles should be banned as well for the satey of the public. If you do not like smoking, stay away from it. It's that easy!!!

Because it is my home or my car I own the air inside them, I don't own the air on Campus.

I am no smoker but when is enough enough. Government in every aspect of our lives! I suppose I am not surprised by where this kooky legislation is coming from, but just like any cancer, it will usually spread.

I'd be all for it under one circumstance. Any person living there who approves this must STAY there and NEVER relocate. I am sick of Californians coming to our state then trying to make it as kooky as the place they left!

The old saying still applies...

California..."Land of fruits and nuts"...

Well, this is multi-family homes, where more than one family is sharing a house. So really, this is a case of "you will respect the rights of OTHERS IN THE HOUSE YOU OCCUPY to clean air."

I think you misread the article. This isn't in response to two families occupying the same house, it's two family living next to each other in a row of townhomes, etc. 2nd hand smoke doesn't seep through the walls, so who gives a rats ass what your neighbor is up to.

I suppose next you'd support a city banning people who living in multi-family dwellings (e.g., townhomes, apartments, etc.) from having sex, because the neighbors might hear it and that's indecent exposure.

Given your tenor on your 1st response, I suppose you'd be on board with a "no sex in adjoined homes" law as well, correct?

When do we pass laws keeping fat people out of fast food restaurants since that is more of an epidemic than smoking? I mean it isn't good for everyone else when large people continue to be unhealthy.

I am at risk of them having increased rates of heart attacks when they are driving next to me right? My health care bill goes up because of their health problems right?

Just watch where this goes. Hey in New York they can't balance the budget for the transit authority but they did outlaw those pesky jumbo softdrinks.

This busy monster, not that it really matters but the article is addressing Multi Dwelling residences where they have shared walls. Not multiple families living in one unit.

Why not ban drinking, because more people are hurt and killed by people who drink (than those who are killed by second hand smoke? Of course, this doesn't mean shutting down the alcohol industry--we wouldn't want to shut down a profitable industry. Just make it illegal to consume their product either at home or in a public place? It's a public safety issue. I shouldn't be threatened by people who drink alcohol.

Aids is detrimental to health, maybe we should ban gays also. It's a public safety issue too.

Why don't our elected reps find how to fix problems instead of creating more.

Leave me the #$%& alone to live MY life.

thisbusymonster, it's not a slippery slope until the government bans something that you want to do in your own home. I lived in a duplex with a smoker in the second unit and never smelled any smoke. Breathing the air in most of California is more dangerous than threat of second hand smoke from somebody in an adjoining apartment. California is the land of government gone wild and out of control.

"Police in the United States reported 1,093,323 crashes involving a driver or pedestrian with a (BAC) of .01 or more."

Okay, so let's ban drinking certainly more threatening to one's life than smoking a cigarette.

Does this also apply to medical marijuana?

Can I infer from your comment, Hatr, that you are for telling the groups with whom you disagree what they can or cannot do, but are for others not being able to tell them what they can or can't do?

"Police in the United States reported 1,093,323 crashes involving a driver or pedestrian with a (BAC) of .01 or more."

Okay, so let's ban drinking certainly more threatening to one's life than smoking a cigarette.

not a great comparison cause drinking is legal but driving afterward is illegal.

Once you begin coming into peoples homes, even under the best intentions, you're setting yourselves up for something more sinister down the road. Next they'll be dictating how you should decorate them. When you should shut off your tv or what you put on your dinner plate. I'm not a smoker and while I can understand not wanting to smell my neighbors cigarettes, especially if they're lighting up 10 or 20 times a day, they should at least set up a separate building with smoking units. Smoking may be very unhealthy for you but we can't go around telling people they can't light up in their own homes. What's next? You can't have that bacon for breakfast because someone is concerned it might clog your arteries? Where is the line drawn.

there they go, stomping on people's rights again. Damn california.

thisbusymonster,

They may be multi-dwelling houses but, they are separate with fire walls and their air ducts are separated. I think they went too far to say you cannot smoke within the walls of your very own home where you pay all the bills and mortgage.

What!? Do I have to fill out an application to rub one off in my own privacy of my shower because it "may" clog the drain that is a communal system?! WTF man.

I agree with public places banning smoking but, this is my freakin' house man! What are they going to do? My neighbor smells it then the Police kick my door down because I won't answer it knowing it's the cops with a butt in my hand?

That'll go over great when they're arresting me while simultaneously there's a liquor store being robbed at gunpoint across the street but they're too busy with me.

• Put it out or we'll shoot! LMAO

Hatr_Hurter also has a valid point. I always wondered how anyone could legally drive to a bar but cannot legally drive back home. If I smoke and drive, I'd bet I would have about a 99% chance "LESS" of killing someone than if I was driving. WTF!

Smoking is legal, too. But the point is, if you are taking preventive measures to protect the public from something that might or might not happen, why not just ban drinking and put a stop to any threat of being killed or hurt in an automobile accident?

I could see how they could legally ban smoking in rental units, but how can they legally ban a person from smoking in a home that they own? How could they monitor it and enforce it? Are they gonna have cops raiding homes and rounding up cigarette smokers? What will they do with people who have prescriptions for medical marijuana, or will that be allowed?

I also wonder why they are doing this when California also has the worst air quality, which is not due to smokers but to their millions of automobiles. The number of non-smoking lung cancer cases are rising, most of these do not live with smokers or spend any significant time with smokers; but everyone spends a great deal of time in their car and/or surrounded by cars. They run or go for walks (surrounded by car exhaust), sit outside in cafes (surrounded by car exhaust) open their windows to "air out" their homes (and replace the "stale" air with car exhaust). Yet, they want to believe banning all the smokers, will put an end to all the lung problems of the world, instead of dealing with the largest culprit; because it is so much easier to make changes to someone elses life and not their own....

The majority of the scientific community will tell you their is no connection between car exhaust and lung cancer/disease (guess who funds this research)...when you have run all the smokers out of town and your lung cancer/disease count still rises, you might see the truth, but I doubt it.

I'm a liberal and a non-smoker who detests cigarettes. And I'm also troubled by this. As a liberal, I believe in personal freedoms and keeping the government out of our private lives, as long as our personal actions don't impact others. Now here's a law dictating what people can do in their homes. The flip side of this, though, is that I'm currently living in a high-rise building. My neighbor next door smokes, and the smoke does come through the ventilation. A friend of mine who was a non-smoker, but was exposed to second-hand smoke growing up died of lung cancer several years ago. So I think about that often: being exposed to possible health risks is a concern to me. Bottom line for me: I guess I'm just not sure yet where I stand on this.

If the landlords do not want people to smoke they should have told people before they moved in. They could easily eliminate smoking on their privately owned property/properties they own by telling people who move in from now on that they will not be allowed to smoke. Eventually as smokers move out, smokers will be less and less common on their property. They could have designated areas away from A/C and/or heating units for people to smoke outside. Smoking inside rather than outside, although far worse for the individual, does NOT effect people living on the other sides of those walls.

I just saw an advertisement for a house for SALE that said - "no pets - no smokers". Wish I could buy it an get a big dog, and take up smoking!!

Two things.

First, they just outlawed smoking for anyone who cannot afford their own home.

And secondly, how exactly are they going to enforce this. I assume, like drugs, they will have to actually witness someone smoking. The smell alone will not prove anything. And for a cop to make it anywhere in the 6 mins it takes to smoke a cig, well that is just absurd.

Jacka$$: "Yeah I am calling to report my neighbor is smoking a cigarette."

Cops: "Be right there." (rolling eyes and laughing hysterically while actually investigating crimes worthy of their time.

Writing an unenforceable law is dumb, expecting the police to carry out the ban is just plain pathetic.

In Houston, when they decided they would outlaw smoking in bars, the assigned one cop for a city of 7 million people who worked 9-5. Needless to say, some bars aren't smoke free.

This is what happens in a nanny state. This is what happens when liberals, with supposed good intentions, take charge. This is more government, more interference, less privacy, less personal responsibility.

There are many people who are now being diagnosed with cancer who have never smoked and never been around those that do. The Doctors are perplexed as is the rest of the scientific community. The are hush hush on it because they don't want to appear to be taking sides with tobacco.

If the people in California are allowed to get away with this you can start kissing goodbye to many of our personal freedoms as this will without doubt open the doors to them passing legislation's to interfere with all our freedoms.

Yeah, in Houston it's okay to wear your guns in public and shoot somebody, but don't light that cigarette!

Rick-in-SD...

As a liberal, I believe in personal freedoms and keeping the government out of our private lives...

Really? Maybe you should tell that to your fellow liberals. I've found that most liberals are very good at imposing their beliefs on others but have a very difficult time seeing things from the other side. If they don't get it their way (elections and propositions), they clog the courts and find some liberal judge to halt the action...

Liberals tend to want bigger government and greater government control. You may want to look towards the conservative side of the fence...you may just find us to your liking!

I wonder when the cameras are going to be installed in these people's homes so they can be monitored 24 hours a day to ensure they do not smoke in their homes. Rapists and murders will have to be released from jail to make room for these new smoking offenders.

Indeed it is a very slippery slope. Laws that criminalize non-violent behavior inside of ones own private residence can't possibly be constitutionally sound.

I can see it for health reasons if, for example, the units share a common hallway or are in some other way connected (ductwork, for example). However, in cases where all units open to the outside, then I can't see how you would justify this. Another possible reason could be for fire prevention (which does make some sense). However, if fire prevention is the prime driver, then one would think the law would also ban candles, incense, space heaters, and anything else that is a fire hazard. I don't see evidence of that.

This seems to me like one more case of liberal excess, telling us how EVERYONE should live based on what THEY believe to be best. Another loss of freedom.

They want to dictate to people what they can do in thier homes??? How do they possibly plan to enforce this??? Fill jails way beyond the breaking point??? Impose ridiculously high fines for smoking in the property that you pay for??? This is liberal legisaltion yet they talk about republicans trying to control everyones lives?????? First smoking, then what??? By the time these people are finished legislating our lives will we have any rights left????

KaliFarcia You Say????? This is the WOMB of the rebirth of Police State NeoNazi Politico-ism. Here in This Place, there are Sooooooooooooooooo Many Politico good ole' bois who dream up NAZI laws like this latest one which, of course, gives them power over the average citizen...sound Nazi-Like to anybody? I don't smoke and I can see no smoking in movies and close places But This Is EXTENDING THE POLITICO PARASITE FEEDING TROUGH. These are Little beams, jerry moonbean babies who can't do anything of worth and get a political appointment position@$200,000p/year to dream up ridiculous laws that, of course, lead to the BIG PICTURE with BIG IRON FISTED BROTHER.Time is running out.

It is hard for me to believe that just because you live in California, every decision that is made there is completely the right one. You wonder why California is going bankrupt, is because all of the state government and city councils that think they know what is best for all people. Totally wrong. It is not your right to tell me what to do. What needs to happen is for the citizens need to have a recall on the council members. Don't discriminate against smokers. Get rid of alcohol. More people die each year from accidents caused by alcohol. Please, lets hear from people about the drinking. I know a lot of you will slam me for my opinion, but I just wanted to throw it out there.

Guess what Cali? Can't smoke dope either! You'll have to go to WA or CO to enjoy a fattie. LMFAO

@cantakenomore "I've found that most liberals are very good at imposing their beliefs on others but have a very difficult time seeing things from the other side. If they don't get it their way (elections and propositions), they clog the courts and find some liberal judge to halt the action..."

Cantakenomore, I would replace the word "liberal" in those two sentences with "conservative" and it would seem more accurate to me. I see conservatives constantly trying to put their religion into our laws, trying to dictate to women what they can do with their bodies, telling people who they can marry. This is my whole point: government should in no way be involved in our private lives. Now back to the point of my post, that's my dilemma: how to reconcile my belief that the government should not dictate people's private lives with my own personal issue: my neighbor smokes in his apartment, but it comes through the vents into my apartment and I'm forced to breathe this crap. My non-smoker friend died of lung cancer caused by second-hand smoke. So this is a real issue to me.

I have a hard enough time trying to figure out how they can outlaw a legal activity inside a private business, much less a private residence. If the business itself (or resident) wants to ban it, fine, but otherwise, if you don't like it, don't go in.

This ought to be interesting....

If you live in a multi-unit housing deal, there are a lot of things you have to consider about your neighbors. Think about things like loud music, kids, anything that a person might consider encroaching on their personal rights. So, in that regard, you might consider smoking. But the common assessment for other things has been laws that are done on a case by case basis. For example, nobody is banning television and stereos from homes, because POSSIBLY, the noise could bother the neighbor. On the other hand, certain things do get banned, like dogs, or pets in general. You can't, for example, say 'We only allow pets that don't bark.'

Smoking laws aren't make by thinking people, however, like gun laws. They are made by total idiots. One wants to make cigarettes illegal while the other would prefer to stick them up the noses of babies. So nobody here is actually fighting for or against these laws here. Only some radical idiot who has decided smoking laws are the most important thing ever, including over things like a nuclear Iran.

That's the perspective here...total idiots arguing for and against common sense people's rights.

Well U know, if California had any real crimes happening, the law makers wouldn't have 2 make up stupid laws. (yes-sarcasm)

Really. The Big Cali has so much crime keeping the cops so thinly spreadout that they decriminalized pot!

I think California has bigger fish 2 fry than what U smoke in your home.

@rusthand: actually, textbook speaking, Liberals tend to value maximum freedom for individuals, while Conservatives tend to value maximum freedom for commerce. Totalitarians do not value freedom for either category. (Libertarians value freedom in both categories, but that's another can of worms) Centrists are somewhere in the middle.

The issue I have with this law, is it dips down into Totalitarianism territory.

There are lots of things you can't do "in the privacy of your own home" because they can harm others. In every apartment I ever lived in, there were stipulations about using bug foggers and certain kids of craft materials like certain glues, paints and varnishes because the fumes can penetrate walls. Why is cigarette smoke any different? And please, the argument about car exhaust - yes, that's bad too. And when people start leaving their cars running in the living room, that, too, will be an issue.

Rick-in-SD...

This is my whole point: government should in no way be involved in our private lives.

You really sound like a Libertarian...I voted for Barr last time but can't bring myself to go with Johnson.

Now back to your issue with neighbors...I'd normally say "ask your neighbors to smoke outside when possible", however, isn't it illegal to smoke outside in CA? I thought they passed some other goofy law like that...maybe it was just San Fran...regardless, try that approach. You may find they will cooperate.

I'd also incorporate some filtering...there are in-line filters that remove to ppm, dust/smoke, etc.

Sorry to hear about your friend w/ lung cancer (my wife is fighting her 3rd battle w/ the disease) but it's not certain it was caused by second hand smoke...could have been pollution or some other agent they were exposed to. I believe we've all been exposed to "bad" stuff...can't just blame smokers, though.

@Panic Moon,

My best advice 4 U would B: move about 50 miles away from everybody. U & them will B happier. :-)

@Derek,

"Think about things like loud music, kids, anything that a person might consider encroaching on their personal rights."

Excellent point, dawg! While I don't have a problem with loud music ('cuz my 30-year-old 501 cabinet Bose STILL shut down everything else; I guess that's Y I still have them.), I do have a problem listening 2 someones screamin' meme & someones POS back firing truck. R we gonna ban these next?

@PanicMoon: the major differentiating factor is that those restrictions are in a lease, not a law. In other words, if you set a bug bomb off and the lease forbids it, you are in breach of contract. The apartment complex could deem you in breach of contract and start the eviction process.

It isn't "against the law" to set a bug bomb off. The police could not come and arrest you for it.

And by the way, apartment complexes don't like bug bombs because they usually do not kill the bugs, they just scare them into somebody else's apartment. At least in all the apartments I lived in, each unit had it's own ventilation system with thermostat. I couldn't smell my neighbor cooking, smoking, etc.

"it dips down into Totalitarianism territory."

YEA!!! I nominate Chris-Austin 4 Poster of the Day!

♪♫Can I get a witness?♪♫

Posted by: worn out-4024611 (#1.18)

"Aids is detrimental to health, maybe we should ban gays also. It's a public safety issue too".

Your comment is in extremely bad taste and is well outside the published standards that Newsvine writers agree to abide by.

(Just so that you know, I am straight too).

More than eighty percent of all of the people that are HIV-positive today worldwide are heterosexual.

By far the community most-heavily afflicted are people from Africa. Some nations in Africa, such as Botswana, have rates of infection as high as 1/3rd of the adult population.

Are you going to want to blanket ban people from Africa from coming here too on the grounds that some of them might be HIV-positive, without regard to their sexual orientation or without any other attempt made to determine their health status?

I also strongly feel that whatever lawful activity that a person chooses to engage in within their own house is protected by the US Constitution too, and that this alleged "law" will not survive a Federal court challenge either. As others have said, should any person be given the right to be free from auto exhaust present outside their home either, a pollutant far-more dangerous in second-hand form than cigarette smoke is?

This law attempts to usurp the otherwise lawful rights of some homeowners in favor of other homeowners, and I seriously doubt that it will stand as it is written. Moreover, any current homeowner should have grandfather rights under State and Federal law too.

This subject has me torn. We rent a condo, and the walls are so thin we hear the old gent next door hacking his smokers cough and we can smell it quite strongly when he smokes. With that in mind, I'm all for such a ban. But I'm aware how slippery a slope this is, especially if you own that home. The other concern I have is the fire hazards of smoking. When you rent in a multi-housing unit, you can suffer for someone else's mistake.

While the smell cigarette smoke really is a problem for my allergies, we want to move into a house because of the fear of a fire (and yes, I know there isn't a guarantee of no fire in a single-family house).

Decriminalized pot; Banned tobacco in your home.

Picture it, kids:

smoke a cigarette in your home, the SWAT team kicks in your door, throws U on the floor & hauls U off 2 jail.

smoke a J in your home, U won't even get a ticket unless the cops R looking in your window.

Nice, right?

Old Timer...

good post! I don't usually agree with you politically but I have to give you a check for this one...good post (1.58)

It's just the latest push by the anti-tobacco evangelists. There's no point in trying to analyze it rationally, because it isn't based on rational evidence in the first place.

The goal is not to protect the health of neighbors, it is to eliminate tobacco from the society altogether. They, liberals and conservatives alike, are on a 'mission from god' and like all true believers they could care less about who they might harm or what civil rights might be stripped away in the process of attaining their goal.

A about a decade ago a bar put in air conditioning that served to make the air in the bar cleaner than the street out side the bar, but the evangelists would have none of it, saying they would still maintain the ban "on principle".

Aids is detrimental to health, maybe we should ban gays also. It's a public safety issue too.

What an ignorant comment. Do you really think that only gays have aids?

They are already telling you what you can and can't do in your homes. Go see if you can buy a shower head that uses 10 Gal. / Minute. Find a toilet you can buy that flushes as well as the older ones. Perhaps you like 100 Watt incandescent light bulbs, good luck. That goes for furnaces, hot water heaters, refrigerators, freezers, microwaves, toasters and a whole bunch of other things.

Pretty soon with these new thermostats you will be getting your government alloted amout of heat and air conditioning. And when some buerocrat decides your are using too much get ready to pay for your overindulgence.

Slippery slope....we are almost at the bottom of the slope. There's not too much more left for them to screw with. But I am sure they will think of something.

bookem, you can infer whatever you like but that's not how i feel.

Everyone stops smoking

1. How much in taxes will be lost?

2. Next will be food and your weight.

3. How many jobs in the stop smoking and tobacco industry are lost?

4. Chew will be next **looks at the cowboys**

Same people who endorse Obama and O = Epic Fail

@ Rick-in_SD and

cantakenomore:

Your exchange about parties imposing beliefs reminds me of a third party candidate who pointed out as I'll paraphrase that one party wants to be you mommy, the other wants to be your daddy: We want to treat you like adults.

The biggest problem we are facing as a nation is that we tend to see most of the faults of the opposition with few of the faults of those we identify with. That is the first gap that needs bridging before we can move together through common ground, not battling differences.

I geninuely thank both of you for creating the example for my thoughts. Health and success to both of you!

I am fed up with California's need to regulate, regulate, regulate! We are one of the most heavily regulated states in the country. Where does it end?

U don't say,

How do you insert musical symbols etc...? I can't do anything that's not available within the bar above outside of copy and paste words.

Let me know.

Thanks, CD

I live in a government run apartment complex and was told in September that they too are going non-smoking and that we can't smoke in our apartment. Many of us (hundreds of people) protested at a meeting and we were told that smokers have no Constitutional rights and have no Rights to Privacy. We must be 25ft. away from the building and if you do smoke in your apartment and get caught that there will be a $300.00 fine and you could be evicted. There is nothing that we can do but move but it is hard to find affordable apartments for those on Social Security around here so we have no choice.

People have the right to not smoke, but others have the right to if that is what they want to do, I understand not smoking in a restaurant, and public building, but not the right to say you cannot smoke in your own home.

Here in Nebraska, it is illegal to smoke in bars, they are working on a law that says if there are children in the car, you cannot smoke in it, I wonder why it is legal to drink in your own home, or around kids.

The only rights we have are those allowed to us by the government, interestingly enough, most of the politicians don’t smoke, but they are all a bunch of drunks, that’s why there are not more laws on alcohol.

KyEngineer- I've lived in my apartment complex for about 3 years now, and have seen the fire trucks pull up several times. Usually, the cause is reported to be a stove fire. If there has been a fire caused by smoking, I've yet to hear about it.

Wait a minute! I have the right to smell clean air. I have lived in apartments where my neighbor smoked on the balcony and the cig smoke would waft into my apartment and I had to close the windows on a nice beautiful summer day. Just because you want to consume 1 cup of tar in your lungs per year doesn't mean that I want to.

And, yes, I am knowledgeable on the topic because my grandmother worked with smokers for many years in a closed room and ended up getting skin cancer, thryoid cancer and had her voicebox removed because of these selfish human beings who wanted to put their selfish and disgusting habits on everyone else.

ONE CUP OF TAR IN YOUR LUNGS PER YEAR. GO FOR IT YOU HAVE MY BLESSINGS! Not to mention wrinkled skin, hoarse voice and stinky, stinky, stinky everything.

i dont smoke i quit awhile back. i dont agree with this law, just another sign of how our govt. is getting less free every day. what you do in your home that you bought and payed for, is no ones business but your own.

When person does something that is literally poisoning the people around him/her actions need to be taken. Sorry smokers it is not your right to smoke it's your choice. The fact that a smokers addiction supersedes the well being of others who choose not to smoke (the majority of people in the US) shows that smoking bans are required to combat the irrational logic of the addict.

To those acting as if this is some sort encroachment on your freedoms (I'm going to assume your all smokers), why don't you go ahead an tell that to the people whose babies have died (because you know your addiction is more important than the life of an innocent infant), tell that to those that have never smoked in there lives but none the less die from lung cancer do to neighbors that smoke in their apartment building, tell that too....well the list goes on.

So tell me, is the addiction that is killing you and everyone around you worth it?

Positive me,

You were renting at the time. "BUY" a house and problem solved.

jpeyton76,

It's also "your" choice to walk to fresh air.

Also, there are thousands of reasons people contract lung cancer "other" than cigarette smoke. I also have a bubble apartment for rent. It's only 125psi if you're interested.

Have a nice day...

CD

@creek dog

Wow you really live in your own world don't you. Just go buy a house, lol.

I don't smoke, and if I did smoke, I wouldn't smoke in my house. MY HOUSE. But if I did, it would be none of the governments business.

You California liberals are absolutely retarded. Every one of you.

"Wait a minute! I have the right to smell clean air. I have lived in apartments where my neighbor smoked on the balcony and the cig smoke would waft into my apartment and I had to close the windows on a nice beautiful summer day. Just because you want....."

I'll bet that U R fun at parties.

;-)

jpeyton76,

We live in our world and I did buy a house. I do have respect for non-smokers.

Even when it was legal to smoke in public places like restaurants, I still did not smoke.

Interested in the bubble? I have to dump it soon. LOL

Have a good day man.

WOULD you all PLEASE read the article ?

It does NOT ban smoking in single family homes.

"have outlawed smoking in buildings with as few as two units."

AND:

"San Rafael's ordinance applies to all homes, new or existing and rented or owned, with shared walls."

This has nothing to do with single family homes. It has to do with units who "share walls" and as few as 'TWO" units.

I am a smoker and I do not like this law - but, c'mon guys, there's more than enough about this law to dislike without inventing new reasons.

WILL some idiot power hungry city council member try extend it to SFR's ? sure...but that's not this law.

You can only smoke pot not tobacco.

someone commentated that this is tyranny, its not tyranny if its forced on you by a liberal because they are always right in what they think, what they propose, and what they do, its liberals that will ultimately save the world and mankind from its own destruction! didn't you see the memo? next they will make a new effort to outlaw fast food again, and that thing you call the constitution well that does not apply to liberals that are on a mission, and you will not be allowed to hide behind that, liberals will find a way to wright their way around that. now vote for Obama its the right thing to do. then Michelle can outlaw all the fast food places and kids will not be forced to do PE in school if they don't want to. and all those nasty smokers that pay all our taxes can all be locked up and we will make money from there making license plates. just think of the potential profits from all the prison run facilities and corporate structures in our new prison system that is privately run for profit, prison farms, prison factories, prison road maintenance, Hay we can be just like China. Obamas slogan Yes WE Can. we can enslave everyone that does not comply with the liberals way of thinking and divide there money up amongst the collective. there will be three classes the wealthy socialist, the middle class socialist and the slave prisoner or drone class the ones thatwill have the honor of supporting the liberal socialist classes. what I really like about the article is the way they state that they intend for this to spread across the entire country and beyond, what business is it of theirs what people in other regions do these people need to be stopped. liberals live in a fantasy land and they want to force their dreams on everyone else, piss on their dreams.

@touchdownplay- you forgot washers with choice for rinse temp other than COLD!

How many people have been displaced from their apartments due to smokers who fell asleep or a lit cigarette igniting fires? There have been three in the last 5 years in my neighborhood. As for the smoke residue that seeps through the walls and shared vents...people have a right to keep healthy. Living in a multi-family dwelling means respecting your neighbors whether it be noise levels, smoke (cigarettes or pot), or animals. Not all of these should be banned but ones that cannot be controlled such as smoking.

I have Cystic Fiborsis and there is a law that those who are smoking outside of the apartment building need to be 25 feet away from the building or inside their own apartment with the doors closed. The landlord does not enforce it and it makes me sick. Every year I call the town health department and he puts a sign up, but it is only temporary. He does not care. I cannot wait for the economy to pick up so I can move somewhere decent even if it means paying more money.

@teresa,

LOL I missed it 2. Darn the luck. (good eye, girl)

I suppose this is just tobacco products, not weed?

Soon you won't be able to do anything in your own home what's next, no smoking, no drinking, no wanking?

What happens when you're neighbor is offended by you cooking onions or fish? Are they going to ban those as well.

@Teresa,

Ah, you caught me. Well I never did say I was perfect. But thanks for the looking out. If anyone wants to add to the list you are more than welcome. But I fear if everyone did add to the list, post #1 will have thousands of replies.

Oh and good eye.

Buss emissions cause cancer, I don't want to see any more busses.

Jets exhaust causes cancer, I don't want to see any more jets.

Factories emissions cause cancer, I don't want to see any more factories.

Cell phones send out radio active microwave beams in all directions effecting everything and also cause cancer, I don't want to see cell phones any more.

Liberals cause a wide variety of fatal conditions such as brain aneurysms, strokes, heart attacks, death by frustration, or in many cases people just fall over dead from exposure to liberals, I don't want to see any more Liberals. pass those laws when you pass the laws to control what a person can do in their home. sex causes cancer outlaw that, second hand sex is worse then first hand sex. go liberals go YFI.

California's still on the map? Bummer, I was hoping the next time I heard anything about Cali was during (or after) its descent into the Pacific. Maybe next time...

Luckily it's only one city. Can you imagine the violence in LA if it were the city that did this?

Positive me, I have to go with Creek Dog on this one, I bet you are just so much fun at a party!!

You are like the neighbor that turned me in to the police for smoking a brisket (on the smoker). She claimed to be a vegetarian and be disgusted by my display of murderous cannibalism. Of course two months ago before she suddenly became a vegetarian she would cram as much steak as she could during neighborhood parties and her family raised cattle on the very property she lived on. Thank god that idiot moved, she didn't even understand cannibalism correctly. I am an omnivore, not cannibal.

The ordinance also would prohibit smoking on San Rafael's downtown streets

.

This is the most offensive part of the law, telling you that you can't smoke outdoors.

"I have to go with Creek Dog on this one, I bet you are just so much fun at a party!!"

Dawg didn't say it.

And thank U!

@Creek Dog Look up special alt characters. Hold "Alt", hit "1", then "3" and it will do/make "♪". Alt, 1, then 4 will do/make "♫". People use them in video games all the time for names, and they can be annoying unless you know the codes.

As an ex-smoker I can tell you the smell is what most people hate. Does not bother me as much as seems to bother others. Women with their sensitive noses can smell better then men in my opinion and make more of a deal about. The whole second hand smoke argument is just to push the agenda since there are many toxic things in the air, not just second hand smoke.

What I see happening is that people will just buy a vaporizer that does not burn the tobacco, but boils it out, and hides the smell better. Of course then the secondhand smoke would not be as bad/toxic either so it would not be as "bad", but people will still complain if there is a smell. Where there is a will there is a way.

@Tired,

U had 2 tell him, didn't ya? lol ;-)

Somebody's always after me lucky charms!

I think the people who claim they can smell smoke through a wall, even if it is thin, are 'short of a six pack'. And it is interesting to reflect that these laws banning smoking in apartment units only became popular about the time that medical marijuana was legalized.

No, it is not alright to do this to residents of multi-occupancy units unless the air duct system is connected. Renters have the same rights as homeowners; the only real difference is that renter's rights are renewed upon each payment of rent. Watch out home owner's. Nosy neighbors consider themselves owners of your yards.

If you live in a multi-unit housing deal, there are a lot of things you have to consider about your neighbors. Think about things like loud music, kids, anything that a person might consider encroaching on their personal rights. So, in that regard, you might consider smoking. But the common assessment for other things has been laws that are done on a case by case basis. For example, nobody is banning television and stereos from homes, because POSSIBLY, the noise could bother the neighbor.

Actually, there are normally noise ordinances so you can't make a noise that is over a certain decibel range, outside of a certain time frame. At least where I am you can't. That would mean no loud music, using loud reno tools, etc, between 10 (or 11, I forget) pm and 6 (or 7, again I forget) am.

I wish I lived 200 years earlier, where I could shoot these A$$holes. All civilized and legal in the name of honor. So if Democrats are killing coal and Republicans are killing all forms of healthcare, then who is to blame for my cig taxes? (I don't pay anymore, started growing my own tobacco, lot less chemical additives.)

@zorloc, thanks for your perspective. That helps clarify where I stand.

@StP13: "Your exchange about parties imposing beliefs reminds me of a third party candidate who pointed out as I'll paraphrase that one party wants to be you mommy, the other wants to be your daddy: We want to treat you like adults."

Love that! And thanks for your remarks.

@cantakenomore: "Now back to your issue with neighbors...I'd normally say "ask your neighbors to smoke outside when possible", however, isn't it illegal to smoke outside in CA? I thought they passed some other goofy law like that...maybe it was just San Fran...regardless, try that approach. You may find they will cooperate."

I doubt they would want to cooperate. I'm on the 11th floor of a 17-story building. We don't have balconies, so there is no "outside" unless you take the elevator up six floors to the roof or down eleven to the ground level.

I'd also incorporate some filtering...there are in-line filters that remove to ppm, dust/smoke, etc.

That's good advice. But fortunately, I'm moving out of the building and out of town in a month.

Sorry to hear about your friend w/ lung cancer (my wife is fighting her 3rd battle w/ the disease) but it's not certain it was caused by second hand smoke...could have been pollution or some other agent they were exposed to. I believe we've all been exposed to "bad" stuff...can't just blame smokers, though.

Best wishes to you and your wife. I'm very sorry to hear she's dealing with this. And yes, it's not necessarily the smokers that are the problem. Our air in general is filled with all kinds of garbage now.

As to your comment that maybe I'm a liberatarian, that reminds me of a few months ago when I was listening to Ron Paul speak (and more recently, Jesse Ventura) and I thought, "Hey, I totally agree. I must be a libertarian!" Then the next thing out of his mouth made me go, "Hell no, there's no way I could be a libertarian!" :)

creek dog is smokin' some bad sh$*

U don't say...

Funny...funny!!! I'm still laughing...

"Someone's always after me lucky charms"! Bwahahaha haven't heard that in years!

Rick...

Thanks for the kind words...all the best to you as well!

I think that if you live in multi-unit housing where you own the unit, if you want to smoke (or not) inside, that is your business and your right. If you live in multi-unit housing where you are renting, your landlord has the right to set rules about whether smoking is allowed inside or not. (Same goes for single-unit housing-if you own the house, go for it, if not, better check with your landlord first).

Personally, I kind of miss the smoking or non days. There was usually nobody smoking anyway, and if you said "either is fine by me", you could sit down immediately, rather than waiting 10-15 minutes for a table. At any rate, even if I were a smoker, I would never smoke indoors-that smell just lingers. So much nicer to just step outside and keep the smoke from settling onto all your belongings.

Many, not all pro-choice people who believe that you should have the decision of what to do with your own body, seem to be on the side of anti-amoking legislation. You can't have it both ways. Choice is choice. Hypocrites!

Californicators of the nation UNITE!! Prove to the rest of us how wonderful and intelligent you are! Move to another country, and make THEM into California. I CANNOT WAIT for the big one to hit San Andreas. Ahhhh, Heaven!!

@cantakenomore,

Elvis voice: "Thank you. Thank you very much."

;-)

I don't have a problem at all with tobacco smoke when it is in someone's own home. What I have a major problem with is the horrid stench of marijuana from selfish jerks who think that because it is legal and they have a prescription that I have to accept their nasty smell.

That stuff smells so bad it travels right up the vents and smells up an entire duplex, room, or apartment right next to yours. One time, they stank up an entire wing of a motel. If laws like this are all I have to combat it, then I'll accept it graciously. Until we have specific no-smoking marijuana laws though, I support this particular law beside it.

Honestly though, I am sorry for tobacco smokers that have to be drawn into it too.

F'ing Pathetic

I do not smoke but this is just another reason my State is so @!$%#ed up.

Pure @!$%# for brains up North.

thisbusymonster,

Let us pass a law that forbides you bathe between the hours of 7 AM to 9 AM and 9 PM to 12 AM so YOU can be considerate of others in your complex who might want to bathe at those hours.

And you're going to say what? Oh ok, I will go along with that! Like hell you will - you're going to tell whomever made that law to stuff iot up theirm collective a$$e$!

Butt I forgot - ithe issue is about smoking and we all know that smokers are less then secondhand citizens whose ONLY function is to be bled white by the g. d. politicians who can only see $$$$$ and not the bullsh_t of caring for peoples' health like they lead people to believe.

OUTRAGEOUS!!! Where's the ACLU? (Under a haystack, fast asleep?)

blondeness032, #1.30- A "rental unit" is still a Person's "PRIVATE HOME", for their use, just as much as their "Leased" car is still their "Private Car", for their use.

WOW! What A LOT of really-really GREAT posts on this thread!!!

So if I own an apartment complex and I want to make a cluster of units that are not connected to other units a smoke friendly cluster - I can't?

This one dimensional, all or nothing bubble is dumbing us down....we elect stupid, that makes us stupid.

Next they will ban renters/owner who take smelly dumps...I worked with a guy that cleared out the locker room every day at quiting time...I'm talking about you Lenny...lol.

Smokers - the easy target - look at who city and State governments always want to raise taxes on first.

People, calm down! It's one town, not the whole state or even the whole county. It affects renters, not owners, for crissakes! If your freedom is so impinged upon, go get yourself a gun and a bible and call Sarah Palin. Jeezus H.!!

I'll probably get collapsed for this one but (I really don't care).

I've not seen the details of the law, but this is how I feel about it.

If the multi-family dwellings have firewalls and separate ventilation systems, then the governent has no business making an issue of it. It doesn't affect anyone but the smoker (and his/her immed8iate family).BUT if they are older buildings where the smokers put others at risk, then perhaps it can be justified. It might be a blanket law beause it is impossible to distinguish from the two. Maybe by providing proof of the firewalls/ventilation systems, a building can be ruled exempt.

@Beth-440386, why would you expect your comment to be collapsed? That sounds like a pretty common-sense approach to me.

The Gestapo is now in our home.I think that unless the units share the same ventilation systems then it should be up to the property owner to decide if they will or won't allow smoking in one of their units.When the anti smoking laws started out it was for the workplace.I'm a smoker and thought it was ok to ban smoking in the office.Next,it was banned so many feet from the front door,next it was hospitals,restaurants,bars,the beaches in some So Cal. locations and now this.I'm waiting for this to hit the higher courts and see how it plays out.

We are already living this where I live in CA. Maybe it's because we live in Military housing, but there is no smoking allowed inside the houses where we live. It's possible that because they have such a high turnover rate, the complex's don't want to have to pay to get new carpet and paint the walls every time they have new people move in. I'm grateful for it because I have very bad allergies and cigarette smoke aggravates them. And for people who say it doesn't seep through the wall, you apparently haven't lived next to a smoker in a building with thin walls, because it does. I had to wash my clothes repeatedly after living in an apartment next to a smoker just to get the smell out, because it lingers and then gets a really foul stale smell. Ventilation systems are not the only way for the smoke to get into your apartment.

POSITIVE ME,

Can you produce documents that clearly state from whom an illness was transmitted or that a certain persons habits caused someone else's illness. Can't be done!! I suffer from an illness that was transmitted to me from somewhere, but I cannot conclude it came from a specific person or situation. Not everyone is of optimum health from the day they were born. People get ill from many different sources and situations , or from having a weak immune system which lessens their survival rate. Granted smoking is not healthy, but you have to be very closed minded to think the way that you do.

D Buck-2239568,

I actually enjoyed the point that you made about it not being tyranny if it is forced by liberals. Truer words have never been spoken. The point about pot not being covered by this new regulation is the first thing that came to my mind. Just be careful, because anything that you say which is not in lock step with the social marxist agenda can be construed as "hate" and you will be labeled as a "hater" and sent to mandatory "diversity training." About 35 years ago the Dead Kennedys had a song called "California Uber Alles" which made fun of just this kind of garbage and it referred to then Gov. Jerry Brown. It appears that history repeats itself.

All you people who are wringing your hands and moaning about cops "kicking in doors" are completely wrong. They wont kick in doors! That is bad press! California has found a way to fix some of the economic problems it has created for itself. Find a scapegoat (smokers) and fine them into oblivion. Cops wont kick in doors. They'll write a ticket. Then come back and write another. Then another. And another. It's free money. And that's what the State of California wants. Your money.

I see the Californaliens are at it again..

If we cut them away from the rest of the landmass we just might avoid the plague of 2019 and the War of 2112..

Honestly though, is their marijuana laced with lead of something?

First Government to ban smoking in government buildings - Nazi Germany 1935, "for the good of the German people" they began to give up their individual rights for the "common good". California, the land of Hollywood Governors and fiscally irresponsible legislatures somehow belive that politicians have the peoples best interest at heart. California, the air that you can cut with a knife but thinks the air will somehow magically become fresh and clean by telling people they cannot smoke even in a home they purchased. Even if free standing homes are not part of this law, there will be an amendment to this one or another law that will eventually ban smoking period. They are just laying the groundwork for it now, so the "It's just one town" argument does not fly as it will become the legal precedent for further discriminitory laws. Yes this is pure descimination over a lifestyle choice, because this has become the "whipping boy" for people who cannot live peacefully without denegrating someone else. In this day of political correctness, you cannot denegrate people because of race, or gender, or ethnic background, but lifestyle choices are completely fair game. Smokers, obesity, politics are all fair game for vehement hate speach, just look at the hate posts that don't get pulled from websites. They are full of people who if your changed a few words, you could belive it came from the Grand Wizard of the KKK. Keep it up Cali. Your ever growing Pinnochio's nose sticking into people individual liberties is about to get slammed in the door of the US supreme court for being completely against the Constitution. And you and Mayor Bloomberg of NYC can begin to plot your next group to be discriminated against.

Holy Crap, people are all up in arms about government telling them they need to get heathy (smoking bans "fat" bans etc. and I think airlines should charge by the pound for tickets)

but they don't have a problem with government forcing women to get unwanted tests, or what to do with their bodies................WTF

yes also alot of idiots fall asleep with lit cigs and many people have burnt up

because of it !!!

Liberals tend to value maximum freedom for individuals,

Liberals USED to value maximum freedom for individuals, but not anymore. They have defined a rigid set of beliefs that everyone must have (pro gay, anti gun, pro choice, etc) and if you don't share those beliefs, YOU are labeled as intolerant and a bigot. They seem totally oblivious to the fact that they themselves have become the most bigoted and intolerant among us by insisting that everyone adopt their beliefs.

Chick-fil-a is a great example. Since the founder doesn't adopt their beliefs, they seek to eliminate his freedom to open public restaurants. The diversity officer of Guaullidet is another. She signed a petition that she is against gay marriage ( a position which our president pretended to share until just this May) and was fired for not having the standard liberal beliefs. It really is becoming appalling how much power liberals have gotten to take away peoples' freedom!

Next the IDIOTS will ban all pork products from a complex if just one muslim lived there!!

And to think it all started with fluoridation of the water. All in the name of public safety Ha Ha Ha

Cars, semis and factory's put more @!$%# in the air then smokers do. That black @!$%# (exhaust) that comes out of a truck and blown in your face is a million times worse then a little bit of cigarette smoke.

AL-1735815

You know what I like about you Al, that you view this as frivolous and then turn around and demand I pay for contraceptives, heath insurance I do not want, wearing seat belts in a car, a helmet on a bike, that I need to give more money to the government so they can help me. Maybe some good ideas but why do I have to do these things if they are not for me. You see I do not want the government making any personal choices for anyone capable of making their own. You want the government to make the choices for you so you can be safe while you tell everyone it is for their own good. You see I am not telling women what to do with their own bodies, I just do not like it and in as much as you do what you want to your body maybe that right should extend to others as well. Your type called for the government to rule on your rights and now they think they have the right to decide everything else.

@Beth-440386, why would you expect your comment to be collapsed? That sounds like a pretty common-sense approach to me.

Have you READ most of these comments? Commonsense responses are usually the first one to e collapsed! LOL (But I was being a wee bit sarcastic!) LOL

Liberals USED to value maximum freedom for individuals, but not anymore. They have defined a rigid set of beliefs that everyone must have (pro gay, anti gun, pro choice, etc) and if you don't share those beliefs, YOU are labeled as intolerant and a bigot.''

I guess you miss the irony here, right? The conservatives insist on a rigid set of beliefs that everyone must have (anti gay, pro gun, anti choice, etc.) and if you don't share those beliefs YOU are labeled as anti-American, non-Christian and probably atheist as well.

Now, how does that sound switched around just a wee little bit?

In case you haven't figured out my point, somewhat sarcastically made, it's that extremists that go around insisting everyone think like them are, to use an old phrase, the pot calling the kettle black!

I guess you miss the irony here, right? The conservatives insist on a rigid set of beliefs that everyone must have (anti gay, pro gun, anti choice, etc.) and if you don't share those beliefs YOU are labeled as anti-American, non-Christian and probably atheist as well.

When was the last time you read about a liberal speaker being shouted down on a college campus, or being forced to to cancel their appearance altogether because the conservatives complained. I sat in group of VERY conservative people a few months ago and the speaker for the evening was very liberal. Virtually everyone there disagreed with about everything the speaker said, but they all sat quietly and politely, and even gave the speaker a round of applause at the end for being there and sharing his views. No, conservatives and liberals are NOT the same. They tend to behave VERY differently when they are challenged.

Yep, agree! Ca just join Mexico as a country and take your radical practices and concepts and non American ways with you! This is not just a slippery slope it is communism when persons do not have the rights to make their own choices or are imposed upon by state regulations IN THEIR OWN HOMES!

Until you pay the mortgage, oh that is funny , you are in a shambles economically, button your non American beliefs and save the rest of the nation from battling shifts you sit around and create in good ole sunny CA!

KeninT@3.2 they will ban you going to the bathroom next.

gangus whatever, why do we tolerate people like you-oh it's still a free country.

This is completely absurd. The government has no right to tell you what you can and can not do in the privacy of your own home. This is a completely unconstitutional invasion on our personal freedoms. If you own an apartment complex or a home and you want to tell your tenants that they can not smoke that is your right. However, if you own your own home, be it a single family home, condo, duplex, townhouse, etc. then you should be allowed to do what you want inside that home. Homes like this do not share ventilation systems and smoke is not going to penetrate through the walls between homes. Each unit in a multifamily housing building has it's own separate ventilation system with no cross-connecting of duct work. If they did, then people would be sharing the costs with their neighbors for heating and air conditioning and be unable to maintain their own home at the temperature they desire. Smoking is not illegal and the government has no right to stop you from doing it in your own home. And just for the record, I am not a smoker.

Does this ban on smoking extend to "medical" marijuana, also? Don't bogart that joint!

As many have said, the slope is steepening, and it doesn't matter if Reps., or Dems. do the legislating. I would hope that these kind of laws will be struck down, but believe that our Supreme Court are just as guilty in allowing these things to happen. I can only hope that someone is intelligent enough to know, that we are capable in making our own decisions.These are buildings that can be privately owned. People do not have to buy a house if people smoked in it, it is up to the individuals to make these decisions, not be legislated into it. We need to stop government from these out of hand agendas. This is from a non-smoker. I hope people that go to this town will pass it by and go to the next one down the road. Maybe this town has plans for banning autos too.

CelticWizard, yes, there is. Most of the people with 'medical' marijuana prescriptions are simply recreational users. I can tell you that anyone posting on this board could get a prescription if they gave the rigth story to their doctor.

Anyone could get any prescription from any Dr. if they say the right words. Your point is moot!

"How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time." How do you ban tobacco? You start with banning it in Government buildings and then go with banning it in public areas. You then follow it up with banning it in vehicles that can have children in them reguardless of who owns the vehicle, oh and throw in any home business that has any interaction with the public. Next is the ban in multi-unit apartments and condos, then you can't be allowed to smoke in free standing houses because that is unfair to all those who can't smoke anywhere else. Then, with a wimper, a complete ban of tobacco would be such a small step after everything else that was passed. After that? Maybe Bloomberg's soda ban will take hold in California. Then mandatory health checks to see if you A1C is low enough, then city wide work-outs and weigh in's. I know it seems far fetched with my last couple of sentences, but with what has happened already, is it THAT far-fetched????

Good idea. I like to look at the stars at night, but all the lights that are lit up in my neighborhood are spoiling my enjoyment of the night sky... I say everyone has to turn off their lights exactly at 8pm so I may enjoy my nighttime skywatching.

It's amazing how much freedom people are willing to sacrifice for the illusion of safety or security. Mindless, brain-dead lemmings.

The only problem is the light from those stars are not going to kill you. Got brains?

You miss the point PM

C'mon PM... Haven't you ever seen that great 80's SciFi film, "Night of the Comet"? There's no telling what sort of zombiefying rays that starlight is carrying.

Exactly! Government overreaching. Especially if you're smoking inside your residence.

And in duplexes and triplexes, I'd hate to be in the shoes of the one who turned them in... Easy enough to figure out who turned them in. Think of all the little unpleasant things they'd probably do afterwards. "Oh! There's dog feces smeared all over your door? Must've been some neighborhood delinquents!" :)

Good question indeed!

The WHY I am still baffled...but it is the HOW that will be intersting.......mabye we get random police inspections to do a sniff test- and if they think you are smoking- you get a fine.

People should vote these clowns out of office quickly starting with botox pelosi.....

DaveM, Obama has nothing to do with this. That's why this isn't an issue nationwide, yet, and if it does become so, it will happen state by state... not federally. You do know the difference between state and federal laws right?

DaveM- thats a good idea except california is broke and can't pay the hired help to do the sniff tests, besides they are most likely smokin' something anyhow.

"besides they are most likely smokin' something anyhow."

And yet, they are still more capable than alcoholics.

A man was strangled to death last night by his neighbor after the neighbor discovered that the man had turned him into the police for smoking in his adjoining home.

"Just more evidence that second hand smoke can be lethal", said a representative of the Non-Smokers Association of the condo complex. "It's a shame this man had to die for his anti-tobacco beliefs", he added, "but we're all going to have to sacrifice for the greater good."

I can assure you all arrest on this will be made by rookie cops who are cops because they got beat up in school too many times.

Before people jump my arse about that statement, I am a former officer. We had people on our own department that were that way. They are the few, but they are the ones the public unfortunately get to see too much of.

Ryan-

Now why did you have to bring Obama into it???????

That ruined my day.........

If you read my post- never mentioned Obama- only Pelosi........

Obama smokes in the White House, if this idea goes nation wide, will he obey this law? A Marxist makes rules for everyone but themselves.

I have asthma which was well-controlled until a smoking family bought the condo next door a year ago. I am now on three medications to help with my breathing. I live in SoCal and it was hot this last summer. Most days and nights I had to keep doors and windows closed because the constant smoke triggered asthma attacks. I don't know what kinda cigarettes they smoke but they are foul. We don't have air conditioning and can't install a window unit because of HOA noise violations. These people are up at 3am sitting in the backyard calling relatives in the middle east and that's when they haul out the hookah. We politely asked them to confine their smoking to the indoors. We were physically threatened. I would sell and move but can't because we are so underwater.

As for smoking marijuana, patients can use vaporizers which eliminate the smoke and smell in the air, or you can cook with it.

Slippery slope? Ya I'd say so. This is just awful to hear. I can't believe we are actually going down this path. Before you know it there will be a ban on bad breath because it may offend someone.

Check again at the state level. This is the People's Republic of California. They want to be tolerated but they dont want to tolerate others.

I think it's good that a tenant can't just rent out a room in a place that doesn't otherwise have smokers and smoke the place up -

But what about the landlords? If they own the place, and want to designate it as smoking-friendly, why the hell not?

Gotnorice,

Any landlord can put "no smoking" into the lease. Mine has.

It's when the government climbs through my window and tells me what I can do in my own home. What next, no cooking pork?

I cannot wait until they go after obesity, that is next you know. Watch out.

Carol

Operative word..... YET!

Very well said Hambone

Thank you, Tracy.

KAY-T

Instead of complaining about the neighbors at the condo where you live, why didn't YOU take in to consideration that you were purchasing in a multi-unit dwelling and the air quality might not be to your advantage. The term multi-unit wasn't a big enough clue that other people would be sharing the same area with you, along with their guilty pleasures. How ignorant can you be? WHY IS THIS SOMEONE ELSE'S FAULT? YOU SHOULD HAVE BOUGHT A SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING! Bottom line, YOU didn't do YOUR DUE DILIGENCE and now you want someone else to pay for YOUR MISTAKES.

Another self-entitled person, NO SYMPATHY FROM ME! I would never consider living in a multi-unit housing, but if I did , I would understand that others do not have the same values as I and that tolerance is mandatory.

And as for MMJ patients, there is no law that states that vaporizers are mandatory for consuming their medicine. Again, self-righteousness at its finest.

Rosupi, you're an idiot. Comments like yours give me high blood pressure which in turn leads me to poor health. Therefore you should be illegal so please leave.

Sorry Rosupi but if there are walls in between your unit and the others in a building than they are NOT being forcefully exposed to second hand smoke. My neighbors next to me in my apartment smoke and my unit doesnt smell like smoke, not have I ever had second-hand smoke magically go thorugh the walls and enter my apartment. Your argument is just plain wrong.

It should be up to the rental companies and landlords to decide if they want to allow smoking or not. There are plenty of lanlords who do ban smoking in their properties and people can choose to live there if they dont want to be in the same building as people who smoke.

I can agree with that,

I used to live above a lady that has a tracheotomy that still smokes! and id come home to my apartment smelling like cigs almost every day. hurry up and kill yourself already!... so yes this law is for all the people like me that have had to put up with other peoples bad habbits... your rights don't extend to tainting the homes of others.

The point that people seem to be missing is that this does not just concern what ONE person does in their home! It is what that one person does that affects others in THEIR homes that was brought into question. This is about the health of everyone. Not just you.

Incorrect, reading comprehension for the win. This has nothing to do with "other in their homes," it's preventing your neighbor from smoking in THEIR home because it's a townhouse adjoined to yours, whether or not you share a common ventilation system.

If you neighbor wants to smoke in his/her home, it's none of your god damn business, period, end of discussion.

I used to live above a lady that has a tracheotomy that still smokes! and id come home to my apartment smelling like cigs almost every day. hurry up and kill yourself already!... so yes this law is for all the people like me that have had to put up with other peoples bad habbits... your rights don't extend to tainting the homes of others.

If you live in an apartment building and the hallway smells of smoke cause your neighbor smokes, get in touch with the landlord and have a "no smoking indoors" policy instituted in your building. There are more non-smokers than smokers, this shouldn't be hard. Viola, problem solved.

I can see 2nd hand smoke being a problem in apartment complexes, but you have other means to correct that situation aside from outlawing smoking in homes, period.

WhenWillItEnd and Aaron:

People like you are morons who don't think things through. This law applies to multi-unit housing. Most of those SHARE VENTILATION SYSTEMS! Think about that for a bit then come back with something intelligent to say.

Also, Whenwillitend, I'm sorry that logic and facts hurts you so badly. Quick, turn on the TV and watch FoxNews! You should feel better after that.

DrowningGrover:

When their smoke gets into my house/home, then it is my damned business. Period.

Also, most landlords suck and won't do a darned thing. The best way to stop secondhand smoke is to stop the smokers from smoking in such a confined space. This law is completely necessary and welcomed.

When their smoke gets into my house, then it is my damned business. Period.

I actually agree with this law when applied to apartment complexes and units with shared ventilation systems. And if your landlord is that useless, get a bunch of your neighbors together and present a unified front, threaten legal action is necessary. They'll listen then.

The problem with law, as per usual, is the overreach, banning smoking in duplexes and townhomes. If someone takes out a mortgage on a townhome that doesn't share a HVAC unit with yours, it is none of your damn business what they do in that house. They own it, not you, nor the city.

If there was/is such a great demand for smoke free apartments, town homes, duplexes, tri-plexes, the owners of these buildings would be changing their rules to not allow smoking (I'll bet the ban does not apply to "medicinal" marijuana). Since it seems that the demand was not that great - otherwise it would have been done - this becomes an issue of elected officials creating laws to make themselves feel better.

I did get in touch with my apartment complex people, it was a fight and a complaint to the state board but eventually they let me out of the lease it was so bad, even all my clothes were smelling...

I was in college so it was an easy move... might not be so easy for a low income family...

Is it really asking to much to tell ppl to sit outside if we all have to be crammed in the same building?

Rosupi: How do town houses share ventilation systems? It's all cool until Government bans something you like to do in your free time, in your own house. Do you know who this law won't effect - rich people. Get over yourself, the air is already polluted.

Jay:

I said "Most" homes, not all. Duplexes and Townhouses share walls. Smoke permeates through walls (which are usually made of a porous material), especially in the homes of heavy smokers. Do YOU know who this law won't affect - non-smokers. Get over yourself, you don't have the right to push yourself and your bad habit onto others.

Property owners already can designate part or even all of their buildings as non-smoking. IF your looking to rent I think this is something that many already look for and can make a choice to live in a community that allows smoking or not. WE DO NOT NEED GOVERNMENT DICTATING THIS!!!!! NON-SMOKERS like this but what's next???? Like a nice stiff drink after work??? How you gonna feel when they ban alcohol which is legal just as smoking is???? After that are they going to ban 32oz, pops in rental units? Junk food?? Certain TV programs that if heard through the walls might offend somebody??? YOU open this door and alot more BS than you asked for is gonna come marching right on in!!!!!!

Rosupi-so you have the right to force YOUR agenda on everybody else??? YOU drink alcohol, eat foods that are bad for you etc..???? Check yourself, I'm sure there are things you want to keep your rights to as well!!!!

Skrewdworld:

So me telling someone not to force themselves or their bad habits onto me is the same as me forcing my "agenda" on them. No, it's not. There is already a whole bunch of BS in this country, but at least this is a step in the right direction. Sorry if this law took away your candy and gave you broccoli instead. Sorry that California actually cares enough about the health of its citizens to pass a law like this. Sorry that you are so selfish that would prefer to put your "rights" over the health of a child.

Also, though it isn't any of your business, what I do doesn't directly affect anybody else in a negative way. Take a look at your own life and see if you can say the same thing. I highly doubt it.

Smokers and their supporters are too dumb to understand the real issues here.

Disagreed, Positive (oxymoronic) Me. It is you who seems to think that your desire to make everyone better trumps personal freedoms. Therefore, it is you who is too dumb to understand the real issue.

rosupi would you agree, that since this law was made after many people paid for their condos, that the town now has to buy the condos from all the smokers. these people bought their homes expecting freedom of use. the town/state has now limited the freedom of their home usage. the town/state should now have to compensate them so they can move, to practice their freedom elsewhere. i know i would be pissed if i paid money for a home, that i would now have to sell, with the market the way it is (most likely at a loss for what i paid for it).

But it's ok to light up your grill on your 5x5 balcony space............double standards at its finest!

well rosupi i dont see you responding to what i wrote. i guess you are just a narrowminded anti freedom wingnut.

Non smokers are drinking koolaid provided by the anti-smoking lobby. Let's try common sense, A pack a day smoker takes in how much first hand and second hand smoke daily? A non smoker stands fifteen feet away, If the second hand smoke is going to kill the non smoker in twenty years, wouldn't the smoker be dead in hours? I think taking the it smells to its going to kill me is a stretch.

Poorly-built buildings have poor ventilation (they're obviously not the sharpest crayons in the box over there), even some well-designed buildings have shared ventilation. Sometimes, there's but a mere grate between units. Sometimes, cigarette smoke does invade your neighbors unit whether you want it to or not.

There should be a provision allowing tenants to sign waivers if they're OK with their neighbors smoking.

I live in NY and I'll bet we're next - but nobody in my building, including my landlord, are going to turn me in. No fools to worry about, here.

rosupi would you agree, that since this law was made after many people paid for their condos, that the town now has to buy the condos from all the smokers. these people bought their homes expecting freedom of use. the town/state has now limited the freedom of their home usage. the town/state should now have to compensate them so they can move, to practice their freedom elsewhere.

That's true if I owned a condo or a townhouse I would have a lawsuit on their behinds so fast. I used to work for a sign company years ago & that's what they did when they banned billboard signs. They won too. It was a national company & they had deep pockets. The state had to compensate them for the signs removed & the rest were grandfathered in. Same thing you are denied by law what you paid for after you've already paid for it.

Eric:

Being against smoking and the freedom to do harm to others isn't a right-wing, nut job topic, it's a liberal topic. If you are going to insult me, at least do it right. The law says the ban would take place IN the home. Not outside. The landlord can still set up a smoker area. The smokers won't have to move and lawsuits will be ignored.

I think you are still missing the point. He is speaking of those who PURCHASED their townhomes, not rented. NO landlord to "set up a smoking area outside".

If you PURCHASED a townhome,condo, or duplex with its own ventilation and you are a smoker you have just had your freedom encroached by the state of CA. Period. However you twist it, this is still 100% wrong.

Besides your "send them outside" argument is rediculous,half of the anti smoking NAZIs want the smokers to hide in their homes and keep it off the streets, the rest of you say you should be outside and not indoors... you cant even agree on how to boss smokers around lol. Its their OWN HOME if you made the poor decision of buying a home with inadequate wall thickness to meet your poor noses needs than too bad for you. You own it, deal with it. The smoker next door paid for his walls and home and is allowed to do what he wants in his.

I saw this coming along time ago. Mark my words in 5 years they'll be coming after the king and the clown.

Eating beans and drinking buttermilk doesn't kill people. If I wanted to go after those who produce too much methane, then I would go after those who raise cattle. Smoking is a killer. That can not be denied. Smokers and their homes tend to be nasty. No one likes cleaning up after a smoker has moved out. It's disgusting.

@Rosupi: No one likes cleaning up after an old person has moved out, either. There's this... lingering smell to the house that's just nasty. Are you suggesting we all live in a "Logan's Run" world?

People can live their own lives as long as they aren't poisoning me while doing so.

chow why dont you complain about the corporations poisoning your air and food , and i dont smoke but if i dont want to breath it i keep away from it but the air pollution outside i have no choice but to breath it what a diversion and its not socialism its more dictatorship

chowchig,

Does that mean I can sue the state for the highway next to my home? All those cars are poisoning me.

Class action law suit to big corporations, auto manufactures, oil companies etc and the goverment for allowing them to poison our earth

People can live their own lives as long as they aren't poisoning me while doing so.

There are other, more widespread things poisoning you other than someone smoking a cigarette in their home 2 doors down. You eat tainted lettuce, get injected with fungal drugs, drink dirty water, smell exhaust fumes. You inhale bleach fumes. You can get killed by a drunk driver. To think you'll get poisoned because someone smokes a cigarette at home in which you are not even present is totally stupid. If smoking is this lethal, then why not just Forbid Cigarette Sales and shut down the entire industry?

This is a desperate town's ploy to raise more money through fines by creating stupid laws they cannot enforce. People do all kinds of criminal things in their own homes and there is no way to know what they are doing unless you also agree to install cameras and other kinds of surveillance in people's homes.

If you don't like people who smoke, no one is forcing you to be their friend.

Chowchig, people like you are poisoning this country. Where do you draw the line? How many laws do you want to control your behavior?

Right, because forcefully exposing others to your bad habits should be socially accepted. No.

If a smoker wants to smoke, then go do it outside, preferably very far away from others, or better yet STOP SMOKING. Problem solved and money saved.

This is a good law which concerns the health of others who are forcefully exposed to selfish smokers. Most of the people on this thread who are complaining are probably smokers themselves who care nothing for the health of others. If you complainers actually stopped and read why the law was passed, then you would be agreeing with it. If you still don't like it, then don't live in multi-unit housing.

Also, that nasty yellow tar that builds up on everything in a smoker home is an absolute pain to clean when they move out. In multi-unit housing, that crap gets into other people's homes, which is disgusting and unacceptable. Think of it this way: if your neighbor has a roach problem in their home that has now spread to your home, wouldn't you be really pissed off? Wouldn't you want something done about it? It's the same thing in this situation, only with smoke and tar. This law will allow concerned people to do something about it so that they can protect their families and homes. Great job, California.

the law was put into place so that people from this city have something to squabble about while the politicians steal millions of tax payers dollars and call it a pension

Rosupi, maybe we should just force everyone to where air masks, huh. Some "selfish person" gave me a cold. I guess I am lucky it didn't turn into pneumonia.

Rosupi - You are an uneducated idiot. Money saved by not smoking? Tax money from smoking and from tobacco settlements funds State Trauma Systems that provide medical care to those that are uninsured. Have you reviewed any studies which show the implications of lost tax revenue of smoking + the additional Medicare costs associated with longer lives that may be lived by all those who quick smoking? Use your brain if you have one.

I choose to smoke because I enjoy it and do it in moderation. Now I can't smoke an after dinner cigarrette in my own home? Look at the medical studies - smoking related illness is linked to the number of cigarrettes smoked and the years you have smoked IN ADDITION to a strong genetic component. There is relatively little harm to smoking a few cigarrettes a day. You need some education. I would also suggest a good review of the literature on second hand smoke. You sound like some ignorant sheep who believes everything that they are told. Not the type of citizen that promotes the strength of a free and democratic society. Get over yourself.

I don't like the smell of my neighbors Indian food which wafts into my home and permeates by upholstery...can we outlaw that stuff too?

Rosupi - I think you'd feel more at home back in Germany circa 1940. Please. I hope you don't drive a car, you're polluting my air.

Rosupi

Either get a life or get a grip !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is next on the list of no can do ???? I can not burn my toast because the odor bothers you. How bout I can't cook cabbage because it makes you sick . It is you one way people who make life miserable for the rest of man kind.

Pj:

Accidents happen with catching a cold, but smoking is not accidental. There is a difference and the two cannot be compared. Besides, stopping others from smoking is helpful to both the smoker and others. Sorry if you can't comprehend that fact.

Amb:

Oh, so the money smokers spend go directly to those who provide medical care? I can just feel the IRONY.

Why don't you try reading this: www.tobaccofreekids.org/research/factsheets/pdf/0202.pdf

And then calculate how much you would save by not buying cigarettes in your state: darrenfauth.com/calculators/money-saved-by-quitting-smoking

And then proceed to invest in something that donates to a medical care organization and doesn't put you, your loved ones, or complete strangers in a hospital or grave.

Jay:

This is America. Everybody has the same rights. But it is 100% wrong to force someone to deal with your bad habits. If you don't like being told no, then go someplace that says yes. Why don't you try moving to Germany? I heard they have lots of alcohol, drugs, and plenty of selfish stupidity. You'd fit right in.

Bob1/28:

Ever heard of allergies, food recalls, being a selfish bastard who tries to put his/her rights above the rights of everybody else? Sound familiar. It should Mr. I-like-to-tell-others-to-get-a-life-even-though-I-don't-have-one. Stop being a hypocrite and get a grip on reality. Smokers affect people far more directly and fatally than just about anything or anyone else. People are being killed because of smokers and their bad habits. It is completely justified to try and put a stop to it. Sorry if this reality and facts go right over your head.

Rosupi

Give yourself a fleet , you will feel better.

You are a one way street who can not stand others having the same rights as you do. I have been smoking for over 50 years and am not dead yet. Matter of fact I am in better health than many people I know who never smoked. What I do in my own house is my business and you can not take that away from me ever.

Bob1/28:

I think you have confused yourself. What you just described is a very accurate portrait of yourself: a child who doesn't like being told no. Nice to see you compare yourself to the health of other smokers instead of those who don't smoke. Congrats. Be a smoker for as long as you want. Just make sure you keep your smoking away from everybody else. Just because you MAY be lucky and haven't had any bad symptoms YET, doesn't mean that you won't get sick later or give your relatives or complete strangers cancer. Honestly, you sound just like a child who got caught with his hand in the cookie jar and is complaining about it. Grow up.

ROSUPI

I stand by my statement !!!!You are a one way street who is completely intolerant of others who disagree with you or those who have different life styles than yours. I love to hold mirrors up in front of people. THE REFLECTION SCARES THE HELL OUT OF THEM.

Have a nice life

bob

Bob1/28:

And I stand my assertion that you have no right to force me to endure your bad habits. You are being intolerant and inconsiderate of those who suffer because of your selfishness. Nice mirror trick by the way. Just make sure to hold the reflective side away from yourself. You could drop it out of sheer horror.

Have a nice day.

Rosupi, I am sorry that you can't comprehend the fact that this is still a free country. I prefer not to give up any more liberties for the illusion of safety. As a non smoker, you are more likely to get lung cancer from your home in the form of radon gas. Sorry if this reality and facts go right over your head.

PJ:

I understand that this is a free country. I just happens to look down upon forcing yourself or your habits onto others. If you want to smoke, you can still smoke. Just not in a multi-housing unit. If you don't like it, then live somewhere else.

And the combination of the two proves to be far deadlier than the either one by itself. Thanks for helping to prove my point. Also, the average number of people who die of lung cancer caused by radon is one per every 15K-22K caused by cigarette smoke (source: www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/radon). Sorry, but smokers are the bigger threat and should be dealt with first. Once again, sorry that reality and facts just keep going right over your head.

Rosupi

Smokers affect people far more directly and fatally than just about anything or anyone else.

First you say something like that and then have the gall to start accusing poor bob of having a lack of understanding reality and facts? Look into the mirror.

Rosupi, you are a troll and nothing more. People that live in glass houses shouldn't cast stones and I highly doubt that you are a complete polutant free, give more back to the earth than you take person. Since you are on this board you obviously use electricity. Fortunately I will not have to see anything you type again via the ignore button.

What you saw:

the average number of people who die of lung cancer caused by radon is one per every 15K-22K caused by cigarette smoke

Um...O.K.!

Come on Rosupi, explain your "statistics" to me.

Good grief! You pro-smoking/murders are just as bad as the pro-gun/murders. Seriously! Smoking is one of the few things which can be and has been controlled. There are better ways to kill yourself that don't involve physically harming others.

Radon can be controlled, but not as well. If you want to avoid radon poisoning, then check out an EPA map of Radon Zones.

If you believe yourselves to be completely right, then please tell me why smoking bans in other places, such as restaurants, have gone over so well and stayed in place. This law is only in California, for now. Before you start bashing it and offering BS reasons behind keeping such a dangerous thing around, why not wait it out and see if the law is indeed effective.

Pj:

I admit that I misread it, but I was not wrong in saying cigarettes cause more deaths than radon. It would have been more accurate for me to say "It has been estimated that active smoking is responsible for close to 90 percent of lung cancer cases; radon causes 10 percent, occupational exposures to carcinogens account for approximately 9 to 15 percent and outdoor air pollution 1 to 2 percent. Because of the interactions between exposures, the combined attributable risk for lung cancer can exceed 100 percent." (source: //www.lung.org/lung-disease/lung-cancer/resources/facts-figures/lung-cancer-fact-sheet.html)

You pro-smoking/murders are just as bad as the pro-gun/murders

Good Grief, indeed! It isn't even so much about smoking as it is about liberty and freedom, and that is what you cannot seem to grasp. Do you really want the government to fine you if you feed a kid a piece of candy? Do you want the government to dole out rations for cooking oil and shortening? That could be next, and it isn't even a ridiculous notion anymore. There are thousands of ways to die, and dying from second hand "smoke" through the walls of a condo is beyond minuscule. What is likely to kill you, Rosupi, could likely be fixed by what Bob1/28 suggested to you (give yourself a Fleet!)

Have a great day, try to avoid breathing, it'll kill you.

Pj:

You have just as much liberty to be a smoker as I have to tell you not to smoke around me. It seems you do not understand that everyone has the same right as everyone else. I have every right to keep myself and my children healthy, just as you have every right to slowly kill yourself. This is an issue of public health. The liberty and freedom of many others who are put at risk because someone practices a selfish and dangerous habit are not going to be put down because you want to put them in danger so you can slowly kill yourself and others. Your liberties and freedoms do not trump my liberties and freedoms. By the way, the law states no smoking inside the residence. The landlord can set up a smoking area.

"There are thousands of ways to die, and dying from second hand "smoke" through the walls of a condo is beyond minuscule."

I would like to see you say that to a child who has lung cancer caused by second hand smoke.

Have a great day being insensitive and selfish to anyone who isn't you.

Liberty: freedom from arbitrary or despotic government or control. Don't you think the owner of the property, be it a bar or an appartment building, be able to make that choice? Just as you have the choice to not live there, work there, dine there or drink there.

I would like to see you say that to a child who has lung cancer caused by second hand smoke

Lets see your "statistics on that one, be sure that is from second hand smoke from the apartment next door, too.

Have a great day being insensitive and selfish to anyone who isn't you.

Well aren't you a sweet and selfless jerk. :)

Pj:

No. Just as a murderer does not have the liberty or freedom to continue going around and murdering people, smokers should not have the liberty and freedom to go around and cause cancer or other health problems in others.

Children do get cancer from second hand smoke: www.envirohealthpolicy.net/kidstest/Cancer%20Pages/EnvironmentalCausesCancerChildren.htm

If you don't believe in second hand smoke, despite all of the evidence, nor understand ALL of the hazards of smoking, then you have no right to say anything at all about this issue.

"Well aren't you a sweet and selfless jerk." Why, yes. Yes I am. But at least I'm not some ignorant prick who keeps trying to defend a public health hazard.

No. Just as a murderer does not have the liberty or freedom to continue going around and murdering people

HA! ok, now you are just sounding silly. Face it, you want a world where your every move is regulated because it's "good for you". Well, go live in a cave then.

Lets ban all the IDIOT POLITICIONS. Everyone would agree on that!! (Except the IDIOT POLITICIANS)

Pj:

Why is it that whenever I present an accurate analogy to smoking, you say it is silly and proceed to leave your wool blinders on? Get a clue. Smoking is a killer. Always has been, always will be to smokers and everyone around them. It may take a long time, but it can and does kill. Besides, it's about time regulations started being put in place over certain things (public health hazards like smoking) because it is obvious people can't regulate or take care of themselves. Hence, why we have so many obese, sick, and poor people in our country. People need help since they can't help themselves. And it seems that people are going to bitch and moan about getting healthier and living better every step of the way because they want to remain "blind" to problems (both their own and other people's) and want to continue living in their "glass houses".

It's not ok for anyone to dictate what we do in our own home legally... Wake up America, socialism will reign without firing a shot!!!

Chance,

This is not socialism. It's authoritarianism. And both sides like to employ it, they just have different pet causes.

This is why Americans love their guns...........................

The minute you lose your guns, legislation like this will come out faster than you can read, that is when you really will need to lookout.

And they will say...."ignorance of the law is not an excuse..." guilty.

These are also the same lefties that think it's fine to kill babies, but you're evil if you smoke around them.

This issue is at the heart of what it means to be an American. Only the owner of the residence should make the rules of the residence. Now, other rules can be enacted, like not smoking around infants, etc. But this one is ignorant. Watch out chubby people. You're next.

R&R 2012 Im keeping my guns!!!!

Dear Cigarette Smokers & Their Supporters:

Your burnt toast or cooked cabbage smell won't kill me but your cigarette smoke will. I can't debate with someone who willingly smokes a cigarette to end their life prematurly and painfully and pays $6.00 a pack to do so. Some known facts to the walking dead cigarette smokers and their supporters:

1. 4,000 chemicals in a cigarette

2. 43 known carcinogenic (formaldyhyde, arsenic, DDT, ammonia, cadmium, fungacides, etc YUMMY!)

3. One cup of tar per year intake in lungs. Errrr, cough, cough

4. Nicotine reaches the brain in 6 seconds and a lethal poison that affects heart, brain, lungs, etc.

5. Cigarette smoke is 10,000 times more concentrated that automobile pollution in rush hour.

6. The tobacco companies are getting rich off of your stupidity, weakness and early death. Bye, bye!

Tobacco executive mindset: "An addicted customer is a customer for life no matter how short that life is."

End of debate. It's hard to debate pure stupidity and a great waste of intellect.

Best regards,

My healthy lungs

president you do realize that romney is for more gun control, while obama is not. look at the laws that romney pushed through on gun control while governer of mass... hell when i came home from the airforce i had to go thru ny and across to vermont then down to NH to get home. i had to drive around mass. so i could bring my guns home with me. a month before i got out, there was an article in stars and stripes of a guy going home to maine. he got pulled over in mass. was arrested because of the 5yr mandatory jail law for a non registered gun with the state of mass. romney pushed this law thru, along with the mass. assault rifle ban, and the mandatory fid card that you have to pay for to even own a firearm there.

i really dont get how blind you republicans are about your candidates. i know i will not be voting for romney. i dont like his gun control policies ( past voting record on gun control). i dont like how he bought companies out then outsourced work for the increased profits, then sold them. i also know as an independent i wont be voting for obama. i will be voting independent and third party all the way.

That would only be fair.

Well I guess what's happening is the city doesn't really want to work on the tough problems they have so they champion dumbass problems like this. Vote them all out of office for wasting everyone's time and refusing to do their jobs.

Again they go after the middle class and poor. most wealthy people own their stand alone house's

Yeah they're leaving Cali in droves and swamping my beautiful state of Oregon.Some to escape gangs, violence. high prices, and BS laws etc.. Others come and try to turn OR into another Cali!!! TO those wanting to come to OR and start legislating life here, DON'T!!!! Just give All of CALI to Mexico and get it over with!!!!!

Yeah I hate it when they leave CA and decide to turn where they go into CA. If you liked it so well there why did you leave and if you hated it there why do what your new home to be just like it?

Now now now.....not EVERYONE from Cali feels a need to intrude in the lives of others! A lot of us from here can't even stand the others here. They tried to ban smoking in my city, outside on your own property & thankfully we did not allow our city government to impose such a stupid ban. There are still a few of us that can see the bigger picture of things.

Last time I visited Oregon, I didn't dare tell people I was visiting from California & we got along just fine!

Alright, alright - I'll give in and say not everyone in CA is this way, but there are enough who are and who are leaving it to make it uncomfortable for the rest of us...

So you're suggesting all smokers just go kill themselves.

Well, we live on a planet where everything dies. Why don't we all just kill ourselves.

Smoking is a choice that many people have made. It is not illegal so how can it be illegal to do something legal in your own home?

Nauseating and sickening incense creeps under doors, pollutes furniture, stinks-up everything. Should we outlaw that too?

What about vegetarians: should we outlaw cooking meat in duplexes and multifamily homes because the smell of meat offends them?

Don't kiss girls who smoke if you don't like it. You radical anti-smokers are eroding everyone else's rights and freedom and I take exception to THAT. You have no right to dictate what someone does in his/her own home. period.

Bill unless your as pure as the driven snow yourself you should stop judging!!!! And please don' try to insult anyones intelligence and suggest that you are!!!!!LOL

If you are buying a HUD home how can you afford cigs, selling those stamps hey!!

you don't get addicted to nicotine, it's all the other chemicals in cigarettes that you get addicted to. that's why nicotine gum doesn't help you quit, it doesn't give you the fix you're looking for.

Well I guess the makers of E-cigs are jumping for joy!!!! The upside to them is that they really work pretty well and there's NOT smoke just warm air!!!!!

Whynot - that was the first thing I thought of. The problem is the government wants to have it both ways. They want the revenue but don't want people to actually smoke.

It won't be long before they ban e-cigs too. I quit smoking two years ago using e-cigs, and you would be shocked at how much ignorance there really is about e-cigs. I get people just as mad at me about e-cigs as when I smoked, and, most of the time, i find myself having to stand outside with the smokers. It's amazing how ignorant and over reactive people get.

How the govt plans to enforce a law that bans activity that goes on in one's private domicile is unclear.

Your laptop? With the webcam embedded in the frame?

The government didn't have the technology in 1984 but now most people have invited it into their homes.

trust me - there will be fines.....if the radical asshat anti-smoker next door gets ONE whiff of cigarette smoke he will be on the phone calling police. I wonder how many fights and violent crimes will result from this?

I wonder, NJ, how they will be able to prove you were actually smoking in the residence? By the time the police arrive to enforce the law, the cigarette can be put out. If it smells like smoke, won't the government have to prove that smoking was in the home and not outside but the smell was still on the person's clothing?

In Michigan, smoking is banned in restaurants. Yea! We are making strides. Go outside in the cold a$$holes to get one step closer to death. Ha, ha I love to inconvenience those dumb azz smokers.

You are brain dead!

REALLY??? I mean do you REALLY think your post has any value.....or do you think it just expresses your obsession with homosexuality?

How long did it take you to come up with that drivel?

I've noticed the correlation now that you mentioned it.

Can we ban Indio Rage

Can we ban Indio Rage

That was frankly just plain stupid and doesn't help the cause against peoples personal freedoms being assaulted what so ever in the least. Grow up!!!!

That is a Deusy! IALMAO!

Just like large soda in new york being banned they let people decide to get 2 mediums what idiot came up with that

especially since 2 mediums means twice the trash.