What happened to the right to a speedy trial? His life is already destroyed and even when found innocent, how will he ever hold a job or be able to go out in public again?

Under Florida law he felt his life threatened when the kid went for his legally carried handgun. Someone tries to grab your gun that is assault as their intentions are not altruistic. He defended himself within Florida state law. The alternative was his life was in danger. It's a horrible situation as a kid died but nonetheless he did nothing wrong...

the defense waived speedy trial to pursue the various motions involved...

Zimmerman had a football player on top of him pummeliing him and he pulled a gun in self defense...

the only eye witness confirms Zimmermans account

it's all over but a long expensive useless trial.... oh and all the shouting on the internet about how it's unfair....

the lesson: don't get on top of someone and beat their azz for any reason ever.... you could get killed.... .duh

Joe,

Yep, not guilty.....let the riots begin !!

dietrich -

Under Florida law he felt his life threatened when the kid went for his legally carried handgun. Someone tries to grab your gun that is assault as their intentions are not altruistic. He defended himself within Florida state law. The alternative was his life was in danger.

obviously, you believe the cock and bull story gz put forth. i, myself, find it a bit unbelieveable, especially the part where as he's on the ground with tm supposedly pummeling him, he feels tm's hand reaching for his weapon and he pins tm's hand, pulls his weapon and fires ALL WITH THE SAME ARM. just doesn't seem possible or believeable...

If Zimmerman had been black and the boy he shot had been white, he'd have been convicted and imprisoned by now.

or rather, we'd watch his story on "The First 48" and see how he gets set free for lack of evidence

Bob (1.6),

I think Zimmerman shot Martin because he was getting pummeled, not because he was black.

@DietrichtheKaiser - The Right to a Speedy Trial only means that the Prosecution has to be ready to proceed within 180 days.

The Defense however, has the right to postpone proceedings. In fact, this is a typical Defense Tactic. It behooves the Defense to delay things as long as possible. Wtinesses die, forget things, etc. The fact that this trial has taken over a year is due to motions on the part of The Defense, otherwise the 6th Amendment would call for Zimmerman to be automatically freed.

Maybe you should learn something about how the Legal System works next time before you attempt to critique it?

Thom.... most criminals don't deserve to be shot... just the ones who commit a violent felony assault, such as the case with Trayvon (if proven in court)... Both persons had every right to be in that location at the same time.. it's the one who threw the first punch is the person who went over the line.. so far from what I hear from witnesses, that person was Trayvon..

KeenInsight (1.14),

If Trayvon was attacked, why didn't he have any marks on his body? Other than the cut on his knuckle (presumably from hitting Zimmerman) and the gunshot wound?

Anyone is allowed to walk up to anyone else in a public place and ask them what they are doing. The person being questioned has the right to tell the questioner to go to hell, but they don't have the right to attack questioner.

Once Trayvon hit Zimmerman, Zimmerman was within his rights to defend himself by whatever means he felt were necessary.

This is cruel and unusual punishment ...... making all these people with preconceived notions wait until June.

There is no one who saw that fight from beginning to end. You have just decided to accept the story of the person who is alive. Right, there were no marks on Trayvon, funny for someone who was apparently pummeling Zimmerman and bloodying his head. Have you ever seen the fists of someone who's been beating the cp out of someone with his fists? That's why police take pictures of those hands. And the cut wasn't on Trayvon's knuckle. It was on a scratch on his little finger.

If someone had been stalking me and then grabbed me, I'd scream and fight back, too, under the assumption that my assailant planned to kill me. Apparently Zimmerman can't fight--he can only shoot and kill.

June trial ??? George was convicted 6 months ago by the press. Here we go again.

George was tried and convicted 6 months ago by the media, why do we need another trial. Oh yea, we are a nation of laws . . how silly of me to forget. Guilty as charge, next case please.

KeenInsight,

I also believe the story of the eye witness to the middle of the fight. Conversely, you've decided to believe the story you made up for yourself.

Zimmerman had injuries consistent with being hit in the face a few times and Martin had a cut on his knuckles. Do I fully believe Zimmerman's story that he was hit 20 times and his head was being bashed into the ground? No. Do I believe that it's reasonable that a person who was being assaulted remembers the assault being a little more brutal than it actually was? Absolutely.

If you, or anyone else, can prove that Zimmerman started the physical confrontation I will immediately change my opinion.

Let's clear up a few misconceptions here....

oldhamletman said;

Zimmerman had a football player on top of him pummeliing him and he pulled a gun in self defense...

Martin reportedly, on his facebook page, loved football, loved watching football,but he himself did not play on his school team. At 6'00 and 160 pounds, he would not have had the muscle mass or build to play football.

thom said;

Trayvon happened to haev been expelled from school (drugs) and he happenedd to have been caughtt with tools for committing burglary... and a lot of womens jewelry in his packpack.

Martin was suspended, not expelled, for having an empty baggie that MAY have held marijuana but was never conclusively proven. He had also previously been suspended for carrying a screwdriver in his backpack, which the school postulated MAY have been used to break into lockers at school; there were several items of feminine jewelry in his backpack but none of it matched the description of items stolen from those lockers and no one ever stepped forth to claim said jewelry items.

Keen Insight said:

Trayvon smoked a joint apparently weeks before he was killed.

Trace amounts of a chemical called THC was found in Martin' system by the coroner. As THC can remain in the bloodstream for up to two weeks after it is first consumed, he had exposure to the chemical between ten and fourteen days prior to his death. (no earlier than ten, no later than fourteen or fifteen days.) while it is most likely it was from a joint, one cannot rule out other possible forms of ingestion, (my husband's brother's wife once made marijuana-laced brownies and my husband ate one unknowingly.)

He's 16 and the night he was killed, as police state, no crimes were being committed--except, perhaps, by the shooter.

He had just turned 17 two weeks prior to the shooting.

scubaSteve said:

Zimmerman had injuries consistent with being hit in the face a few times

yes.

and Martin had a cut on his knuckles.

Martin had a small cut on the ring finger, not knuckle, of his left hand, right about where one would be if he'd been wearing a ring that was pushed into the skin by outside pressure.

You arm chair judges/juries/executioners, you think you have it ALL figured out, yet you know absolutely NO FACTS, just what the biased Govt. controlled media lets your dumb a$$'s know. Keep your armchair "I thinks" to your selves. STFU! Remember: When "SECONDS" count, the police are only "Minutes" away. Thats right, think about it.

Exactly, Amanda. The point is that Zimmerman supporters have to make up stories about the dead boy to justify Zimmerman killing him. It doesn't even make any difference if he smoked a joint. We don't execute smokers in this country. We don't execute children suspended from school or children who haven't been arrested and convicted of anything. We don't stalk & kill children because, to our eyes, they look suspicious.

No one here has addressed Zimmerman's criminal record, his history of violence. His and his families lies in court under oath. But they are all into executing a boy because a couple of weeks ago he smoked a joint and got suspended from school.

So much for the right to a speedy trial.

Amanda,

You were correct on most of your points, I'd just like to make 2 statements.

1.) 6'0 160 pounds is certainly big enough to play high school football or to beat the crap out of someone.

2.) From the autopsy report, the cut was about half an inch and was located between his 1st and 2nd knuckle. Although it could have been caused from a ring as you suggest, Martin wasn't wearing any rings and the wound appeared to be fresh. I don't think it's unreasonable to believe he got the injury from hitting Zimmerman.

KeenInsight,

You are absolutely correct. The ZimmieZealots have to make things up and attempt to villify a dead kid all in the name of supporting not George Zimmerman, but their Neanderthol, racist belief system. Sad, isn't it? Justice is the least of their concerns.

ScubaSteve,

And apparently, 5'11" and 200 lbs. is big enough to decide to leave your vehicle with a 9mm loaded with hollow points to chase after a barely 17 year old kid, from one side of the neighborhood to the other, and then shoot him through the heart all because your paranoid mind tells you a Black kid walking home in the rain is "suspicious."

What's your point? Had George Zimmerman not taken the law into his own hands, Trayvon Martin would never have been put in the position of having to defend himself from some looney tunes cop wannabe.

what's our country coming to when one marine can kill another without consequence, and a white man can't kill a black kid in the south without going to trial? defense screwed up, they should claim the "Feres doctrine" defense and claim sovereign immunity because he was on duty. everyone knows soldiers, cops, politicians and neighborhood watchdogs are above the law, when on duty! heck, i don't even know if the kid who killed my son is black, white, brown or yellow...oops, i guess i do know he's yellow-bellied. google "Feres doctrine", none of us are safe. RIP Justin and Trayvon, my condolences to the family. i do hope the whole truth comes out in the trial, and if zimmerman is found not guilty, i hope he uses better judgement in the future.

Wow. I'd like to see the defense build a case on Trayvon's ferocity on the basis of a scratch on his finger. That'll ought to liberate Zimmerman right then and there! LOL!

@Thom-

Your a bunch of sorry ass morons.

First, it's you're, not your. Who is the moron? Second, when did petty theft and smoking pot become capitol offenses?

(hes a man if he is old enoguh to commit crimes)

Really??!! My neighbor's 5 year-old got caught shop-lifting a couple of weeks ago, he is a man now, according to you. Should we shoot him? Please feel free to stop wasting oxygen.

How about they use the witness who says he saw Trayvon hitting Zimmerman "MMA style"?

Would that be a good enough defense to prove that Trayvon did some punching?

Really Amanda??? 6ft 160 to small for football??? I can tell U know nothing of the game, I don't watch it nor do I pay any attention to it but I do know enough about HIGH SCHOOL football to say at 6ft 160lbs he would have made a excellant WR or a RB or even a QB we are not talking he had to a 250lb lineman!!!!!!!!!!

lots and lots of making up evidence here... the actual verifiable evidence about the confrontation is very little:

- cuts on the back of Zimmermans head and broken nose

- cut on Travyons finger

- eyewitness saying Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman hitting him

- recording of someone yelling help, Zs father says its Z, Ts father said it was NOT T then changed his mind

None of the other crap matters

this whole building up things people think they know is crazy.... if someone is on top of someone else hitting them, it is never excusable for any reason ever, it's aggravated battery.... and it's grounds in Florida for self defense

Scubasteve said:

1.) 6'0 160 pounds is certainly big enough to play high school football or to beat the crap out of someone.

6'00" and 160 is a very slim build. I'm a biometrics tech and when someone gets their prints done i have to enter height and weight as part of the physical identifiers. 160 for 6'00" is slim build for a male. Also, although I could be wrong on this and I have to go check (my memory may be fuzzy on this) his school did not say that he played.

I don't think it's unreasonable to believe he got the injury from hitting Zimmerman.

No. It is not. But I also don't believe that Zimmerman was 'close to being in diapers'as his family has stated he told them.

Oldhamletman,

I'd add the timeline from Zimmerman's initial phone call to police and the subsequent 911 calls.

Amanda (1.32),

I was 6'0 165 my junior year of high school and I was pretty big. At that age, athletic males have very little fat on them. To give you an idea, I ballooned to 6'0 215 in college (buffalo chicken sandwiches are, apparently, not good for you if eaten every night). The high school version of me would have been a much better fighter.

I will agree that Zimmerman and his Family are probably exaggerating the severity of the attack to try to gain sympathy (and having the opposite effect). But assault is assault and courts have traditionally been very generous when head injuries come into play. All it takes is one solid punch in the right spot and you could end up in diapers.

Put yourself in Trayvon's shoes, people..... he is at his Dad's girlfriends condo and is bored. He decides to walk to a nearby store and talks to his girlfriend on his cell phone while doing so. He realizes some guy is following him and confronts him. We only have Zimmerman's word that Trayvon "attacked"him, we do know there was an altercation, but no impartial witness as to started it. You all do not even KNOW Zimmerman, but are prepared to take his word as proof... but yet you criticize the people who think he is lying?? The man took one look at Trayvon and decided he didn't "belong" there? I guess you accept he knows every resident by sight? Do you know every one of your neighbors by sight? I don't. Even though there was none of Trayvon's DNA on the gun, you accept he was trying to take Zimmerman's gun?

It is my theory that Zimmerman saw a black guy walking around and decided he was a threat, that he confronted him, Trayvon knocked the snot out of him, so he drew his gun and shot him; not out of fear but out of anger. You all say he had the right to stand his ground...why didn't Trayvon have the SAME right? (Remember, he was walking back from the store to a place he had been invited to.)

You want to damn Trayvon for having an empty pot baggy and getting suspended from school and IGNORE the fact Zimmerman was arrested for being drunk and out of control? You also seem to want to ignore the fact that Zimmerman was prescribed ADD meds and anxiety meds.... Zimmerman claimed he got the gun to make his wife feel safer because of a break-in; yet he took the gun WITH HIM to ride around the neighborhood and left his wife defenseless? Do I KNOW Zimmerman is guilty? Do I KNOW he shot and killed this kid out of anger? Nope, I am drawing my own conclusions, just like you have....

Im tired of people calling Mr Zimmerman a "vigilante". First of all, he was acting to protect his community from known issues of breakin's and criminal damage to the neigherborhood from unknown people. He followed Martin FROM A DISTANCE, and when he lost sight of Martin, he was on his way back to his car when Martin hit him from behind. Now Zimmerman is on the ground with Martin on top, beating the hell out of him. Then the Martin sees that Zimmerman has a gun, and grabs for it. Somehow zimmerman is able to keep posession of his gun and is able to put one shot into Martin. By all accounts, this is the description of the incident. Sadly, you again have a radical prosecuter who has decided that she hates guns, and wants to punish a lawabiding citizen and cause a lengthy and expensive trial that will and should be declared not guilty. Also sadly, when he is finally declared not-guilty, that prosecuter will still have her job!

Blondeness032,

You don't have the right to stand your ground by throwing the first punch.

As I've said before, show me some evidence that Zimmerman started the physical confrontation and I'll change my tune.

the prosecutor will offer a involuntary manslaughter and to drop perjury charges against Zimmerman's wife, for a probated sentence; the prosecution does not want to try this case, it is a loser, and they well know it.

Scubasteve58001

Oldhamletman,

I'd add the timeline from Zimmerman's initial phone call to police and the subsequent 911 calls.

--------------------------------------------------

yeah, that's all evidence, but not direct evidence of the actual confrontation.... and almost certainly the whole case will come down to that....

Amanda,

High school football players are typically at least 15-30 pounds lighter than College or Pros... and yes, Trayvon was on his schools team, at least until he started getting in trouble / suspended. 6 foot 160lbs is plenty big esp with a young athletic guy, to completely overwhelm an out of shape older guy... it happens every day... He also bragged on twitter about giving a bus driver a beat down.....

overall you are stretching fact to a great degree to make a plausible doubt that Trayvon was capable of doing this.... it's not at question... there is an eye witness.... he assaulted Zimmerman and had won and wasn't stopping in spite of cries for help, end of story.

given that fact and the evidence of the direct confrontation the legal question is answered... it just comes down to how far the prosecution is willing to take it.

the Stand your Ground hearing has yet to happen.... it's likely to get thrown out there...

it sucks that Trayvon died.... but he took that risk when he decided to fight Zimmerman.... even if you believe the outlandish idea that Zimmerman started the fight after running down an 18 year old football player.... Trayvon fought.... and won the fight.... and didn"t stop..... and died

Scubasteve said:

I was 6'0 165 my junior year of high school and I was pretty big. At that age, athletic males have very little fat on them.

Having never weighed that much, I can only tell you what I've observed from the physical identifiers of my clients. I never really paid much attention to the jocks at my high school except to make sure none of them were close to me in the cafeteria or the hallways (I was one of those shy nerdy quiet wallflowers who got picked on all the time--I eventually stopped eating lunch and just spent lunch in the library feeding my brain instead.)

And I went back and checked--his school did not say that he played ball for them.

I will agree that Zimmerman and his Family are probably exaggerating the severity of the attack to try to gain sympathy (and having the opposite effect).

That was the impression I got as well. let's wait until the trial unfolds and we can discuss the evidence--you're one of the few who, while holding to their own opinion, is still willing to be open-minded about new evidence. My opinion? Both Zimmerman's and Martin's actions contributed to the tragedy that night, and both have lost their lives.

KeenInsight ....(#1.1)..."Sure we do. It's okay to target and shoot an unarmed 16-year old when he's on his way home from the store. If Trayvon had been white, he'd still be alive. If Zimmerman had been black and the boy he shot had been white, he'd have been convicted and imprisoned by now."

That's a big pile of horsefeather hockey pucks...Here are the FACTS about Florida's SYG cases....Victims, shooters...each are black, white, brown, male, female....Click on each photo and read about the case on the left side of the page...33 Convicted-----66 Justified-----22 Pending ( including Zimmerman-Martin case)

Each case, one by one.....the law and the system WORK !!!

http://www.tampabay.com/stand-your-ground-law/fatal-cases

Simple take on things guys, Zimmerman had a right to Stand His Ground and defend himself. Trayvon had a right to Stand His Ground and defend himself. Now that we've cleared that up, I think we shud settle on this. They both stood their ground and Trayvon lost. Was it right? No. Was it fair? No. Was it illegal? No.

Correction: went back and looked--early news article said he did not play, but later reaction from people he knew included a former football coach so yes, at one point he did. My error! Thanks to those who corrected me!!!

oldhamletman said:

there is an eye witness.... he assaulted Zimmerman and had won and wasn't stopping in spite of cries for help, end of story.

Here's what I read (from a paper in Great Britain, since american news can't seem to run an unbiased story on this case):

A man who says he saw Trayvon Martin shot dead claims that the Florida teenager and his killer, George Zimmerman, were scuffling on the ground at the time with one on top of the other.

The first eyewitness account of the 17-year-old's final moments emerged on Thursday night more than a month after the boy lost his life in an altercation with a neighbourhood watch leader in a gated community in Sanford.

The anonymous man said he reported to police details of what he saw on the evening of 26 February, which included watching the gunman walking away from the fight apparently uninjured.

It contradicts an allegation from Zimmerman's father earlier in the day that the unarmed black teenager broke his son's nose during the incident and also left him with bloody injuries from slamming the man's head repeatedly on to a concrete pavement. The eyewitness says he saw no blood and that the entire confrontation took place only on grass.

"I saw two men on the ground, one on top of the other. I felt they were scuffling and I heard gunshots which to me were more like pops," he said in an interview broadcast on CNN's Anderson Cooper 360, his voice disguised to protect his identity.

"I don't know if was an echo but it definitely made more than one pop.
"After the larger man got off there was a boy, obviously now dead, on the ground facing down.

"It was dark. I can't say I watched him get up, but in a couple of seconds or so he was walking towards where I was watching and I could see him a little bit clearer. It was a Hispanic man. He didn't appear hurt or anything else. He just kind of seemed very worried with his hand up to his forehead."

The man said that before opening his window and looking out, he had heard angry voices outside. "There was a loud, predominant voice. I couldn't hear the words but this is not a regular conversation," he said. "This is someone aggressively yelling at someone."

He said there was a lull but the argument resumed and that was when he decided to see what was going on.

"I'm thinking something horrible is happening. I heard the yell for help and another excruciating kind of a yell, it didn't even sound like a yell, it sounded so painful," he said.

The Sanford police department, which has been criticised for not arresting Zimmerman, 28, would not confirm the witness's account, referring questions to the office of the Florida state attorney Angela Corey, who was appointed last week to oversee the case.

Nobody was available at Corey's office to comment.

panhandletown.....

Had Traygone been in school in miami and not "on vacation" suspended he would not have been shot in sanford over 400 miles away.

panhandletown... you f'n piece of sh------ttttt!!!! Your an A$$$$!!!! Okay!!! Any kid being suspended is not any reason for him/her to be shot to death!!! You stupid B$$*tCH!!!!

I am just sick to my stomach and tired of everyone around the world blaming Treyvon. Lol... I'm a caregiver and step-father and I also take care of foster-kids. A kids safety comes first!!! Treyvon (no matter how people want to view him because of his stature and him being an athlete) is a youth!!! Let me repeat that... Treyvon is a "youth." Let me clerify some more... Treyvon is a teenager!!! Lol...okay!!! Let me clerify some more... Zimmerman is an "adult." Okay, now does anyone understands now... or are you still confused!!! Let me say it again... Treyvone is a Kid/Youth/Tennager under 18. Zimmerman is a 29 year old "adult" now is it more clear!!!!

Going back to me being a foster-parent... County Social Workers are 100% for the safety and well-being of a youth in the foster system. And so are parents and family members of their own children. If an adult (even faculty at a school) was to put their hands on a foster youth protected by the county, state and social workers... That adult would be in serious trouble and would face prosecution!!! Well....let's get back to the Trayvon case... This man SHOT & KILLED A KID/YOUTH/TEENAGER WHO'S UNDER 18. I DON"T CARE WHAT HAPPENED DURING THE ALTERCATION, I DON"T CARE WHO DID WHAT AND WHY.... BOTTOM LINE.... ZIMMERMAN SHOULD HAVE NEVER USED LETHAL FORCE ON A KID/YOUTH/TEENAGER AND SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN ABLE TO CARY A GUN OUTSIDE... HE"S NOT A COP. LET THE COPS BE COPS AND CONSTITUENTS BE CONSTITUENTS...

LASTLY - I'm saddened at a lot of people here commenting on msn about this case... It's opened my own eyes up... to how far behind as a nation we are... You all are sad!!! And I hope most of you are not parents... because that would be even worse!!! One question.... What if this was your child who got shot? Don't beat around the question too... Don't say well that would have never happened because my child would have never got suspended... No.... Just ask the question....

HOW WOULD YOU FEEL IF YOUR SON/DAUGHTER ASKED YOU IF THEY COULD GO TO THE STORE AND GET SOME SNAKS AND YOU AS A PARENT SAID "OKAY..., BUT BE CAREFUL BECAUSE ITS RAINING AND IT"S DARK OUT." AND YOU NOTICE THAT SEVERAL MINUTES PASS, AND HOURS PASS AND YOUR SON/DAUGHTER NEVER MADE IT BACK HOME.... FINALLY RECEIVING A CALL FROM POLICE THAT YOUR SON/DAUGHTER HAS BEEN PRONOUNCED DEAD FROM A FATAL GUN SHOT WOUND TO THE CHEST.

WHAT WOULD BE YOUR REACTION? HOW WOULD YOU FEEL? HOW WOULD YOU CALM YOURSELF DOWN? HOW WOULD YOU PROFESSIONALY HANDLE THE SITUATION BY FINALLY KNOWING FROM POLICE THAT IT WAS A 29 YR OLD ADULT WHO FATALY SHOT YOUR SON/DAUGHTER? HOW WOULD YOU LIVE DAY TO DAY? HOW WOULD YOU FIGHT BACK? HOW WOULD YOU BEST REPRESENT YOUR SON/DAUGHTER? HOW WOULD YOU FEEL TO KNOW YOUR SON/DAUGHTER FATALLY GOT SHOT BY AN ADULT WHO WAS NOT EVEN A POLICE OFFICER BUT A NEIGHTBORHOOD WATCH CAPTIN WHO SAW YOUR SON/DAUGHTER TO BE SUSPICIOUS AND HARRASSED HIM/HER BY FOLLOWING YOUR SON/DAUGHTER IN HIS CAR AND THIS STRAINGER APPROACHING YOUR SON/DAUGHTER AT NIGHT WHILE IT'S RAINING?

I WOULD LOVE TO HEAR EVERYONES ANSWERS TO THESE QUESTIONS!!!! INTERESTED TO FIND OUT HOW PEOPLE WILL ANSWER!!!!

Amanda-2017567..(#1.44)...

I've read every statement taken by police of the " witnesses"...they are all in the Document drops made by state officials.....Not a single one even remotely resembles what this person interviewed on CNN said.

http://www.axiomamnesia.com/TrayvonMartinFiles/Trayvon-Martin-George-Zimmerman-FULL-case-report-documents.pdf

http://axiomamnesia.com/TrayvonMartinFiles/Trayvon_Martin_George_Zimmerman_Documents_given_to_the_Defendant_R.pdf

There really is no answer to that question, sillyboy--at least not from the Zimmerman supporters who have swallowed his story whole. Trayvon posed no threat to either Zimmerman or the community he was in. He went to the store without incident. On the way home, he spots some strange guy following him. The entire incident was under Zimmerman's control. No crime had taken place. He had no reason to pursue anybody and he didn't even identify himself to this boy according to his own testimony.

Now if the dead child had had Zimmerman's criminal history, there might be some discussion. but you see no one addresses Zimmerman;s history of violence and instability or the fact that his family perjured themselves in the court and he hid funds and a second passport.

But Trayvon was apparently whamming some guy "MMA style" and had nary a mark on his hands except for a small scratch "between" two knuckles. Any doctor or cop will tell you that a fight of that magnitude would have produced swollen and abraded knuckles from the assault.

And those witness testimonies have changed over time.

Amanda....

most of the actual evidence, not newspaper accounts, are available as downloads online at gzlegalcase.com and other sites....

there was one (1) actual witness who saw the actual confrontation... he drew a diagram of the placement on the concrete sidewalk and indicated that the man all in black (Trayvon) was on top of a man with red on his jacket (Zimmerman) 'ground and pounding' him 'MMA style'

no matter the scenario before that... throughout the US... that's aggravated assault ( aggravated meaning intent to do great bodily harm or death), a major felony, and is ample cause to use deadly force in self defense.

Looking at your newspaper quote, I would say that the author took extreme liberty quoting the actual witnesses, appeared not to quote from actual statements given to police, and biased the article to infer that Trayvon was simply an innocent teenager who got jumped by a guy who wasn't hurt at all by the confrontation.

Zimmerman's physician confirmed that he had multiple lacerations to the back of his head, a broken nose, and a strained back.

Also, the UK press has had a habit of portraying the US as being a wild west free for all with respect to guns, and I've frequently seen reporting like your quote when reading UK papers.

The only reason this became major news and wasn't dismissed on the spot is that the racial angle was played by various people and politicians until it got legs with the national media...

blondeness said:

You want to damn Trayvon for having an empty pot baggy and getting suspended from school and IGNORE the fact Zimmerman was arrested for being drunk and out of control? You also seem to want to ignore the fact that Zimmerman was prescribed ADD meds and anxiety meds.... Zimmerman claimed he got the gun to make his wife feel safer because of a break-in; yet he took the gun WITH HIM to ride around the neighborhood and left his wife defenseless?

First: he was running to the local Target on an errand the night of the incident, not 'riding around the neighborhood'.

2: Zimmerman has a prior criminal record.

7/18/2005 Resisting officer with battery, 7/18/2005 resisting officer without battery. Criminal felony, case closed--Written plea of not guilty entered 8/05/05, Defendant not present 10/27/2005, PTD program agreement for supervision 6/15/2006, Nolle Prosequi 7/28/2006

And here's this from the DOJ website about that PTD program:

The U.S. Department of Justice has a Pretrial Diversion program (PTD) which basically allows a potential defendant to avoid criminal prosecution for lesser crimes. The person has to sign an agreement with the Department of Justice or U.S. Attorney's Office and agrees to be supervised by a Pretrial Services Officer for a period of time not to exceed 18 months. The subject will have to report to pretrial services and be booked, ie, fingerprinted, photographed, etc..., so the government can monitor the subject's behavior during the diversion period. It is important for the subject of the PTD program to not violate any laws during this time because doing so can result in the PTD being terminated and the original charges being prosecuted. Once a subject has successfully completed the PTD program, the government agrees to not prosecute the original charges.

So what all of that boils down to is that Zimmerman pled not guilty was going to go to trial, instead of being tried he was shuttled into PTD, a sort of parole monitoring situation and the case was dropped. There were originally two charges; resisting officer with battery (fought a cop in a bar according to some accounts) when the cop called another to arrest Zimmerman, he resisted the other officer but did not assault him. Both those charges we combined to one case. In this case I do think that his father being a former judge most likely did have something to do with the way this turned out because the PTD program is supposed to be for misdemeanors and assaulting a cop (two cops) is a felony. Zimmerman's excuse was that he did not know they were cops; well, Martin didn't know Zimmerman was neighborhood watch. Ignorance does not eliminate guilt. If that trial had gone on and he had not been shuttled into the PTD program, he would almost certainly have been found guilty.

8/9/2005 Domestic violence, case now closed-Temporary injunction issued 8/10/2005, permanent injunction issued 8/24/05. He then filed a counter-case in which he sought an injunction against Ms. Zuazo, which was also granted.

12/14/2006 Speeding, case closed--officer did not appear.

12/14/2006 No vehicle registration during stop, case closed--officer did not appear.

In my municipality, when a domestic violence restraining order is granted, the party must surrender weapons and permits. these will be given back upon expiration of said order, so if tat injunction has expired he did legally have a permit and carry a weapon.

Now, he was at the time being treated by a psychologist with benzodiazepines and amphetamines--Temazepam and Adderall--and while I don't know what the law is in FL, in my municipality if you are under treatment by a licensed professional for a mental disorder/psych disorder, weapons and permits need to be surrendered.

IF this is the law in FL (I saw one website that said it is, but if a lawyer could verify that for me I'd appreciate it) then why weren't his weapons and permits confiscated? Did he know he was supposed to surrender them? Did his doctor tell him? Failure at any or all of these points contributed to the tragedy and the State of FL needs to take responsibility if this is the case.

oldhamletman said:

there was one (1) actual witness who saw the actual confrontation... he drew a diagram of the placement on the concrete sidewalk and indicated that the man all in black (Trayvon) was on top of a man with red on his jacket (Zimmerman) 'ground and pounding' him 'MMA style'

But he changed his story:

A key witness to the Trayvon Martin shooting changed the story he had given Sanford, Fla., police, telling state authorities he was not sure who was screaming during the altercation with George Zimmerman, NBC Dateline confirmed Friday.

The man known as Witness #6 originally told Sanford police Zimmerman cried for help. The witness stuck to his account that he saw Martin, 17, straddling Zimmerman and pinning him to the ground before Martin was shot.

On March 20, according to the Orlando Sentinel, while sitting for a follow-up interview by a Florida Department of Law Enforcement investigator the witness said that he was no longer sure who was calling for help.

"At first, I thought it was the person on the ground, just because, you know, me thinking rationally, if someone was on top, the person on the bottom would be yelling," he said, according to the Sentinel. "I truly can't tell who, after thinking about it, was yelling for help just because it was so dark out on that sidewalk. You can't see a mouth …"

Amanda

As THC can remain in the bloodstream for up to two weeks after it is first consumed

Wrong,
I work in a laboratory and THC will be undetectable in blood within 24 hours for first time users. That is why urine is the preferred specimen to test because it stays in the urine much longer.

http://www.canorml.org/healthfacts/drugtestguide/drugtestdetection.html

The most popular kind of drug test is the urine test, which can detect marijuana for days or weeks after use.

snarky said:

I work in a laboratory and THC will be undetectable in blood within 24 hours for first time users.

One could argue that based on the way Martin's grades were slipping, he might not have been a first-time user. I was looking at this from Marijuanasideeffects.org:

When you ask the question “How long does marijuana stay in your system?” you need to take into account the fact that there is no simple answer to this question. THC (Tetrahydrocannabinol) can stay in a person’s body for as long as 3 to 90 days after smoking or being ingested orally. There are numerous determining factors for how long drug toxins stay in a persons body which vary from person to person, such as the analytical method used, your health, your body weight, metabolism, fluid intake, the type of drug toxin, and the degree of exposure to the drug toxin.

The speed at which marijuana leaves your body depends both on the speed of your metabolism, as well as on the half-life of THC. It’s estimated that THC can have a half-life that ranges anywhere from 1-10 days. It’s almost impossible to find out what that half life is, which means that it is very difficult to use it to calculate how long it will take for all of the THC to leave your body.

The most common period of time is anywhere from 3-30 days, depending on your metabolism and the amount of marijuana that you’ve smoked. This is unfortunate, since it means that while most drug tests can only turn up evidence of other drugs if you’ve been taking the drug within a few days of the drug test, marijuana could still be detected in a urine test up to a month after the last time it is used. If you smoke it occasionally it will remain in your system for up to 10 days. If you smoke marijuana on a regular basis it will stay in your system for as long as 45 days, and if you smoke marijuana at a constant pace, it can stay in the body for 90 days, Marijuana is fat soluble. It stores in the fat cells of the body, the brain, the liver, and the kidneys, in other words the major organs.

lol what a bunch of nutcases on here !! unless your black ...there is no way you can say guilty as charged all you white peeps on here would @!$%# your pants and shoot first and worry bout the law later if you saw a 6ft banger fresh of a batch of lean comin at ya in a dark alley in the middle of the night !! lolol who da @!$%# is goin to let someone bash there head in to a sidewalk ? no matter what the fudge the reason the little dirtbag had for gettin mad and isnt goin to defend themselfs ? one thing ive learned thru-out life is when blacks are involved you can be sure lies are involved so never rush to judgement !!! careful what side you pick you could be the next zimmerman wondering how your fellow spanish countryman left you to the jakals and took the side of a messed up looser over a seemingly normal law abiding citizen !

Here is some additional info on a study that Yale performed.

The plasma concentration of tetrahydrocannabinol
(THC) presents a very fast peak (about 3 to
8 minutes) and then decreases quickly (half-life of approximately
30 minutes). 11-Nor-9-carboxy-9-tetrahydrocannabinol
(THCCOOH) has a much longer half-life, about 20 to 57
hours in occasional users and 3 to 13 days in regular users.
THC is detectable (LOD 1 ng/mL) for approximately 5 hours
in plasma and 10 hours in urine

http://www.labmed.yale.edu/Images/detection%20times%20in%20urine%20rev_tcm45-9313.pdf
Have a great afternoon.

Keen- Despite the name your insight is any thing but keen. I was in a situation years back where a friend was abducted at knifepoint right in front of me. While chasing them down, my friend was able to steer him off the road and I caught up. I punched out the driver's window and pulled the guy out by his collar and in less than 10 seconds he had a broken jaw, busted nose and eye socket without a single mark on me. I also had a classmate in high school killed from ONE PUNCH when he fell and hit his head on a concrete parking barrier. The point is, for you to say that just because there were no marks, there was no assault; or that he couldn't have "ended up in diapers" is not only arrogant, but just plain rediculous. By the way, had he survived the coma, he would have needed constant care for the rest of his life. Obviously "keen insight" is exactly what you lack.

One of the odd parts of this law is that Martin would have been allowed to shoot Zimmerman based upon fearing for his life because Zimmerman was following him.

Gressman--not according to the accounts described on this board. Those who accept Zimmerman's account that the boy was punching him repeatedly MMA style would have to agree that such repeated punching would produce physical evidence on this fists of the puncher. They didn't say he punched him once. They are saying, the boy hit Zimmerman repeatedly--and for it to be MMA style, it would have been with both hands.

Any medical person or lawyer who's worked fights will tell you that as soon as they take a perp into custody, his hands are photographed as evidence.

I don't think anyone believes that boy assaulted anyone. He was being followed by some weird dude and the kid defended himself. Self defense is hardly assault. If I was walking down some dark street and some guy started following me, I'd do what I've been trained to do--turn and kick him in his nuts & knock him down while yelling and screaming. Of course, if he has a gun, there's nothing I can do or could have done anyway.

Point is, if Zimmerman had gone about his business--he wasn't even on watch duty, his own words--Trayvon would have gone home to his dad. There was nothing suspicious about Trayvon to warrant calling the police on him in the first place.

And what the heck difference does it make if Trayvon had smoked a joint a couple of weeks ago? I think someone pumped up on amphetamines & benzos is more likely to behave erratically & aggressively than someone who's puffed on weed. If Zimmerman was taking controlled substances, he shouldn't have even been carrying a weapon.

KeenInsight,

How can you say you don't believe that Martin hit Zimmerman?

Where did Zimmerman's injuries come from if not from Martin? There wasn't time between the shooting and the police arriving for Zimmerman to produce those injuries. And if they were self inflicted, don't you think that would have come out by now?

C'mon man. You have to at least admit that Martin hit Zimmerman, even if you won't concede that Martin started the fight.

(I agree with you on the pot thing. As a teen, Trayvon shouldn't have been smoking it but his marijuana use has no real bearing on this case.)

Keen Insight said:

I think someone pumped up on amphetamines & benzos is more likely to behave erratically & aggressively than someone who's puffed on weed.

I would agree with you, but apparently there's this strange marijuana down there in FL that makes you want to eat the faces off homeless guys...

But seriously, yes, I do agree. When my sister in law baked marijuana laced brownies as a joke and my husband ate one without realizing it, he got very relaxed and lackadaisical, like nothing mattered. That's how we ended up with my nephew's naked mole rat at our house--I accused my sister in law of deliberately doing that so that she could get my hubby to take the hairless rat out of her house.

Amphetamines, on the other hand, are illegal in every country except the US. And one of the side effects is reportedly 'lack of control over behavior' and it only takes a little cooking to turn 'amphetamines' into 'methamphetamine'--which is illegal everywhere.

If Zimmerman was taking controlled substances, he shouldn't have even been carrying a weapon.

As I stated in my post, if he were in my municipality his weapons and permits would have been revoked--and there would have been no question of guilt or not, he'd be in jail on illegal weapons charges!

However, this is FL and I don't know if the laws are different. No one's given a straight answer on whether weapons are to be confiscated upon treatment for psychiatric disorders with controlled substances. I saw something on a FL lawyer's website that said it was, but if this is so, then why in heck has he not been charged already with illegal weapons possession?

Amanda-2017567

I believe that was a different witness.... look... you are using media reports to do this, and that is very misleading.... If you really want to sleuth it.... go to the defense website or another and download ALL the actual discovery, not the BS media interviews.... read it all.... really look at the actual evidence.... then come up with a conclusion...

maybe you will find something I haven't, but if you look at the evidence... evaluate what in that evidence is actually hard fact... then answer the legal question at issue: did Zimmerman START the fight beyond a reasonable doubt...... if you can't say yes... then he's innocent of murder.... unless he actually started the PHYSICAL altercation, it's justifiable homicide.... talking to, following, so called stalking, asking questions of, etc don't count.... did he actually attack T? that's the legal question...

People think Trayvon was this innocent little kid. After all, he was only 17. Don't you people ever read the news? There are LOTS of cases of kids younger than him that have already killed many people. Just being 17 means nothing

The timing on Officer Ayala's report states that Dispatch first alerted the patrolling officers of Zimmerman's suspicious person complaint at 1917 hours (7:17 civilian time.)--that corroborated Officer Smith's report and could also be independently verified by the 911 call tapes. Paramedic Brady declared Martin dead at 1930 hours (7:30) So only thirteen minutes went by from the time the officers were first dispatched to the scene and the time a paramedic declared Trayvon dead. Is that really enough time for everything that Zimmerman said happened, to have actually happened? Zimmerman called 911 about a suspicious person, then per the dispatcher's instructions he stopped following, hangs up on the dispatcher at 19:21.

Between 1921 (Zimmerman's hangup) and 1930 (Martin declared dead by a paramedic), is there enough time for:

1) Zimmerman to return to his vehicle,

2) get jumped from behind by Trayvon, (now one story he reportedly told police was that he was at his vehicle when Martin accosted him but as they were nowhere near his vehicle this is implausible, see explanation below*)

3) punched hard enough to break his nose,

4) had his head slammed into the sidewalk multiple times, at which point he

5) pulled a gun and shot the teen,

6) for the police to search the subdivision to find them in a wooded area between two buildings,

7) for the officers to secure the crime scene,

8) three different officers start trying CPR on Martin until the paramedics get there,

9) the paramedics try to revive him and then declare him dead?

For me the timing doesn't add up!

* If Zimmerman indeed shot the teen after being jumped while trying to reenter his vehicle, why is the crime scene in the middle of a grassy area between two residences identified in the report as 1231 Twin Trees Ln and 2821 Retreat View Cir. and not by Zimmerman's vehicle? Did he shoot the boy, then drag the body to the grassy area? I think the cops would have noticed drag marks and blood, and I also think there wouldn't have been enough time for Zimmerman to have done so. The initial police report says Trayvon is 6'00" and 160, and Zimmerman is listed as 5'09" and no weight is given, but I doubt Zimmerman would have been able to do this in the 9 minute window.

to the trayvon defenders out there:

how many of you, being "chased" by someone and only being a scared 17 year old, would stop running and try and fight???? Not many, I'm thinking!

oldhamletman said:

maybe you will find something I haven't, but if you look at the evidence... evaluate what in that evidence is actually hard fact... then answer the legal question at issue: did Zimmerman START the fight beyond a reasonable doubt...... if you can't say yes... then he's innocent of murder.... unless he actually started the PHYSICAL altercation, it's justifiable homicide.... talking to, following, so called stalking, asking questions of, etc don't count.... did he actually attack T? that's the legal question...

No, Zimmerman did not start the fight beyond reasonable doubt. However, he owned the gun that was used to kill an unarmed person. That's manslaughter. I am firmly in agreement with the original investigator's initial finding: negligent manslaughter--unnecessary homicide to prevent unlawful act. and if it turns out that due to his being treated for psychiatric disorders with controlled substances he was legally obliged to surrender weapons and permits, knew that and did not do so, then I would agree with homicide.

Out of all of the stores I have seen listed I have noticed that one very important fact in the whole case was left out! When Zimmerman first saw Trevon, Zimmerman called the police and the officer on the phone told him to not follow Trevon!

:Immediately after the comment in question, the 911 dispatcher asks Zimmerman, “Are you following him?” To which Zimmerman replies, “Yeah.”The dispatcher tells Zimmerman, “We don’t need you to do that.” Zimmerman acknowledges hearing him, saying, “OK.

I want someone to show me where in the (Stand Your Ground Law) it says it is ok to Follow anyone around! And on top of that Following them around when a police dispatcher tells you not too! Oh and one more thing to add, Neighborhood watch volunteers are trained to be the eyes and ears for police. According to the leader of the national Neighborhood Watch organization, volunteers are not to be armed and they are not to pursue anyone. They are asked to call police if they see or hear something suspicious.

For the people who dont like to do their research before they post on here, this is a release of some of the call:

Some of the first words Zimmerman said to the 911 dispatcher were: “… there’s a real suspicious guy … the guy looks like he’s up to no good or he’s on drugs or something … it’s raining and he’s just walking around looking about … he looks black …”

Asked what he was wearing Zimmerman said, “A dark hoodie,” then said “Now he’s staring at me … now he’s coming toward me … he’s got his hands in his waist band … and he’s a black male … something’s wrong with him … he’s coming to check me out … I don’t know what his deal is …”

The 911 dispatcher says, “We’ve got him on the wire … let me know if the guy does anything else.”

Zimmerman said, “These @!$%#s, they always get away … he’s running.”

Seconds later he speaks something under his breath – HLN’s Nancy Grace played the recording Monday evening and said she could clearly hear the words “F-ing coons.”

Amanda-2017567

No, Zimmerman did not start the fight beyond reasonable doubt. However, he owned the gun that was used to kill an unarmed person. That's manslaughter. I am firmly in agreement with the original investigator's initial finding: negligent manslaughter--unnecessary homicide to prevent unlawful act. and if it turns out that due to his being treated for psychiatric disorders with controlled substances he was legally obliged to surrender weapons and permits, knew that and did not do so, then I would agree with homicide.
----------------------------------

you are very wrong on both of your major points....

In Florida and almost all other states, it's allowable to kill anyone, armed or not, who attacks you with intent to do great bodily harm or death (among a bunch of other reasons)... the original investigator was reaching to say the least which is why he was overruled until a month later when this became a race thing in an election year.

Also in Florida, a person does not need to surrender a concealed weapon permit simply for seeking mental health treatment or using a controlled substance... no one is obliged to surrender weapons or a concealed weapon permit unless ordered to by a court...

Zimmerman was completely, legally in possession of a weapon or believe me he would be looking at a bunch of other charges already because the state is looking to get him any way they can.

You admitted it.... No, Zimmerman didn't start the fight beyond a reasonable doubt..... that's checkmate.

Tim Mock

Neither a police officer nor the 911 dispatcher who is not a police officer (who Zimmerman was speaking to) has the power to order someone to not do something. They can advise, as in "we don't need you to do that" but they can't order. We don't live in Nazi Germany, you don't have to do anything a police officer tells you to, you may get arrested or shot if you are breaking a law, but you don't have to take orders.

Stand Your Ground has to do with permissible use of force given a threat to someone or a 3rd party in areas other than your home or place of business.... it has nothing to do with following someone... following someone is not illegal and it's not a threat.

Nor is it illegal to ignore the suggestions of Neighborhood watch.

Z saw T. The neighborhood had been burglarized numerous times. He called and reported it. It sounds like he wanted to make sure he could could point out where T had gone. I'm sure suspicious people reported to police often get away before police show up so Z wanted to try to keep that from happening so he followed. 911 said they didn't need him to do that and he said OK and did it anyway.

None of that adds up to an assault on T that would have justified ground and pounding Z.

and believe me, if any of those things you brought up were actually illegal... Z'd be looking at charges....

oldhamletman said:

Z'd be looking at charges....

Are you serious? GZ has been charged with 2nd Degree Murder!! Geez - where have you been?

following someone is not illegal and it's not a threat.

Tell that to all the kids that have been abducted and killed in this country including Trayvon Martin.

What a weird a$$ post!!

CONCERNED CITIZEN-5861507

you are mentally challenged or a troll or both, huh?

charges meaning for the things discussed in the post.... following someone is not a threat in the legal context.....

Tim Mock,

Did you listen to the un-edited tape for yourself? You can find it on wikipedia if you haven't. I'll break it down for you:

Zimmerman:S#$%, He(Trayvon) is running.

Dispatcher: Which way is he going?

(rustling noises, a car door opening and closing, heavy breathing)

Zimmerman describes where he is and what Trayvon is doing.

Dispatcher: Are you following him?

Z: Yeah.

D: Okay. We don't need you to do that.

(heavy breathing slows, stops)

Z: He ran.

Now, do you think that Zimmerman's cardiovascular shape suddenly improved to an extent that he no longer had to breath heavy while running and his phone's software got an upgrade that was suddenly able to cancel out the sounds of movement? Or do you think that Zimmerman stopped running and lost sight of Trayvon (as Zimmerman himself stated to the dispatcher about 30 seconds later)?

Now think about this, Zimmerman's police call ended at 17:13:44. The first 911 came in at 17:16:11. That means for Zimmerman to have initiated the confrontation he would have had to, in 2 minutes and 33 second:

1. Locate Trayvon (who he had lost sight of 1:30 earlier).

2. Catch up to Trayvon (who had a head start).

3. Initiate the actual conflict.

4. Have it escalate to the point that someone thinks they should call 911

That's a lot to happen in 2:33.

Is it maybe at least possible that Trayvon did circle back while Zimmerman was walking back to his truck, like he always said?

Yep - Steve that's the recorded version - kinda, you seemed to have left a few sentences out - but anyway - the reenactment version and the Hannity interview are quite different and they are all told by GZ. So which story do you believe?

I believe the recorded version, which shows Zimmerman heeding the dispatcher and not following.

-Scubasteve-

This is a comment from back at your #1.37 comment.

There's no "proof" which person started the physical altercation other than the testimony of a PROVEN liar. Zimmerman is the ONLY one who claims Martin started it. For all we know Martin retaliated only because he was grabbed by Zimmerman. That would be cause to hit back for anyone. But, if that was what happened then self defense isn't applicable for Zimmerman. Regardless if he was losing the ensuing fight or not.

Hey scubasteve - actually all the versions have been recorded and all were spoken by GZ. Also, if he did not follow - how did he end up so far away from his vehicle? Just curious - why do you believe that one account over the others?

Stephen Nichols,

If it can be proved that Zimmerman struck or grabbed first, then I'd agree with you. But, as you (and the police) stated, there is no proof.

Since Zimmerman is considered innocent until proven guilty, the burden of proof falls on the prosecution to prove that Zimmerman did indeed start it. The defense merely has to establish a reasonable doubt that Trayvon could have initiated the fight.

Concerned Citizen,

I believe the account from the original recorded police call because Zimmerman had no reason to lie. He hadn't met or shot Trayvon at that point.

the basic nature of this entire discussion is exactly what the legal case is going to be about:

- Team Z / the Defense is saying that there is no proof that Z STARTED the physical confrontation, thus the use of force in light of a witness seeing T on top of Z beating him was justified

- Team T / the Prosecution is trying to build a case of circumstantial evidence that A leads to B leads to C that T had a right to be beating Z out of self defense

the problem is, there is no evidence that T was attacked by Z

in fact common sense 101 says that it's very unlikely a roly poly out of shape guy ran down a full grown teen football player and started an altercation... that is unless T wanted to have the fight.

I guess its hard for some to believe that a athletic guy with tatts, grills, suspensions from school for pot burglary tools and stolen jewelry, and twitter account about smacking girls and beating down bus drivers... might want to give a nosy out of shape neighborhood watch guy a beating for having the nerve to look at or follow him....

at the end of the day... you can't ground and pound someone and expect that they won't fear for their life and defend themselves...

In the link click>/the-truth-about-george-zimmermans-kel-tec-pf-9/----is this bit of information--

The PF-9 tends to get caught-up in clothing when a shooter tries to remove it in a hurry.

Could George perhaps not have been looking down because he could not find his cellphone in his pant pocket.......but had to look down to untangle his gun from his clothing? Might he, in fact, have been trying to grab his gun from his holster which was in his waistband at his hip?

Just why did George need to look down at his pocket for his cellphone?? A person can discover if a cellphone is in his pocket without having to look down! You can feel by touch if your cellphone is in a pocket or not.

George pursued Trayvon from Frank Taaffe's house on to the clubhouse where security camera's picked up George looking for Trayvon with his flashlight then returned to his vehicle and drove on TTL past the mailboxes, made a U-turn and watched Trayon.

Trayvon told Deedee that a creepy guy was following him. The fact that Trayvon called George creepy reveals the concern that Trayvon had of this suspicious pursuer.

George still did not stop following Trayvon.

When Trayvon ran away up on to a sidewalk inaccessible to vehicles in order to create distance between himself and George in his car......George IMMEDIATELY exited his silver Ridgeline right after telling the dispatcher, "He's running."

Let's now consider the attitude George had toward Trayvon.

What George said to the dispatcher at that moment says it all---

These a$$h@les.....They always get away.

Fu@k!ng goons.

This is the mindset that was driving George as he commenced his chase of Trayvon.

The dispatcher, hearing George running, asked George....."Are you following him?'

George replied, "Yes".

Any normal person including Trayvon would be worried and on high alert in such a situation AND feel threatened by being pursued by an unknown stranger.

Thus, when the two did meet up, Trayvon was already feeling defensive toward this creepy George.

Deedee has stated that she heard Trayvon ask George, "Why are you following me?"

This would have been an ideal time for George to have simply identified himself as a member of Neighborhood Watch.

Did George identify himself as such. The answer is NO.

This leads me to conclude that Trayvon's punch to George's nose was an act of self defense against a creepy and potentially dangerous stranger.......especially when Trayvon at that moment saw George reaching for something in the area (below) of George's waistband.

I truly think that George reaching for his cellphone in his pant pocket alarmed Trayvon.........especially since George did not identify himself......but merely answered Trayvon's question with, "What are you doing here?"

Click> A Walk With Marinade Dave - YouTube

Click>A Walk With Marinade Dave, Part Deux - YouTube

Click> A Walk With Marinade Dave, The Conclusion - YouTube

Click> Zimmerman: LLMPapa and Marinade Dave Are Back in the House ...

.

CLICK> New Improved George Zimmerman Re-enactment vs. The World

CLICK> PROOF George Zimmerman Stalked, Chased, and Murdered Trayvon Martin!!!

Click> George Zimmerman - R@TL walk through w/ PD dispatch call ...

.

click> He Yelled Out For Help - YouTube -----this link points out where George Zimmerman is actually recorded slipping up and saying that Trayvon Martin was screaming for help!

gangbanger, wow he was not ever linked to any gangs but zimmerman was arrested for beating up a cop!!!!!

It's sad that this boy was killed--a child whose life was taken from him because someone thought he looked suspicious. Now his parents have to suffer their son's reputation being torn to shreds as well. Sickening. The person who shot him was the one with the criminal record.

please inform us reader the proof that he was in a gang? Maybe he should have been and one of his gangbanging buddies would have defended him and Zimmerman would have been stretched out on the ground right beside him. Then you would have something to talk about, but for right now, shut up and grow up.

KeenInsight, I agree and all the people that are defending George's action have yet to speak on his criminal past. I wonder why? This is what happens when people are looking at thing/issues with rose colored glasses.

Anyone here read the Florida Laws on this....you opinion means jack if it fell within the law!

what does a that have to do with what happened?

panhandletown, the people who wrote the SYG law have said it would not apply in the Zimmerman case.

Missexcrement, hola!

Zimm walks.

You can call me names, and make predictions, but that does not change that what I posted is a fact.

Misscreant

"the people who wrote the SYG law have said it would not apply in the Zimmerman case"

The way the law was written dosen't reflect that. More care should have gone into the language of the law.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57401619-504083/author-of-stand-your-ground-law-george-zimmerman-should-probably-be-arrested-for-killing-trayvon-martin/

How the law was/is written is one thing...

How the courts interpret it is what really matters, though.

The authors could have meant one thing and say "x was the goal, not this" but the what the court decides is what sets the meaning of the wording.

Our banging Mrs Dennis

@Lenora... Trayvon was a probationary member for being a gang banger.. lets see... Stealing, selling drugs, felony assault.. You know... that and other stuff you have to prove to be a good member in standing.

@Joey.... all ya have to say is..... "it all depends on the meaning of IS" (1)....

.

.

(1) W. J. Clinton.

So sad to see so many people in this country still blantantly profiling. A kids walking to a condo...so he's "a gangbanger, a welfare taker, a thug, he deserved to be shot etc." AMAZING.

A man follows him and its getting dark and rainy. The kid see's this guy following him and tries to walk away. He runs aittle, talking on the phone to a friend. The guy is still following. Why? The guy confronts him. I'd try to hit him too. He has a GUN. Jesus, a guy with gun following him home.

The picture shown in the article is the man who Supposedly had his head all bashed in with broken nose after a bloody fight and was in fear of his life from this kid he followed and confronted. The facts, without profiled opinions, tell it all. Zimmerman belongs in jail.

Back east said:

Trayvon was a probationary member for being a gang banger.. lets see... Stealing, selling drugs, felony assault..

Martin had no criminal record, juvenile or adult, hence you cannot prove 'felony assault.'.

'Theft' at his school was never proven, as the items of feminine jewelry found in his backpack were never identified as stolen and no one stepped forth to claim the items as theirs.

There is no evidence that he 'sold' drugs--we know he ingested/consumed marijuana (due to the presence of trace amounts being in his system at time of autopsy) but this is not, in itself,evidence that he distributed.

Martin WAS NOT A BOY in the eyes of the law! If Martin would had had a gun, and would had gone into a Convience Store and robbed it, and murdered the teller, he would had been proscecuted as an adult!

that's why some security gaurds should not be carrying guns. there not trained as people belive they are. yet if children are taught to be soldiers at young age,for politics, ? his security management office need to held in the public eye and should insurence be required for those who carry weapons . loss of life in this instance needs to be adressed,

Martin WAS NOT A BOY in the eyes of the law! If Martin would had had a gun, and would had gone into a Convience Store and robbed it, and murdered the teller, he would had been proscecuted as an adult!

Whole lotta "woulds and ifs" in that statement. Since none of that happened, at any point in time, we can assume you are just practicing your fiction writing skills. Don't give up your day job.

And Martin, under the law, was a juvenile. He was not an adult.

try again doc. 16 and 17 year olds are tried as adults all the time

To be tried as an adult if one is under eighteen requires going through various hearings and other hoops of law. A prosecutor can't just magically decide to try a minor as an adult without doing these things, and having a judge decide if that is appropriate.

Under the law, if you are under eighteen, you are a minor, a child, not an adult.

Yeah, the only time whites riot is when their hockey or local college basketball team looses and the campus bars close early. Come to think of it, it has been nearly six months since the last European soccer riot; I guess all the hooligans migrated down south to Greece to help throw Yoplait at the police.

Fight the power, brother man, fight the power!

We dont have riots here in the south....they get handled swiftly with great intensity...

Riots??......oh...I thought They were called bbq's...cause if it were called a job fair no one would show up.

There will be no riots. Please stop being so racist.

agreed, panhandle...lot's o' hunters down here...they have weapons and know how to use them well

riots are a ghetto phenomenon

there will be riots across the country gaurandamnteed

@Joe......Not to smart for only 13% of the population, besides they will run out of bullets in the first hour and still not hit anything.....Keep holding that pistol sideways cause it makes you sooooo cooool....LMAO

You racist idiots. The issue of race is inevitable, but you all are being totally disrespectful and ignorant.

Picture this: YOUR unarmed son is followed by a man with a gun. He is shot and KILLED because he allegedly attacked someone. So tell me, would you feel your son's death was justified? White, Black, Asian whatever he is. Would you feel your son's death was justified? This is someone's child. It could've very well been yours. Regardless of the activities your son was involved in, would you feel his death was justified? Remove the race of your son and imagine this. Seems like your stand on the judicial system would take a turn if you were sitting in Trayvon's parents' seats in that courtroom.

Nothing worse than a bunch of witless racists trying to appear witty. Oh, how they do embarrass themselves, and are so witless, in fact, that they don't even see that they embarrass themselves.

It does not matter how the parents feel they do not make the law.

It is good that time has passed as you can see there are not as many knee jerk reactions. People realize Zimmerman is innocent but you still have to have a trial and ruin his life to keep from burning down the town.

Zimmerman will go free and I hope he sues the Martin Family,Obama and the rest of the race promoting cronies. It is a shame when you have people keep race alive and make a living off of it.

It does not matter how the parents feel they do not make the law.

It doesn't matter how the parents feel? Really? Really? Are you truly that lacking in empathy that you believe it does not matter how Trayvon's parents feel?

What about George's parents? Are their feelings to be considered? Do their feelings matter at all?

The law says that when you chase down a kid who was running away from you, and then shoot and kill that kid, you are guilty of 2nd degree murder. Deal with it.

Joe-3144156

there will be riots across the country gaurandamnteed

Really? You're certain of that? Would you care to place a sizeable monetary wager on your certainty?

Hey DOCJT - same old same old from the Zimbeciles!! UNBELIEVABLE!!! No empathy, no sympathy - just flat out racism at its worst! I hope they all remember KARMA is one bad mama when their glass houses break into jagged pieces.

I am not without empathy but in the court room law rules not emotions. Yes Doc I will bet that when/if he is found not guilty there will be riots.

TrayGone 0

Zimmerman 1

a Latino on trial in Central Florida where we are 50% Latino in many areas....just takes one and he walks.

News flash!!! You can shoot people when they attack you! Like skittles did.

Can you hit people when they follow you at night? You try to get away but they pursue and they have a gun. Can you hit them?

Or do you submit to a stranger who seems menacing?

No Julea, you can NOT hit them... That's the point. You can yell and scream all you want. You have to call the law and say that you are being followed, NOT physically attack the other party. Zimmerman was not initially arrested because he was the one that called the law to report suspicious activity. Both of them could have stood in the middle of the street and screamed at each other until the police showed up. Trayvon could have called the law. The cops would have came up on Trayvon and Zimmerman both on cell phones talking to the police dispatcher saying, "There is a suspicious looking black guy in the neighborhood!" and "There is this creepy ass Puerto Rican dude following me!" Then the whole thing would have been sorted out. Trayvon would have been escorted home by the police and Zimmerman would have been told to go home. For whatever reason, Trayvon broke bad and Zimmerman pulled his card. He'd be guilty of Manslaughter at most.

That was good Alan. I find that Florida runs on very different fuel than the rest of the country. Killing kids and walking seems to be an okay thing in that state. They (the accused killers) live in hiding and on who's money? Donations?? Casey, where are you now??

@ Fran

Only if it was proven he committed felony assault.

Evidence doesn't support that Trayvon Martin committed felony assault on George Zimmerman, nor any assault what so ever.

Really so what about the injuries and what the police said?

MN...Zimm walked up to TM and started harassing him. If he had left him alone as the phone guy instructed him there would have been no crime. TM didn't walk up to Zimm and start this. If some A-hole started questioning you while you're walking home, minding your own business, would just say,"Oh excuse me, am I disturbing your world? If so, shove it buddy". Free speech goes both ways dud(e).

You know it absolutely amazes me that we teach our children to stay away from strangers. We teach them to run, scream and then if nothing else works to fight with all their might to get away. That goes for teenagers too!! Trayvon Martin did all the above - run, scream and try to get away from this lunatic following him first in a vehicle and then on foot. Trayvon have every right to be afraid of this idiot and every right to defend himself. GZ DID NOT identify himself nor try to diffuse the situation. Teenagers disappear in this country every day! Hell - as a grown woman I would be afraid of some lunatic following me all over the neighborhood. Those people like ScubaSteve that say

You don't have to identify yourself. I could walk up to anyone on the street and say "What the heck are you doing here?"

and then act like this is accepted behavior that would not cause some kind of confrontation, obviously live in an alternate reality. Don't come to my neighborhood cause we don't need your type harassing our teenagers nor will we stand for it.

Really so what about the injuries and what the police said?

The injuries and documented notes from both the EMS and the PA seen in the physician's office the next day do not list or described any injuries consistent with having one's head repeatedly and forcefully banged against a concrete surface, nor with repeatedly being punched in the face, and having one's mouth and nose forcefully covered in the act of "smothering". The absence of expected injuries that would be readily observable on physical examination is very damning to George's case. Again, even detective Serino mentions this to George 3rd recorded interview session, and the medical documentation further substantiates the lack of injuries that would be expected from George's explicit description. The police reports do not indicate any thing that could be interpreted as being consistent with George's descriptions, either. Further, forensic indicates that the only blood or human DNA found on Trayvon's hands came from a fingernail scraping on his right hand, and it was found to be only blood and DNA from Trayvon himself. Had he repeatedly punched George in the face, there would have been DNA transfer from George to his hands. Had he covered George's nose and mouth as George struggled to breath, DNA from George would have been transferred to the palms of Trayvon's hands. Therefore, forensic evidence does not support George's claim simply through the lack of any evidence of the "assault" occurring in the many different ways George has described it. Additionally, there was no bruising of Trayvon's knuckles, area between the knuckles, or the back of the hands; no contusions, no swelling, either significant or insignificant, no abrasions save a small area between the first and second knuckle of the little finger. Therefore, lack of expected injuries and/or evidence of "punching" discounts George's claim of being "repeatedly punched in the face. Further, no evidence of DNA from George Zimmerman on the lower cuff portion of Trayvon Martin's sweatshirt. So, quite simply, there is no evidence to support George's claims that he was repeatedly punched in the face, smothered with both hands, and had his head repeatedly slammed into the concrete by Trayvon Martin.

Lenny, have you read his twitter account or followed his school records?

This is exactly what is wrong with the World we live in with comments and thoughts like this. If you have these same attitudes then you are full of hatred, bigotry and a poor excuse for a human being. Look in a mirror and you will see exactly who you are. A sad person who will never make the World a better place to live in. A big fat Zero!

Alan = post police

Let he who is without sin Alan....let he......

@Lenny12

Most people would consider assaulting someone who hasnt laid a hand on you, regardless of the circumstance, as "thug like" behavior.

Hmmm Panhandletown,

Let's just bring religious rhetoric into it. I'm not the one being judged by a Jury or your "God". I'm making the simplest statement of "knowing right from wrong". Post Police? Anyone with a brain can see a person that is full of BS and bigotry as seen by some folks on here. Are you a priest or something and preaching forgive them "They know what what they do or say?" So you are saying this according to your statements above "Since Trayvon skipped school, smoked some weed the past week and he was walking home from a store breaking NO law whatsoever and some wanna be rent o cop with a gun "Thought he was doing something wrong", Plus was TOLD not to pursue ends up killing an unarmed person. That is okay with you? I am far from perfect to be sure but you are completely biased to be sure if not a lot of other things. Two things. Don't bring Religion or Politics into your posts. This is about a person being accountable for their own actions, period.

im thinking hollywood has smoked to many turds

maybe he should try injecting turds instead

what a dumbass comment

and man do i see alot of them

tells me 90% prejudice in the usa

pretty fu cking sad

say592

@Lenny12

Most people would consider assaulting someone who hasnt laid a hand on you, regardless of the circumstance, as "thug like" behavior.

I'd say that pretty much describes what 6 feet 200 pound Thugvon did

...tried to give someone a "beat down" and got his stupid thug-azz killed

God bless George Zimmerman...may the road rise to meet him

Wow, here we go again.

George Zimmerman - A man concerned about the safety of his neighborhood. Carrying a gun, legally, without the intention of killing anyone. His neighborhood has had a rash of recent burglaries!!!!!!!!!!

Trayvon Martin - A 17 year old punk with no sense, or respect for his elders. Living the Rap dream, no limit niggaz style.

Look people, unlike you I am not going off some namby pamby PC BS because I can't think for myself. I analyzed the available facts to come to my conclusion. There is nothing RACE related involved. It's how each party acted that determined their fate.

READ THIS SLOWLY, LET IT SINK IN. George Zimmerman, concerned about his neighborhoods safety (we need people like that) saw a suspicious person in his recently burglarized neighborhood. He was suspicious because HE WAS WALKING SLOWLY IN THE RAIN, LOOKING INTO GARAGES as if he was casing the houses. AS I said there were recent burglaries from garages, car break ins etc.

THAT's why George followed him, he was concerned, and rightfully so. I have said it a million times before and I will say it again. Trayvon should have stayed his course, if indeed he was innocently walking home. NOT TAKE OFF RUNNING!!!! Anyone with half a brain knows no one is trying to kid nap you if you are 6 ft tall. He took off running, hid, then attacked !!! Just like someone WHO WAS there up to no good would have done!!!!!!!!!!!

Trayvon should have kept walking, and if need be asked George "can I help you sir?" And explain that he is just walking home. It's ALL in the way Trayvon handled it. He was killed in self defense because of his own actions.

TIME SERVED! Have a nice life George. You are welcome to live in my neighborhood!

Hollywood,

Your statement alone "Treyvon acted like a thug, and got treated like one. That's how no limit niggaz roll" is true bigotry at best if not totally racist in nature. You left out so many facts one being "HE WAS TOLD NOT TO, NOT TO PURSUE" so what do you not get in that order alone? So if a car is following you and you are on the phone with gf and both worried as hell, you just might run too. We are not sure if that's what he did. We know one thing for sure that he carried NO weapon and he had committed NO crime other then walking home. Give me one shred of any proof that he had committed a crime for George to be tracking him and again if you can read and comprehend "DO NOT PURSUE", those simple instructions not followed ended up with a death. You are an excuse maker for those who are accountable for their own actions. Again your comment above and others show exactly what kind of person you are in life. Demented and full of hatred toward others.

Hollywood said:

Trayvon should have kept walking, and if need be asked George "can I help you sir?" And explain that he is just walking home. It's ALL in the way Trayvon handled it. He was killed in self defense because of his own actions.

George Zimmerman himself admits that when he walked up and asked Martin what he was doing, Zimmerman never identified himself as a member of the neighborhood watch. Had he done that Martin might still be alive.

Both Zimmerman's and Martin's actions contributed to the tragedy that night. However, seventeen year olds act irrationally; and Zimmerman, as the adult in the situation, had the greater responsibility to try to avoid escalating confrontation and one of the simplest and most direct ways to have attempted to do so as to identify himself as neighborhood watch.

Lenny, have you read his twitter account or followed his school records?

You mean the social media accounts that were hacked by racists and posts and photoshopped pictures posted in a attempt to create something that was not there? And, his school records have not been released. So you have not followed them, either, other than to know his teachers described him as an A-B student with a bright future, well liked, and non-aggressive.

If George Zimmerman was acting in a law abiding way, why do you have to keep making crap up to defend him? The evidence should do the trick, if this is such a clear cut case of self defense. Oops! Evidence doesn't help George. It all points to his guilt.

"We don't need you to do that" is what the police said. He didn't do anything wrong. Now hackers got into Treyvons account, where do you people come up with this stuff? Wow, people. ATTENTION 17 year old thugs: Don't attack adults!!!!!! It will help you not get shot.

Alan, you make no sense. Are you actually reading what I am writing? We will all just agree to disagree at this point. I want to avoid calling you the wierdo's and morons that you are.

If Trayvon was so tuff as to attack a grown man at night (un provoked). Why wasn't he tough enough to keep on "innocently" walking home? He was up to something!! At the very least he was in a hurry to attack someone - FACT! THE FACTS DON'T ADD UP. Get it through your thick skulls!

Maybe if black youth stopped glorifying and imitating the 'thug' lifestyle, they would not be treated like thugs.

Identification and all that doesn't matter. Neither Zimmerman nor Trayvon were certified law enforcement agents, so they had no obligation to identify themselves to one another... It would have been nice, but not required. Yes, call it racism, bigotry, profiling, or whatever else you want to label it as; Trayvon portrayed a thug lifestyle as the majority of teenage black boys do, especially in FL. It is a cultural norm. Rap music, which easily influences young minds, doesn't exactly tell you to act civil, get an education, a good job, and a 401K. It's about being hard and not being punked by or take sh*t from anyone. I know all about it, I have stacks of letters from my homeboys in prison... IN FLORIDA. Hell, one of my best friends was Clay County's Most Wanted, and he's a white guy. I've chilled with these fools, I've seen people get jumped, beaten with bats and stabbed, I've seen people get guns stuck in their face over a petty arguement. Being a thug has nothing to do with race it's a lifestyle. Trayvon portrayed a boy from the hood and Zimmerman pulled his card.

Dinath said:

Neither Zimmerman nor Trayvon were certified law enforcement agents, so they had no obligation to identify themselves to one another...

Exactly. Martin did not have to identify himself to Zimmerman, nor did he have any obligation to inform him of what he was doing or where he was going.

And as Zimmerman was not a law enforcement agent, the only thing he as a citizen was obliged to do was report suspicious activity. He was not obligated to confront or demand that this other person identify himself and what he was doing there. I have a neighborhood watch program in my neighborhood, and they stick to the observe and report rule.

I practice Kummooyeh--Korean sword disciplines. When we first moved into the neighborhood a year ago and took my swords out to the field beside the neighborhood church to practice, I was accosted by a cop who said he got a report about a crazy kid waving a sword.

I explained (and demonstrated) to him that it was a form of martial arts, I practiced, and I wasn't hurting anyone and the swords were not sharpened. I asked the cop if it was going to be a problem, should I not practice outside? He said that wasn't necessary, I was free to do as I liked just to not openly threaten someone with the swords.

So a couple weeks later a different cop stops me while I'm practicing and says he got a call from the neighborhood watch about a crazy kid waving a sword. Again, I explained the situation and demoed the forms. He told me the same thing; its fine just don't threaten anyone.

Three weeks late I see someone standing off to the side of the field watching me practice and he's on his cellphone. I sheathed my sword and waited, thinking it's another cop and I have to explain again. This time it was the neighborhood watch captain who had been hearing reports from the other volunteers about a crazy person (hey, at least they didn't call me a kid this time, I'm in my freakin' 30's) waving a sword, and then he saw me but this time when he called 911 the dispatcher told him it's already been investigated, I was harmless and if he would wait they would send an officer out to make an official introduction.

So I'm standing there watching him, he stands there watching me, neither one of us has the guts to approach each other. My sword still sheathed but I can draw it in a moment if I have to, and I don’t know if he was packing (conceal isn’t allowed in my state) but he apparently wasn’t coming anywhere near my katana. Then a cop drives up, talks him, walks over to me, then waves the guy over and introduces me to the neighborhood watch captain. So I explain, for the third time, who I am and what I'm doing and since then I have had no further trouble with either the neighborhood watch, or the police, although they did tell me if I have sharpened swords leave them at home (my practice weapons are not sharpened).

That, in my opinion, is how a neighborhood watch is SUPPOSED to be run! Watch, observe, report, and let the cops deal with issues!

Amanda, you weren't running!!

Bollywood...."legally carrying a gun"?

In direct violation of the NHW....of which he was the captain of.

Sad when GZ can't even follow his own rules.

This is par for the course. In a criminal trial the longer it takes to go to trial is generally see as an advantage for the defendent.

So sad. All we can hope for as a country is that the law works the same for everyone. Good luck finding a fair Jury. When both sides are heard then we can make our opinions and "judgments " intelligently.

Way too much spin to believe the Media about anything in this case.

What is taking so long is that the defense attorney is wasting time concentrating on extraneous issues like Martin's school records and making speeches at 2nd Amendment rallies, and begging for funds instead of using the evidence to exonerate his client. Oh, wait...there is no evidence to exonerate his client. That is why he is trying to hard to get people to look at issues completely unrelated.

Lenora I agree with everything you said except. He doesn't need a hug because what he said about "thug". Just plain and simple slug will do it.

How do you people get that I am racist? You are complete idiots! I would say the same thing if Trayvon where white and behaved the way he did, and GZ was black and behaved the way he did.

I judge people based on their actions, and facts, not skin color. You people are complete clowns. Check Alan out saying he would slug me. You sound like Trayvon, and yes you would get shot just like him for being a double digit I.Q idiot who can't manage to walk home without getting in a fight.

Call it racism, bigotry, profiling, or whatever else you want to label it as; Trayvon portrayed a thug lifestyle as the majority of teenage black boys do, especially in FL. It is a cultural norm. Rap music, which easily influences young minds, doesn't exactly tell you to act civil, get an education, a good job, and a 401K. It's about being hard and not being punked by or take sh*t from anyone. I know all about it, I have stacks of letters from my homeboys in prison... IN FLORIDA. Hell, one of my best friends was Clay County's Most Wanted, and he's a white guy. I've chilled with these fools, I've seen people get jumped, beaten with bats and stabbed, I've seen people get guns stuck in their face over a petty arguement. Being a thug has nothing to do with race it's a lifestyle. Trayvon portrayed a boy from the hood and Zimmerman pulled his card.

As a neighborhood watch person, he did not have authority to carry a gun (permit or not). If there were no gun, this tragedy would not have occurred.

Tooelemom, the story would have been different. An unknown black male about 6' 170lbs beat a Neighborhood crime watch just shortly after he called 911.

LMAO.......you keep believing that amigo

Or the courts follow the law and he walks of into the sunset.....We had Casey Anthony remember....States attorney blew that case...

If you are going to attempt to compare cases, try using a comparison that has some validity in similarity.

You're really not a very deep thinker, are you?

DOCJT - apparently YOU are not the big thinker.

This trial is almost EXACTLY like the Casey Anthony trial.

In both cases the DA bowed to political pressure and got an indictment for a charge that there was NO EVIDENCE to support. In Anthony's case, 1st Degree Murder. In Zimmerman's case, 2nd Degree Murder.

If the DA for Anthony had been willing to settle for Manslaughter, it would have been a lock. Instead they spent the majority of the trial trying to establish the proof necessary for 1st Degree Murder, and they lost the whole thing.

Likewise, Zimmerman is guilty of manslaughter. Nobody on EITHER side of the debate is arguing that he didn't kill Martin. Boom, manslaughter proved - now the burden is on the defense to prove that Stand Your Ground applies.

Instead, the prosecutor is going to have to prove that Zimmerman killed Martin, "by an act imminently dangerous to another and evincing a depraved mind showing no regard for human life." There is insufficient evidence for such a charge, the prosecutor is going to just waste trial time trying to prove it, and in the end Zimmerman is just going to walk - just like Anthony.

There are absolutely NO similarities to this case and the Anthony case. Circumstances are entirely different.

Uh, the prosecutor does not have to prove that Zimmerman killed Martin. Zimmerman has already admitted that he killed Martin, well over 10 documented times now.

I do hope you don't have your heart set on becoming a lawyer.

nope just to keep earning like one ;)

DOCJT

you are exactly right, some people keep forgetting that there is a difference between 1st and 2nd degree type charged cases.

they dont seem to get that 1st degree law states in laymen terms that the person charged DID KILL THE PERSON while the 2nd degree charge, in laymen terms states that the person charged IS RESPONSIBLE for the killing of a person.

big difference.

The American justice system is anything but speedy or efficient, but it is confusing.

Or, in this case, to try to make one appear magically out of thin air.

CoTex....were you there buddy???? You sure are going to be crying in your TAB soda when Zimm walks....

If anything, the opposite would happen. If he loses, people will freak out that it will open the door for stronger gun control legislation and there will be a run on guns and ammo.

This case doesn't have anything to do with the NRA. Zimmerman is supposed to be a registered Democrap so I'm sure he doesn't belong to the NRA. Isn't that supposed to be the rhetoric?

Boy, do the NRA freaks come out of the woodwork when the truth about their heros is brought up. LOL

Typical LIEberal news bias....why was TrayGones picture from when he was 9 shown for months?

again.....nobody can respond to this.....it was blatant and well thought out what the media did!

panhandletown.....

again.....nobody can respond to this.....it was blatant and well thought out what the media did!

...and what they continue to do

paint thugvon as some sort of saint and poor George as a monster

if there are riots and people get hurt when Zim walks, they need to be held accountable

Quite frankly, the loss of racists such as yourself are a benefit to society. Just saying.

DOCJT

Quite frankly, the loss of racists such as yourself are a benefit to society. Just saying.

you must be referring to racists such as Jesse jackson and Al Sharpton

...the sooner they are gone, the better

Try again. I was referring to people such as yourselves. But I understand why you didn't grasp that. Racists never seen their own racism, just as crazy people always insist, "I'm not crazy...it's everyone else that's crazy." Well known and often observed clinical phenomenon. Perhaps you should take the time to be evaluated.

10 paces, turn, and FIRE!!! or fastest draw?

exactly!

WILL SOMEONE PLEASE CALL AL AND JESSE !!!!!!

You can call them Ricky Ricardo, but 1st you have to take that pillow case off your head or turn it around. (FYI - the holes for the eyes go in the front, not the back). Viva Fidel - be-yotch

This irriates me. I live by Chicago, and I get really angry when people who don't live here, who don't live anywhere near here, trot out Chicago's problems and tragedies for their own purposes. Trust me, there is plenty of outcry and anguish about what is occuring here.

but you can pick on in central florida???????

Pot, meet kettle!

I'm not picking on Central Florida. I have not said on bad thing about Florida, or Sanford. I am discussing a particular legal case, not generalizing an entire area.

I'm saddened that our locall case gets 99.9% of the national attention while people are being killed right and left in other cities but it is not considered "news worthy" because they are not trumpet up racial situations....this event here is being played out like a soap opera because the media has decide along with other "leaders" local and national that there is a ton of moneyto be made and is currently being made! It also needs to be kept in the news so that we don't pay attention to larger national issues....THAT is what bothers me.

Don't forget the chicken bbq and the FREE Obama phones......lmao....

I came across an article last night about an incident where two urban youths jumped a random guy walking home as part of a game they came up with because they were bored. Turns out the guy had a knife. One ended up dead and the other ended up in critical condition. Now there is a facebook page in "loving memory" of the one that died and the family is screaming for justice. You attack someone, wind up dead and you're somehow the victim? Gooby, please. This didn't get national attention that I am aware of and it was unclear as to the race of the guy walking home from work that had the knife. Regardless, the lesson I take away from incidents like these is "don't fight strangers because you never know what weapon they might be carrying."

Zimmerman did not pull his gun until Trayvon was trying to take it from him

No evidence to support that. You really should not believe everything the KKK tells you.

In fact, since it has already been proven that Trayvon Martin was running in a direction away from George Zimmerman, had he not said, "Oh, shyte, he's running" and jumped out of his car with a loaded weapon to chase the kid down, Trayvon would never have been close enough to George Zimmerman to even throw a freaking rock at him. When George chased after someone running away, that had not been witnessed as committing a crime, George Zimmerman became the aggressor and lost all rights to a claim of "self defense."

actually cochino they have already cast serious doubt on zimmermans story. they could not locate any of trayvons DNA on the gun anywhere.

OBAMA PHONE!!!!!!!

What Dinath? You didn't get your free phone so you're yelling at us about it?

I can see how some people could grow tired of it.

Maybe Zimmerman will have better luck if he can avoid lying to the new judge.

So, you're implying that Trayvon deserved to be murdered because he was a troubled teen? You are implying that Trayvon deserved to be murdered because he was tired of America treating him as a second-class citizen; he was tired of being profiled & targeted for no other reason that he was Black American!

Zimmerman should be praying that he is convicted and sentenced to prison, because if he is not, there will be 50 Million Americans gunning for him.

The prosecutor should be ashamed of not including lesser charges in the indictment. It's one more reason Black Americans should not trust the judicial system.

HAHAHAHA- Koatz, I don't even know where to start. You must be being sarcastic. No will will be gunning for Zimmerman. You saw how gunning for Zimmerman turns out for ya!

Another Fool, 40 of your 50 Million would be Felons. Did Trayvon get shot in the back..NO. His thug like attitude put him where he belongs. watch first 48.. 90% are Nigga killin Nigga while in the game. Then i see where a Black man killed 3 whites. One thing i didn't see was Where was Jessie Jackson , and all the other NAACP Racists asking for justice. Where is the White entertainment Channel. Reverse Racism is Rampid blame everyone but yourself. Lockem up in cages toss in a couple guns and save taxpayer dollars. Koatz will be first. You can take the Nigga out of the hood but you can't take the hood out of tha Nigga

justice130Another Fool, 40 of your 50 Million would be Felons.

Your remark is an example of the kind of environment Trayvon faced on a daily basis. At some level, people reach their boiling point. Zimmerman's racially motivated effort to target & stalk Trayvon, despite instructions from law-enforcement to stop, elicited a response from a teenager who had had enough of being targeted simply because he was Black!

Zimmerman is a coward who provoked a confrontation, then murdered a teenager. The fact that "East-Texas" didn't approve a crime-scene detective's recommendation that Zimmerman be charged with murder is proof enough that vigilante justice is necessary in this case.

In short, No Justice, No Peace!

But,, aren't you Zimmie Zealots are claiming that the evidence proves that this was a clear cut case of self defense? If the evidence proves it, why the need to even attempt to manufacture dirt on Trayvon Martin? You only have to resort to those distraction strategies when the evidence is all against you...in other words the evidence is not there to show that this is a case of Zimmerman defending himself and having no option but to shoot and kill a 17 year old teen.

In fact, O'Mara started off with, "The evidence will show that this is a clear instance if SYG." to "Well, the case doesn't meet the standards of SYG so we will be using traditional self defense. It appears that George was reacting to getting punched in the nose" to "Get Trayvon's school records, because we have to try to dirty this kid up some how! The evidence has George up a shyte creek without a paddle or a canoe!" Now his defense attorney is even admitting how weak his case is. Yet you want to claim that the evidence is there to prove him not guilty?

Fact is, there will be nothing in Trayvon's school records to show a history of violent or aggressive behaviors, and that is what O'Mara is going to have to do. One incident will not get it. It has to be a long standing pattern observed over a period of time, occurring frequently and repeatedly. And no matter how much false hope you pin on something like that coming out, it simply is not going to happen or it would have already come out during the first 8 months following Zimmerman's arrest. We have gotten plenty of additional incriminating information on Zimmerman. Plenty of people have volunteered information pointing to his history of aggressive behavior. His criminal record attests to his record of repeated violent behaviors. And yet nothing, not a thing, NADA, to suggest even so much as a playground fight over a sand bucket when Trayvon was in kindergarten. Nothing. Zilch.

Face it. You have nothing but the several different stories Zimmie has told, and the fact that he can't keep his stories even remotely the same, the fact that his stories do not match the forensic evidence, the fact that his bail was revoked as a result of his dishonesty with the court...Zimmerman's word isn't going to help him. His credibility is shot.

I have a disdain for ignorance... ( You said "He beat himself up") That has to be a first!

( You said "He beat himself up")

You'd be surprised how many times that occurs. Especially when one is attempting to make the victim look guilty of something in order to exonerate themselves from wrong doing.

Don't have much contact with the real world, do you?

Joy McD, ever been on a jury.....no... because you obviously arn't very stable minded. Kangaroo court is more your style, guilty till proven innocent. No wonder liberals hate the constitution ...its just too fair.

George Zimmerman got those wounds from rolling around trying to detain a kid, he had no business following in the first place. NO crime was committed.

By Zimmerman.

DOCJT

( You said "He beat himself up")

You'd be surprised how many times that occurs. Especially when one is attempting to make the victim look guilty of something in order to exonerate themselves from wrong doing.

Don't have much contact with the real world, do you?

Well, my best example is tywana braley...you remember her, don't you? Your daddy Al Sharpton's poster child for victims of evil white racists? Messed herself up and wrote the 'n' word all over herself and claimed she was raped by white cops?

...but as far as beating oneself up to produce serious wounds such as those on Mr. Zimmerman - can you please demonstrate how someone actually does this?

Joy McDaniel HogueVIA FACEBOOK

Zimmerman needs to be put away we all know he did it. He beat him self up to make it look like Trayvon assalted him

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Joy,

an eyewitness saw T beating Z while on top of him.... your statement is laughable.... Z is going to walk as he should. It's not OK for thug kids to just decide they are going to give someone a beatdown.... and T was a thug.