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Subscribe to RSSThree states will decide on Tuesday whether to take the unprecedented step of legalizing marijuana. NBC's Pete Williams reports.
Marijuana-legalization backers believe they’re well schooled on all things leafy – from cannabis to political tea leaves. With pro-pot measures leading in recent polls in Washington and Colorado, proponents don’t foresee federal agents interceding in those states if voters approve the initiatives.
Their rationale: Two years ago, when California voters considered a similar proposal to legalize the adult possession of an ounce or less of pot, U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder publicly vowed the feds would continue to prosecute anyone in that state caught possessing marijuana — even if the law passed. It failed.
This year, in contrast, federal anti-drug authorities have repeatedly declined to discuss decriminalization proposals in three states — including a measure in Oregon that would end the prohibition of marijuana there. (That initiative trailed in recent polls.) The response routinely delivered by U.S. Department of Justice spokeswoman Allison Price, including in an e-mail to NBC News: “We are not going to speculate on the outcome of the various ballot initiatives in each of the states.”
“That, to me, is significant because they didn’t just copy and paste what they did and said in 2010. We feel pretty good about that,” said Alison Holcomb, campaign director for Washington’s Initiative 502, which seeks to regulate and tax marijuana production and distribution in that state. According to a poll released Thursday, Initiative 502 had the support of 55 percent of Washington voters.
But Dr. Kevin A. Sabet, former senior drug policy advisor to the Obama Administration and director of the Drug Policy Institute at the University of Florida, predicts a far different law-enforcement reality on the ground in Washington — as well as in Colorado, where Amendment 64 would allow the state to regulate marijuana as it does alcohol.
“Once these states actually try to implement these laws, we will see an effort by the feds to shut it down,” Sabet said.
Sabet’s vision of post-election pot realities in Washington and Colorado — where Amendment 64 has majority support, according to a recent poll — seems to suggest a possible weed war between the feds and the states.
“We can only guess now what exactly that would look like,” Sabet said. “But the recent U.S. Attorney actions against medical marijuana portends an aggressive effort to stop state-sponsored growing and selling at the outset.” (That includes, he said, letters sent by federal prosecutors last January to medical marijuana dispensaries in Colorado operating within 1,000 feet of schools, ordering those businesses to halt sales.)
“The question voters should be asking themselves,” Sabet said, “before voting on these initiatives is this: Is your right to buy pot from a store down the street worth the risk of increased teenage drug abuse, increased enforcement action by the feds, and increased problems like 'stoned driving?’ "
Whether a legal showdown is ignited or not, some state-legalization proponents see their measures as possible footholds in a march toward national marijuana decriminalization.
“Exactly 80 year ago, Colorado voters approved a ballot measure to appeal alcohol prohibition, and that came prior to it being repealed by the federal government,” said Mason Tvert, co-director of the Yes on 64 campaign in Colorado, a state that already regulates the sale of medical marijuana. “And it was the individual states taking that type of action that ultimately resulted in the federal (Prohibition) repeal.
“The same kind of thing is underway with marijuana,” he added. “Whether there’s going to be a critical mass, who knows?”
In Washington, Holcomb echoed that uncertainty: "I'm not sure how that’s going to play out.”
“It may be there’s going to some generational evolution on this. Medical marijuana was introduced in the mid-90s and we were still talking to a lot of people that were coming out of the ‘Reefer Madness’ era, who had a lot of fear. And (medical marijuana) was a really powerful way to help them see that marijuana is not this terribly scary thing that they had been told,” Holcomb said.
Indeed, the most recent poll on Colorado’s Amendment 64 found that 73 percent of state state’s residents who are under age 30 want pot legalized. At the same time, more than half of seniors are against decriminalizing marijuana.
Anti-drug watchdog Sabet, meanwhile, sides with most current political leaders — “the overwhelming majority of Congress (and) both major presidential candidates” — as well as the American Medical Association standing against the decriminalizing of marijuana: “I don't envision national legalization as a realistic possibility in the near future.”
“The state-level efforts could soon prove to be a tipping point for more aggressive legalization initiatives,” Sabet said. “However, there is a growing consensus within the medical and treatment community — who deal with the problems of marijuana use and addiction everyday — to reject both extreme prohibition and lax legalization. I think we'll end up with a policy that is more centrist, for example, not punishing people by barring them from a job for a past marijuana arrest, but also not allowing marijuana to be marketed and sold like alcohol or cigarettes.”
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Our local police chief was rambling about this "gateway drug" and how it would destroy civilization if it was legalized. The only thing that it's a "gateway" to is twinkies and Doritos.
It's way past time we legalize pot. The efforts to stop it have failed miserably.
The state legislators should legalize these drugs an nullify the evil prohibition laws. The people shouldn't be allowed to vote on it. That would be voting on the rights of others and that is wrong.
He must be ignorant of history. Civilization started in the same areas where marijuana was native. Not saying they are related, but I think pursuit of the question is worthwhile.
So true, Milk would be considered a better gateway drug since 100% of addicts started on that.
The REALLY SCARY thing is that the REAL Gateway Drug these days is the Vicodine (Hydrocodone) that Mom's Doctor put in her Medicine Cabinet. It is now COMMON on Middle School Playgrounds where it is sold for Lunch Money. The over prescription of NARCOTICS in the US has led to this now being a $9 BILLION Business in the U.S. - So Doctors are the Biggest Narcotic Pushers in the Country.
Legalizing marijuana will play havoc with the private jails system. Do you realize they'll get hit both ways? less from the state and less from the companies that hire inmates. They'll be devastated. Not to mention the cuts from the suppliers, etc. There go their millions. Maybe they can move their operations to Mexico or some south american country and go with them.
The only reason the administration is staying silent on the issue right now is that Obama knows that if the administration states it's true feelings and intentions it will cost him votes. Once the election is over the administration will make it very clear that they will take action against anyone who tries to move forward with legalizing marijuana and will continue to go after anyone who sells or possesses it the same way they have gone after the marijuana dispensaries in CA. The federal government has been forcing the landlords for the dispensaries to evict them. They are doing this by threatening to seize the property as part of federal drug forfeiture laws if the landlords allow the dispensaries to remain. They are telling the property owners that if they do not evict the dispensaries that the federal government will take their property from them. I do not expect any change in this attitude by the federal government. Obama is simply telling Holder and the rest of the administration to keep quiet until after the election so that Obama does not lose votes among the young who support both him and legalization. Obama is afraid if faced with the reality of Obama's agenda they will no longer support him. What Obama is doing is hiding who he is and his agenda toge reelected. fear for what is going to happen to this country if Obama is reelected and can them implement his true vision for this country without having to worry about any more elections!!!
The opposition to legalization is mainly due to the fact that nobody needs a pharmaceutical company to produce top quality marijuana. This natural drug also stands to replace a good bit of what big pharma peddles.
We also know how willing some physicians are to become shills for big pharma. It's good business for them.
It IS a gateway drug. But that's only because the people that sell it also sell harder drugs and will eventually try to push you onto other stuff. If it's legalized then people who want weed will walk into dispensaries or liquor stores to buy it, no longer having to deal with drug dealers that will try to get you hooked on some harsher things. Thus, legalizing weed will turn it from a gateway drug into not a gateway drug.
Legalization is murderous. The states stupid enough to legalize marijuana see upticks in crime all the time, every time because the people who use marijuana are very bad men. Look at the cartels in Mexico, look at the 10,000 people they murder per year and tell me that marijuana dealers are really nice guys.
You legalize that crap and guys just like that are coming into your neighborhood. Why bother smuggling pot across the border when cartels can grow it in Washington and Colorado without fear of reprisals or smuggling charges? Drug cartels are evil, not stupid. They're going to see a legal place of business and come running into Colorado and Washington and set up their criminal farms. Then the killing starts. With 47 States where pot is still illegal, criminals will come set up shop where the law can't touch them.
Colorado, Washington and Oregon need to be ready to welcome their new murderous cartels if they pass this weed law. They will come expecting a lot of open arms and a lot of backs to stab.
Mean Gene, you certainly are mean spirited. And not very strong between the ears to boot. Your remarks show that you are an alien from another planet.
judging from the number of morbidly obese kids in this country twinkies should be more suspect as a hazardous substance than pot
@ meangene
Legalization is murderous. The states stupid enough to legalize marijuana see upticks in crime all the time,
I don't know exactly where you are of if you are just yanking chains with the above statement BUT thus far NO states have actually legalized marijuana. If you think about it even when given to or taken by a person for whom it is not specifically prescribed penicillin use becomes a criminal event. The same is true for medical MJ.
Please learn about the laws of the United States before you comment on them further because either you failed Civics class in middle school or you are from a country outside our borders.
Thanks
In some states were it has been legalized it hasn't gone well like California. In some like Colorado it has gone better.
"If states legalize marijuana, will feds still crack down"
I sure hope they will - for the preservation of our society and our freedom in America.
Marine57 is correct! How can we preserve our Freedoms if we are free to decide what goes into our own bodies??? We need to Government to tell us what we can and cannot do! That is TRUE Freedom!
Who cares - since when does some social goal like 'lowering crime' trump the rights of the individual to control what goes into his or her own body?
Grab your prayer rug and go back to Saudi Arabia.
The city I lived in in CA had several medical dispensaries selling pot. The crime rate in those areas were the lowest in the city. The ignorance and stupidity of people is astonishing when speaking about pot.
Bottom line is we need a bunch of old people to die off so that we can pass sensible laws regulating and taxing pot, as the medicinal purposes alone would save Americans BILLIONS, let alone provide a better pain relief solution without the addictive properties of codeine related drugs.
Yep, predictable. Pot monger wants a bunch of people dead. Gee, who couldn't see that one coming from a mile away? Pot mongers and death?
Go into a head shop. Gaze upon the skulls and bones and sacrificial blades they sell. Potheads love death. The biggest pothead music group was called what? Oh yeah, the "Grateful Dead".
MeanGene...
You are a riot. Haven't had such a giggle in a long time.
Not only yes but hell yes.
I live in Washington and have already voted yes on I-502.
Stated as the gospel by one of the people who constantly demands death to all of the "evil pot smokers". England, Portugal, and Vancouver, have all had their crimes rates drop by close to 70% when they decriminalized heroin, which is a far bigger danger than pot is.
Spreading your fears as being the truth, regardless of proof, puts you firmly in the ranks of the government and anti freedom groups. Just because you are terrified of people having free choice does not mean that everyone else should also be terrified, or forced to give up their rights.
MJ will remain illegal as long as the government is making the obscene amounts of money from all of the government chosen "winners" in this fake morality war. Just taxing MJ will come nowhere near the money that the special interests anti freedom groups put into the lawmakers pockets. Power over other peoples choices, as well as the obscene money involved, will not be given up by TPTB without a major fight.
Another quadrillion dollars wasted in a morality war over prohibition will make zero difference to the anti pot crowd. It won't put any noticeable stop in its usage either. Stop the waste and stop the damage from the massive failure called the war on
drugscitizens rights.@Arterian - "The most dangerous a pot-head ever did was murder and consume two large pizza's."
I beg to differ. Here are a few "pot-head" related incidents and the accompanying news articles for you to "munch" on.
http://missoulian.com/news/local/medical-marijuana-advocate-christ-banned-from-um-campus/article_8d9c3176-1d73-11e2-b40f-0019bb2963f4.html - The face of Medical Pot in Montana, certainly FAR FAR from having a munchie attack in this incident.
http://helenair.com/news/state-and-regional/govt-and-politics/libertarian-legislative-candidates-plead-not-guilty-in-ravalli-county-drug/article_1c947a64-0e3d-11e2-8efa-0019bb2963f4.html - Two Libertarian candidates for the Montana Legislature arrested on charges stemming from an incident in which marijuana-infused candy was distributed on a Hamilton school bus.
http://helenair.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/local-taxi-driver-charged-with-smoking-marijuana-with-kids/article_8b16f1b8-076a-11e1-ab03-001cc4c03286.html - taxi driver picked up 5 kids in his taxi, drove them to a parking garage, smoked pot with them, and drove them home.
http://helenair.com/news/state-and-regional/five-charged-after-marijuana-theft-assault/article_9de79404-59fc-11df-8dab-001cc4c03286.html - here is one with some pot heads and vigilante justice where they beat a man nearly to death with baseball bats and a maglite.
http://www.ravallirepublic.com/news/state-and-regional/article_d6083879-dd58-5011-8f82-cde176582be4.html. Here is one involving a Medical Pot Provider involved with Kiddie Porn.
http://missoulian.com/news/state-and-regional/jason-christ-medical-marijuana-entrepreneur-on-trial-for-alleged-bomb/article_10048656-1e44-11e2-9bac-0019bb2963f4.html - here is one for a pot head threatening to blow up a verizon store.
http://missoulian.com/news/local/medical-marijuana-business-founder-jason-christ-no-stranger-to-legal/article_61e21434-d99f-11df-8cbc-001cc4c03286.html - same face of Med Pot and the whole slew of his shinanagans, from death threats to tearing up a local car repair shop, to internet crimes including website hijacking.
To support the contention made about rising crime rates - http://www.bozemandailychronicle.com/news/state/article_b8b4b410-97a9-11e0-86dd-001cc4c03286.html?mode=story - The head of the Montana Department of Justice's narcotics bureau said Wednesday that crime has increased in 78 percent of the state's jurisdictions since medical marijuana became legal in Montana.
and this one http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35940756/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/criminals-target-medical-marijuana/ - Patients, growers and clinics in some of the 14 states that allow medical marijuana are falling victim to robberies, home invasions, shootings and even murders at the hands of pot thieves
So, chief, there is more to pot heads than simple munchies and pizza binges. And I didn't include the increases in Pot related DUIs, which here in Montana, this year alone, have involved at least 3 fatalities including an 8 yr old killed by a high on pot motorcyclist.
OK Will,
You are blaming MJ for irresponsible parenting---like alcoholics have never beaten a child or let one go hungery, or hit an object while driving killing someone other than themselves.
You are blaming the robbing OF growers, homes, etc on MJ as oppose to actually blaming the theives themselves.
Heck in the Denver metro area thee are DAILY rush hour rollovers, kidnappings, murders, etc. these are not blamed on marijuana they are blamed on irresponsible drivers, crazy/calculating child molesters, and more often than not lunatic exes.
The media sensationalizes----if I believed the media I would believe the Denver metro area is a crime vortex.
I have family in MT and the general consensus by them is----1/2 of the state is comprised of feds and the other 1/2 of militia types------I do not buy into that ideology either.
No one has the right to by the products that will finance the enemies of the American people.
The biggest threat to our society are the unnecessary prison sentences for possession of pot. All the goofy fear generating from this topic is proof there is a ginormous pool of stupid overflowing in our country. Our priorities are so screwed up. Go ahead and swill a fifth of jack, pound a case of beer, pop some addictive pain killers, puff on cancer etc, but what ever you do...don't smoke some cheeba! Even if you can't justify voting yes for recreation, do it for the millions of dollars that will fund schools. The biggest shock that will come from legalization is that all the people who smoked pot, still smoke pot. Even if it isn't legalized, will still smoke pot but the states won't see a dime of its revenue.
The only danger that "pot" produces....is to ones refridgerator!!!
No Lexi, I put the blame squarely on the head of the individual. But for someone to say pot heads do not engage in such activities is both assinine and ignorant. The exact comment was, "The most dangerous (thing) a pot-head ever did was murder and consume two large pizza's". Those links and articles was to show, pot-heads are NOT flower children that sit on thier duffs, huffing the cheeba, and stuffing thier faces with doritos. They are the same people pushing thier drugs onto kids, the same people robbing, stealing, assaulting, and committing crimes just like any other non-pot head. And these are the same pot-heads that ARE NOT content with sitting thier asses on that couch. They are taking to the roads ADDING TO the number of traffic related fatalities while under the influence of thier drug, just like boozers and the "dangers" they pose.
Whether or not you are for or against smoking pot, people must realize anyone consuming ANY drug can and will pose a danger in some way, shape or form. And truthfully, there are more "decent" people in Montana than people realize. But what I would say is not so much 1/2 are feds and 1/2 are militia, but 75% of em are boozers, and the statistics for DUI offenses and repeat DUI trends support that.
I have to wonder if any of you who support this idea have considered one of the costs of legalizing a recreational drug – regardless of what it is? Most companies have a no-tolerance policy for anyone who uses recreational drugs as well as for those who abuse medicinal drugs. As an HR professional, if our state passed something like this, I would encourage my employer to institute mandatory drug testing for all positions and anyone who tested positive would lose their jobs, period. You can legalize it all day long, but you can’t force employers to accept the risks that come with hiring people who participate in recreational drug use. The stakes are too high for the employer.
Are you including alcohol as a recreational drug or does that magically not make the cut? Seems like you are demonizing one drug while allowing one that is even more destructive to society
justicenonexistent - I hope your company has well funded lawyers to combat the pro-bono lawyers that are going to love to take a whack at a company that is limiting what people can and can't do outside of their place of employment.
Who is this Mean Gene person? LMAO at your paranoia. It is looking like Amendment 64 just might pass. I have always envisioned what it would be like to have a weed plant legal. Period. No red card necessary only be over 21. So I am just gonna sit back in awe and wonder and see what happens. Then I am gonna turn on the tv news and see what happens. ;) Stock Tip: Cheetos, candy bars and ice cream. Mean Gene - you need a Snickers bar.
Regarding states rights, do they even exist anymore or do the feds control everything?
@justice - we had a case EXACTLY involving your concern here in Montana. Here is the article http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/24/brock-hopkins-bear-maul-marijuana_n_840374.html. This guy still high on his med pot collected Workman's Comp after getting mauled when feeding a bear. And that issue has come up more than once in discussions with Department of Labor workers here. It is just another factor/facet people need to start thinking about before engaging in this legalization stuff. I know with alcohol consumption on the job here in MT, that is grounds for immediate dismissal (no unemployment benefit or workmans comp claims), and pot should be no different, as should any other recreational drug.
Phuchk the law. The law is an ass.
Pot should never be legalized.
Would you like the teachers at school teaching school after smoking pot?
Or the bus driver of your school being a pothead?
Pot is bad and causes accidents.
^ If those people were going to smoke before work, they would already be doing so. Just because you make something legal does not mean that people are going to do it whenever they feel like it. If they don't do that while it is illegal, why do you think it will change if it is made legal? More unfounded fears over what MAY happen, not reality.
Why go out of your house, you MAY get sick, injured, or killed? It is exactly the same kind of thinking, based on fear, not reality.
I have no desire to use it but don't believe it's worse than alcohol and isn't worth the effort controlling it. Better to tax the crap out of it like cigarettes. It would still be cheaper than the smuggled stuff. Put the mexican cartels out of business.
After pot is legalized, perhaps Mr. Sabet could get a job in a convenience store selling pot once he loses his job in the prohibition industry
Convenience stores won't sell pot. They don't like getting robbed and people who smoke pot are hardcore robbers. Here in Phoenix just last week we had a pistol whipping and a shootout at a medical marijuana dispensary. These are exactly the sorts of people marijuana attracts to a store and you think a convenience store is going to want to deal with that crap? They're not going to want their employees DEAD at the hands of every murdering thug who wants a joint. They're just not going to carry it.
Do you know ANOTHER reason why Convenience Stores won't carry pot? Ever heard of RICO laws?
Circle K (for example) has about 3,000 company owned stores worth on average about $300,000 apiece. IF THEY USE THEM TO VIOLATE FEDERAL DRUG LAWS, then the Feds can use the RICO statutes to SEIZE all of those stores, all BILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF THEM. Which maniac manager is going to risk that? NOBODY.
Think the Feds won't? They dropped AT&T like third period French in the 1980's. They can take down a chain of convenience stores and don't you believe for a second that they won't.
You will NEVER, EVER see marijuana sold in a convenience store so long as it's against FEDERAL LAW.
Right MeanGene, because nobody has ever knocked over a liquor store....
More like confused gene - the poster said "AFTER POT IS LEGALIZED" but nice rant ding dong.
That is a lie. You know who are the real thieves? The government taking people's property away in this modern mass persecution known as the "war on drugs".
Really? How many convenience stores have you been in where cigarettes are available for public perusal? I would guess "none". Why is that?
It's because people who smoke are evil thieves and can be expected to engage in banditry.
Smokers are crooks. All the time. Every time. If somebody has a pack of cigarettes then you know they've got a rap sheet to boot. Don't trust them. Convenience stores don't trust smokers at all. They keep the smokes locked up because smokers are evil bastages who will steal in a heartbeat. That's just tobacco smokers. Pot smokers are a bazillion times worse.
MeanGene,
Seriously??? Are you stoned right now or just a troll?
Percent of tobacco users behind bars is about FOUR TIMES HIGHER than the tobacco users on the street.
Yes. Seriously. If you see somebody with a cigarette in his mouth then he's four times more likely to be an outlaw than a nonsmoker.
I carry a concealed weapon, usually a 9MM Ruger. If I see a cigarette, a pack of cigarettes or smell tobacco then I'm unsnapping the holster because what I smell is trouble. I might have to shoot my way out of a bad situation. The choices are to be ready or to be dead. Second hand smoke may take a few years to kill, but the people who smoke will kill you in a heartbeat.
MeanGene, I'm afraid that someone who is obviously so mentally disturbed as you are has a CCP.
That's freakin' HILARIOUS coming from a person calling themselves "Misscreant".
I served in the United States Navy for 8 years. I achieved a rank of E-6, Petty Officer First Class inside of five years, an AMAZING rank increment because not even ONCE was I up for promotion that I did not get it. I'm damned good, scary good.
I held a TS clearance (top secret) as a crypto tech in the Navy. I worked on NESTOR, VINSON and other things I can't even tell you about. I know satcom, I know military air traffic control, and you think I'm mentally disturbed when I'm the most certifiably sane man in America.
Nobody on this planet is more careful than I am. I believe in measuring twice before cutting once. Intent matters, and it matters a lot is my mantra. Always go with good intentions and never make a cut you haven't measured twice.
I'm not mentally disturbed. I'm just too sane to be around crazy people.
It took you eight years to get to E-6? My ex did that in three. All the strange ones were crypt tech on his base.
You clearly have mental problems. This maybe a result of age, I don't know.
MeanGene...
I had a TS Crypto and I raise you a Launch Clearance as an enlisted. Anyone that sounded a LITTLE bit like you, I bounced into Dusters.
ROFLMAO..... MeanGene....thanks for the best laugh I've had on these boards in a very long time. I shall continue to laugh at the boneheads who are unable to see your posts for what they are. I'm betting they are all aspiring politicians.....
"Percent of tobacco users behind bars is about FOUR TIMES HIGHER than the tobacco users on the street. Yes. Seriously. If you see somebody with a cigarette in his mouth then he's four times more likely to be an outlaw than a nonsmoker."
MeanGene,
Using that logic consider this: Traffic inreases every day just as the sun is going down. It happens every day just like clockwork. The evidence is conclusive: we need more traffic lights.
Excuse my sarcasm here but your posts seem to show a lack of understanfing regarding the concept of a "Causal Relationship".
No it doesn't. We solved that problem in Arizona by ignoring Daylight Saving Time.
That is nothing but more hateful propaganda from the oh so-professed "mean" guy.
Oh...don't Mr. Mean guy! Don't OFFEND us with your POWERFUL words...we might just faint right now!!!
Oh...heh heh heh.....
That is so amusing! Feel welcome to continue to invent falsehoods. And keep your persona intact. Because you are soooo "scary" and "intimidating".....
To all others....This of course is part of the persecution I was talking about. Hateful lies about people he doesn't know in order to sound 'mean'. This is the kind of person you are talking to. You can't convince them to not treat other people better because they would prefer to spread the government's lies.
MeanGene- First mistake, your proud of CCing with a 9mm. Second, if your that jumpy around smokers that you begin to unsnap your holster you are the last person that should be CCing. And stop lying about your naval career. It is nearly impossible to pick up E-6 in 5yrs in the navy unless your accelerated to each rank. And then you would be out of your mind to get out. So dont shame the rest of us serving (and smoke) with your BS.
Ruger LC9, made in Arizona. I like Arizona. I live here. The 9MM was made by Americans, for Americans, right in Prescott, AZ. It's the big brother of the similar Ruger LCP which is the .380 version. The problem with .380 is it doesn't have the stopping power of a 9MM. My first choice would be my .357 Ruger Blackhawk because that thing would stop a charging bear dead in its tracks, but it's not very concealable.
Where there's smoke, there's a criminal. The statistics don't lie. Smokers are bad people, that's why every time a vote comes up to raise taxes on smokers it passes with flying colors. People don't mind taxing the crap out of evil people, and smokers are evil people. That's why the "money" in prisons today are CIGARETTES. Prisoners use cigarettes for barter and trade behind bars because so many inmates are smokers.
It's very possible. I did it. Pushbutton 3rd Class after graduating in the top 10% of my class at Naval Training Center Great Lakes ET 'A' School. I was an E-4 by the time I'd been in the Navy one year.
Actually, I would have been out of my mind to stay in. My annual pay as an E-6 was a whopping $16,000 per year. I'm an electronics communications expert. I got out and TRIPLED my pay in the private sector. I would be LOSING over $30,000 per year by continuing my Navy career.
Had I stayed in for the extra 12 years to finish my 20 years, it would have LOST me $360,000 at the very least.
Losing a over a quarter of a million dollars isn't worth it. Military pay is crap and if you were in then you know it.
I see it every time Social Security sends me a pay history. I can see EXACTLY what happened when I got out of the US Navy. MAN OH MAN did my pay skyrocket. I went from barely poverty level to upper middle class OVERNIGHT.
Granted, it was the military training and electronics education that allowed me to do that, but still, the military is GROSSLY underpaid compared to the private sector.
MG- Still lost on the concept that smokers are bad people. Alot of the guys in the military are smokers. Are they evil people? And I am a US Marine so I know how crappy our pay is, and all the BS we put up with. Still I have worked with the Navy and I know how there pomotions work. Thats why I said nearly impossible. IF you picked up that fast(still very hard to believe) you would of been sitting very close to Chief and so on.
OMG. Almost 20 years of the interwebs and you guys still don't know when someone is yanking good. Good show MeanGene!!!!! Best troll I've seen in a long time. I almost pi$$ed my self when you started in on tobacco. Brilliant.
It's big money for the DEA, they will never allow it to be legalized without a fight.
That is so true LJ_51. The war on drugs is really a war on Cannabis considering over 49% of arrest are because of Cannabis. If they change the scheduling of Cannabis to a class III, IV, or V they would still be able to have arrest for Cannabis for those not "Prescribed" MMJ but then their numbers would drop still and if they were to regulate it like alcohol and tobacco (both of which have a high potential for abuse and NO accepted medical use in the United States and are still legal) then the DEA arrest number's would drop dramatically. It's about politics and cash flow it has nothing to do with the welfare of the US citizens or our rights for liberty and freedom which have been stripped from us due to this so called "war on drugs" which is a complete failure. All the government is doing by not legalizing Cannabis for recreational use and medicinal use is funding criminal activity and encouraging a black market.
This is so true. If you have any doubts about it, watch the movie Lynching Charlie Lynch and tell me what side of the argument you fall into after watching it. You can find it on Netflix right now.
Current US CDC Figures on Average numbers of deaths per year in the USA :
Prescription Drugs: 237,485
Tobacco: 81,323
Alcohol: 23,199
Marijuana 0, none, ever in medical history. not one death.
NO WONDER it is considered so bad------no population control factor-----lol
Marijuana is worse than death. There are some things worse than death, like losing your soul to a plant.
Marijuana would be better if it were lethal. Then it couldn't own your mind.
They say it's not addictive. It doesn't have to be. Not when every person who has used it will break the law to use it again and again.
Current US CDC Figures on Average numbers of deaths per year in the USA :
Prescription Drugs: 237,485
Tobacco: 81,323
Alcohol: 23,199
Marijuana 0, none, ever in medical history. not one death.
http://www.darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin2007-06.html
Potheads make the Darwin Awards.
You know, playing with fire while you're stoned is probably not the wisest of decisions. It's right up there with drunk driving and cow tipping on the stupidity scale.
This is a state's rights issue - Feds need to worry about more important things.
I HALF agree - but we already settled that thing about States Rights with a little thing called the Civil War
The states still have rights. Unless you're willing to back that up with something more meaningful I'd say you have no point to make.
As for the feds? The federal government grabs power everywhere it can. It's disgusting and people need to call out the government on this in a meaningful way. This is just another failure of the two party system.
@east coast
Not only does the Fed grab power but too many in this country are sheep and believe the propaganda spouted by the fear mongers they elected.
I'd like to know what happened to those of us who did not require parentalism in the form of governmental control, who were able to think and reason and discern possible issues and problems before they occur.
Lastly whose idea was it that the government was suppose to "take care of us"----Lenin's????
The idea that government is supposed to take care of it's citizen's is as old as Democracy. Why else have it voluntarily to begin with?
Hell even most Kings considered it their duty to see to the needs of their subjects. The ones we'd call "good" anyway.
It is very much governments duty to work for the best interests of the people it represents. It's a bit more complicated than building roads. Not allowing companies to sell you baby formula filled with lead, for example, could be called taking care of us.
Sorry, no. It's an Interstate Commerce problem so the Feds can stick their Pharma paid fingers in if they want.
Capt Tripps
First of all gotta love a S. K. reader and The Stand was my fave also.
BUT I'm surprised you did not realize a little tongue in cheek was employed in my post. I am concerned though because I do work in the school systems and we no longer teach children HOW to think and reason. We tell them WHAT to think and pretty much confine the line of thought to what they need to know to pass the standardized tests. The No Child .....Act was the absolute worse thing that could happen to education.
Can't say much about baby formula----I breast fed my kids.
IN CANADA WE WERE ON OUR WAY TO LEGALIZING POT THEN ELECTION CAME CONSERVATIVES GOT IN AND STOPED IT AND INCREASED TIME FOR possession. However medical pot is legal across the country. If america legalizes pot before we do will show that america is back on track as leader of the free world.
Really??? Leader of the free world because drugs are legalized??? But you can still be dragged out of your car and have armed troops put rifles to your head in order to catch a "bank robber". We have Iraqi "justice" around here but we are so "free"??? People that think like that really need those drugs I think.
You know nothing of what happens in this oppressed nation.
Polka.....so tell us all about your personal experiences outside the USA in actual oppressed nations....have you ever actually lived outside the US? I am willing to bet you are talking out your posterior region.....because despite what people like you, know nothing loudmouths, have to say...this country still offers more freedom than ANY other country in the world. I have lived abroad...and I actually do know what I'm talking about.
You know little of what happens here or you have forgotten or were privileged enough to have never seen it. The US is extremely oppressed. It is rarely done openly like in the Chinese Empire or Iran or places like that with exceptions like the soldiers pointing guns at people and dragging them out of their cars at random in order to search for a "bank robber". Got to defend those banks, right??? If you look at the laws then you would know that Americans have little to no freedoms. We have no freedom to collect rain water in Oregon. No freedom to sell large soft drinks in NYC. No freedom to own military assault rifles without the state's "permission" despite the second Amendment. No right to not vaccinate children. Not right to protest in certain areas where the "secret service" is. No right to due process if the state declares you to be a "terrorist" (under the NDAA). We have no right to own land with the "eminent domain" laws and no right to own property in general if the supreme court sides with corporations (and they will, I am not sure when or if they have done so already). They can take your right to vote away if you are a minority. The US intimidates and persecutes mass numbers of people based on race, religion, sexual orientation and drug users. The state has the "right" to imprison an entire race under "Korematsu vs. US". We have no fourth Amendment protections and if you disagree or reject unlawful searches then you are a "terrorist" and we know what happens to them in this nation (see NDAA again). Corporations have more rights then we do since they are considered "people" but are above the laws they write for the people and they benefit from the state's protection and authority. All that is a fraction of the injustice plagued upon Americans in this most oppressed "free nation" on Earth.
Oh yes, leaders of the free world, NOT.
All people on pot, lots of unemployment, no one cares about anything.
Who will build anything?
NO to comm:
You are perpetuating stereotypes through the use of fear. There is a long list of famous people who were contributors to society in some form or fashion who smoked pot. Plenty of people care including pot smokers and that is why you are seeing a movement for a change. A change in damaging drug policies that do more harm than the drug use itself. The violence is born from prohibition.
Try poking out of your bubble for once and stop relying on stoner movie stereotypes to create unfounded fear.
Polka i agree with some of what you say right to have an assault rifle seems unrealistic the very name gives it away as a weapon not used for hunting ex assault is usually used in terms of harming another human being. And no to communism i smoke pot lot of my friends do to and am quite successful as are they accountants lawyers you name it millionaires most of them so that really does not hold water anymore.
One of the more interesting questions will be how will companies who do drug testing react to legalization. Will they change their policies? And what about public and service jobs such as drivers, pilots, etc.? Current drug testing cannot (easily) pin down if someone is currently under the influence, only that that have ingested in the past few months.
David9000,The hair follicle test will show recent marijuana use.I've never seen a driver under the influence of pot cause an accident.They drive slower which will be safer for all on the road.
It is very interesting you mention drug testing------It is perfectly acceptable in NV to test positive for a narcotic and install electrical wiring in a new casino BUT though NV does have a medical MJ law in place it is taboo to test pos for MJ even with a MD's prescription.
Driving slower is safer? No, it's not. It's illegal to be on the Freeway with a vehicle incapable of doing at least 45 MPH because it's going to cause an accident. Otherwise they'd allow bicycles on the freeway.
Marijuana is a hallucinogen. We don't need drivers seeing things that aren't there behind the wheel. That would be a "bad idea" and marijuana users suffer odd hallucinations like distortions in the perception of time.
The reason you see potheads drive slower is because their perception of time is impaired. Since the formula for Speed=Distance/Time these stoners can't TELL how fast they're going. That's pretty bad when you've got a foot on the gas pedal.
I know companies won't change their policies on drug use while driving company vehicles.
You think the FAA is going to accept the argument of a pilot that he was on a stopover in Colorado, smoked some legal weed from a coffee shop in Denver and then got into the pilot's seat of a Boeing? His license to fly is going to be so gone that he won't even be allowed to fly a kite anymore.
@just a cleaning lady - FYI... hair follicle tests don't reflect use within the past few hours (they don't have that kind of resolution)... they can't show that there is THC in the bloodstream.
BTW... I support legalization. But impaired is impaired whether it is alcohol, weed, or prescription drugs.
In any case, my question is primarily directed at company policies that forbid hiring anyone who fails a drug test. Would they continue those policies wrt marijuana? It will be interesting to see how that resolves.
Perhaps Cleaning Lady was referring to the Saliva test? Shows use in the past 6 hours or so. Longer than you'd be stoned for but better than nothing.
Marijuana doesn't cause hallucinations like that. Not why it's considered a (mild) hallucinogen, has to do with it's affect on the brain. You're not likely to see anything that isn't there.
It would be as bad idea to drive while high tho, and should be just as illegal as it is to drink and drive. A test would probably need to be developed otherwise you're looking at zero tolerance laws, which would be a tad bit stricter than alcohol is treated. I'm pretty sure cops already have a field sobriety test for pot.
Hallucinations aren't just visual. You can hear things that aren't there. You can smell things that aren't there. There are five senses, after all.
I think there are more senses than that, actually, because there's a sense of time. If you ask a typical dude what time it is then he's going to be able to tell you within a half hour. That's at least a "B" grade on a school test, 80% or better out of 24 hours and it's a sense that marijuana degrades. That is a form of hallucination.
The reason people drink and drive is simple... they believe that they will not get caught. Potheads have even more reason to believe that they'll never be caught than stinky-breath drunks do.
No, actually, they don't. It's a blood test and Kojak isn't qualified to be sticking a needle in your arm at the corner of Oak Street and 5th Avenue. That one pretty much has to be done at a hospital.
@Capt Tripps - Actually, unlike alcohol, there is no accurate way to measure THC levels in the field and a person can test positive for marijuana for up to thirty days after first using marijuana using current lab tests. Cops have to rely on standard FSTs (balance tests, eyes, etc.).
Source: A criminal lawyer I know who specializes in DUI.
That would be the field sobriety test I was referring to, a set of visual and behavioral cues.
The test I said needed to be developed is one similar to the breathalyzers for BAC, for the purposes of any court cases.
Mean Gene
FYI----In Wyoming bicyclists use hwys I80 and I90 almost daily.
They might drive slower but they might not drive straight.
They will think what it's in front of them is just a tree, instead it's a person.
There is a reason why intoxicated people cannot drive.
Anything that alters perception is dangerous.
It's a known fact. Reactions are slower, that means they won't hit the brakes in time.
While I do not advocate driving under the influence of any drug and it should be punished accordingly, there isn't going to be a slew of accidents with pot legalization.
Marijuana is not harmful. Yet the US government classifies it as one of the most dangerous substances, more dangerous than crack cocaine. The USA is supposed to be a free, just country. The fact that marijuana and industrial hemp are still classified as schedule 1 substances demonstrates that the USA is not free and just. We are no better than any other corrupt country where arbitrary laws are created that lessen the freedom of its citizens and give arbitrary, undemocratic power to the government.
Yes, it is. I've got a dead brother to prove it. Drug cartels in Mexico have killed over 50,000 people since 2006. Marijuana is deadlier than the Vietnam War.
If you legalize it, then do you think it's going to be Ma and Pa Kettle stepping up to feed the druggies? HELL NO. It's going to be the cartels. Decent people won't get into the marijuana vending biz. It'll be like here in Phoenix when Turf Paradise (a horse track) got put up for sale. It was almost IMPOSSIBLE to find a decent human being without a rap sheet to buy the gambling venue.
Everybody I've ever known who has smoked marijuana was a criminal. I have never met one decent human being who has touched pot. They're all evil men. Most Americans (like me) have never smoked marijuana because they're decent folk. The people who have smoked pot are all evil. They call it the Demon Weed for a reason.
You might find that part of the answer to this is that our prison system has become a for-profit venture. Stiffer Marijuana laws have been heavily supported by commercial prison corporation lobbyists. Think about it... marijuana users are generally not going to be hardened or violent criminals (much harder to manage). They will be easier to manage and that means lower costs for the company running the prison service.
Look at it from the perspective of money, and it all makes sense (that doesn't make it right though).
@MeanGene-3334839 - You're apparently either a moron or a liar. There are plenty of decent folk who use weed on occasion. I don't myself, but I know heads of companies, cops, doctors, lawyers... people from all walks of life who are responsible, have no criminal background, contribute more than you do to society... and they all use marijuana.
You are the problem, not them.
What are you talking about? Are alcohol users supplied by cartels? Or is alcohol inherently more moral and not a good parallel? And how do you end up meeting people that tell you they smoke pot if they are all criminal degenerates that you wouldn't associate with? I know that I wouldn't tell someone with a clear bias about my personal habits if they were in conflict. You have met numerous good, moral, empathetic cannabis enthusiasts and simply didn't know it. Try a little and you might be surprised. Just make sure you get a doctor's recommendation, first. I would hate to see anyone get in trouble over nothing.
Come on people, wake up to the blatantly obvious. MeanGene is playing the ultimate Devil's Advocate. He does NOT believe what he is typing. It is like when Stephen Colbert plays the ultimate Neo-Con, and the right wingers can't seem to catch on to the joke. I mean, come on--he is making up stuff everyone knows to be untrue and no one is catching on.
The difference is, Colbert is FUNNY.
Yes. The last Republican Candidate for President, do you know who he is? JOHN MCCAIN.
Now, why is he a political force to be dealt with? He was just a Fighter Pilot and a POW. He didn't have any real money.
Cindy McCain, do you know who she is? Apart from being John McCain's wife? Maybe if you knew her FULL name. Cindy Lou Hensley McCain is the heiress of the Hensley beer distribution, she basically OWNS Budweiser this side of the Rocky Mountains. Hensley is the exclusive beer distribution for every Anheuser-Busch product from California to Colorado and everything in between.
John McCain didn't fly very well, but he sure as Hell married well.
Go and tell me how alcohol hasn't influenced our politics. Next lesson will be the Rum Running Kennedy's and Joe Kennedy if you try it.
Actually, I believe Meangean is being truthful and it's is easier for him to spout this crap than the truth. To outlaw mj the govt. basically launched a race war (Reefer Madness) to scare people, but he can't admit he is a racist. I have known soooo..... many people who smoked pot from all walks of life and they are not criminals. Or at least they are no worse than your Sunday Christians who will stab you in the back Mon. through Sat.
It is a money deal with the Feds. because in states like CA. a person can grow their own mj with in certain guidelines. The won't get any tax money from those individuals. It's the communal growers who really run into problems. Usually the criminal element ripping them and the dispensaries off have rap sheets that have more arrests for every other crime than mj possession. Given the smell of mj at harvest it is easy to pick your target depending on how you grow it.
In 45 years only a few of the people I have known have become the type of people meangene envisions lurking behind every shred of cover waiting to steal anything. I'm surprised meangene survived 8 years in the Navy, in my Navy back when he would probably have ended up going for a midnight swim - unless he was lucky enough to be a freshwater sailor for his 8 years.
As for employment while smoking mj, you always going to have companies that won't hire someone who fails a test, rightly so I might add. I don't want aircraft mechanics and bus drivers, truck drivers, etc. who are high working in such jobs. That being said, not all companies fall into those categories but a company owner should have the right to hire who he wants. It reminds me of an article I read years ago about an apprentice mechanic who worked for Rolls Royce and had his in lacquered spikes standing up about eight inches all over. The company informed him it was a safety issue and I could see what they meant since I was working in the trades at the time. This moron gave up a job working for Rolls Royce!!!! People have to make their own choices, but it should be THEIR choice!!
I think that if the initiatives pass, the feds will amp up their tyrannical crackdowns. One need only look at the zealous fervency with which Obama's dogs have gone after legal dispensation avenues in California to realize that he doesn't care one bit what states decide. He has made up his mind he will do what it takes to prop up cartels, and their violence, and thus will aggressively pursue all marijuana sales not related to cartels; this can also be seen in his efforts to supply the cartels with military grade firearms and then claiming executive privilege to hide those efforts and the man carrying them out, AG Holder.
Stop collapsing DanTheManofVegas comments just because he is not an Obama supporter.He has posted the truth and did so in a very articulate manner which is more than I can say for some of you posters.
He's not posting the truth, especially if he's trying to say that the "fast/Furious" sting was an attempt to supply the cartels with weapons. That's just...insane. For one thing we didn't supply anything we simply tracked weapons that were already moving.
We know why you are just a cleaning lady - why do you think they call you "dope"?
President Obama will NEVER have to Run for Office again - He is Free. He can use the EPA to ban burning Coal and he can order the Attorney General to not prosecute any Marijuana users (but still go after the Drug Cartels) His Personal Political constraints will be gone and he can finally follow his conscience and good sense and stop a War on Drugs that has overcrowded our prisons and Funded Armed Gangs from Mexico that terrorize our cities.
You are so naive. Obama has done more to crack down on marijuana than any other President, including zealous drug war Presidents like Nixon and Reagan. You think this has all been a show to earn reelection? Tell that to the innocent businessmen and other citizens who have gone to jail on his watch. Obama is just as much of a criminal as the cartels his position props up.
Where do you even get that "follow his conscience" line? You just straight imagine that. His actions reveal what his conscience is, and it is supporting prohibition, not being against it.
Do you honestly think that Obama is getting support for supporting the drug war or marijuana prohibition? My god.... You people understand that there is a lot of liberal support for legalization don't you? I also support legalization as a conservative. I can't see why anyone wouldn't support it except by means of misinformation.
It is a religious law forced upon the masses.
If one of the "two puppets" running for office had declared pot should fall under state laws not national, that puppet would carry each of the three states in question. I'd go as far as to say, he would carry many swing states as well.
The reason they don't is because of the "BAD NEIGHBOR EFFECT".
Colorado is a neighboring State to my home State of Arizona. I can be in Grand Junction from my driveway inside of 12 hours, and it wouldn't be the first time or the tenth time. Which is fundamentally the problem I have with Colorado passing a marijuana legalization, actually. They're just a road trip away.
I actually know quite a bit about Colorado, especially the Western Slope and the Grand Junction/ Fruita area which are largely agricultural. They can grow almost anything they want there, they've got the whole Colorado River for water, but they mostly rejected medical marijuana because of the crime. The nearest medical marijuana in the Western Slope is in Palisades, and that shop doesn't accept new "patients" anymore.
But I'm not talking just about the Western Slope. I'm talking about Interstate 70, or I-70, which will most assuredly become a drug running corridor.
Interstate 70. FIRST INTERSTATE COMPLETED WEST TO EAST. It runs from UTAH clear to MARYLAND. The I-70 is the gateway to the heartland of America. It will take you through UTAH, COLORADO, KANSAS, MISSOURI, ILLINOIS, INDIANA, OHIO, WEST VIRGINIA, PENNSYLVANIA and MARYLAND.
You legalize marijuana in Colorado and the I-70 becomes a hardcore drug smuggling corridor. You'll have 8 out of 9 of the States along the I-70 VERY PUT OUT by drug runners coming to towns near them.
Then they'll ask the Feds to do something about it. Which the Feds will. ESPECIALLY for Ohio and Pennsylvania which are battleground States. There will be PROFILING for Colorado plates along the I-70 and then Coloradans are gonna be ticked off because they'll be looked at as potential drug runners. THEY'LL ask the Feds to do something about it. It's all a huge mess which can all be avoided by one simple thing...
JUST SAY NO.
Mean, your ignorance is astounding. You obviously have no clue as to the effects of cannabis. This is a plant that has been used by man for thousands of years and has literally thousands of uses. It was cultivated by George washington and Thomas Jefferson, and was used in everything from ships sails to medicine since this country's early beginings. Alcohol and tobacco kill millions every year - there has never been one death proved to be the direct result of marijuana use. And those thousands dying in Mexico at the hands of the cartels are dying because the drugs are illegal. If pot were treated like alcohol nobody would get killed over it - including those who are shot by legal gansters with badges who break down peoples' door in the middle of the night. Ignorance and hatred such as yours is the reason this sensless prohibition has caused so much damage to otherwise law-abiding citizens who choose to smoke a joint in their own house to relax, just like millions of Americans have a glass of wine or a beer. The reason cannabis is illegal is it threatens the profits of the legal drug pushers - the alcohol and pharmaceutical companies.
POT - safer than alcohol, safer than tobacco!
Hello,
To all my fellow Patriotic free loving Americans I just wanted to say this is my first post ever, anywhere on any social network. I'm forced after years of reading the stupidity from God hating, country hating, freedom hating, and just pure stupid HATRED for our soldiers who died to protect OUR freedoms. These dispicable subhuman lowlife garbage neanderthals aren't even smart enough to logically debate with any sence of truth. They are either 1) That STUPID 2) They are that sinister to spread evil, vicious lies which is a major problem which is destroying this country like cancer. These backward thinking neanderthals are the same people who thought the earth was flat and you would fall off if you reached the end. These evil ignorant subhumans don't even know the very technology they are writing on were from people who smoked marijuana.. Bill Gates, Steve Jobs and on and on. @!$%#z for brains MeanGene makes an astounding statement that pot smokers are evil and murders. Who did Steve Jobs or Bill Gates murder...Please post links to that and the other MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of peaceful law abiding citizens who have minded their own business and took part in a natural plant that GOD created. You can't even get past a few pages in the bible where GOD specifically says how he created the world from darkness and he created ALL herbs for mankind... and it was all good. Why do you hate GOD you idiots and think you know more than he. Marijuana has been part of and has saved humans in so many ways throughout human history it's unreal. These idiots like this @!$%#z for brains Marine57 claims "I sure hope they will - for the preservation of our society and our freedom in America". Yes @!$%#z for brains "freedom in America". The very same america which was founded upon marijuana. Have you heard of freedom of religion @!$%#z for brains Marine57?? Why do you hate GOD and freedom of religion so much? Does everyone know during WW2 the "Department of Agriculture" made a video called "Hemp for Victory" because it can be used to make textiles, rope and thousands of other uses (nontoxic) to help win the war. Thats also where the term "shotgun" came from. Soldiers were smoking it overseas blowing it down the shotgun barrell and winning wars. This is not even a debate, there are thousands upon thousands of positive ways to argue this subject and "0" logical rebuttals except their stupid last resort it's the kids.. Ya.. the same ones who are old and happily smoking today. If @!$%#z for brains MeanGene or Marine57 or anyone else cant provide me where Bill Gates, Steve Jobs or any othe famous person went on a rampage and started murdering people because of pot you should then NEVER post or use their technology again. Since you only speak the truth it will be easy for you to provide me this link... If not you should just STFU and go back to the dark ages from where you came. Which leads back you are either 1)that STUPID 2)They are that sinister to spread evil, vicious lies which is a major problem which is destroying this country like cancer. I'm waithing @!$%#z for brains. To everyone who has ever stood up and wrote a post or verbally blasted someone for their lies and stupidity you are a true patriot of knowledge. Your words were heard and truly inspiring. Never stop. Be LOUD and be heard and shout these sinister, evil neanderthals down like theres no tomorrow and your life depended on it. You inspired me and today on I will never, ever sit back and let these evil freedom hating, GOD hating idiots ever spew their stupitity... Look up US PATENT 6630507. Again all, thank you. Your words were never in vain. To anyone who was just a spectator like me.. it is well past time you join and SHOUT down this evil.
P.S. - I don't smoke pot, but i'm fgt4urights and know the truth about this miracle of a plant thay GOD created. Its enemies are are big pharma (it can be made into medicine), oil (it can be made into bio deisel) The currupt part of our Government that doesn't give a @!$%#z about our rights or constitution which was also partially written on hemp and the fore fathers Lincoln, Washington and about 75% of the historical population including GOD was just plain stupid and murders.. So says MeanGene and Marine57. Listen to these neanderthals and they will lead you to the promised land...cause they speak the truth. I'm wating for your links... were all waiting for your links!!
wtf-over,
I've hated this plant for over 30 years now. HATED it. And because I've HATED it, I've studied it as any soldier would study his enemy. I know everything there is to know about marijuana, the plant, the creeps who use it and how to beat the crap out of my enemies.
Not true. Smoking was unknown as a practice by Europeans until the 1600's. They didn't have lighters.
They owned slaves too. Was that okay? They had vile habits. Washington was a drunkard who had an entire HOUSE built as his personal wine cellar and Jefferson raped his slave and got her pregnant. These are your role models? REALLY?
Meangene you actually are a moron, which is hilarious. I smoke pot every single day and don't have a rap sheet, don't see things when I drive, don't engage in violence, don't drink alcohol, and I don't sit on my behind all day spewing garbage out like you clearly do. On the contrary, along with smoking "Devil Grass" I also work full time and attend college full time. I enjoy lifting weights, riding bikes, and hanging out with my friends, almost all of whom partake in the combustion of cannabis. I know it may be shocking to you, but "Evidence of the inhalation of cannabis smoke can be found in the 3rd millennium BCE, as indicated by charred cannabis seeds found in a ritual brazier at an ancient burial site in present day Romania."
Again, your a neanderthal... sorry to neanderthals because they had more sense than you so that's kinda of an insult to them. Would anyone let someone fly a plain, drive a car, fly a helicopter or millions of other things if they were not an expert... I seriously don,t think so. So you never smoked pot, but your an expert scientist and knows what it does.. you really did just watch refer madness you ding dong. Your and expert?? You've been studing this evil plant?? Really? How? It's illegal. You ding dong there are various ways to consume pot, vapor, made into oil to name a few. Did i say anything about Europeans ding dong?? I said ancient not 1600's more like since the begining of time. Sorry, but i don't have the exact date and time but you were around you neanderthal. Slavery... Slavery!!! You bring up slavery. Your ignorance truly shows. And I said get out of here you ogre if you can't show where Steve Jobs, Bill Gates and millions of other peaceful, brilliant human beings who consumed pot went on this so called murderus killing spree. Can every one who has ever smoked pot on here please tell ding dong how many people you killed today. I suck i'm at "0" must be the pot that makes me miss when I shoot. Ding Dong you can't be an expert in ANYTHING if you've never done it... like flying a plane, driving a car ect.... Slavery.. How pathetic you really are. Please never smoke pot because your dumb enough to be that person who does go on a murder spree and give this miracle plant a bad name.
Everyone you do know that's his actual picture right? A sane looking citizen he is. I'm still waiting for your links. Everyone when this ogre speaks demand he provide these links or get of the very technology which was created by brillant minds.
MeanGene where are these links??? They can't be that long I have to go to bed soon please provide i'm waiting. Don't say another sentence until you produce an answer to this very simple or just tell all these people which one you really are number 1 or number 2.
Let me get this straight: You demand links which I never agreed to provide and then cry when you don't get them? Do your own homework. This ain't my first day on the internet, bub. I know that game.
Here's what you're trying to pull:
You send me off wasting my time looking for links, which provided you will instantly dismiss as "biased" or "bogus" and demand REAL links. Then if I'm stupid enough to go get you more links you'll pull the same crap all over again.
I know your type. My experience with blogging runs a HELL of a lot deeper than yours. I'm smarter than you, I'm more experienced than you and you are no match for the sheer genius that I possess.
The Florida Cannibal, Rudy Eugene, the man who ate a homeless guy's face clean off... high on POT. No other drugs were found in the cannibal's system at all. He had to be shot SIX TIMES to get the brutal attack to stop. http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/27/us/florida-cannibal-attack/index.html
This is what marijuana does to people.
If you smell marijuana, then lock and load lest a cannibal comes for your face next. They're vicious, they're crazy and they are 100% murderous evil. Have at LEAST six bullets in your gun because it takes that many to stop their zombie asses.
you are an idiot, the canibal in florida was not on marijuana at all. he was on a synthetic drug. if you going to make false claims try getting on faux news
Ignorance breeds fear. Fear breeds hatred. Hatred breeds violence.
I'll leave this here also...
Subjective vs. Objective
When someone makes a judgment call, as it were, they are speaking subjectively. When someone renders a decision based on an observable fact, they are speaking objectively. A subjective interpretation is just that: a filtering through of facts through one's own thoughts or feelings. An objective interpretation leans heavily towards unbiased reportage. Subjective is tied to belief. Objective is almost indisputable.
MeanGene, your views on cannabis are clearly biased and tied to your own personal beliefs. It's subjective and not "the facts", so please quit trying so hard to push it as such.
Folks, here is all MeanGene is trying to do....save us from the zombies. I for one say...Thanks MeanGene....for saving us from the zombies. I'm sure they are right over the hill. PS...Don't let the zombies vote tomorrow. They will all vote democrat and as we know, all THOSE people are nothing but dope smoking zombies of the future.
The bastards who put poison on MY STREETS more than deserve all of the violence they get. They are GODLESS, they are GUTLESS and they are GONE if I ever catch one of the S. O. B.'s disgracing my presence.
HATE doesn't even begin to cover how I feel towards a pothead.
Get that poison off of my streets. NOW.
Uh ......? Meangene, that would be murder you know. I doubt that you could get off even if you loaded the jury with crackers like yourself because even some of those crackers are probably closet pot smokers.
You are not judge, jury, and executioner no matter what you think. Besides, unless you shot them in the back (for all your blustering that is probably a given) they might shoot back. What makes you think they wouldn't have a CCP also?
The more the government tries to control marijuana, the more it appears they are supporting the illegal import and distribution for a cut of the profits. Same thing with shipping thousands of full automatic assault weapons to cartels in Mexico while threatening to ban the same weapons here at home.
It is blatantly Clear to me that the Federal Government, controlled by corporates,
It concerned ONLY with its effect on the producing profits for the corporations and thus the taxes it pockets. The Fed's logic is a fail. If I were to present a Cure for Cancer they would fight it to the death because of the loss of jobs and money from the people working in the Cancer industry. Same for anything else that produces a money stream for the bureaucrats. No one gives a tinkers damn about you or your welfare. MHO
The FEDS will crack down until the last older Congressman and Senators retire.They have bought into the illogical excuse that marijuana is a gateway drug.It grew wild before prohibition and hardly anybody gave it much thought.When alcohol became legalized the alcohol industry didn't want any competition.I think that criminalizing a wild growing herb that American Indians relied on for medicinal purposes is ridiculous.It's time to legalize it,regulate it and tax it.doing so will take a big bite out of the drug cartels income.
The "wild growing herb" that the American Indians relied on for medicinal purposes was hemp, not the marijuana you can get now. Hemp does not have the same levels of THC. The plants are similar, but not the same.
EEK
Are you implying that marijuana has been GENETICALLY MODIFIED to be more potent which of course must be much worse than being genetically modified to handle round up weed killer. OH Please say it isn't so!
Just teasing here. couldn't resist I do understand your point.
You still can't convince me that the round up isn't pulled up by the plant along with nutrients that are necessary and passed on to us at the dinner table but that is another story.
Here's how silly marijuana prohibition is: I have prescriptions for opiates from my doctors for various reasons. Opiates are incredibly addictive and impair your ability to, among other things, drive. I have a prescription for a drug in the benzodiazepine family to help me get to sleep. Benzodiazepines (vallium is probably the best-known drug in this family) are incredibly addictive. Fortunately for me, I live in California, where I can get a medical marijuana recommendation. So if I have to choose between a non-addictive drug with no known side effects or an addictive drug with a laundry list of side effects, I can make a rational choice. At least, under California law I can. Under Federal law, I have no choice. The Feds say that opiates and benzodiazepines are a better choice.
That's just plain nuts.
The Other Jim,I agree with you.I know of a person who works for a is a not for profit drug and alcohol rehab-mental healthcare business.Yes,I said business.It's a revolving door with their clients who are addicted to prescription drugs,meth,alcohol,cocaine and heroin.I'm talking junkies who can't obtain or keep a job,are homeless and are now mentally ill do to their meth use.Not one of them are being seen so that they can kick the maryjane habit.Marijuana is a natural herb with many benefits.
Jim you make a great point. marijuana has become a Cash Cow for the Court system. If government revenuers were really interested in the public health and welfare they could not allow the sale of alcohol and tobacco.
Hypocrisy ?
The opiates and benzodiazepinesare a better choice because corporations can synthesize those in a lab and sell to consumers in a form that is better than consuming the raw material. The government can't allow some easily grown plant to be legal now can it?
Jim, of coarse the Government is going to side with the pharmaceutical and alcohol corporations they are the ones that get these slithery snakes into office and keep them there as they sell there toxic products that are highly addictive. These people will not come up with any pros to legalization, but we know there are many many more pros then cons on this matter.
Or maybe it's that potheads are just so freaking annoying? Nothing worse than a white guy with dreadlocks.
I strongly support legalization, but your second sentence gave me a chuckle. If you need sunscreen or can't spend the day under a tropical sun wearing a red-yellow-green knit wool cap without sweating profusely, then you may be a rastafunder and you shouldn't be wearing dreads. In the same vein First Nations people shouldn't wear cowboy gear.
The worst thing about pot is the criminal enterprise that supplies it. Legalization and regulation would help to dismantle that enterprise.
I'm a Washingtonian. I do not imbibe in MJ (I have an inverse effect & puke my guts out) but I come home from work & sip a Cabernet or Valpolicella to relax. I certainly dont think that my neighbors who come home & smoke a bowl should be treated like a criminal. I voted FOR I-502. How the Feds will react, I'm not certain. If all three measures in all three states pass, it may be a more muted & reasonable reaction thanif just one did. For the record, I believe that Washington voters WILL vote for 502.
EMDF9A,I'm sorry to hear that MJ makes you ill.I've heard of people puking from hash but not MJ. Enjoy your spirits because grapes are full of antioxidants. If the truth be told I wonder how many politicians own stock in the liquor companies.
There are issues with pot, and States rights, at some point a state will tell the DEA to FO! and use the national gard to back up that stance! Then what does the DEA do? Shoot the National Gard? I'd love to see it! The DEA does not get the cash cow all to themselves anymore! All will get the green, in every respect! It is the states right to do this. prove us wrong!
Actually, yes. That's exactly what happens to people who point guns at Federal officers. They get shot. The Feds are vicious. Remember, these are the guys who killed over 600,000 Americans in the US Civil War. They have no problem at all with killing massive numbers of Americans. You try that bluff at your own peril. They absolutely will kill. I know they will, I was in the US Navy and if I were ordered to kill a man, then I'd do so without hesitation and without question. Follow orders, even to kill.
That's easy enough. 24 States sued in Federal Court to opt out of Obamacare this year and the US Supreme Court said that Federal Law trumps State Law so they can't. The States do not have the right to circumvent or override Federal Law. Arizona lost the lawsuit over SB 1070, our law against the damned despicable illegal aliens who cost Arizona taxpayers over a BILLION DOLLARS PER YEAR and the Feds sued Arizona. The courts sided with the Feds and said Arizona has to suck it up and keep on paying for the endless parade of welfare and crime caused by damned illegals even though the Feds won't do a damned thing about those parasites.
I'm just curious...if they told you to shoot your mom because they didn't like her(and they told you she was a drug dealer though you knew different), you would? Remember, you were ordered. Real question BTW.
I would not even hesitate. I wouldn't ask, I wouldn't care. Orders are orders.
There is no questioning an order. There is no refusing an order. There is only following an order.
In the old days of conscription, when soldiers were impressed (drafted) into the enemy army, do you know how they got them to fight? It's really easy.
Basically, the impressed soldier had 'friendly' guns at his back and 'enemy' guns at his front. If he didn't shoot the right way, then he got shot himself. Many times. His only hope of living to see another day was to follow orders.
So, about your question:
Ordered to shoot your Mom? Do it. She's dead anyway, because if you don't do it then somebody else will be ordered to, and they'll kill you as well. Then you're BOTH dead. The better choice is to shoot because that's the better outcome. It's the lesser evil.
MG- Come on! You have got to be kidding me right now. Orders are orders and you follow them no questions asked. If this scenario was real you would be jailed for murder and so would who ever issed that UNLAWFUL ORDER. Its alright you feel so strongly about something but to the point that you'd off your own mother just on a suspicion is wacked. It sees that you hatred could be stemming from fear. You might want to sit down and work something out.
No. I am not kidding. I do not question orders. If ordered to fire, I will fire. Hesitation loses wars. Never hesitate. Never question. Just do it.
True story, I was born left-handed. My second-grade teacher in Mulvane, Kansas told me that left-handed children were Satan Spawn and that I was NEVER to use my left hand to write with, to eat with, or to reach with. She was the AUTHORITY. When I questioned that authority, my parents sided with the teacher. I was seven years old when I figured out that you DO NOT question authority. EVER. I use my right hand to write now, even though I am preternaturally left handed.
I got my questioning of authority beat the hell out of me. I don't do that anymore.
Yep. Asking questions takes too long. Decision has been made. Decide first and then autopsy.
Don't care. I'm 48 years old now. I can kill anybody I want to and never face the death penalty for it because I've got 25 years of appeals. At this point, I would die of natural causes before this gutless nation could execute me no matter who I kill. I'm old enough that the death penalty doesn't even apply to me. So what have I got to lose? Anything? REALLY?
The main reason I don't go around killing people is because I'm ordered not to. It's illegal. Following orders. Orders say don't kill people. If the orders change, then that sucks but I will follow orders. All the time. Every time.
I do my best not to have feelings. I don't like emotions. They're illogical. Big boys don't cry. You try and appeal to my emotions and you'll find that I have none. No mercy. No love. All of that was beaten out of me as a child.
Law and Order. It's all I have left. No love. No mercy. Just the Law.
Concentration Camps in WW2 would have loved you.
MG- "Instant willing obedience to orders" has a fine line between right and wrong. It is training and trust between senior and junior that makes that concept work.
And you say you have no emotions? You've sounded quite emotional in each of your posts. "Big boys" is that what the Navy called there sailors back then? Well I can tell you that all the sailors I served with and still serve with are damn good "Men" and let me tell you, a real man can cry with his brothers-in-arms.
May 2008, 4 Marines KIA in IED attack in Iraq. One was my roomate and another was my mentor. The third was the father of 3. And finally, a strong willed young lady. And hell yes we shead tears. Its not weakness it GD respect.
All- Sorry for getting off topic
meangene - you would have made a nice little Nazi! They also tried to use the excuse "I was just following orders." Look at how many of those little suckers got executed after the war (not enough IMHO) and how many spent years in prison. I'll you something else, it is a lot harder to kill someone than you think it is, sanctioned or not, and it changes you forever.
I'll give you credit for a good imagination though, but you are not considering all the people around you who would probably willingly frag you if you were killing mothers and children because "you were ordered to. I have been that cold, emotionless person you claim to be and in retrospect I prefer the person I am today, I am at peace with myself after many years. I thank my wife daily for that. If you are what you claim I feel so sorry for you as you are missing life, trust me - black and white is no way to live.