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Provided by gzlegalcase.com
George Zimmerman's defense team on Monday posted this photo online, which was taken by a police officer on the night of Feb. 26, 2012.
The defense team for George Zimmerman on Monday posted a high-resolution color photo of the Florida neighborhood watch leader taken by police the night 17-year-old Trayvon Martin was fatally shot.
The Feb. 26 photo, which was previously released as a black-and-white photocopy, was provided as a high-resolution digital file to the defense on Oct. 29.
The shooting took place when Zimmerman encountered Martin, who was unarmed and walking through the Sanford, Fla., neighborhood where his father lives.
Earlier this year, Zimmerman, now 29, pleaded not guilty to a charge of second-degree murder in the shooting death of Martin. In the highly publicized case, which has drawn national attention, Zimmerman maintains that Martin attacked and beat him. In July, he was released from Seminole County Jail after posting $1 million bond. Zimmerman remains out on bail and is in seclusion.
Martin's family has called for a change in Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law, which allows the use of force in self-defense, when there is a reasonable belief of an unlawful threat.
Zimmerman's lawyers posted the following statement about the photo:
"This is a photo of George Zimmerman taken by a police officer on the night of February 26, 2012. A black and white photocopy of this image was provided by the State in the first Discovery. This high-resolution digital file was finally provided to the defense on October 29, 2012. This image was disclosed in the State's 9th Supplemental Discovery. In accordance with the updates to our media policy that we published on November 13, we will be making all public documents related to the case available on our website, including the rest of the State's 9th Supplemental Discovery as soon as we are sure it has been properly redacted according the the Court's stipulations on protecting information regarding specific witnesses."
A spokesperson for the office of Special Prosecutor Angela Corey did not immediately respond to an email request for comment Monday.
Benjamin Crump, an attorney for the Martin family, told NBC News the photo is not new evidence –- just a color version of a photograph that has already been seen.
“George Zimmerman profiled and pursued Trayvon,” Crump said. “Trayvon had every right to stand his ground.”
In a video clip from Feb. 27, 2012, released by his attorney, George Zimmerman takes investigators back to the scene of his shooting of Trayvon Martin. (George Zimmerman featured at 2:15)
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Leave a Comment:
Since this matter has still to go before a jury, why has the defense even posted this? Or has it already been declared inadmissible?
The jury is going to learn that Trayvon’s body was found 30 feet from the location that George pointed out as being where he shot Trayvon because his head was being pounded on the concrete.
Self-defense. Not guilty. Next case.
yup. Lesson here is to not punch people who have guns. No matter the circumstances- you'll be dead and they'll be walking.
The lesson is, keep your punk a$$ in your car and don't profile, chase down, and kill innocent kids. You will spend the rest of your life in prison if you do.
I know people are angry and want to use a conviction here as a symbol to fight racism.... I get that. People latch on to anything to advance their own causes. I know the state has to prosecute to keep the electorate happy and to put the responsibility to a jury. But its already a finished case- zimmerman will walk on this one.
Some do. But some want a conviction for bullying. I think Zimmerman was doing what he had been doing for a long time - being a faux cop. He admits it when he said they always get away. And he made sure he didn't get away didn't he. For doing nothing. And now Zimmerman knows exactly what he did. He got in over his head. Oh and by the way did the photo in the police station show a bloody lip. I don't remember seeing that did anyone else. And the real kicker to me is that the police car did not have any protection to keep blood from getting on the car. Why not? With the advent of aids that is one of their first priorities. The prosecution should point that out. I don't think there was that much blood at all. The defense just wants us to think their was. May truth prevail in this case. No matter who it favors.
It has nothing to do with "racism", it has to do with justice. Trayvon Martin was doing NOTHING WRONG, he was unarmed talking on his cell phone, walking back from the store...his only crime was being a "black male teen", nothing more. GZ was looking for black male teens, that is a fact.
I'm really sick of hearing GZ was in the right because crimes were being committed by black male teens...I live in a white neighborhood in SW Florida, and crimes are being committed by WHITE male teens (pill heads) and I sure don't want my white male teen children or their friends being murdered simply because they are "white male teens"....and yes, they all were hoodies in the rain...
sheesh
Well said, Jo-An. The same people would be just as adamant had it been a white kid that George chased down and killed.
How do we know Martin wasn't acting in self-defense, and perceived Zimmerman as a threat? Zimmerman had no business playing cop and approaching Martin.
could be true, but you cant convict on speculation like that. Again, don't punch people with guns. Its not about what is right or wrong, its just reality. Even if a racist pig is profiling you and baiting you to fight, don't take the bait and throw the first punch.
I think we can all assume he was. Who of us wouldn't at least try to defend ourselves. There is after all a stand your ground law for Trayvon to use.
You are correct ktlin60.
"Who of us wouldn't at least try to defend ourselves." And if you assault someone for simply approaching you, even if they are being an a$$hole, you are guilty of assault and battery.
And if you chase across a neighborhood, shoot and kill an unarmed kid just because he was wearing a hoodie and had Black skin, you go to prison for the rest of your life. You are quilty of second degree murder based on profiling.
"chase across a neighborhood, shoot and kill an unarmed kid just because he was wearing a hoodie and had Black skin" And what does that have to do with this case?
All this shows is that Trayvon fought back. If I were the defense I don't think I would have posted that. We know after all that Zimmerman was not taken to the hospital in an ambulance. I bet upon thinking about it he wishes he had been. Instead he is strolling in the police station with some little scratches or bruises. My son looked worse than that when he tripped and hit a sidewalk. But it was just superficial too. If Zimmerman had got a whaling he would have had a few more contusions don't you think? If Trayvon has no bruising on his fists that would indicate to me he was restrained by Zimmerman and he headbutted him. Which he had every right and obligation to do. I imagine that Zimmerman had his gun out and was trying to restrain Martin and he would have none of it. Then bang. This picture and the 911 calls does not contradict that at all. And I think Martin probably tried to get the gun, wouldn't you if it was pointed at you?
George Zimmerman will be found guilty of manslaughter. Obama owes the Latino community a favor so he will commute the sentence. Just a theory.
Ridiculous thought pattern.
Guilty or innocent, he sure is an ugly SOB.
People are already filling in for Trayvon, telling it like they were there instead of Trayvon. Unfortunately, Trayvon's not here any longer to give his testimony of what happened, so now people are just filling in the blanks with what they want to happen. We only have George's version to go with, so they should just end this trial on the basis of Stand Your Ground, judge George innocent in defending himself, then abolish Stand Your Ground. Not only to end the trial, but to keep other people from doing this exact same thing and get away with murder.
Steven-2432993, did you look at the evidence and read up on the law, Stand Your Ground? Zimmerman was not in any danger because he was the pursuer and Travis was the pursuee. If you was in Travis shoes being pursued by god knows what, you would try and defend yourself if backed into a corner. Travis screamed for help and know one came to his aid. Zimmerman shot him to shut him up and abused the Stand Your Ground law. Zimmerman caused this, not Travis. Travis was minding his own business. Zimmerman was told to stay put and let the police handle this. But no, Zimmerman went after Travis. Clear cause of premeditated murder.
Also for the record, the picture that his defense just put out on the is a ploy. Zimmerman was fatter when he was first arrested. And he did not have that jacket on.
"Zimmerman was not in any danger because he was the pursuer and Travis was the pursuee." George only followed for 10-12 seconds. Then 4 minutes later Martin returned and confronted George. That most certainly does NOT make George the pursuer. George was in danger because he was the one assaulted and beaten.
InterestedObserver78,
...you really need to look at all the evidence, listen to the non emergency call, and then look and listen to GZ's reenactment, they do NOT line up. Someone is lying, and it can only be GZ.
WRONG, wrong, wrong. Do a little research.
Why should we take the word of a proven liar, and not allow the evidence to speak for the victim, Stephen?
Jo-an, I have done extensive reading of the evidence and unlike some posters, I am not swayed by the color of the participants skin. I stand by the conclusions I posted above. It's what is logically inferred from all of the credible evidence.
Really? Please explain...
Where do you come up with that?
Just like with every other lie he's (as in InterestedObserver) posted, it was from his fairy guide that lives in the fairy tale world where evidence doesn't matter and lies are normal behavior.
This photo looks staged to me. When GZ was first arrested he was a fat slob, and in this photo he looks as skinny as he is now. I think it's a ploy...
I agree.
Posting pictures, the defense knows Zimmerman will be found guilty. If people take the time and read up on the law, "Stand Your Ground", it outlined when this law can be used to protect the victim from going to jail because he or she was protecting themselves from immediate threat caused by the person who started the threatening situtation. Zimmerman after ignoring the orders from the 911 dispatcher PURSUED Travis. This made Zimmerman the threatening person and Travis the victim. Think about it, if you was Travis and realized you was being pursued, with all the dangers in todays world, you would be scared out of your mind. When Travis tried to get away from his attacker (in his mind), Travis yelled for help, Zimmerman pounced on him to stop and shut him up. After hearing the audio couple times and compared it to Zimmerman's voice it is very evident that the person shouting for help was Travis. The Stand your Ground law applied to Travis because HE was the victim trying to defend himself. Zimmerman, in reality lost his claim to this law when he pursued Travis after ignoring the dispatcher's order to not to pursue Travis. If Travis went after Zimmerman then Zimmerman would of have a very strong case. If Zimmerman is not found guilty of this murder I can see major riots taking place in Florida, because you can look at this case at every angle, the bottom line is that Zimmerman should of have not pursued Travis. This shows Zimmerman went looking for danger. Anyone who is in danger would tried to get as far away fromdanger as possible. But in Zimmerman's cause he is the starter of this messed up situtation and caused the death of an innocent teenager. All for what?? Zimmerman, destroyed his and Travis's family because of his own stupidity. If Zimmerman would of listened to the dispatcher and let the police handle this a life would of been spared. The stand your ground law is widely abused and need to be revamped.
So much misinformation. George was the one who was confronted, assaulted, beaten and who was yelling for help. Review the evidence.
InterestedObserver78,
You are the one that needs to "review the evidence".
Show us where the evidence shows
All you have is ZimmerLIAR's word...
Evidently, Interested Observer is gullible. I have a bridge to sell her.
If you think he looks bad now, wait until he is on the wrong end of a prison shower party.
next innocent person that i chase, hound like a dog, and intimidate who then turns around and punches me in the nose to keep me from chasing and threatening them... i'm going to shoot them in the face. that seems reasonable.
You just upset that Crayon brought a bag of skittles to a gun fight.
Robert, your callous post says a lot about you.
Robert, why aren't you in that 4th grade classroom where you belong? You will never make anything of yourself by skipping school.
They NEVER would have appointed a "special prosecutor" ...if they thought for one second they had a case. Also under any state law...if your under attack, you have the right to defend yourself,NO MATTER who started the attack! Zimmerman most probably WILL walk.
I doubt he will walk. You have the right to defend yourself is true, but if you are the cause and was told from an official from the office of the law to stay put, then you stay put and let the authories handle the matter. That is what we, the tax payers, pay the police for protection.
Doby think carefully, the law thru out the land, for example, if a bank robber open fires at a police officer after he was told to give up and if the police bullet accidently hit an innocent person, that bank robber is now charged with murder because, THE BANK ROBBER STARTED THE SHOOTOUT. If the bank robber would of given up without shots fired a life is spared. It is in the law books.
In Zimmerman's case, he was told to stay put. He ignored the dispatcher and went SEEKING TROUBLE. So the law, Stand Your Ground is no longer in Zimmerman's favor but more Travis because he is now the victim. If Zimmerman would of stay put or if Travis pursued Zimmerman, then and only then can Zimmerman claim Stand Your Ground because he was threatened.
So what you are saying is if I run up to you and punch you in the face and you fought back to defend yourself, Only I would get not locked up for battery and assault? Even if I caused the fight, I would walk. I think not.
"In Zimmerman's case, he was told to stay put." No, he was not. Review the evidence. The rest of post shows a fuzzy understanding of the law.
He was asked if he was following Trayvon, he responded that he was...he was told "we don't need you to do that"...
GZ continued to follow...errrr...I mean "go in same direction" as Trayvon, and then....
It's all on the audio...
Thanks Republicans
Not sure what case you are speaking about...
InterestedObserver78 already corrected you about what was stated... Even Jo-An-4354969 tells you that and refers you to the recording of the calls that night.
Dispatcher is not a LEO and has NO police powers. The dispatcher is a civilian employee of the COUNTY who has the job of gathering information from callers and requesting appropriate resources be deployed.
Once Trayvon "lost" George there was no imminent threat, if there ever was one in the first place. BOTH of them had the legal right to move freely along the common area of the community. The question remains just how Trayvon and George managed to come into contact if Trayvon was in such fear that he was heading home.
They appointed a special prosecutor to review the evidence and see if the county prosecutor was fulfilling his duties. He was found not to be.
And of relaying instructions on appropriate responses by the caller. This old argument isn't going to help George in the least in a court of law. It's tatamount to a 4 year old saying, "But you didn't tell me to use soap when I washed my hands!"
That Zimmerman may have had a bloodied and broken nose contributes absolutely nothing toward Zimmerman's claim of self defense and "stand your ground".
I wonder if you were on the end of that beating what your dumb ass would be saying then.
Trayvon had none of GZ's DNA on his hands, fingernails, or shirt sleeves, and yet George says Trayvon put one hand on his nose and one on his mouth in order to smother George.
Click> Zimmerman's Gravity --
All the blood on George's head ran down which indicates he could not have been on the bottom with Trayvon on top. If George had been on the bottom the blood would have been smudged and smeared and not in the trickle lines seen in this video.
"Trayvon had none of GZ's DNA on his hands," This statement does follow logically from the evidence as Martin's hands were NOT tested for blood or DNA. You do not help this discussion be posting incorrect information, particularly after you have been corrected numerous times.
YES, Trayvon's hands WERE tested for DNA, go read the evidence!
See Page 106 of the first evidence dump (183 pages total)
I know of nothing that's been released to indicate that Martin's hands where not tested for blood or DNA. There are, however, official reports that found one small abrasion on one of Martin's fingers, and none of his DNA on the gun,
you all have thoughtful comments
Gets old... DNA does not always transfer.. nor does it solve EVERY case. In other threads you make the claim that George was in contact with Trayvon.. I believe there was ONE mixed sample proven to be both Trayvon and George on Trayvon. I guess that doesn't count?
You are really chalking up the wrong answers. Better go check those lab reports.
And while you are at it, please do explain how Trayvon Martin "repeatedly punched George in the face", "repeatedly slammed George's head into the concrete", and covered his mouth and nose (which was bleeding, according to this doctored photo), and ended up with none of George's DNA on any area that would have come in contact with that DNA. Seriously, explain that one.
Jo-An, Page 106 refers to the fingernail scrapings. HIS HANDS WERE NEVER TESTED. Good grief, woman, how much more clearly can anyone put it!
Interested - are you just being intentionally obtuse or is your reading comprehension really that bad? After the info on the fingernails, the lab report goes on to state there is no DNA foreign to TM on his right or left hand and continued on page 107 it talks about his cuffs and sleeves. Guess you missed all that - now who is only seeing what they want to see?
This whole thing is getting pretty boring. How about we all wait and see what happens at the trial? Not a single word typed by anyone of us will affect the outcome of it, and that's the way things are supposed to work.
Looks like a boxer after 18 rounds. No doubt its a real picture taken by the police, he's sitting in the back seat of a police car.
Funny
Someone got beat and someone got killed. Happens everyday in this country. Get on with the trial already.
It is obvious from this picture that Trayvon Martin was in fear of, and fighting for his life. Too bad he couldnt have hit Zimmerman one more time, maybe then he would still be alive.
The only thing obvious is the stupid assumption you make based on a photograph. Oh thats right you were an eyewitness. You prove can't fix stupid.
So now EVERYONE in American can have a free ticket to shoot and kill someone as long as the shooter can produce a picture of his bloody nose?
No you need to go to court and get aquitted by a jury of your peers. then as you say its a free ticket.
Guess George might not get acquitted by the jury because Trayvon's body was found 30 feet from the location that George pointed out as being where he shot Trayvon because his head was being pounded on the concrete.
Yep, George's whole claim to being "in fear for his life" was based on the fact that" he shot while his head was being pounded into the concrete, and he was being smothered". Yet, Trayvon's body was located 30 feet away from any concrete surface that would have made that possible.
"Trayvon's body was located 30 feet away from any concrete surface" Liar. Martin's body within about 6-8 feet of a concrete sidewalk. Pretty much consistent with actions related by Zimmerman, the police, and EMS.
InterestedObserver78
LOL..do you have any comprehension of the crime scene?
GZ told the cops the encounter began at the "T", and his flashlight and keys were found at the T. Yet Trayvon's body was found 30 feet BEYOND the T, closer to his destination...
So Jo-An let's explain this to Mr. Obtuse just a little further. So if the altercation happened at the T like GZ said - then that means:
!) GZ was on the ground being beaten within an inch of his life (HAHA) and Trayvon was on top him with his 4 hands just going all Jackie Chan on GZ and going for the gun
2) GZ thinks he is about to lose consciousness (yea right), so he pulls out his gun and shots TM in the heart.
3) GZ rolls Trayvon - now wait for it cause this is CLIMAX of the play - 30 feet from the T (the site of the confrontation and shot) climbs on TM's back and pulls his hands out to make sure there is no weapon. Of course, somehow even though he has been shot through the heart and died almost instantly, TM pulls his hands back under enough himself and that is how the cops found him.
WOW - that was one hell of a roll, and miracle of miracles, TM actually moves his arms and hands after he has passed!!!
LOL...yup that about sums things up!
Come on down to Florida, the only state in the union where you can kill someone and get away with it while waiting to vote.
LOL...
JOHN-2512182
Seems Chicago holds that distinction. vote early, vote often.
Sore loser, Crusty?
We are discussing an incident that happened in Florida. Get out a map, please.
FACT - Zimmerman did not smash his own nose or back of head. (Forensically ruled out)
FACT - Zimmerman had a legal permit to carry that no HOA or POA could legally prohibit him from carrying. (On legal record)
FACT - Floridas "Stand Your Ground Law" allows people to confront head on any threat to their life that they may perceive without having to wait to get stabbed, shot, or killed read ANYONE - even 15 y/o boys. (Read the law)
FACT - TM was in an area that had been robbery prone by individuals looking, acting, and behaving like TM did the night he was killed. Does that make him a thug - no; does it make him someone that a local resident might THINK was a potential danger in the dark of night - ABSOLUTELY. (Subsequent police and FBI reports)
FACT - This case has been turned into a media approved cause and circus by the same people that always stream out of the wood-work every time a person-of-color is killed by a white, and the media has been complicit in molding pubic opinion and prejudice against George Zimmerman since Day 1. (Anyone that doesn't believe this has been living on the moon)
SAD FACT - Juries are oftentimes made up with some of the dumbest people the prosecution and defense can find, since intelligent people on juries can often wade through the BS that the lawyers try to imply. THIS is why people like OJ and Anthony get away with murder while others are locked up on circumstantial evidence. (Just sit on a jury or watch the Simpson and Anthony trial.)
Fact--Trayvon was simply walking home from the store and had every right not to be bothered by a stranger with totally unfounded suspicions.
FACT: IF GEORGE Zimmerman would not have played law enforcement that night and followed and threatened the kid this would have never happened.
FACT: Stand your ground applies IF you are the victim not the agressor> zimmerman Started the contact/agression, he had no self defense or stand your graoun. If that is the case every robbery in which the victim is killed would be self defense , if the victim is killed defending him/herself.
JP, your list, in order:
Zimmerman did not smash his own nose or back of head. (Forensically ruled out) - you made that up.
Zimmerman had a legal permit to carry that no HOA or POA could legally prohibit him from carrying. (On legal record) - irrelevant, the policy disallows it.
Floridas "Stand Your Ground Law" allows people to confront head on any threat to their life that they may perceive without having to wait to get stabbed, shot, or killed read ANYONE - even 15 y/o boys. - wrong, the aggressor cannot "stand ground" when the victim responds.
TM was in an area that had been robbery prone by individuals looking, acting, and behaving like TM did the night he was killed. Does that make him a thug - no; does it make him someone that a local resident might THINK was a potential danger in the dark of night - ABSOLUTELY. Not at all - Zimmerman was in his truck, supposedly driving out of the complex, not remotely threatened.
This case has been turned into a media approved cause and circus by the same people that always stream out of the wood-work every time a person-of-color is killed by a white, and the media has been complicit in molding pubic opinion and prejudice against George Zimmerman since Day 1 - that's merely your opinion, not a verifiable fact.
Juries are oftentimes made up with some of the dumbest people the prosecution and defense can find, since intelligent people on juries can often wade through the BS that the lawyers try to imply. THIS is why people like OJ and Anthony get away with murder while others are locked up on circumstantial evidence. - while there may be some truth to your jury analysis, OJ and Anthony were found not guilty because the prosecution failed to prove their cases beyond a reasonable doubt.
"had every right not to be bothered by a stranger" thoughful, I don't know where you get your screwy ideas about U.S. laws, but no one has a right to not be "bothered" while walking in a public place.
Rick: (MY ANSWERS IN ALL CAPS)
Zimmerman had a legal permit to carry that no HOA or POA could legally prohibit him from carrying. (On legal record) - irrelevant, the policy disallows it. -- IRRELAVANT. THE POLICY IS NOT LEGALLY BINDING AND STATE LAWS TRUMP VOLUNTARY GUIDELINES.
Floridas "Stand Your Ground Law" allows people to confront head on any threat to their life that they may perceive without having to wait to get stabbed, shot, or killed read ANYONE - even 15 y/o boys. - wrong, the aggressor cannot "stand ground" when the victim responds. --YOU MISSED THE ORIGINAL POINT. AND EVEN THOUGH AN AGGRESSOR CANNOT CLAIM SYG, HE CAN STILL CLAIM STRAIGHT SELF-DEFENSE UNDER CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES
TM was in an area that had been robbery prone by individuals looking, acting, and behaving like TM did the night he was killed. Does that make him a thug - no; does it make him someone that a local resident might THINK was a potential danger in the dark of night - ABSOLUTELY. Not at all - Zimmerman was in his truck, supposedly driving out of the complex, not remotely threatened. -- YOU MISSED THE POINT AGAIN. THE OP MEANT A DANGER TO THE COMMUNITY IN GENERAL.
Goodness. It appears that Interested Observer is getting frustrated with her lies and misinformation being corrected. All caps and bold! LOL
But still just as wrong, misinformed, and untruthful.
Come on down to Florida, the only state in the Union where you can kill someone and get away with it while waiting to vote.
Skittles was a hoodrat plain and simple. Can we just set Mr. Zimmerman free now and dispense with the circus. I've never seen a clearer case of self defense in my life.
Trayvon was not a "hoodrat".
You people.
Self defense? Zimmerman initiated the contact/agression , that is not self defense.
Dennis says:
December 4, 2012
I uploaded a graphic showing the doctored photo and the real photo side by side for a rough size approximation. Just look at how swollen and huge his nose is while he is sitting in the police car. Then look at the photo of him at the police station after he was cleaned up. His nose is the normal size. Swelling magically gone..poof.
click> http://tinypic.com/r/nycxax/6
you all have thoughtful comments
the real photo? seems the photo in question has been squeezed down quite a bit for the compare..
and George was treated at the scene.. how long after the incident was the official police photo taken?
Seems as though YAHTC is attempting to suppress this evidence. She has posted (reposted) the same post about 10+ times now.
Is she worried? A picture is worth a thousand words.
LOL
A fellow posted wrote..
Response to YAHTC..
Why do you keep posting the same thing over and over
And another wrote....
you all have thoughtful comments
I can see Georges broken face just fine in this very article, no need to follow a link to your biased BS information
And this...
No this person must somehow be on the prosecution team every time a TM/Zimmerman post comes they say the same crap over and over like somehow this time its true. They have NO idea how things work in the real work apparently.
Or the best one yet....
@ you all I have performed Crime Scene Investigations, not played one on a blog, and You cannot be serious about you statement or your theory. In other words you don't have a clue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LMAO on her feeble attempts to "seek justice"
And then her "plea" to the very community that collaspsed her comments (22 of them on page 1 alone)..
you all have thoughtful comments Comment collapsed by the community
If you click on the words "comment collapsed by community" on my post above, you can read what I wrote.
How ironic is that?????
LOL
Then, obviously, you have never seen a case of self defense at all.
Wrong. George was cleaned up at the scene. No treatment rendered. No so much as a cold pack.
Swelling increases in the first 24 hours after an injury. His nose would have been MORE swollen in any photograph taken after this one. Especially since a cold pack was not even applied to control swelling.
Hi, ric. Get too dark under the fridge for you?
ric----Since you are from the Zimmerman support group, I would expect you to talk as you do and to quote some of those on your side. No Trayvon advocate has ever whined about what I post.
Also, you were not here last night to know that I reposted collapsed comments one at a time.
Most of my comments are collapse by the Zimmerman side because they point to George's guilt and his lies.
I will not stop just because you choose to bully me.
By the way, it is very important to see the two photos of George's nose side by side at
Click> http://tinypic.com/r/nycxax/6
because as Dennis says--
If George hadn't been stalking him, he never would've been punched. He's lucky this is all he got. Trayvon was trying to protect himself. Period. Only problem is George got pissed off and shot and killed him. And what took so long to show this picture? I hope not to drum up sympathy.
Terry McMillan/Writer
If you actually read the article, you would discover that the PROSECUTION did not turn over the picture until very recently. If you haven't looked, it is a picture taken in the back seat of a squad car. I'll surmise it was taken by a police officer at the scene, although that is admittedly NOT indicated. But it has been in the hands of the authorities from day one, so you'll need to ask them why it hasn't surfaced till now.
Another troll eyewitness.
Terry McMillan/Writer,
Correct!
Dennis says:
December 4, 2012
I uploaded a graphic showing the doctored photo and the real photo side by side for a rough size approximation. Just look at how swollen and huge his nose is while he is sitting in the police car. Then look at the photo of him at the police station after he was cleaned up. His nose is the normal size. Swelling magically gone..poof.
click> http://tinypic.com/r/nycxax/6
How do you know which is the doctored one?
I don't care how his face looked that night. He went looking for trouble , he followed and pursued the kid. THAT IS NOT SELF DEFENSE OR STAND YOUR GROUND. He was the agressor that night, Trevon defended himself and was murdered. Trevon had the right to defend himself and inflicted whatever injuries he could on Zimmerman. Again if you initiate the agression IS NOT SELF DEFENSE. Period, no matter how bloody he looks.
JAXRAD
As I wasn't there I can't say who is guilty. Are you on the witness list? You appear to have such extensive knowledge of the events of that evening, you must be.
XDm9mm - The 911 tape summed it up quite nicely. The 911 operator told him to stay in his car and wait for the police. He made the decision to get out of the car and confront him. You can't initiate the incident then claim Stand Your Ground as defense.
Jaxrad,
We don't know who started anything. Who ever laid their hand on the other first is to blame. If GZ grabbed TM then he should face the consequences, but he still had the right to not be beaten to a pulp. If TM, as indicated by GZ, came out of nowhere and punched him then self-defense will stand. Had GZ not fired a shot, how do we know that he wouldn't have been killed in the beating? We don't know because GZ defended himself. There is a fear there that his life was in danger or in danger of great bodily harm if the beating continued. A normal level headed person wouldn't fly off the handle and attack someone because they were being followed. A normal person would run like a mother to get away. Especially if they are an athelete. If the girlfirend's phone call is correct, and GZ is heard saying what are you doing here, then TM has no reason to feel threatened as he was a guest in the community and should have simply stated he was going to his dad's girlfriends house and went on his merry way. GZ while not reccommended to follow or confront someone, he does have every right to since he was inside his gated community, and based on prior crimes in the neighborhood found someone to be suspicious. You know darn well that if you had 6 or 8 breakins in the last year you would be suspicious of anyone that fit the description. I would even after the first breakin. In the 7 years that my development has been in existance we have had no crime what so ever. The first one would put everyone on edge. After 6 or 8 I'm sure we would have armed patrols going thru the development.
"The 911 operator told him to stay in his car and wait for the police. " No, that is not what happened. He was not talking to 911, he was never told to stay in his car, and he was never told to wait for the police. You might want to review the evidence in this case.
SKUP,
He's not advised to go back to his car until he is already out of the vehicle. You can hear him breathing heavy before he was advised. Once he said ok the breathing started to slow down as if he was returning to his car. Besides, a dispatcher in FL has no lawful authority to issue commands. They can only make suggestions for the safety of the caller.
It doesn't matter what the 911 operators authority was. Zimmerman had no standing whatsoever to confront Martin. Period. The 911 tape clearly shows he was pursuing him. He can't claim Stand Your Ground.
911 dispatcher:
Are you following him? [2:24]
Zimmerman:
Yeah. [2:25]
911 dispatcher:
OK.
We don’t need you to do that. [2:26]
Zimmerman:
OK. [2:28]
SKUP,
He was already out of the car. Everything points to GZ at 2:28 going back to his vehicle.
Skup--"Zimmerman had no standing whatsoever to confront Martin"-- no "standing" is required. Anyone can walk up to anyone else in public and say "what are you doing here?" That's legal and you can't assault someone for asking you that.
InterestedObserver,
He had every right to ask TM what he was doing there. They were insided the gates of a gated community which is PRIVATE PROPERTY, and as a resident GZ has every right to ask a stranger what they are doing on private property.
If GZ was "already out of his car" when told not to follow (and he was) the rest of his story doesn't line up with the non emergency call. The prosecution will connect those dots and prove that GZ continued to follow Trayvon after being told "we don't need you to do that".
Georges non emergency call and his reenactment video do NOT line up. He is LYING!
Then why didn't he??
Jo-An,
According to TM girlfriend, GZ is heard saying what are you doing here, and TM is heard saying why are you following me. We don't know at what point that took place or if the girlfriend is leaving anything out. So, it does appear that GZ did ask what TM was doing there. The only question is who committed a crime first? Was it TM punching GZ or did GZ put his hands on TM first. That is where self-defense boils down to. Nothing else matters, because no laws were broken prior to physical contact.
"Then why didn't he??" According Martin's 18-yr-old friend, he did when Martin confronted him. Before that, I suspect he was trying to avoid a confrontation.
"did GZ put his hands on TM first. " And if he did to what extent?
Because Martin used force likely to cause serious bodily harm or death, which is unwarranted if, say, Zimmerman simply put a hand on his arm and said "let's wait for the cops". Or even if Zimmerman grabbed his hoodie, that's still not a serious enough threat for Martin's response.
According to Trayvon's girlfriend, Trayvon asked GZ "why are you following me."
GZ tells a different story, he says Trayvon asked him if he had a problem, to which he replied "no"...nowhere does GZ say he asked Trayvon "what are you doing here".
Who is this 18 year old friend?
You really need to review the evidence, you spin quite a bunch of lies...like all good GZ supporters....truth doesn't matter!
GZ says he reached in his pocket for his phone...I'd say it's more likely that he reached for his gun. And probably reached for his hoodie as well, judging by the evidence.
Jo-An,
Phone records confirm that Trayvon Martin, the unarmed 17-year-old shot and killed by neighborhood watchman George Zimmerman, was on the phone with his 16-year-old girlfriend at the time of the shooting. The girl, who has remained anonymous, says Martin was followed and then cornered by a mysterious man just before he was shot.
The girl relayed the conversation in an interview with a lawyer:
Jo-An,
Hearsay or speculation doesn't hold up in court. Based on facts that have been presented thus far, and witness accounts it was Self-defense. Sure there's all kinds of should haves and why didn'ts, but those don't really matter in legal proceedings.
And then the phone goes dead...
OKAY? Now, let's compare the girlfriends version with GZ's version...
GZ say's FIRST, Trayvon jumped out of the bushes and started attacking him, SECOND, that Trayvon hollered over to him "you got a problem Homey?" or THIRD, Trayvon walked up to him and said "you got a problem?" to which GZ simply answered "no" and then reached for his phone, and was punched...
Which of these versions matches the girlfriends version? The 16 year old girlfriends version.
GZ NEVER admitted to the police that he asked Trayvon why he was there, never.
Review the audio, it's all on gzlegal.com
You can send money too, which is why this picture is being shown right now. GZ and his wife are hungry...
Jo-An,
You're right. The phone goes dead. Was that because TM started attacking or was he pushed? That we don't know for sure, but all the evidence in the case shows GZ was attacked.
You try taking someone's life in self-defense and see if your story has the same exact words every time. I'm sure you would leave things out, and the next time remember a part and add.
The phone went dead because Trayvon hung up the call in anticipation of confronting GZ.
Listen to the conference Crump held in March announcing the "girl friend" statement to ABC News. Crump brain farts and almost states Trauvon hung up the call, then catches himself .......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kevsJM2mLqk
Listen closely and watch Crump's lips at 3:25 to 3:50 on the recording.
Dawgfan-4710266 - A dead TM points to him getting back out of the car. No matter how you slice it he got out of the car and confronted TM. You can't confront someone then claim self defense when it doesn't go the way you think it will.
Then how, exactly, did he end up further away from his vehicle?
And the person being asked has just as much right to respond, "WTF business is it of yours?"
George had more than one opportunity to identify himself and reasonably express his concerns. He did not do that.
As a guest of a resident of the community, Trayvon Martin had just as much right to be exactly where he was as did George Zimmerman.
Re: the "stranger" slant...George could not even remember the name of 3 freaking streets in the neighborhood after having lived there over 2 years. I doubt seriously he had the ability to recognize on sight every resident or every guest of every resident. That stranger BS is just that, BS.
Where is the evidence of serious bodily harm or death? The only serious bodily harm and death is that inflicted on Trayvon Martin according to all the evidence that has been released, including EMT records and documentation from George's physician's office.
The evidence shows that had George Zimmerman not taken it upon himself to play cop, he would never have been a position to be attacked. George put himself in proximity to Trayvon Martin, after Trayvon Martin had moved in a direction AWAY from George, thus creating to threat what so ever to George Zimmerman's safety or well being. George made the decision to follow after someone who was indeed, minimizing the chance of a confrontation. That is called being the aggressor.
Nothing more than your biased opinion. There is no evidence what so ever to support that conclusion.
Still no evidence what so ever to support your opinion. Grasping at straws.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kevsJM2mLqk
Youtube? Really, ric? How many times have you derided others for using Youtube to support their posts in this case? Hypocrit. LMAO
@Skup & DOCJT,
If you have read any of the police statements, watched re-enactment video, or any of the interviews you would know that GZ was headed back to his car when he was confronted. He didn't get back to his car and get out again. If you also listen to some of the recordings you would hear that GZ had pulled into the clubhouse and told the non-emergency person that he lost sight and was at the clubhouse. The Non-emergency person asked if GZ could get to a place that he could see TM. You have to watch/listen to the full length recordings and not the edited down versions provided by the media.
Here is a cut/paste of when justifiable force is ok outside the home, residence, or auto according to the Florida law 776.013.
From what we know about the case self-defense was completely justified.
DOCJT,
The stranger angle has merit. If you had 6-8 breakins in your neighborhood withing the past year, wouldn't you be a bit suspicious about someone wandering in the dark while raining that fits the description from every one of the past breakins? If there was one breakin in my community I would stop everyone that meets that description that is inside our gates and not accompanied by a resident. We have 90 homes, so it's pretty easy to get to know everyone and tell who is a resident and who doesnt' belong. Not to mention that we have bright neon green visitor badges that are required by visitors.
Dawgfan-4710266
Although your post holds strong merit, Doc will go right to the "TM was profiled" "TM had a right to be there", "GZ had no authority" "TM was committing no crime" "TM was just walking home" BS.
Doesn't matter that TM appeared "out of place" that night in GZ's eyes.
Doesn't matter that previous documented incidents in the complex were due to young Black male strangers being on a property that they should not have been.
No. According to Doc, GZ sought out only young Black males to investigate. Perhaps, one might reasonably conclude, because that had been the pattern of the prior incidents? Young Black males that were on the property that perhaps should not have been? Remember, the prior incidents were documented, not fabricated. And GZ began his call to dispatch as "there have been a lot of recent breakins in the neighborhood..."
Doesn't sound so far fetched that GZ might be somewhat suspicious.
According to Doc, that would not hold true if the person wandering about was a Black male. Then you would, according to Doc, automatically be "profiling".
LMAO
Too much here to respond to all of it, so a few things:
"that had George Zimmerman not taken it upon himself to play cop, he would never have been a position to be attacked." Doc, that's like telling a rape victim, "well if you hadn't worn such a sexy dress, you wouldn't have invited being raped." The fact is that even if Zimmerman did not do a good job of watching out for danger once he was out of his vehicle, MArtin still had no legal or moral right to assault him
Jo-an, the girl that Martin was on the phone with was 18. At least she gave a sworn statement to the prosecutor to that effect. Crump and others have been mis-stating her age for months now.
Also, Zimmerman only followed for 10-12 seconds some 4 minutes before MArtin started the confrontation. How many times does that need to be explained to you all that that does NOT make Zimmerman the "aggressor".
InterestedObserver,
She was 18? Would that constitute statutory rape charges against her?
Dawgfan, not sure in Florida. But that would also assume that she and Martin had had sex. The girl denied being Martin's girlfriend (she said they were just friends) but given the extremely poor example Martin's father set for the kid, I wouldn't be surprised.
I have read all of the evidence in the case, more than once. And, had George Zimmerman headed back to his vehicle at the time he was advised to do so, instead of continuing to follow Trayvon Martin, even by George's own words in the re-enactment, he would have been closer to his vehicle, not closer to Trayvon Martin.
No one said he did.
That is a complete fabrication. The dispatcher never made such a request.
I have. On many occasions. And no where did the dispatcher instruct George Zimmerman to maintain surveillance, or to move to a location where he could observe Trayvon Martin.
And that would apply perfectly to the situation Trayvon Martin was placed in by George Zimmerman.
Perhaps from what you know. All of the evidence would suggest otherwise.
No, it doesn't. And for exactly the reasons I stated earlier. There was no way for George Zimmerman to accurately determine who had a right to be in the area and who didn't. Just because he did not recognize Trayvon Martin does not mean that Trayvon Martin was a stranger. Unless George knew, by sight, every single resident and every single guest of every single resident, he was in no position to make that determination.
Wrong. You are quite confused. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman. Your support of George Zimmerman's victimization of Trayvon Martin is like telling a rape victim they are responsible for their victimization. You are reversing the analogy.
Then you would no doubt find yourself arrested for harrassment. You have no authority to do so.
Incorrect. Compare the time lines of the dispatch call, the witness calls, and the time of the gunshots.
5:05-5:15 of the above video. GZ says non-emergency told him to get to a place he can see TM. That should be in a recording from the police department.
Yes, I will. Because as much as you hate it, it is the truth, and it is a fact of the law.
Too subjective. Based on what? All that gives George Zimmerman the right to do is report the individual. Not to take any sort of action what so every beyond reporting.
Incorrect. The one Black male arrested actually lived in the complex, so he was not a stranger at all. As far as the other incidents, even the SPD has stated that there is no evidence what so ever to support the conclusion that all the break ins were committed by young Black men.
I see you engage in the same type of profiling George Zimmerman did. One Black guy was arrested, so all Black guys must be about to do a break in. Pfft.
Actually, that would be according to the 28 pages of documented calls that George Zimmerman made to the SPD. And George Zimmerman had no authority to investigate anyone. He was a private citizen, not an investigator nor a police officer.
Trayvon Martin was not "wandering". He was walking home.
George SAYS the dispatcher told him that. The audio of the call shows that the dispatcher never told George to get to a place where he could see Trayvon. That is just one example of George's numerous lies.
"You are quite confused. Trayvon Martin is the victim, not George Zimmerman. Your support of George Zimmerman's victimization of Trayvon Martin is like telling a rape victim they are responsible for their victimization. You are reversing the analogy." No. Zimmerman is the victim. My analogy is apt
"Then you would no doubt find yourself arrested for harrassment. You have no authority to do so." Wrong again. Look up the legal definition of harassment and, again, you do not need any "authority" to ask people what they are doing somewhere.
If you are stopping everyone in your neighborhood to ask them what they are doing there because they fit some sort of a profiling description you have in your bigoted little head, you are harrassing people. Instead of telling others to look these things up, you might try looking them up yourself.
You can ask me what I am doing somewhere. I don't have to respond, I can respond with "WTF business is it of yours, and if you have followed me across the neighborhood without every asking me what I am doing, I have the right to defend myself from your advances. If you want to stop me and ask me what I am doing, you'd better have probable cause and a badge.
DOCJT,
If you are inside the gates of my community and you don't have a visitor's badge on, then I have every right to assume you are trespassing in our community. That is why we have gates and the perimeter of the property fenced off to keep people that are not residents out. You have no right to self-defense when there is no force being exerted on you. Someone following you and asking what your business is on private property is not a forceable felony, nor is it life threatening or giving reason to believe that great bodily harm will occur. In my community we stop people that don't have a badge for their own safety. We have a gun range within the gates of our community and we would hate it if someone trespassing wanders onto that range and get's hit.
Since when do visitors in a gated community have to wear visitors badges, lol? Now you are just being silly.
No, you don't have the right to assume that at all. And if you act on that assumption, you are stepping out of line. Living in a gated community does not give you the authority to harrass people.
And the gates allowed Martin in. In fact, the gates were wide open.
If you try to stop me from going where I am going by interfering with my right to do so, you are being aggressive, and I have the right to defend myself against your aggression.
I doubt seriously that you live in a gated community, and I know you don't have people wandering around looking for people without badges on. That is a lawsuit waiting to happen. You are nothing more than a private citizen. You have the right to report. You do not have the authority to act to detain, either by questioning or any other method.
Do you by chance live on the grounds of a state hospital, or a prison compound?
Now stop making stuff up.
DOCJT,
Actually it's a 4,000 acher community. Average home price is $400,000. We don't have people wandering around looking for trespassers. I never said that. If we see someone without a badge as we go in and out of the community then we will stop them. Our gate is always closed. There is a little thing called a Citizens Arrest, and Yes, as a private citizen I could possibly detain you if you are trespassing on our property. Yeah, I am a private citizen and I intend to keep it that way.
"If you are stopping everyone in your neighborhood to ask them what they are doing there ... you are harrassing people." -- Since you couldn't be bothered to do your own homework, I'll tell you. Harassment requires LEGALLY repeated acts directed at a single person. Asking five people the same question is not harassment. Asking a single person the same question five times, after they have asked you to stop, could qualify as harassment.
"and if you have followed me across the neighborhood without every asking me what I am doing, I have the right to defend myself from your advances." -- You CANNOT assault someone simply for following you. And if you use force likely to cause serious bodily harm or death in response to someone physically stopping you and asking you a non-threatening question, then your a$$ will also end up in jail.
I've explained this so many times I think I'll just call this copy-paste response #1 since it doesn't seem to be sinking into your thick skull and I grow tired of retyping it.
See, here is where you little tale falls apart. If your gate is always closed, how are tespassers getting in?
And you might want to check out the law of Citizen's Arrest. You have to witness someone committing a felony to enact a citizen's arrest. Trespassing is a misdemeanor.
Then stop repeating yourself. You are just as wrong everytime you repeat it.
You mean Shellie is probably fed up with George. I want to see how long they stay together. I bet she is tired of keeping him tamed down with her cutsy, wootsy talk.
OH WOW...
Dawgfan-4710266 & InterestedObserver78
Neither of you have a clue...look at the actual evidence, good grief, we can add you both together and still get less than ZERO!
ROFLMAO!!!
DOCJT,
In my state it does not have to be a felony act. The only requirement is that it happens in your presence or you have knowledge of the crime. Someone trespassing on our property is a crime in my presence and would merit a citizens arrest. So someone climbing over a fence that clearly has no trespassing signs posted would mean they knowingly trespassed on our land. Some things are really hard for you to understand aren't they?
Dawgfan-4710266
lol some people, doc for example, don't understand that actual laws differ from one jurisdiction to the next and rarely do they conform to what any one individual feels is "right" Some feel that FL Statute 776 is written in such a way as to target Blacks... I'm still trying to figure out which words in the law make it open season on any particular individual or group other than criminals.