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A father has been arrested and charged with aggravated assault after telling a 911 operator he carved a pentagram into his 6-year-old son's back.
Just after midnight Wednesday, officers were dispatched to a home in Richland Hills, Texas, after the boy's father, identified by police as Brent Troy Bartel, called 911 and said: "I shed some innocent blood."
When the dispatcher asked what the man meant by that, the man replied: “I inscribed a pentagram on my son.”
The dispatcher asked why, and the man said: "It's a holy day."
At the same time, the child's mother called 911 from a neighbor's home and said her husband was hurting their child.
Officers arrived at the home and found the child cold, standing in only pajama pants with a large pentagram carved into his back. The carving covered most of the boy's back, police said.
Officers wrapped the boy in a jacket and turned him over to paramedics. The child was transported to Cooks Children's Hospital for treatment. Child Protective Services and a crime victim liaison were working with the boy and his mother.
Police said Wednesday afternoon that the carving wasn't deep enough to require stitches and that the child is expected to physically recover.
At the scene, officers also recovered a box cutter they believe Bartel used to make the carving.
Bartel was arrested and charged with aggravated assault with a deadly weapon-family member. He was being held early Thursday on $500,000 bond.
The father's call to 911 was placed at 12:10 a.m., just minutes after the day 12-12-12 began.
It is not clear what Bartel meant by calling Wednesday "a holy day."
However, Catholics celebrate the Feast of Our Lady of Guadalupe on Dec. 12. The Dec. 12, 2012, date, along with Dec. 21, 2012, have drawn attention from numerologists and those concerned with doomsday prophecy.
On Wednesday, it's reported more than 9,000 couples will tie the knot and hospitals have seen a surge in scheduled Cesarean sections. NBC's Andrea Canning reports.
NBC 5's Lindsay Wilcox contributed to this report.
Leave a Comment:
at least the mother had enough courage to report him immediately.
Watch your backside. This world is filled with nuts.
Did she report it immediately?
The man had enough time to carve a pentagram on the child's back before the police came...hmm
What else has gone on in the home?
At least he had the presence of mind to apparently carve a proper pentagram, and wasn't one of those dolts who thinks the Star of David is one and carved that into his son. I'm not sure what would be more awkward, having to explain to future girlfriends why there is a big pentagram scar on your back - or why there is a big Star of David supposed-to-be-a-pentagram-but-my-dad-was-a-moron scar on your back.
How long do you think that would take?
Americans going crazy. I can't help but notice the age range of these people also. It's often the younger 'I need attention' generations.
Courage would be taking her child with her. If it were my child I would have been back at that house fighting to get him out.
Yes, it was a good idea to call the cops but she was there a long time trying to relay information to 911. All that could have been done in about 30 seconds "My husband is trying to hurt my 6 year old son. I took a knife from him but they're still in the house. I live at ....come now!" pass the phone to your neighbor and go back home to save your child.
You are kidding me, right? How do you think such a thing was accomplished? Who held this child down? This is the Satanism that some fools have fallen for. I'm guessing the woman finally got it, but not until the blood of her child was drawn. Let's hope it was the first time.....
Courage would be taking her child with her. If it were my child I would have been back at that house fighting to get him out.
Yes, it was a good idea to call the cops but she was there a long time trying to relay information to 911. All that could have been done in about 30 seconds "My husband is trying to hurt my 6 year old son. I took a knife from him but they're still in the house. I live at ....come now!" pass the phone to your neighbor and go back home to save your child.
Next would have been RedRum, RedRum. Lock this freaky demon up for a long time.
And she would have been killed. She obviously took to appropriate course of action, since her son isn't too badly injured and she isn't dead.
It's very easy to say what you would have done since your sitting comfortably in your chair.
As a Father of a 5 year old, I just can't wrap my head around how a Parent would be capable of inflicting harm on their child? Just baffles my mind...
Some Guy. what do you call to badly, dead?
If the pentagram were point-down, it's Satanism. If it is point-up--on of those who practice the Left hand path of my belief system needs to be 'policed' by the local Right-Hand Path High Priestess in that area.
Amanda-2017567
I just learned something new lol! I never knew that if it was pointed down, that was what Satanists used. I knew some people about 8 years ago who claimed to be involved in it but it was obvious these kids didn't really know a thing about Satanism with the information they spouted off. Plus, some used it pointed up, but usually those are people who are uneducated and are in it more for the rebel thing than true worshipping.
Geez, people, do some research before posting! While nutjobs who revel in that crap often use the point-down pentagram as a satanic symbol (often with a demon-goat head superimposed, and a double-circle around it), it's been drawn in either direction for hundreds and hundreds of years. Some popular writer a few hundred years ago declared it was "evil" to put it point-down, and it's often been associated with witchcraft or black magic ever since. But it certainly doesn't belong solely to "Satanism".
He didn't even require stitches.
I'm a practicing witch. You are correct in that is has been drawn in either direction for hundreds of years, but the various uses for the symbol have, in today's times, largely been reduced to usage by Pagans (namely Wiccans) or Satanists.
Within today's context, if the star is depicted with one point uppermost, it is a pagan symbol of someone who follows the Right-Hand Path, or the Lightpath--the uppermost point represents the soul/mind/individual, and the four lower points symbolize the four elements--Earth, Air, Fire and Water. The intent of the whole thing is to express the idea of mind over matter--the soul is more important than the body. And when surrounded by a circle (a pentacle) it indicates a belief in the Circle of Life, the cycle of death and rebirth that drive life as we know it.
If the pentagram is depicted with two points uppermost and one point at the bottom, this is commonly considered a Satanist symbol, symbolizing the rule of matter over mind--the idea is that there is no soul and no 'after' to be concerned with, so do what you like because this is all there is and ever will be. This was later adopted by Darkpath practitioners--those pagans who practice the Left-Hand Path--which include curses and death and blood magick but has largely fallen out of favor. The commonly-held belief by the majority of Christians that the upside-down star is a Satanist symbol has been difficult to overcome, so Darkpath practitioners now rarely use the inverted pentagram to avoid being associated in any way with Christianity.
The Hexagram is commonly used by some traditions of Wicca--however, whoever draws it as two overlaid triangles is not a practitioner. A Wiccan hexagram basically looks like two large arrowhead-shaped chevrons interlocked at their points (remember the slightly-offset chevron logo used on Star Trek officers' shirts in the original series? They look like that) and the figure should be able to be drawn in one continuous line.
can you say DEMONIC???
ohh wait... most of you guys on here don't believe in God or the Devil... LOL weak sause..
@Some Guy
Yah it is easy for me to say what I would have done because I know myself and I tend not to think about my personal safety before I jump into situations, trust me. In my younger years (like 5 years ago) I jumped into a few fights (not knowing the ppl) to protect ppl that were being hurt. I did that because I never thought "I may be a 5'9 chick but someone might have a knife" --and one time someone did. Now that I'm older I've seen how degraded people have become that I now I go around thinking "I'm Mad as Hell and Im not going to take it anymore" just waiting for someone to slip up with some crazy misplaced crap...especially if it has to do with family.
But I guess you didnt fully read what I said though. I said It was good that she ran to a neighbors' house to call 911 but if you listen to the call she was there a long time. Me knowing myself, I would have ran back to see what was happening. I mean, she says in the call that she was able to get the knife away from her husband and he called 911 himself. it doesnt seem like he was putting up much of a struggle.
Wes Cravin wher are you when we need you the? oh never mind.
It's pretty obvious the dad is a nut case, probably has a brain like Swiss Cheese! That poor kid is going to be physically scarred for the rest of his life and the emotional damage will certainly take it's toll.. I hope he doesn't grow up to be a serial killer, thinking the mark makes his somehow aligned with Satan..
As for the dad, hopefully, when he's thrown in jail, the other prisoners will carve a few designs on HIM!!
Take away the superstitious and insane excuses for obscene and equally insane behavior offered by religion and people like this become much easier to identify.
At what point does it become too much to ask people in the most powerful nation on Earth to set aside a system of belief based on the story of an invisible sky entity that doomed humanity because a rib-woman was tricked into eating a piece of magical fruit by a talking snake?
I realize, to some, this might sound obnoxious... but HOLY CRAP! Do you guys ever pay attention to your own kind?
Now I know most people who go to church don' t carve up their kids... but wouldn't it be nice if this kind of crazy didn't have a convenient place to socially camouflage itself?
It's my opinion that most of American christians just cling to the beliefs because they can't bring themselves to admit they've been living a lie. The positive regard they feel toward christianity is conditioned within them; they ignore the over-arching themes of ridiculously evil abuses of humankind and attempts at world domination offered by their religion and it's associated cousins as being just some other guy that got it wrong... but they never consider the alternative of what if those guys are just the ones who pushed the con too far and they're the exact same kind of rube that propped up the "false prophets".
If you are wrong, what does that say about your establishment? The people who profit from it? I'll take my chances; what about you?
@Chris. I lost faith in humanity long ago. There is no way to shake the madness from our fellow humans. We simply should ignore (as much as we can) and continue on with our lives.
#1 The dad is a stupid, crazy mf'er. #2 The best Christians I know are also the best sinners, but because JC and the Boyz paid the price, they always know they'll be forgiven if they ask for forgiveness( Hard to imagine Hilter in Heaven, but if he asked for forgiveness, he'd be there, hopefully he forgot).
By Zeus' beard these people believe in strange things!
Hey man, I'm right there with you... mostly; I have some hope. To be honest, this is exactly what Nietzche meant by "Human. All too human."
At this point, I'm probably just saying this stuff on auto-pilot. Like a man trapped in a burning building with no way out; he'll still try to keep people alive as long as he can but in the end, its just blind hope that something will change. Maybe I'm just a whiner, after all. I know the world is crap everywhere I could conceivably go but I just can't help complaining about the smell.
I have some hope, but it's twisting in the wind. Sooner or later, I may succumb to bitterness and take delight in watching the world burn itself down around me. I know you aren't suggesting that, but in the absence of faith in a god, I'm forced to put some measure of faith in the psychologically diseased herd of humanity that I belong to in order to maintain the false sense of hope necessary to greet the new day.
I don't think I have the fortitude to greet the day without hope that humanity isn't doomed to destory intself in an inferno of stupidity but at least I have the fortitude to look at the world through an evidence based lens. I don't know for sure what the future will bring, and I'm not optimistic, but I can still hope that it will work out or that humanity will have a golden era of knowledge and peace. Hope is not always rational, but it sure as hell doesn't have to be totally divorced from reality or revolve around fairy tales stories of flaming swords, secret magical gardens, or intangible, inaudible, immaterial, invisible bipolar, control freak gods
There's nothing wrong with human nature. Both the human capacity for greatness and for evil come from our cognitive capacity which makes us creatures of self made soul. Humans can believe false and destructive ideas as well as true and life sustaining ideas; cognition is not infallible. Living up to human potential means using observation based reason to discover true ideas. As we can see here and in human history, the failures can be gross and breathtaking in their stupidity. That makes epistemology the primary human science. Human nature is not the problem; brazen irrationalism (including religion, but not confined to religion) is the problem.
Well, Chris, aren't you just "superior", lumping all religious people together, and somehow managing to connect Christianity to a story that doesn't even mention or concern it. You and others gleefully gravitate to stories like this to "prove" how crazy religion is, but ten to one you wouldn't comment on a story about a doctor who kills his wife to say that he's proof that organized medicine was lunacy. In your opinion, the world would be a better place without "irrational" religion. You and others conveniently skirt the fact that millions have suffered and died under atheistic political regimes too. We humans do not need religion in order to come up with "beliefs" of one kind or another that justify hurting and marginalizing others.
You equate religious stories to superstition. Not all believers take these literally, Chris, many view them as allegorical, reflections of "truths" that can't be adequately expressed. Religion in many ways is akin to poetry, music and art. You suggest that we don't "need" religion to live good lives, and I'll agree with that to a point. We also don't need music, art and poetry to live good lives, but imagine a world without them? There is wonder in science, and "rational" can be good, but there is also wonder in myths, dreams, and spiritual imagery. Those things were born of a sense of us being part of something greater than ourselves, and it was those things which eventually gave BIRTH to science.
You believe in matter, in the physical, and you believe in intellect, order, and intelligence, but apparently don't believe that the very universe could be infused with ALL of those things. For some people Chris, that "all" = "God".
Mel - using "observation based reason to discover true ideas" is what led to the development of the atomic bomb. Observation based reason can only uncover facts, not truth. It can only lead us to what we CAN do, not what we SHOULD do. Epistemology will help us understand how the universe works. Faith is a search for WHY, not how. We can observe how the universe was created but the whole "truth" for most humans requires an understanding of why the universe was created. Human nature seeks to understand purpose, not only function. Your epistemology cannot uncover purpose and therefore doesn't answer the fundamental question for most people. That's why epistemology is not the only branch of philosophy.
Chris - there is plenty of reason to find hope in humanity. The problem is that the profit-based media only make their megabillions reporting the twisted, violent stuff that we do to each other. There is very little profit in reporting the millions upon millions of kind, helpful, generous things that humans do for each other every day. Constant exposure to only the ugly side of humanity would cause most people to lose hope.
There is no legitimate Christian denomination that would condone the carving of a pentagram into the back of a 6 year old. The fact that Christians (if this guy is one - not clear in the story) do bad things does not mean that they do them because they are Christians nor that the Christian faith condones, supports or requires these stupid acts. The only tie to Christianity in this story is the reporter writing that Catholics observe the feast of St. Guadelupe on 12/12. So what. Catholics observe the feast of some Saint or another every day of the year. Apparently then all violence must be related to the Catholic celebration of the lives of the Saints. What hogwash.
@MelJM; Thanks man, that was a breath of fresh air.
How do you type that and not do a double take?
Facts = Truth. All else is speculation; some more speculative than others as facts are further and further removed.
Guess work is fun when you want to be creative. New Facts equal new progress. New speculation without facts or a realistic search for facts is just day-dreaming.
@Joemike:
... did you read this story? Even if you just read the title, just the word 'pentagram' is deeply tied to christian mythology.
I suggest you take a second look.
And yes, I do feel superior at times when I consider the conflagration of religious foolishness that controls so much of the country. How could I not given the scope of it? I realize that it is vanity... but it isn't the worst stretch of self-aggrandizement... like for instance considering yourself the "chosen people" whom are individually special to Invisi-God and all others are just obstacles to be struck down...
Not since people who distrust the church neutered its political influence. You have heard of the Inquisition before right? How about the bible? Oh, sure, maybe not specifically carving that particular symbol into his back, but it certainly justifies mutilation of the bodies of slaves and every other kind of sweeping term of general abuse of a human being up to and including human sacrifice.
Or do I need to whip out a bible and discuss burnt offerings of human beings?
Progress didn't happen because of christianity, it happened in spite of it. Maybe it motivated it... in the same way the immune system is motivated to create antibodies by the flu.
crazy or evil?
Brilliant! Your comments are SO intelligent!
Chris,
The apple thing is also interesting. Back in the day (including Eden) apples weren't eaten as they were far too sour. Apples were pressed into juice, which was fermented into hard cider, which packed a bit of a kick. Really smart Snake-guy and even gullible Rib-lady should have known that.
Just because the man said it was a "Holy Day" , why is this being associated with Christianity? This is poor reporting.
Chris, not all Christians are crazy/evil. Also, it's not just the Christian community that has members who commit evil/insane acts. Yes, many of these acts have been perpetrated by so called Christians for thousands of years, however, there are many others of different faiths who have acted out in the name of their religion. For example, the men who high-jacked the planes and flew them into the Trade Center buildings did it in the name of their religion so that they could become martyrs, their families would go to paradise and they would have some 70 (I believe that is the number but I am not sure of the exact amount) virgins for themselves in paradise.
Before you start lumping all Christians together in the same pile why don't you actually go out and meet a few "true" Christians and find out what they are really all about.
Chris - You do realize that your very name is based on that belief you so despise, don't you? Perhaps you should change it.
Nikolaus20, well said.
Odd how 1% of any religion acts out like they insane or just evil and everyone wants to group all of that faith system into the same "label"... My church have had Thanksgiving dinner with our muslim neighbors for the last 4 years...what have you done to promote peace on earth lately?
Oh yes, there would never be a crazy as bat@!$%# nonbeliever.
@Chris
Please get off your high horse. Im so fed up with Atheists who think they're above everyone because they only believe in things they can physically see or "prove". Its small mindedness. There are people in this world who are just evil or who just have mental illness who come from many different beliefs, not just Christians or other religions.
Nikolaus had it right, Christian teachings are like poetry. In fact there ate whole books of the bible that are just poems. They are meant to inspire. People who scoff at religion and take bits an pieces out of our doctrine and holy books to attempt to prove the ridiculousness of it are just as bad as people who use their religion to excuse their evil. You can't take something out of context completely and use it as proof of anything.
Seeing that you think youre so smart and logical, how about you use the brain God gave you and accept the fact that not all religious people are mentally unstable fanatics who cant think for themselves, the same way that I know that all Atheists arent arrogant people who think they are smarter than all the religious folk, despite what I've read in your posts.
FYI - The pentagram has nothing to do with true Christianity. Its a pagan symbol. There are many pagan symbols that have made their way into Christianity but that doesnt mean that all Christians accept them. The Christmas tree was phased in from pagan worship, the Easter bunny has nothing to do with a crucifix, and worshiping on Sunday (rather than from sunset Friday to sunset Saturday like the Jews and early Christians) was adopted when the Romans began to combine regions to solidify their Empire.
Chris-735081.....excellent post my man.......hit the nail on the head....all religions have caused more grief than all natural disasters combined.....
Rose, ditto that. Excellent post.
Rose: While the pentagram is a Pagan symbol, 12/12/12 is not a Pagan holy day, or Sabbat. Yule is coming up on 12/21, the longest night of the year when many neo-pagans, such as Wiccans, celebrate the rebirth of God and the return of longer days (more sunshine means life will continue). It's an old story that mirrors the stories of the birth of Christ in Christianity (Bible), as well as the birth of Ra in Egyptian mythology (Book of the Dead). It's actually quite interesting to study.
However, I don't think this 'dad' was playing with a full deck. He's either insane or on some type of substance, and either way, down right evil for lack of a better term. It wouldn't matter what image he carved on his son's back, it was still a type of terrorizing torture for both the child and his mother. I have a hard time understanding why everyone is jumping on religion for this incident, and not the man who committed the atrocious act. Or how about the folks auto-blaming the mother - like she wasn't affected in any way by her baby being hurt and deformed. Some days I really believe that the world and humanity is doomed, and all the religious fanatics and anti-religion fanatics only add fuel to the fire. Want the world to be a better place - make it one. Quit whining, complaining and blaming and DO something.
Satan walks among us! Like the Bible says- sow the wind, reap the whirlwind. Everyone is so bat@!$%# crazy about religion nowadays, of course we're gonna have more incidents like this popping up...
Organized religion of any sort is a lie.
A pentagram is a five pointed star. If the star is depicted with one point uppermost, it is a pagan symbol--the uppermost point represents the soul/mind/individual,and the four lower points symbolize the four elements--Earth, Air, Fire and Water. The intent of the whole thing is to express the idea of mind over matter--the soul is more important than the body. And when surrounded by a circle (a pentacle) it indicates a belief in the Circle of Life, the cycle of death and rebirth that drive life as we know it.
If the pentagram is depicted with two points uppermost and one point at the bottom, this a Satanist symbol, symbolizing the rule of matter over mind--the theology is that there is no soul and no 'after' to be concerned with, so do what you like because this is all there is and ever will be. This was later adopted by those pagans who practice the Left-Hand Path--which include curses and death and blood magick.
Now, as Satan is a Christian idea, then the upside-down pentagram would be considered a Christian symbol--or rather an 'anti-Christian' symbol. It was adopted in the Middle Ages when Christianity said that practitioners of Craft worship Satan--this is not true, as those practitioners of my belief system who practice the Left-Hand Path usually worship one of the Dark Goddesses--Hecate or The Morrigan.
I'm a practitioner of the Right-Hand Path, my spells are limited to protection spells, spells to lay to rest wandering spirits or revenants,and 'hearth-witch' spells--common spells meant to keep mice out of a pantry, to ensure a fire never gets out of hand and burns you, spells to ward off computer viruses (with an anti-virus program as a backup!) I don't do love spells--we Right-Hand path practitioners don't believe in casting spells on living, sentient, sapient beings. I appeal to a Deity which has both a male and female aspect and call on either as the situation warrants it.
(It didn't make sense to me to pray to a male God while giving birth to my children, no male will ever understand what that is truly like!)
So yes, Rose, you're right in saying it is a pagan symbol, but wrong in that it has nothing to do with Christianity. I wish the article had made it clear whether the pentagram was point up or point-down--if point-down, it was a Satanist, if point-up the Priestess of the local coven will need to take steps to ensure no practitioners of the Left-Hand Path are setting spells on innocents.
They can't even prove that Satan didn't write the bible? They just prey he didn't. Remember Satan will lead you ti false profits.
@PyretQueen
I didnt say 12/12/12 was a pagan holy day. I said that the pentagram is not a Christian symbol. The insane man said that he carved the symbol into his child's back because it was the Holy Day. The writer of the article decided to mention that Catholics will be celebrating n 12/12/12. Some readers decided to draw the parallels between the two even though one has nothing to do with the other. Im a Christian but I'm not closed minded. I know that many religions intertwine and resemble one another and enjoy learning about different ones.
@Amanda
I think the positioning of the points it depends on whether the boy is standing on his head or not....That being said...I think that your missing the point (no pun intended) a kid got carved up by his crazy father...
Chris - The pentagram is associated with many religions, not just Christianity. Its use dates back Mesopotamia in 3000 BC. Also, I didn't say a thing about your sense of superiority although now that you mention it, I see little justification for you feeling that way. I did read the story, just without the vail of hate you feel regarding religion and the blindness that comes from your self-confessed superiority complex.
I also find it amazing that religion-haters and atheists constantly have to go back 1000 years to the inquisition to make their point and yet see no problem with that. Societies, institutions and religions evolve. You shoud try it sometime.
joemike4045,
Observation based reason is critical to ethics; it's needed to develop a metaethics; it's needed to judge the relationship of the pursuit of something to some standard of value which is the base of an ethical system's metaethics. For example, if ones life is the standard, then one has to know not only facts but be able to judge their relationship to one's life. Ethical facts concern a relationship. I think medicine is a good model: a medication or procedure may be good or bad for a patient and the patient's life is the standard. The philosophic science of ethics should tie the other sciences to the needs of human life -- such values as reason, purpose, work, honesty, courage.... The study of these things leads to the conclusion that they are values, i.e. good for us. "Is and "ought" are inextricably connected -- both in theory and in everyday decisions.
The Xn metaethics, however, is rooted in the will of God: the good is what God says is good and virtue is obedience to God's will. This is arbitrary and completely disconnects a person's ethical judgements from facts, understanding and or even welfare and happiness -- therefore the serious Xn problem of temptation. For example, faith is a supreme virtue in religion, but, in fact, it's invalid as a method of knowing, a cognitive disorder, and a moral vice. The basic commandment is "don't think," and it's amply asserted in the Bible. Perhaps the worst thing about the Xn ethics is that it's purpose is set to be achieved in death. Why not happiness on Earth instead?
The article on metaethics (link) in the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy is interesting in this respect also. I quote the last few sentences:
BTW, for clerics that no longer believe, there is now (website started March 2011) an organization dedicated to helping with the many problems associated with the transition to a secular life. It's a confidential online community named (link) The Clergy Project. According to the site, it currently has 395 carefully screened members. For others, there is the older (link) Recovering From Religion organization.
@JoeMike
1000 years?
Wrong on three counts. Founded about 1000 years ago... still in operation up until the 20th century.
1. The last major inquisition ended in 1860
2. the office of High Inquisition was renamed in 1908; Inquisitors were still in business up to then and even then just got a change of name due to bad press.
3. I don't even have to look back to yesterday. I can show you TODAY, RIGHT NOW a savage example of just what I'm talking about. The inquisition is just what popped into my head at the time; you made a very unrealistic suggestion and I debunked it. Wanna take the bet that I can show you a huge Christian religious movement that is currently doing things that make this look like just another day?
The communication problem you are experiencing is that you have constructed a straw-man argument: that I have suggested that Christianity or religion drove this guy to do these things. I did not say that; I said that it provided a system of social camouflage for a lunatic and I suggested that Christianity, Judaism and Islam foster lunatic justifications for lunatic acts.
The foundation of myth in which the bible is steeped requires a dogmatic acceptance of irrational beliefs and magical expectations. You can chalk certain parts of it up to parable if you want, but at the end of the day, Invisi-God still commands your absolute loyalty or your death. Your life in devotion or your body in the ground.
You can blame it on the individuals if you want to but I think that is just ignoring the elephant in the room.
Christianity/Judaism/Islam are incredibly irrational systems of belief that any fool can and will use as a direct, no creative reading necessary, license for exploitation, oppression and abuse. You would have to ignore gigantic portions of things it states as fact and divine mandate to believe otherwise.
If you take it as a literal history book of the universe... you are engaging in an exercise in absurdity... which is exactly what the bible instructs the reader to do. There are no disclaimers. A creative author or 2 (hundred) may have intended to trick superstitious pious audiences into doing something with a creative story... but that suggests the bible contains untruths. Deception. Doesn't it?
At what point do you stop and say, "Hey man, this is just an old book that was poorly written by a bunch of twisted up demagogues who are trying to instruct me in their personal biases under the guise of divinity and highly unlikely threat of eternal damnation." If any part of it might be just a story, then you are left to assume that all it may very well be just a story. I'm not willing to bet the lost potential of my life on something like that and I'm tired of being told to eat sh!t and like it by people who lack the capacity to think for themselves.
Tradition? So was slavery and I'm not willing to be a slave to another person's insanity. The divine mandate of these 3 religions is not one of personal redemption for the non-believer; it is one of oppression and conquest where an unthinking mass of fanatics try to force you to live in a world where you pretend bad is good and crazy is the real normal.
It's obscene and, yeah, I'm pissed off about it. I'm also honest about it. I don't need to make up justifications. I have just about everything ever discovered or invented in the real world. Angels with flaming swords are welcomed... but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for them to show up.
As if any such beast exists. You're being intentionally intellectually dishonest.
You might as well tell me to go hunt for unicorns. "TRUE" Christians (tm)... by whose definition? Yours? Are they any different from the thousands I've already met? Or the ones who raised me? Do they read a different book?
Mel - I really enjoyed reading your post and you make some excellent points. I just don't think any of them were an answer or response to my post. I didn't suggest the there was anything wrong with observation based reason - I agree it is essential - its just not the only way of knowing and it is not the only truth.
Chris, if there are so many more contemporaneous examples then why do you not use them? Both religion and science have their dark sides. Yes, systems of religion are in may ways irrational and can therefore be used to justify bad acts. Science has brought us guns, atomic weapons, biological and chemical weapons, electronic eavesdropping, the ability of government to more efficiently abuse the freedom of the people and many, many other horrors. Atheists hail science and reason as their religion, but the twisted among the scientific community are just as willing to pervert science and reason to do their evil bidding as are those who seek power through the manipulation of religion, generally in the pursuit of money and power. As much mayhem in history can be attributed to non-religious affiliated violence as that connected to religion. The problem is neither religion nor science, it is man's eternal quest for power. Religion and science are just the tools used to exploit others to get it.
Get off your damn horse, you are not nearly as impressive as you believe yourself to be.
I'll take this one step at a time, I have a final paper to finish in the next 30 minutes before class, but I'll make room for this.
A1.
Child "witch" accusations have swept Africa in the last decade and are on-going. Lynchings, imprisonments and MURDERs committed by Christians.
A2.
A3.
B1,B2,B3
C1.
This link is to a video series made by Helen Ukpabio, a Pentecostal pastor, to instruct the viewers in the danger of child witches and how to identify them. She claims it was made for informational purposes.
C2. Here's another one with a demon or something giving kids evil powers; courtesy of Pastor Ukpabio.
C3. And here's a REAL BEAUTY. A bunch of accused witches showed up to be "Exorcised". WHat do you want to bet they just showed up so they wouldn't be hanged the next day? See how they take great care to mention the NOT KILLING??? And how everyone showed up willingly... Do those look like people who aren't scared out of their "God" damned minds and ready to bolt at a moment's notice?
Yeah, these witches don't look scared or tortured or miserable at all. /sarcasm (if you couldn't tell)
Oh sure, though. I can hear it already, "but those aren't REAL christians. They're Africans!!!" RIGHT? /sarcasm
Forget all the hellfire and animal transformations and demon powers and junk. You don't have to catch them ripping the soul from a man through his eye-balls, all you have to do is look for other warning signs of being a witch. Like not doing your homework. That's a real thing. Want a link to that too?
50,000+ dead, tortured and imprisoned kids not proof enough?
No, clearly not. They didn't have the "real" God. Wait a second... isn't the Charismatic and Pentecostal churches American denominations of Christianity? Why yes, they are. I was forced to attend both of them. Want to hear about my exorcism? Of course, you can't trust that because it's hearsay. It's evidence produced based purely on my claims that it is so. With no other evidence, you'd have to be a fool to believe me or take my word for it.
Look on the bright side people, their was a time not that long ago in our history where @!$%# like this would not even be reported. Sad as it sounds this is progress. There will always be crazy people out there who hurt kids. The best we can hope for is a rapid response from authorities to address the matter.
Additionally, I hope once the intial wounds heal that a local surgical laser doctor will donate his or her time and equipment to rid the child of the scars.
What a POS. I hope his wife and son have enough sense to walk or run away from him as fast as they can. Some people don't deserve children.
SICK PHUCK. One things for sure is prison justice awaits his a$$. If he is doesn't get off on a plea bargain or a technicality then he will get whats coming to him.
@Chris:
your post lacks much relevance...and coherence for that matter. This is not a defense of Christianity, but rather, a nod to people who reason absurdly such as you do.
First you oversimplify the matter by simply clumping violent tendencies into one big category labeled "The Fault of Religion". You fail to explore the idea that maybe this guy grew up in a life of abuse and violence. Maybe he has psychological issues and requires therapy. Maybe he that simply because the human will can and does have the capacity to commit violence against one another without mental disorders. Maybe this. maybe that. Maybe X. Maybe Y. Maybe Z. The bottom line is that we don't know his background, and that it is absurd to automatically equate this to the fault of religion (though in the end, that very well could be a possibility as well).
Secondly, what relevance does your personal disbelief in the foundational tenants of Christianity have to do with anything else you are saying, let alone this article? At what point does it become too much for anyone of any world view, to ask for them to put aside their delusional Atheistic, Buddhist, New Age, Marxist, Anarchist, Darwinian, Feminist, Nihilist, Vulcan, Elvish, etc, etc, etc, systems of belief for altruistic reasons? This sound more like an opportunity to nit-pick Christianity, then add any thoughts of real substance to this article.
Thirdly, this article claims nothing about the father being a Christian, or being Catholic. What business does a superstitious Catholic have carving a pentagram on his kid? Maybe this guy is an avid Satanist who loves Norwegian black metal? By your reasoning (as it sounds like you skipped all the way down and the page and read the very last paragraph and based your reasoning off of that, while ignoring the fact that it is clearly stated that it is unclear as to what context in which this day is holy through), he could also be a paranoid 2012 nut, who believes in the Illuminati, aliens planning to invade earth, Bigfoot, 9/11 was an inside job, fairies, and the Easter bunny.
Fourthly, I'm sure he would stick out much less down at Occupy Wall Street...
Fifthly, thanks for your opinion. Now we can all sleep better at night knowing that you have cracked the secret Christian code. Your opinion ignores the fact that Christians regularly discuss the issues that you claim they ignore, with each other, rather regularly. Your opinion ignores the fact that many Christians find it rather easy to accept science and God equally. Your opinion ignores the fact that critical reasoning and philosophy is rather popular in modern Christianity, and that their beliefs are probably more complex than you would ever care to think. What is it to you if somebody chooses to pursue the answers to big big questions in life through the means of their choosing. Your opinion ignores the fact that Christianity offers more charity towards humanity than any other "establishment" period (please, name a competitor). I would recommend that you stop attacking the Christianity of the 40's and get with the times. Then again, you have probably never had a real conversation with a Christian, and gather your beliefs about Christianity based purely off of what Bill Maher and Richard Dawkins tell you to believe.
Lastly, your question doesn't make much sense. Nothing you have said provides any evidence that anybody anywhere is wrong, especially since the meat of your reasoning is based off of an opinion (a non-argument) and not something substantial to stake your claim with. so nobody should spend anytime loosing sleep over the prospect that they were wrong. In the end, if they really are wrong, what difference does it make? Your camp claims that there are no absolute truths, so you wouldn't be anymore right then them. They wouldn't be missing out on anything, since the alternative to religion doesn't offer anything more beneficial than religion. Your own logic makes it win-win for religious people. if they are right, then they get to reap the benefits of what their particular religion offers. If they're wrong, they still have nothing to loose. You should probably stop clinging to your beliefs and go ahead and admit that you are living a lie. Thats not a very positive regard.
So, what if you're wrong Chris, what does that say about your establishment? The people who profit from it? I'll take my chances; what about you?
@Libercrite,
Well said. Religion is a convenient target to pin life's ills on. Christianity and Islam (the two biggest, surprisingly enough) are the flavors du jour. What people fail to realize (willfully or otherwise) is that good and evil acts are done by people. Organizations are the sum of their membership. Those that have more evil members do more evil. I no more blame churches for evil than the NRA for gun deaths or the NEA for stupid kids. Evil acts are committed by evil people, gun deaths are caused by bad or irresponsible gun owners and stupid kids are the result of bad teachers and bad parents.
Humans have tried since before recorded time to solve the problem of how to live in groups and still maintain personal rights and dignity. So far with limited success. We have progressed from the family to the tribe to the city to the state. All of those groups call on humanity to look beyond yourself to the benefits gained by collaborating. Religion, at its best, calls on humanity to look beyond the planet and into eternity.
Unless and until we can fix the blame for evil acts on those who commit them instead of the organizations they may belong to, we will continue to wallow in ignorance. As Pogo so succinctly put it, "We have met the enemy, and they is us."
Libercrite & Denver Bill, Bravo and thank you. Just because I call myself Christian does not mean I am weak, stupid, or need a crutch. I would rather live as if God exists and die to find out He does not, than to live as if He doesn't and die to find out He does. That is not to say I am perfect, no human is. This human condition lends itself to fallibility.
I have seen much evil committed in the name of many different religions. Christianity is not the only one that has evil/insane members. Lumping all Christians into one catagory is unfair to say the least. We are not all evil/insane. Just because a handful of people commit evil acts in the name of Christianity does not make us all evil.
My ex-husband called himself Christian, even went to church on a regular basis, but he was extremely abusive physically, verbally, and psycologically. So, does that give me the right to lump all men together in the same category. No, I was wonderfully blessed with a man who is loving, kind, and the complete opposite of my ex. Had I come to the conclusion that all men were evil because of the treatment I got at the hands of one bi-polar, abusive idiot, I would have never given another man the chance share my life.
Lib and DB2: **Applause** Thank you, Well put!
MsC1960: I'm glad you escaped the abuse and went on to have a better life. I'm 5 years out myself (did we leave the same guy? LOL), and loving my life. Have a great day!
It's what you do that matters, not whose Name you do it in!
You don't blame all birds for the one that pooped on your car!
ms.c1960, that is the wisest thing I have heard a "christian" say in years.
PyretQueen, glad to know you were able to get out as well. Kudos to you.
Women stay entirely too long because they are told they are nothing without a man. Got news for them, I did way better without that loser than I ever did with him. The only good thing that came out of that marriage is my son. I'm almost 21 years out, was single for 13 years while raising my son. Finally found a good man, who loves me just the way I am, and is not abusive in the least.
So wonderful to hear you made it through the abuse and are still able to have a wonderful, happy life. Don't know who to attibute the quote to but I have lived my life by this "The best revenge is living well."
Funny how we move on and they stay stuck. Your ex has probably done the same to you as mine had done to me. Wasn't good enough for him but he can't leave me alone.
My ex drives in front of my office at least twice a day, every day. He has 3 alternate routes to his work place and still feels the need to come by my office. I live about 7 miles out of town on the opposite end from where he lives and I have seen him drive in front of my home, when the hubby is not at home that is. My ex is scared to death of my new hubby and that's a good thing.
Patrick, thank you. The way I see it, we are all human beings trying to share this earth. I have had the priveledge of having friends from many diferent cultures and backgrounds. Some bad, but mostly terrific people and my life is much richer and better for knowing them. I grew up in a household with a dad that was, shall we say, less than tolerant and made the mistake of marrying a man who fit that mold perfectly. My mom, on the other hand, had a wonderfully open mind which was passed on to me.
Whether one believes God created us or not makes no difference. I try very hard to keep an open mind and will accept you as a friend until you give me a reason to not be your friend.
We, as humans, all deserve to live on this planet as equals and in peace.
Chris-Your obvious anti-Christian and attack on religion appears to bear no relationship to this article. It is unfortunate that you seem to feel the need to insult others belief system. It reduces the likelihood you will be taken seriously and respected. The inability to treat others civilly is a poor character flaw. It makes communication more difficult in the end.
The pentagon is actually an ancient symbol, from Babylonian, which spread to other cultures have including Greece. Among other things, it most frequently represents the four elements-earth,water,fire and air, with the fifth being spirit. Also usually used in magic rituals and to show a person is one with nature when worn on the body. It can be used for invoking or banishing the elements. But also for protection from evil. It has no use in any Christian religion as it is viewed as a satanic symbol of worship.But it is used by Wiccans and neopagans. Neither group which worships a Celestial Being.
What this man did was sick, cruel and obviously not condoned by any religion.There are certainly a good number of abusive people in the world capable of carrying out acts that are reprehensible. Just because they mumble something that sounds religious doesn't mean they represent the religious community.
The seal of Solomon represents a system of logic which can be found in almost every culture in some form, but it doesn't necessarily take the form of a star, although it is most commonly referred to as the North Star, or Polias.
Alot of people are taught it's about witchcraft which is just flat out ignorance. There's no ritual involved in understanding what it means, although one could put one there, it's more about a walking meditation. It is also to many people a symbol of sacrifice which was imposed upon the meaning.
In biblical terms it is also referred to as "two really big fish and five loaves of bread".
What was going through this father's mind ...............
Luci,
the Seal of Solomon is generally depicted as a hexagram (six pointed star or Star of David), not a pentagram (five pointed star).
It helps to have your facts straight . . .
wren, wrong again. It's a concave irregular octagon.
If nothing else the "Old Testament" plagiarized much older myths, including the epic flood that 'Noah', once known as Gilgamesh faced. If the "HOLY BIBLE" ripped off old legends such as this, why do modern, supposedly educated people, still believe this xxxx?
Let's say a Hobbit slew an Orc with nothing more than a slingshot. Holy xxxx! We got the story of David and Goliath.
Maybe in another 2000 years from now, people will start believing Harry Potter is their lord and savior.
Because, even though the story can't be real, it reflects the truth we FEEL IN OUR HEARTS. It's sad that disbelief in a single myth will cause some to close their minds to all of the other possibilities, as well. Read between the lines, look for the signs, and SEEK THE TRUTH. Very few will ever GET IT, because they are blinded to it( as are you, my friend), or follow Christ. He is the light of the blind.
lion, it's not just one myth we and historians have trouble believing, it's about 95% of biblical chronology. I can easily support using jesus as a philosophical guideline for life. What I cannot do with a clean, logical conscience is buy into big religion.
That's quite a contradictory statement. "Because, even though the story can't be real, it reflects the truth we FEEL IN OUR HEARTS". Really? Can't be real, but reflects the truth? Sorry. I don't beleive in the snake oil your people are selling.
Someone needs to carve "ass_hole" into his forehead!
Dear Mama.......................you are way too kind and forgiving!
The fear and hurt this child will live with may never be resolved and probably will haunt him through all his adult life. How could you ever trust anyone again?
Please neuter this fool before it breeds again.
Someone seriously needs some professional help.
Oh Great! Another reason for fundamentalists christian nut jobs to persecute wiccans. Obviously wiccans worship the devil, look at the pentagram (devil's star) that the dad was forced to carve into his son.
F. Schrodinger...Thanks for the first relevant post. Most likely this guy is not Christian, as everyone is assuming, since the pentagram is mostly used by pagans, such as Wiccans, and a few kooks who think they practice "Satanism." My ex-husband is Wiccan (I am not) and he is raising our children in his faith. There is nothing weird or wrong about the religion, although I have never followed it or fully understood it's draw. We live in a town that is largely Wiccan so my ex and kids don't actually face that much persecution; it's fairly common and accepted enough that my boys can talk about it in school without retribution. But you are right, Wiccans are misunderstood and persecuted in most places and this kind of nonsense just gives them ammunition. For the record, neither my ex nor any of his coven members have ever or would ever hurt anyone in the name of religion.
Don't know if the guy is a christian or not, but he could very well be, statistically speaking, given that 73 % of americans are chritians :
From wikipedia :
The pentagram is used as a Christian symbol for the five senses.[22] Medieval Christians believed that the "pentalpha" symbolizes the five wounds of Christ. The pentagram was believed to protect against demons.[23]
The pentagram figured in a heavily symbolic Arthurian romance:[23] it appears on the shield of Sir Gawain in the 14th century poem Sir Gawain and the Green Knight. As the poet explains, the five points of the star each have five meanings: they represent the five senses, the five fingers, the five wounds of Christ,[24] the five joys that Mary had of Jesus (the Annunciation, the Nativity, the Resurrection, the Ascension, and the Assumption), and the five virtues of knighthood which Gawain hopes to embody: noble generosity, fellowship, purity, courtesy, and compassion.
Thank you jo for actually looking something up and posting relevant material (so rare these days).
As I read the banner headline the question in my mind was whether the story would be from Texas or Florida!!
Wow, that one is easy.
It means: "It is time to do something completely irrational to appease the invisible sky fairy".
Very seldom do I post comments, especially concerning religion. Raised as a Muslim, now an ordained Christian Minister I pretty much stick to the scripture that reads (Proverbs 26:4) "Answer not a fool to his folly or you will be like him yourself". I won't debate the existence of God but I do have a question for atheists and non believers (such as Chris). Why do you spend so much time trying to prove to yourself and others that God doesn't exist? I know that Santa doesn't exist but I don't spend time trying to convince people that he doesn't exist. The truth is, it's all about fear and accountability or the fear of accountability. The increase of man's arrogance parallels the decrease in man's need or belief in God, I like what Libercrite said, I'll take my chances. Lastly I worked with an atheist whose daughter was dying of cancer, one day while we were alone in the break room, he asked me to pray to God for his daughter, deep inside he knew that only God could heal her. Oh yeah I'm working on a book titled "Athiests, the New Christians" becuase I feel that if some Christians kept God on their minds as much as athiest do...the world may be just a little brighter.
Ending your belief in Santa is the first intelligent step towards intelligent,rational thinking.
You have BEGUN your journey my friend, good luck with the rest of it.
"I contend we are both atheists, I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."
...Stephen F Roberts
For the same reason people spent so much time trying to convince the ignorant that the earth isn't flat, that bacteria and not evil spirits cause disease, that witches don't put spells and curses on you, and that volcanoes aren't signs that the gods are angry.
It's human nature to seek the truth and to spread knowledge. It's also human nature (for quite a few) to RESIST any knowledge that might shake their beliefs.
That's why Copernicus was almost burned at the stake for daring to say that the Earth revolved around the sun. And why christians burned so many heretics.
Put that in your book.
Great post Minsmif. Also WoR I can't understand your way of thinking, why would someone mark a child with a sign that generally represents evil to please God?
Interesting comment about atheists being "the new Christians". Probably more on the vine than anywhere else, we're inundated with what I call "evangelical atheists". Indeed: why so compelled not only to "convert" others to your belief system, but also a self-righteous sense of superiority? Isn't that what you really dislike so much about many religious people?
I get it: you don't believe in (any) God. I just don't CARE - anymore than I care that someone else worships God, Allah, or a freakin' totem pole. As long as someone is respectful and a decent human being, they can believe whatever they like, AFAIC.
we all, because in old christian lore the pentagram is supposed to ward off demons and act as a symbol of the five stab wounds of christ.
Mifo, I'd agree with you up until the point physics basically proved: even if god does exist, he can't be all-powerful. And now quantum chaos has proven that a god-like creature or force was unnecessary for the creation of this universe and the multiverse.
I didn't say God, I said "invisible sky fairy".
To me that could be Vishnu, Thor or Satan. They are all equally as preposterous.
To all the people who write a comment as long as a short story, "get a life", or a job. You have way too much time on your hands and no one cares about the crap you are selling.
Ooops, double post.
Too stupid to live. The mother had better divorce this nutcase and move on. If she stays with him then take the kid away from both of them.
Just because he said it was a "Holy Day",why is this being associated with Christianity? Poor reporting in my opinion.
Elle, do you believe a nonbeliever would do such a thing. I mean the nonbelievers are of complete sound mind and body...Ha Ha!
elle,
The article even admitted it wasn't clear why he said it was a holy day. Many people probably assume it's christian because they all claim to own this season. Remember, it the "Christmas Season" not the holiday season. "Jesus is the reason for the season."
Personally I think he was a faux-satanist (12-12-12 is the double of 666?). If he carved the pentagram upside down, then that would seem his intent. And since christians invented satan, they are naturally associated.
The article didn't mention Christians at all, did it? Just the people posting on here making an assumption.
Yet another example of our failed mental health system. This man has been religiously delusional and preoccupied for years and it was just a matter of time until he did something like this. There are untold thousands in the US that are just like this man and so many know they are unbalanced and the vast majority do nothing hoping beyond hope that they will never act on their disturbed thinking.
Many people are religiously delusional, but we're not allowed to call it out because that is offensive to the religious.
What a sick individual, why did he not do it on how own body? Perhaps he could cut pentagrams on his body.
Oh lets see what happens on the 21st, they're some crazy people out there. I see a lot of purple koolaid being drank. People are getting crazier by the day, or we are just hearing about it more now that we have the world wide web.
We,
You just hear about it more to to instantaneous data transmission. Over the past 20 years the increases of admissions to psychiatric emergency rooms has been do to population growth and a sicker population. Also due to cutbacks and less treatment the people seen are alot sicker on the whole.
"For I know that in my flesh, dwelleth no good thing..."
"For the hearts is deceitful and desperately wicked above all things."
His head would have been introduced to my frying pan, up close and personal like..if he had tried that with my child. There is no way I would have left the house, leaving that maniac with my 6 year old son, to make a call. Claws would have come out, fangs barred and that man would be carrying his ***** in a gunny sac! :-(
You go daughter, I like your way of thinking. The lioness would have come out and this nutcase would have been running for the hills if it had been my son. Cannot understand women who put a man above the health and safety of their little ones. I know I could have never done it.
When my ex husband knocked me down and beat the tar out of me in front of my two daughters, I kind of when into a state of shock. When he finally stopped, I ran. I went out the door and made it two blocks in the pouring rain in my socks. After I'd run across the second intersection, I stood there, in a puddle and realized in horror that I'd just left my kids there with the man who had just beat me. It was adrenaline and instinct - a survival mechanism, but I still feel tremendous guilt for it. I ran back, and was able to eventually leave - but not for a year.
You, none of you, have any idea how you will react when in danger, real life-threatening danger. The first time my husband laid a hand on me, I was in shock. Quit blaming the mother who sought help. Blame the scum who caused the damage. The mom ran and got help, clearly not putting the man above her child - GETTING HELP is exactly what she needed to do. I only wish I'd been as brave as this woman and called the police that first night.
I called family. Bad move - they took the kids and told us we should give each other hug and pray together about it. It took me a year and over a dozen attempts before we were able to leave. It was terrifying, and I needed help. Why didn't my neighbor's call the cops when they heard the screams? Why didn't the family offer real help? Because people like to blame the victims. Can't really blame the kid in the story, so we gotta blame the mother - cuz she's not suffering enough. We don't know anything about how this situation arose, or if he threatened to kill the boy if she came near them - your judgements and assumptions are astounding.
The most prevailing myth in domestic violence is the statement frequently made that if someone ever abused them, they would leave the relationship. In reality, love does not preclude violence; children learn that the parents who love them may hit them and violent couples can express love for one another when not engaged in an act of violence. Another bit of info: 70% of deaths of victims of domestic violence occur when the victim is trying to leave the abuser, and I'm sure you know, a protective order isn't going to save someone. Not really.
Still, I'm so glad you're both absolutely cognizant of all of your possible responses in an emergency and that you have already been able to decide how to handle your child's safety should your spouse ever go bat-$#!{ crazy and try to maim your baby. You have a great day.
Pyret, Bravo and extremely well said. Sorry that your family told you to pray with your husband. I know how that feels, my grandmother took the ex's side and told me I was going to hell for what I was doing to "that good man." Of course, she did the same to my mom when she left her druken abuser too.
I don't, for one minute, believe that any woman in that situation should stay. "Stay for the children" balony. The children, especially little girls, grow up in this situation to believe that this is what love means and will fall into the same patterns as the moms. Boys grow up and think that this is the way a man treats his woman, beat her into submission. Again, Kudos to you for getting out and getting your children out as well. No matter what the situation is no one deserves to get beaten.
You are absolutely correct in saying that a protective order won't save anyone. A protective order is not worth the paper it is written on. I know that fact first hand. My ex showed up at my home, kicked the door in, grabbed me by the throat and pushed me down on the sofa, all this with my son standing on the sofa. My child was only 4 years old at the time. I had bruises from my neck to my ankles. When I picked up the phone to call the police he pulled the phone out of the wall and destroyed it. I was alone with a 4 year old with this mad man trying to "put me in my place and teach me a lesson." But that wasn't enough, he then went out to my car, kicked a huge dent in the door, pulled the coil wire off and threw it into the field next to my house, disabling my car so I couldn't leave. For 4 hours he held me hostage. No matter what I said he would tell me "This is my house, you are my wife, I will stay if I want to stay and there is nothing you can do about it." The only thing he didn't do to me that day was rape me, which wouldn't have been the first time, the only thing that stopped him was my son was there. People think just because you are married it is not rape. THINK AGAIN! Rape is rape whether you are married to the rapist or not. During the entire 4 hours guess what I had in my hand. That's right, A PROTECTIVE ORDER! My ex laughed at me when I told him I had the order and asked him to leave. He LAUGHED! This is what most abusers think about a protective order. It is more important to keep his woman in line than to abide by what the court has said.
I must say, at least he never beat my child. I was able to get out before he decided to go there. He spent 2 weeks with my son last month. The day he left my son called me and said, "Mom, I don't know how you put up with that man for as long as you did."
Pyret, be safe, keep your children safe and most of all "Live well." I know that you will meet a man who will love you and take care of you the way you deserve and without using his fists!
Pyret, one thing furhter, the reason for the post above is not to put down a woman who reacts as you did in the that kind of situation. I fully understand the fight or flight response you had. I commend you for going back and getting your children out no matter how long it took. When I said "Cannot understand women who put a man above the health and safety of their little ones" I was speaking of these women who know the men they are with have a documented history of child abuse and choose to put that low life ahead of their children, which you did not do.
I made a conscience decision on that last day that I would never let another man use me as a punching bag again. What I failed to mention was that on that day the ex blocked my path to my bedroom because he knew I kept my gun there. I assure you, with the bruises I carried, it would have been self defense. But I didn't get that chance. That was some 21 years ago, I am older and wiser and I assure you that should someone try to hurt my child, or me for that matter, I will stop at nothing to protect him and myself. Since that time I have carried a weapon and I now hold a Concealed Carry permit. My home is like a fortress, there is not one room I walk into that I don't have something stashed to protect myself with. My husband doesn't even come in the door after dark without calling first to let me know it is him coming in. I'm not paranoid but, the way the world is going, you just never know.
srsly? i don't get the "holy day" reference. i mean wooooooo its a day that is the same date format forward and backward. not a huge deal. Clearly this guy is just nutso and wanted an "excuse" to harm his kid but make it seem legit?
Who knows what goes on in crazy people's heads when they get something stuck in there. I'm glad that the boy is for the most part OK. and hope that this loon goes away for a long while.
Mom, stay away from him and take your son with you!