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Subscribe to RSSInvestigators believe the gunman shot his mother at home, where he lived with her, and are researching the suspected gunman's writings, looking for any clues as to what might have precipitated one of the worst mass shootings in history. NBC's Pete Williams reports.
The weapons used in Friday’s shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., were legally purchased and registered to Nancy Lanza, the mother of the gunman, Adam Lanza, two law enforcement officials told NBC News.
The gunman was clad in black and used two 9mm pistols to kill 20 small children and six adults at the school. It was unclear how many shots were fired there.
Two 9mm handguns, one made by Glock and the other by Sig Sauer, were recovered inside the school. An AR-15-type rifle also was found at the scene, but there were conflicting reports Friday night whether it had been used in the shooting.
In total, 28 people died in Friday's rampage, including the gunman, who was found at the scene, and a woman believed to be Nancy Lanza, found shot dead at a home in Newtown. She was a teacher.
Under Connecticut law, people under 21 are prohibited from purchasing or carrying handguns. Adam Lanza was 20.
The nonprofit Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence ranks gun control laws in Connecticut and neighboring states New Jersey, New York and Massachusetts as the most stringent in the nation, after California.
Government officials
Undated photo confirmed by government officials to be Adam Lanza, who apparently killed himself after killing more than two dozen others, including 20 school children.
Connecticut allows possession of assault rifles, except those with certain features, such as a fixed bayonet type lug, or a collapsible stock, according to attorney David Clough of Southbury, Conn.
Otherwise they are allowed, and like other rifles, easier to acquire than handguns.
Under Connecticut law, anyone 21 or older can purchase ammunition, Clough said.
The Associated Press, citing an unnamed official, reported that state police records show that Nancy Lanza had legally purchased five firearms, all registered in Connecticut, though the reported was not independently confirmed by NBC News. The AP later reported that authorities also recovered three other guns — a Henry repeating rifle, an Enfield rifle and a shotgun. It was not clear where those weapons were found.
There have been several mass shootings in 2012 alone, and on Friday President Obama said politicians will need to come together to take action regardless of the politics. NBC's Tom Costello reports.
Related content from NBCNews.com:
- Elementary school massacre: 28 killed, including 20 kids
- Vigils, services honor school shooting victims
- Video: 'Our hearts are broken,' Obama says
- Gunman's mother owned weapons used in massacre
- 'Screams were coming over the intercom'
- Video: School shooting reignites gun control debate
- Massacre leaves America shocked and grieving ... again
- Connecticut school shooting is second worst in US history
- Authorities ID gunman who killed 27 in elementary school massacre
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Leave a Comment:
Can someone explain why a kindergarten teacher in quiet town with virtually zero crime needs not one but two heavy caliber automatic pistols, each holding at least fifteen shots? Those handguns, btw aren't cheap, either. The imported Sig will set you back $800-900.
I hope school systems will learn from this and adopt a rule: no one who owns a handgun can be employed here. Kids and guns don't mix.
Maybe if people were not so afraid and carried guns this would have been stopped sooner. I shot my first gun at 7 years old. I knew never to fool with them. I never thought to take one to school. We actually had pocket knives in elementary school and NEVER USED THEM AS WEAPONS. The values of America have changed for the worse. Americans are helpless sheep who see self reliant Americans as a danger it seems. I was once told that a John Wayne type was an idiot. They needed John Wayne today.
"I knew never to fool with them (guns)." -- I've never heard a gun owner who admitted that he/she had been careless with his/her guns.
This particular case could definitely have been avoided or minimized if guns have not been so readily available - Why would a school teacher in a peaceful quiet town need to own at least two guns with live bullets?
Gunfight at the Kindergarten Korral, huh?
I think you've been too long in that hot, desert sun without a sombrero.
Stupidity and freedom of speech don't mix. YOU, Bungman, off the Internet, now!
Sorry, Takealongwalk, it's you and the other NRA sock puppets that need to disappear.
Nungman -
Can you define "heavy caliber automatic pistols?"
Can you tell us why it is your business why the teacher "needed" to own firearms. There may have beenvery valid reasons.
Can you tell us what difference the cost of the pistols makes (and she may have bought them used or inherited them anyway)?
Might I recommend that you make like a horseturd and hit the trail?
News reports stated the pistols were "bought legally", said nothing about an inheritance. Presumably the (murdered) mother was the purchaser though it may have been someone else. She in any case registered them in her name which is all that is known at the present.
States that require a permit to carry a handgun may and must ask why the would-be permittee needs to have and carry a firearm. If the answer is "Because of the International Communist Conspiracy against our Precious Bodily Fluids." the permit may then be denied. There's no such answer as "It's none of your business".
All "Shall Issue" States must change these laws. There should and now maybe will be a presumption against the civilian sale of any handgun or automatic rifle larger than a .22. It will be up to the buyer to show need. Congress now finally might grow some balls and stand up to the death merchants and their mouthpiece the NRA, even if a few American jobs would be lost. If no action is taken nationally then localities like school boards must take action, create gun-free zones and no-gun requirements for employment or residency.
Any handgun caliber more powerful than .38 Special is heavy caliber, including any automatic using a locked breech system, such as 9 mm.
Let's use our imagination and suppose this kindergarten teacher had a sideline as a diamond dealer and therefore needed to go armed. Accordingly, she also had plenty of extra income to spend on costly imported hardware. Why two pistols? Why the kind with big magazines that aren't really suitable for personal protection?
Newsflash--
The story that seems to be emerging is that the late Mrs. Lanza was a "straw woman". She bought and registered these pistols as an accommodation to her estranged husband. He presumably is barred from legally owning handguns, perhaps due to a criminal record.
This opens the possibility that the murder weapons actually were in his possession when the mass killer Adam Lanza seized them.
The State of Connecticut will be more diligent from now on about investigating anyone applying for a handgun permit. In retrospect it is obvious there is a disconnect between a kindergarten teacher in a rural community and these sorts of highly lethal firearms.
Oh no..you mean the weapons used in this mass killing were.."legal"...say it ain't so. Well, so much for the ole ban the gun's idea.
Sounds like this guy was mentally unstable or possibly on drugs.Took out his Mom at home before heading to the school. There is a lot more to this story yet folks. I feel very badly for the parents and families of the victims.
Just maybe we should do the opposite of gun control, have teachers trained how to use a weapon and have them be armed while on duty. Or at least the weapon close by.
90 million American gun owners are just as upset with this murderer as you non gun owning people.We are not angry at the guns.
But chamberpot, or is that shyteforbrains, 27 families, the President of the United States and a whole potful of Americans are angry at you.
Nungman: grow up.
NM, shut up. Pat Garret and Billy the Kid are long gone.
This issue about weapons has been around for Centuries.Seneca,the Roman Scholar,4 BC-65 AD,state;"Don't blame the sword,it's just a tool in the killers hands".If they'd had guns his words would have been the same,blame the human,not the tool he uses.
A Land Without Guns: How Japan Has Virtually Eliminated Shooting Deaths
By Max Fisher
inShare197 Jul 23 2012, 1:45 PM ET 595
In part by forbidding almost all forms of firearm ownership, Japan has as few as two gun-related homicides a year.
They also prize a quality education and moral upbringing for their youth.
Nor are they fed a steady diet of violence, murder and gun glorification by their media.
Let`s face it, they don`t have guns because for the most part they don`t need guns.
Also Doug McCarthur had alittle bit to do with it as well.....
Hey Baloney, long time no see! Howya been?
Working hard paying your bills leroy, how`s things?
Still singing Cumbaya in the kibbutz?
Lol, I was raised by depression era German immigrant farmers Baloney. Trust me, I could work you into the ground on my worst day, and I'm in my 50s!
"Lol, I was raised by depression era German immigrant farmers Baloney."
Raised by your grandparents huh? What happened to mom and dad? Drugs? Prison?
"Trust me, I could work you into the ground on my worst day, and I'm in my 50s!"
Then get off the dole and work then! You`ll feel better about yourself, I`m sure.
Oh and I`m 50. All that clean living I guess...raised by my maternal parents...
It's amazing how you righties just keep on calling everyone on the left a welfare case, you may as well just post "I'm an idiot" because 90% of the people you say this about have worked their entire life. Funny thing is, all these idiots like yourself who keep saying this about me would be shocked to hear how close my feelings about welfare coincide with yours. There is a lot of abuse of welfare and unemployment insurance that should be cracked down on, but I'm not stupid enough to think that people collecting welfare caused the economic downturn. The abuse at the bottom is NOTHING compared to the abuse at the top.
And for that you get a thumbs up leroy!
Good luck!
Baloney voted one of my posts up?!?!? Can I delete this post somehow?
LOL!!
Gotcha!!
I don't know if anybody has the answer. All I know is these are babies in life, and that has been taken away. We have to quit bickering on this issue and come up with something plausible. This can not go on and on. Even self protection can go awry. I just pray for these families and hope maybe this may help us come up with some type of answer. Just kids!
There is no solution for we can not look into peoples minds. What ever makes a person do what this young man did can't be fore told and prevented.
What we can do is look at the situation in this country where the future is very bleak for these young people. There are no jobs for them and the likely hood that they will find one they will be able to sustain themselves with as independent adults might explain why this is happening.
When there is no hope, there is only despair. Despair will have rational people doing irrational things.
What a chicken-@!$%# coward,..........to kill innocent unarmed babies and kindergarden teachers. Why does America have so many cowards killing innocent unarmed victims? I guess the NRA likes that kind of gunmen,......you know, ...hunters killing defenseless animals.
Leftof I say if that is what we need to do that is what we should do.
This is not the 1700's. We seriously have to sit down and see what our values are.
America now has over 300 MILLION firearms......all to protect trailer parks.
the NRA: putting profits before people......it's working
The progressive socialist values in this country have led to people, young ones especially, feeling lost in society and bereft of true American values. You lefties will never believe your values are at fault and not my guns. The 2nd Amendment is not about hunting. It is about tyrannical government. Mine are to protect my rights and my property because I do not trust the government to do it any more. I will not shoot a deer unless hungry but do not touch my stuff.
From whom do your property rights need all this protection, NM?
You're planning to shoot first, I gather, before "they" come to violate your rights and take your property.
No. It is no use explaining to someone who refuses or is not able to understand.
I suspect there's nothing to understand. We are one country. Your right to have fun shooting tin cans in New Mexico can mean twoscore school children shot dead in New England.
The mother is responsible for all these deaths. If she had not owned those guns, these people would not be dead. The 'guns don't kill people' argument is just stupid ... he could not have killed so many people with a knife or a hammer. Not saying we get rid of all guns, but they should be a lot harder to get, with classes, training, testing, magazine limits, mandatory gun safes, etc.
Or we can go the NRA way, and we all carry, and we all start shooting if you even think someone is reaching for a gun. Let's flood the country with guns, so the next time some idiot pulls a gun in a mall, hundreds of people can start blowing away everyone in sight. Do the police really feel safer if they know everyone they stop is carrying ... because that is where this is going if we can no apply any rational laws to this mess. Hell with concealed carry, I need a quick draw on my hip.
No, if the son had not stolen the guns these people would not be dead. I do not know how she stored them, that is a whole other issue. But if he was so far round the bend he could have found many ways to accomplish his goal - he was intent on doing damage. He killed her, left, took the car, went to the school, got buzzed in, hunted down who he wanted...... He caused this.
He wanted to do this - that is on him. He was 20, old enough to make his own decisions. And they sucked.
Well, dingbat, Adam Lanza is beyond vengeance now, and twenty-five innocent people are dead. Plus two who weren't innocent at all: the murderer and the parent whose sick fascination with weapons and shooting brought this all on.
You can't deter someone who is determined to die. Keeping the means to commit mass murder out of his hands is the only prevention.
This is, tragically enough, by now pretty common series of events--except for the appalling numbers of people killed and the tender age of most of the victims.
I believe in the Second Ammendment,....just as they did in 1776,...you can have all the flint lock muskets you can buy.
And YOU can have all the quills and inkwells you want as your First Amendment rights.
Actually, if you bother , check out a book called "Letters of the Presidents" at your library. You'll find the "militia" was the citizenry. And that they mistrusted government control as much as foreign invaders. TJ armed the militias as well as the military.
But a question. We are currently supplying multiple countries in the middle east with , beyond semi -automatic , fully automatic military weapons. All in the name of "Democracy from governmental control". Isn't the same as the 1700's?? Has nothing changed??
So we arm the third world for "Democracy". And disarm our countrymen for what??? Can't be "Democracy" , thats already taken.
While the notion, so beloved of the political Right, that the Second Amendment was passed to allow the citizenry to take up arms against their own government is an utter fallacy, you have touched on an interesting point about our supplying arms to rebels in other countries so that they can overthrow their government.
It's a round world and what goes around, so they say, comes around.
I wonder why they were not in a gun safe, with her having the only combination? Is the NRA against gun safes, too???
We don't know they weren't in a gun safe. A 20-year old intent o getting in a gun safe can do so.
Assume much?
And the NRA is very PRO gun safes.
The "bad guy" (in this case, yet another mentally ill guy, by the look of it) got the guns from.... his mom. The guns were owned perfectly legally. If you so-called "good people" did not have guns in your home, the "bad people" wouldn't be able to get their hands on them. Most guns used by criminals are stolen out of the homes of so-called "good people". If you "good people" didn't have a gun in your home, there wouldn't be any guns sitting there for the "bad people" to steal.
And the "bad people" would be free to sack and pillage.
Y`know, the rest of the stuff you keep in your home? You? Your kids?
Just a thought...
Let the so-called "bad people" "sack and pillage". "Stuff" is not more important than peoples' lives. Including the lives of the so-called "pillagers".
That's what home insurance is for.
Have you ever heard of locking your door, or is the concept foreign to you?
Have you ever heard of forced entry?
Rape? Murder? Are those illegal actions merely illegal or impossible to you?
What kind of homeowner`s policy fixes that?
Or is reality a foreign concept to you?
Seattle - who is a locked door going to stop? Only the lazy criminal - not the ones intent on doing damage. Might as well leave it unlocked - saves replacing a window. Not being funny, but think about it - someone wants in - they will find a way.
I'm in a city of well over half a million people, there were only 21 murders in all of last year.
Forced entry is rare.
Rape and murder are even more rare, almost nonexistent.
You have a higher likelihood of getting hit by a falling Soviet satellite than being raped or murdered.
But of course gun nuts love to create fear and terror in people in order to sell more guns to stupid frightened sheep who think "the Big Bad World gonna getcha".
It's not "Reality", it's fantasy and propaganda spread by gun nuts.
dingboter
A locked door stops pretty much everyone.
Doesn't make any difference whether they're "lazy" or not, if they can't get in.
And I grew up 15 mins. from Newtown, still have relatives living in Newtown. Never thought it could happen there (can't remember a murder in my town). But it did happen there - because someone was determined to make it happen. Locked doors, gun safes, laws, not going to stop someone that is crazy enough to do something like this.
And what planet are you from? Not this one, for sure! Try peddling your line of complete BS to someone who lives in certain neighborhoods in Brooklyn, the Bronx, Newark, Paterson, Jersey City, just to name a few. You know nothing, Absolutely nothing!
"I'm in a city of well over half a million people, there were only 21 murders in all of last year.
Forced entry is rare.
Rape and murder are even more rare, almost nonexistent."
Really?
"http://www.seattle.gov/police/crime/12_Stats/2012_Major_Crimes.pdf"
"http://web6.seattle.gov/mnm/incidentresponse.aspx"
I lived in Federal Way and have an Aunt and Uncle in Puyallup...and murder is up my friend.
"A locked door stops pretty much everyone.
Doesn't make any difference whether they're "lazy" or not, if they can't get in."
What, you`re smoking crack as well?
BrianPatronie
Did you even bother to read your link before you posted it?
I was mistaken, there were even fewer homicides than I thought.
In all of 2011, there were only 13 homicides in Seattle. A city of over half-a-million people.
You sound like you'd be the expert on smoking crack. I'm told it makes people tremendously paranoid and that's why they like to carry guns. And shoot out the TV set. They think the people inside the screen are spying on them.
Now, go hide in fear and cuddle up to your .38 cal. penis. Let the grownups talk in peace.
Mymomdidnotraiseafool
Have you ever heard of "moving to a safer neighborhood"?
BrianPatronie
You also know nothing whatsoever about Japan, either.
They have ready access to huge amounts of often-violent pornography.
They actually ARE fed a steady diet of violence, murder and gun glorification by their media. Their videogames are exceptionally violent and explicit.
They just can't act on those violent images. They can't acquire guns. Nobody sells them to the general public.
Which means, nobody in the general public can buy them.
Chalk up another subject that you know nothing about.
"http://www.seattle.gov/police/crime/12_Stats/2012_Major_Crimes.pdf"
How`s your reading comprehension skills? Checked 2012 and the percentage of change from 2011?
"You sound like you'd be the expert on smoking crack. I'm told it makes people tremendously paranoid and that's why they like to carry guns. And shoot out the TV set. They think the people inside the screen are spying on them.Now, go hide in fear and cuddle up to your .38 cal. penis. Let the grownups talk in peace."
Why? Are you:
"You're just desperate to change the subject.
When you're on the wrong end of a discussion and are desperate to avoid losing, it's understandable why you'd try your best to deflect distract and change the subject."
What`s up with ad hominem? I present facts and you talk of strange penis sizes?
Grow up.
"You also know nothing whatsoever about Japan, either"
Semasen?
I lived there cupcake. 3 1/2 years.
SSunset -
I see you didn't respond to Brian's links.
A very quick google check shows Seattle has 5.83 violent crimes per 1000 residents (as opposed to 3.14 for the state overall, 4.0 national mean).
Glad you are 100% safe behind your locked door in your fairytale city.
BrianPatronie
How's your comprehension skills? Are you capable of understanding the importance of not wildly exaggerating and lying about a statistic for personal gain?
Yes, homicides are up in 2012 from 2011.
A whole 24 homicides, as compared to 13 in 2011.
In a city of well over half a million people.
Wow, I'm quaking in my boots.
Six of those homicides occurred in one incident when yet another nutbat with a gun walked into a cafe and started shooting people.
If you knew anything about Seattle, maybe you would have known that.
Which merely further proves my point, that ready access to firearms by anyone, especially mentally ill people, leads inevitably to tragedy.
Now, if you were capable of actually intepreting statistics, you would understand that 24 homicides in a city of over half a million people is so miniscule, it is almost impossible to calculate the risk of homicide as a probability.
Because it is so tiny.
The city's population is roughly 616,500.
Twenty-four homicides in a population of 616,500 is a homicide probability of 0.00003892944.
It's so tiny, I had to find a special calculator that could track out to that many zeros.
Your basic problem is that
(a) you are paranoid and probably a gun nut, and
(b) you do not understand basic statistics.
You completely lack perspective because you're focusing on being afraid, of creating a sense of fear, of inducing panic in people so they'll be frightened and think they need to "arm themselves" against a non-existent "threat".
You are the kind of person who would take an announcement of two murders in a town of 60,000 in 2012, compared to one murder in that same town of 60,000 in 2011, and breathlessly announce "Murder Rate DOUBLES!"
Sunset is a trolling douche-nozzle, and his reply that people who live in unsafe neighborhoods should just move is one of the more inane posts I've seen in a long time. Like I said, if he tried peddling his line of BS to the people who live in those neighborhoods because of their socioeconomic status, they'd beat him to a pulp and curb-stomp his teeth out. And I'd pay good money to watch!
Seattle-Sunset:
Look if it makes it any easier for you let`s keep the ad hominem out of it and just face some facts;
Seattle is getting rougher. It`s a shame but it`s true, and we could wax and wane over the issues driving it but that`s better left for another day.
A locked door will not deter a motivated individual. Firearms will.
Incidents of this nature (mass-murder) while highly reported and emotionally driven are rare when compared to the number of firearms and owners in this country.
About as rare as a Seattle sunset in December...
Kumbawha. (Nippon for good evening).
BrianPatronie
Congratulations, you are the example of someone who can live in a foreign place and yet learn little to nothing about it.
How did you manage not to learn about the massive amounts of violent pornography available in Japan?
Oh yeah.
Gaijin.
BrianPatronie
I agree, let`s keep the ad hominem out of it and just face some facts;
Seattle is an exceptionally safe place to live. It`s a shame for you, because it completely eviscerates your argument, but it`s true, and we could wax and wane over the issues driving it but that`s better left for another day.
When one single mass murder in Seattle by a nutbar with a gun (which completely validates what I have been saying all along about nutbars getting their hands on guns) is itself responsible for 25% of all the murders in Seattle in 2012, that is what we call an "outlier". That means, you can't draw conclusions about "Seattle is unsafe" from it, because it's an outlier that skews the murder count and validates my point about what happens when nutjobs get their hands on guns.
A locked door does keep out motivated intruders. No firearms necessary.
I am completely unarmed. I am completely safe.
I've been here since 1987. Never been robbed. Never been mugged. Never even had my car broken into. Ever.
Incidents of this nature (mass-murder) while highly reported and emotionally driven are occurring more and more frequently in the USA.
"I am completely unarmed. I am completely safe.I've been here since 1987. Never been robbed. Never been mugged. Never even had my car broken into. Ever."
I`m happy for you. I mean that. Remember I have relatives there. Several in fact. They report the area is getting worse. If you do a quick search (as I did) you`ll discover it so. Most of them own firearms. I support their right to do so. I also support their right to life. If that involves defending themselves with a firearm so be it.
Those kids didn`t deserve what happened to them. Depriving my right to defend my loved ones is not a response I can agree to. Something is happening to our youth and it`s not the availability of firearms, it`s the increasing lack of morality and individual responsibilty IMHO.
Layla Tov (Hebrew, good night).
mpa-4893349
Yeah, I am 100% safe here, thanks.
Here's the rankings of America's most violent cities:
10. Stockton, California - Violent crimes per 1,000: 14.1
09. Baltimore, Maryland - Violent crimes per 1,000: 14.2
08. Atlanta, Georgia - Violent crimes per 1,000: 14.3
07. Birmingham, Alabama - Violent crimes per 1,000: 14.8
06. Little Rock, Arkansas - Violent crimes per 1,000: 14.9
05. Memphis, Tennessee - Violent crimes per 1,000: 15.8
04. Oakland, California - Violent crimes per 1,000: 16.8
03. St. Louis, Missouri - Violent crimes per 1,000: 18.6
02. Detroit, Michigan - Violent crimes per 1,000: 21.4
01. Flint, Michigan - Violent crimes per 1,000: 23.4
Here's the source: homes.yahoo.com/news/most-dangerous-cities-in-america.html
Seattle - yeah and I lived in Fairfield County for 35 years - most of them within 15 min. of Newtown. Never had anything happen to me by a stranger either. But guess what - now it happened - so safety history in CT has taken a dive.
And again - a locked door only keeps out those that don't have an eaisier mark or really want to get in. Break a window? Knock and shove? It happens. A lot. Maybe not in safe Seattle - but look at Fairfield county criminal records. In my town 0 homicides since 2006 - 1 rape since 2006. Not a high crime area. But if someone wants to they will find a way, and forget about the door. Didn't stop my ex.
BrianPatronie
Sorry but I cannot agree.
"Increasing lack of morality and individual responsibilty" cannot be attributed as a valid factor in the case of someone who was clearly mentally unstable and in need of mental health services.
The elephant in the room, and one which firearms enthusiasts generally refuse to address, is easy access to deadly weapons.
Chag Samech (Hebrew, happy holidays).
Right, mom...fool, crime in our inner cities is not unheard of.
Is that why Nancy Lanza owned a military caliber Bushmaster autoloading rifle (named for a highly venomous African snake), an ultra high power 10mm Glock pistol, a Sig Sauer pistol in 9mm and other firearms? Because she was afraid of a purse snatching in Newtown, Connecticut--median family income $90,000 plus?
w w w.nationmaster.com/compare/Canada/United-States/Crime
Make sure you pay particular attention to the Murder By Firearms portion.
Then, bear in mind that the USA has ten times' the population of Canada but has SIXTY-FOUR TIMES' more murders involving firearms.
That's the price we pay for freedom and out of control inner cities and illegal immigrants.
Most other countries on the planet are vastly more free than yours.
If you had ever been anywhere outside of your trailer park, maybe you would know this fact.
You don't have any "right" to shoot illegal immigrants.
If they break into my place while I'm still here, I have every right to shoot them, and will. You're welcome to join them, if you feel so inclined, you prattling git!
No, depending on where you live, you generally only have the right to evict them from your home.
You generally dont have the right to kill anyone unless you can demonstrate that your own life is in danger.
That's precisely why a homeowner in Minnesota, who shot two teenagers who DID break into his place, is in jail and facing second-degree murder charges.
Minnesota town mourns teen cousin shooting victims; homeowner arrested
www.thedenverchannel.com/news/u-s-world/minnesota-town-mourns-teen-cousin-shooting-victims-homeowner-arrested
And that is what is wrong with America.
Tell ya what, Seattle-boy. Why don't you just try breaking into my place while I'm inside, and see how that works out for you, OK? The guy in Minnesota had mental problems, and executed them needlessly. If someone breaks into my home and confronts me as an armed threat, I will execute them needfully. End of discussion.
Mymomdidnotraiseafool
What do you think you have in your place that I could ever possibly want?
Another "under the radar" whackjob gets ahold of a gun.
And commits an atrocity.
And, predictably, nothing will ever be done about it.
Gun-nuts love to claim that "tougher laws will deter people from doing this sort of thing". Does the nutjob who committed the massacre look "deterred" to you?
He killed himself, does he look like he was "afraid" to die?
He killed 27 people, he got away with it, what are YOU gonna DO about it anyway? Dig him up and shoot him a few more times?
Teach something other than new age and progressive values. There is right and wrong. Parents should wack their kids. Stop destroying traditional American values.
Paul from NM
Mentally ill people don't understand the difference between right and wrong.
That's why you shouldn't give them access to deadly weapons. You don't know and can never be certain what they'll do with them or who they'll use them on.
Most sentient, thinking people on the planet understand this concept.
You apparently don't, which makes you part of the problem.
Paul from NM
"Traditional American values" glorify violence.
"New age and progressive values" never killed anyone at all.
Deadly weapons kill thousands.
Spot the difference, if you are able.
I'm betting you can't.
Liberal Hollywood does the glorifying. Ever been to a war? Communists, socialists, fascists kill most people; Stalin, Mao; Lenin; Hitler; PolPot; People who believe in large centralized government and, like progresive liberals, believe they are smarter than every one else. Remind you of yourself. A little full of yourself aren't you. By the way. Their victims were not allowed private property or guns.
SSunset -
Do you get paid by the insult? We are all terribly impressed . . .
The relatives will cry and grieve on nationwide television.
Flags will be lowered to half-staff.
Facebook "We're so sorry" pages will be created to mourn the victims, to be promptly followed by "No, we're not THAT sorry" Facebook pages created by gun-lovers who adamantly refuse to consider any restrictions on their right to own military-grade assault rifles with 100-round magazines.
There may be the odd telethon to raise donations for relatives of the murdered kids. Which, will inevitably and eventually be followed by public recriminations against some relative of a murdered child who supposedly took the money and went to Disney World or the casino or something and behaved like a vulnerable grieving human who's seen their whole world shattered, instead of behaving like a saint like America "wants" them to.
The victims will be buried. It'll be a Kodak Moment.
And then, America will forget about it, as America always quickly forgets about it and moves on.
And nothing will change. Nothing ever does.
And no, it's not "harsh cynicism".
It's reality.
I've been around America long enough to know how this place works.
You speak the truth but this one tears my guts out.
That's how all places work. Ours is better than most. How about Hamas hiding behind children in Gaza? How about muslims and their treatment of women; how about the Chinese and forced labor; Russia still has Gulags; The reason we are free is our traditional values and guns.
No, it is not "how all places work".
If you had ever been anywhere outside of your trailer park, maybe you would understand this fact.
What do Hamas, Muslim treatment of women, China or Russia have to do with a nutjob getting his hands on perfectly-legally-owned weapons and gunning down children?
Ohhh right, nothing at all.
You're just desperate to change the subject.
When you're on the wrong end of a discussion and are desperate to avoid losing, it's understandable why you'd try your best to deflect distract and change the subject.
How about Canada, Germany, France, Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Italy, Czech Republic, Poland, Austria, Spain. Or have you ever heard of those places.
All of them completely free. All of them parliamentary democracies. Just as free as America. Maybe more so.
Absolutely none of them ever have to deal with firearms-related massacres of innocents. Ever. It literally never, ever happens.
All of them are free because... they just are.
Freedom IS free.
No "traditional values" or guns required. None at all. Zero. Zilch. Nada.
It's a very, very safe world.
Except in elementary schools in America, apparently.
What's with the constant "trailer park" insults, you maundering twit? How about some new, albeit equally inane, material, Zippy from Seattle?
Totally agree with you on your orig. post on this thread. That is exactly what will happen, and it is very sad.
It is almost a given. The individual families will have pain forever, but the rest of the world will just make nasty comment and move on to the next time.
It does suck.
Yep! You suck a big one.
Being a grandfather of 11 this is so deeply disturbing to me. I see my 3 year old grand daughter and say what could anybody do in this situation. Do we have to put the whole country on lock-down?
Time and time and time again there are parents that have a mentally ill child and are under the influence of the child to do what they want. I will bet that Adam pressured his mother to buy the guns in order to keep him calm and did that work out? I say over and over on the vine how our mental health system is in tatters due to funding cuts but, gee golly who cares until they see something like this. Come on citizens of the US, will this do anything to spur you to act, whether it be for gun control or to deal with the mental health issues facing our country? No, the answer is you will do nothing and just wait for the next time.
I guess I can understand a woman owning one gun but why oh why would mommy need a rifle and two pistols? I can't believe that junior just snapped mom had to have seen some signs and didn't make sure he couldn't get her guns. If you are going to own guns which I have no opposition to make sure no one no matter if they're 20-40 can get to them without you being present. What a coward I'm sure he has been coddled to his whole life and started playing violent video games at a young age, pay attention to what your kids are watching, they are getting desensitized by the violence they watch for hours on end. If you don't want to raise your kids right please do us all a favor and don't have any.
I would hold this mindless retards mother responsible (If she weren't DEAD). How do you have a mentally disturbed 20 YO living in your house and have unsecured weapons lying around? In what alternate reality FANTASY world did this stupid woman manage to maintain the belief that this WOULDN'T end badly?
The kids mother knew what he was and she knew that she should have turned him over, She chose not to and she paid for that mistake with her life (and so did 20 innocent children and 7 adults). These women just LOVE their children and simply can NOT accept the fact that their kid could possibly be a "Bad Apple" so they self delude, and live in denial, walking around with blinders on.
People have to be responsible and turn these kids, spouses, relatives, etc. over when they know that they're dangerous and a threat to others. And law enforcement has got to STOP blowing off people who try to set them hip to these A-holes. The GOVERNMENT has got to stop this "HOW can we cut more money from the police, the mental healthcare, the courts, and the social agencies so we can line the pockets of our wealthy owners" bulls#!t, and reinstate the programs and policies that USED to prevent this crap from happening.
And for GOD'S sake, LOCK UP YOUR F$%&ING WEAPONS! If you're not even responsible enough to keep a weapon properly secured, then why the F$%& should you be allowed to own one?
We have to start dealing with these stupid, twisted, sick, retards. If someone has to die it needs to be them. I know all the bleeding hearts on here will be condemning my attitude, and they can go right ahead. Until you've lived in a house where there's a crazy person who's liable to attack you at any moment with no warning whatsoever, you have NO effin' clue. I DO...and the FACT of the matter is, that there are just some people in this world that are just no F$%&in' good, and probably the most merciful thing we can do with them is the same thing we do with sick rabid animals (Put them DOWN). That's not a popular attitude, but most of the time it is the only viable solution.
Just like the airline pilots, every school teacher should be trained and carry a gun. Sorry, but this is the reality now. This could help save many lives in incidents like these.
What I Fear are not guns or those who legally own and poses them, and the "wackos" that get a hold of them through fraudulent and illegal means. What I fear are the universities that are turning out highly intelligent and unstable people who will eventually develop and deploy biological means to destroy hundreds of thousands if not millions of people at their whim.
That's a good fear. How can anyone forget the high school kid that made a working atomic bomb from research he did in his school and public library for his science project.
If you have supported "gun control," YOU are partly responsible for these deaths. YOU helped make it so adults could not protect these children. Even one pistol wielded by an administrator or teacher, and this punk would have been STOPPED.