Yeah but don't visit or live in New York. It's a real hell hole.

Actually the NRA doesn't dictate policy. The Constitution does.

Enough is enough. I've already contacted my Governor and the White House in support of a policy shift against gun violence.

So have I. Hold those responsible accountable for their actions.

I'm going to send Mayor Bloomberg a copy of the Constitution.

Second Amendment: A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

This is at best vague. It implies you have a gun to support your militia, something we don't have anymore. The wording and authority of this amendment needs to be reexamined. Does it still support the kind of country we want in the 21st Century? The Constitution has been changed before; maybe it's time to do so again.

AG99

The first Ten Amendments to the Constitution were called the Bill of RIGHTS for a reason. They are inviolable.

The Bill of Rights was written by men and can be changed by men. It wasn't handed down on stone tablets from on high. If any provision in it no longer reflects our values as a society, then it needs to be changed.

Then lets start with ending Birth Right citizenship.

Then add a balanced budget amendment that requires our leaders to balance the federal budget.

Add another amendment to end career politicians and set term limits.

Add another Amendment that politicians cannot accept any private donations, soft money, or any other campaign contributions and can only use public money.

Add another amendment that prevents them from using Taxpayers money to pay back their supporters, etc. such as the $800 billion dollar stimulus that went to all of Obama's green energy buddies, unions etc.

Add another amendment that if they are going to create some new "entitlement" program that we are forced to pay into, A.K.A. Social Security, that it has to be self sustaining and that the money that is suppose to go into a lock box they cant touch and use as their personal piggy bank.

After all that is done, our political system is actually fixed and works for us, our politicians are only beholding to the people that elected them and they are supposed to represent and not every special interest group, PAC, Hollywood star, etc. that buys them an election, then we can talk about changing fundamental rights that we have had for over 230 years.

Bloomie's cops opened up and shot 9 innocent bystanders a couple months ago.Maybe he should get them some training and mind his own business.

NYC Mayor Bloomberg launches campaign against gun violence

With all due respect, but you are a jerk, Bloomberg, and we don't need you or the likes of you and your fu.ked up opinion.

@Noah, let's get this right. In the face of the most horrific massacre on our own soil all you are concerned with is money? That's what you want to fix FIRST? That is precisely why Republicans are losing constituents and elections. You guy's just don't get it.

Bloomberg is a freaking tool who would use anything to his advantage. The recent Sandy Hook massacre is clear evidence of that. If he is so against guns then maybe he should disarm his personal guards, live in a crime ridden area, or try to disarm 3 armed thugs who have loaded guns. Bsides the Sandy Hook school had absolutely no security personnel at all. NONE The school district should be held criminally and financially responsible for this tragedy

I believe the most horrific incident on our soil was 9/11 when almost 3000 people were killed.

Then there was the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995 when 168 people were killed, 16 were children, and 680 injured.

Lets not forget Waco Texas in 1982 when 82 Branch Davidians were killed by the ATF.

How about the 1927 Bath school disaster when 38 children, two adults, and two teachers were killed and 58 others injured.

Newtown isn't exactly the most horrific massacre on our soil now is it?

Nice try to twist it into a meaningless point about money but if you want to talk about money perhaps you can explain were the Federal government is going to get the money to enforce any new gun legislation?

The Democrats haven't passed a Federal Budget, which they are required to do by law, in four years. We are only $16 trillion dollars in dept, have been running record setting $1.2 trillion dollar deficits every year, Social Security and Medicare will be insolvent in the next decade, we can't even enforce our current immigration laws or secure our borders, in two weaks and a day the "Fiscal cliff" will hit us all with huge taxes increase if Obama and Congress doesn't fix it now.

Congress doesn't even follow laws they are required to follow, our government doesn't enforce laws that all ready exist.

Of all the issues facing the United States today, and needs to be fixed now, gun control is the least of our problems.

David Noah,

Lets not forget Waco Texas in 1982 when 82 Branch Davidians were killed by the ATF

waco was in 1982? that can't be... was miami vice "big" when you heard about waco on the news? I don't remember needing to flip the channel from miami vice to the news for waco texas.... I remember miami vice tv show was in re-runs and fading in fame when the waco texas thing happen.

ATF was big on miami vice tv shows...

Thanks for the correction. The Waco Texas massacre occurred in 1993.

Do you think it added any relevance at all to the discussion?

Do you think any one gives a crap about what was on T.V?

David Noah,

you identify alot of incidents with one outside of our life span in the time line. You made reference to leaders not leading by written law but their wits and at the moment of the time. Leadership is funny. Often time, it is synergy that leads the people to wander about with no leaders. Other times, it is unity that unite the people for purpose of ongoing life to follow the leader. As a result leaders show themselves to lead with written law or with their wits at a moments ready or something like that; i dunno how to communicate that well... The subject of your thought process is about leadership and that is why you ask:

Do you think any one gives a crap about what was on T.V?

You ask that because there is no leadership or hints about it in the question itself.

your second question on relevance tells me a lot about you at the moment as well the third one about caring about what was on tv. What I read between the line about you has no relevance to your topic of discussion. Just an FYI for you. So, FYI + just saying = discusion satisfied... ...?

I'm going to send Mayor Bloomberg a copy of the Constitution.

He obviously has no idea that we have a bill of rights.

Yeah, that's the ticket. All the violent criminals are gonna quit their evil ways cuz' bloomberg weighed in. Now all we need is one more gun law to make them turn in their weapons. This time next year, we can stand in a circle with the bloods, crips, latin kings, cia, nsa (hell, this is America - lets let the drone drivers join in), hold hands with the mental defectives & sing 'kumbaya my love'.

Has anyone noticed that this wing nut & all others before him broke a volume of laws? Who can verify that one more is going to alter their behavior? The republic that existed before the Uni-Stat empire was founded on the Constitution of the United States including it's 1st Ten Amendments. That republic is long gone because the people took their meds rather than responsibility. Why - WHY are soldiers still swearing a solemn oath to protect & defend that constitution if it's gutted? We can all agree that most politicians are bought & paid for by corporations. Sturm-Ruger, Colt, Armalite are all corporations. Does anyone think that these companies need the NRA to buy off a senate-whore to maintain their bottom line? Tragic & major stupid.

@truehell, most schools don't have guards let alone enough teachers. Budget cuts ensure a venerable security system in public schools.

@Noah,

Nice try to twist it into a meaningless point about money

I didn't have to twist a thing, it's what you said in response to AG99.

AG99 said:

The Bill of Rights was written by men and can be changed by men

The very next post was from you. And Noah said:

Then lets start with ending Birth Right citizenship.

Then add a balanced budget amendment that requires our leaders to balance the federal budget.

You then went from one financial issue to the next.

When my young child asked me; what is a Democrat? and what is a Republican? I oversimplified by saying that Republicans care more about money than people and Democrats care more about people than money. And you, buddy boy, haven't let me down.

Cool. So you want us to throw all our guns into the water over a few shootings. To just completely disarm. What an excellent idea, afterall, it worked so well in Britain, and in Australia!... Oh wait. It didn't. The numbers only went down because there were fewer guns, people were still dying, violence was still happening, and hey, crime also got worse. I'm all for making background checks mandatory. I'm all for making it so they can't be illegally modified, which... well, it's already illegal. I am not, however, for Americans to just completely disarm.

Our forefathers knew that tyrants would love to take advantage of power to take control of a people afraid to defend themselves. This is the same mentality for crooks and thugs on the street, the ones that will still have these weapons. I'm sorry folks, but there's no Batman that'll save you when the REAL monsters, actual criminals, are wielding actual guns.

Here's a fun story from my elderly neighbor, who owns a gun: When the power went out after a storm, someone started trying to break into her house. She cocked that gun and they ran screaming. Please note: THE POWER WAS OUT. There would be no way to phone Police. Much less for them to get there in time to help her. So tell me, do you really want to leave that poor old lady unable to defend herself? Or are you folks going to throw away another one of your freedoms so you can have the illusion of protection?

ThaMonkeh

I'm an old lady who lives alone in the woods. I have two dogs, but I bring them inside at night and would not turn them out at night if I think there are human predators outside with guns. I am the one who shoots into the air to let them know that I am armed and willing to protect my life and property and have had to do so.

Wonder what they are willing to do for me if they take my rifle?

Bloomberg is laying the grounds for a presidential run. Heaven help us all.

Bloomburg is a extremely rich man who is a communist and would take away every Americans rights if he could. He is a traitor and wants to be a dictator. I despise this man. I'm guessing he had New Yorkers fooled in order to get elected, if not, the place is worst than I thought. Just another reason I do not care if the government takes seventy five percent of his/their stolen money.

I'm curious, Mr. Bloomberg. How do you enforce background checks when the guns are being sold out of the trunk on 38th & 7th?

And you were pushing the dangers of Big Gulps.

Excuse me.... I read your comment several times and I still don't see what it has to do with the article. Did you comment on the wrong article? The slaughter of innocent children has nothing to do with immigration or drugs. Try actually reading the article David.

How many of those 47,000 people killed in Mexico do you think are innocent people and children?

Yes it does relate to this article because while the Democrats are running around screaming for gun control laws to save lives tens of thousands of people are dying each year In Mexico because they refuse to enforce our immigration laws and secure our borders. On top of that you have the ATFE who allowed weapons from the U.S. to be sold to straw buyers for Mexican drug cartels and 1600 of those guns are still unaccounted for.

Explain how knew gun control laws will work when the dept responsible for enforcing those laws violates them?

Explain why its so important that we have to pass gun control laws now because a few dozen people have been killed by psychos in a couple of shooting incidents but its not important to deal with an issue that's causing tens of thousands of lives to be lost every year?

Legalization of all drugs would help weaken the strength of the cartels.

Legalization of all drugs would help weaken the strength of the cartels.

No it won't. They will find something else to make up the revenue. Looks like it will be guns and ammunition on the black market.

Bloomberg loves to violate the Constitution. His NYPD do it everyday with their stop and frisks

Maybe you can explain to me why on earth anyone other than police and military should have the need of an automatic assault weapon?

Who has one of those that you know about?

AlaskaGirl,

There is a big difference between an automatic and a semi automatic weapon. Google the word assault rifle and you will see that what the media is calling "assault" rifles are not even true assault rifles. Google the difference between automatic and semi-automatic and assault rifle verses rifle also. What they are calling assault weapons are just menacing looking semi-automatic rifles. It is just media spin like "undocumented" aliens is. You need to look a little further than NBC or MSN news when you don't know your rifles. I wish someone at NBC or MSN news would do a little research before they write some of these articles.

Google the firing rate of a semi-automatic rifle while you're at it. How fast did the psycho pull the trigger on his semi automatic to put 3 slugs into each kid? Two seconds per child?

One of the boys buried yesterday was shot 11 times. All the children were shot from 3-11 times. One of the surviving teachers that also lunged at the maniac was shot 3 times.

Ban ALL Assault STYLE weapons. Ban ALL high capacity magazines.

Freedoms march and Dave,I agree with both of your posts.

The assault weapons and high-capacity magazine ban expired in 2004. Background checks aren't required on private sales, which according to the article account for 40% of gun sales. And I can't believe gun trafficking isn't already a felony.

This country's gun worship is truly staggering.

AG99

That 40% figure is bandied about as if it's gospel by none-other than the Brady Campaign / Handgun Control organizations.. Those rabidly anti-gun groups funded by none other than..... drum roll please...

His Honor Mayor Michael Bloomberg. Not too biased now are they?

Yet they refuse to acknowledge the approximately 2.5 million times a year that firearms are used to thwart a crime in progress or stop one BEFORE it happens. Of course, those numbers are extrapolated using statistical analysis of reported incidents, but for some reason, they are always lost in the discussion.

So what is the correct figure for private gun sales? I've owned 3 guns in my lifetime, 2 of which I sold to a private buyer. The real figure may very well be higher than 40%.

No one is saying ban gun ownership or that private citizens can't perform a useful function when armed, but when we can't even consider placing limits on the kinds of weapons suitable for private ownership or requiring all owners pass background checks, then we are in the "gun worshiping" phase of our dementia instead of examining the problem like rational adults.

AG99, did you do a background check? I personally own several firearm's, I would never, ever consider selling them to a private party without them going through a background check including fingerprints. I'm a Life member of the NRA. I don't need the Feds. to tell me what is right or wrong.

I do need them to help rebuild the mental health institutions and stop making it not PC to point out that someone is having difficulty coping in society. I need them to educate the public that not everyone can be mainstreamed. I want them to support medical professionals and back them up, when they say someone should not be left unsupervised. I want it easier for someone who cannot or will not cope in our society be able to be held for a 72 hour inpatient observation without the ACLU filing a brief with the Supreme Court.

I'd liked our society to have let that mother know she had nothing to be ashamed of and while she did the best she could her son needed to be institutionalized. Too little, too late.

What would be so wrong with closing/changing the private sale without background check loophole? The background check could be done by a licensed dealer for a fee. I don't see how this would restrict my 2nd amendment rights and it might stop someone that should not be able to purchase a gun from doing so.

I believe this will be a course of action that everybody can and should support. While this will stop criminals and those who have been institutionalized by court order. It is not fool proof by any means. We need to make crime not pay. We also need to rebuild our mental health infrastructure and change our prejudiced against long term mental health hospitals. Understand that some people cannot be mainstreamed.

@little, you guys are grasping at straws. The real issue is this - when any person, mentally deranged or not, wants to go out and kill everything that is the image of happiness, they choose the firearm. More often than not it is a semiautomatic rifle or handgun with an excessive capacity to kill. They don't go pick out the canoe paddle from the garage or the family SUV or EVEN THE 2 GALLONS OF GASOLINE NEXT TO THE LAWNMOWER. They get a gun, a semiautomatic gun, and lots of bullets. These firearms have been legally obtained by themselves or someone in their household. When YOU and these kind of people start carrying out massacres with potato mashers and spatulas we'll explore ways to protect citizens against attacks from kitchen utensils. Until then the PROBLEM IS GUNS.

So you suggest confiscation? Ok you confiscate the guns. But I want the confiscation of alcohol. It by far kills more people from disease, accidents and crime.

We tried that didn't we? We've tried the, "War on Drugs", now a, "War on Guns". Well intentioned.

But you're grasping at straws.

What is an 'assault weapon?'

Zannie84

There is no reason on earth that the average citizen owns any assault rifle or a max amount of ammo.

alan_static

What is an 'assault weapon?'

Zannie84, no "average citizen" owns an assault rifle. An assault rifle is capable of automatic fire. Automatic weapons can only be legally bought, sold or bartered between people who have a federal license for automatic weapons. Just out of curiosity, how many rounds of ammunition qualify as "a max amount?"

Alan_static, An assault weapon, as defined by the AWB (Assault Weapons Ban), is a semi-automatic weapon. That is, one that fires each time you pull the trigger, as opposed to an assault rifle, which is capable of firing all its rounds with one pull of the trigger. The AWB defined an assault weapon of the rifle variety as having a detachable magazine, and two or more of the following characteristics:

Folding or telescoping stock

Pistol grip

Bayonet mount

Flash suppressor

A muzzle device allowing the attachment of a grenade launcher

These are all cosmetic devices. So the government definition of an assault weapon is something that looks military. It has nothing to do with automatic fire or caliber. In fact, many states don't allow the smaller caliber assault weapons to be used for big game hunting. They look military, but many hunting rifles are more lethal.

@Alan_Static an assault weapon is one that has 3 options on the safety. Safe - won't fire. Semi - one round per trigger pull. Auto (rock-n-roll in nam slang) - keeps firing as long as the trigger is held down. However, these are not sold to civilians but can be modified easilly. Also most current military AR-15s (M16 & all its bastard knock-offs) are now designed to only fire 3 rounds on automatic because even professionals (soldiers) tend to empty the magazine in the heat of the moment. This wing-nut did not possess an 'assault rifle'. That is media hype. He had a very macho looking .22.

jackieboy

Basically the same???????

Ok.. same caliber. Ok... same appearance.

But please tell me exactly where that selector switch for full auto operation is? What? You mean it doesn't have one? So the firearm is NOT basically the same.

Please explain the difference between that 22 caliber (that is what a 5.56mm is actually, a 22 caliber) and the 10/22 Ruger my wife uses when we go out "plinking". They're both semi automatic, they both have detachable magazines, they're both "basically" 22 caliber. So besides that scary black color and the carrying handle, what is the difference?

What kind of weapons was the Second Amendment writing about? Maybe muskets and axes?

No, read the Second Amendment, learn and understand it before posting such nonsense.

XDm9mm,

You know firearms well enough to know there is a significant difference between the .22 cal long rifle cartridge and the .223 (5.56mm) cartridge. If your point is that both the .223 and the .22 cal semiautomatic rifles to which you refer, operate in essentially identical fashion, there's no argument against that position that will withstand scrutiny.

If your point is that the outrage against semiautomatic assault weapons is primarily emotional and based on the fact that, for example, the AR-15 assault RIFLE is nearly identical in appearance to the AR-15 STYLE assault WEAPON, again your point is easily defensible.

My basic gripe against all the gun control bruhaha is two fold. First, people don't seem to be aware of or don't want to acknowledge that schools, hospitals, malls, theaters, etc., are no more safe than any other place commonly occupied by our citizens. Therefore, if a citizen wants to be safer (as opposed to feel safer), steps must be taken to assure the citizen's increased safety. Those who argue that these venues should be safe are just shoulding on themselves and probably wanting someone else to do something about it.

Increased personal safety doesn't necessarily mean carry a firearm. It does mean being aware of what's going on around you rather than having your head buried in your iPhone. For instance, when the guy in Clackamas, Oregon, walked into the Clackamas Town Center mall wearing a hockey mask and carrying an AR-15 STYLE assault WEAPON, it should have set of mental alarms and panic in the minds of everyone who saw him. Within seconds there should have been no one left either who was visible or in his proximity to shoot.

Besides being aware of what's going on around you, other things that a citizen can do to assure their personal safety include not going to places where trouble seems to brew at a higher rate than at other places. You can become proficient in the martial arts and basic self-defense. You can train to increase the speed at which you run, become proficient with throwing knives and clubs. And you can obtain a firearm, become proficient in its use as a defensive weapon, and learn what the risks and responsibilities are of carrying and using a firearm.

My second gripe is that even though the proliferation of guns contributes to the problem of gun violence, banning guns is going to be about as effective as banning street drugs. There is a demand for both products that will be met.

As a hypothetical example, let's say that we are successful in having every privately owned handgun, whether owned by criminals or law abiding citizens, turned in and destroyed. At this point, no privately owned handguns exist in the country. How long before someone with criminal tendencies or gang affiliations realizes that having such a handgun would be a decisive advantage? How much would such a person be willing to pay for the only handgun in the country? $5,000, $10,000 or more. And how long would it take a crooked cop who needed some extra money to report accidentally "losing" his handgun when in reality he sold it to a private citizen for lots of money?

How long would it take a member of the military with somewhat squishy ethics and a need for extra cash to figure out a way to rig records so as to smuggle handguns and ammunition off base undetected and sell them? How long would it take people across the country with machine shops that included reloading equipment to start producing black market handguns and ammunition if they could sell each handgun for thousands of dollars and a box of 50 cartridges for $500?

The technology of firearms has been with us for centuries and it is well documented. Privately owned firearms are ubiquitous. The only way we'll ever be able to remove them from private hands is when something better comes along. (Remember the IBM Selectric.)

I guess the hunters in the Dakotas and Nebraska would be surprised that the deer they took with a .223 rifle was not fit to eat... me thinks you are parroting misinformation...

Personally, I think if you need more than one shot to kill a deer you probably need to get back to the target range for more practice.

@freedoms, the guns used in the school massacre were not stolen. They were in the home legally, owned by the shooter's mother. He killed her, took weapons from the house, legally bought and registered weapons, and used them to kill innocent children.

What the hell are you talking about? How is killing someone and then taking something from them not considered stealing?

We have no proof that either she or her child had ever been evaluated for mental health issues. It just comes down to why individual who cannot or will not cope in society not be evaluated. This young man had a history of behavioral problems in school. Why did not child protective services get involved? Just to have him put under a 72 hour observation in a hospital? I suspect he'd have a breakdown and would of been recommended to be put under constant supervision. The mother was trying to raise an individual that needed to be kept under 24 hour supervision. Something she was not equipped to do and resulted in this tragedy.

The hurdles a family has to jump in order to have their loved ones evaluated, treated and if necessary institutionalized is almost impossible.

Well, there it is - put some teeth in the laws. No parole for violent crimes & no twenty years of appeals for convicted criminals. I don't believe that 'temporary insanity' is a valid excuse since a certain degree of insanity is needed to take a human life in any situation. Even in self-defense one must make a snap decision as to which human deserves to live longer. Or, as Josey Wales said, "when it looks like all is lost, ya gotta get mean, real mean". Sadly though, a murderer's execution was recently commuted because he is obese & a double tap to the back of the head is 'cruel & unusual punishment'. And less than a year ago four Marines were convicted for selling military ordnance to gangs. Know for sure, they will play a whole deck of pity cards, from bad up-bringing to ptsd & get out early. Those weapons they sold are on the streets.

You are mad because the leadership in usa is not consistent to your thinking process. Similiar tone in the voices of america. Quite frankly, your view of leadership need to go high up like an eagle to turn on eagle vision. Try to understand leadership now with your new found eagle vision.

Wait, I am not done yet. Read more. Next, go to chruch or place of unity, sit down and meditate. Now, you have peace and hopefully tunnel vision. Try to understand leadership with your new found cyclop vision.

Third, and don't quit on me. Goto to place of chaos or marketplace. Smell the synergy. Locate a busy cafe of choice outdoor, and order a drink--coffee for non-alcoholic. (for alcoholic wannabe, pick busy outdoor beer bar). In door mega mall is swell too! Smell the synergy. What?!?!? Still can't smell synergy ?? Then you forgot something. To find something in chaos you must think b-for business.

resistance is futile. The end.