Yes, crimes must only be tolerated in commercial and industrial zones. No more neighborhood crimes!

I agree!! That will work just as well as banning drugs!

Oh wait a minute, that area is loaded with drug dealers and junkies.

Tacky is working on his douchenozzle merit badge. He's most of the way there.

Wind, I would have to agree with you. There are two things that need to be done. The educational system needs a complete overhaul, I don't care if they take funds from sports or raise taxes a little to cover the costs but schools and parents need to take an active part in children's lives. The more education people receive the more they are likely to find jobs and the less likely they are hanging out in the streets with nothing to do but act like morons who have no care for who they hurt. The second thing is exactly what you say, there needs to be stricter punishments for those that use weapons and violence. All I see now is a slap on the wrist and an off you go attitude. Those that are released from jail need to have some form of assistance to get them on their feet or else they will return to their life of crime.

I don't blame the Grandfather one bit for wanting to leave, I would too. That child was innocent and could have been killed by these fools that have no concern for anything other then themselves, I hope they are found and punished severely.

That area is crime riddled? That describes the entirety of the City of Memphis. I left that cesspool of despair ten years ago and will never even think about going anywhere near it. I'd drive 200 miles out of my way to avoid spending the hour it would take to drive through it. A friend of mine and her husband are big Iowa football fans and are going to attend the Liberty Bowl. I have been using every argument I can think of to change their minds. Maybe I'll show them this article as well. I just pray they get in and out of town safely. Wish I could afford two sets of body armor to give them for Christmas.

This area of Memphis is an absolute -- armpit. It's so crime-riddled there, and their law enforcement is so backed up 24/7 that break-ins/burglaries warrant a police report over the phone until they can send a physical presence out... days later, if at all That is not an exaggeration.

For those who think banning firearms will solve this problem, you're 100% wrong. What makes anyone think the firearm used here was legally obtained in the first place? I would wager a fairly large sum of money it wasn't. Gang activity in Memphis is rampant, and even if a gang member had no prior convictions that would preclude them from buying a gun legally [probably a very small number there] they still don't. They will always, always be able to find what they seek in order to terrorize, steal and kill, through many illegal channels.

The idea of disarming citizens who follow the rules and leave them defenseless to those who don't is just asinine. Political correctness be damned, some people need to freaking think. Growing up probably wouldn't hurt, either.

Memphis...

For those who think banning firearms will solve this problem, you're 100% wrong. What makes anyone think the firearm used here was legally obtained in the first place?

It is likely that the firearm was legally obtained in the first place. What happened after that is anyone's guess.

It doesn't matter what section of town it is . It can happen in any section when people like this have a dispute. I did find it intresting that 5 or 6 shots were fired and only one of the people being shot at got hit and a little girl got hit because of thier stupidity. I can see these idiots bein cool and holding thier guns up sideways( like in the movies when gangsta are bein tough) because they think it intimidates the others. These morons have no clue of life and should all be sent to prison until they are old enough to draw SSI.

This is the problem we have today with the image of gun owners. Stupid trash cause this type of thing to become headlines. the better headline would have read 6 morons shoot it out and kill each other. City must now clean up the mess.

A 68-year-old man was stabbed to death nearby just last Friday, according to police reports.

Ban "ANYTHING" you want, they'll still find another way. Whether it's the above,....or,.....a brick.

How can you live with yourself?

Guns are not an issue, because if this people didn't have guns, this girl could have been hit by a stray knife or rock in the privacy of her own home.

/Sarc

Guns are not an issue, because if this people didn't have guns, this girl could have been hit by a stray knife or rock in the privacy of her own home

And banning guns or more strict gun laws would have stopped the criminal shooter from getting a gun... oh, yeah!

I've got three bridges to sell, who's first, step right up!

Morning, CD.

And banning guns or more strict gun laws would have stopped the criminal shooter from getting a gun

Yes, I feel confident that if we didn't have guns this girl wouldn't have been hit by a stray bullet. And that if we had stricter gun laws (with harsher penalties for criminal gun use) it would have at least reduced the likelihood of the criminal getting a gun and this type of thing from happening.

Also, not all stray bullets have to come from criminal shooters. They can also come from "law abiding" citizens enjoying their rights to "protect" their familiy and/or their property.

This is just going to happen more and more as more people are carrying guns. And soon it will be happening in 'good' neighborhoods too.

so you allow your government to piss away all the decent working class jobs and you wonder why there is so much crime and despair in the poverty "community". Oh I know all those people really need is more education and they'd think up some jobs. What we're all going to be getting pretty soon is some government reeducation when the handouts and helping hands run out and martial law is put into place to deal with the "less fortunate" masses

southern gent is right on the money. They'll get guns, just like they do drugs. Trash is trash no matter how you color it. Trash doesn't work. Just blows around in the street until it ends up jammed in a corner behind a dumpster and that's what those areas are. We have them in our nearest city just like everyone else and it's always the same thing. If it wasn't for the low class, low income black sections, the newspaper would have nothing to write about. I say we all chip in and buy them some bullets and wait for the show. Besides, at the rate they breed, if they didn't shoot each other, we'd be in trouble

I guess vision thinks they really don't have dope either since it's banned and removed from society. Wonder what they are all sitting around smoking if they have no drugs.

Also, not all stray bullets have to come from criminal shooters. They can also come from "law abiding" citizens enjoying their rights to "protect" their familiy and/or their property

We have had stories of family members shooting each other thinking a burgler was breaking into the home, but when was the last time we have a story of a neighbor's stray bullet hitting someone while he was protecting his family and/or property?

Just where I want to live, where I have to have bars on my doors & windows like I'M the one in jail. Can we please start holding people accountable. It starts in your own homes & neighborhoods.

Not hit with a stray pencil, but a stray bullet... what does that say ?

"I guess vision thinks they really don't have dope either since it's banned and removed from society. Wonder what they are all sitting around smoking if they have no drugs."

so you think that since criminals already break every law we have, their should be no laws, right? We should all just live a lawless world, right, because criminals will be criminals, right?

Well, laws and regulations are not to stop criminals from being criminals. Criminals are known to break the law. duh. They are to push authority figures to take certain matters more seriously and to ensure that the regulations are more strongly enforced. Don't you think the government knows that people will break all their laws, even if we have them? But when there are regulations, it helps increase the pressure of scanning weapon handling and push them to keep an eye on black market schemes. I don't think guns should be banned...but there should definitely be regulations and ones that are more ENFORCED.

Southern Gent, 1.12:

I wasn't referring to 'hood denizens doing the thinking. I'm a pretty optimistic person, but there are limits. Not because they don't have the capability to think, but because for the most part the thugs are perfectly content with their lives as they are. As for the innocents that get caught in the crossfire (literally) it is up to the ones who brought them into a world like that in the first place to either 1. get them out of it, or 2. take enough personal responsibility not to give birth to them, knowing they'll have to live in such a horrendous manner. Of course it's a tragic thing when an innocent is injured or killed; they didn't ask to be born into that mess. These parents need to stop looking at these children as nothing more than a check. Selfish doesn't even begin to cover it... just because one can procreate doesn't mean one should. Kittens grow up to be cats, puppies grow into dogs, and more kids than one can handle and/or afford turn into feral adults. Bam.

No, the ones I would like to think are the ones who come here spamming post after post with the same old and tired "ban all firearms" thing over and over. (But again, I'm not holding my breath...) I would remind those folks that they aren't living in reality, and that if faced with an (illegally) armed criminal someday they might just find themselves wishing like hell they had a trained CCW permit holder around with a legal gun to save their butts... especially when the police are on the other side of town dealing with the next popular protest that comes along, masquerading as a crisis. (Eye roll)

May these screaming anti-gun people without a clue remain as invincible as they seem to believe they are... bless their ignorant little hearts.

Vision, show us a story when someone defending their home shot someone with a stray bullet. I do remember a recent story where the highly trained professionals of the NYPD shot nine bystanders while shooting at one criminal.

No Raygirl, quit reading foolishness into it. Of course I don't think we should have no laws. We should enforce the ones we have rather than just ban everything we aren't enforcing well. Banning weapons is a stupid idea as they, meaning the criminals, will still have just as many as they do now. JUST LIKE THE DRUGS. At least the taxpayers will still have one to fight back with if it comes to that. Criminals will always break the laws, duh as you say. Like we don't understand that...

The NRA should pressure the congressmen they own to introduce legislation to issue weapons to all two year olds watching cartoons.

More guns....we need more guns!

I agree with enforcement of the current laws. I see that more then one of the people involved in this went to the hospital, so there's a start. Throw them all in jail. More weapons bans will not solve the issue, just cause more demand. Over the weekend here, every gun store ran out of these same weapons that we are currently talking about banning (AR-15s, Kalashnikovs, SKSs, ect.). Control of the sale of these things will not stop people from getting them anymore. It is in education and parental responsiblity that we should be looking now. And if they are over age of concent, jail time under the current law and make the sentencing tougher.

That's not really my view though. My view is very unpopular. If it was up to me, if you are caught committing a violent crime against a child with a fire arm, the punishment should be simple. You are sent to a nearby wall, the parents are given fire arms of thier own, ready, aim, do what ya' gotta do! Televise the event to spred the word since the media seems to need to sensationalize the public so much. Let all others who think it's cool to just go around shooting in areas where are young are that their collective @$$es are next! See if that doesn't lower your gun crime...but I think it would.

Banning guns wouldn't help here. Then gangs would just hurl knives at each other. Stray knives would be flying everywhere, from distances of up to 100 yards, at amazing speeds, breaking through glass and striking innocent victims in their own living rooms.

What I don't understand for all the defeatists who say well, we can't ban anything because it'll happen anyway.

You could say that about murder too. Should we legalize murder?

Banning guns wouldn't help here. Then gangs would just hurl knives at each other. Stray knives would be flying everywhere, from distances of up to 100 yards, at amazing speeds, breaking through glass and striking innocent victims in their own living rooms.

No, they won't use knives because it takes a measure of nerve and courage to get into a knife fight. Cowards use guns because it isn't up close and personal. So if they can't use guns the next best thing would be Molotov cocktails and pipe bombs which are fairly easy to make, especially the cocktails because alcohol is so easy to get. And we know for damn sure prohibition isn't coming back.

Alcohol, a rag, a bottle... BOOM! and anything flammable goes up with it. Do you honestly think they will stop the destruction if guns are not around? And do you think banning guns will make them disappear? They are already out there.

Damn....Over 200 years with guns and now they start to be a problem....Granted, they became more technologically advanced yes but still....Form of suppression. Suppression leads to more violence....SMH at this stupid, f*cked up world....

I would generally argue that guns aren't as addictive as drugs though, admittedly, I can't say for sure. Withdrawal symptoms are the reason why drug laws are so ineffective. Those who act like there's no difference between being attacked with a gun or a knife would likely change their minds if they were trapped, unarmed, in a room with an attacker who could only have one of those weapons at his disposal. I do agree that both drugs and guns come over our Mexican border in large numbers, illegally so, unless we intend to finally get serious about border control, banning guns will probably do little to prevent street crime. Countries that have banned guns and don't suffer a border invasion like ours, such as China, also don't have nearly our level of gun-related homicide. Few developed countries could even compare to America's homicide rate, anyway, though the highest homicide rates belong to the states with the thoughest gun laws. I think if Obama wishes to tackle the problem of gun violence in this country, he will have to attack several other problems that he has already clearly demonstrated he is not willing to attack. Otherwise, his expressed concerns over American safety strike me as mere show.

But yes, if we sealed the border and created very tough gun laws, where every gun had to be legally registered to you or removed from your possession, every gun owner was fined for careless treatment of their guns (particularly of the type that could result in another person gaining access to them), and guns were all American-made, rather than imported, I suspect we'd see a drastic reduction in homicide for this country, much as other countries have already demonstrated. Any parent should already understand this concept - just because your kids won't stop fighting doesn't mean it's futile to remove their guns.

What makes me chuckle, is ANYONE who believes banning guns is going to stop something like this. Sandy Hook, maybe, but gang violence will only increase if protection is taken away from law abiding citizens. The amount of crimes that are twarted by everyday, law abiding, carrying citizens. Personally speaking, I own many of the gun models that have been used in some of these massacres however I only own them for sport. I do not believe I will need to use these weapons for self defense. Banning semi-automatic rifles, or atleast, putting heavy restrictions on the purchase of them MAY BE THE ANSWER. Now my .44 magnum on the other hand, THATS MY PERSONAL PROTECTOR.

@ Boreal Belle...

Don't forget about aborting all the brain-damaged white ones, who will grow up to be white gun-goobers-- that habitually go crazy and commit massacres every othe week-- in crowded cities, malls, schools, in their own vanilla hoods , homes & on college campuses.

Eventually, America would be able to eradicate that biggest of gun problems of the the 21st century!

Hey, Belle... have you racially profiled any white males, lately?

Ok i am convinced , we need to outlaw watching cartoon in section 8 housing!!!

SouthernGent--#1.12 -- Your experience is very different from mine. I live in a nice, integrated older neighborhood, current home values about $79,000 to $120,000 depending on size and condition. The most trouble I've seen in our neighborhood came from a white man renting a house about 5 doors down--there was always trouble going on there. One night my hubby and I were woke up in the middle of the night by a woman pounding on our door and yelling "Help me help me!" It was that white man's girlfriend who had locked herself in his bathroom, crawled out the window, and ran off---to our house. Please understand, my husband and I are both white with a little tiny bit of Native American. I let her in, and let her use my cell phone to call her sister to come pick her up. And just in case that idiot of a boyfriend decided to come break down our front door to get at her, my husband had his shotgun ready. Of course, we never had to use it, and we both hope we never have too. There are plenty of successful integrated neighborhoods. The whole world is not represented by your one bad experience.

racially profile a white male? Hmmm. Get up, work all day, return to a home that you pay property taxes on, clean guns and worry about folks that don't pay taxes, i guess.

Enforce the laws we already have on the books for all crimes, PUNISH criminals with more than 3 hots and a cot. Put deterrent back into punishment. Teach people that crime will be dealt with swiftly, severely and without regard to the perpetrator's upbringing. Absolutley no pleas for a firearm related offense.

Stopping criminals from commiting crimes with firearms and victimizing law abiding citizens should be the focus of any gun control effort, not victimizing law abiding citizens who happen to own firearms but have committed no crime.

As a society we see it as wise practice to license cars and require driver training, I believe it is wise to license gun ownership and require gun owner training. This is not unreasonable.

For all the "guns get stolen from law abiding citizens" talk and using this to further efforts to tell law abiding citizens what legally produced, distributed, marketed and sold product they may own I say this. Larceny is already a crime. So are you saying laws dont prevent crime? I agree. Stopping Larceny and punishing those caught, more so if they steal guns, will eventually provide you the safety you seek by taking away my right to own a product.

Obama hater

I thought I told you to go back to bed.....LOSER!

C_D

I would hardly call two people dead at the mall a massacre. You can call the school shootings and the theater massacres, but the one or two people on the streets or in their homes now and then? No.

Windancersong-1494878

- Someone needs to relay that to the legal system and lawyers that allow this kind of stuff to keep going on and one.

If anyone is absolutely sure that the community should have anti-violence laws and better mental health facilities, start a community committee on gun control. Keep pushing your legislators to make stricter laws, and providing better mental health centers.

This has been a thrilling year for gun enthusiasts across the country! Mass murders, child killings, and the wholesale slaughter of the innocents on the alter of the Second Amendment! At least the childish wannabe Rambos of the nation still have their pointless, yet deadly, playthings...for now, anyway. You guys should be proud.

If the 2 year had been packing she'd have been able to defend herself. Get one for the older girl there too. Why if EVERYONE had a gun (maybe two or more) there would be no more deaths and injuries due to gun violence. Guns put an invisible shield around anyone carrying one.

At least that's what I've been reading from those defending guns.

Sailcat-2064101

I've seen your comments on various threads here... but I have yet to see you offer up a practical solution... Banning all firearms is NOT going to happen in your or your great grand childrens lifetime.

The entire city of Memphis is one big slum project.

Well, there in lies part of the problem. Government subsidized housing. How many of those gangbangers/drug dealers/criminals had two PARENTS, not just a sire and a surrogate. A return to parents that instill discipline, manners and respect.

You, SouthernGent, with your racist, pompous attitude do not deserve any respect yourself.What a totally innane idea you spout. Killing off a group of people will not lead to building up upper middle-class neighborhoods. There is no society that exists consisting of only upper middle-class people. Keep dreaming in your enclosed high-gated pristine white community. Just remember; according to National Vital Statistics, Vol.61, No 1, August 25, 2012, the birth rate among white, unmarried women was 627,541 births as opposed to 427,687 among black unmarried women. Best not let your daughter venture beyond those locked gates.

jerseyshoremarie

You got on SouthernGent because they made this about race then you turn around and play the race card yourself? and you should really learn how statistics work in full context rather than raw numbers.

They created their own problems. They @!$%# kids out with no means to support them and we have to pay for them. They have the same chance to get an education as anybody else but choose not to. We build housing for them and they destroy it. Outsiders arent coming in and trashing the place. The parents dont give a @!$%# as long as they get their food stamps and welfare. If the taxpayers are going to have to pay for them because they wont work and want to be dope dealers and gang bangers. then just spend our money on building extra large prisons to keep them off the streets and away from civilized society. Oh my god, what a racist comment you will say. I say,if they want to live and act like animals,then treat them like animals.

Marie, it seems your comment was what was racist. Negro is not a racist term, and he did not advocate killing an entire race as you did. While your statistic stated numbers, the correct way to disclose that would have been in a percentage, seeing how there are so many more white people than black in America. While your at it, how many of those unmarried women continue to have the father in the child's life, though not married, as that has become common place in today's society.

Southern Gent: You sir are NO gent! But I'm sure from your posts you definitely are "Southern."

For the record: The little girls mom was at work and the Grandfather was babysitting.

Thank you, 1SGFitzsWife4ID, so succinctly well said! The mom is doing the best she can, trying to better herself in honest and honorable ways--I wonder how that squares with SouthernGent's racist views?!?

SoutherGent,

I've read a lot of your posts in the past and thought they were OK but C'mon man. Be nice.

Even though this vine is here to vent and discuss our thoughts, there are certain thoughts that you/we need to keep to ourselves.

Have a nice weekend...

CD

Judging all Southerners by comments from Southern Gent is as bad as him judging all Blacks by an experience from one or two bad fools.

I live in a small Southern town (only one stop light). We have mixed racial couples with beautiful children, who are accepted and loved without anyone blinking an eye. We have no racial conflicts at all here, and this town has a good mixture of Blacks, Hispanics, Iranian, East Indian, Native American, Cuban and a few I have no idea of.

Everyone but the East Indians seems to own a gun but the only arguments generally center around foolish things that are settled without even a fistfight.

Morning, FitzsWife!

CD, you are getting around today!

Thank you, screminmimi--well put, and thank you for sharing your experience:)

southerngent should have been aborted and other sick white men like him. It was a white boy that killed all those kids in conn. it was a sick white boy that killed those people in colorado it was a white boy shot Mrs gifford and killed others.There is a light at the end of the tunnel because the white birth rate has been will continue to be on the decline that means less sick white boys running around with their guns

It should be a privilege to land a residency in a Project when you are in need, and with that comes certain responsibilities. Projects are meant to help the needy, not to pad your profit margins for dealing drugs. I don't have any problem with those who are living there being subjected to periodic searches for weapons and drugs.

It seems every year close to the holidays people go nuts. More robberies, theft, killings and the like. Stay safe out there. Glad this child is in stable condition.

1SGFitzsWife4ID

For the record: The little girls mom was at work and the Grandfather was babysitting.

• 2

• !

#2.9

Yeah I saw that too, but the question still stands, Where is her Dad? Where are the other guys Dad's

JersyshoreNiteMare likes to point out that there were more White than Black giving birth which true, obviously, but NEARLY THREE QUARTERS OF BLACK HOUSEHOLDs are single 'parent', and how many of those are full blown welfare/foodstamp/housing? How many are no Discipline, no Supervision, mom's on drugs homes?

I am not saying this doesn't happen to whites or hispanics, or asians, but it seem to happen a lot more to Blacks. Why?

For generations the welfare system has made it impossible for males to be part of the equation, and now we have a generations trained to "once she's knocked" get out of the picture, your "responsibility" is over. Maybe I am wrong, but that is the perception that the media leaves me with.

But if I am right, we need programs to reinforce the males role in child rearing. I don't care what the liberals say. A woman can not do it alone.

Since there were no arrests, it's clear the cops stay away from this place. Guess there are too many guns.

Or not enough cops.

Plenty of cops. The entire Memphis police dept. is on the take from the local gang lords.

Cool.

Last time I checked you couldn't get any deer meat, moose, elk, geese, Buffalo, Large unattended corn fed Cows in someone elses field, (edible, not eligable) at the grocery store, so I do see why there are 15K more hunting stores than grocery stores.

What a crock of s++t the article in the link is. It doesn't mention that alot, probably most of the "gun stores" are merely a person with an FFL that just got the FFL so that they wouldn't get bothered by the BATF. Nice spinning!

Just like Detroit, which I'm near, Memphis is an absolute pit. I have a buddy that was a cop there, he said it was merely like trying to herd a bunch of animals. No intelligence, nobody living there that even cares that they're all idiots, and so you think the cops really cared? The people hated the cops and wanted them all dead! Would you give a crap about people like that? He said a homocide usually was usually idiot against idiot, and when you got there you hoped they both were dead as the paperwork was less and you didn't waste any time going to the hospital, but the hospital did have good coffee.

Fishman1

Because you can't get elk, moose, deer, geese, etc...in grocery stores that accounts for why there are 15,000 more gun stores than grocery stores? How many guns do you need to kill one of these animals? Besides; I sincerely doubt that more people like game meat more than chicken, pork or beef.

Jerseyshore... There will always be more of one or the other. It isn't a 50/50 world. Deer, buffalo and elk meat is healthier than beef. Never had moose but suppose it's good. No feedlot additives in wild game.

Guntoter13... I have my doubts you tote any guns. Having an FFL gives a person the ability to have a business (tax permit also needed). Having an FFL doesn't get you around the BATF. Other way around. I have to know where all my guns have been aquired and then sold. Background checks are needed on all guns sold. Then noted on the Form 4473. I'm subject to visits from an ATF agent. Hours posted. Paperwork needed. It's a crock if you think an FFL gets you around regulations. Actually it adds! Been an FFL holder since 1975.

The "acceptance of crime culture" in this country is a greater threat than my legally owned and obtained firearms are.

For all the talk of "getting rid of guns" no one wants to talk about getting rid of criminals. If the shooter in this story had been properly dealt with for the crimes no doubt committed prior to the shooting, the little child would not be injured, at least not by this perp. Observe, arrest, try, convict, punish. Repeat as needed.

Jerseyshore: I need as many firearms as I would like to work and pay for. What i dont need is you or anyone else to tell me what I need where a legal product and activity is concerned.

My hubby and I live in Bakersfield, CA and there are way more grocery stores here than gun stores.

BTW, elk meat is DELICIOUS!! Not wild tasting at all, and much healthier.

In some state a convicte felon can get a gun but not vote. how many of them do you think obtain guns and sell them on the street. Its the guns stupid

harold would you please name the states that a felon can "get" a gun cause you know they can't purchase them legally right?

dtrx

harold would you please name the states that a felon can "get" a gun cause you know they can't purchase them legally right?

Every state in the union actually. ANY felon can petition to have their 2nd amendment and voting rights restored. All depends on the felony, time and felon whether it is granted or not.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/14/us/felons-finding-it-easy-to-regain-gun-rights.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

In some state a convicte felon can get a gun but not vote.

Ok

so name one state that will restore 2nd amendment rights but not voting rights.

Senior Chief

so name one state that will restore 2nd amendment rights but not voting rights.

Have to petition for each individually. Voting rights are a different topic.

A 20 year old killed this morning by a stolen car occupied by 3 juvenile thieves that ran a redlight . One of them was arrested last week for multiple burglaries but turned loose by a 'bleeding heart' judge.

The only thing that I see odd is you can't see the difference between auto accidents and the shooting of anyone especially a child.

Gpa, of course its odd to you, it does not bode well for your stance that eliminating legal guns will result in people, of any age, remaining alive.

Reality is people, of all ages, will continue to die at the hands of criminals even if every gun in the world was eliminated tomorrow.

The cars kill more people than guns excuse is truly getting old. Cars are not made to injure or kill; what is the purpose of a gun other than to do just this? Let's also get rid of swimming pools and bathtubs; kids drown in them, and so on and so on. Not a viable argument.

Cars are not meant to kill people, although they are dangerous in the wrong hands. That's why they require you to pass a written test and road test. to acquire a license. Licenses need to be renewed. And you need to prove you have good eyesight, at least with corrective lenses. Cars need to be registered and inspected regularly. Car owners need to get insurance, including liability insurance for the benefit of those they might hurt. Guns are at least as dangerous as cars. At a minimum all these same rules as for cars should apply to gun owners.

Marie, it is a viable argument. The results are on the wall. Responsibility is the issue here. Millions use both items responsibly daily, so when one crazed individual screws up & you want to ban something, that just proves the point that you are arguing against.

The cars kill more people than guns excuse is truly getting old. Cars are not made to injure or kill; what is the purpose of a gun other than to do just this? Let's also get rid of swimming pools and bathtubs; kids drown in them, and so on and so on. Not a viable argument.

The restricting legal gun ownership argument is what is getting really old. The auto death argument is just inconvenient for that argument.

Target competition as seen at every Olympics

Hunting - still legal like it or not

Collection and investment - again still legal like it or not

Here are a few other legal uses. The fact that you disagree with them matters not to me.

The idea that guns provide safety Greatly depends on whose hands the guns are in. In this instance the guns were clearly in the wrong hands. The idea that everyone should have a gun is absolutely sheer lunacy. The idea that no responsible law abiding citizen should have a gun is also lunacy.

Too bad you don't understand my position. The paranoia among gun owners that suggests people want to take their toys away is really stupid. REALLY STUPID!

Beyond that, from what you write I can't tell what point your trying to make. That the answer is that if some people have guns everything will be fine? Pul-eeeeeeeeeeease!

Point is some people can safely handle the responsibility of gun ownership some people can't .Is that so hard to understand? If I have a different position than you It doesn't mean that I'm stupid or paranoid. I would never promise you everything will be fine,you sir misunderstand my position.

Monstrous myth my ass! My gun saved me from either being beaten or worse, twice! And no shots fired. The mere knowledge that "Oh S++T!, this guy's got a gun!", made the scum disappear. I really hope you never find yourself in a situation where there's a guy walking up to you with a steel pipe wanting whatever you have, or just crazy drunk and wanting to beat someone up. So you better just hunker down and never, ever leave your house, and even there you are not perfectly safe from someone who wants what's in your house and will go through you to get it. Good luck, my naive friend...

So you're saying if somebody broke into your house, intent on doing you and family harm, you wouldn't want to have a gun? Just talk to him about violence in today's society..I'm certain that will protect you!

When you can prove to me that no criminals have any weapons of any sort & there is no corruption in any division of government, that you may be able to get the law abiding citizens to forfeit their own weapons.

guntoter13 has a point there--even just hearing a round being chambered in a shotgun will send many perps running.

Jack,

Too bad you don't understand my position. The paranoia among gun owners that suggests people want to take their toys away is really stupid. REALLY STUPID!

and you actually have the nerve to call us stupid? really? Isn't that exactly what you are advocating?

That is by far the stupidest comment i've read all day.

Lol.

No I'd rather ask someone who has no conception why people think large capacity magazine's are necessary. Maybe it would make them think a little bit.

granpa...our second amendment is also to protect us from a tyrannical gov. do you think they don't have automatics? which are already BANNED. the three thugs that pistol whipped me didn't give a @!$%# about the laws(wish i had a gun,they would of been three dead thugs) sorry to burst your bubble but we live in dangerous times

Gpa: I dont need to justify my legal purchase of a legal product to you or anyone else. so go ahead and ask "why large cap magazines are necessary?"

dtrx:Automatic weapons produced before a date of ban may be legally purchased and owned by citizens in the USA with the exception of states which have banned their posession. (CA) A license is required to buy and possses these weapons.

woodja-didn't know they could be owned thanks for the info. my point was that we would already be fighting against more firepower were there martial law and removal of more of our rights as it is.to those that are calling for registrations of gun owners are also forgetting that hitler did that before systematically removing them from peoples homes and killing anyone that resisted. don't think that can happen here you have your head in the sand...please take it out and look around

underemployed

Your sarcasm made me chuckle...Unfortunately, your comment will probably be used by some of the gunphiliacs (newly listed psychological disorder) to support their passion.

Lol.

Criminals buy their guns illegally. Gun theft is low. Your theory is implausible.

Not mine and not a theory. It is a well established fact direct from law enforcement. Guns owned legally by a home owner are more likely to be used in an accident or act of violence, injuring another family member or, having been stolen, another innocent elsewhere in the same locale (city, town, etc) than they are to be used to defend property against a would be criminal.

The conclusion being that rarely is a gun actually useful for protection and more likely your gun will be used to injure someone innocent or yourself.

So goes the myth of "I need a gun to protect my family/self/home."

That's because the home owner is rarely home when a burglary occurs.

The point that you may be missing is how legally purchased guns are actually used, not for protection. And yes, as you said, not being home to attempt to use the weapon to thwart a thief, again makes the gun purchase pointless. Alarm systems are much more useful.

Remember during prohibition, when liquor was stolen from homes...oh wait, it was made illegally or imported from overseas...

What you say cannot be true. It is illegal to steal from homes. There are laws, we have prohibited this act. Alarms and locks are unnecessary.

Down here in South Carolina I read about plenty of whites killing people.

At least their shooting each other. Mass murder by whites usually involve killing completely innocent strangers.

2 years old. Them "inner city black gangstas" sure start young.

This country has the money to send our military around the world. If one half of that was spent here it would go long way to in stopping all the shootings we have lately. Its time to look out for the home folk and let the world worry about them selves. People come from all over the world to live in this country. Some of them because some laws are so weak they take advantage of it. Guns are to easy to get through legal purchase of home burglary. One way to slow or stop these shootings is to CONTROL THE SALE OF AMMUNITION. Let the law enforcement handle the sale of AMMO. That may not stop the problem but it might slow it down. Its not the GUN doing the harm its the bullet. We have floods,we call the national guard, we have hurricanes ,we call the national guard, It is time to call out the national to help get the ammunition out of the hands of the gun owner. Pay what it cost him to buy it.

Using the National Guard to go door to door to get the ammo from everyone in the country could work, but after the first batch of guardsman get shot up and a full scale civil war starts, who is going to finish the job?