No, its Hollywood, video games and music that inspire people to do these things. We must ban all forms of video entertainment, and ban music to curb our violent urges. Because, you know, none of this could have anything to do with those proclaiming violent revolution, mental illness, or individuals that are just plain violent.

If the media keeps perpetuating the Newtown shooter who will not be named, more crazies will start coming out of the woodwork.

STOP SHOWING HIS PICTURE.

But I thought this was part of the video game being played..

Its a shame, but we are going to have copy cats on the lose now. The more they see how much media coverage there is, the more people who want that limelight glory are going to be doing crazy stuff like this. Once again, a Gun is nothing with out an owner. It will never fire for eternity if it just sits there. It needs someone to pick it up and pull the trigger.

"There were 38 THOUSAND gun related murders in Mexico (where all guns are illegal) in the last six years. You ban guns and only the criminals will have them."

And many western European countries have far fewer guns than us, and yet their violent crime rates are a fraction of ours.

It's a cultural problem, not a problem of too many or too few guns.

In certain part of the world for the male teen, the ownership and knowledge of using a gun is a sign of reaching adulthood. It is almost like a rite of passage. In most of the MiddleEast, almost all adult male either own guns today or in the future. In Afghanistan the cultural tradition is the same. In fact, Afghanistan craftsmen make some of the best duplicated guns in the world.

Yet despite the common practice of gun ownership in these foreign cultures, there is little mass killing in these nations in contrast to USA where gun ownership is not as common and homicide by gun is rampant. As to an explanation for this disparity, there's must be other factors at play in the American culture.

A well regulated Militia,

EXACTLY...the words "well regulated"are a part of the amendment.

I have no desire to take away hunting rifles or the hanguns with less than 6 clips of sane legal people. WHy does a sane person need an automatic weapon? For what legal purpose would you use it?

"GREECE IS DE ARMED PLUS , Iran, Syria, Libya, Iraq, Sudan, Russia, ENGLAND, AUSTRALIA, SPAIN, GERMANY..."

I'm not sure why you capitalized the safest countries on the list... But yes, you're right - those capitalized countries are both de-armed (though limited gun ownership is still allowed) and significantly safer than the US.

I would love to move to Germany or England or Australia or Spain - not because I dislike the US, but because I spent time in Sweden as a child (my father got a job there) and I learned to love their people and their culture. Unfortunately, it's not simply a matter of buying a ticket - many of those countries have pretty strict immigration laws and you have to have certain skills to get a residency visa.

"25 States allow anyone to buy a gun, strap it on, and walk down the street with no permit of any kind: some say it's crazy. However, four out of five US murders are committed in the other half of the country: so who's crazy?"
-- Andrew Ford
"By calling attention to 'a well regulated militia', the 'security' of the nation, and the right of each citizen 'to keep and bear arms', our founding fathers recognized the essentially civilian nature of our economy. Although it is extremely unlikely that the fears of governmental tyranny which gave rise to the Second Amendment will ever be a major danger to our nation, the Amendment still remains an important declaration of our basic civilian-military relationships, in which every citizen must be ready to participate in the defense of his country. For that reason, I believe the Second Amendment will always be important."
-- Senator John F. Kennedy, 1960

Human-4637934 where did you get that the troopers were the first who were shot........?

And this country has a well regulated militia, its called the National Guard.

If the @!$%#ing media would quit fueling these @!$%#ing quacks this @!$%# would not be happening!!!!!!!!!

AN ARMED SOCIETY IS A SAFE AND POLITE SOCIETY!!!! They also would think twice if a larger number of the population were armed there would be a huge drop in crime and less people that commit the crime on the streets cause they will be dead no longer a minus to society

All the kooks are coming out they all resemble zombies just a matter of time before this virus effects overseas but right now it’s just affecting the ones that want gun control!

The NRA will tell you that these troopers survived because they had a cop in every car.

"Guns in themselves don't kill, it's the human who pulled the trigger who did the killing. Simple and spot on"

And guns make it a whole heck of a lot easier.

And this is why I have a conceal & carry permit. Do you really believe that our government is actually going to protect you? Do you think they care about each & every citizen in this country? They have their own agenda to attend to & really don't give a rat's a$$. With saying that, I do love my country, but it is the government that I fear.

Long, the U.S. has 5% of the world's population but 50% of the world's guns, yep that's something to be proud of; being the most dangerous country in the world...

The Gun Violence will not stop.

Every massacreist (sp.?)wants to be famous---If they would just only take their own life--who cares about the issues confronting their selfish selves.

There will more out there, because Gun Sales have been selling faster than paper napkins---In some Gun Shops, they are out of the guns, and ammunition.

So look forward to more craziness in this country--It could not be crazier. This is going to be the new "Norm" in US Society---I do not accept it.

WilliamOfRites

I hope this gunman who murdered 4 people and wounded 3 state troopers with his gun didn't interrupt the NRA speech clearly telling the USA guns aren't the problem.

If your kitchen cabinet falls off the wall, who do you blame

(A) The Carpenter's Union

(B) The carpenter who hung the cabinet

(C) The screw gun the carpenter used

TruettCollins does the order of the flying bullets make those troopers any less injured or those people any less dead? Trained armed people--state troopers--were present and three people were still killed and the gunman took his own life.

And this is just a side note, but if you need an assault rifle to guard your home, maybe you need to stop buying guns and save for a new house in another neighborhood. If you need an assault rifle to shoot a deer, then you are just a terrible hunter.

The purpose of the 2nd is for citizens to be armed so they can protect themselves from foreign AND DOMESTIC enemies.

The article is incomplete, poorly written and vague at best.

"Didn't Norway just have 77 people killed in a mass shooting and they have some of the strictest gun law in Europe?"

Yes, violent crimes occur all over the world. But don't fool yourself into thinking that that means that places like Norway are just as violent in the US. Norway is one of the safest places in the world, and your chances of being affected by a violent crime there are much, much lower than they are here in the US. Mass shootings are also MUCH, MUCH rarer, even taking into account the differences in population sizes.

Also, on a side note, Norway actually has more lax gun control laws than several other countries in the region. Hunters and so on are still allowed to own guns.

"Perhaps if a few of those who were slaughtered had a gun, more would have survived."

So now you're proposing that children at a summer camp arm themselves? I mean, you do realize that nearly everyone on that island was under 18, right? You've fully gone out into LaLa Land if you think that "they should have been armed" is the right response to that tragedy.

Also, I'm loving the presumptuousness: "If the scenario had been different, then things would have turned out differently." Or maybe they wouldn't have been different - or maybe things would have been worse. After all, trying to aim at a gunman in a crowd of panicked teenagers isn't guaranteed to have the best results. Even if there had been armed guards on the island, the man would simply know to take them out first (and, having the element of surprise - after all, incidents like these are exceptionally rare in the region - he would probably be able to take them out before they even recognize what's going on.)

But your post makes a good point: The diehard gun advocates don't really think, they just mindlessly echo the refrain: "More guns! More guns! More guns!"

In spite of the fact that guns are strictly controlled, most of western Europe is doing pretty well for itself on the violence front. To put it another way, Americans don't really have a right to criticize other developed countries for their gun control laws. But you highlight another important point - to some people, it doesn't matter that those countries are MUCH safer than the US. That they can't own guns is all that matters. They value gun ownership over everything else, including safety.

Awful lot of conversation by so many with so little information to go on.

this country has a terrorist law what these nuts are doing is the same as whats going on overseas maybe its time to start locking them up and quit yelling they are mental then bring back corporal punishment back to homes and schools get rid of time oput . then they might show a little respect to more than themselves . it looks like when these laywers vand judges and congressmen took out the butt whuppins they let the guns come in . they are just bas guilty of these murders as the ones pulloing the triggers.

Yeah, if only criminals have guns it will make it a lot easier to identify them.

uchusky99 - Even with 5 round magazines he could have killed the same amount of people. I read in the news that some of the kids were shot up to 11 times each.

Wall St. Fat Cat - have you ever read a newspaper? Watched the news on tv? Had any kind of information regarding the middle east? There is more violence throughout the middle east than anywhere except certain African states. Between the different sects and the "resistance" movements, it's nothing but a freaking war zone over there.

I was there. The gun just jumped off the floor and started to kill people all by itself. When will all those evil guns learn to obey the law?

You people are blaming everyone but the shooter. What a waste of time.

What? Did someone way up at the top say that mass school shootings like the one that happened in Connecticut do not happen in other countries around the world? That maybe only kids in the US act out violently and kill after watching violent movies and playing violent games meant for adults? Well, I don't know if that's the entire reason they do this, but I do know that such mass killings at schools occur around the world:

infoplease.com/ipa/A0777958.html

Hmm, we have to start arming our troopers so they can stop people like this.

hey denver bill, you are an idiot! did the cabinet kill you? did the cabinet maker intentionally kill you? did the maker of the screwdriver design it specifically to kill you? did the cabinet makers union defend the cabinet maker who wanted you dead with the screwdriver that was specifically designed with the single purpose of killing you? NO!

Human - "And this is just a side note, but if you need an assault rifle to guard your home, maybe you need to stop buying guns and save for a new house in another neighborhood. If you need an assault rifle to shoot a deer, then you are just a terrible hunter."

No one tells you what kind of car you should drive down the street. If you want to drive a Porsche, it is your right. No one should be able to tell me what type of gun I should be able to own. Assault style weapons are legal. If that is my choice, then I should be able to own them.

The first time I met my grand nephew, he was 5, we picked him up from a baseball game and he sat next to me in the back seat in his child seat and as we were heading home, he spit in my face. His parents didn't discipline him for it. Every time I've seen him, he acts out, he has a separate meal cooked for him because he won't eat what everyone else eats at the table, then he doesn't eat that. Soon after dinner, or even before everyone else is done eating, he is ordering ice cream, soda, potato chips and other snacks for himself. I've seen him playing Halo, Deep Space, Resident Evil, Metal Gear, Infamous and other violent shoot'em up killing games. He's 7 now and will be 8 in a few months. Last month at Thanks Giving, he was waving one of those Nerf guns around with the hard plastic tips on the ammo and I told him not to point it at anyone. Less than a second after I said it, he shot me in the face with it. He wasn't disciplined by his parents. In a few days, for Christmas, he is getting a Daisy BB gun, I can only guess the damage he'll do with that. Maybe by the time he is 10 or 12 he'll have his own .22 - who knows, maybe even an AR style rifle. He's not my kid, but I've seen the things he is permitted to get away with and I doubt he is unique with young parents who also play these same games own guns sitting in the closet.

Your all a bunch of anti gun wackos, this article doesn't give the type of weapon or a motive. Lib nut jobs run a muck.

Wall St. You were doing good until your second paragraph & then went off the deep end. Whom is responsible for all the suicide bombers killing hundreds of people at a time on a less that weekly basis. Who stole airplanes & flew them into civilian buildings killing thousands. Who burned & killed at our embassy? I could go on, but I gotta go.

Sadly, there IS something to be said about the violence that our children are exposed to today.. It is graphic, vicious and brutal.. Much of it shows the very worst of what humans can do to each other and there really is no stopping a kid that wants to watch this stuff.. In most cases both parents work and a smart kid will certainly find a way around computer and television blocks.. It's also very easy for them to get a hold of R and X-rated DVDs and video games.. Even prime time shows like the CSI's, Revolution and Law and Order:SVU, just to name but a few are pretty damn violent.. In fact, I found Revolution so repugnant, because of it's horrible graphic abuse of the children on the show, that I quit watching it! Beating the hell out of kids is NOT my idea of prime time fun! Yes, folks, I DO know these are ONLY TV shows and that they are not real, that they are suppose to be 'entertainment', however, one person's 'entertainment' is not always everyone else's choice.. But I can't help but think about the kids that watch this crap and you can't tell me, if I'm affected by it to a certain degree, that some of them are not just as affected, perhaps much more..

I've been playing video games for 25 years and am nearing 70 now, but even I am shocked by some of the realistic and violent graphics that these games have.. It's not like when I first started playing and the evil dude was a funny looking little sprite, now it's more likely to be the player who is blowing people's limbs and heads off in a spray of VERY realistic blood and gore! There IS a correlation between the violence in these games, TV shows and movies and real life.. If you people fail to realize that some people, young and old, are deeply affected by them then you are fools with your heads buried deep in the sand!

Understand, I am not saying everyone who plays games or watches the violence on a TV show or movie will be so disturbed by it that they will go out and kill.. Far from it, but there ARE those that truly are mentally unbalanced enough to begin with or so deeply into drugs that they WILL be affected by what they see.. They are simply so out of it they cannot tell real from fake anymore and, sometimes, they just don't care, they want to hurt others the way they, themselves, feel hurt.. Bullying and abuse by parents and peers only serves to inflame the rage higher until the break comes and then, look out world, the killer is unleashed again!

One thing is certain, taking away guns from ordinary citizens is NOT going to stop violence.. People who wish to kill WILL kill, perhaps in even worse ways.. A bomb can kill and maim far more people then a rifle and there are a ton of bomb making sites on the web, take away the guns and you leave a killer with even more dangerous options! I don't know the answers but I'm no fool, I can recognize that over the decades, watching as more and more graphic violence has taken over our 'entertainment', no matter what it is, that more deadly violence has also occurred in real life.. No coincidence there, folks, it's related, no question about it.. Play the fool if you want, keep your head buried in the sand or play the denial game all you like, the truth is very easy to see.. The old adage 'violence begets more violence' says it all and it says NOTHING about 'fake' violence!

The day that mankind everywhere gives up 'contact' sports for good, science can be assured that humankind has just taken another giant leap up the ladder of evolution..

If the media reported every fatal car accident, and every medical mistake that killed somebody, like it does when somebody gets shot, you idiot liberals would be screaming for safer cars, and more hospital oversite.

Do you have any thoughts that aren't spoon fed into your brains by the liberal media?

Surely it must be a simple solution.

And it must be just one thing that caused it.

It surely couldn't be complicated!

People are easy to understand and "figure out".

Is it even remotely possible that this is a multifaceted issue that may encompass more that one issue?

Sure, guns are A issue. No different than someone who chooses to use another tool (a knife). But so is mental health care, violence on TV, violence in music, violence in/on video games, a lack of morality etc etc. Every situation will have these and more as part of the milieu of the shooting but in different proportions. I do believe in a very strong liberal (ecchh!!) interpretation of the 2nd Ammendment. Every reasonable person has the right to their gun(s) for any legal purpose they choose. But the liberal justice system has watered down justice to the degree that people are becoming more-and-more brazen in their break-in's and thievery such that I want/need to protect my family AND my bombs, bazookas and sling shots while I'm away from the home (3 cute little puppies help). If the lefties are sincere, then start arguing for more safes in the home...not fewer guns.

.

Well...there goes Wayne Lapierre's idea! His "good guys" didn't prevent this, did they?

What a moron...

DG_W: I guess Huckabee loses his "God was thrown out" argument too.

Will LaPierre demand that we arm all the church ladies now too ?

This is the reality, if you want to kill, you get a GUN.

Yes, people kill without guns, but they don't throw knives through windows and walls to kill.

One death is too many.

By reading all of these comments, I can see that most of the problem has to do with hate. Look how many of you are name calling each other. Gay bashing, calling people idiots, morons and worse. Maybe we all need to take a look inside ourselves and see where the real problems are. I wouldn't want a gun in the hands of many of you angry people.

Merry Christmas and let there be Peace on Earth.

Hey Come to decatur Illinois, We have gang Violence everyday where illegal weapons are used to shoot and kill everyone. oh and you will know when you drove down the wrong street but hey take away the guns from model americans that only want to protect themself and there familes just so govt can come in and take us over, well i have news for you, ill give up my guns, one bullet at a time. they spend 99% life on a gunrack in my room collecting dust but if someone ever were to break in i will be the one protecting my wife and i, i will be the Law on my property

I have the right to bear arms, but Obozo and his Marxist buddies in Washington want to get their hands on my thermonuclear devices. F'ing Hawaiian Kenyan Facist Socialist Neoliberal Neocon Realist Oligarth!!

the queenie Comment collapsed by the community

dude peeps in other countries see the same movies and TV shows and play the same video games and yet they aren't shooting up their schools, shopping malls, and movie theaters......

****************

You are right! Because those other countries have real strict gun laws. A knife wouldn't have killed the poor lady in the church nor could the shooter have killed a driver in the vehicle he hit with a knife. All the driver would need to do is roll up the window or run the shooter over.

I guess none of you liberally freed minds noticed it was a gun that stopped this man? That's right. Care to notice? I bet you people think you could just hug the man, give him a tree and some welfare and it would be ok?

I know...I know. If the church lady had a gun in her purse she would be alive today.

I think the government should take the guns away from the fanatic hostile Republicans and leave the rest of us alone. Check the person's background. If he's a registered Republican he is unfit to own a weapon.

I'm a registered Independent but I must confess I have voted for Democrat presidential candidates for the last 24 years. The Republicans have been fanatics starting with their vendetta against Bill Clinton simply because he beat their man Daddy Bush. Daddy Bush was a crook that sold American weapons to Iran to fund the Nicaraguan Contras which was a crime yet he had some flunkies to take the fall. Republicans cannot handle defeat and the last four years have proved that as did the 8 years Clinton was in office.

These Republicans want to cast themselves as Reaganites but the irony is that Reagan would not have a chance at getting nominated with the bunch of fruitcakes that run the Republican party today. He was too sane.

Seriously Larry? Ban gun ownership by political party? Do you know exactly what that makes you and how ridiculous that makes your independent democrat stance? Why not take it a step further and ban by race, culture, sexual affiliation and religion? Only Mexican gay atheists can own guns! Maybe you'd like to burn books too? Burn all the republicans books! It's good your not in charge of anything because you're nothing more than the shooter without a gun.

@ Joe Done

I guess none of you liberally freed minds noticed it was a gun that stopped this man?

Whats your point?

The gun was in the hands of a policeman.

Policemen are government personnel.

Republicans hate government.

Republicans are trying to cut funding for policemen.

Republicans are trying to break the policeman's union.

So before trying to give guns credit for bringing down this gunman remember it was a policeman trained on the use of a gun. Even if the ones that dies had guns the element of surprise was against them. Same with the policeman if he never had the bullet proof vest. A regular citizen with a weapon that might have tried to bring the gunman down would most likely have been dead also.

And by the way...I never expected you to agree with my previous comment made in jest. I might add in seriousness that it would probably stop 75% of the gun violence in America.

@Larry-2260635 - But Larry, then who would the Democrats hire to shoot fur wearing children in playgrounds so they could then hand out anti-fur pamphlets?

The KhanKubla - If I were you I'd either have a serious talk with my child (the parent of your misbehaving grand child) or not go near them in the future. It really sounds like they are taking the "don't discipline your child, you might warp them" a bit too far. If I had done any of those things as a child, I wouldn't have been able to sit down for a week.

Why are ALL of these shootings happening in "BLUE" states?

If your kitchen cabinet falls off the wall, who do you blame

(A) The Carpenter's Union

(B) The carpenter who hung the cabinet

(C) The screw gun the carpenter used

Well, Denver Bill, while I might spare a thought for the Carpenter' Union, if I had hired him through that agency, and if they had attested to his competence. But obviously the correct answer is (B), the carpenter.

However that is not a particularly apt analogy. You have a choice as to whom you hire to hang your kitchen cabinets, or even whether to have cabinets at all.

You have no choice regarding the number of guns floating around in our society. You can only elect either to own one or not, and hope you're not about when a berserk shooter strikes.

A better analogy would be having a poorly engineered and maintained LNG storage facility in your neighborhood, in which case I would chiefly blame the zoning laws which allows such a manifest hazard in a residential area, and also those who lobby for the continuance of such laws. If guns are the manifest hazard, the NRA is certainly one of the chief agencies lobbying against changing applicable laws.

So, in my view, WilliamorRites, is not too far off base with his remarks.

Since the only way to stop this according to many is to ban guns, then how about we stop the illegal drug use by banning drugs Get rid of ALL the vicoden, norco, valium, hydrocoden, and all the script pain killers. Because more people abuse these drugs than any other drugs out there. So, get rid of all drugs. The people that legally use them will come to understand that if one person is saved by banning them, it is better for the country. Sound familiar.............See how long the soccer moms could go without vicoden.

Yeah comparing guns to medication is a spectacular idea. That being said, the pharmaceutical companies pumping kids full of Adderall...Ritalin...and Anti-Depressants surely isn't helping the state of mental health of America's youth...

@YourOnly

Are you kidding me? You want to move to Australia because it's safer? Because guns are banned? Australia has one of the highest crime rates in the world. Rape per capita is triple that of the US. Other violent crimes are close to doubled. Banning guns doesn't make a country magically safer.

If you want to carry that analogy through to its logical conclusion, then you need to ban doctors. They are the ones who introduce the drugs to the patient, overprescribe the drugs, and fail to warn their patients of how addictive the drugs are.

But it is actually a poor analogy, as drugs, both legal and illegal, are monitored, the law establishment does attempt to regulate them, and there is rehab available for those who recognize their problem and are willing to get help.

Your defense of guns is based on the theory that it would be impossible to get the guns out of the hands of the criminals. But that is a specious argument, because all of our laws have people who disobey them. We track down these criminals and we put them in jail. We do this with drug pushers, bank robbers, scam artists, etc. Just because some of the people don't obey the law doesn't mean that you repeal the law. It means that you track them down and put them in jail. Many of the people who have obtained their guns through legal means still use them for illegal acts. Do we just give them a pass because they have second amendment rights?

The bottom line is that there are just too many guns out there. Too many guns are owned by people who are unstable, irresponsible, careless or stupid. They kill people through intent or through carelessness. We need laws to restrict gun ownership to people who are mentally stable, responsible, careful and reasonably intelligent. We need laws that forbid gun use by persons under eighteen years of age, because teen-agers are, by virtue of hormonal activity, mentally unstable. We need laws that would forbid keeping guns in the same house with someone who suffered from mental illness, not just to protect others, but also to protect the impulsive suicidal individual from irremedial action. We need to require that authorities inspect your gun safe to determine if it will really deter someone from obtaining your weapons without your consent. We need all gun purchases to be registered, to require a waiting period and a background check that would be thorough enough to rule out those who clearly should not possess a gun. We need gun owners to reregister their guns every year. If a gun is sold the seller needs to file a notice of non-responsibility, just like you do for your car. All gun sales need to be registered. If you lose, sell or have your weapon stolen, you must immediately report that fact to the police or be held liable if the gun is used in the commission of a crime or there is an accident that results in injury or death. When you purchase a gun, you assume responsibility for the manner in which that gun is used. You are the owner. We need to stop gun shows that have a reckless disregard for existing gun laws and don't even attempt to determine if a purchaser if fit to own a weapon. No private sales of guns. If you wish to sell your gun you must go through the police department so that they can oversee the purchase, the transfer and whether or not the purchaser if fit to own a weapon.

soarsis

hey denver bill, you are an idiot!

Ahhh, name calling. The mark of a thoughtful, well reasoned and persuasive argument.

did the cabinet kill you? did the cabinet maker intentionally kill you? did the maker of the screwdriver design it specifically to kill you? did the cabinet makers union defend the cabinet maker who wanted you dead with the screwdriver that was specifically designed with the single purpose of killing you?

It's called "analogy." Get to know it. Make it your friend. On second thought, get to know "abstract thougt" first.

AN ARMED SOCIETY IS A SAFE AND POLITE SOCIETY!!!!

We are an armed society. Three hundred million guns!

Safe? Polite? Not so much.

It's time to quit spouting this 'more guns=safety' hogwash. It's a fallacy that doesn't hold water.

dman-353357

A better analogy would be having a poorly engineered and maintained LNG storage facility in your neighborhood, in which case I would chiefly blame the zoning laws which allows such a manifest hazard in a residential area, and also those who lobby for the continuance of such laws.

In other words, you would blame the government for not having or enforcing regulations rather than the people who engineered and maintained the facility. Telling.

If guns are the manifest hazard, the NRA is certainly one of the chief agencies lobbying against changing applicable laws.

If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.,

In other words, you would blame the government for not having or enforcing regulations rather than the people who engineered and maintained the facility. Telling.

Yes, denver bill, I would blame the government for not providing adequate laws to protect the people, which apparently in your mind casts some dark implications. Absent laws there would no means of preventing someone from building a toxic waste dump right next to your home.

Apparently you have a problem with this. Telling.

If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.,

Cute, but the gender identifications issues of your family members are not relevant.

dman-353357

Yes, denver bill, I would blame the government for not providing adequate laws to protect thepeople, which apparently in your mind casts some dark implications.

You (inclusive) get the government you elect, not necessarily the government you want. Depending on your point of view, that does have dark implications.

If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.,

Cute, but the gender identifications issues of your family members are not relevant.

My family's gender issues are every bit as relevant as your disconnected, rambling blather that preceded it.

My family's gender issues are every bit as relevant as your disconnected, rambling blather that preceded it.

Ah yes, insulting language, the last resort of those who cannot effectively argue their position.

You (inclusive) get the government you elect, not necessarily the government you want. Depending on your point of view, that does have dark implications.

...and you accuse me of posting "disconnected, rambling blather", very telling.

What is anybody to make of such a dark, vague and non-specific statement? The principal I cited, that Government enacts and enforces laws relating to the common good, is at least as old as this nation, and if the Government you elect is not the one you want, who are you going to blame, the Carpenter's Union, or yourself?

Adam Lanza didnt play violent video games. He played strategy games. Similar to Axis an Allies, Risk, etc. He didnt play what are known as "shooters".

YourOnly

"GREECE IS DE ARMED PLUS , Iran, Syria, Libya, Iraq, Sudan, Russia, ENGLAND, AUSTRALIA, SPAIN, GERMANY..."

I'm not sure why you capitalized the safest countries on the list... But yes, you're right - those capitalized countries are both de-armed (though limited gun ownership is still allowed) and significantly safer than the US.

I would love to move to Germany or England or Australia or Spain - not because I dislike the US, but because I spent time in Sweden as a child (my father got a job there) and I learned to love their people and their culture. Unfortunately, it's not simply a matter of buying a ticket - many of those countries have pretty strict immigration laws and you have to have certain skills to get a residency visa.

Yea they are strict, but not us. We allow anyone and everything in. Our resources are being sucked dry from the inside out, and its only a matter of time before one of two things happen. Either America completely implodes and collapses from the inside out which it pretty much is now, or we put laws in effect- take drastic measures to made immediate changes else we collapse anyway.

BAN GUNS !!!

I am going to show some violent tendencies. Guns DO kill. It takes a sick person to pull the trigger. If all you NRA supporters who believe what your leader says believe it, I have a suggestion. TAX every round of ammunition for EVERY gun made to equal 100% of what it cost to manufacture. Tax anything it takes to make said rounds. You can have any freakin gun ever made, but if you can't prove you paid you tax go cry to a grieving mother or father. Yur NRA president/vice really has no freaking clue and you are all just stupid followers. Enough is enough! Ot is time for the crazy fu3ckers to just step aside and allow the sane to fix you dumb fu4k problems for you.

I am so surprised that nobody mentioned Mike Huckebee. Did he not just say that its liberals banning God in schools? Well this was a church, not the first shooting in a house of worship this year, but I hope its the last - where is God, Mike?

The dialoge needs to start. I don't think the 2nd Amendment covers the idiotic need to own guns like the ones out there and so many. They wanted you to protect yourselves and your family with one gun to each man to protect yourself from King George, not to shoot at a Mall, or theater or church or school. More guns are not the answer.

Check out www.demandaplan.org

We the American People need to remember that Crime in America has been dropping steadily for years.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/violent-crime/violent-crime. and http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-1

Please try not to let the media frighten you into believing that our Country is degrading and more dangerous and violent. Horrors do occur but do not loose sight that we live in a beautiful Country that was shown to be safer every day. People may be surprised to know that Great Britain is far more dangerous than the USA or even South Africa. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1196941/The-violent-country-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html

I have little use for the NRA. They were once a good organization promoting patriotism, safety shooting sports and education about all sorts of weapons. They were once a reliable collector of statistics related to gun issues. Then they became a Political Action Committee. At some point they saw that educating people about guns and promoting their safe use for legitimate purposes could only go so far. The public is a large group and creating or changing public opinion is a huge task. The easier way was to just appeal to a small subset. The voting public. If you can control what politicians are in charge, you can make the rules. In typical elections, voter turn out is in the 30-40 percent range of all eligible citizens, even with contentious issues at stake. So all you need to do is convince a bit more than half of the voter population. In reality, in a lot of instances simply by controlling 15-20% of the population can win elections. The NRA soon became a very significant power broker in politics. The techniques they have used are often somewhat underhanded, unethical and completely biased. (But legal) Rarely do I favor the NRA supported candidate. Not because of their views on guns, but because of the rest of their politics. The NRA tends to back candidates who would rule by dominance with little regard to the opposing views.

I suppose this has some parallels with guns. Guns can be used for sport, competiton, entertainment and also the important role of self defense against otherwise overwhelming force. They can be a force equalizer when others might unfairly or illegally attempt to force their influence. But guns can also be used to exert dominance. I believe it is that ability to exert dominance that appeals to the crazies who commit these mass shootings. In almost all cases the shooter is trying to exert that dominance. Evidence suggests that he often feels like he had been unfairly dominated and seeks to change that. It is often about some form of revenge. That could be very specific or it could be a general view that society in general has been unfair or innapropriately trying to control the individual. It is often about making a point even though it is rarely clear to others exactly what that point was.

The NRA has beome broken.

That said though, even a broken clock is right twice per day. Where the NRA was right today is that 99% of the time, when come crazy goes on one of these rampages with guns, the overwhelming tool that stops it is a gun. Either that of some authority or the shoooter himself in a final act of dominance ending it himself while denying releasing the control he grabbed. It is extremely rare that one of thse guys ever gives up because doing so is allowing himself to be dominated again. Putting that potential capability to stop the individual in place ahead of time, is very reasonable insurance.

If the shooter knows that the place of his rampage is equipped to seize control from him, he's is at least possibly going to be deterred from choosing that taget. These guys aren't looking for a challenge, they are looking for the opportunity to dominate in a cake walk. Chances are that many of these guys might love the opportunity to dominate the police directly, but you never hear about one of these were they choose a police station to attack. I think there is a pretty simple reason for that. Even as warped as their thinking may be, they can still understand that they will most likely never gain dominance in such an attack. The can indirectly dominate them by conducting mayhem in their abscence, at least for a while. Whenthe cops show up and pose the threat of taking control, often these guys prevent them from doing so by declaring game over by killing themselves. Sometimes the cops do grab the advantage and seize control briefly in the end. But almost exclusively, these incidents end with an act of violence.

I see a lot of merit to LaPierre's proposal. He's not advocating arming teachers, but instead specially trained authorities. He's suggesting actual experienced police officers and potentially military veterans. I think that makes good sense as long as these people are screened and well trained.

I don't agree with the NRA the vast majority of the time. But I can recognize that sometimes they may be right. I find it a bit hypocritical when some of our Congressional leaders are so vocally rejecting out of hand, the very logical idea of armed guards in schools, but then you don't hear any of them suggesting we should remove the armed guards protecting Congress and government buildings. If it is a good idea for protecting Congress, than it ought to be an equally good idea for protecting our kids.

I am very much a Progressive, but maybe not so typical as I am also a "gun enthusiast", from the standpoint of hunting, sporting and competitive shooting as well as self defense. But I also live in a rural environment and see guns as serving a more necessary role maybe than living in a city with loads of police always within a couple minutes away. In rural environments, we don't have that level of protection or benefit from its deterrent effects.

I tend to see gun ownership as a personal right not much different than many Progressive rights we stand for like a woman's right to choose, Gay's rights to marry who they choose and the rights of minorities. I also have a great deal of knowledge on the topic and know the whole "assault weapons" thing is purely about cosmetic appearance and has nothing to do with lethality. A lot of mythology exists around high capacity magazines too. They tend not to be very reliable as you get up in capacity. And really offer no added lethality over multiple smaller magazines. It only takes a mere few seconds between the last shot of one to the first shot of another when swapping them. That few seconds really means nothing in the mass shooting scenarios were the victims are unarmed. Maybe they provide a slight edge if someone is shooting back, but that is almost never the case in these mass shootings. But most anti-gun folks don't understand these things and think we are talking about military weapons because that is how they appear. Well they aren't military weapons. If you are a gun person it is so obvious when the anti-gun pundits talk about it. It reminds me somewhat of another now famous Congressional Interpretation. The one about the Internet being a series of tubes. The late Senator Ted Stevens may have been trying his best, but his technical knowledge of the topic was lacking.

I am afraid the the anti-gun wing of Liberals/Progressives are just reacting to what they view as the threat without knowing the facts. Unfortunately, that distracts from the more effective preventive measures of improving mental health care. Eliminate mentally ill people and you prevent more tragedies than some kind of weapons bans would.

I own guns which, according to a lot of you, I am now a Gun Nut Whacko right?!

Now, here are some statistics for you "Anti" Gun Nut Whacko's...

Last year there were approximately;

1. 163,500 deaths from lung cancer
2. 75,000 alcohol related deaths
3. 43,000 auto deaths
4. 12,700 murders from which, 8,580 were "GUN" related

So, of the 8,580 murders by guns, 3% of them were people hit by stray bullets. That's 257 innocent bystanders.

Now, of the 163,500 people who died of lung cancer, 3% died of second hand smoke that didn't even smoke. That's 4,905 innocent bystanders.

Hmmmm....... So, that's 4,648 "more" innocent bystanders than gun bystander death's.

Hmmmmm........ So, what do we have the most and least problems of from the above categories?!

Isn't it human nature to control whatever it is the most of that harms people?!

I don't think kids (nowadays) have been "taught" respect or useage of guns. They are simply something you hold and fire. Anyone who owns any sort of firearm should not have it in their home if they aren't willing to teach their kiddos to respect it, and use it wisely. I'm an old fuddy-duddy, but dad used to brag that if I targeted something, I never missed. I don't remember it that way, but I do remember being eaten up by mosquitoes waiting for a stupid raccoon that kept getting into my chicken pen...and yes, I did eventually shoot his butt dead. And true, I rarely missed, but not "never missed". After Newtown, apparently 2 idiot children (can I say "children" if they're in High School?) said they were going to make Newtown look mediocre, on Friday. My kid was so stressed that her Dr. wrote a note to excuse her from school. I grew up with guns and rifles, but there are zero in our home, now. The last time there was anything was in the late 90's, and it was just a BB gun that was borrowed...I wanted it to shoot into the trees that had those hundreds of blackbirds cawwing away (nasty noise!) while our little baby was sleeping. The BB gun was only fun when my hubby was bent over, about 20 yards away, and I shot his rear...LOL! I agree with the saying that if no one is allowed to have guns, only criminals will, and someone (somewhere) will have to come up with a better way. I've heard about technology that allows only the registered user to fire the gun. A good idea, but where I read that, was it true?, or just a Fantasy Idea from some book? I've googled (months later) and can't find the truth. The world is becoming unhinged, and if we don't teach our kiddos how to hang on we are probably all screwed...they're the ones for the next few decades...not us.

denver bill 2,

I would blame the resident for putting to much in the cabinet.

Yes, I jest.

Merry CHRISTmas!

“It is wise to direct your anger towards problems -- not people; to focus your energies on answers -- not excuses.”
― William Arthur Ward

Yur NRA president/vice really has no freaking clue and you are all just stupid followers. Enough is enough! Ot is time for the crazy fu3ckers to just step aside and allow the sane to fix you dumb fu4k problems for you.

You know, it's batsh1t crazy people like you wanting to make decisions for me that finally convinced me to join the NRA yesterday. I did so on line, and I don't even own anything high powered. Just a pair of .40 caliber Glocks and a pair of .22s. Thanks for the reaffirmation. Have a great day.

OK, let us look at a little gun control: Shall we?

A LITTLE GUN HISTORY
In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. >From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million educated people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!
The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind them of this history lesson.
With guns, we are 'citizens'. Without them, we are 'subjects'.
During WWII the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED!
If you value your freedom, please spread this antigun-control message to all of your friends.
SWITZERLAND ISSUES EVERY HOUSEHOLD A GUN!
SWITZERLAND'S GOVERNMENT TRAINS EVERY ADULT THEY ISSUE A RIFLE.
SWITZERLAND HAS THE LOWEST GUN RELATED CRIME RATE OF ANY CIVILIZED COUNTRY IN THE WORLD!!!
IT'S A NO BRAINER!
DON'T LET OUR GOVERNMENT WASTE MILLIONS OF OUR TAX DOLLARS IN AN EFFORT TO MAKE ALL LAW ABIDING CITIZENS AN EASY TARGET.
Spread the word everywhere you can that you are a firm believer in the 2nd Amendment!

It's time to speak loud before they try to silence and disarm us.
You're not imagining it, history shows that governments always manipulate tragedies to attempt to disarm the people~

We actually don't hear many stories about the millions of responsible gun owners. I mean, imagine the headline, "Man owns gun 50 years shoots no one." Ya, that just isn't a sensational headline. It's the irresponsible or crazy people we hear about in the news. My favorite irresponsible story (because it is just so Jerry Springer stupid) is the one that happened at that child's Halloween party at night, "Hank, git yer gun and shoot that skunk!" BANG! "That ain't no skunk, that's yer kid!" When I think about that, the amount of time to go into your home, find your gun, load it and come back out if kids are running around playing and for that kid to still be there, that guy must have had his gun on him - the story didn't say.

Banning guns won't make all this go away. Cutting down clip capacity may reduce the numbers of people killed by lunatics. People who kill out of passion are going to find a way to kill even without a gun.

What makes the most sense is keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill, the imature and the untrained.

People who have mental disorders need to be treated. The imature need to grow up and the untrained need to be trained. These are things gun laws need to address. Gun laws need to be able to identify these people and keep guns out of their hands. There need to be psychological and maturity tests involved with purchasing a gun as well as training on gun use and handling before a person can pick the gun up.

But even so, there will still be people killed with guns. There are plenty of illegal guns out there in the hands of criminals. There will always be careless people and there will always be crazy people who find a way to get guns - this happens even in countries where gun ownership is illegal.

It's not the guns that are the root problem here. Guns have been owned by US citizens since this country was established. It's the mentality and mental health of the people who have the guns that's the problem. Solve that and you'll solve the gun problems - or at least most of them.

One final note about the shooter in Connecticut. He lived with his mother in a home described as a mansion. He had 2 rooms just for himself. So, I can't see the mother not being able to get her child the best psychiatric care while he was growing up. I also don't see why she couldn't afford to have some kind of gun safe for her weapons. Maybe she didn't get her son help because of the stigma of having a child with mental problems. We keep reading how she kept everything secret and private.

At my kingdom hall, guess what? We have no windows. Years ago we were prepared. So a stray bullet coming in? Not likely.

i wonder what sort of firearm this guy used.

Typical cast of characters, the liberals that know knot of what they speak. But i am quite sure they attended at class lecture or read a theisis from amother know knothing. In this case the good guys did prevail they wasted some peice of slime. Hope they take his remains out to the garbage dump and burn it.

Typical cast of characters, the liberals that know knot of what they speak.

On the other hand, John Q Public, you have conservatives, who speak loudly and say...

nothing.

One wonders, do they know of what they speak?

Thanks for advancing the debate with your incitefull comments.

uchusky99 Comment collapsed by the community

Only a fool would suggest that MORE guns are the answer-note that even the armed troopers were hurt here.

While it is true that people, not guns, kill people...guns make it a lot easier. Lanza with a knife, baseball bat or even a only 6 clip gun would not have been able to kill 26 people.

I agree with the NRA that simply making guns illegal is not the answer, but their position is going to hurt them as they are going to be seen as too extreme.

Violence has always been a part of society, but assault/automatic weapons have not. There needs to be a common sense soution-and MORE guns in schools is not it.

Hey smart guy, my wife can change a 6 round magazine (they only call it a "clip" on lame TV shows) in less than 3 seconds. Duct tape multiple 6 round magazines together and she could shoot non stop for 20 minutes with only 21 seconds of reloading. That would kill a hell of a lot of people. Please get a clue, your theory is trash.

Long, the U.S. has 5% of the world's population but 50% of the world's guns, yep that's something to be proud of; being the most dangerous country in the world...

...or the best defended country in the world.

Raygirl-wow what a trusting religion you have.

I wonder why god allowed something like this to happen in a house of worship? Clearly the people inside were followers of his word. Were they not worthy?

... and a gun.

I find it interesting that people are placing the blame on Mental Issues. If that is the case, perhaps we should evaluate and psychologically assess everyone who is in jail/prison who has a murder and assault charge.

Liccy u would very shocked to find out just how many peeps who commit crimes have some form of mental illness.......especially when the facts tell us that 1 in 5 kids in this country also have some form of mental illness......

So true queenie...Just like heroine and bath salts don't kill people that are suppose to be illegal

1 in 5 people have a mental illness, and a vast majority of them will never do anything violent. And while it does take some level of craziness to want to shoot a large number of people, many of those who do these things don't have any diagnosable mental problems.

I just carry a gun when I have menstrual issues....

@liccy, I don't think the point is whether or not we should release/lessen the sentence for mentally unstable people who commit crimes, I think the point that's being raised about the need for mental health care is that we might be able to take preventative measures from tragedies like the CT shooting or this one from happening in the future.

Oh yes they do, YourOnly.

Our mental health care system is broken. Most inmates are mentally ill. We need more resources for individuals that suffer from mental illness and their families. There is NO help for families unless their loved one is a threat to themselves of others. Even then, the loved one is placed on a 72hour to 14 day hold long enough for evaluations and stabilization on meds. There is no forced follow up care, our broken system leaves it up to the patient to set-up appointments and continue care. The families can't do a darn thing legally if their loved one chooses to stop taking their meds or refuses treatment all together. We need a law that gives responsible family members the right to enforce care on their loved one and commit if necessary. Most families in these situations "saw it coming" but the existing laws make them helpless to do anything. Another suggestion, if there is a diagnosable mental illnes ie: bipolar I or II, Schizophrenia, personality disorders (those types) no guns should be allowed in the homes they live in period. Not to say they can't steal one, or murder using another weapon, but let's make it harder for them to get one in the first place. Our plan should be mental health prevention, and intervention that includes continued, consistent care.

Maybe its the stigma that comes from having a mental issue. By our society that keeps some from getting help. Not all people who have a mental issue are insane. Even people with the same diagnosis have varying degrees of said diagnosis.

To many wont seek help due to the idea of being called week or Crazy. When its more crazy and week not to address a problem. And most shootings stem from some sort of temporary situation. Like theft or divorce, monetary loss, heated argument. Things like that. Not from a mental disorder.

So, everyone that goes out and kills people must have mental problems? You can't blame mental illness for everything, it's just an excuse. Obviously, it's not the gun that they are holding, because guns don't kill people, people do. What do you propose? Lock up everyone that has some form of a mental illness? Some people are in their "right" mind, they are just an evil/bad person. The movie shooter and school shooter, were both extremely intelligent, high IQ people. Not everyone sitting in jail has a mental problem either. Majority of them deserve to be exactly where they are because of the person that they are.

Eric-2189088

I didn't Create him, he created me (and you) to follow his rules.

So have you ever heard of this little thing called Free Will that your God gave us?You know the ability to make our own choices in life(Though I do firmly believe, with the ever mounting scientific evidence, that people are born homosexual/bisexual, and it is not a choice, is many so-called christians contend.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So, who takes your pants off before you have gay sex?

==================================================================

Though if you are truly Christians, why are you so antithetical to the teachings of Christ)?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

See above.

======================

"Oh yes they do, YourOnly."

Well no, not so much. And unlike you, I've actually looked into the issue.

Yup, there was a shooting, We have 311,000,000 people in this country and some of them are bad, so what is your point? Ever notice that many of the crimes that used to NOT get nationwide coverage are suddenly front page news now? Crappy little Liberal/Communists. I guess they will never learn, We arent giving up our guns. Nothing you can do will cause us to give up our guns.

Walter_P_Oreilly

People who have a drinking problem say the same thing. That they cant help it, that they were "born that way". But that doesnt stop them from getting help. They actually have the cure for that homosexuality, You dont have to throw your life away, you can get help and cure yourself of this self destructive behavior. Good luck.

YourOnly--if you've looked into the issue, do you know how many mentally ill have no diagnosed mental illness due to having fallen through the cracks? How many different families tried to get help for their loved ones and could not navigate the complicated often lacking mental health system we have today?

Queenie, I have a problem with the statistic that 1 in 5 children have some form of mental illness. If you follow the guide that psychiatrists and psychologists use, a child that squirms even a little bit in the classroom is ADD or ADHD, or the big one these days, somewhere on the autism spectrum and should be on medication. They want everyone to be the same - sort of living zombies - with no emotions. Granted, some people, like the young man in Ct. and possibly this one in Pa. (not enough information on him yet), definitely need help, but sometimes they go overboard.

Looks like the blame is going to video games and media now. Lets collapse opinions that don't go with master La Pierre.

Some of you guys are like school children. Come up with an intelligent argument! We cannot change the mental state of our nation or what our citizens like doing. Please be reasonable.

NRA is business with its own agenda and profits.

Mercury, will you please tell these women and the Men who follow them, on gun control. Was this Man a felon, or was he mental ill? because it seem that people want reason for things, or why people who don't follow, must say (WHY) because they are not like me a Stepwives, people are not the same and just because most people want to be politically correct, and by doing and saying what they deemed to be the right thing to say, one lady on the net, said it the best of all, (What work for Me may not work for you). So if he was not a felon or a crazy man, then where is your logic for the reason, it is like Sex which is bad for Men but why do Men like sex, it is to make babies. So why do Men like to kill other people? So control is not the awnser, nor is what all women want, is let just kill all the Men in the world, and that will end all women problem.

Everyone needs to check these articles out:

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12/14/15911025-authorities-id-gunman-who-killed-27-in-elementary-school-massacre?lite

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12/14/15901085-villager-slashes-22-kids-with-knife-at-elementary-school-gates-in-china?lite

Homo -sexuals, bi-sexuals, mentally disturbed, not mentally disturbed does it really matter? We are all
hurting ourselves, but moreso our innocent children. We do not deserve to treat ourselves like this and definitely should not be treating our children as such. This needs to somehow stop.

Mercury-2923436 u don't have to like those stats for them NOT to be true...and no if a child squirms a little bit he/she will NOT be diagnosed with a mental illness.....and no one wants everyone to be the same....the drugs that are given need 2 be monitored just like u would monitor ANY drug given to a child...it is no different than taking antibiotics for an infection.....the brain is an organ and needs to be on medicine sometimes to make it function properly....

Yep. More guns is the answer. Just look how it keeps playing out.

Funny how you here a lot about gun killings and they are overhyped. But you here almost nothing about other murders that did not involve guns. I reference todays minor mention of a group of 3 who killed 2 people blowing up a house for the insurance money and destroying 33 houses. It could have been much worse if more people would have been home. Can we say 66 killed in arson explosion.

Eric-2189088

I didn't Create him, he created me (and you) to follow his rules.

So have you ever heard of this little thing called Free Will that your God gave us?You know the ability to make our own choices in life(Though I do firmly believe, with the ever mounting scientific evidence, that people are born homosexual/bisexual, and it is not a choice, is many so-called christians contend.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So, who takes your pants off before you have gay sex?

==================================================================

Though if you are truly Christians, why are you so antithetical to the teachings of Christ)?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

See above.

======================

I'm sorry, what? I see nothing but a bent perspective, perverted by the homophobic, domineering teachings of the Roman Catholic faith. Never in my life has a group who has stated devotion to an individual who taught peace, love, forgiveness and acceptence been so hateful, spiteful, violent, begrudging, and phobic in my entire life. All because of a mistruths perpetuated by an organization spawned by an empire that had domination and controlin mind. As for my sexuality, what I do with whom in my bedroom is none of your concern. The same goes for everyone. You want to play moral police, go live in a theocracy like Iran.

Ban handguns.

Firearms are designed to easily maim or kill a number of people at a distance.

Why does this nation need so many of them?

We have more guns per capita than compared to any other nation on Earth.

We have more firearms-related deaths than any other nation on Earth.

Not counting military and police arsenals, for every 100 people in the U.S. there are 89 civilian firearms.

There Are 15,000 More Gun Stores In America Than Grocery Stores

Pardon the pun, but it looks like Americans would rather eat lead, than eat food.

http://www.businessinsider.com/more-gun-stores-in-america-than-grocery-stores-2012-12

From and by: Ken kiger@northstate.net

Lost in the gun rights debate, much to the detriment of American freedom, is the fact that the Second Amendment is in fact an "AMENDMENT". No "Articles in Amendment" to the Constitution, more commonly referred to as the Bill of Rights, stand alone and each can only be properly understood with reference to what it is that each Article in Amendment amended in the body of the original Constitution. It should not be new knowledge to any American the Constitution was first submitted to Congress on September 17, 1787 WITHOUT ANY AMENDMENTS. After much debate, it was determined that the States would not adopt the Constitution as originally submitted until "further declamatory and restrictive clauses should be added" "in order to prevent misconstruction or abuse of its (the Constitutions) powers". (This quote is from the Preamble to the Amendments, which was adopted along with the Amendments but is mysteriously missing from nearly all modern copies.) The first ten Amendments were not ratified and added to the Constitution until December 15, 1791.

In this Light:

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." What provisions of the original Constitution is it that the Second Amendment is designed to "amended"?

THE SECOND AMENDMENT IS AMENDING THE PROVISIONS IN THE ORIGINAL CONSTITUTION APPLYING TO THE "MILITIA". The States were not satisfied with the powers granted to the "militia" as defined in the original Constitution and required an amendment to "prevent misconstruction or abuse of its powers. "(Again quoting from the Preamble to the Amendments.)

What was it about the original Constitutional provisions concerning the "Militia" that was so offensive to the States?

First understand that the word "militia" was used with more than one meaning at the time of the penning of the Constitution. One popular definition used then was one often quoted today, that the "Militia" was every able bodied man owning a gun. As true as this definition is, it only confuses the meaning of the word "militia" as used in the original Constitution that required the Second Amendment to correct. The only definition of "Militia" that had any meaning to the States demanding Amendments is the definition used in the original Constitution. What offended the States then should offend "People" today:

"Militia" in the original Constitution as amended by the Second Amendment is first found in Article 1, Section 8, clause 15, where Congress is granted the power:

"To provide for the calling forth the MILITIA to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrection and repel Invasions." Article 1, Section 8, Clause 16 further empowers Congress:

"To provide for the organizing, arming, and disciplining, the MILITIA, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;" Any "patriot" out there still want to be called a member of the "MILITIA" as defined by the original Constitution?

Article 2, Section 2, Clause 1 empowers: "The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the MILITIA of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States;" The only way the States would accept the "MILITIA" as defined in the original Constitution was that the Federal "MILITIA" be "WELL REGULATED". The States realized that "THE SECURITY OF A FREE STATE" required that the "MILITIA" as originally created in the Constitution be "WELL REGULATED" by a "restrictive clause." How did the States decide to insure that the Constitutional "MILITIA" be "WELL REGULATED"? By demanding that "restrictive clause two" better know as the "Second Amendment" be added to the original Constitution providing:

"THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED." The States knew that "PEOPLE" with "ARMS" would "WELL REGULATE" the Federal "MILITIA"!

Now read for the first time with the full brightness of the Light of truth:

"A WELL REGULATED MILITIA, BEING NECESSARY TO THE SECURITY OF A FREE STATE, THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED."

For those still overcome by propaganda:

The Second Amendment declares by implication that if the "MILITIA" is not "WELL REGULATED" by "PEOPLE" keeping and bearing arms, the "MILITIA" becomes a threat to the "SECURITY OF A FREE STATE."

The "MILITIA" has no "RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS" in the Second Amendment, rather it is only "THE RIGHT OF THE ""PEOPLE"" TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS (that) SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED."

Afternoon TFNJ!

"So, what happened?"

Four people were killed, including the gunman

Just another loser trying 2 get their 15 minutes.....Please! Can we NOT waste a week giving it to him?

Sympathy 2 the victims & their families.

No kidding. Was the person with a gun by himself? Were the 3 that were killed with the gunman? Where are any details? Did 3 innocent people get killed?

The story allmost makes it sound like there were 3 people with the gunman and they all were killed.

This kind of reporting infuriates me.

the media likes it that way.

I hope you will all take thirty seconds to read this... VERY IMPORTANT.....

Hi Yanks,
I thought you all would like to see the real figures from Down Under.
It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.
The first year results are now in:
Australia-wide, homicides are up 6.2 percent,
Australia-wide, assaults are up 9.6 percent;
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent. (Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not and criminals still possess their guns!)
While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed.
There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the elderly, while the resident is at home.
Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in 'successfully ridding Australian society of guns....' You won't see this on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the State Assembly disseminating this information.
The Australian experience speaks for itself. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect only the law-abiding citizens.
Take note Americans, before it's too late!
Will you be one of the sheep to turn yours in?

The innocent give up guns but the criminals always have weapons, guns...

Numbertech, that's what I thought when I read this. Who exactly was killed, and under what circumstance? No details at all.

jean, since we have no way of confirming what you just wrote, go away.

@Jean - Wow, that's an old meme. Unfortunately, it's also very false. Since gun control was enacted 15 years ago, gun violence - and violence in general - have gone down by about 33%. There have been bumps, but it's been a consistent downward trend.

In other words, there's certainly still violence, but things are safer now than they were. It doesn't mean that gun control is the sole reason for the decline - but the assertion that gun control increases violence is directly contradicted by all available evidence and statistics.

Jean: LMFAO!!! You cut and pasted a chain mail letter from 2001 that has been thoroughly debunked!! Please check Snopes.com for an exact copy of the letter you pasted here along with a thorough analysis of why this letter that was written 11 years ago is totally meaningless. Next, you're going to tell me to beware of rattlesnake eggs in my houseplants. You are either deliberately trying to mislead us or you haven't yet figured out that not everything you see on the internet is fact. Either way, you have lost all credibility.

@TFNJ, its easy to confirm what is written, these statistics are publically available on the internet, do some research before you spout off, all it does is make you look stupid. As for the guy who said we should make automatic firearms illegal, case in point, if you have no idea what you are talking about then educate yourself before voicing an opinion and sounding like a total moron. You cannot legally own automatic weapons, I can spend 5 minutes on the internet and verify that one, instead people here prefer to post emotional garbage that has no merit. Did you know that fire arms are a 39 billion dollar a year industry that employees over 196000 Americans directly? 39 billion that is taxed for local, state governments who are already broke. 196000 people who have jobs and pay taxes will be jobless, not to mention the people who rely on those 196000 to spend their money they earned working. you cannot tell me that having armed guards in school is a bad idea, we have them everywhere else, why not schools? Is it a cost thing? I can pretty much guarantee that the money can be found, hell we pay for bridges to no where and airports that never see a single plane, but there is no money for our kids safety? I'm sorry, ban all you want, 1. there will still be 200,000,000 guns in the US, they won't take them from us, and if they do, the criminals aren't going to give them up, so great plan there. 2. If you did manage to get all the guns from everyone (impossible to do but for the sake of this conversation lets say they did) now someone blows up a school, or drives a car through the playground, or any other number of ways there are to kill someone, do we then ban cars? do we ban recess? There are more mass killings in China's schools then the US by far, you cannot own a gun in China, instead these people stabbed their victims to death, time to ban knives too? How far are all of you willing to take this before we give up all our freedoms? what do we lose next?

Todd, I take it you didn't bother reading the two posts above yours before responding. Now, I had no idea it was a known fake letter. But from the tone of it, and he taking the opportunity to post it in a conversation not related to that, I assumed it was false, and thus told him to go away.

Perhaps, its you who should research before spouting off?? Just a wild guess.

Jean-982597 -- Please give reference so that we can verify it. If true, then those are very important statistics and we need to be aware of them. At the same time, I've seen people on all sides of many different issues give unsubstantiated quotes and numbers. Thank you.

This is for Lisa, and the other two that laughed at me...

Thanks for being kind Lisa

Lisa, You can google it, but I did go and look and found an article from SNOPES, if you take them with

a grain of salt... They said it was some truths and some doubts..

This info is out there for all of you....GOOGLE

I have the link here, so click on... It shows many deaths up in certain ages, and down in others...

snopes.com: Australian Guns Stats

www.snopes.com › Home › Crime › Statistics

Jul 21, 2011 · It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by a ... of deaths attributable to ... statistics from the Australian ...

One more question Folks.. Why are all of these shooting, the majority of them, in BLUE STATES??

Arizona is a toss up but most have happened in Blue states where they are supposed to have the

toughest gun laws... I'm going to look this up too..

So people lets quit bashing people for giving into.. Lets have a nice talk about this, OK??

One more question Folks.. Why are all of these shooting, the majority of them, in BLUE STATES??

As I thought, an agenda.

Todd: You are wrong. With a class III license you CAN legally own automatic weapons, but they have not been sold to the public since the 80's. They have however gotten very expensive. BTW NONE have been involved in any wrong doing as far as I know.

Gary Martin-7068295

Todd: You are wrong. With a class III license you CAN legally own automatic weapons, but they have not been sold to the public since the 80's. They have however gotten very expensive. BTW NONE have been involved in any wrong doing as far as I know.

And before people start freaking the @!$%# out, in order to get a class 3 license you need a FFL (Federal Firearms License.) In other words, you need to own a gun store, be a licensed collector, manufacturer, etc. to even qualify to apply for the insanely expensive Class 3.

Hi Jean -- Thank you for the link to the Snopes article--I clicked on the link you providid and read it. They give a part true part false rating, and explain very well why. To sum it up, they found that it was a "small, mixed grab bag of short-term statistics" that needs a longer term study over a greater population base to really be able to come to any meaningful conclusions. Also, it mentions how the laws in Australia are different than the laws in the USA, thus not being extrapolatable as is to the USA. I will add here that for any ultimately meaningful conclusions, another study would have to be done that would be much more longitudinal (cover many more years), cover a wider area--perhaps the whole country-- and that would control for more variables that such a small short term study could control for. I am going to post what I have on this comment now, and then come back and post more. My computer is causing me a problem and I need to fix it:(

Aha--my computer is back to 'normal' :) BTW, I misspelled 'providid' -- it should be 'provided'. I didn't have time to edit because of my computer acting up.

Anyway, when I said above that the laws in Australia are different than the USA, I mean the laws that were in effect before the turn in/buy back program began there, so even from the gate, there's a differing constitution and history. Having said that, I will say this: I still believe that the Second Amendment is very important, and I do not believe that a total gun ban is wise. In fact, it is our right to keep and bear arms that insures us from tyranny and also provides us with protection from those who would break into our homes and do us harm. And with owning firearms comes great responsibility. I do believe that criminals and psychotic people should NOT be able to legally possess firearms, though, and where I live, a 10 day waiting period and background check is mandatory for purchasing any firearms, and that wait and background check is done EVERY time a person purchases a firearm. I know this because that is what I had to do when I first bought my 20 gauge (my husband and I hunt upland game birds to eat), and then again when I bought my .22 rifle (we also hunt rabbits to eat). I use my husbands older (but quite good) firearms for hunting waterfowl and big game. The greatest amount of meat that we eat is what we are able to hunt. In some ways I am 'conservative', such as the Second Amendment rights. In some ways I'm 'liberal', such as my convictions of the importance of taking care of our ecology and environment.

You are spot on. Unfortuantely, the lunatic left will have nothing to do with logic or statistics.

Yes, you are right...it is ALL the liberals fault...this whole mental health issue is NEW and needs to be addressed...just keep allowing as many guns that are necessary to keep us safe...enact laws to make everyone own one...ban ALL video games and movies with any kind of violence...this has NOTHING to do with the copious amounts of weapons and magazines that hold 30-50-100 bullets...this is all about sick people who need to be locked up...keep the guns flowing...this is the US of A...we NEED our guns to feel like the baddest kid on the block

The same trolls that wanted all the mental institutions closed now want your guns.

I don't want your damned guns, just keep them locked up so one of your mentally defective family members doesn't go out on a mission with them. Give it a rest, Bobo.

Lanza wasn't a real criminal, just a messed up kid who liked to play with guns

Portia,

The Virginia Tech shooter killed 33 and injured 17 with 2 pistols; one with a capacity of 10 rounds, the other with a capacity of 15. These certainly aren't high capacity magazines. In fact, 10+ round magazines are common for pistols.

If magazines are limited to 10 rounds, then people will just carry multiple magazines. The VT shooter carried 19 magazines in a backpack.

robert- ronald reagan wants your guns now? he's the one that closed the mental institutions.

AzDrummer89, The answer is a "heart". In today's day and age, people tend to only care about themselves, including myself. Everything in today's world tries to make people "feel good" -- from the movies, to the games, to the endless videos on YouTube, etc. These things are totally fine in moderation, but now what's happening is they're being used to fill a hole in people's lives; it's basically a drug that people are medicating themselves with to distract them from their reality. As I am only just beginning to learn, the more selfless you are, the more that others (AND yourself) begin to feel "filled".

Murder is already illegal, no new laws required there. An assault weapons ban was previously enacted in this country as was the "Brady Bill". The assault weapons ban was allowed to lapse after ten years when studies showed it had no effect on reducing gun violence. There are many modalities that can and are used to kill people including guns, knives, bombs, vehicles, biologicals and chemicals, drowning, electrocution, starvation, and many others. The only people that obey laws are the law abiding and they are not the ones committing murders since murder is already illegal. Time to focus on the perpetrators not the lethal modality employed.

Actually, the same wealthy "trolls" who have been making so many cuts to programs over the years so they can keep giving tax breaks to the ultra-wealthy, are the same responsible for lack of mental health programs. Ironically enough, these are the same folks responsible for lack of gun control. The morals of these supposed Christians are non-existent. They worship the almighty dollar at all expense. Why is there such easy access to semi-automatic assault weapons?

Of ALL presidents, it was Jimmy Carter who signed the Mental Health Systems Act of 1980. And the act was considered a landmark in mental health care policy. The key to the proposals included an increase in funding for Community Mental Health Centers and continued federal government support for such programs. But this ran counter to the financial goals of the Reagan administration (supply-side economics), these were of course to reduce federal spending, reduce social programs, and transfer responsibility of many if not most government functions to the individual states. So, the law signed by President Carter was rescinded by Ronald Reagan on August 13, 1981. In accordance with the New Federalism and the demands of capital, mental health policy was then in the hands of individual states. Ahh, the GOP, a self-interest group that just keeps giving...

Ronald Reagan isn't responsible for the closing, within the last few months, of some of the facilities that provided (among other things) mental health care here in Illinois. I have to wonder what happened to all those people who were at Murray Center in Centralia, IL, for example, after it was closed?

It was Kennedy who started the movement to close government owned/operated mental health facilities. He had a family member who was kept in a government owned facility. Most states still have state owned mental health facilities, however, it would be easier to get struck by lightening than actually get someone admitted to one of the facilities.

It's hand guns. I had to check around on some other websites, because this NBC article did not say, but this killer used a hand gun.

Hand guns are the problem. Hand guns are the #1 murder weapon in the US. And for good reason, it's just about the best thing we have for killing people.

So, what to do about hand guns? Well, I thought you'd never ask...Put them in the same classification as machine guns. That will make them more difficult to purchase. And, when there are fewer legal hand guns, there will be fewer illegal hand guns. All guns start legal.

Don't focus on mental health, you'll never catch all the crazies. Don't try to provide armed guards everywhere, because that only points out how much of a failure your gun policy is. i.e. you need to protect yourself from people who are armed!!

If you want to reduce the killing, you need to find the common factor and that is hand guns. Get hand guns out of as many hands as possible, and you will reduce killing.

I love how the NRA constantly says an inanimate object like a gun doesn't kill people, but people do. Then the blowhard NRA Exec. Dir. went on TV and blamed inanimate objects like video games and movies and took absolutely not one iota of responsibility for what happened. If there is anyone I would like to see become a victim of his own words, it is that guy.

TomJ the way you talk this guy walked into that school himself and shot those kids. Also that gun doesnt have A heart beat, it cant reason out things as A person can so yes it is an inanimate object. also why do you think these mass killings alway happen in gun free zone? Where we live we have always had A deputy in every school for at least 30 years that I have been around them and not one person has ever been shot, BUT THEN AGAIN WERE NOT AS SMART AS YOU LIBERALS ARE.

I guess we're going to need a lot more NRA volunteers so we can assign everybody their own.

What a bunch of idiots. So, if people are out there flogging people to death with sticks... are we going to ban sticks too? You don't take away the guns because anyone who truly wants one, will still get ahold of one. Then, as a result, you have just taken away the guns from law abiding citizens who are able to protect themselves. Would you rather your son, daughter, sister, brother, etc. walk into a convenience store during a robbery with a few citizens carrying CHLs, or would you rather guns be banned in that situation with only the gunman holding one? Bunch of libtards ... oh... oh... take everyone's guns!

Fitzme... That is a horrible comparison. Thanks for playing. Whens the last time someone killed somebody with a stray stick? You are right though, guns don't kill people, they just make it a hell of a lot easier for someone to kill massive amounts of people. You obviously cannot ban guns as they are everywhere. Lets all get armed so we can solve every dispute with a weapon. Someone has watched way too many westerns.

I've owned guns all my life basically. I've also played violent video games and still do and I'm in my late 40's. I own my own home, have children and the means to be a stay at home dad. My children know about guns, gun safety and the respect that fire arms deserve. Nobody has access to my gun safe but myself. Responsibility and education is needed for all since there is no way you will ever be able to un-invent the technology or take the knowledge away to be able to build another.

Let's all get armed and play Wild Wild West!

Toni J, Guns don't stand up and take aim alone.. These games show how it is done.. They do play on ones mind...Read below..

You need some help here.. Guns don't play on your mind while watching them...DUH, video's and movies do just that.. There was a Psychologist on TV a couple of days ago.. He said: They took a group of young children, 6 and 7, showed them videos and movies of killings.. They then placed them into a room with dolls.. They kicked and beat the dolls trying to kill them as they saw in the videos... HELLO ... Now what does that tell you? This man was very good. He was an un/biased person and spoke it as it was.

Except that Canada and other countries also have violent video games and movies as well, and they don't have the same amount of mass killings that we do. HELLO - now what does that tell you?

indigo4- Canada has approximately ten percent of the population of the USA. Thus, if they had 90 percent less problems than us, they still would be statistically the same. Do the math.

The Planet has 7 Billion humans on it. Never before has that many humans existed. Throw in advances in technology... Well something is gonna give.

Another example of a mentally unstable nut job with no compassion for other lives.

who probably got the gun illegally

Are all of the gang members who kill people EVERYDAY suffering from mental issues? What is the excuse for them? There are hundreds of shootings across America everyday. The issue is bigger than these publicized shootings.

Say a prayer for the families.

Exactly. I can go out right now and pick up probably any kind of gun I want illegally. Gun laws won't change that. The people who kill people like this are sick and want to hurt others. Without guns they will find a way. It will be a shame when they have to resort to explosives which will easily claim more lives than guns will because we made it hard for them to get a gun.

If anything, a 30 round magazine is not needed for hunting or sport. Limit the size of the mags.

You said it brother. And thank you for your service.

TL'S NIGHT TRAIN -You are so right!!! Nicely put!!

TL, first of all, thank you for your service to our country.

I agree with you completely. A few weeks ago a drunk football player got into an accident with his car and killed his passenger in the process.

Do we blame the car? No of course not. it was the person driving it who caused it to crash, not the car.

Do we blame the alcohol he drank? No, of course not. It was his choice to drink and then to drive.

So who do we blame? We blame the drunk driver.

NOW we have someone with a gun.

Did the gun get up off the table all by itself and shoot at people? No, of course not. It took someone consciously taking the weapon into his hands and aiming and firing at the people.

Do we blame the person? No of course not. We blame the gun. It was the GUNS fault this person decided to go on a rampage and kill others.

What is wrong with this picture?

Janine,true but that car has to be registered and insured,why not guns?

Finally some commen sense here. I see crazy from both sides so this is refreshing

They are registered. B.S. to the person who is the licensed owner.

As for insurance, the moment you start mentioning that you will people up in arms over the profits insurance companies already make, and what kind of profits they would make if gun owners were required to insure their guns.

But regardless, what difference will insuring the gun do for the people who are killed?

Did the drunk football player having car insurance make his dead passenger any less dead?

I don't think so.

Ban handguns.

@ TL, My hat off to you , sir. Some of the best people I have had for a neighbor was a vet. The standout was Ray Fliggee. He had an appreciation for life that was phenomenal. Didn't have to think to hard why that was. More people on this planet than ever before(7 Billion) makes things "Weider" than ever. Thanks for coming home from Nam...

Dan,

And i can go buy and illegal gun just as i can buy illegal drugs. May cost a little more but i can get one. The black market will provide all anyone wants.

Napalm? You clearly don't care about global warming! JDAM's are more environmental safe.

Walter_P_Oreilly

Dan M-744640

Clearly, the solution calls for a more heavily armed state. If the cops only had napalm, then they could have ordered an air strike and this would have been prevented.

Or, perhaps, on the other hand, we could just take the semi-automatic weapons out of the hands of non-military? Just a thought.

And a "Retarded" thought at that Dan, If you could "TAKE" and "KEEP" those weapons you mentioned out of the hands or said individuals, well, you may have a point. Since you "CANNOT" do that, your point is irrelevant.

how then do other countries do it if it can't be done???

the queenie

how then do other countries do it if it can't be done???

they don't have the "RIGHT" in the first place, or choose not to use it.

Dan, It did not say he had a semi-automatic. Do not jump the gun.

common sense isn't so common is it queenie. Get the second ammendment abolished and THEN you can begin to compare with other countries like that

Agreed that there will always be a way to get assault rifles (and nuclear weapons technology for that matter) on the black market. But, I really wish it had been a little more difficult for the CT shooter to get his weapons. Maybe it would have taken him a few extra days and he might have regained his sanity in the meantime. Maybe he'd have settled for a legally obtained revolver and 21 more people would be alive.

I'm a conservitive gun owner who goes to church every Sunday, but I still have a heart that tells me that there's absolutely no logical reason for anyone to legally obtain an assault rifle with a high-capacity clip.

Marc I dont' think that individual was going to regain his sanity anytime soon and if you had been paying attention he was denied purchase when he attempted to obtain a weapon legally. He got his hands on his mom's weapons, illegally, murdered her and then went on his vile rampage. If he was more closely monitored due to his mental state, maybe even temporarily institutionalized he would have had less ability to break our existing laws. Your power of logical reasoning could use some improvement in my estimation. Think about your statement, absolutely is a pretty strong word, I can think of several logical reasons but since we clearly have slightly different views concerning the 2nd amendment I won't attempt to explain them to you.

Where does it say this happened in a school?

Freedomfrys deputys in the schools do work. We have had deputys in our schools for the past 30 years that I have been around them and we have not had the first shooter walk in here.. You know I was going to say something cute about your statment but really.

The problem is, a lot of the morons have guns. That scares the hell out of me.

Paranoid much? That's a pretty far fetched conspiracy. Unless you are being sarcastic.

Like the "fast and furious" operation?

You know Dan, my cynical mind has thought the same thing on some level. I don't think they pay to incite the act, but I bet they pass $$$$ to the media to make sure the incidents are front and center.

Dan, just because you're paranoid, that doesn't mean they aren't out to get you.

Take it a step farther. With all the recent incidents, is it possible that they (govt, or gun control advocates) are using drugs and hypnosis to incite these incidents, with the shooter then killing himself after the rampage so he can't say why or what really motivated him? Paranoid? Probably, but knowing how our government works, and how little regard they have for the lives of their citizens, certainly not out of the realm of possibility.

Call me crazy, but the Colorado theater shooter is still alive, as are countless other mass shooters. So I'm not sure any of this is government mind control. The issue is getting to the bottom of what made them do something like this in the first place. This stuff is happening everywhere, guns or no guns. The incident in China was done with a knife.

And for the record, check out the gun laws and crime statistics in Switzerland, where every adult male in the country is armed and all citizens have the right to carry a gun. They must be doing something right over there since they are the only country in Europe to never be invaded by their neighbors. That might have something to do with the fact that all their citizens have a firearm and know how to use it. It is also one reason no one has invaded the US. It's very hard to take over a country full of citizens who are armed and will defend themselves, their neighbors and their property.

There is no easy solution to our problems, but I think one thing that would make a big difference is everyone spreading love, peace, compassion, empathy and things that are good, instead of spewing hate, violence, meanness, selfishness and bigotry.

God Bless America!

how did they cause this exactly?

Mike, of course it's the NRA"s fault. Don't you know that.

THEY made that gun aim at those people and kill them.

This is the "It's not my fault" Society. It wasn't the fault of the man who consciously picked up a gun, aimed it at others and fired. Of course not. It's either the guns fault or the NRA's.

Personal responsibility is not the issue. The individual certainly isn't going to shoot someone and then throw the gun down and claim the gun made him do it. But if he hadn't had the gun he couldn't have shot anyone. So that is a specious argument.

On another note, the mass killings at Aurora and Newtown were both committed by people who were delusional and seriously mentally ill. But not all mass murderers are mentally ill. I believe that if someone is delusional and psychotic that it actually does mean that we might have controlled his actions with earlier intervention regarding his deteriorating mental condition. But some mass murderers are not delusional or psychotic. There is obviously something wrong with anyone who would just randomly kill a lot of people they don't know, but it isn't necessarily a genuine mental illness. Sociopaths are not mentally ill. They are just born bad. Maybe someday we will discover what goes wrong in their brains that they are so completely incapable of human emotion, but until then we will have to define them as evil. They are not always easy to identify, until you start finding the bodies. No mental health system or treatment has ever been able to change their behavior or identify their evil before they acted out. Some mass killers are sadists, who want to hurt the maximum number of people, but they won't necessarily to identified by a mental health care system prior to killing. Some mass killers start off normal and get triggered by some major trauma. They might well evade detection before killing half of the office staff. Not all mass killers would be identified by a mental health care system, so don't put all the eggs in that basket.

The shooter in Newtown was an NRA member? Really?

I suppose it's possible that his mother was in the NRA, but there have been no reports to that effect.

MSDNC is trying way too hard when they make this a breaking news banner. The Chicago murders don't even make this site.

Doesn't Chicago have pretty strict gun control laws?

Yet they have some of the highest gun violence rates.

The Guns must be sneaking in a killing people all by themselves.

Do you know why local gun laws don't work? It's because guns are brought in from nearby areas without gun control. It's because there are so many guns out there that even with gun restrictions, guns are pitifully easy to get hold of. Until we get serious about controlling the proliferation of guns on a national level, we will not be able to correct the problems at the local level. This is why we need federal rules and regulations governing gun ownership and use.

I am a NRA member, I graduated from college with majors in Management Finance, English and Accounting, I served in the US Navy, I own several shot guns, a 30.06 rifle, a.22 rifle, several .223 semi-automatic rifles, and .32 and 9mm handguns. I do have large capacity clips for several of these weapons - several of which have never been fired! Why does this make me a bad person?

Why are you afraid of me? I have commited no crimes, attend church, give to charities and volunteer my time for the less fortunate. Why does being a member of the National Rifle Association make me a despicable person? I disagree with your opinion, but you still have a right to express your opinion - after the 2nd amendment, the first, third through eighth, and the twelfth amendments will be the next to be denied us.

I simply dont understand why you feel the need to have large capacity clips. For what reason?

Dejavu, for the same reason some people feel the need to have off the road vehicles, or Motor cycles, or big trucks, or 90" TV's or whatever. It's what they want. No one is asking YOU to pay for their things. It's up to them.

dhp - Are those crickets we hear? I'm sure your comments will be ignored; they don't fit the "aganda".

Thanks for your service.

No offense dhp, but we are afraid of you because of what you own. You sound like a nice person, but if you ever get really mad, etc, we have only your word that you won't turn those guns on the rest of us and our children. People are all law abiding until they start shooting up somewhere. And even if we have a gun, typically the one with more fire-power wins.

As for the NRA, they reject even criminal back-ground checks. Your organization is simply too extreme and lacks common sense. There should be waiting periods in all states, back-ground checks and no large capacity clips.

How do you suppose the shooter was killed? Ill timed stroke?

so police officers are infallible? Of course they aren't going to be 100 percent effective everytime. So human slips up and gets shot while trying to protect people. It'll happen. That doesn't nullify his proposal. You're an imbecile if you think that. More times than not, the state trooper will prevail.

Four dead and three troopers injured (one shot but protected by bullet proof vest, one injured by flying glass as his windshield was shot out and one injured in an accident). Nobody said the bad guys would stop shooting once the LEOs were on scene. Nobody ever said the bad guys would stop shooting when an armed citizen fought back. What exactly is your point, that the goal is nobody gets injured? Of course the state troopers were vulnerable, just as you are if you experience a home invasion. At least they had the ability to defend themselves, do you?

Interesting -- So how is this event proving the NRA point ?-- wasn't like this guy didn't have a gun or anything..did he? Of yeah,,wait-- he did. Didn't beat these folks to death with a table leg or a axe handle. Guns are the most fastest and most effortive way to kill! Let us not forget that the founding father of this great country wrote the founding documents to support their revolt against a government. Therefore justified their actions and they taking up arms. Don't really think these men really meant for the aveage Amercian citizen to be armed to the teeth --with guns they would have no concept of in 1776!

LSCWquilter- So what is your point about the armed state troopers ? do you think UNARMED troopers would have done a better job, or a quicker job or had less loss of lives? Pretty sure if the cops were UMARMED, you would have had MORE DEAD BODIES. Kind of speaks well of why we have ARMED people going into situations involving ARMED people. Cops respond with ARMS even when the agressor is unarmed. So does the military. So does any person that values their future when confronting many threats.

Excellent post.

Well stated.

Fukin retarded comment. Switzerland does not have a uniformed military which is why they treat firearms they way they do. Another factoid: Switzerland is one of the most educated (leaps and bounds beyond the US) and wealthy countries in the world. They don't have back country hicks who are easily duped into the "government is out to get me" bullsh*t like we do. One last factoid: Since you like to point out Switzerland as a fine example of how the government should treat it's people, they also have universal health care. But that's a whole other subject that you teanuts know you are wrong about so we won't go there.

Out of that WHOLE post all you can come up with is answer to those 3 "Switzerland" lines?? Funny how you have no comment about the page long list of stats he gave you about unarmed defenseless "subjects" being executed. Blows my mind how blind people are. They only look at what they wanna see. Speaking of retarded..... SMH

regardless of whether or not the Swiss have a uniformed army, they have lots of people with guns, and the lowest crime around. Doesnt matter about the army.

Eye witnesses are the least reliable of evidence. A significant number of people wrongly imprisoned were put there by eyewitnesses who were absolutely sure they were right, even though they weren't. And why is it you're willing to trash our Constitutional right to a fair trial and legal representation but elevate the 2nd amendment to God status. I happen to think that due process is a hell of a lot more important than owning a gun. Without due process they can jail and/or execute anyone for anything, including the exercise of free speech.

Johnnybeegood1, Yeah, just make up your facts. Because you are hugely WRONG. In fact, the Swiss have the second highest rate of firearm homicide and accidental gun death in the G12 (look it up if you don't know what THAT is). They are second, of course, us. And, not a particularly close second. Our rates are almost 3 times their's as to firearm homicides and over twice their's as to accidental gun deaths. The rest of the G12 is well below either us or the Swiss.

Love, Texas, you kind of cherry-picked your countries, didn't you? Most western European countries have strong gun control laws and somehow it hasn't affected their democracies. Japan and South Korea have stringent gun controls, they are both democracies (South Korea just elected its first female president) and have extremely low crime rates.

If you honestly think your little guns will stop a military that wants your ass you a naive.

Yeah, long live paranoid white guys who truly value guns and not a whole lot else.

please read post 23 tetra@!$%#

STFU, if it weren't for white people you wouldn't be enjoying your freedom of speech in the good ole USA moron!

Tetra you obviously lack the ability to see cause and effect. If the citizens are disarmed, then the government has carte blanche to do whatever the @!$%# it wants. The government is already trying to do its best to expand and control. We don't need the private sector to assist them. I sincerely hope you and others are in the minority - the ones who are so blind that they cannot see the insane amounts of invasive procedures and technology the government is using to spy on its own people and violate their rights.

We need more people to own guns than ever before. This government has been heading down the path of total control for decades, and it's accelerating. If we have no capacity to rise up if the situation becomes dire, then you might as well use the Constitution for toilet paper to wipe your ass, because that's all it will be good for.

Adam L, I agree. When the time comes to fight our government, if they have their way, we will be

without weapons.. We won't have a country like the United States to give us guns like they have given

to Lybia, Syria, Mexico, Pakistan, Afghanistan, etc.. WE WILL BE ON OUR OWN. One more thing, what happens when a foreign Country invades, how will we protect ourselves? Do you really want the Government to protect you? Like they protected our men in Benghazi??

WAKE UP PEOPLE..

If you are planning on fighting our elected government, then it is time to try you for treason.

Well said, LUD!

first of all, our elected government isnt the country. we the people are the country. the reason for the second amendment is to keep that government from stepping out of line.

The idiots who want assault weapons fully intend to use them against the rest of us as Jean and Adam were stupid enough to just admit. It's time to wake up all right. These treasonous future murderers belong behind bars!

Chef89...Gun regulation is about PEOPLE...regulating their opportunity to own certain kinds of weapons

No right is unlimited. The founders,when they wrote the 2nd Amendment, said people had a right to bear arms in order to maintain a "WELL REGULATED MILITIA"...not to have assault weapons for pleasure or personal prefererence....

What militia do you belong to ? The paranoid,under educated,masculinity concerned,white folks,against common sense and public safety militia?

Supreme Court said the founders meant individuals not militia, the individual has the right to own a weapon to protect their home! The Bushmaster is not a military weapon, semi automatic and now used in war, those weapons are full auto...Ban them if you want, hunting rifles as the Browning semi-automatic can fire just as fast as the Bushmaster and they will still be available, high capacity mags are cheap to make and bootleg.

Knee jerk reaction and no real fix with over 300,000 million guns already out there. The 2nd amendment gives home owners the right to own a gun....do your homework before you join the liberal, limp wristed Heinz 57 variety lemming that does not have a clue about how to really fix the violent and mental health care problem...Prohibition has never worked in this country, how's the drug war going for ya! Just going to create a demand for guns for criminals to fill and get rich on...

Thank you for clarifying the constitution for the lame larry. earwax, assault rifle is a generic term use to describe a rifle that resembles, in appearance, a military grade weapon. luckily they do not completely function as a military grade weapon (full auto, three round burst, etc) the performance of the round is just that and does not vary greatly when loaded into the guns that they can be shot from. A standard .223 caliber can be shot from multiple rifles and even hand guns (to include the AR-15 used in CT). The only thing that would have stopped him from shooting up the school would be another armed person shooting him first (murder) or after he started shooting in the school (too late by any standards) so unless he was confronted with his weapon in view and shot first before firing his own weapon there would still be some deaths and people complaining that more should have been done and more "control" needs to be made.

I'm not concerned that my guns will or can be taken. i am concerned that my kids, grandkids and beyond won't even have the option let alone Right to even own a gun.