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Subscribe to RSSWomen who rode into Iraq during the 2003 Coalition invasion or who withstood on-base mortar attacks that killed other U.S. troops raucously cheered news of the impending lift of the female-combat ban, shouting the same three spirited words.
“It’s about time!” said Laura Cannon, a 2001 West Point graduate who rolled into Iraq with the Army’s 3rd Infantry Division, spending seven months there. “Women have been on the ‘front lines,’ per se, for years. Now they're getting credit and authorization that is long overdue. The landscape of combat has changed so much that front lines are ambiguous, and frankly, what I believe to be an obsolete concept.”
“Yes!” added Julie Weckerlein, a Air Force veteran who served in Afghanistan and Iraq. In 2007, she sought cover and was not far from Army Sgt. Trista Moretti, 27, who was killed when mortars exploded on their base in Nasir Lafitah, Iraq. “There is definitely a sense of ‘it's about time.'
“This decision means the military is finally removing that useless ‘attached, but not assigned’ verbiage that meant absolutely nothing on the field, with the boots on the ground,” she added. Weckerlein worked as an Air Force combat correspondent, traveling throughout Iraq and Afghanistan, documenting the missions of Air Force joint terminal air controllers and Army infantry soldiers at remote provincial reconstruction team locations and at forward operating bases. In other words, she shadowed military men who were doing “male only” jobs.
Women now compose about 15 percent of the U.S. armed forces.
Placing American women in combat is “a great idea,” especially because "my gosh, women have served in the military since World War I," said Terri Kaas, an Air Force veteran who spent time in Bahrain and Germany.
“Women in the military should be able to do the same jobs as men, whatever the mission is. Though the military has desegregated, women are still treated differently,” in part because they have been held back from combat, Kaas said.
“I know, you still hear: 'It’s a man’s military.' But we are all service members,” she added. “Look at the Marine Corps — they have equal standards of fitness for both genders. If the men can’t respect women for the job they’re doing maybe these men shouldn’t be in the military.”
In fact, argued Cannon, the policy and political path is now clear for Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta to eliminate “gender-based restrictions on military jobs and career paths altogether.”
“I think every branch should have its own set of criteria and physical requirements, instead of the basic, existing standards that say: men need to do this and women need to do that,” Cannon added.
“Pilots in the aviation branch certainly don't need to physically perform to the same levels as that of infantrymen. So have new standards applicable to every job. Then, if a woman can achieve all of the requirements necessary to enter the infantry — by all means — let her!”
Related: Defense chief Panetta to clear women for combat roles
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Women in combat roles might, might not be a good thing. Men have always been the warriors, and yeah, yeah, I know about the Amazons, lol. My opinion is that women have a different mentality, like; Could a woman mentally handle dragging a comrade with her guts hanging out, face blown off, and screaming in pain? Sure, men can barely handle that, but they do it in combat. I'm not sure that a woman could. I knew women in the army that were almost as BAD as a man, but one fact is pre-eminent; Women are life givers, not takers, so, could a woman handle shooting down a child attacking with a grenade? Well, a gun doesn't care what gender pulls it's trigger so women could have a role in defending a position, but, does the average woman have the "Killer instinct" to go on the offensive, shooting anything that moves? Yeah well, I guess we'll just have to wait and see, see how it all sorts out. Personally, I would feel better having a man walking point than a woman. A soldier, infantryman, goes into combat with the mindset of a brute, harsh and cruel. And, as a matter of course, following orders. A woman could, sure, if her child had just been killed. But could she do it, calling upon the "Wolf" to maim and kill because she was ordered too? Yeah well, we'll find out if woman has the same level of killer instinct that a man does, or should have if he's a combat soldier.
My celtic heritage has plenty of bloodthirsty women in it. The most successful pirate (granted it's not war, but close) was a woman.
Barry Bonds is a girl?
Who knew...LOL!!
Henry Morgan was most certainly a man, IMHO-2730490. And bloodthirstiness is not something we want in modern soldiers...
On a sidenote, the Amazons were not real. Some of the Steppes people had female warriors, but to them war was not so much a profession as a necessity.
“Yes!” added Julie Weckerlein, a Air Force veteran who served in Afghanistan and Iraq. In 2007, she sought cover and was not far from Army Sgt. Trista Morietti, 27, who was killed when mortars exploded on their base in Nasir Lafitah, Iraq. “There is definitely a sense of ‘it's about time.'
After seeing that you would think the light bulb would click on and Julie would not want anyone in that situation.
Laura,
Thank you for your service and voice of reason. First, not to be overly pedantic, but give Army women more credit:
"said Terri Kaas, an Air Force veteran who spent time in Bahrain and Germany."
AF, no combat, it's even worse than you thought. Everything you have said is spot on. I'm a retired Army grunt btw, combat in 4 theaters, so I'm not a total neophyte. Civilians spouting off about the military drives me nuts.
On a positive note, unless I read this incorrectly, women will be allowed to serve in their traditional MOS' at the Bn level in combat arms units. They will not be scouts, grunts, SF guys, etc. For now anyway...
Ironically, all those guys whining about this decision are beginning to sound like a bunch of girls.
Man up with it.
Americans are getting sick and tired of having all the PC BS shoved down our throats. Men are expendable women are not. If you want to send your daughter or your gay son then send them by all means to the front of the fight. We need to get to the real issues affecting the United States of America and this is really really low on the list.
"Man up with it."
Now that`s funny right there!!
IMHO-------- Havent been there have you dem lefty?
I look forward to the time when the dreaft has to be restarted and they start drafting dem leftys and homos and women.
IMHO, not really, the more targets for the enemy to shoot at lessens the odds for everyone, so, let the women go into combat. You posted earlier about the blood-thirsty women in your Celtic heritage. Right, we've heard and read about the Celtic warrior queen; Boudicca. Would she be an exception to womanhood, and then too there's Joan, of arc fame?
all ive got to say is if they can lug 60 + plus lb rucksack up an 8 mile mountain road in full battle rattle along with weapon and all the ammo they need then let em in ( we did this in germany in preparation for afghanastan...ive seen combat tested e5 and e6 booted out of the unit for laggin behind)..... but remember every member of an infantry squad needs to be able to do this..... dont know many men let alone woman that can do it ....min standard for army infantry is 12 miles full gear and ammo with 50 lb ruck in 3 hours
well, it finally came. having served in the u.s. military for 10 years and stand at 6'5" it really concerns me because half of the guys I served with could not carry me when I was to pretend to be injured. I have no problem with women serving in the service. I do have a problem when one is jumping with me into combat, ruck march, or trying to fend of some unfriendlys and they are given a less physical test them me and they say they can do the same things I do. in this article it says women and men have the same pt requirements in the marine corp, I thought great then that is fine but looking up the pt requirements guess what they are not the same. the test consists of pullups, crunches, and a run for the guys and females is a flexed-arm hang, crunches and a run. well having said that the run for females max is 21 minutes and guys is 18. I still stand by what I said, jumping out of planes, fast ropes, climbing, whatever the case may be I would like the person that is next to me to be able to do the same run, same pull-ups, and in general be able to do the same fitness level of me because without that its not going to be a lot of fun if they drop me or get us both killed because they could not run as far, or carry the weight. I guess the facts don't matter.
Do you know that many of our enemies have a great sense of smell. Some say they can smell a fart from at least 2000 meters and the smell of second hand smoke that is on clothing 4 to 5000 meters, depending on the wind. Just think how it will be with a woman out on point when she is on her period. Lets not even mention the over a thousand hormones she has to battle with in her body.
"some say"...lol. "some say" that the earth is flat too.
Most men I know stink more than most women I know.
Give it two weeks in the field without a shower friend, and they`ll be "equally" ripe if not more so...
oh, women can stink too. But the idea that somehow differences in scent between the genders is some kind of significant advantage to our miraculous enemies who, apparently, have the noses of hounddogs is kind of silly.
Vermont Guy, another loud mouth dem lefty with no direct knowledge, running his mouth.
Wait for it dem lefty harder to get volunteers daily now, be fun when they start drafting women, dem leftys and homos.
Couldn't agree more, well said:
"Indeed. I understand women were already working in harms way and not getting the pay and promotions for it."
"These women (As being one of them/recalled to the USMC back in feb. 2003) want the recognition of combat. Being right there in the thick of it and then be told that you weren't is crap. It serves no purpose to have a "front line" when there is no longer a "front line" and then tell someone...anyone male or female...that they weren't there or not give them the same medals or credentials as the man standing 10 feet away and doing the exact same thing."
"Women are already coming home in body bags; over 140 female soldiers have died in Iraq and Afghanistan. So I'd say the American public is OK with it."
Wow, that many huh?
Okay let's form up some all female units, they can strut their stuff, show us what they can do and not get men killed.
Interesting. So because the "lines" are nebulous in current warfare and women were killed in their current roles (whatever it may have been) that means everything else is out the window and they should be on the "lines" in MOS's that require them to do things that they can't? i.e. the physical constraints? Come on, lets be real!? NOBODY is degrading women or marginalizing their sacrifice and efforts now or in the past. God bless them every one! There are things a woman can do that I can't, nor any man. Why is it so hard to accept that there are things that the majority of women can't do and those who can (God love 'em) would create more of a distraction than need be. I WHOLEHEARTEDLY APPLAUD WOMEN FOR WANTING TO HELP AND SACRIFICE!! I really really do. But ladies, at this time, please, let the men be MEN and let us try to be gallant just a little more, please.
I agree, but the females take everything the wrong way. Like I said, they have a chip on their shoulder. I respect women, but most men in the same situation are stronger and faster than most women. Sure there are females in excellent physical and mental shape, but that is a rare thing. Also like I said, if women and men were equal physically there wouldn't be a mens league and a womens league in the same sport. In pro golf, why is the mens course longer than the females course on the same course. In pro tennis, why can a female win her match after winning 2 games and a male has to win 3 games to win his match? Did you ever she women's hockey? It's so much slower than men's hockey. Why is this? Easy to answer. Under most situations or settings men are better and faster and stronger than women. So if a unit doesn't have that special female in it, their weakest link will be very weak. I'm a disabled Vietnam combat veteran, I have experience in combat and I find it hard to believe that any person, male or female would be excited about going into combat. If getting wounded or killed makes females that happy, then I think mentally, they have something wrong with them. Combat isn't a stroll through the park.
why not fight for the need for them to register for selective service (draft) then like every 18 year old male is required to do? equal rights, right?
maybe because the selective service system is a 50 year old holdover that has almost zero chance of actually being used for actually drafting troops, so fighting for an obsolete systems seems kind of pointless?
50 years old were you not alive in the 70's?
Then make all register not just males, or do away with it. For a man to get a job he must show that he has registered.
I don't have a conceptual problem with expanding the system to include women. Of course, congress would have to change the laws, and provide more funding. Seems kind of silly, given our situation, to spend time and money "fixing" a system that will never be used, so I can understand why no one is particularly "fighting" to change an obsolete law.
It is only obsolete until needed. You assume it will never be used again because it has not been used since Vietnam. What happens when there are no volunteers and we need people to serve. You think this generation will stand up like we did in WWII not.
I don't think we'll ever need an army the size of WW2 again.
and why would there ever be "no volunteers"?
If we didn't need the draft during the iraq/afghanistan scenario, its hard to imagine ever needing it. Our absolute numbers of fighting soldiers are declining as we replace "brawn with brain".
You ever hear of China? They have more brains and brawn.
"Women are already coming home in body bags; over 140 female soldiers have died in Iraq and Afghanistan. So I'd say the American public is OK with it."
Yep, now they can get used to thousands and thousands more...
So much for equal opportunity...to die for one`s country I guess...
We are not ok with anyone coming home in body bags.
Who is this "we' you speak of and when did "we" not get going into battle results in good girls and boys coming home in body bags?
Afterall this isn`t a beauty contest we`re talking about, is it?
That's right Brian, war, combat isn't a beauty contest nor is it some Friday night high school football game. It's serious business and for that reason I claim that the average woman isn't mentally or physically up to it. Well, lol, a lot of men aren't either, I'll agree to that but I would still prefer a man with me when the sh!t goes down.
Anybody ask the average grunt what he thinks? I can tell you...I wouldn't feel secure in a foxhole with a riflewoman guarding my ass. Just to be clear, like in WW2 and Vietnam women have a role they can play. And that role is to free up men for the real fighting. Dykes on the front line is stupid.
ah, so only "dykes" want combat. lol. Yeah, straight women prefer to be barefoot and pregnant, serving neanderthals like you? :)
I will tell you a little secret. A lot of men will object becauses it places two concepts they cannot bare to see...women and killing...
Lots of cheers, until the dead, mutilated female bodies start coming home.
dead, mutilated bodies have already been coming home. Have been for decades.
No kidding, Verminguy. There is a difference between women dying in war zones and dying the way the SF men were killed and dragged through the streets in Mogadishu.
"verminguy"? lol.
as far as I can see, "dead and mutilated" is "dead and mutilated", no matter the gender or how it happened. I'm pretty sure that people advocating for women in combat understand what could happen. Its crazy, but women can be as patriotic as men in terms of wanting to defend our country, including with their lives.
Then with this decision Vermont just get used to alot more of it...women dying for their country that is.
Just another ploy to help destroy America. There are tons of men coming back with post traumatic stress disorder. Do they really think women are gonna be able to handle combat. Sure, some women will be able, but most won't! wouldn't want my back covered by a woman. And NO, Im NOT a chauvinist! Some women are capable of doing things on par with men, most aren't. They are made differently: physically, mentally, emotionally and phisiologically. I think this is a BAD move!
its a commie conspiracy, I tell ya! lol.
I guess being "patriotic" is now considered UN-American.
how so?
Can you just imagine a woman stopping in the middle of a fire fight to squat and pee or insert a fresh tampon? The whole platoon will be wiped out. Distractions like that is not needed in combat.
why would a woman do that?
so, no I can't imagine a woman just stopping inthe middle of a fire fight to squat and pee, no more than I imagine a man doing that.
No a woman wouldn't stop to squat a pee they would just stop and panic and get everyone killed.
C'mon JC, there's no reason to take cheap shots at women like that. Lol, I doubt that any woman in combat would be doing that. Making a comment like that is like a woman in combat; "Oh no, I can't go on, I've broken a fingernail." I've heard that one and it just isn't so. Women should be respected for what they can do, not for what they might be able to do. Sure, there are women fighting alongside men in the IDF, Israeli Defense Force. Women in the French Resistance fought. There was a woman who, when her husband was killed, took his place as a member of a gun crew during our Revolution. I think they were the exceptions and not the norm and exceptions occur only in times of extreme stress, or need.
What if the female soldier cannot find daycare and has to breast feed while on the battlefield? This could be distracting. And what about future photos of urinating on bodies of the enemy? Some type of protocol will have to be worked out to make it practical, yet manly. So many things to consider.
This like most of Panetta's decisions do not seem to have much thought behind them. It is time for him to go.
I hope that the military will not allow mother and father to serve at the same time. If both are killed then the children will have no parents. I say it will probably be to much for majority of children to take in when they are told your mom is dead and so is your dad.
Good example..already looking for exemptions. They will have a million expentions in place before one ever hits the field. From PMS to I just painted my nails.
Kids are resilient, they persevere. Most went on in spite of the fact that mom and dad were killed in the shelling of a village.
I remember the Crosby show where Bill takes Theo down to the recruiter and tries to put him in the Navy, the recruiter told all the dad's that had dragged their sons down to enlist to raise their hands...funny stuff! Now we can haul our lazy butt daughters down to the recruiter as well...lol
Idiots! Panetta has just weakened all of our military. I would never serve with a woman in combat. There will be a lot of straws drawn on them.
And the straws will be rigged.
Exactly i agree i have served in the military in combat with women before the ban.I'm lucky to be alive but many of my friends were not so lucky.save lives and billions in tax dollars keep women totally out of the military.
There is something inheritenly wrong with a country that cheers as it sends it's mothers of to war. Nuff Said.
I think cheering for equal rights isn't a bad thing. We're not "sending our mothers to war", we're allowing women to serve in combat roles. Nuff said.
which is crazy they put themselfs and men in danger for WHAT! equal rights My God all i have to say is @!$%# it let'em the world is over populated anyway.
Vermont: I have been there and there are many mothers in uniform. To put childrens' mother in a life and death struggle trumps the "equal rights" argument. Why is it that people like you are interested in "equal rights" regardless of the consequence. For cryin' out loud. Equal rights? We are NOT equal. There is a difference between men and women and you should know that. Nuff said.
Yeah Ali, men will have to learn to ululate, cheering as the units of women soldiers march by.
No offence to women being in the military but a friend of mine almost lost his life because before the ban women were getting themselfs and men hurt and killed they were just a distraction it was like taking a cat to the dog pound you were always worried about her having u'r back or having to snap her out of a panic attack my god there some things women just can't do like men and theres things men can't do that women can.women are getting men killed and it's all over women thinking there being treated unfair when in fact women are costing tax payers billions of dollars when they have no business being in the military at all.ya ya'll can bitch whine and cry all you want but why don't u ask them women who's husbands didn't come home because a woman in combat cost him his life there is enough confussion in the battlefield women just add to the deathcount.
Sure do wish this would have happened 43 years ago. I could have had one to heat up my C rat's, one to keep my clothes clean in the boonies, and three to hump all that s**t like pack mules. You know M79, M16, M60, M1, frags, smoke, PRC 25, field phones, rations, water, and lots and lots of ammo. I want to see the true number of females stupid enough to even try this for months on end, one step closer to death each day, and have no clue how your name didn't make it on the wall lose limbs or your sanity! The U.S. will never reinstitute the draft in my life time, so moms and dads you can rest knowing your daughters will not have to endure the many hardships of being INFANTRYMAN. Peace to all.
women are suspost to give life instead of take it read the bible see what god says about a good woman and if they are captured how many of the emenies children would they have over an extended time or how many different fathers would the children have war should be a last resort i'm140%+ disabled nam marine sgt1/9 jan68-69+ delta co human nature would make a man do/risk his life for a woman the emeny knows that and will exploit that