E-mail updates
Follow on Twitter
Subscribe to RSS
Credit: Los Angeles Police Dept. newsletter via NBCLosAngeles
Christopher Jordan Dorner is seen in a photo from a 2006 LAPD newsletter. Dorner was on the force until 2008, and he was a reservist in the U.S. Navy.
Updated at 3:50 a.m. ET -- An ex-cop suspected of killing three people including a policeman and threatening to kill others — as laid out in a chilling online manifesto — continued to elude a massive manhunt early Friday despite local, state and federal agents following leads throughout Southern California.
Speaking to a packed press conference, Los Angeles Police Chief Charlie Beck chronicled the bloody events and called on the alleged gunman, 33-year-old Christopher Dorner, to turn himself in.
More coverage from NBCLosAngeles.com
"This has gone far enough," Beck added. "No one else needs to die."
Police conducted door-to-door searches in the ski area of Big Bear Mountain after discovering Dorner's burned-out 2005 Nissan Titan truck in the area, NBCLosAngeles.com reported.
The FBI and Las Vegas police were at Dorner's Las Vegas home earlier Thursday. According to a statement released by the FBI, the surrounding neighborhood was cleared for safety reasons while a "law enforcement action" was completed.
Early Friday, the San Diego Sheriff's Department said it had received a call saying Dorner was at a home in the area. Units were at the scene but as at midnight local time (3 a.m. ET), officials said they had not taken any suspects into custody.
Dorner, a 270-pound former Navy reservist who was tossed off the police force in 2008, was acting out of revenge, according his 11,300-word treatise — a cached version of which was obtained by NBCLosAngeles.com — and was targeting not only perceived enemies, but their families as well.
Described as 'one of the more dangerous shooters we've seen in a long time,' police say 33-year-old Christopher Dorner has already killed three people and is gunning for more. NBC's Miguel Almaguer reports.
"I never had the opportunity to have a family of my own, I’m terminating yours," Dorner wrote in his rambling manifesto, addressing LAPD officials he blamed for ruining his career.
"Look your wives/husbands and surviving children directly in the face and tell them the truth as to why your children are dead."
Dorner has an arsenal of weapons, including assault rifles, police said. Citizens were told to call 911 if they saw his truck, but warned not to approach him, describing him as "extremely dangerous."
Dorner is a 2001 graduate of Southern Utah University, where he majored in political science and minored in psychology and played football for at least two of those years, the university confirmed.
He was a lieutenant in the Navy Reserves from 2002 until this week, and earned a ribbon for rifle marksmanship and a medal for pistol expertise. He was honorably discharged.
He joined the Los Angeles Police Department in 2005 and was fired for making false statements in 2008.
Los Angeles Police Chief Charlie Beck provides a briefing on the case of Christopher Dorner, the fired LAPD officer wanted in revenge slayings in Irvine, California.
Police say Dorner began his killing spree on Sunday.
Monica Quan, 28, and her fiancé, Keith Lawrence, 27, were fatally shot while parking their car at their apartment complex after a Super Bowl party. Quan is the daughter of retired LAPD Capt. Randy Quan, who represented Dorner at the internal review that led to his ouster.
On Wednesday, Dorner tried and failed to steal a boat in San Diego, Beck said. No one was hurt in that incident.
Hours later, he began targeting cops, they said.
At 1:25 a.m., in Chino, LAPD cops assigned to protect someone named in the manifesto came under fire. One cop suffered a graze wound to his head, "literally inches from killing him," Beck said.
Twenty minutes later, in Riverside, he ambushed two cops stopped at a red light. One officer was killed and the other is in stable condition.
Police in Riverside said that they had notified the family of the slain policeman, but did not reveal his identity out of concern that it might endanger his family members.
Tensions were high across the region, where cops on protection details wound up injuring innocent civilians.
At 5:15 a.m. in Torrance, police assigned to watch the home of a potential target got a report of a vehicle like Dorner’s in the area, and then spotted it driving with the lights off.
Police fired at the vehicle and wounded two women who were out delivering newspapers. The Los Angeles Times reported that one was shot in the back and one in the hand and both were taken to local hospitals for treatment. The back of their blue pickup was riddled with bullet holes, the report said.
Related: Women shot by cops were just delivering papers
"Tragically we believe this was a case of mistaken identity by the officers," said Chief Beck.
Later in the day, dozens of cops surrounded a motel in San Diego where a man matching Dorner’s description was reported to be holed up. KNSD said police eventually confirmed the man inside was not the suspect.
"It's extremely intense," Sgt. Rudy Lopez said of the dragnet to capture the suspect before anyone else is killed.
"We're trying to identify where he's been, where he's going. In this case, we are the targets. He's brazen. He's on a hunt to do whatever havoc he can."
Dorner’s manifesto, titled "Last Resort," is a road map of his rage over being tossed off the force. He claims that he was punished for accusing his field training officer of brutalizing a mentally disabled man.
"The attacks will stop when the department states the truth about my innocence, PUBLICLY!!!" he wrote.
Half of it chronicles the wrongs Dorner says he suffered, stretching all the way back to a racial slur used against him in the first grade. He portrays the LAPD as rife with racism, corruption and abuse.
There is a long passage in which he expresses support for an assault-weapons ban, and a plea that his brain be preserved for scientific research on the effects of depression.
The document also contains page after page of praise for friends, political figures, journalists and celebrities and opinions on issues of the day — from women in combat to the boycott of Chick-fil-A.
Mostly, though, he talks about his bloodthirsty plans. He claims his arsenal includes "Bushmaster firearms, Remington precision rifles" and silencers and boasts that his knowledge of police tactics will allow him to elude capture.
"I know I will be villified (sic) by the LAPD and the media," he wrote. "Unfortunately, this is a necessary evil that I do not enjoy but must partake and complete for substantial change to occur within the LAPD and reclaim my name."
In addition to posting his manifesto online, Dorner also reached out directly to CNN, mailing a package to anchor Anderson Cooper's New York office, according to CNN. The package contained a hand-labeled DVD, a yellow Post-it note reading, in part, "I never lied," and a coin wrapped in duct-tape.
According to CNN, the tape was inscribed with the words "Thanks, but no thanks, Will Bratton," and the letters "IMOA." The coin is a souvenir medallion from former L.A.P.D. Chief William Bratton, CNN said, but it appears to have been shot-through with bullet holes.
CNN told law enforcement about the parcel.
At an emotional press conference in Riverside, home to the fallen officer, Police Chief Sergio Diaz said that judging by Dorner’s manifesto, the fugitive had a "depraved mind and heart."
Diaz, like his counterpart in Los Angeles, said the suspect should turn himself in.
"His grievances will not be further aired by further violence."
View more videos at: http://nbclosangeles.com.
Leave a Comment:
Total kook, but a dangerous one. Sounds like if he was ex LAPD they need to do a better job of screening their applicants.
They need to break out the U.S. drones as he is now a terrorist. Take out the White Bronco......
In what way? They didn't say why he no longer is a cop. PTSD? Who knows? Could be. Maybe he became crooked after some time as a cop or he was already crooked when he came in.
he's a NUT with a gun....just read his "manifesto"....says it all!!!
@DiggernNE
Reading is obviously not an ability you excel in.
Dorner was FIRED from the LAPD. So, yes, I will submit that he is a FORMER cop.
Earlier reports were that he was fired for lying. He reported his Field Training Officer kicked a suspect, she claimed she didn't. That started the process of his firing. The Suspects Father, of the kicking, confirmed his son had injuries and stated he was kicked when then son was questioned about those injuries.
XDm9mm,
Maybe you shouldn't be disparaging others' ability to read. DiggernNE's statement was that they didn't say WHY he's no longer a cop, not that they didn't say he's no longer a cop.
BAN POLICE!
Why pick on Dorner---Just because he is a red neck--he got fired-Dorner is a brother to many people--All charges should be dropped--PRONTO !
He was fired from LAPD back in 2009 for telling the truth.. Now he is seeking revenge...I don't blame him..
@XDm9mm, my statement was 'They didn't say why he no longer a cop'. That means he is a FORMER cop.
@G1032, thanks for giving me the info on why he was fired.
Yes, by all means....Keep the guns only in the hands of Extensively Trained Professional Law Enforcement Personnel...
No need for Citizens to have them...Except maybe the person who he's probably holding Hostage in one of those neighborhood homes....
"Former Cop"....Did they take all his guns away....was he put in the FBI NICS data-base as " not eligible" to purchase a hand gun....
Enquiring minds want to know !!!
It's NOT THE GUN, It's the Mentally Deranged ....Scheesh !!!
He's already shot 3 Cops, one died so far....This crazy has nothing to lose...he knows what happens to Cops in Prison....This will not end well....
I just read his entire 11,000+ word manifesto. Some people keep referring to him as a raving lunatic. Sounds to me like he was a good cop and veteran that is tired of the 'Blue Wall' and the injustices served on the people by bad cops. I'm not saying I condone what he is doing, but I think I can understand WHY he is doing it.
And of course since SHE was the training officer (more time on the job), they believed her, after all, she had more time on the job and probably lied better to cover police brutality.
I bet these LA Cops are going to have fun killing him. Keep his side of the story a mystery, and manipulate anything else he may have said, or written.
Exactly, but for some reason I believe most people would believe everyone, except him!!!!
@DiggernNE
My apologies. Lack of morning coffee (it was still brewing) and dirty reading glasses!! Damn these things! Coffee is good and glasses cleaned!
@Ian in Calgary
Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
"Lakeview Terrace"
an ex employee left with no recourse committing murders seeking revenge/justice for loosing his job, which look like have destroyed his lifetime working career. in his mind he has nothing to loose, he already lost everything. he is not the only ex employee who have gone berserk killing those he/she believed responsible in ruining his/her career.
Come on people (Mister X, Chepe V)! He may have gotten a raw deal (I don't know and you don't either), but to kill people who are not involved (the daughter of someone he alleges was involved in his firing and her boyfriend) for revenge is simply wrong no matter if you think his motive is justifiable or think you might "understand" it. He believes he's going to get his good name back? By his actions he has demonstrated he is a nut and should have been let go. How in the world does this freak think he will somehow come out the hero here? He needs to be hunted down and captured as soon as possible. But, he has Martyr's Syndrome and will probably end up forcing the police to kill him. Don't excuse nuts.
Hummmmmmmmmmmmm .........."In the manifesto -- addressed to "America" and titled "Last Resort" -- Dorner writes that the "horrendous murders" are "a necessary evil."
Seems like he thinks and acts just like our high government officials & Dexter .... By secret killings they are just doing the dirty work .... someone needs to do it, innocence doesn't matter, nothing does except what they think .... the justice system just isn't up to the job...
Really chepe?? You don't blame him for going out and killing 3 people because he was wronged?? So you think it's ok he killed those people...Wow..Thought I've read some stupid stuff on the Vine, but this is close to the top....
No one will know why he was fired until the Department comes out and says why..until then we can sith here and pretend we know and make stupid comments about it....
Mike why should he have any guns taken away except his service weapon?? So he was fired...He didn't get fired for commiting a felony or a violent crime...
Guessing he's not taking the whole; Someone has to be the fall guy, sorry it was you idea very well.
LOL.....From the looks of the cop holding the shotgun, I doubt if he'll have to "force" them to kill him. Cops love killing cop killers!!!
@Chuck - I agree that his killing of innocent people is both wrong and sad. He is beyond the point of getting his name back. If you read his manifesto, his thought process is that all a man has is his name. And when he stood up to the injustices being served on the people of LA by the LAPD, they ruined his name. And I get what he is saying..... When you hear 'Charles Manson', 'Ted Bundy', et al.....what comes to mind? What horrible people they are/were. When you hear 'Mother Theresa', what comes to mind? So his thinking (however twisted it may be) is logical.
He is not looking to be a 'hero' - he knows that will never happen. He is looking to change the veil of secrecy and conspiracy that is rampant within the LAPD. I believe his comments about the station being built out of glass could not be more true.... after all, that's why they made it out of glass block.
Another nutjob with weapons at his disposal, why am I not surprised? Those psych evals need a thorough rehab! As an ex "insider", he'll be harder to track and take down. 3 cops shot, 1 dead plus two civilians dead, they better hope they get him sooner than later! Another person, with weapons, loose on the streets of Amerikkka. Whatta country! We are regressing instead of progressing.
He deserves what he gets... and with that kind of mentality I'm guessing he deserved what he got when the LAPD let him go.
When a person is too absorbed in their own self-pity to care about how his actions will affect not only those he hates, but innocents surrounding them the person deserves no mercy. He will die... he is too much of a coward to face words and consequences for his actions.
Honor pricks me on. Yea, but how if honor prick me off when I come on? How then? Can honor set to a leg? No. Or an arm? No. Or take away the grief of a wound? No. Honor hath no skill in surgery, then? No. What is honor? A word. What is in that word honor? What is that honor? Air. A trim reckoning! Who hath it? He that died o' Wednesday. Doth he feel it? No. Doth he hear it? No. 'Tis insensible, then? Yea, to the dead. But will it not live with the living? No. Why? Detraction will not suffer it. Therefore I'll none of it. Honor is a mere scutcheon. And so ends my catechism. Falstaff (Shakespeare)
This is a PERFECT opportunity for Holder and obama to try out their new "kill the American terrorist" drones.
Kind of blows the NRA theory that all it takes is a good-guy with a gun to take care of a bad-guy with a gun.
YEP, Blows that theory all to hell!
If you think having a gun is going to keep you from getting killed, tell that to the highly-trained police officers.
Okay, I've read enough of his Manifesto to see it looks like this month he received word that he has lost his Reserve status in the Navy, along with his Security Clearance, both of which he was so proud, because of the determination of the LAPD Board that he lied about a fellow officer using excessive force, the incident which resulted in his firing.
Seems he has been fighting this thing since 2009.
He says the whole thing even destroyed his relationship with his mother
jrae-1215199,
Kind of blows the anti-gun nuts' theory that you just need to call the cops if you're in danger. The cops have shot at two innocent trucks now because they are scared. If there was ever proof that the citizens should be armed, its this story.
never mind....
@jrae-1215199
Also blows away the theory that background checks and psych evals will fix everything! You get both when you apply for the P.D.!
well i think that maybe the lapd did something wrong to dorner employers / supervisors / chiefs and the employees that brown nose think that they can do anything and get away with it
if this is the case you go dorner pick em off all the way to the top i wish i could do the same to the people that have blatantly disrespected me
This is LAPD. They have a history of being violently crazy as a group. Best to get the FBI involved and fast to sort this out and put an end to it.
I wrote the above this morning on this story which has changed to reflect my fears...
They had better take this guy out ASAP! With all his background training, he's like pulling in a 50lb Bass on 10lb test line. Better loosen up on the drag or you'll snap the line and lose 'em...
One thing I can say about you, is the latter of your name is right on..... Get some help & be careful of what you wish for.
Hey "Marta", go peddle your spew somewhere else.
We should give more guns to police officers and take away guns from law abiding citizen, that will fix the problem. /sarcasm
"
well i think that maybe the lapd did something wrong to dorner employers / supervisors / chiefs and the employees that brown nose think that they can do anything and get away with it
if this is the case you go dorner pick em off all the way to the top i wish i could do the same to the people that have blatantly disrespected me
"
And people wonder why things are going downhill in our country. When did this sentiment become acceptable?
Must be a democrat...
Another reason why mental defectives should all be locked up. It couldn't be any shortcomings on your part right?. It has to be everyone else's fault. To be disrespected and justify murder as a correct response it is insane dude. Hope i never come into the weird Video store you probably work in and get the full brunt of your craziness. Seek help.. Stay on the meds..
Must be a democrat...
All of this "INSTITUTIONAL CORRUPTION" where those who actually commit crimes are protected by those at the head of these institutions Must be held responsible for their actions.
When they are not held accountable for their actions and do not pay the price (like the officer that kicked the individual in the head) then it becomes an individual responsibility to ensure that the officer who kicked the individual in the head be held responsible. The only time that the public pay attention is when situations escalate and are taken to a level where individuals are killed.
Don't make it seem as though the cop who's shooting at the police in retaliation is the only one in the wrong, like the media is making him out to be without focusing on those who committed the first wrong.
I do believe he went a bit too far with killing individuals but, who am I to say when they fired this black officer and inflicted a bad reputation on him because he tried to do right.
Demand that the officer who beat the individual be fired or else things like this will continue to occur. Demand that the individual who fired this officer be fired for protecting the corruption within this department.
All of us as well as our families are in jeopardy as long as we continue to allow for individuals in institutions to be protected after they do wrong. Things will continue to escalate beyond this point because people are not afraid to punish individuals for the protected wrongs that are committed just because they are a part of an institution.
When you are part of a government organization it doesn't mean that you are protected from the wrongs that you commit. Your wrongs can get others killed!!!!
And the non action by the public when wrongs like this occur will only continue to place the public in jeopardy.
I don't want for the lives of my family members to be placed in jeopardy because some government official from the police department or in the government believe that they can commit crimes and get away with them because the institution that they work for will protect them.
Clean up this garbage that is within the LAPD!!!!
THE LAPD IS KNOWN FOR THEIR CORRUPTION!!!!
1.9 and 1.10
Alan and Chepe
I assume you are law abiding citizens
I assume you are not somewhere registered as insane
I assume each of you could buy a gun.
That's scary.
That's what's wrong with the second amendment as defined by the NRA
"Well regulated"?
What this ex-cop is doing is wrong - but frankly, I have a hard time thinking he's crazy.
What I think is that he's fed up, and he's not going to take it anymore.
he knows full well this only ends with him dead...thats not the point.
and I think if we give a damn about stopping these kinds of mass shootingings, we have to want to understand WHY they happen in the first place...and stop assuming every person who makes this choice is just straight up mentally ill.
No one would ever call a sniper, like the guy who died in TX a mentally ill nutcase, but he's killed a lot of people. It doesnt take mental illness to kill people.
it takes a belief that you are righting a wrong.
In this case, he's targeting what he thinks are "dirty cops" who screwed him out of a career because he dared try to side with JUSTICE not his BUDDIES.
Again, it's not right to go killing people over a perceived wrong - but a lot of our nations actions contradict that, so here he is...out righting a wrong.
For all he cares, those cops ARE the terrorists destroying america
and I cant say he's wrong.
Hope they catch this guys,
Makes you wonder they type of training mentally going on for officers to justify killing people, in general.
Sometimes it looks like they have systematically devalued the sanctity of human life, maybe if they gave more value to all people it would curtail these types of unjustified murders.
Alright, delete the above, please and find out how to filter this crap from the "serious" posts (well, I agree that's a bit of a stretch)
None of us knows at this point what happened with this guy, but I hope it's OPENLY looked into. (Don't hold your breath.) Not just an IA look, but a REAL investigation. News media -- where are you???
Nothing excuses killing people, innocent or not, but what if this guy was a decent man and good cop (if there is any such thing), and thought he was doing the right thing by exposing abuse in the department? Again, not to excuse what he has allegedly done, but if this was a big cover-up and he was treated unfairly, he's had lots of time to sit and stew about it and to think about his unfair treatment and lack of recourse, because he has no job (and, therefore, probably no money to get help to see him thru this), and his anger has grown.
Well it's not like everybody doesn't know who his targets are. At the very least they can take some kind of action to protect themselves, that's If he remains on course and doesn't start blasting away at the general public. At this point and until he is caught anything can happen.
I can only hope that all public places and schools are taking extra precautions until this guy is caught.
If I where to guess this nut is in a car garage somewhere in the area, laying low & planing his next strike.
@Ferrosynthesis
your assumptions are correct, but don't be scared. I aint gonna shoot ya..Why would I?
Totally unsubstantiated guess of a theory here: He's on a boat, headed for ole Mexico by this point. He is former Navy and his ID was just found in San Diego. Bets anybody?
Square Dude--are you a complete idiot? Everyone has the instinct to kill so no amount of background checks in the world could have prevented something like this or Sandy Hook.
All of you people excusing this man's behavior truly exhibit what is wrong in this country today! There is NO excuse for killing people, especially the innocent. He killed that basketball coach and her fiance because she was related to someone on the LAPD? How evil is THAT???
Where are some of you seeing that he was "fired for telling the truth"? All the article said is that he made the accusation, right after the line that said he was fired for making false statements. So you just automatically believe the word of a crazed gunman that just killed 3 people this week? Did you ever consider that maybe he was the one caught in a lie?
Sounds like some of you need to get your heads check if you say you can't blame him. You can absolutely blame him! Regardless of whether or not he was a scapegoat it doesn't justify the killing of innocent people. And it certainly defeats whatever awareness he is trying to raise by making his enemies into the victims in this situation.
His actions aren't reflective of anyone's corruption but his own. No one forced him to shoot others. That was HIS choice!
Jessica:
First of all you don't know that to be true. Although the LAPD does not have the best reputation, there was an investigation and we are not privvy to the events leading up to this action although you appear to be more than willing to accept this manifesto. Secondly, does someone you know have any reason to 'right a wrong' you have done to them? (Bad performance rating, firing, argument, etc). I guess it would be acceptable for them to pick off your family members as long as they feel they are righting a wrong.
It does say in the article why he was fired.
He joined the Los Angeles Police Department in 2005 and was fired for making false statements in 2008.
DingleB
As reported by CNN he tried and failed to take a boat here in San Diego on Sunday.
First, I urge you not to comment until you read his "manifesto" (wow the media is already trying to vilify this guy with that connotation).
I believe every word this guy is saying. He had the misfortune of being a straight arrow in a corrupt system. I dare anyone in similar circumstances not to feel the same level of anger he so eloquently expresses. I realize it's difficult to side with this guy without sounding like a nut, but ...
I hope all the people that wronged this guy, and especially the ones that are named in his farewell letter, take inventory of their lives and make a change when this all inevitably ends. I have no doubt they are @!$%#ting in their pants just about now. This guy sounds like a badass and he is coming to get you. Isn't that the premise of all of the action/revenge movies out there?
To Jessica:
Impressed by your post, very smart, good thinking...Best post i have read so far in this gruesome story; the key point is to understand how this officer/soldier/hero of our nation, at least until exposed in the media by his actions, how is that he sees them others doing harm to our society; isn't that the exact thing we as nation did when we went after bin laden? killing the one or those in his organisation responsible for attacks on American citezens?...he is doing the same and he is as "insane" as those defending our country's values and liberty at this very moment? including his fellow police officers who are NOT crooked?
If George Washington would not "condone" his man executing redcoats, we would not be here commenting on this post today would we? those man to whom we owe these liberties were also, as far as the redcoats were concerned a terrorist, a lunatic a maniac and a mantal unstable fellow!
Only prepared minds can understand and see through the fog of lies the media and other organisations throw at us!!
Well I guess he wasn't much of sailor than.
@iknowzero "If you think having a gun is going to keep you from getting killed, tell that to the highly-trained police officers."
LOL you really know nothing. How else do you stop a person who is intent on killing you? Maybe if they all held hands, baked some smores, and sang Cumbaya those cops would not be dead moron. Maybe if they had a bullet proof car or eyes in the back of their head they could have known that they were going to be ambushed. Cops are highly trained at stuff other then "drive bys" and being "ambushed".
Guess who is highly trained at those things? Gang members and drug dealers are. They know not to sit at stop lights for very long and always take right turns even if it takes them longer to get where they are going. It is safer, but you know zero and love to talk chit like so many others.
Had they "known" they were going to get ambushed they would have stood a fighting chance since they are armed with almost equal tools. If you do not have time to use the tool that makes you equal to others then that is a problem. A good sniper can drop you dead and you would not even hear the bullet before it hit you or even be able to react. A bad one might miss however and might not kill me giving me time to react. IF ONLY I HAD A F***ING TOOL THAT MADE ME EQUAL TO THE PERSON THAT IS SHOOTING AT ME AND WANTS TO KILL ME...IF ONLY.
/begin rant
If you cannot stop drugs and people from getting into this country you are not going to stop guns from entering this country either, GET IT THROUGH YOUR F***ING HEADS. Stop American manufactures from making certain guns and magazines and foreign countries will step in to fill the demand plain and simple. Good job on sending even more American money overseas instead of helping out our economy. I wonder if Russia will stop making AKs or 30 round mags for them, Glock, H&K, etc. or if Iran will stop making drones if we ban/outlaw them for example?
Maybe do something about what makes people get pissed off in the first place and flip the f*** out instead of blaming a tool. Maybe stop pushing people's buttons on purpose, messing with their emotions, backing them into corners, etc. and they would never start killing people in the first place.
Want to get rid of gangs then legalize drugs and remove the profits. Without profits they could not sustain themselves, but as long as there is tons of money to be made then there will still be violent gangs that will do whatever it takes to get their share of the pie just like many corporations do.
Remove the rewards and magically people start acting better towards each other, but that is to easy and simple. As long as people get rewarded for acting, doing, or behaving in a certain way THEY WILL. STOP REWARDING BAD BEHAVIOR.
/end rant
Wow that is one crazy MoFo. The police have a war on their hands.
well said JM
When you take away guns from law abiding citizens, only politicians and police will have guns--do you feel safer now? Why?
JM, I read his manifesto, and now I KNOW he's crazy. He makes some valid points. So did Ted Kaczynski.
Of the many reasons why this guy is more than crazy is his inability to understand reasonable response. To him, the old childhood mantra of "sticks and stones" has become:
Sticks and stones may break my bones, but use the n-word in my presence, and I'll put a "Winchester Ranger SXT 9mm 147 grain bullet in his skull and Officer xx's skull". (quoted from the manifesto)
I believe LAPD knew this guy had the capability of becoming unhinged and used trumped up charges and lies to get rid of him. They saw he was a liability, but they created their own liability by lying to get rid of him. Perfect case of two wrongs don't make it right.
LAPD should of done better screaning like if they belong to actual racist groups and if internal investigation discovers it later then fire those officers for their affilation with racist groups that call for exterminating others
Harold,
I believe you mis-attributed a quote to me. I never said he wasn't "nuts". I said it's "hard to side with this guy without sounding like a nut, but ...", which I still stand by.
I do believe he snapped, but that does not mean it's without merit. Have you ever been in a situation where you are so angry you've wanted to break someone's neck? Of course we don't go through with it, but the feelings of vengefulness stick around. Well, this guy has the means and the will to go there. And the people that screwed him are wearing diapers just about now.
Watch this video and tell me if you still think the department is blameless: www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVmGWLsn0iM
It is UNBELIEVABLE to me that some of you people are saying HE'S the victim! Who cares WHY he's pissed? What I care about is what he's doing with his anger! Corruption is EVERYWHERE! That does NOT give him a right to kill innocent people! Does he have a right to be angry, YES! Does he have a right to kill people??? Hell no!!!
Catch this menace and end him before he has a chance to harm anyone else! I live in Cali and we have schools on lock-down out here because of this nut job!
Shame on those of you making him out to be a victim! Morons
Do any of you armchair moralists and philosophers care about the murder of the 28-year-old woman and her 27-year-old fiance?
Justly aggrieved or not, this man murdered two young people who did nothing to him. Would any of you excuse the deaths of your loved ones at his hands?
It's one thing to bear a grudge; it's another to take revenge on the families of one's enemies.
Where are your moral values?
Jrae & Sandie, it does NOT blow the theory that a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun at all. Nobody said that you can necessarily stop the bad guy before he kills anyone or that the bad guy can't make a stealth move against an armed person. It just means that if there was an armed person nearby when the killer was shooting at the others, they could very well stop him before he does MORE damage.
REGARDLESS of his past treatment.... there is NO reason for him to KILL someone to make his point....
That boy is on a mission...reminds me of that Rambo movie where Rambo destroys the towns entire police force!
If LAPD was smart..they better not use their police radio's.
The suspect was fired for telling on a fellow officer for police brutality. Why would he lie about that?? Chances are very strong that this was a good man who saw the ugly underbelly of the LAPD. Police have one of the hardest jobs on Earth, that is a fact. But for this man to be fired for being a careing human being is wrong, dead wrong. He has snapped, and it is all a very sad day. I have seen my share of police brutality, from the "60's" to the present and it is not a pretty sight. When police start to stop the public from tapeing their actions on I Phones, you are living in a sick dictatorship no better than any third world country. Weed out the sick cops, stop their clandestined actions and that will be a start. Too bad this man went mental, but people better start asking questions before the government is called the politboro....
Scary but this guy really looks a lot like LL COOL J!
Please, we need to contact the nearest CSI department... Las Vegas maybe? N.Y and Miami are too far!! :)
This EX COP was accused by the LA PD of lying and falsefying statements after he snitched on a female officer that bruttally abused and beat a person with mental dissabilities that they were arresting. They say he went to court for the charges and lost because the LA PD stood by the female cop even after the victims father had indeed said that his son had signs of being beaten and abused...Looks like the coverup, corruption and lies within the LA Police Department is to blame for this.
Looks like LL Cool J? Well, tell us what his victims look like then.
Here they are: http://abcnews.go.com/US/slain-irvine-california-couples-death-mystery-police/story?id=18413611
"Too bad he went mental"? Yeah, too bad...considering that two "unmental" people are dead. "Why would he lie about that?" I don't know - why would he kill civilians over the truth?
Do people hate the government/the police/whatever so much here that they dismiss the murders of the very people that they claim to be defending in their grievances against the government/the police/whatever?
That's how Timothy McVeigh thought.
Keep on enjoying yourselves. I am heartbroken over this couple.
Stay safe Southern California, the cops are trigger happy right now.
@Ferrosynthesis-3490482 Here is something to help you out on what exactly well-regulated means.
The purpose of the 2nd Amendment is to allow the people the ability to fight by against a tyrannical government.
A. The Federalist Papers, No. 28: Alexander Hamilton expressed that when a government betrays the people by amassing too much power and becoming tyrannical, the people have no choice but to exercise their original right of self-defense — to fight the government.[Halbrook, p. 67]
B. The Federalist Papers, No. 29: Alexander Hamilton explained that an armed citizenry was the best and only real defense against a standing army becoming large and oppressive. [Halbrook, p. 67]
C. The Federalist Papers, No. 46: James Madison contended that ultimate authority resides in the people, and that if the federal government got too powerful and overstepped its authority, then the people would develop plans of resistance and resort to arms. [Halbrook, p. 67]
D. There was no National Guard, and the Founders opposed anything but a very small national military. The phrase “well-regulated” means well-trained and disciplined — not “regulated” as we understand that term in the modern sense of bureaucratic regulation. [This meaning still can be found in the unabridged Oxford English Dictionary, 2d ed. 1989, Vol 13, p. 524, and Vol 20. p. 138.]
E. The Federalists promised that state governments and citizen militias would exist to make sure the federal military never became large or oppressive. To say that the National Guard replaces the notion of the militia runs contrary to what the Founders said and wrote.
F. The Third Amendment: Expressly restrains the federal government from building a standing army and infiltrating it among the people ...and at the people’s expense ... in times of peace. The Third Amendment runs against the idea of a permanent standing army or federalized National Guard in principle, if not by its words.
*********
CHALLENGE TO AMERICANS
As you read the Constitution and the Bill of Rights:
And then consider that law students and future lawyers likewise have received precious little education about the Second Amendment.
Realize, too, that the judges know just about as little. Then imagine how little the average American knows — based on the average public school coverage of the Constitution.
The protection of our sacred right of self-defense against both petty criminals and oppressive government — the right of civilians to keep and bear arms — is in your hands.
http://jpfo.org/filegen-n-z/six-about-2nd.htm
Having a gun for private protection is to give yourself a fighting chance in the face of a determined threat against you or your family. There are no guarantees; but better a fighting chance than none at all.
He sounds like he's a punisher wannabe killing off relatives, and seeking justice and what not. I'm not in agreement with what he's doing, but finally police corruption is in the spotlight even if he's considered the corruption.
as shown by the statement below, this is an obvious pattern for losers like this guy. they always blame others and the world for their mistakes.
it is nobody else's fault for YOUR MISTAKES, he lied and made false statements in reports, and then blames others for getting in trouble for it. The very definition of a LOSER.
"I never had the opportunity to have a family of my own, I’m terminating yours," Dorner wrote in his rambling manifesto, addressing LAPD officials he blamed for ruining his career.
"Look your wives/husbands and surviving children directly in the face and tell them the truth as to why your children are dead."
people like this should not be in society. when he was fired for what he did, he should not have been released to society as a civilian. he was a dirty cop, period, and when dirty cops are found, they should not only be fired but they should also not be allowed in society as a civilian. this guy should already be in jail or prison.
TO: Mister X-2515301 who wrote:
The manifesto must have been taken down, maybe because a lot of people were reading it and sympathizing with the guy or something.
I'm not saying this guy is right to kill anybody, let alone people who had nothing to do with his firing. What I am saying is that given the reputation of the LAPD (racism/ corruption/ brutality), you can't help feeling like they (the LAPD), with their years of breaking the very laws they're sworn to uphold, planted the seeds for something like this to happen. Police departments across the country need to realize that your reputation is one of the most important weapons you have in your arsenal. Killing people is the wrong way to go about righting a perceived wrong, but in his mind he's just trying to shed light on the ill that he feels was done to him. I'd say he's somewhat succeded at that, if at nothing else.
Another Mentally Ill with a gun. Sadly its made worse by his obvious emmersion in the "victim" mentality this administration has fostered over and over and over and no doubt is part of the reason hi "manifesto" goes all the way back to a racial slur in first grade! Give me a break, what kid remembers anything from first grade. But of late everything has been called racist and those in power have been the worst offenders of using this rediculous and dangerous method of gaining power. Now, see the effects happen, but sadly they won't change, just use this as an excuse to keep trying to take the lawful citizen's guns and add any retired or ex cop to those they don't want to have guns, just like they tried to take gun rights from ex soldiers. Very dangerous idiots we have in charge.
And American Girl I am sure those sympathysing with him are part of the huge "poor mistreated me" this administration has fostered for the sole reason of getting votes from people easily influenced by thier victim upbringing.
Screening their applicants?? This guy was a model employee. He was on the cover of the LAPD newsletter.
He got fired for reporting his boss for abuse of a suspect. He's a whistle blower.
OK, so obviously he's lost it or never even had it.
I think this says more about the quality of applicants that are interested in a career in law enforcement and the need to lower their standards to fill vacancies than it does about screening.
We are going to see a downward spiral and more and more violent acts from behind the badge as time goes on and the increased risk of getting shot decreases the interest of well adjusted individuals.
And if he storms a bus and kidnaps a young child, and holds the kid in an underground bunker, you'll still be saying, "I'm not agreeing with him, BUT..."
I have traveled widely and this is still the least corrupt nation on earth. Go to Mexico sometime if you want corrupt police! Go to South America. There are some countries on this planet where you do not even smile at a police officer or say "hello" (as I made the mistake of doing in Paris).
Oh, what's the use? I keep trying to bring this back to being about people, and you guys just want to talk abstractions and ideologies and corruption. All of you "Yeah, but"s remind me of the pastor who just apologized for participating in the Sandy Hook ecumenical service because it corrupted his phoney-baloney theology!
Purity uber alles!
When the bombing in Oklahoma City happened, I hugged my loved ones. When 9-11 happened, I hugged my loved ones. I feel like hugging them now. That's what I call a normal reaction.
Aren't police routinely tested for Psych fitness?
If so, I can see how the Psych tests people want civilian gun owners to undergo will really stop killings.
American girl, how can ANYONE sympathize what this man has done? He murdered innocent people for his own purposes. Regardless of why he was fired, whether it was right or wrong, there was no cause for this at all.
My heart goes out to the families and friends of this mans victims. I hope they catch this man, and you get some justice.
related story: cops shot two (black?) women delivering newspaper in Torrance. obviously unarmed. how the hell did they mistake a black woman for him? looks like the cops are not interested in "questioning" since they shot unarmed suspects now.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2013/02/ex-cop-manhunt-newspaper-delivery-women-shot.html
BLACK PEOPLE, STAY INSIDE YOUR HOUSE!!!
He's trying to facilitate change in the LAPD by murdering people? Where is his head? I hope he's caught before anyone else is hurt or killed.
Um, hate to burst your bubble, but while the U.S. usually ranks in the top 15% of least corrupt nations, there are other countries that do better. Canada, the Nordic countries, Singapore, Hong Kong, tend to show up ahead of the U.S. in several studies on corruption. But I would say that for a large, populous country, the U.S. does pretty well on managing corruption, and I think this is due, in part, to a free press.
I just read the Dorner manifesto. If you google/bing Christopher Dorner Manifesto it comes up. 9 pages of truly eye opening information if what he states is correct. LAPD being corrupt? Say it isn't so. Not cool to kill people only to make a point but it takes place every day across the nation. Not just LA.
markl323
Nissan Titan drivers STAY HOME!!
Black Nissan Titan Drivers...you're screwed.
Um, I would not say that giving me knowledge that corrects a statement of mine "bursts my bubble." In fact, I appreciate being corrected, but perhaps you could preface your comment more politely next time?
Also, I would never refer to a librarian and an internationally published writer who travels a lot as living in a "bubble."
When did it become acceptable to be so casually rude, Me-683854?
When it became acceptable to sympathize with a man who wrote a manifesto then shot two innocent people, as is my original point?
Under the new proposed drone law, that car that wasn't his could have been struck by a missile since it was "suspected" to be him. Then the two innocent people inside would just be dead instead of wounded. The same could have been done to that motel room he wasn't in. The government wouldn't have to justify any of it to us.
markl323
It seems like the cops are rampaging with paranoid hysteria down there. These cops need to man up and stop shooting anything that moves.
Amused Muse
I appreciate you. Can I have a hug too?
Absolutely, DingleB! ;-)
Google: KTLA TV. They have their Sky Cam all over this. Live.
Thanks. I feel better already. Right back at ya. 'sup girl?
Looks like he has taken to the hills, he's going Red Dawn!
...with all due respect to the victims.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2013/02/burning-truck-may-belong-to-fugitive-ex-cop.html
This is what happens when the thin blue line is crossed and why corruption is encouraged and is so prevalent in law enforcement. Those reporting the bad behavior of others are the ones punished by being fired.
I'm sure that a lot of people have grievances. I have one myself, being that a very privileged princess at my former job tried for six years to drum me, a first generation college graduate, out of the workplace by tattling, backstabbing, and sabotaging my work, and my supervisor was so enamored of this insubordinate control freak rich spoilt brat that she was constantly disciplining me without even hearing me out. (That all changed when we were restructured and it was revealed how many mistakes Control Freak was actually making that she blamed on me.) This b*tch could not even let up while I was watching my father die. She spent two days crying over how I formatted peel-off nametags, instead.
So, do I feel aggrieved? Sure. Did I ever think of going after her with a gun? No, in fact, I had a nightmare that she came after me with one. What I did do is plan my escape, which included a "I understand that she is young and inexperienced but the time has come for her to grow up" talk with my supervisor. I came out smelling like roses, whereas people actually don't like her very much.
Therefore, while certainly good people can snap, I find it much more likely that those who are angry and immature individuals, and who tend to project their faults onto others, also tend to act out against others, while those who are introverts and sensitive may tend to be anxious and introspective rather than outwardly violent.
I don't suppose that it ever occurred to the shooter sympathizers here that while they think they are being iconoclasts in their comments about his manifesto, they are actually succumbing to groupthink and group behavior that plagues most online forums, and are puting aside their individuality, not a small part of which is empathy for this nut's victims? (I'm a forum moderator as well.)
One wonders if all of the shooter sympathizers here have the conviction to die for this man's manifesto, instead of just striking a contrarian pose behind their avatars?
I didn't think so.
Wonder why there's no PHOTO of this man in a POLICE uniform? Does MSNBC hate the military?
Law enforcement tends to hire many with military backgrounds and have difficulty transitioning from viewing everyone as the enemy during tours of war and coming home policing civilian fellow citizens.
It appears he was pushed past an already fragile breaking point.
This guy sacrificed his ideals the moment he went on a killing spree. Getting fired clearly does not justify murder.
It is very likely that this man had schizophrenia or paranoia, and felt that the whole world was plotting against him. But paranoia is visible to people around you, so they react negatively to paranoia--thus justifying the paranoia. Eventually it reaches a level where reality itself takes on a hostile shape, and you are filled with anger and a desire for revenge.
By acting this way, he suggests that the past event of a fellow officer kicking someone in the head was imagined and fake. Maybe he believed it was true, and that was why they thought he was lying. My point is that by acting in an irrational manner he does not gain credibility. He is a threat to everyone because he feels that everyone is in on the "conspiracy".
square dude Total kook, but a dangerous one. Sounds like if he was ex LAPD they need to do a better job of screening their applicants.
Debi-1314897 Law enforcement tends to hire many with military backgrounds and have difficulty transitioning from viewing everyone as the enemy during tours of war and coming home policing civilian fellow citizens. It appears he was pushed past an already fragile breaking point.
Some people have had trouble transitioning from combat to civilian life. That would include police hires, among hundreds of other occupations.
However, and unfortunately, there is no know method to accurately test for or screen for dishonorable intentions and cowardice.
This person is Other Than Honorable, and a coward. This guy joins the ranks of many who "passed all the tests," but ended up being unacceptable as a human being. I hope he decides on another shoot out with the police, and a police sniper with a Barret .50 caliber gives him a bullet to the head at about a mile distance. That would be a fitting end for this piece of manure...
If this wacko thought that anything was amiss at LAPD he could have gone to the State Attorney or even higher to file a complaint.
Because the LAPD has been under investigation before other agencies would have likely looked at what he had if he had anything at all. He didn't have to go off the deep end and start killing.
There is nothing anyone can say to excuse the action this nut has taken. So you where fired from the job....File a law suit if you where wronged and move on with your life.
I still think he's in a parking garage in the area laying low until night or early morning, if not dead from a self inflicted shot.
Some people are unable to take a step back and realize that they are being irrational, that their anger is taking them too far. We perpetuate the idea that mental illness is taboo, like the plague or something, so no one goes to the psychiatrist. It's a shame because a few prozac might have saved this man and his victims.
It's THURSDAY 5:26PM -- DO YOU KNOW WHERE YOUR crazed Gun Whacko is ?
YOu mean it's 526PM and they haven't found him YET !?? A guy built like him should be ultra easy to find.
Sounds like the guy choose a career that did not match his mental / behavioral characteristics.
Seems like the cops were too scared to care much about shooting the real bad guy.
FINALLY... now you people know NOT TO DRIVE AROUND TOWN AT NIGHT WITH YOUR LIGHTS OUT !!
Turn those damn headlamps ON ! Or else some fraidy-cat cops will shoot at you ! In upscale Torrance, no less.
This is why we should leave the safety of our lives in the hands of the only people the liberals want to have guns! (can you feel the sarcasm here?) Yep, a deranged cop with untold fire power against law abiding unarmed citizens (if the libs get what they want). No thanks, I'll keep my ability to protect my family and myself.
Hope they get him soon. This is like the beltway sniper all over again. Did anyone see the coverage of the two trucks they shot the hell out of that weren't Dorner? Both in Torrance near a protected target. Two women in a small jap truck were delivering newspapers driving without their headlights. Only one was hit and its not bad. They put about 100 bullet holes in the back of the cab and tailgate. It sure doesnt speak well for the 9mm. Std issue. Ive heard from other cops that they have seen 9mm bounce off windshields if from an angle. Wanna bet they ask for 40cal after these photos make the rounds. Another truck was exiting the same subdivision and Torrance cops that it was the truck that was being fired on and they rammed it and shot through the windshield 3X. No deaths, but some new millionaires though. Im guessing those mexican women in the 1st truck think they've hit the lotto. Sure beats delivering newspapers.
its becoming a "POLICE STATE" when all the cops do the killing ,even among themselves ,gun control is useless ,ESPECIALLY when the police fails basic shooting skills and shoots up innocent victims in the back ,gun control is KNOWING YOUR TARGET & whats behind it, the cops who shot up the victims because the car was the same make should be FIRED ,as well as get SUED PERSONALLY from the victims &the police dept should also be held liable for ALL DAMAGES including hospital bills ,loss of income ,stress and for NEW REPLACEMENT VEHICLE as its bullet riddled ,the victims should get the chance to shoot up the police cars as revenge &stress release too as payback ,take it out of those officers paycheck !
Killing is wrong, under any circumstances, but I believe we need to heed the messages being sent that people are past their breaking points and have had enough and are willing to take action.
No one is immune.
Twenty minutes later, in Riverside, he ambushed two cops stopped at a red light. One officer was killed and the other is in stable condition.
This goes to show, contrary to what the NRA would have you believe, the "good guys" don't always win - even if armed and trained.
run dorner run and hide regroup and become a master at disguise and fight a nother day
This is getting funny, well not really:
Cops shooting 2 females delivering newspapers at 05:30 in the morning, IN THE BACK!!!!
That's some bad, ass kicking cops!!!!!
I hope they sue the @!$%# out of LAPD!!!!
@AmusedMuse Your story of being aggrieved doesn't really reach the scale of what he allegedly had to take. Imagine instead of your co-worker just sabotaging you you saw her regularly beating mentally ill, poor or ethnic people and then laughing about it, then you going to try to report that and everyone taking her side and then not only firing you but later getting you fired from your next job. And then she gets promoted and you know that she and all the others continue to regularly beat mentally ill, poor and ethnic people and laugh about it.
The killing he's doing is of course wrong, but it is not just a common workplace rivalry that supposedly drove him to this point.
1. Damn the collapsing of comments! I get irritated having to click one..by one..by one..to expand.
2. This guy may have some problems in the head, however, who makes stuff like this up? I do not believe he is lying.
3. That is no excuse for killing innocent people, or anyone for that matter.
4. I know for a fact that yes, there are corrupt cops out there, everywhere. Doesn't mean all of them, but they're out there.
5. If I witnessed police brutality and corruption, reported it, got fired and my name slandered, I might have my panties in a wad too.
6. If he is trying to exact some kind of vengeance, why not go for the people he says are corrupt, why is he killing their innocent families, he is only making himself the monster when in fact, he might have started out the opposite. Too late now.
7. My condolences to the victims and the victims' families.
8. I get it, I really do, but how in the hell can you, as a cop, go out and shoot the hell out of some vehicle that "looks suspicious" thereby shooting up two old ladies delivering newspapers!?! Tensions may be high, but dayum! I hope each of those ladies gets $5 Mil a piece.
9. Hope he chronicled, with as much evidence as possible, the so-called corruption he witnessed within the LAPD. I have a feeling he will be smoked soon and if he's the only one that knows this stuff, it will all have been for nothing.
10. Again, may the innocent victims in all of this mess find peace soon.
little chris dorner sat in the corner...putting names on his score card each day...all the police couldn't find him...and they nearly blew 2 asian ladies away...
Reminds me of the movie"The Running Man"
ahh. The new latest and greatest misleading data. Number of people shot. Actually the stat is number of people injured by a firearm but hey, it doesn't sound as good so we'll assume its people shot.
I don't know one person that has handled a firearm regularly that hasn't been injured in some way. burns from touching the barrel, slammed hands from the slide, hitting themselves in the head with the firearm, harming themselves reassembling or cleaning them. All without being hit by a bullet or shrapnel. Most don't need formal medical attention. HECK the Lapd seems to have injured at least 3 people with a firearm just yesterday if not more by shooting at the wrong vehicles. How many of those officers shooting reported being harmed with flying brass or scrapes by the moving mechanical parts of the firearm? Maybe we need to try to be a little more honest here?
I don't know one person who, in the course of their lives hasn't cut themselves with a knife.
A person that drives a motorcycle regularly that hasnt burned themselves on a motorcycle exhaust
A mechanic that hasn't injured themselves when working on a car.
This whole turning injury by firearm into number of people being shot is absolutely stupid, it takes just about every bit of credibility out of the argument.
Try to be intellectually honest folks.
You should also take out anyone that shot themselves on purpose. Like the guy that shot out his testicle on purpose and posted it on you tube? You're going to count people like that in your "statistic"? Really?
One day man might become mature enough to actually have a reasonable intelligent discussion without making up lies and misleading people with numbers like this.
liberalsare: "Jap"? You don't know when you're giving it away, do you? Darwin's been on vacation.
From what I gather he uses the same logic the Government uses to justify Drone strikes.
So if your OK with Drone strikes then you must be OK with what he is doing.
@LookingForwardtotheFuture,
Regarding your post #1.89....................Thanks for sharing that. You have a gift for this sort of thing please keep writing and sharing more of our common history and your knowledge. I wish that I could give your post 100 votes.
This is one of the few that I copy and save.
Regards and Best Wishes,
Brandon
Funny that most of you that are giving the old "poor baby" crap are first to say give him the benefit of the doubt in regards to his plight yet are also the first to vilify the LAPD and the officer he accused w/o knowing ANY of the details in regards to that...Have you read that other officers AND other citizens never saw the officer kick or hit that guy and that he only had a scrape mark on his face from when he fell into a bush?? I mean if you get kicked and hit like this psycho claimed ya think there'd be more markings??
But but that'd mean he lied...*GASP* Not the cop killing psycho!!!
More Violence with Guns Tell me it aint so.
You're boring.
But, wait. Isn't it all the anti gunners out there screaming that only the cops and military should have guns? It's people like this, who abuse power and authoriuty, legally armed Americans need protection from just as much as from the felons.
@ Ranknfile
We may not appreciate your comment, but your sycophant Liberal friends will.
So ... instead of "some" control over who is out there shooting people, you want "no" control over who is out there shooting people. Do I have that right?
Wow chuckzul: Back to the wild west, perfect solution.
chuckzul, you NRA Kool Aid sippers will take anything to promote your gun crazed life style.
What would you have done, out draw them and kill them with single shots each?
Spare me, you are nothing but a pro-gun-dip-chit.
What is sad, is there are a lot of peeps like YOU out there with guns. That is scary.. Now STFU!!
@ Porter Rockwell
Just like criminals, you consider laws against murder, no controls.
Do I have that right?
@ TruthNow
Gun crazed Lifestyle
It's no worse than your welfare crazed lifestyle.
TruthNow1226, you act like everyone that owns guns are "NRA Kool Aid sippers"???? What about you empty headed fools that would rather live in a country, with the new Hitler in the White House! Actually the Kool Aid sippers are people like you that do not see past the fact that the resident is black. He hates you, he hates me and he HATES AMERICA!!!!! Those of us,with our guns, will be defending you defenseless numbnuts when things get really ugly! We will do it because you have the right to your opinion (that is if it is your opinion and not what the media is brainwashing you with) as we have the right to ours!
Allenna, you are the best reason I can think of to own a gun. Seek mental health treatment. Keep the tin hat on until you can receive the help.
You aian't takin my guns---( NOTE CONFEDERATE FLAG ON SHIRT )--You yankees tryed that in 1861-1865--when you yankees came south to kill men--women--children--and to burn our cotton fields--we had free labor--and the help got a ham once a week--go back north yankee--we do not need your money here in Florida
GJBMD,
Oh you are a wild west historian? Please tell me about all these shootings that took place during the time. How out of control was the murder rate then? Oh, you just got your history from western films and didnt know that mass shootings and murders of innocent people, and violent crime in general were way lower than now?
Alan
You are a humorist, sorry about my earlier post. I thought you were serious.
The NRA and gun lobby like nuts with guns. They may say that they are against them, but it's what sells guns. People like Allenna are their justification for rational people to have guns. You're all falling in line with their strategy. Keep it up. More people dead before their time and more guns sold. Good business for Smith and Wesson and the undertakers!
Allenna..hear hear..you go and tell him as it is..I side your post 150%! well said!
Alan Fischer you are the most disgusting and vile troll I've seen on the Vine - ever. I hope Django finds you some day.
Django had better get his tail up North if he knows what is good for him. Real life ain't no Tarintino movie!
Oh my God, must I separate you now?
Must have an NRA member/Tea Partier ...
Not all people who use guns are NRA members/Tea Partiers. And not all cops are NRA members/Tea Partiers.
I was being sarcastic, as that kind of specious insinuating comment is what the media and anti-gun groups always like to make.
As a matter of hard core fact.... NRA members rarely ever commit crimes involving guns... and we can tell by your "Tea Partier" adage that you are a "libby kook" which have a much higher percentage of violent crime.
As a matter of hard core fact.... NRA members rarely ever commit crimes involving guns... and we can tell by your "Tea Partier" adage that you are a "libby kook" which have a much higher percentage of violent crime.
Sarcasm is lost on some people, PoorBustard.
Folks, you must admit that PoorBustard's comment could have been EITHER sarcasm or sincere until he clarified it. Some people actually believe that what he intended as sarcasm is true. More people than I would care to admit, judging by comments I have been reading on gun control the last several months.
He couldn't have been in the Tea Party...he's black
u need to read his manifesto...he supports anti-gun laws. Incidentally, if the LAPD want the killings to stop all they have to do is 'confess'. So instead of accidentally shooting 2 women putting out newspapers that happened to have a truck similar to Dorners they need to hold a press conference and do what he has demanded so no one else gets hurt. Simple really.
Also in his manifesto - He's a proponent of Liberals and also of Obama.
This dude has some serious issues for sure, but how many more like him are out there, just like him, on the verge of exploding? ALOT! Here is a guy who was obviously wronged out of his job with the LAPD and just friggin snapped. Do not get me wrong, I am not condoneing what he has done, but to a certain point, when you take away a policemans career, from what sounds like some bull @!$%#, you have created a monster. The truth is, cops have huge ego's. Why do you think there cops? You take that away and make them feel like they have a score to settle? Good luck! Sounds to me like you could add a few more pages to standard psych evaluation questionaire. Good luck catching this guy, he will NEVER surrender.
Guns don't kill people. People with deep-seated mental problems with guns kill people.
Guns don't kill people, bullets do.
An angry black man... With a gun? Did he move to L.A. from Chicago?
@ Baddog
Axes don't kill people, axe blades do.
Axes don't chop wood, guns do.
OK, so he HAPPENS to be angryand black. Adam Lanza was angry and white. What is your point Lee-936758 because I fail to see it. UNLESS, ohhh, I see. You were attempting to be funny. NOT!
@Sandie-644591
And your point was?
ha ha hah
Hey Sandie-644591,i have to give you that one,that was a bad example for him to use.But weather you like to admit it or not,there are curtain patterns that differences races generally follow.And i am not a racist for the one's going to jump down my throat,but it is fact.Blacks are more prone to,drive by shootings and killing innocent people and armed robberies gone bad.And wont hesitate to just shoot you period in the street.But white people plan out that "Im going to take out as many as i can that dont even deserve it"crap.Hespanics fall under the black cadigory,but have a place to go run(Mexico) to hide out.
Sandie can't see, is your tin foil hat covering your eyes? Kool-aid overdose?
@OldDog47........maybe you are getting a little TOO old, dog. My point was that why bring up the race of the person? What difference does that make to anyone. I bet it doesn't make a damn's worth of difference to those killed by this nutjob. Adam Lanza was a white nutjob! SO WHAT!!!!!!! The end result is tragedy all around. What the hell is WRONG with you? Your response to me and/or my post was asinine. Ohhh, I see AGAIN. You all need to leave the comedy to actual comedians!
WTF - hispanics actually fall under the "white" category, from our govt perspective.
but to your point, if you understood - at all, even in the slightest - our nations history...you'd have a good idea of how this reality has come to be.
I know, I know...white people dont like to believe that accumulation of historical events can have ANYTHING at all to do with how things are today.
of course, lets just presume that the accumulation of america's historical events really have nothing to do with it - well todays "black thugs" are no different than Prohibitions white thugs who accounted for all the massive gun deaths and violence in the 20's.
The solution is obvious - end the prohibition on drugs.
But that would make black people into legit business owners like it did for the white gangs of the 20's
And well, we couldnt have a reversal in how we see black people...now could we?
But you are right, black people shoot up other gang members and sometimes innocent people get hit.
White people just become mass murderers, serial killers, mass rapists and child rapists...but we've no need to stereotype them as such, not ALL white people are like that...right?
Let's just start calling black people ANGRY BLACK PEOPLE
and white people CRAZY WHITE PEOPLE
the shoes fit, right?
@lee-936758 and W.T.F.101.......I place you both in the same "cadigory"! And that is, literally, so appropriate that I can hardly believe it! Isn't it time for both of you to have your naps? And one of you desperately needs to learn how to spell! Uh, that would be you W.T.F.101, just in case you did not know.
THANK YOU Jessica-1170252. Thank you very much.
Jessica-1170252
You really think that by legalizing drugs gang members would open up shops and run legitimate tax paying business? That there would be no turf war?
You do know that they have legalized marijuana in some states, but you don't see gang members applying for business licenses to run these shops. Por que?
PS: I don't like your stereotypical response of black people as gang members. You stated "end prohibition on drugs...that would make black people legitimate business owners..." There are white, asian, and hispanic gangs that could also become legitimate business owners if your theory is right. But as I stated above, it ain't. Como?
Thank you Jessica-1170252.
It's sad to think that there will come a day when history is sanitized to the point where no one remembers. It's even sadder because now, nobody seems to care.
Phinster66, I see your point but it ignores the fact that while all of these other races are doing the same thing, if you view the incarceration rates in this country it's as if blacks are under a microscope - doing prison time for things every race does. If alcohol were still illegal, I doubt the incarceration rates would be much different among blacks even though the Irish and Italians were the power behind the illegal alcohol industry. As for Marijuana being legal in some states, those states still have Federal law to contend with. Once you get past that - as in the War on Drugs is ended, there's still the fact that most of them would be denied business licenses due to some trumped up reason or another. The war on drugs needs to end, not to make legitimate business owners, but to dry up the resources fueling the drug war. Once you could buy alcohol in the store the shootings on the streets between mobsters faded away until Cocaine and other illicit drugs came to the forefront. Slowly, over the past few generations, the power of the mob has faded away. This same thing will happen to the cartels- and by extension, the gangs who profit alongside them.
By the way - I don't believe Jessica was stereotyping all blacks as being gang members. I didn't see that in her comments at all - you did Phinster66, you did. I'm sure I'll catch hell for calling you out for it, but I've had many conversations with people who wanted to be offended by something. Tactic: Pick one word or one statement that you can twist or take to mean something else or ignore the spirit of the conversation in favor of being offended by one aspect. Then you can point righteous fury at that sentence, ignoring the overall point and changing the conversation to suit your agenda.
I've seen it dozens of times - on this vine no less. So how about I throw it back at you - why do you think gang members are incapable of opening legitimate businesses without it turning into a turf war? Why do you think gang members can't organize? The Ballistreri's were gang members and opened legitimate businesses (some are still operational today - I shop at them). Capone, Lanksy, and countless others are seemingly celebrated in film and folklore these days. They were gangbangers - that's it.
It's interesting how back in Reagan California everyone wanted to get guns off the streets because of the Black Panters, and now it seems everyone wants to be armed because our government isn't what you'd like it to be, or how you'd like it to look.
Oh man. Look genius: If you legalize drugs the gangs that are formed around drug funding will SHRINK, s they won't be able to match the funding elsewhere. The mafia shrank dramatically in size and power after the end of alcohol Prohibition. Crime rates plummeted. The murder rate plummeted. Alcohol use went up among adults, but alcoholism rates went down because children had to be carded when it was legalized and alcohol content was normalized by the industry (percentage of alcohol became uniform).
IN 1920-1921(the year alcohol bans were enacted) the crime rate soared 24%. Over the 13 years of Prohibition, 1920-1933, the crime rate went up 78%. The year they legalized alcohol again, in 1933, in just 12 months the MURDER RATE fell 40%.
Over 51% of all murders in the USA, including 51% of all gun murders, are ditrectly linked to the illegalization of drugs. Go add up the numbers...drug gang murders plus non-gang related murderso ver drugs and drug turf.
Here's a clue, genius: When you outlaw things like drugs (who only directly harm willing adults using them; a victimless crime) you turn over their sale to sociopaths in a black market. These sociopaths can't go to court when they have disputes, because the selling of the substance is illegal...so they solve their disputes how sociopaths do when they can't use dispute resolution services (courts); THEY MURDER EACH OTHER.
If you are concetrned about kids, then legalize, because drug dealers don't card kids, whereas pharmacists, store clerks, and doctors do.
It doesn't a genius to figure this out, genius.
And just so you know, in countries where drugs were decriminalized or legalized (even hard drugs) crime rates, especially violent crime and murder, decrease. See, most drug users never become addicts, and most addicts do not fund their habits via crime, and those who do fund their habits via crime usually commit property crimes (like theft or fraud) NOT murder.
Also, most of the Cartels of today are funded by mostly marijuana funds. They get 70% of their funding from marijuana. Yep, a drug less dangerous than alcohol. And don't give me that "gateway drug" BS...most people who have smoked weed have drank alcohol FIRST, so which is the "gateway drug"? And no, we shouldn't outlaw alcohol again!
The drug war also has racist results:
And whites use and sell drugs at about 2 times the rate as non-whites (accounted for population differences), yet non-whites are about 2 times more likely to get arrested and jailed over drugs, while also getting longer sentences thatn whites.
The fact no one in the chain of command are racist is irrelevant. No cop, jailer, judge, juror, or lawyer needs to be racist if the result in racist. It's called institutional racism. The Drug War has been called "the new Jim Crow", or more accurately "racism without racists". Results are results, and they are all that matter.
And one major result: the Drug War has been a abject failure and a waste of resources. We have set up incentives financially for cops to pursue drug criminals instead of violent criminals. While we have become the most incarcertated nation in the history of the world (both per capita and in total - despite our relatively small population as compared to the former USSR and China, both of which had/have 'gulags"), 70% of thefts, 60% of rapes, and almost 40% of murders in our country go unsolved. About 50% of the offenders in prison are nonviolent drug offenders, about 50% of the money we spend on law enforcement is spent on this useless drug war, and only 8% of offenders in federal prison are violent offenders.
To continue this failure because YOU hate human freedom, or YOU want to impose your morality on everyone, or because YOU don't like drugs or their results is stupid and tyrannical.
BTW...I don't even use caffience or alcohol, let alone drugs. I don't even eat processed sugar. I'm a health nut. But that's MY choice as a free adult. I would have no problem getting drugs if I wanted them, and either does anyone else. The drug war doesn't keep drugs out of anyone's hands, while at least kids would have harder time getting them if they were legal.
Freedom is about choice, not authoritrianism.
I just read his "manifesto." This man does not have, 'deep seated mental issues,' but he is (obviously) not acting in a calm and rational manner.
The problem with the public is that so few understand how the military and police forces operate. It seems to me as though he went into an obviously corrupt institution with a few blinders on, they tried to show him how it is (giving him a chance to come around to their way of doing things) and he is unwilling to accept it. Ultimately, they cut him loose. Whether that is right or wrong - some people see things one way, others see them another. But mentally defective? He reported obvious corruption, the system he was a part of covered this up and punished him for it. He is reacting with violence to a system that sees violence as a necessary solution to problems. He isn't mentally deficient, he is following his training. His only mental defect is his idealism. He rants about ethics and integrity, but come on, no one really believes in that crap.
The problem is that this is what you get from violent systems - violence. The best police officers I know, genuinely good people, have all, over time, been worn down by that job and the situation those people are placed in. The only ones that don't get worn down are sociopaths. They get promoted.
ProIndividual-3906907
Couldn't have said it better myself. It's a ridiculous system that chews reasonable people up and spits them out.
I see this quite often on the Vine. Are you stupid enough to believe that black people don't commit these crimes as well?
Every time this comment is brought up, the first one is said about white people, as if only whites are guilty of those crimes.
Spread the love around... throw out the statistics on Latino gangs shooting each other up, too. You don't have to carry that burden all alone.
This isn't about race. It is about a rogue cop with no coping mechanisms. Someone who cares nothing for human life, especially those innocent of any crimes that may or may not have been created by family members.
On top of that you have cops running scared and innocent citizens are at risk. Two innocent victims have been shot by mistaken identity.
People of Southern CA - stay off the streets if you value your life.
They are either going to have to kill this man or publicly address his assertion that there was a cover up over his charges against the female cop who used excessive force against a mentally deficient suspect.
He also seemed to feel there was a bias against black individuals on the force by Hispanics.
This man definitely has some deep mental issues. He's targeting innocent, uninvolved family members, for goodness sake! That is someone without coping mechanisms or morals.
On the contrary, if you read his Manifesto, you would get a picture of someone with an extremely rigid and fixed sense of right and wrong, a very black and white view of morals and life. The problem is he had no way to cope when he found that always doing the right thing resulted in him becoming the victim. He honestly felt that because he was right, he would prevail.
Now, he has become Vengeance and when he draws his last breath he will still believe he was in the right. He will never see that taking innocent lives such as the young couple that started all this was nothing but evil.
For every action there is a reaction. We should all remember that in every aspect of our dealings with others. The glue that holds civilization together is weakening, as everyone worships the idol of free expression. You are free to "express".... I am free to react to your expression.
Phinster:
Although very profitable, the reason there aren't many people applying for business licenses to run the marijuana shops, including gangs, is because it is a high economic risk to invest in the setting up and opening of a new business when the Feds have sent letters to the states threatening to arrest city council members if these business licenses are issued. Who would want to do that knowing their business license could be revoked at any time?
Even gang members are savvy enough and are not willing to take that financial risk.
Gee, what a pity LAPD didn't do a background, before issuing him a gun.
Well, don't worry, the new background checks of civilian gun owners will stop all gun crimes. lol
This guy is a Liberal Nut. No wonder why MSNBC and CNN don't want to talk about his complete background. I bet they were all over the story just licking their chops hoping to pin him as a Tea Party member, but now they know the truth, and they are quiet.
This is what this nut job said. Feinstien you're supported by a nut job..
Wow now I know I need an ar-15 with 100 round magazines because this guy is walking around with a Title III firearm!!! WTF.. How do you protect yourself and your family from this @#$%hole with 7 rounds?
To get a business license, you need to be of high moral character or at least not have a recent, felonious criminal history.
Known gang members cannot get a license to open a Bar, there is no way they will be allowed to get a license to open Marijuana dispensary. Not that it is a problem, they can and often do own businesses under the name of person with a clean record. If you are making big money slinging weed on the street to all the folks who don't have the sense or the money to get a prescription - why sell it legally. Besides, I think the state or the city would not look kindly on you offering credit or accepting stolen goods, bartering for weed. To legally sell weed, your record keeping needs to 110% accurate.
Legal or not - the authorities will want to be able to track who is using. My guess is if the courts legalize weed today - it'll be 20, 30 years before the cops will actually respect the laws. Cops have much too big an investment in keeping drugs on the front burner, illegal, their whole culture is built on th easy money and ability to avoid punishment for brutality which they receive from trotting out that tired old excuse - "civilians don't understand all we have too do to keep drug lords from over running the streets. Police have been living off of drug money for so long - they will never be able to accept going back to earning a living actually enforcing the law for real.
I want to know why this story isn't at the top of the page!!! I mean this is big. This guy is going to kill a lot of people unless he is stopped by luck or by police randomly shooting up the right truck after killing and injuring many innocent people..
He was in the Navy Reserve. He held a Security Clearance. He held awards for marksmanship. A background check would have given him an A+ clearance, and probably did, in fact, do so.
What do ya mean he has an AR15.......these are banned in Kalifornia. This must be a phony story!!!
Dorner feels he was wronged by the police dept and he also wants to expose the corruption with the police, but he is going about this the wrong way. The supreme ruler of the universe in the bible commands us not to take our own revenge but rather to leave vengeance in His hands because God is just and He has His own timing to pay back evil. Apparently Dorner doesn't have faith in God. Here is a scripture I hope Dorner will meditate on: (Romans 12:17-19) "DO NOT TAKE REVENGE MY DEAR FRIENDS, BUT LEAVE ROOM FOR GOD'S WRATH, FOR IT IS WRITTEN, "IT IS MINE TO AVENGE; I WILL REPAY" SAYS THE LORD" I pray that Dorner will stop taking on himself to do God's job, but will allow God to handle this matter in His own way. I also pray that the American public will have the opportunity to hear Dorner's side of the story in exposing the truth of the police dept because there is ALWAYS two sides of a story
"There is a long passage in which he expresses support for an assault-weapons ban, ....also contains page after page of praise .... political figures, journalists and celebrities and opinions on issues of the day — from women in combat to the boycott of Chick-fil-A."
My God there is a crazed, assault rifle shooting Liberal on the loose in L.A.!
wid wid west. No need to change. That would be unpatriotic
Grampy, I think you need to change your Depends more often. That would be civil.
You're calling that guy Boring? I haven't seen anything that you have written that makes any sense. Boring? Look in the mirror.
Do you have an opinion or do you bitch at everyone in the morning?
Wild West?
Yeah. Every American has a .00004% chance of being shot with any firearm a year!
Oh God! It's the Wild West! It's an epedemic! We need to take yer guns!
0.00004% comes to 1 in 25,000/year. Assume an average life span of 70 years and that comes to 1 in 333 people on average will be shot at sometime in their lifetime. By your figures that comes to 1 million people in the US who will get shot.
RDH, don't confuse the trolls with facts. They get all confused.
Are you a wild west historian, or do you get your info from western films? It may surprise you that there were a smaller amount of shootings on innocent people, and mass shootings were practically nonexistent. When outlaws would ride into small towns to try and take over, they were run out of town, and many were killed. Please actually read historical accounts, and dont base all your beliefs on Hollywood.
RDH
Your calculations are severely flawed.
First of all who gives a s....h....i.....t.about statistics we all know guns are dangerous,and you increase your chances of being shot,but its the only way to protect yourself from the people who have them,wanting to do harm.When you get a swimming pool in the back yard,you automaticlly increase your chances of drowning.Guns will never go away in this country and they shouldn't.So buy a gun,or learn how to duck.
"1 in 333 people"
And your chances of dying due to medical malpractice are ~16 in 25,000 per year (~195,000 cases per year). If my math is correct that comes to 1 in 25 people will die due to medical malpractice. I'm personally far more concerned with medical regulation than something that accounts for 0.4% of the nations annual deaths.
Ano,
You are right. Your argument is so inspiring that you've got me totally convinced. Since more people die from other things than die from guns, then who cares about people who get shot. Let them die -there are bigger problems in the world. Thanks!
RDH your statistical analysis is COMPLETELY BOGUS and I would love to watch you present that data to a review board of qualified mathemticians. They would laugh their asses off and I would join them.
We have long known the LAPD is the most corrupt and abusive police agency in America, and this young man who had served his country and citizens of LA just could no longer turn his head to the inter-department corruption all around him. Now it appears he is issuing his own form of justice like that which dehumanized him and derailed his career.
It must be true, 'what goes around, comes around.
Regardless of whether Dorner's vengeance is justified, it is wrong to target family members of those he feels wronged him
And the police who panicked and shot the two women delivering newspapers will be exonerated on grounds of a justifiable mistake.
LAPD is one of the cleaner pd, this ex-cop murderer was fired for lying. Something they promote you for in the nypd, chicago & boston pd.
If anything his rampage shows why we need ar-15s and 30 round mags!! How do you defend against the likes of him (even if he had zero firearms) with 7 rounds?
Heck the cops have shot up TWO trucks now. Struck two newspaper women and who knows what happened to the person(S) in the black honda?
Those cops need to go to jail. you don't just start shooting without knowing the person is committing a crime!!!! Heck if the guy was in there on his own you have to wait until you see a weapon to open fire. Why would you think the newspaper delivery women are dangerous? I don't know one gun owner that would open fire without knowing the target first. Shows just how much we can trust the police and its a testimony to the average gun owner. This crazy liberal is the same as a crazy terrorist or crazy XYZ.. The focus is on crazy. It shows how we have to focus on mental health and NOT firearms.
My god the guys right LAPD is nuts..
The cops should consider the possibility that Dorner is NOT ACTING ALONE.
Multiple vehicles, supplies, access to here and there in short amounts of time... more than one person is on his side, helping Dorner.
People always claim two shooters... Blah blah. He's on his own probably.
myownthoughts56: LAPD is one of the cleaner pd -
Might I guess that you have never been through Los Angeles? I assure you, many would dispute that thought.
lets see.........take away the guns from us honest citizens, the feds, criminals , and police have guns.and when a police officer goes rouge.......and we have no guns i guess thats okay. it happens they will say.
no.......keeping the guns is a good idea, this is crazy talk, since california is run by idiots, and they go out of their way to send their biggest idiots to washington to spread idiocy. unbelievable.
Renee,
Actually lived there AND those other three wonderfully protected cities.
The east coast is more corrupt, that's why Washington D.C is back there.
WARNING!!! ALL POSTERS WHO USE NEWSVINE ON NBCNEWS.COM! Newsvine's policy of allowing posters to collapse comments they don't agree with amounts to censorship!! If enough folks don't like your comment they can collapse it and all the responses you receive!!! This is NOT how a blog should be run. I urge you all to boycott Newsvine and change to blogs on CNN or any other news provider. A blog should not be a popularity contest but a true exchange of ideas. If you want to be heard DO NOT USE NEWSVINE!. Check out the huge number of "collapsed by the community comments" on this article. They are almost always the most popular comments and they DO NOT VIOLATE THE NEWSVINE CODE HONOR! They are arbitrarily cancelled by posters! This is NOT free speech!!
MOUNTAINLADY Is Right!! 1st Amendment.......No abridging the Freedom of Speech, or the Press!!!..........Go after the CRIMES and not our GUNS!!! 2nd Amendment
There is a long passage in which he expresses support for an assault-weapons ban, ....also contains page after page of praise .... political figures, journalists and celebrities and opinions on issues of the day — from women in combat to the boycott of Chick-fil-A.
My God there is a crazed, assault rifle shooting Liberal on the loose in L.A.!
Wow LL Cool J went on a rampage? Sorry LL your music sucks now used to be good back in the 80's.
I somehow don't think we have gotten the whole story here. Sounds to me that this guy was fired because he broke the blue wall of silence against his fellow police officers. He filed a complaint of police abuse against other Police men. He was fired for that. Fired for doing the right thing. I think the Police F*cked with the wrong guy this time. This guy defended this country and came home and joined the police here. Then He saw something he couldn't live with and did the right thing, Look what it got him. Now he is doing the right thing in his mind.
LAPD shot at innocent people. They need to be fired.
"Tensions were high across the region, where cops on protection details wound up injuring innocent civilians."
This was shoot first and check ID later. These morons are taking the drama to the taxpayers that pay for their salary. I wonder what really happened to set this guy off.
5.28 what set this guy off was that he was a whistle blower and was fired for it. READ his manifesto.
"And the police who panicked and shot the two women delivering newspapers will be exonerated on grounds of a justifiable mistake."
Are you f'ing serious? First drones killing civilians now cops? PLEASE take the Guns away from the Gov't. They apparently can not be trusted to use them.
and your chances of dying in a terrorist attack are about 100 times less than your chances of dying from a gunshot coming from an American, yet we have been spending hundreds of billions "fighting terrorists"
"dr"alchemy;
sabot and heats "0.000004%" number is pure BS pulled out of his arse.
total gun deaths in the US, 2011=32,163 (32,000 for round #)
total population US, 312,000,000
32,000/=.0102% about a one in 10,000 chance in any given year
multiply by an average life span of 70 years and you get (70*0.00102)=0.719% chance of dying in your lifetime
actually, you have one chance in 139 of dying from a gunshot as an American over your lifetime
perhaps the good "dr" should stick to alchemy
This nightmare is not about guns. Sadly, I do not cheer both sides.
Bad stats and a large percentage of those homicide by gun deaths are gang on gang or caused by criminals that do not care about gun control.
Well Ted, you pretty much answered the question as to why the media avoids mentioning that a suspect is " Black." The White community generally doesn't face an overall risk from law enforcement or vigilantes based on the acts of White criminal individuals or White gangs, rather they tend to zero in on the individual, such as the vigilantes harassing Casey Anthony. Black criminal has meant open season on the entire Black community for as long as we can remember. Newspaper delivery persons have been driving with no lights for years as a courtesy to people who are sleeping. Not surprised that a Black male suspect brought an indiscriminate response.
for clarity, that line should have read:
32,000/313,000,000=.0102% or about a one in 10,000 chance in any given year.
@MountainLady - I agree with you completely. The "moderators" on Newsvine are unbelievable little trolls who will suspend anyone who states a belief they don't agree with themselves. The "moderators" need to find real jobs and let adults on here express themselves.
so much for the NRA theory that a good guy with a gun stops the bad guy with a gun.
Unfortunately just because you have a police uniform on doesn't automatically make you a good guy. The person behing the uniform and what they stand for is what the real meat and potatoes are when you are measuring character. Sometimes I wish it was simpler to figure out the good from the bad. In any even this guy seems to be mentally disturbed.
Exactly. Cops in my area are notorious for driving under the influence WHILE on duty. The uniform absolutely doesn't make you a good guy.
So much for the liberal theory that only the police should have guns.
Leave it to a liberal to blame inanimate objects for the actions of human beings.
Hey,when people get pissed off,sh!t happens. If you can't handle that you should uthinize your self.
Good guy with gun, turns into bad guy with gun, shoots 3 good guys with guns. More good guys with guns hunting for bad guy with bigger badder guns.
Sounds like we should just arm everyone with guns, so we can all be good guys with guns and go get this bad guy. But wait, how do we stop more bad guys from getting guns? Answer: give good guys more guns.
Jack, huh??? I have gotten really "pissed" and never thought of grabbing a gun and killing someone! Sheesh!
How does anyone identify the "good guys" from the "bad guys" with 100% accuracy? Who gets to define and make this decision?
Bry In VA, The good guys are the ones NOT shooting at you. Simple but true.
"Good Guys" Do you people live in a Marvel Comic book? Simple minds. Lets get all of the "bad guys" to wear black and the "good guys" to wear white to make things easier! /s/
Another "hero"
Seems like the "good guys with guns" are losing a few.
Just another good guy with a gun, turned bad guy with a gun, shooting good guys with guns, so more good guys can get guns to go shoot the bad guy.
No Big deal, no need for change.
Sounds like you are happy about that? That's sick. You need to go talk to someone about this problem.
So cops shouldnt have guns now William? If anything, this stories proves that citizens need to protect themselves against cops as well, and we shouldnt ban certain guns that libs find scary. Did you know these cops have shot at 2 innocent trucks because they were afraid?
What side scares you more though?! The guy shooting cops cause he believes the system wronged him, the police force which is obviously covering something up (read manifesto) or the fact that mental illness probably has nothing to do with this scene.
Some people call them police, others call them a uniformed gang. Personally, I care about a bunch of cops killing each other just about as much as I care about a bunch of gang bangers killing each other. Leave the innocents out of it and oh well.
People, when driving at night, TURN YOUR HEADLAMPS ON !!
Look at what happened to the two newspaper delivery women who didn't do the sensible thing.
Lights on. Please. Or else Bang Bang.
You noticed how the law enforcement is on their cars... More than half of these cops don't even know the law, let alone enforce it... So yes they are a gang! Most police officers don't even have a degree, most are college drop outs, so you tell me... Would you want someone with a badge and gun that doesn't even have what it takes to make it through school???
Typical cops. Shooting first, asking questions later. I'll bet those cops who shot those innocent people will face no charges for what they did.
@SeanNordick - easy, the cops scare me the most - their shooting those two women in the pickup truck showed the mentality and intelligence level of the typical cop in this country. They have a badge, gun, radio, think everything they do and say is perfectly okay and they think THEY are the law, forgetting they need to obey the law just like civilians. At least I know what the bad guys' intentions are.
gang members killing each other and their families. nothing new.
they are police officers NOT gang members.....Reading is obviously not an ability you excel in.
the queenie, obvisiously you missed the point. There are a lot of people who consider cops nothing but gangs. Some of them ignore what they are suppose to be upholding, the law. Gang members don't follow the law either. This will not be the last time you will hear about them being referred to as members of a gang (in blue).
really? you are an expert on police work standard? or you are an expert on...street derogatory labeling of police, the law enforcer. sure there are always bad apples in a basket with thousands of apple. to label them as gangs comes only from criminals, who do not want to be stop on their business of breaking the laws to the point of killing.
She writes the truth. Keep traveling troll. When you reach the edge, take one more step.
They are gang members..only difference is that they are organized..unionized..and conceal it with their uniforms..
The Christopher Dorner Theme Song, click on the YouTube link below:
Steely Dan "Don't take me alive"
Time for gun restrictions. Those weapons were not from his job.
takenaka, where in the world do you live in by chance? You surely do not live on the planet Earth if you are so obscessed with your comments against the ownership of all guns. Also, is it me or did you COMPLETELY miss out the part in the article where the guy was for an assault weapons ban (as well as possibly a complete ban on ownership, usage, possession, and manufacturing of guns), yet he had more of them than even the most die-hard racist, revisionist, paramilitary/cult types usually carry! Furthermore, in your country of birth (Japan) the Yakuza-controlled police forces, military forces, the Yakuza themselves, and other criminal organizations as well are the only ones that own guns and the other people that do not use guns the same way that they are used in the USA tend to use them FAR more on themselves simply because the majority of the citizens in your country have such an OCD perfectionist hegemonic society in which appearances matter more than the truth and where the concepts of deception and lies rule the day. Seriously, I need to do what everyone else lacks the courage to do on here and do this to you. (pimp smacks the crap out of you so badly that your head flies off of your body) Please do the world a favor and learn to get a brain or allow me to go back in time and make sure that your parents never meet and add to the stupidity of the world. Thank you.
I think takenaka suffers from a "little gun" complex. Lol
The difference between law enforcement and gang members is...???
If I ever come up with anything, I'll let you know.
@ Debi: The cops' pants sag around their guts. Gang members pants sag around their ass...That's the difference!
At "thetruthteller." It's ironic. I think you are adding to the stupidity in the world by your obviously small and sheltered mind. What a generalization and how racist to assume that because someone has the name "Takenake" that they were born in Japan.To add to that, you made racist generalizations about Japanese people. You are culturally insensitive and seem to have a lack of understanding about people and diverse views. You probably would never be able to guess what ethnicity I am if you just went by my name. I suggest that you get out into the world and educate yourself a bit more.
Ann4r545454.... you're obviously ethnically a b!tch.
@JaredMatthews - why are you assuming Ann545454 is a woman? How do you do know it's not male using a female username? That happens all the time on the internet. Or do you just hate all women so much that any female sounding username comment has to be denounced with the unimaginative B word?
Trust the police. They're here to protect you.
Give them your guns, they wont shoot you.
SERIOUSLY
So say the "police".
Do as the POLeese tell you; you won't be killed.
TO PROTECT AND TO SERVE.
You can place your faith and trust in us; the few, the proud... the L A P D.
You noticed how the law enforcement is on their cars... More than half of these cops don't even know the law, let alone enforce it... So yes they are a gang! Most police officers don't even have a degree, most are college drop outs, so you tell me... Would you want someone with a badge and gun that doesn't even have what it takes to make it through school???
This occupation doesn't require a brain; just extremely high testosterone levels, a desire for power and domination due to a lifetime little "peeps" complex, and a never fulfilled love of donuts.
When I was an Officer in the Navy (the real Navy, not the @#!*/! Reserves like this dickwad), all the biggest screw-ups under my command wanted to get out and go back home and become cops. It was perceived as a "no-load" job with bullying rights and fat perks. That is not to say that there are not lots of fine cops out there, but there are also a lot of WoF ("wastes of flesh"), too. Yet those who want to disarm us tell us to put our faith in the cops (at the same time that the Courts are ruling that the cops actually have NO duty to protect any individual - look up Warren v. Dist. of Columbia and prepare to be appalled). Yet rogue cops are legion. So are incompetent ones. And jittery ones (like those who shot those two women in Torrance, whom they apparently mistook for a 270 lb black man...). AND, as this situation reminds us, crazy ones.
No, I personally agree with Ted Nugent. It is utterly absurd to tell someone that they do not have the right to protect themselves or to own the means with which to effectively protect themselves. If there is any "innate" right, any "God given" right, any "natural right", it is the right to protect oneself, yet there are a substantial number of people out there who actually believe that it is some form of privilege, that it is something which the government should have the power to dole out according to their own judgment of who is "deserving" and "worthy" of exercising it. Officer Dorner, like Major Hassan, is proof that the government's judgment in that regard is sometimes rather faulty.
cool i want to buy a NUCLER BOMB to protect myself from all the cofederate flag waving whites im so scared of in the south...i wouldnt be able to shoot them all when they come in their pick up trucks to rape my wife and kids and hang me...so i want a NUCLEAR BOMB or some other explosive to kill them all...I AM SO SERIOUS...its my god given right to protect myself by any means
And the beat goes on ...
He was fired 4 years ago? I would think that he would have wanted revenge right after he was fired. What made him snap that he decided to go on a rampage now? I will be curious to see what comes out when this is all said and done.
Revenge is a dish best served cold....
dmiller he said he wanted to get them when they least expected. I guess 4 or 5 yrs later they have thought that he was no longer a threat to anyone.
Perhaps that's how long it took for the psych drugs (antidepressants) to really upset the apple cart.
4 years is enough time to plot , explore , watch , plot some more , and sike yourself up to go through with your plans
Comment 1.35 posted by sceminmimi may shed some light on this. The latest repercussions from his 2009 firing came this last month- lost of his Navy Reservist status and Secret Clearance. And I would imagine that he had been trying for reinstatement or other outcome the whole time. Frustration and anger grows if you keep feeding it.
You might want to read up a bit on violent crime. The notion that people like him "snap" one day and go out and immediately start killing people is simply not supported by the evidence. Such actions are generally well-planned crimes, sometimes taking years to put the pieces together. He may very well have made the decision to do this the day he was fired and just taken this long to finish setting up his plan.
Per his manifesto, the firing incident cost him his job as a Navy reserve recently he has nothing to lose now.
dmiller~ There will be pork in the trees before that truth comes out.
He's been trying to clear his name all this time through legal recourse. The cops caused him to lose his security clearance last week, so he had to resign from the Navy. That ended his career. After all what they did to him, that was the final straw. I don't blame him for what they resorted him too.
I hope the guilty ones stand out on the corner and take their licks, which will save everyone else. I'm going to feel bad for him if they kill him before he gets the top three on his list. Plenty of corrupt goverment officials and cops. Too bad he isn't taking requests.
Hey, the night maniac, it's "psyche", not "sike"...
It took him that long to realize that he has been destroyed. I am sure that since his firing he tried to reclaim his name and life. He talks about depression, totally normal, especially when you have lost everything in the world. I have posted twice about peoples ability to reach a breaking point. I firmly believe that everyone has one, except that most don't reach it. Unfortunately he did and is reacting in the only way he knows how to get the justice he thinks he deserves. Besides, I saw nothing rambling in his manifesto. I am just so sorry that it had to come to this and I hope the LAPD will be investigated, because I believe every word he said about that authorized gang.
"He was fired 4 years ago? I would think that he would have wanted revenge right after he was fired. What made him snap that he decided to go on a rampage now? I will be curious to see what comes out when this is all said and done"
He was probably waiting for his contract with the guard to expire. Wouldn't want them hunting him down.
Hmmm, after viewing his photo it would appear one vital descriptive characteristic is missing.
Obviously he is clean-shaven!!
You should be getting more checks for that one.
You know, when I read the description I saw "Hagrid" in my mind's eye. Pretty accurate, I'd say.
MSN just cannot bring themselves to describe a killer as black. White or even part white on the other hand, such as Zimmerman gets broadcasted immediatley.
Somethingsaid,
The photo isn't enough? People can tell that Zimmerman isn't 100% white and you're right the media screwed that up. That was obvious race baiting.
Here's something else they got wrong here so don't believe everthing this reporter writes.
Those are CPT bars on his camos' lapel, not LT bars.
Bob fu, please don't show your ignorance. One simple google search would show you that in the Navy, those are LT bars.
Thank you, Grape, for putting the "fu" back in "Fu**ing Idiot". Nothing like shooting one's mouth off when one is simply wrong. That's probably why he's named "Bob", too - you can spell it backward and still be right so it saves a lot of embarassment.
Heh, he saw the BDU's and missed the Navy part. Our Captains get birds.
Was he "grazing" on a doughnut??
OMG....dude that was wrong but funny!!!!!
WilliamOfRites,
You and the queenie make such a cute couple!
lol..he was grazed while grazing on a doughnut...
He was grazed while holding a glazed doughnut
LOL!!!! SO WRONG!
If you are a police officer in LA, do not go near the random open box of donuts in the middle of the street.
IT'S A TRAP!!
WHY IS IT that when anybody else writes a clever yet true line, readers laugh out loud and their comment gets kudos and gets to remain posted up on our NewsVine, but...
...when I post an equivalent comment, I get several days of "CodeName : Bubblegum" time-out suspension?
Life is not fair. But since I do not know how to write up a Man Meat Manifesto, I shall not attempt one.
Good day, Sirs. For now.
He must have become dazed if not craized when grazed by a bullet while grazing on a glazed donut.
I slit a sheet, a sheet I slit, upon this slitted sheet I sit.
Has nothing to do with the article but still fun to say fast at a party.
When he "surrenders" I hope they just take him out in a hail of bullets so they can't figure out who to blame for killing him. He'll probably wants to to surrender so he can whine to the media about his imaginary plight. Don't give him the chance. Just say "Oops, we thought he was going for a weapon."
I realize he's delusional and mentally ill, but this country and its schools has spent the last couple of decades preaching that the condition of your self-esteem is THE most important thing in the world to everyone else, and if you're not perfectly happy, by God, the world should pay for it. Time to start teaching reality checks to kids from an early age so we stop producing generations of self-absorbed maniacs pissed at the world that they didn't get a trophy for showing up.
I don't agree with the first part of your post, but I do agree with the second part. There is such an entitlement mentality with everyone these days, and by that I mean it seems like everyone feels that they are entitled to be the best, #1, a winner, a success, to get their way, to get what they want all the time, etc etc etc. Reality and the real world must be quite a shock to those people, and evidently they just don't know how to handle it.
Sounds like you didn't read his manifesto..... he wants the injustices done by the LAPD to stop.
Heck no I'm not reading this maniac's manifesto. Whatever his gripes against the LAPD and their "injustices", they don't warrant murdering people because they're not what he thinks they should be.
@Mike N-366459
His manifesto also includes testimonials from a father of the abused supporting the ex-cops claims. Just plain ignorance to not look at all the evidence before making an assumption. It gives your posts absolutely no credibility now and looks more like a bias, uneducated statement.
Yeah thats their way out..."I/We thought he was reaching for a weapon", is the phrase to say to try & cover their ass!! Just sucks when they shoot an un-armed non threatening runner in the back!!! And stiil say that?!?!
Mike you sound just like one of those of "LAPd Finest" maybe your name is in the manifesto; you should read it
The minute that he started killing people, his manifesto became moot. He killed two innocent people because one of them was the daughter of a man who he believes was instrumental in getting him fired. I don't have to look at the so-called evidence to know that what he is doing is 100% wrong. Are there injustices being done in the LAPD? No one claimed that there weren't injustices done, but that still does not make what he is doing right.
So, His corked popped, after his Navy Career did not renegotiate. He did how ever get an honorale discharge; but that was all he had left, and with out a Security Clearance in the military, you are done!
It would be best if he eats the gun; but then he did say he wants his brain to be left to science to study depression
I see your point - the LAPD is corrupt, but does that warrant killing them? However, their corruption involves killing and assaulting others....SOOOOOOO....
It's a slippery slope. Frankly, I could care less if police who abuse and kill innocents end up on the wrong side of a gun or if they kill this guy and move on. Just hope no more innocent people are killed.
Let him surrender to the Cleveland Police. They just shot 2 people after a high speed chase. 230 rounds into their car. One cop reloaded 3 times. No gun found on the man or woman and all officers were cleared!
Thing is Mike, I haven't heard from any of the anti-Obama tyranny militia with their call to arms support Dorner. If you read some of their statements you'll find Dorner is doing exactly what they are calling for, with the methods they have espoused. That's exactly what every single one of the "my rights are in danger" activists are going to have to do to resist their Obama tyranny. Just wondering if they are maniacs as well or just fat mouths with a keyboard and a bag of potato chips? One persons tyranny is another person's justice. One person's good guy is another person's bad guy. If we have to determine that with the deployment of arms, you can expect more of it, ten-fold.
Debby, it's probably not wise to make a prediction, but typical studies about suicide that I recall is that suicidal people head for high country, hills, mountains etc. when they are about to self-destruct. I'm expecting his migration to the San Bernardino mountains to trend toward suicide.
My sincere condolences to the wounded and murdered officers and their families and coworkers. I hope those injured recover quickly and completely.
A cop killer is bad enough... a former cop, cop killer is worse. To the LEOs tracking him. Don't take chances. He has proved that he is capable and willing to do whatever he believes is necessary to accomplish whatever task he has in mind. Take him out like a rabid dog, that is what he has become.
I feel a lot more sorry for the innocent people the police have been shooting because they are so trigger happy to get this guy, they have shot 2 people already, and shot at a third but fortunatly missed, all because they drove blue pickups.
The Honda was black!
@XDm9mm, sure let's give up our guns and trust the "LEO"s will take care of us.
Stop raising criminals onto pedestals. Give someone a suit and a title and you're drooling: "they sure are LA's finest." Actually, no they're not. People who choose to be police have a dangerous mix of wanting power and not having skills to be successful in legitimate professions. They are supposed to be working for us, not the other way around. Idolizing them is naive, and just a figment of your liberal fantasy of government somehow magically protecting us.
Being in a position of power and abusing it is the worst crime a person can do, it is a fundamental betrayal of human trust and dignity, and a significant number of cops do it all day and joke about it. This mentally ill guy can take out a dozen people, and it still isn't as evil as what these cops do.
While people like you support the liberal utopian ideal where police help maintain government-prescribed order, you might want to think about the reality of how the world works before you so easily give up the rights we worked (and killed) for.
I think I can truly say that the circle has turned 360 degrees the other way. First a Black liberal President and now " Conservative" anti-police and anti-military. Next you guys will be burning the flag and deserting to Canada. I guess Mexico would be out of the question?
@XD..... - because of course the "LEOs" are never wrong. Like when they shot up the two ladies delivering newspapers in their pickup truck because it was moving slowly and the cops weren't bright enough to think maybe since it's 6 a.m., the newspaper delivery people are here in the neighborhood. The police captain they were supposed to be "protecting" wasn't even at home - he had taken his family out of their house in that neighborhood. Like you, most cops mistake themselves FOR the law - which they are not. They are law enforcement, not avengers and not judge and jury. They need to obey the law themselves. Then they might get some respect. May 1/10th of 1 percent of cops deserve any respect at all.
Hopefully they take him out before he takes anyone else out.
Hopefully they don't try to take "him" out before being sure it's him, the geniuses in LAPD have already opened fire on 3 innocent people because they drove a vehicle that resembled the one the guy is driving(and since 2 of them were small Asian women they can't claim they matched the suspects description)
And before the cops kill anymore innocent people (they already shot two people for driving in a car like his).
They do this to blacks all the time. It's a habit they can't break.
The people in this area need to demand they fire the cops that shot the innocent people. These cops are losers.
One thing I did notice is: gun sales in the US have gone through the roof !. I can fully understand why people are taking up arms t protect themselves against the LAPD gung ho shooters.
All I can suggest is to continue to load up your arsonals as there are bad cops and bad cops out there willing to shoot blind.
Where is the old rule to "Hold your fire till you see the whites of their eyes"
LAPD rules: "Wait till you see the back of their head" and try to limit the shots to 60 rounds per perp.
Ex-LAPD officer on the loose after
allegedly shooting three cops; one dead
New banner headline on this story.
No matter what they need to get/kill that lunatic!!!!
Take him out
Sadly,there is always a bad apple in every barrel. And yet Pelosi and her gang want them to be the only ones with "assault" weapons. Scary aint it? Hope they get this dirtbag quick. Take him out!
Pelosi for President in 2016.. Yayyyyyy!!
Wayne LaPieere, the NRA mouthpiece is a DRAFT DODGER!!
Pelosi for President in 2016.. Yayyyyyy!!
Thanks!! I needed a good laugh this morning!
Wayne LaPieere, the NRA mouthpiece is a DRAFT DODGER!!
Like your pres obozo?
no kinda like that bush guy who protected Alabama when the others were in Vietnam.
President Obama was too young to be involved in the draft. Ban semi-automatic weapons and high capacity magazines.
Lunatic with guns, and license to kill, do you think gun control would have stopped this? and would we all be safer without guns and the cops killing people!!!??? gov. out of control , a lunatic government is the real enemy off all.
edwardo, where were you when the right wingers stole the presidency in 2000, with that BS supreme court 5 to 4 vote, then started a war on lies, sent 5000 to their deaths, where were you?
Where were you at the last general election where the American voters promptly declined all thinkers and opinions like yours? No,we don't have a lunatic government, we have a ELECTED GOVERNMENT, that was duly elected by the majority of American voters. Sorry, that your right wing dip chits can take it.. Come 2014, and 2016, we will vote out the rest.
You are wrong...the president as with many presidents in the past are not elected into office by American voters. They are elected into office by Electorial Votes. Meaning that we the American voters..really don't have a say who is in office anymore because our votes really don't count..it's all Electorial.
Shhh, let TruthNow stay delusional so we can all continue laughing at him. He doesnt know that all the recounts still went to Bush in 2000. Shhh
Edwardo, you are 100% correct. Team Obama seems to think that we can defend ourselves with a pair of scissors while they get to enjoy an army of well armed guards. Same league as Marie Antoinette with her paraphrased, "Let them eat cake!" comment. Obama, "Let them wield scissors!"
GA,
Sorry, sharp scissors have been regulated as "assault scissors", private citizens may only own Round-Nosed scissors that are 10 mm or less.
And running with scissors is banned as well. New legislation to regulate letter openers is coming in the spring.
Did a 5 year-old write this or do I need another cup of coffee? Very difficult to follow.
"The response occurred during the search that began with a report of a vehicle matching the description of ex-LAPD Officer Christopher Dorner."
Wow.
3 people dead and that is what you focus on?
3 people dead and that is what you focus on?
Obviously the story wasn't written well because it was only 1 cop killed, not 3 like you claim you read in the story.
1 cop plus 2 civilians. 1 + 2 = 3. Math lesson for the day.
Sad no matter how this went down, I still say that his accusation should be investigated by an outside authority then they should do a full psych evaluation on all Police officers in America to make sure there aren't more like him waiting to act.
Oh that would go over like a lead balloon.
That ancient greek guy with the lantern out searching for a Reasonable Man? Today he'd be out looking for a Sane Man--and ought to be suspicious of the guys doing the testing.
So we have rogue cops too.
Still want to make sure only cops are allowed to have guns?
Notice that the Obama sycophants like Feisty are strangely absent from this discussion?
All FREE People have the RKBA!
.
Here I am Steve...."Obama Sycophant".....
Your dislike for the president is yet again showing......connecting the dots of blame to the president for ALL what is wrong comes very easy for some.......yet NOTHING good is EVER attributed to him.
The rest of the world takes notice when continue to disparage OUR leader. Remember we at our strongest when WE are UNITED.
The shooter is not a cop. He's an ex-cop. If only cops had gun, then this ex-cop would not have a gun.
We need to ban guns from everybody even the cops. All the cops would need then is stun guns. Obama needs to ban all guns. If all guns were banned then there would be no need for cops or secret service to have guns either right? Of course muder is already banned and people still do it. Wait if we ban assault weapons maybe that will do it.
The last time I checked, the only crime ever commited in the United States by a legally registered fully automatic weapon was commited by a POLICE OFFICER to murder his wife! Kinda shoots your theory of "if only cops had guns" in the foot.
Mackster,
And thats why no lib or television station ever talked smack on Bush... oh yeah...
to "mackster-4452610 "
I have news for you ..... we are in no way united .
I am glad they brought up the mental health aspect , while talking about new gun legislation. my first thought was who is going to do the psyc evaluations on our elected officials in Washington DC ? I for one , think that would be the place to start , considering how much they impact all Amercans lives .
Who cares wtf you buy online fool.
Cops with guns commit murder too. Do we take their guns away? Thoughts and prayers to all the victims here.