Cars were made for transportation, yet we use them for dangerous sport. Prescription drugs were made to treat health problems and they are used for dangerous recreation. Kitchen knives were made to cut food but they are used in crimes every day.

bubba, half of the firearms I own were made specifically for target sports. They were designed from the ground up to smash clay targets or punch holes in paper. The other half were designed to efficiently deal with threats to life and limb. Besides, why is the original purpose of an inanimate object so important to all of you antis anyways? If objects themselves are responsible for deaths, than autos--which take more lives than guns--should be a major focus of concern. Does it really matter what original purpose is compared the actual impact? Fertilizer was not designed with the purpose of creating bombs with the power to topple buildings yet it can be abused that way. Guns are just tools--they can be abused/misused like anything else. That poor 4 year old was a victim of extremely poor parenting. Again, we have a criminal that scoffs at gun laws and the result is a senseless death. Until we start demanding accountability from the individuals that actually make up our society, these types of tragedies will continue.

Bubba is funny. Competing in three-gun competitions is fun and the only thing that "dies" is a paper target or plate. Benchrest competitions are fun too and, again, nothing is killed in that sport either. Cowboy action shooting, the Biathlon, and skeet shooting are all challenging sports that involve guns and each requires discipline, practice, and intelligence.

Bubba is the type of irresponsible brain owner we need to ignore.

And what do you eat at the grocery store bubba? Either you are the reason animals are killed or you are the killer. Dont try and weasel out of this one.

Bubba turn in your man card, that stupid statement just made ya a Babs.

I'm pretty sure there are several Olympic events that involve shooting. They very much are a sport and they are as valid a use of a firearm as racing is for cars.

bubba-1946427

Nero, Guns were made to Kill, they are not a TOY. They were not made for ENTERTAINMENT! or SPORT! You are the type of irresponsible gun owner we need to get guns away from.

------------------------------------------------

like it or not, almost all people who have guns view them as a sport... it's in the Olympics... everyone in the world thinks its a legitimate sport except you

people collect them, modify them as a hobby, go target shooting, hunting, whatever they do, and none of us see it as the magical death machine you do....

car racing, breathing, eating peanut butter, skydiving, walking out your front door in the morning can all kill us... guns are just another thing doing it....

They are for sport you moron. What do you think hunting is.

As George Carlin once said, "Hunting will be a sport when deer carry bazookas."

Buuba, sometimes it's wise to stop digging.

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt" - Abraham Lincoln/Mark Twain/Proverbs 17:28.

I was in the military and am now a deputy. I shoot with friends on my time, I find it enjoyable. Just putting this out there as well. We have a lot of rural areas in my county, some times it takes up to 40 minutes to respond. Shouldn't the citizens have the right to protect themselves? In 40 minutes it would be a crime scene.

Letting the dumb a** drug dealer/burglarizing gunned up thug baby daddy have a toddler for 2 days every week. Yeh, that's a good idea. What are the chances he gave the kid drugs, as well as keeping illegally obtained loaded guns laying around? This is why crime prevention in some neighborhoods ought include free condoms available on every corner.

I just LOVE the way people say that vehicles, etc. should be a major focus when the subject matter is Guns... Not even perceptive enough to know they've failed a simple, yet accurate I.Q. test separating the human wheat from the chaff just by sputtering out the misdirection...

Background checks AND I.Q. tests!! We also have to be able to detect those whose records are clean simply because they've just been too stupid to commit a crime thus far...

@RANGER549

"I was in the military and am now a deputy. I shoot with friends on my time, I find it enjoyable. Just putting this out there as well. We have a lot of rural areas in my county, some times it takes up to 40 minutes to respond. Shouldn't the citizens have the right to protect themselves? In 40 minutes it would be a crime scene."

That's not a completely unreasonable point. My response is that I live in a city where police response times are consistently under 5 minutes for priority calls, and where the walls of my apartment don't stop the downstairs neighbors' terrible techno music let alone a bullet.

I don't support gun bans (partially for the reasons that you state here) but I think it is perfectly fine to impose reasonable regulations such as universal background checks. It won't stop all crime (just like making murder illegal doesn't stop all murders) but the status quo is not working and something needs to change.

MsKat

Cars were made for transportation, yet we use them for dangerous sport. Prescription drugs were made to treat health problems and they are used for dangerous recreation. Kitchen knives were made to cut food but they are used in crimes every day.

When a car can be placed under your coat and hidden with ease, we will talk about restricting cars.When proscription drugs become dangerous at a distance then maybe we can ban them since they are already vary regulated ( more so then guns ). Some knives are actually restricted based on size, but we will talk about restricting knives when they become as efficient at killing as guns are.

No one is thinking that guns are going away, but making laws that hold the original gun owner liable for it's improper use by ANYONE and closing easy loopholes for criminals to gain easy access is the least we can do.

The only other option is a citizens arms race and you are going to start seeing more modern weapons on the street vary soon that will have you wishing there where some tighter controls.

MDP should have been fixed 10 years ago. Just look at that loser.

Yeah, you messed up, and a little 4-year-old boy paid for that with his life. And to child welfare, if you're going to order visitation rights to a divorced parent, make sure that the environment is good for that child. Yes, the parent has the major responsibility, but when government gets involved in the custody dispute, government takes on some of that responsibility as well.

Very well said Rational Hatter. While I have some concern with background checks and registrations (part of me worries about governmental record keeping...ala McCarthy era policies), I think they have become necessary because of all the mentally disturbed people. The reality is that as cliche as it has become guns don't kill people, people do. We need to make sure that the people with the guns are not mentally disturbed. I believe that people have a right to protect themselves and their property. You only need to look at cities and states where gun control is the strictest to know it doesn't work. Unfortunately there are way too many criminals who have no respect for the law and would still have access to guns if they were totally outlawed.

#3.2 Scott - They are for sport you moron. What do you think hunting is?

Hunting is not a 'sport' for the animals. To them, it is unadulterated murder.

MsKat

Cars were made for transportation, yet we use them for dangerous sport.

Yes, and they are heavily regulated. Crumple zones, airbags, safety restrains; all have been added since the 1960's. Guns remain largly unregulated. If left to their own devices, auto manufacturers would never have voluntarily made those improvements: we, the people, through our elected officials, mandated it.

Prescription drugs were made to treat health problems and they are used for dangerous recreation.

But there are rules, yes? Not so with guns, because the NRA has roadblocked common sense reforms every step of the way.

Kitchen knives were made to cut food but they are used in crimes every day

And how many people are dying from kitchen knives every single day? Not in nearly the same lethal occurances you find with handguns. If the kid had been playing with his dad's kitchen knife, he would still be alive. But let's not bother with pesky things like facts...

NeroMaj1: NO, guns are not for entertainment, sport, or any purpose other than to be used to KILL.

TO KILL is the only reason anyone has a gun.

Target shooting is just practice killing.

Animal shooting is just more difficult practice killing.

Rick - really?

"But there are rules, yes? Not so with guns, because the NRA has roadblocked common sense reforms every step of the way."

There are some 26,000 federal, state and local "laws" (rules) that the NRA did not manage to block.

dirp - if you are not a strict vegan, please cease and desist. If you eat any kind of meat, or use items made of leather, you are just a squeamish individual who cannot provide for her/himself. Lay off the subject of hunting, for which you clearly have no knowledge.

Food on the plate. And I am guilty of "killing" many a bottle, can, and paper target.

Go Google: "Olympic targer rifles." I'm pretty sure that at several thousand dollas, they are not purchased for killing. I would also bet none has ever been used in a gun murder.

Apparently Rick's Real believes there are no rules that regulate guns.

But there are rules, yes? Not so with guns, because the NRA has roadblocked it every step of the way.

Well, that's very interesting. And it pointedly ignores such things as the Lautenberg amendment, the Gun Control Acts of 1934, 1968, and 1986, the requirement to fill out BATFE form 4473, and state laws mandating waiting periods. These are all clearly rules. Rick has to ignore all of this and thousands more in the form of laws in order to support his contention, otherwise it becomes nonsensical.

Of course, I could roll out the trite statement that we should

not bother with pesky things like facts

but it's obviously unnecessary.

chlorinating the gene pool.... (kid didn't deserve it but daddy set it up)

Enneagram1

Hunting is not a 'sport' for the animals. To them, it is unadulterated murder.

MURDER??!! So tell me where is this animal court that applies this definition? Do you now wish that we charge animals for killing and eating other animals?

Intelligent people understand that killing is not murder either, though murder is an evil intent of some killings. Anyone without knowing that distinction already needs to be locked up because they have lost ALL SENSE of reason & sensibility, I worry about you Enneagram1

To those that believe that the only purpose for a gun is to KILL KILL KILL....you might want to check out this site:

http://www.usashooting.org

There are currently 15 Olympic Shooting events, and so far as I know, none of them are "training to go kill something/one".

I'll repeat what I've said any number of times - a gun was architected to do a single thing: to project a small metal ball down a long cylinder. It's up to the psyche of the person on the trigger side of that gun as to what that small ball will penetrate.

For some - it's a tiny target for the chance to win an Olympic medal

For some - it's to preserver our freedom

For some - it's to provide food for their family

For some - it's to enjoy hobby time plucking holes in pieces of paper or hitting small pieces of flung clay

For some - it's to protect family and friends

For some - it's "to protect and to serve"

And unfortunately for some - it's to do harm in others

Instead of focusing on the greater group that own guns - why can't we simply focus on that last cluster of people.

Yes, and military members have guns, responsible home owners and sportsmen can get legal weapons. Criminals and the mentally disturbed clearly should not have access. Your argument favors, not opposes, rigorous background checks -- including through private sales and gun shows.

That was a .40Cal Pistol, Not a Revolver, which means the bullet was cocked and ready to shoot Immediately, In case one of his "drug deals" went bad. This guy had no right exposing that little boy to his vile behavior and surroundings. You KNOW What the Chinese would do with him as a drug dealer Let alone the stolen pistol which that little boy played and shot himself with.

RANGER549....few people would disagree with you, however why would you be against having a backgroung check for all legitimate purchases of guns ? Right now 40% of all gun sales have no background checks, and you can be sure that those are the guns that most often find their way into the wrong hands eventually. I am a gun owner, a target shooter all my life, hunted for many years, and have military experience with everything from a 45 Cal to a 105 MM Tank Gun, I am not against guns, I am against people having guns who are not responsible. Those who rant on about the government coming to take their guns are paranoid mental midgets. Who in the government is coming to take your guns ? They cant stop or confiscate drugs, counterfeit money, can't stop car thefts, have literally millions of people with arrest warrants that they cannot find, and some people think that the local police or the army are going to force their way into millions of homes in the country and confiscate peoples deer rifles, shotguns and self protection pistols ? No serious people have said that they want to ban, or confiscate guns, they simply want some kind of background check on everyone who buys a gun.

Most of you seem to miss the point.... This was an unnecessary death. The ignorant, drug dealing son of a bitch who fathered this poor kid needs to be sterilized! And for that matter, so does his mother for letting him go to his father's home for the weekend. The poor 4 year old paid for his father's and mother's irresponsibilities with his life......

bubba-1946427

Some one quick tell Obama he is NOT to use guns for entertainment.

#3.28 @Ken:

I stand by my statements. I already have more readers agreeing with me than with you.

mpa

Sorry, but you are wrong. There are technically "rules" and "laws" regarding guns, but the NRA has removed any way to enforce them. The ATF is NOT ALLOWED to enforce any of the rules, they can not audit gun stores, they can not check to see who the gun stores are selling weapons to... hell, they can't even get a director because the NRA blocks it.

Did you know that you can stumble into a gun store, piss drunk, unable to see straight or even talk... and LEGALLY buy a gun? Do you know what the ATF says about that? "We suggest that gun stores owners do not sell to customers clearly under the influence of alcohol. Although it is not illegal, and you can sell to them, we ask that you do not." THAT'S IT. THAT is the extent of their power. Suggestions.

The laws ARE NOT ENFORCED. I don't care where you are, the ATF has no power to enforce ANY of the laws you preach about.

Look, I have no problem with guns. I own them myself... purchased in a state people "say" has "strict gun laws" with no background check, no waiting period, no nothing. The gun store didn't even check my ID. When I asked if they were supposed to, he laughed and said no one checks up on them so it is a waste of time. And this was in the "strictest state" according to you. I have a friend who collects guns, has over 30 of them... bought the last one drunk. Went straight from the bar to a gun store. No problems.

Personally I think we should just *gasp* actually ENFORCE the current laws... but the NRA will have nothing to do with that. No, it's obviously a much better strategy to make up laws and NEVER enforce them.

This whole argument is pointless. I don't know why people like YOU get upset about "new gun laws"... you know they will not be enforced, just like the rest of the so-called "laws". So why get your panties in a bunch over it?

I have said it before, and will say it again. Until we as a nation stop destroying babies at the rate of 3000 + abortions each and every day, the violence and bloodshed will continue. Death begets death. It is a part of our culture and we consider it the "norm". We have and continue to endorse in the USA the very thing we fought to end in Germany WW II - LEGAL EUTHANASIA and USE OF HUMAN BODY PARTS FOR FORMULATED IN MANY PRODUCTS:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDliDbp2Ky8.We are Nazi Germany. We know that the unborn baby is a human - even the pro-abortionist's agree, but choose to say it does not mean the bay should not be aborted - www.abortioninstrumets.com/ . Connect the dots folks. The reason we are having problems - weather, violence, etc., etc. is because of the choices we have made as a nation.

God tells us we are held accountable for the decisions we make - this message is for everyone:

"Today I set before you life and death; a blessing and a curse. Choose life that you and your descendants will live" - Deuteronomy 29:9 to 30:20 - the alternative is the curse of death!

Enneagram1

I stand by my statements. I already have more readers agreeing with me than with you...

Is exactly like "eat manure... 50 billion flies can't be wrong!"

You stated that like a true narcissist...

The Rational Hatter wrote: "I don't support gun bans (partially for the reasons that you state here) but I think it is perfectly fine to impose reasonable regulations such as universal background checks. It won't stop all crime (just like making murder illegal doesn't stop all murders) but the status quo is not working and something needs to change."

The status quo is working if you would bother to look up the facts instead of relying on what the media will sensationalize. Over the past 20 years or so gun homicides have dropped over 50% even though the number of guns and gun owners has risen dramatically over the same time.

The anti-gun lobby has been pretty quiet because of that until Sandy Hook happened. They, and the media, chose to use that tragedy to try and push their own agenda. And make no mistake, their ultimate goal is to ban all guns from private citizens.

Look at how the media is trying to sensationalize this story. There will always be accidents resulting in deaths of children but guns are a very small percentage of them. There are 700 or so swimming pool drowning deaths of kids 14 and under every year, but does the media make a big story out of those? There are more deaths to children due to car accidents, suffocation, poisoning, falls, environmental factors, medical mistakes and bicycle accidents compared to accidental firearm deaths but those don't fit the liberal media's agenda.

Really, this article isn't about gun rights, the NRA, sports, automobiles, etc. It is about a thief that robbed someone two years ago and stole their firearm and left it within reach of his 4 year old son which in turn also makes him guilty of man slaughter as his negligence led to the death of another as well as a huge list of other offenses. This has nothing to do with legal gun owners aside from it solves a two year old crime and created a host of new ones.

Hmmm... Mike-424215 Of course you are correct. Marquiez Deshon Pratt, 21, is the poster boy for why most men should have to pass a test and buy a permit before they are allowed to have any type of unprotected sex with the opposite sex.

Criminal behavior involving theft and drugs is just plain stupid; but, then as Forrest Gump said many years ago, "Stupid is as stupid does."

I hope there will be a full range of charges, once the prosecutors get a real grasp of the situation; and, I hope there will be convictions on all the charges. I also hope the sentencing judge will give this guy 50 years without any early release.

There's a chance that Mr. Pratt will get to prison and learn that he has a bunkie with the name of Guido, Carmine, or Bubba, who does not like child killers.

Mr. Pratt looks like a real sweetheart, and I'm sure that Texas prison inmates are already having a pool or lottery to see who gets to have him as their bunkie.

ItsAboutTime-3704531

Obama can't have gun control laws.. that would mean righties would actually have to ADMIT there is a gun problem in this country. You can't blame OBAMA for something righties wont even support.

By your logic either (1) "lefties" supported the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, or (2) you can't blame Bush for them.

@Mike-424215 - THANK YOU! It seems no one was reading the article NOR the headline. "STOLEN GUN". Finally an intelligent statement in all these 'gun control v. 2nd amendment right' comments.

Severed Head in a Jar

They are for sport you moron. What do you think hunting is.

As George Carlin once said, "Hunting will be a sport when deer carry bazookas."

George Carlin was a satanist. He is in hell as we speak. Have you ever seen a mountain lion or bear shred a deer? Are you going to convict the lion or bear for murdering the deer? When a hunter "takes" a deer its quick. Mountain lions or bears are not humane in the way they kill. Bambi doesnt exist. We all live off each other.

myguy -

So the ATF cannot enforce the laws and the NRA is to blame? So the NRA blocks the ATF from enforcing the laws so more laws can be written/passed? Yeah that works. The NRA does want the current laws enforced but yet they push the hardest to get the govt to even prosecute the people who have broken the laws but the govt seems to refuse to do that. The director was blocked because he has close ties to the anti gun crowd and instead of working at compromise, the govt just said it's him or no one. But it's the NRA's fault. How convenient.

You say your friend bought a gun drunk and you bought a gun without showing proper identification - the first may or may not be a crime but the second sure is! Did you report the gun dealer? Did you talk to your friend about buying a gun drunk, hell did you talk to him about driving drunk? Nah, don't worry about it. Oh yeah does buying a gun without showing proper id and not reporting it and letting your friend buy a gun (and drive) drunk make you a "responsible" citizen never mind a "responsible" gun owner? You criticize the NRA but do nothing when you see and know of a crime plus a potentially dangerous situation. Nice.

Never leave a loaded pistol around!!!!! Never!! He was very irresponsible and this cost him the life of his precious son. I hope he will turn his life around. God help him to turn his life around!

"I messed up." That is the understatement of the year...

I guess if legal gun owners have problems keeping and storing their guns properly, you can't expect much more from a thief and crack addict.

Let's hope neither the father or the mother have another child!

MM584706 -

Would background checks at gun shows and private sales have stopped the Newtown shooting? How about Aurora? Or Virginia Tech? Wasn't this latest spate of legislation supposed to be in response to those shootings? All the guns used in those shootings were bought through dealers but now we are talking about background checks at gun shows and private sales. Oh you'll say we can't get the assault weapons ban or the high capacity magazine ban so we'll get the background check law passed. This looks like magicians sleight of hand work going on here. We know by some magical number given to us that 40% of gun sales have no background checks and therefore it must be a problem. Because anyone who is buying a gun without a background check must have something to hide. But we don't know if it is even a problem, so by applying the logic used in other posts on other social issues (like voter fraud for an example), if it is not a problem we should not be trying to pass a law to stop it. So why are we wanting background checks? Because then people can say they did something and pat themselves on the back that they made a "better" world until the next inevitable shooting incident. Instead of passing another law on background checks, take the current system and make it better - get monies to state governments to update their reporting of mental health issues, (VA Tech and Aurora) and monies for programs where people can find out about mental issues and possible cures without getting stigmatized (Newtown) but no, we will pass another law (which BTW would be just about impossible to implement), say it will be different this time and then when the next shooting happens scream, shout and cry "How could this happen we passed this law? Add in enforcing existing laws and you will see a change that will work.

Ashley, I just can't get enough of you libs and your deflection. A stolen gun ultimately killed a child and you blame the lawful owner as well as the scumbag dad. So if the dirtbag in question stole my TV and it fell on his baby, it would be my fault? I also love the little story about the motivations of someone you have never met. Judge much? I have a challenge for you; since you are sooooo smart, tell us how to solve all of our problems. O Great and Powerful Oz, lmfao.

GodblessAmerica-1789597

bubba, half of the firearms I own were made specifically for target sports. They were designed from the ground up to smash clay targets or punch holes in paper. The other half were designed to efficiently deal with threats to life and limb. Besides, why is the original purpose of an inanimate object so important to all of you antis anyways? If objects themselves are responsible for deaths, than autos--which take more lives than guns--should be a major focus of concern. Does it really matter what original purpose is compared the actual impact? Fertilizer was not designed with the purpose of creating bombs with the power to topple buildings yet it can be abused that way. Guns are just tools--they can be abused/misused like anything else. That poor 4 year old was a victim of extremely poor parenting. Again, we have a criminal that scoffs at gun laws and the result is a senseless death. Until we start demanding accountability from the individuals that actually make up our society, these types of tragedies will continue.

Actually, mordern inorganic fertilizers are a recent use within the last 50 years. The original use of the ammonia produced from the Haber-Bosch process was to obtain nitrogen compounds for the production of explosives. It is a sad fact that so much of human technological progress has been driven by war. But as it turned out ammoina production had another life giving purpose, in agriculture, and today some 80% of ammonia produced is used in fertilizer.

Firearms are no exception they were invented for warfare as well. Of course firearms also proved useful for hunting, back when hunting was a very important human activity. Firearms would never have been invented for the purpose of poking holes in paper targets at a distance. Target shooting was brought about because of the need to train soldiers to be better killers. Today they have made a "sport" out of firearms practice, but that doesn't change the fundamental nature of firearms. They are tools to make human into more efficient killers.

I find bringing automobiles and fertilizer into the debate about firearms is rather strange considering how heavily regulated ammonia fertilzer is, especially since Oklahoma City. Also Auto mobiles are regulated heavily (both in terms of ownership and how and when they can be operated) and owners must register them and insure them. Also drivers must have a lisence to drive. All of this is because of the dangerous potential of these things when used improperly and irresponsibly.

They need to fry Mr. Dad for child neglect as well as the judge that granted the scumbag unsupervised visitation. My grandson's father was granted unsupervised visitation despite the father's extensive police record. After receiving 2nd degree burns (twice) because he was forced to stay outside all day for the entire weekend while dear ole dad partied inside in the A/C, we decided to hell with the judge. He hasn't see dead beat dad since.

mpa-4893349

Go Google: "Olympic targer rifles." I'm pretty sure that at several thousand dollas, they are not purchased for killing. I would also bet none has ever been used in a gun murder.

Right... and who is going after these rifles? Who is trying to "take them away"? N O B O D Y. That's who. Go Google: "Mass Hysteria".

1. Swimming pool accidents kill more American children a year than firearm accidents.

2. If you want your genes to go on, you might want to lock up your guns around your kids when they're 4 years old.

3. This guy is not only going to jail, but his genetic line may be foiled. This is survival of the fittest at work. He isn't mentally fit, so his seed ends with him. It's sad his child died, but only for the child's sake. We don't need to use eugenics to weed out these weak genes, we just need to not subsidize their idiocy. In his case, we didn't subsidize his moronic behavior by giving him free passes or funding for free. So the market/nature took its course and now he hopeftully won't pollute the species any further with his dumb-dumb genes. That's not cruel...it's reality.

4. I hope he (the father) wasn't his parents' only kid. Someone once told me "farmers in agrarian economies centuries ago had lots of kids to work on the farm, but the added benefit was more chances at their genes making it. Not every kid is a winner." The father clearly wasn't an evolutionary winner.

5. You can't legislate enough to fix stupid. Ignorance is a lack of education, but stupid is an inability to learn. I don't mean a learning diability either, I mean an inability to stop doing stuff that is totally self destructive even though you have an intelligence in the 'normal" range.

6. Gun control has proven ineffective at changing the rate of decline of murder rates, violent crime rates, suicide rates, and accidental death rates. It only slows GUN murder rates, crime rates, etc. But the total still stays the same or changes at the same rates it was previous to gun control...it just shifts to other means. In this case, the kid would have died drinking some household poison or something. The father was neglectful, and that was the fatal aspect. The gn was just one of many ways he was neglectful, all of which were potentially fatal. Ask yourself: did the father strap the kid in his car seat? Cut his food small enough? Keep him from playing in the street? The answer is likely "no" to more than one. I remember when I grew up, in a bad neighbrohood, MOST kids played in the middle of the street until after dark and DARED cars to hit them (they refused to move for cars until the car stopped and beeped). Bad parents = more dead kids. If you increase risk bad results can follow. You don't treat the whole of society like children because a few idiots can't handle responsibilities. You have such a low chance of being killed by a gun by murder or accident it's ridiculous. Even if you count legal self defense gun deaths and suicides, the chance you'll die from a gun in the USA is almost the same as dying from the flu. Meanwhile the 9 nations in Europe with the LOWEST gun ownership rates have a 3 times higher murder and suicide rate than the 9 European nations with the highest rates of gun ownership. Logically, you cannot have causation withut a correlaton. There is no causation between gun ownership rates and MURDER and SUICIDE (which is not the same as "homocide" - a much more general statistic). The same is true of violent crime rates and accidental death rates. All of those things are higher in low gun ownership rate nations, racial groups, income brackets, high population centers, and places the Drug War rages most. Again, no correlation = no causation.

Enneagram1

Hunting is not a 'sport' for the animals. To them, it is unadulterated murder.

LOL! So when animals hunt each other they are actually committing murder and they know it even huh?? Give me a break!

I stand by my statements. I already have more readers agreeing with me than with you.

And I thought your first post was funnier than @!$%#! So there are 13 more idiots, do you actually think that somehow validates your comment??

Wow, I've never seen so many bullsh*t talking points in one post before. Well done, Mr.Proindividual, sir.

Right... and who is going after these rifles? Who is trying to "take them away"? N O B O D Y. That's who. Go Google: "Mass Hysteria".

Are you so foolish or so sophistic to believe that gun owners don't realize banning "assault" rifles and high capacity magazines wouldn't mean we wouldn't be able to purchase them in the future and would only be permited to keep the ones already in circulation? If you take a right to buy something away you have effectively, in tme, taken that thing away. Guns do rust afterall.

Stop making dumb arguments and ad hominems (like refering to us as "hysterical"). It's not going to win in a high school debate class, let alone among logical adults.

Rick's Real

mpa-4893349

"Go Google: "Olympic targer rifles." I'm pretty sure that at several thousand dollas, they are not purchased for killing. I would also bet none has ever been used in a gun murder."

Right... and who is going after these rifles? Who is trying to "take them away"? N O B O D Y. That's who. Go Google: "Mass Hysteria".

You were supposed to Google the rifle. Why didn't you do that before commenting?? If you had you'd notice that many of them have a pistol grip which under Feinsteins new definition would classify them as "Assault weapons". So much for your "mass hysteria". Maybe you shouldn't suggest others look up facts if you are incapable of doing so yourself.

Hunting is not a 'sport' for the animals. To them, it is unadulterated murder.

Ooh, I can play the hyperbole game too. Here goes:

And every harvest is a holocaust to the crops!

Does the "food chain" ring a bell? Who do you think provides the meat at the grocery store? The Meat Fairy? I assure you hunting is much more natural and less cruel than the factory farming used to feed millions who would starve if we reverted back to hunter-gatherer or agrarian economics. You should look at hunters as people who reduce cruelty by not outsourcing it to other people who aren't nearly as sporting or careful in their techniques. At least deer get to be free before being hunted down...cows have it much worse.

Wow, I've never seen so many bullsh*t talking points in one post before. Well done, Mr.Proindividual, sir.

Care to expand upon that comment? See, that wasn't a point by point retort, it was a nonsense insult. Logic class would have done you some good.

I can give you links if you doubt the stats I referenced. Calling facts "talking points" or "bullsh*t" hardly makes it true.

dgeding -

What difference does it make the reason that firearms were invented? It's how they are used. Firearms are not inherently evil, they are pieces of steel that if left alone do not kill or maim. If left alone they would eventually rust away, not leap up and go on a killing spree. All you are trying to do when you "blame" the gun is remove the self responsibility of the person holding the gun.

They are tools to make human into more efficient killers. Only if they want to be/

Are far as automobilies, can you have more than one automobile? Can you have a fast one? How about a BIG one? Do you have to fill out a form stating you are not a criminal, mentally insane, have a court order against you, etc? Do people look at you strange and question your mental stability when you say you are going to buy fast, big, gas hog, (fill in the blank)? Can you be thrown in jail for driving your automobile where it is banned? Do they even do that? Can states or the federal government tell you that you can't have this car or any car at all? Do they tell you that you can only (and should) buy this car because you don't need anything better? You are required by law to have a license and insurance to drive a car but does everyone follow those laws? You don't need either of those to drive a automobile.

All of this is because of the dangerous potential of these things when used improperly and irresponsibly.

Really? All this for automobiles because they are dangerous when used improperly and irresponsibly. I always thought is was because of the monies generated for the states. You may noticed that a lot of MVDs are part of the tax and revenue departments in a lot of states.

This man found out the hard way, that a little carelessness can ruin your whole life. He made a mistake his child paid for with his life, one he can never take back.

Protect your children, keep guns out of their reach and/or gun safes, lock boxes or gunlocks. Just because you tell your child that guns are dangerous and they are not toys, you have to remember, you are talking to a child and they do not always listen and obey.

@Jermo. Abortion could have been the answer. Someone should of aborted this father before he could bring this poor kid into the world.

I love it when people quote the bible. It instantly tells me to skim over that part of the point you are trying to make.

Why bring more kids into the world that are going to grow up in the criminal mindset and most likely become criminals themselves? Sterilization is the answer! Looks to me that the only tragedy here is that the father didn't win a Darwin award instead of bestowing one to his ill-fated offspring!

LiberalsRCommies

George Carlin was a satanist. He is in hell as we speak. Have you ever seen a mountain lion or bear shred a deer? Are you going to convict the lion or bear for murdering the deer? When a hunter "takes" a deer its quick. Mountain lions or bears are not humane in the way they kill. Bambi doesnt exist. We all live off each other.

I guess it wasn't obvious, but ahhh....cougars and bears are usually killing to eat. Most hunters grab their $800+ in guns, clothing, camo, calls, decoys and scents and kill for fun, sometimes being stupid enough to claim they need the meat, but usually just admitting that killing things that have a slim chance at retaliation at best is good fun. Now, there are dirt-poor families out there that do need to hunt, and they're following the true path of nature. Most hunters though (and likely the ones chatting away on MSN articles) do not kill because they need food. Murder? Maybe not. Is it sadistic, cruel and pathetic to needlessly kill animals? That sounds about right. And assuming you know anything about hunting, you know that even experienced hunters occasionally lose track of animals they've merely wounded. City boys and hillbilly wannabe's can make an outright mess of an "attempted" kill.

And George Carlin in Hell? You sound just like the people that made his career in comedy so easy. I'm sure he'd thank you for all the material your kind has provided if he could.

CJ-1087477

sometimes being stupid enough to claim they need the meat, but usually just admitting that killing things that have a slim chance at retaliation at best is good fun

Speaking of stupid claims...you do seem to be an expert on that subject but clearly you don't know much about the people you're whining about. If you had a clue what sort of garbage is sold in the grocery stores you'd realize that for many people "need" is hardly the one and only acceptable reason to hunt. I also suspect you'd be less whiny if you realized the damage millions of extra deer would do to crop lands (not to mention road accidents) and the impact that would have on your grocery bill.

That sounds about right. And assuming you know anything about hunting, you know that even experienced hunters occasionally lose track of animals they've merely wounded.

And assuming you don't know jack @!$%# about the food you eat so have no clue the horrible and short life most of your meals lead. Funny how many of you anti-hunting types don't concern yourself too much over that.

Speaking of assumptions...

Heard of vegetarians?

And spare me the bull@!$%# about hunters being the only thing standing between civilized society and a deerpocalypse. The arrogance. Less hunting = more deer. More deer = more predators. More predators = less deer. More deer = less forage. Less forage = less deer. Ecology is fascinating, and it has a way of sorting itself out if left alone. Deer weren't out of control when a few humans first wandered across the ice. Deer weren't out of control when a few more people showed up in boats, and they're not out of control now in a country of 300+ million.

Before you make any other wild, baseless, borderline desperate assumptions, let me explain that my views don't come from being some long-haired neo-hippy ecoterrorist that brags about owning a Prius. Rather, I grew up in the sticks of Montana, living a few thousand dollars below the poverty line. Back then, a deer was the difference between a hot meal or another bowl of shelter distributed cornflakes. The kind that comes in a white box.

So growing up, my brokeass hillbilly community thought sports hunters were pretty damn funny. They came to the woods on the weekend to work out stress with their high-tech and expensive toys, clumsily wasting bullets on meat they didn't need and rarely used. Oblivious of their place in the order of nature, and the furthest thing from a true hunter. Don't kill it if you don't intend to eat it. If your daddy taught you anything different, smack him for failing to make you into a man, and keep your chairborne ass in the city.

What difference does it make the reason that firearms were invented? It's how they are used. Firearms are not inherently evil, they are pieces of steel that if left alone do not kill or maim. If left alone they would eventually rust away, not leap up and go on a killing spree. All you are trying to do when you "blame" the gun is remove the self responsibility of the person holding the gun.

It makes one important difference and that is all about having a real discussion about firearms. Its not about good or evil, its about safe and unsafe. At any point did I state that I thought some how some inanimate object was going to come alive and start acting of it own volition?

Additionally, at what point did I state that I felt the firearm was to blame for the actions of the one holding it? I feel responsible gun ownership begins with proper repect for the firearm. Understanding the fact that firearms were designed to kill is an important first step toward developing that respect. Firearms were not invented for shooting holes in paper targets, sure there is no reason you can't use one that way. But, you still have to remember that even a target shooting pistol can be used to kill.

I think that if this idiot in the story had had such respect he wouldn't have left his pistol laying around where his four year old son could get a hold of it. Do you?

Hey RICK!!!! Didn't you even bother to read about the proposals on gun regs? My $4,000 olympic rifle is going to be banned because of the thumb hole in the wooden adjustable stock...

And please look up the word, NON-Transferable.... it means that the gun has to be confiscated when I don't want it or want to give it away to my kids... Just smell what the libs are cooking.. it STINKS from lies.

Another child dead, more baloney from the gun apologists. Nothing new here.

The boy's father stole the gun that his son shot himself with. How secure are your guns in case of a robbery at your home?

Guns are a prime target for thieves and you gun nuts are out buying them like crazy.

Think about it.

"Gun Nuts" really? Why is it necessary for name calling? I respond to more calls involving knives and blunt objects, than I do with guns. Everyone that I know that has guns keeps them secure, when I get home from work I lock mine up (Deputy).

@kaybee.... what happened if the original legal gun owner didn't have kids but kept his house locked up.

Isn't that locking up your gun? Then some punk with a long wrap sheet that SHOULD have been serving time broke into the legal gun owner's home?? So what now? Start baring up windows tighter than Fort Knox? A friend of mind who's house was broken into, they ripped out and carried away his gun safe...

Obviously you have no idea on how many types of shooting there are and distances, and types of competitions out there with firearms.. The only crazy people are the ones who try to come up with stupid laws that won't do a damn thing about crime or gun violence, and don't understand why there is no thing called an assault weapon in the hands of civilians (unless have special permits). My AR just LOOKS like a military weapon but in fact it's a H-Bar target rifle... has "oh my" black plastic hand grip and a carrying handle on top... doesn't mean a darn if I can swap out a magazine in less than a second now does it?

kaybeetoys with more BS

guns are available on the black market and not the kind legal gun owners are restricted to. you can find pistols, sub machine gun autos and even M67 frag grenades on the street with no serial numbers for enough cash. save us your liberal drivel, thieves will steal and even kill homeowners for what they want if they can get cash on the street and Chicago proves they can.

CJ-1087477

Speaking of assumptions...

Heard of vegetarians?

Yes I have but since your rant did not include any "meat is evil" type references it seemed like a safe assumption that you were not one yourself. (I also note that you are not claiming to be one so was my assumption off base???)

And spare me the bull@!$%# about hunters being the only thing standing between civilized society and a deerpocalypse. The arrogance. Less hunting = more deer. More deer = more predators. More predators = less deer. More deer = less forage. Less forage = less deer

Oh my God! ROTFLMAO!! What predators? Our ancestors wiped them out. There isn't anything bigger than a coyote within 300 miles of where I live. Less forage???? Are you @!$%#ing kidding!?!?! Have you never left the city and seem farmland?? We GROW all of the forage they could ever want. 100,000 deer are harvested each year in my state alone. Surly you can't actually be claiming that having an extra 100,000 deer ever year (not to mention the exponential growth that would occur when those deer have offspring) would have no impact on the local economy and environment?? And do you actually think that tens of thousands of deer starving to death every winter is somehow better or more humane than allowing those deer to be shot?? Really??

So growing up, my brokeass hillbilly community thought sports hunters were pretty damn funny.

And yet somehow you are still ignorant enough to believe that they represent the majority of hunters. Forgive me if I have a little trouble believing your back story.

I also note that you neglected to comment on my assertion that some people hunt for quality more than need. Just because some people can afford to buy the garbage they sell in most grocery stores doesn't mean those people should be forced to.

Yes I have but since your rant did not include any "meat is evil" type references it seemed like a safe assumption that you were not one yourself. (I also note that you are not claiming to be one so was my assumption off base???)

Weird right? I agree that livestock conditions are horrible (do you perpetuate the "horrible conditions" you mentioned?) therefore I abstain because I can afford to. However, if the situation ever arose when I could not afford sufficient alternative foods, I wouldn't hesitate to take my quota of game. Meat isn't inherently evil, because survival comes first, and our species is built for and has a history of consuming meat. It is natural. However, wasting meat or unnecessarily promoting the suffering of other beings is in my opinion unethical. Take what you need, do what you must to survive, it's very simple.

Oh my God! ROTFLMAO!! What predators? Our ancestors wiped them out. There isn't anything bigger than a coyote within 300 miles of where I live. Less forage???? Are you @!$%#ing kidding!?!?! Have you never left the city and seem farmland?? We GROW all of the forage they could ever want. 100,000 deer are harvested each year in my state alone. Surly you can't actually be claiming that having an extra 100,000 deer ever year (not to mention the exponential growth that would occur when those deer have offspring) would have no impact on the local economy and environment?? And do you actually think that tens of thousands of deer starving to death every winter is somehow better or more humane than allowing those deer to be shot?? Really??

1: Your local corn patch doesn't represent the entire country. Many areas, many states would see a predator boom and the deer population would stabilize. It's what nature does, if it hasn't been @!$%#ed with to the point of being broken.

2: Local situations may vary, this is a given. If the local ecology is so mauled that a particular species is out of control, then it is our responsibility to minimize damage, one method of which may be culling. The preservation of balance in this case is a local issue; we were talking about sports hunting in general. Could "sports" hunting be the answer to a local, out of control deer population? Possibly. But that doesn't make "sports" hunters as a whole the Stewards of Balance and Champions of Good. It's merely the lesser evil in a situation that is our fault to begin with.

3: Population booms and subsequent starvation/die-offs are a natural sequence of events. It happens all the time, and no species is exempt from it. If a die-off would lead to the relative stabilization of the species, then merely keeping the population in check by killing a hundred thousand deer every year for all eternity isn't the cut-and-dried moral high road, no. I'd favor permanent or natural solutions. If a bunch of country boys shooting critters for fun is part of that equation, so be it, but it's not a universal answer or justification for anything.

And yet somehow you are still ignorant enough to believe that they represent the majority of hunters. Forgive me if I have a little trouble believing your back story.

I also note that you neglected to comment on my assertion that some people hunt for quality more than need. Just because some people can afford to buy the garbage they sell in most grocery stores doesn't mean those people should be forced to.

Either you're killing for sufficient food, or your not. People that kill to supplement their diets? I can take it or leave it - meat would have been taken from one thing or another I'm sure. It's rather like a fat housecat that snubs Fancy Feast and instead nabs a mouse or a bird...as long as it gets eaten. Otherwise though, it's wasteful, and it shows a disconnect from your roots, and in my experience taking what you need is not the way of your average hunter, even one that "thinks" they;re from the real country.

You have doubts about my story? I didn't even mention that I was living without electricity, running water or phone at the time in a log cabin 40 miles from the nearest town. I encountered grizzlies at least once a month during the summer. I even got to touch a problem bear the "Bear People" sedated, then relocated. Sound unlikely? I'm sure it does, I won't fault you for your unwillingness to believe. Take a nice trip up to Polebridge some time if you feel verification is important. I can give you directions to the Ramon property, and you can ask them about CJ. Otherwise...

I cant imagine what the family is going through right now, and all the regrets pushing on the boy's father. Does everyone see the man's face, its the meaning of guilt. Even so, the boy should have never been in such a position to shoot himself or around guns, the man should feel guilty in fact more than that.

Back East

Just smell what the libs are cooking.. it STINKS from lies.

The smell to which you refer is more realistically coming from the stench of the rotting corpses of thousands of people killed by gun violence every year.

oldhamletman

You said: "like it or not, almost all people who have guns view them as a sport... it's in the Olympics... everyone in the world thinks its a legitimate sport except you . . . people collect them, modify them as a hobby, go target shooting, hunting, whatever they do, and none of us see it as the magical death machine you do....

car racing, breathing, eating peanut butter, skydiving, walking out your front door in the morning can all kill us... guns are just another thing doing it...."

Well, like it or not, most people have guns because of the impending race war or because the government is coming to get them. And these are sane, responsible people who should have guns??? In the list above, the ONLY thing you mentioned that is actually MANUFACTURED TO KILL PEOPLE is guns.

@kaybeetoys, you want to hold a law-abiding gun owner responsible for what is done with his gun by the person who stole it. OK, let's follow that line of reasoning to it's logical conclusion. Let's say a law is passed that puts responsibility on the gun owner; do you truly think that if the gun is stolen that the owner would risk reporting it, knowing that he might be held accountable for murder? So now we have a bunch more stolen guns out there because the criminals know that the owner is unlikely to report it stolen. Now criminals would be getting away with more crimes, because as far as the law is concerned, the gun is legal. You would see a rise in criminal statistics involving legal owners; giving the gun controllers more leverage and more rights would be stripped from us. Pretty soon, no more guns. Oh, wait, except for the criminals; they would have them all. So, instead, why don't we put the blame squarely where it belongs; on the criminal scumbags doing the robbing, killing, etc.

Oh, wait, except for the criminals; they would have them all. So, instead, why don't we put the blame squarely where it belongs; on the criminal scumbags doing the robbing, killing, etc.

What about the Cop? Recently - there is a post about the son of a veteran cop (kid was 4 years old) - found Dads service pistol on the table - ended up killing himself. Are you saying the LEO is a gangster or criminal scumbag?

'Cause from reading your "put the blame squarely where where it belongs" rant;it would appear that "only" scumbags screw-up do all the robbing and killing?

From my observation - anything, anyone - at one time or another will phuck up.The Sons of man are never perfect, thus the twin notions of forgiveness and mercy.

Oh...are you saying that return to grace is limited to only certain special people?

Nice rant, beo. The cop was obviously responsible for the death of his child. Nice attempt at deflection, though. And yes, if someone is robbing and killing, they are scumbags. Yes, we do make mistakes. Being ripped off isn't one of them. You seem to be one of those who try to make the perps out to be the victim. Personally, I could care less if their mommy and daddy didn't treat them right; they make the decision to hurt others, no one else. And yes, I am saying that return to grace is limited to certain special people; those people that decide not to hurt others and decide to change their way. Oh, if you are ever mugged, I think you should explain to the mugger your beliefs about forgiveness and mercy; I'm sure he will stop and change immediately.

Nice rant, beo. The cop was obviously responsible for the death of his child

I can't believe you are saying we should put a police officer in jail for allowing his son access to a loaded gun, you are almost saying that a cop is no better than some scum bag, hoodlum! So what if they (fathers) both made the mistake of leaving a loaded weapon in a place where a curious kid might pick it up and be lulled into playing with it.

Aren't cops different than common dirt bag, drug dealers?

You never know when you are going to need to "pop a cap in somebody's ass" when you are conducting free lance pharmacy practices for unprescribed medications. You can't put the gun is a "safe" place in case somebody tries to relieve you of your products and your hard earned cash.

He stole the gun.

The whole stolen gun part makes it moot anyway.

I hope he gets charged with murder since he was sorta kinda committing a felony.

dawg

I will side with he was not, since it is illegal to have a gun in your possession or buy a gun if you use illegal drugs.

Actually you are wrong. They with let you join the FBI even if you have done drugs.

flnobody: yes, but the stolen gun being used by your kid to kill himself might be an issue.

Not enough words to tell you what I think of this case. Except daddy should not have been taking a nap while his 4 year old was under his roof

Anytime someone dies in the commission of a felony, than they are charged with murder. Possession of illegal drugs with intent to distribute... felony! Possession of a stolen firearm...felony! Child abuse because of the two....felony! Being idiot, criminal, piece of sh*t....not a felony (but should be)!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually it is felony murder. Felony possession of stolen property, drug possession, illegal transfer of firearm. ect.

You never know when you are going to need to "pop a cap in somebody's ass" when you are conducting free lance pharmacy practices for unprescribed medications. You can't put the gun is a "safe" place in case somebody tries to relieve you of your products and your hard earned cash.

Hence the Drug War causes more problems than it solves.

21 years old witha 4 year old kid. He wasn't destined to amount to much in life.

He was a pretty successful gun thief.

He was a pretty successful gun thief.

Apparently he was also proficient with the use of a scale......

We don't know if HE stole the gun, just that it was stolen.

@Dawgfan-4710266 - your an idiot. Just because you have a child at an early age doesn't mean you will amount to nothing. That was an extremely unintelligent comment. Why don't you focus on the fact that he was INVOLVED WITH DRUGS or maybe the fact that he had a STOLEN GUN IN HIS POSSESSION or maybe the fact that he had the weapon loaded in reach of a tiny child. People like you embarrass me with your ignorance.

Pedestrian-in-SF - "How does "well regulated militia" end up equating to completely unregulated populace in your world, Dawg?"

Well-regulated, in the context of the Constitution, is defined as "sufficiently armed and accoutered".

The militia in this context refers to "every able-bodied man of at least 17 and under 45 years of age who are not members of the National Guard." Eliminating the sex and age discrimination turns this into "every person of at least 17".

So the translation into today's vernacular is "A well-armed populace".

Please Google "well regulated militia" for confirmation.

Dawgfan.... that's a pretty ignorant statement. I think he wasn't destined for much because he stole and sold drugs. But to say that he wasn't destined for greatness because he had a child at 17 is just plain ridiculous! But what do I know? I only had three kids by the time I was 22 and now at the age of 27 work a very successful job and own two homes (which I EARNED myself and not with the help of mommy and daddy)

dawgfanwas right. Here he is - in jail, dead kid, possession of a stolen gun, possession of illegal drugs, possession of paraphernalia, weekend parent, etc. How can anybody deem that successful?

Seriously John C? Does it matter whether he stole it or someone else did and he just had possession of it? Don't forget he also had "possession" of a variety of drugs, paraphernalia, and packaging materials. Obviously this young man has made some poor choices in his life. It is just too bad that his son paid the price for his poor choices. Also sad that young people these days don't understand that taking a nap when you have young children is just not a good idea. Kids seem to have a radar for getting into the things you don't want them in whenever you aren't looking. When they are too young to understand the consequences you have to watch them.

Sounds like the kid took it from him.

So, the stolen gun got stolen from him and then the 4 year old used it to commit suicide, right.

Well, good thing we have "the right to keep and bear arms."

dirp....has nothing to do with the "right to bear arms". He had this gun illegally, it was stolen, and the previous owner shares guilt for leaving it unsecured where it could be stolen. Lots of tragedy and guilt here, but nothing about the right to bear arms.

John C-1841816

yep your right but I am betting he did not have a back round check done. And if he did not steal it then receiving stolen property is also a crime.

how do you know it was un-secured ?

Because it was able to be stolen. Secured guns are just that by definition-- secure. They aren't someplace where someone can steal them.

Someone explain how it would be my fault if someone broke into my home and stole my gun. My home is my hard earned space, if I want to hang guns from strings in my living room why should I not be able to do that? The minute you break into my house, you are a criminal. Then, you steal my property... then use it to commit another crime... and I should be at fault?

A gun locked in a safe is of no use during a break in. Often there isn't enough time to react even if you keep it by your bed.

We don't know if HE stole the gun, just that it was stolen.

John C 5.4, I would guess that it was he, Pratt, who stole the gun.... wager?

Brent981,

In many states it is against the LAW to have a UNSECURED gun in a house, when there is a minor present...

If I steal your car or your wife/children, use it to commit a CRIME. YOU will lose your car...

If your wife &/or children preform illegal acts in YOUR house. ie sell drugs, dispense alcohol (DRAM Law), etc. YOU will lose your house...

If you loan your gun to someone that is a convicted criminal (unknown to you). You will lose your gun and could go to JAIL yourself...

IMO - ALL gun owners should be held ACCOUNTABLE for any crime committed with their UNSECURED GUN. Just like their other possessions...

BTY - I'm former Military, have guns & a CCW. My guns are either LOCKED-UP in a SAFE or on my side...

If you HAVE to have a unsecured gun by your bed, due to the environment you live-in. I suggest you MOVE...

AC, you have just put forward another line of reasoning that I just love you libs for:" If you HAVE to have a unsecured gun by your bed, due to the environment you live-in. I suggest you MOVE... "

So you are saying that if I need to defend myself in my neighborhood, it is my fault. Even if when I bought my house it was a nice area? And then the city decides to put in a public housing project? I should allow myself to be run out of my home? Honestly, I don't care if I live in a gated community with armed response; I'll still own a gun. And since I have no children in my home, if I choose to leave a weapon on every table in my home, it is my home and I'll do as I wish. I could lock my guns up in a safe, but do you think a criminal with a little time wouldn't steal a gun safe. Crap, they steal whole atm machines these days. Pull your lib nose out of my a** and mind your own business.

@Mike C. I agree with you. I'm not a conservative republican. Guess I must be a liberal. Oh wait, if I was a liberal, I wouldn't be agreeing with you! WTF??? *shrugs*

There are plenty of factors that go into a neighborhood's demographic. People who live in bad neighborhoods have guard dogs, bars on the windows, weapons in their nightstands. You can't always expect the police to get there in time to save everyone.

Criminals will avoid homes with guard dogs, bars, and armed occupants for a reason. They know it won't be as easy to burglarize than the place who isn't as secure. Simple as that.

Mike C.-923116,

I'm a Lib, because I'm not willing to live in a DANGEROUS environment??? Ha! Ha!

You are willing to risk your and YOUR FAMILIES safety, due to EGO &/or economics. What does that make YOU???

I have traveled the World and currently live in a country which is 5x the USA's homicide rate. But I did not choose to settle down in a high crime area & I will move-out when the addicts move-in...

BTY - This country puts drug dealers and chronic users - TO DEATH. I & my wife can walk down the back-streets @ night SAFELY, in a city with almost 20+MILLION people...

If you're so enlightened then spread the light otherwise keep the negativity to yourself. There is no deeper poverty than ignorance.

Charles the crack dealer killed his son. How is he not a loser?

How is he not a loser? How to you gauge success? Is it based on the job you landed? Is it based on an impressive stock portfolio? Is it based on how many people you made smile today? His focus isn't the same as yours so how can you honestly say your choices in life are better? Are you completely happy? Do you have all the answers? No one is ever correct when they judge another so poorly. We are all born, we all live, we all make mistakes, we all learn and we all die. No one is greater then the other.

Charles -

While I will grant that I think you are deluded, I will state that from what I know of the "dad" in this story and yourself (admittedly little), I would say you are probably greater than the felonious gun holder, drug dealer and father of a young child dead at dad's hands.

Are we all equal in this world? Gahndi, MLK Jr? Hitler, Stalin? Bundy, McVeigh?

Join us in the real world, it isn't so bad . . .

Well if you say so but you're confusing their decisions with their humanity. People are equal. Their situations are what differ.

Ah, dream on . . .

Some of us see, and recognize, good and evil. Apparently you only see situations.

...keep the negativity to yourself.

How is a 4 y.o. killing himself in a drug den with a stolen gun considered a positive?

...then spread the light...

You'd have to be pretty dim not to see the light for yourself.

There is no such thing as good and evil. That is a delusional thought process. This is a situation.

Only if you believe that there is no right and no wrong. I guess the 4-year-old was just a victim of "situation," eh?

I sincerely hope you own no guns, and probably shouldn't have a driver's license either.

Damn, some of you 47%ers just make me laugh... you'll give anyone a pass! A 21 y/o babies daddy, drug dealer, and theif and he's NOT a loser??

WOW.. next thing you'll tell me is BHO is a great president!!

@Charles, so "humanity" isn't to be judged here? You might be right! "Humanity" doesn't apply to someone who is clearly an animal who shouldn't be allowed to breed. Oh wait, I take that back! I have known ANIMALS that take better care of their offspring than this scum of the earth, drug dealing, non-thinking, pimple on the ass of society, felon!

If you think he is so "humane", please let him baby- sit your son or daughter then see what happens. Or better yet, visit him in prison and become his biggest cheerleader. I am sure as soon as he gets tired of being Bubba's ass-candy he will "find" 'God' and everything will be something that can be forgiven. Oh, except for the kid who is dead.

Well it's sad that you people manipulate my words and twist them to your lower standards. This is a situation and the child probably chose this path before he was born just to teach his father something. They were probably friends in Heaven and chose to come here in order to further themselves. Usually when I child dies this is exactley the reason. You have no clue what lies beyond what you see so I say DO NOT JUDGE. You are not qualified. People would murder this man on a mistake, hang him, spit on him. He made the mistake but it's not with out purpose.

Is this sad? Yes Could this have been avoided? Yes Is this any of our business? NO! Worry about what you can control. Learn from this and move on

MPA is judge and jury

And limit the magazine sizes of all stolen guns! That'll fix everything!

I'm pretty sure stolen guns are already banned. Perhaps we should make them legal since we evidently can't enforce the ban 100% of the time.

Make everything legal that can't be enforced 100% of the time now.

This was a axseedent! U has no see warrant fer dems drugs I wernt seelling. dats guns wernt mines! Yous all did sometig to dat baby hes alive when i lift em!

Pre schools out.

bubba, that is really cute.. racist shyt

So you're saying the mother is worthless because she let the 4 year old see his dad? How do you know the mother was on welfare? Do you know them personally? Let me see you walk on water, and then you can judge. Okay?

Mike , you deduced all that from the picture of a black man.

As Obama might say... "He coulda been my GRAND kid"

They will find a way to blame the gun owner who it was stolen from, and make more laws aimed at the lawful gun owners instead of aiming them at the criminals.

Where some of the many proposed gun laws that got shot down in the past could have helped in this situation? Well, there were ones about proper storage of guns to help reduce the risk of accidental shooting and theft. It would have made it far more difficult for this guy to have stolen it in the first place.

That said, most criminals actually buy guns at gun shows and through private sales. These transaction make up 40% of all gun sales and not only do they not require the buyer to have a gun permit or back ground check, the seller isn't even required to document who bought what gun. I am willing to bet that 50% of these sales are to people who have either been convicted of a felony or have had gun applications rejected. If we required background checks or permits on ALL gun sales this would greatly reduce the sale of guns to criminals and crazy people.

Only an idiot thinks we can end all gun violence just like only an idiot thinks we can end injury and death from car accidents. But we can "reduce" the number of gun deaths. I also think the current weapon bans are adequate as far as reducing gun violence. Will banning AR weapons reduce gun violence? Maybe, but maybe 1 to 2%. It is better to focus on enforcement changes that can have more impact.

That's right JohnKnows... in fact why make any law at all?! After all, it's not going to stop those criminals!

The purpose of gun control laws is not to take away guns, but to regulate them and make it harder for criminals and mental health patients to obtain them. And to add harsher punishments to criminals that do get caught.

Dawgfan - as long as the legal owner reported it stolen (which it sounds like they did) they did everything they were "legally" required to do. So they can not be blamed.

JohnKnows, Stop making guns for the public, Stop selling guns to the public, round up all guns, make anyone caught with a gun loose all possessions to forfeiture, sooner or later you will round up all illegal guns out there, end of story! You asked!

Come take my .45 I hand it over to you personally. I'll start with the bullets.

Ivan,

I know that. Just putting a little sarcasm out there. The gun show you cite above is a little misleading. While someone can buy a gun at a gunshow, they can do so from an FFL dealer or a private seller. The dealer will require a background check. The private seller will not. Also, how are you going to ensure that criminals that sell guns to other criminals are going to conform to the background checks? They won't, and there will continue to be straw purchases, and there will continue to be gun violence. There is nothing anyone can do about it. Look at the states with the most strict controls on guns. They are in the top 5 of gun homicides.

Scott, you know that kind of threat can get you thrown in Jail! even on the Net! You just threatened to shoot me!!!! Oh it's federal FFC Communication. I also bet you don't live in my State!

Bubba you do have mental issues don't you? Now as far as keeping guns out of the hands of those with mental illness are they going to mandate a psych eval for everyone?

That said, most criminals actually buy guns at gun shows and through private sales. These transaction make up 40% of all gun sales

OK I'm calling bull@!$%# on that statistic. Prove it.

WeAll, Really Scott did just state he wanted to hand the bullets of his 45 and his gun over to me and I don't think he meant he was going to give them to me while they were still in there casing or they were not out side the gun and the gun is empty. Now if he would like to clear that up he can. But we have all heard the Pry this gun from my dead hands way to many times. Right know I'm the one because of a gun that feels threatened!

Bubba you are a P*&^y

Looking for hidden meanings where ther are none. IDIOT!

Run, bubba, hide!! I hear it can be nice and safe your under bed.

I'll face him any time!!! Sawed off double barrel 10 gauge shotguns at ten paces! Double buck shot! I told these thing are for killing. I'm not going to jail.

Ah, keyboard cowboy.

Hilarious.

Bubba...you certainly chose the proper name!

Ivan- Criminals buy guns at gun shows? Really? Sellers at the gun shows are required to do background checks just like they have to in a brick and mortar location. Most sellers do have fixed stores but instead of the buyers going to individual gun dealers the gun dealers go to the buyers - a gun show. Criminals may buy a gun from an individual outside of the gun show but those are not considered part of the gun show.

Requiring background checks on ALL gun sales? That introduces a whole new level of bureaucracy that will never float. Do we require all drivers to prove they are entitled to drive? There are people who are restricted from driving but they do anyway. I saw a court case that had pulled a car seller into court and the attorney tried convincing the judge that the seller was partially responsible for the death of a person because he didn't check to see if the buyer/driver was licensed to drive a car. There is no requirement for such verification - even by dealers. When a dealer requests a drivers license it is to cover them in a liability lawsuit and required by their insurance company but not required by the state.

the thinker-318752...great story, even if you are 100% wrong.

the thinker-318752.............Dealers take ID to comply with provisions of the Patriot Act, it is the law. Now it is true that they could require other forms of accepted photo ID ( passport,etc ) but when they ask you for a drivers license it is because they are required by law to ID those who buy a car. Their insurance company may ( and does ) require a drivers license to test drive a car, but while the dealer can violate his insurance companies rules without breaking the law ( may lose his ins company after the first claim though ) , it is a violation of Federal Law to sell a car without positive ID and 99.9% of the time, that is a drivers license. There are also laws agains doing a credit check without proof of ID, and other rules about accepting cash over total of $10,000 with out positive ID and Social Security #. Lots of Federal laws to require positive ID, drivers license is the ID of choice, insurance company rules are just that, insurance company rules, they are not laws.

@Thinker, Not true. I have bought M-16's and other weapons at gun shows with no background checks.

I have known convicted Felons that have done so too. (I'm not one of them)

I have known cops that have bought illegal weapons as well. (Not undercover, it was illegal all around) They wanted to have semi-autos and all the toys too.

Lets talk cars. The last time I bought a brand new car (last year), I was required to show ID (not a DL). So moral of the story is:

Bull@!$%# on all that the public presumes to think that the "law" is being followed just because it exists. When people want something, they find a way to get it. That applies to EVERYTHING in life. Most men are that way by nature. If they want something bad enough, they will make it happen. (It doesn't always have to be bad though) .

scott:

Time to grow up.

Woodysr, it was given to me I didn't choose it.

@Demon Seed....

If you have your permit already, you have alreay passed your background check.

if you purchased an M-16, would would have had to fill out a crap of paperwork... I'm not buying it from you.

To bad no one steped up, this chiled could have been kept away from the father except for controled visits.

Ok Bubba from watching you spell, I can see you are uneducated. My apologies for the previous statements toward you.

WeAll, Well excuss the He!! out of me did I forget a P. I am glad you are so perfect.

bubba-Your ignorance is so laughable!!! ROFLMAO since you seem to think the only mistake you made was missing a "P"?!?!?!!? Let's review shall we "steped" instead of stepped, "chiled" instead of child, "controlled" instead of controlled. Please return to elementary school and try to pay attention during spelling lessons.

WOW... you 47%ers are making a comment about spelling on here?? Talk about trolling!!

It's the internet, you morons... you type, you hit "enter", and you move on... some words are bound to get typed wrong.

So what?? The ISSUE is the important thing... you THAT self centered you can't understand?

?!?!?!!?

You're going to critique spelling after this hot mess of punctuation?

Let's review shall we "steped" instead of stepped, "chiled" instead of child, "controlled" instead of controlled.

You should have used conjunctions in place of your commas, as well as adding the words You typed prefacing the first misspelled word. Also, a comma should have been placed after the word review if you used a question mark, or not if you used a period after the word we. Instead, you opted for no punctuation at all. Guess you like run on sentences.

bubba-Your ignorance is so laughable!!!

bubba, your ignorance is laughable!

The word so is not required. Nor is three exclamation points. Adding more than one is improper punctuation. You also left out a comma and improperly capitalised the word your. A dash isn't proper punctuation.

Then for the finale, you didn't even get his misspelling of the word controlled right when you attempted to correct them. You spelled it properly both times in your quest to be smarter than them.

Since you're so hellbent on correcting their spelling, you seem to have created more grammatical errors than the person you are trying to act superior to.

Please return to elementary school and try to pay attention during spelling lessons.

Does anyone else smell the irony?

DIE DIE DIE GRAMMAR POLICE! Thank God that it is the Internet or there would be red pencil correction and @!$%# written in the margins! With a grade at the top! Is it aggravating to see and read bad grammar, oh hell yeah but give it up, let it go. There is more important @!$%# in the world plus you guys were getting into playground name calling.

Hey Western, He's 21. I'm sure he was sleeping because he was up all night studying for his college exams....well, maybe not....

What they need to do is make it illegal to illegally possess illegally obtained handguns.

Uh, what?

I notice that you put the word "for" in quotes, as though it is in the text of the BIll of Rights. Have you read the second amendment, Merlin? And if he stole the gun from the Army, then your argument would be...?

I'm waiting for you to post something intelligent, for a change. Might be a long wait though...

What the hell does having a well regulated militia have to do with a low-life thug stealing a gun? You personify the lack of intellect coming from the anti camp.

All of you must have missed it. I agree, a well regulated militia has nothing to do with this turd. Nor does it have anything to do with any of the other stories about gun violence, but that doesn't stop the right wingers from trying tie any talk about guns back to the second amendment. Except in this case.

Hey Cappy,

Your opinion doesn't really matter when the Supreme Court has already disagreed with you in a decision on this very subject; Heller vs. District of Columbia. You can file your opinion in the trash.

Cappy-1911

gun control at it's finest

We don't need more laws. We need better enforcement of current laws and more jail time.

National Criminal Justice Reference Service (NCJRS), which found in 2010, of 6 million Americans who applied to buy a gun, less than 2 percent -- or 76,000 -- were denied. Of those, the ATF referred 4,732 cases for prosecution. Of them, just 44 were prosecuted, and only 13 were punished for lying or buying a gun illegally.

Dawgfan, this is really the single most relevant fact there is on the matter. Why keep adding more laws when the violators who are breaking the current laws aren't even being dealt with? The feds aren't even dealing with the current violators and all they want to do is add more restrictions into the mix. It's completely assinine to demand that we have a serious discussion about sensible gun legislation when the current laws are being largely ignored by the very group entrusted to execute them.

Reynolds Wrap called.

Your new hat's ready.

The zoo called.

Your hole is ready in the ostrich area.

Mike N-366459.......I'm a pretty liberal guy, and I agree with you 100%

This wasn't senseless.

This wasn't senseless.

If the death of a four year old isn't senseless to you, maybe you should look up the meaning of the word.

Tim -

No this child's death is senseless and could have and should have been avoided but to try and push this into a gun violence incident, defies logic (as do a lot of the so-called "gun violence" incidents). You would need to look past the drugs, the lifestyle and the fact it was a stolen gun, to classify this as gun violence statistic.

That's right . . . Guns don't kill children . . . Children kill children . . . Or, uh, something like that.

AtomAnt,

Which part of this incident wasn't gun violence - the gun part, or the violence part?

Stop making excuses for the improper use and handling of guns, and do something about it.

Tim -

This is improper use and handling of guns? A drug dealer? With a stolen gun? Who is more interested in protecting his "trade" then his own son? This is the kind of gun violence you use a "evidence" against gun owners? Gun owners have to respond to this kind of bull@!$%#? Gun owners are responsible and somehow accountable for this "gun violence"? This is the example you are including in you tally of gun violence? And you wonder why you get push back from legit gun owners. I don't have to "do something" about this incident. I am not even going to answer for the actions of a drug dealer. If I asked black people to answer for the actions of this fine outstanding example of their race, I would be crucified as a bigot and a racist, but you have no problem with thinking this POS is a gun owner.

I wonder if the legal owner of the gun was made aware that a gun that he did not have locked up in a gun safe played a part in the death of a four year old.

I'd be happy if he never breathed free air again, since he's never going to embrace any rules of our society, but while he sits in a cell, maybe the light comes on and he finally sees the need for rules and order, nah.

Been there, done that (in reverse)!

My ex-wife was a crank user & distributor. I tried to get the judge to listen, but no dice. Visitation was my duty in spite of suicide attempts and drug arrests. For years I could not sleep well while my daughter was at her mother's....but she survived and is now a productive citizen (EMT). The ex is still doing & dealing, but far, far away from us.

...and no, I didn't know she did drugs when we got together, but learned a little too late....

I would think that the judge had no knowledge of his activities. Fathers have a right to their children until PROVEN incapable of discharging that responsibility.

In fact every parent has the right to equal time with their children.. So, yeah, if the judge had no idea and the mother had no idea, then there was no way to simply say he could not see his kid LEGALLY.

Happens all the time! We had a horrible case in Washington where a father, allowed visitation, killed his sons and himself (and probably his wife) She has never been found!

I could tell you a few stories where the mother took off with the kid without telling dad and the kid came up dead, but then you have the internet to look that kind of thing up.

Yep, it happens all the time and the door swings both ways.

You do realize this article is about some thug who STOLE a gun, yes? <facepalm>

Nice rant, great use of bold and caps.

You can already get statistics from the government through the DOJ/FBI which shows that gun violence is directly attributable to gangs - 48- 90% "depending on location" (read urban areas for "location").

That would make your BET of 85% a pretty foolish one. You know what they say about a fool and his money, right?

@Tony: A lot of people eat a lot of pasta, of the copy-pasta variety. They don't think out responses, they merely have a list of edited text that they inject into news stories.

Just more political parroting. Both sides are guilty of it.

With your betting ability, you should not go to Vegas.

Some doofass always posts the same thing. Tiresome.

The only way to solve this guy's problem is to lock him up now and throw away the key. A simple web search returned 3 arrests in the past several years. This guy is not going to reform or turn around in his ways. He will continue to progress in the severity of his crimes.

bottom-lines - You don't know that as fact and it's preposterous for you claim such a thing. His son being dead because of the things he was doing might be the one thing that causes him to wake up and change his life for the better and possibly help others do the same. If things really were the way you say they are then we would never let people out of prison on parole and they would all be locked up for life no matter their crime because they "will continue to progress in the severity of his crimes.".

Does Texas have a 3 strikes law? Maybe he will go away for life then.

@ World - Just how many chances do you give someone? Why is it society's responsibility to suffer for his next chance?

Gneisenau, I would provide an answer to your question if it actually had anything to do with what I wrote in the earlier post, but it doesn't. Where in my last post am I arguing for or against how many chances to give someone or why it is society's responsibility ... blah blah?

I was arguing the possibility of this guy being able to turn his life around or not.

@World,

Let's look at facts. As I said a quick web search turned up three separate arrests in the past few years. These are only his adult record and I can imagine there were more in his youth. He had time after each of these arrests and reflect on his life and most importantly change his direction. He did not. The seriousness of his crimes increased. Is there a possibility that he changes after this latest crime? Yes that is a possibility but one that I do not feel the rest of society needs to accommodate. He had his chances and now, to protect the rest of us, he needs to be put away for the rest of his life. To use the links replace _dot— with .

www_dot_ultimatelakehouston.com/briefs/5677-marquiez-deshon-pratt-arrested-on-charge-of-unlawful-carrying-of-a-weapon

www_dot_ultimatelakehouston.com/briefs/3229-marquiez-deshon-pratt-arrested

www_dot_ultimatelakehouston.com/briefs/396159-marquiez-deshon-pratt-arrested-on-charge-of-trespassing-on-a-property-or-in-a-building-without-forcible-entry

Oh well he would have turned out like his dad any way.

That was one of the other Marquiez Deshon Pratts.

That was one of the other Marquiez Deshon Pratts.

More gun laws and restricting the rights of law abiding citizens will stop things like this. This wasn't an ar-15. This wasn't a 30 round magazine, a vert grip or a collapsible stock.

I don't think most people are saying that newly implemented, gun control laws will stop every type of gun violence. It's being attempted to be implemented to reduce senseless gun violence. Nothing will be a cure all, but stricter laws to obtain guns & outlawing semi automatic weapons for the private sector will have some impact on gun related deaths.

How can I find out the lessons that he endured or the tests that "God" gave him...will the Easter Bunny tell me if I leave a note on the mantel this April?

This guy should be hurting a lot more than he is now.

He is not a parent. A parent doesn't allow such things to happen. Period.

Happster, life lessons are as personal as is your personal belief and personal experiences. You won't always see a lesson because this one may not be for you. I was hopping for more intelligent replies but if all you wish to spread is negativity through mockery then that is your choice. It influences me not. When you have light in your heart then nothing is hidden from you.

Those who know God know him because they want to. No one can force you to see even though you look. That is a personal choice as is this lesson is a personal business. Thank the hearltess at NBC who choose to magnify this tragedy to hold down your heart.

Hopefully you at least give your children the chance to know God before you spread that negativity into their hearts.

charles, "Thank the heartless at NBC who choose to magnify this tragedy to hold down your heart."

So, NBC providing coverage of this story is being done purposefully in order to hold down the hearts of the non-religious? Give me a frickin break! I read your first post and though I'm an atheist and was able to bypass references to any god in order to respect your religion and your right to it and its dogma, I agreed with everything else you said. But, I can't in good conscience agree with you about your last post. It rings heavily of paranoia you seem to be pushing to non-religious folks.

I respect you, your religion and the personal beliefs you have because of it. Please try real hard to provide the same respect for those that do not share your personal beliefs. I couldn't be happier with my life and knowing that everything that has happened to me, or not, was because of my own decisions.

You read things how you wish my good sir. This is how it is. NBC magnifies negativity in order to spread negativity. That's it. It has nothing to do with religion, at least not positive religion. I am saying trust in God and light will not allow this to distort your mind. The part that you may or may not understand is that the way society is designed is to distract us from learning and growing and also keeps us from appreciating each other. If we all started to think for ourselves instead of focusing on “how much money can I make” or “I need to get that new iPad to fit in” then people would start to realize how much of our lives are wasted. There is a global consciousness and we all feed into it. If everyone is feeding negativity and ignorance then we are all living oppressed and there’s no one to blame but ourselves. If you reject the negativity then the good changes come one person at a time.

You want a freakin break? Then break the spell set in front of you. Learn to look as well as to see. There’s a huge picture and you’re focused on one portion.

So let's see, this guy is a criminal, who stole the gun or bought it from someone who stole it, the original owner reported it stolen, so will someone please tell me how background checks and "making the original owner responsible" would have made any difference.

As for the father, if he has a stolen gun in his possession and the house is full of drugs and drug paraphernalia, he doesn't need us to "make him a criminal", he's pretty much done the job himself.

He was so concerend with the fate of his son that he threw him into the arms of the police so he could run back up to his apartment to try and hide his drugs and paraphenalia.

Daddy can kiss my Ass.

If he cared at all about his child he would have cleaned up his act and tried to be a good fathor and role model instead of a Crack dealer.

#25.5 Charles69: Your statements are accurate - bolder than I would venture to state, given your audience - but as you know, some consciousnesses are not ready to hear them and would rather remain ignorant. Life's hard for them, because their egos are in charge. They don't recognize that they are feeding the negative energy field which we must continue to try to overcome. Good for you that you were willing to stick your neck out knowing that your statements would be unpopular with the unaware.

Positive religion? Oh, you must mean anyone of Christian faith. And those of us who are atheists, or a religion not within Christianity, couldn't possibly project anything positive into the world then, right? Right....

Do you just dislike NBC for some reason or do you treat all "news" outlets the same, "magnifying negativity in order to spread negativity"? What about Fox News? Are they categorically the same in your view as NBC or are they able to do no wrong because you agree with what they "report"?

No, he killed his son by being stupid. Stupid is incurable. The US government pays farm corporations and farmers NOT to grow crops. Why can we not pay the ignorant to not have children until they can support a child. They could use that money to educate themselves out of the ignorance.

There are too many ignorant and stupid people out there who should not have children or guns. What a sad story. That poor mother.

That poor mother should have known that daddy was a criminal environment.

We have a winner way to go dad!

You can't fix stupid!

I have as much sorrow for this lump as i do for a turd! burn him at the stake! Be done with it.