so this bans it even if the mothers health is at risk too?? If so, War on Women rd 4 will begin...and rightly so

Come now Charles, you know that we women are absolutely incapable understanding this issue. That's why these old white men must save us from ourselves. /sarcasm

This restriction is unconstitutional and will be struck down.

Completely unbelievable.

There will be consequences.

stopfreeloaders

Im all for abortions, it means far less liberals to feed.

Yeah, cuz we're the ones not using birth control, right? And you mean fewer, not less. Why not cut education funding too so that smart people like you won't go extinct?

Agreed. This legislation should have never been written, much less passed. It will be overturned. Meantime, the ugly old antebellum south raises its head again.

Regardless of whether or not this is good for Arkansas, it's bad for America, and is just another nail in the coffin for the Republican brand. Stupid is as stupid does... and Republicans do stupid like no other political party in American history. Who says Republicans aren't creative? Look at how masterfully they are able to create chaos and division among the stupid and the poor.

Charles.

I know it's hard to swallow, but more women are pro-life than men. Not only that but the most adamant about not having abortions at all, Is also WOMEN.

The Pro-choice people are about getting their own way regardless of who is hurt, especially those that cannot yet speak for themselves.

Sounds like Arkansas will get to PAY for a flood of new welfare and food stamp babies.

Enjoy, Arkansas republicans... that is YOUR money being flushed down the toilet with higher welfare.

Abortion should be treated the same way smoking is. It's legal to smoke; it's just illegal to be able to smoke.

Arkansas just made the price of gas go up, now the women will have to travel.....unless Arkansas is going to make pregnancy testing mandatory, and pass laws about pregnant women traveling across state lines!

Yes, it is funny how everyone loves to shout, "Save the unborn!" but the second they are born, these children are immediately burdens on society, draining valuable state resources from food stamps and welfare programs, and an excuse to tap in to HUD money so their family doesn't live on the street. And as they grow up and reach their teenage years, they're seen as nothing more than obese, sexually-active societal burdens and future welfare recipients themselves--and, thus, they're even more disgusting, now that the early years of innocence and potential are gone.

If the United States seeks to ban abortions in ANY way, shape or form, then how about the Pro-Lifers advocate the opening of nationwide Planned Parenthood living facilities--where pregnant women can go to receive free medical care, drug/alcohol treatment programs (to prevent fetal alcohol syndrome and so on), food, shelter, clothing, education, transportation and everything else that will give them and their unborn child a chance to live a "normal" life after the child is born? Why not advocating for that young life while it's still in the womb, and working to save it from future failure?

Oh, wait, that can't happen! Then we'd actually have to see the mother as something OTHER than a vessel for the child! Then the woman suddenly becomes a person with basic needs that must be met by the state, because either she or her family can't meet them. It's a well-established fact that women are nothing more than baby machines. Never mind the symbiotic relationship between the two beings, and how the "host" has to be healthy to increase the odds of a healthy child...

And to have the STATE pay for that to happen?!? Why, that's SOCIALISM! We can't have THAT!

DB Akron

I know it's hard to swallow, but more women are pro-life than men. Not only that but the most adamant about not having abortions at all, Is also WOMEN.

First, I assume you're not posting links to prove this is because...

Second, it's not Pro-Life as your ilk likes to proclaim. It's Anti-Choice.

Also, while that could actually be true, THEY HAVE A CHOICE. They DO NOT have a choice in what other women may do with their own bodies.

In fact, in my conversations with Pro-Choice people, the majority are against having an abortion themselves. But they also realize the importance of NOT imposing their own beliefs onto others.

The SCOTUS has ruled on the issue of "viability" before. That makes this attempt unconstitutional.

And please do explain why you believe you should have the right to deny a woman a Choice that affects Her life, and not yours or that of a nonviable fetus. Tell me THE REASON you think this way, that you can dictate a medical choice for someone else.

Life in the Deep South, bringing the 5th Century back in style

A "reasonable" length of time.... TWELVE entire weeks to decide if a baby lives or dies..... how could anyone argue that issue?

Guess some folks would like to murder the child right up to the moment of birth?

Steve, when you grow a vagina and uterus, get back to me...

It is not a war on women, but a war on babies.

A "reasonable" length of time.... TWELVE entire weeks to decide if a baby lives or dies..... how could anyone argue that issue?

Tell me, Steve, how long is it before a women even knows she's pregnant without a test for it?

And who are you to decide how much time a woman needs to make a decision about termination of a pregnancy?

to StandUp JokeOff

I agree. We should kill those children who are burdens on society, obese teenagers, sexually -active societal burdens, welfare recipients, and unhealthy children. - sarcasm

And........people want to live in Arkansas......for......??????? I can't think of a good reason either!

I agree. We should kill those children who are burdens on society, obese teenagers, sexually -active societal burdens, welfare recipients, and unhealthy children. - sarcasm

Considering that YOU republicans chanted "LET HIM DIE", when discussing a poor person at your primary debate... there is no sarcasm there. You DO want to kill the burdens of society.

YOU CHANTED FOR IT!

Here's what should happen: We abolish all abortions, and then, when the unwanted baby is born, we turn them into our military. Then, when they are killed in some unwarranted, unnecessary, and completely illegal war, we send the mother a note: "Hey, remember that abortion that you wanted 18+ years ago? Done."

This is just, I mean, abhorrent. No "War on Women" my arse. And to the anti who said more women are anti-choice than men? That's not true. 77% of the anti-choice movement is made up of men and 100% of them will never give birth.

The antis get worse anytime there is a pro-choice president in power. Remember all the murders and bombings that occurred while Clinton was president? WTF is wrong with these people? What makes them think they have the right to TELL ME or any other woman what to do with our bodies, our pregnancies? Yes, the tide is turning and things are becoming much more sinister.

Here in Texas, the latest one can have an abortion is 25 weeks. But Perry has already made it clear that he wants Texas to become a state where abortions are illegal at ANY STAGE. You anti-choicers are sick f--ks. You don't care about women. You only care about a fetus until it is born and then you couldn't care less what happens to it.

We will fight back in this war. It's time for the apathy amongst the pro-choice crowd to end. We think abortion rights are secure because a pro-choice man is president, but from the time abortion was legalized 40 years ago, it has never been safe. More and more doctors and would-be doctors are opting out of performing abortions due to the threats to their lives and the attacks and murders of their colleagues.

These antis are evil. They aren't loving good people. They are misogynistic pigs. And they should be stopped. Because unless we all fight back, and a majority of the country is pro-choice, these nutjobs may get their wish. Illegal abortions and more dead women. But it's all about the fetus, right you crazy anti-choicers? The women don't matter. What sad, truly sad times we live in.

This is why the entire central US is considered the FLY-OVER states...

I made this comment yesterday, but it bears repeating...Why is it that the uneducated, poor, redneck states are so incessant upon creating more uneducated, poor, redneck citizens?

Pro-choice is not "pro-murder." It is PRO-CHOICE... as in, you as a patient have no right to be forced to stand before a committee of total strangers who will determine your eligibility/ineligibility to have an abortion. Your particular pregnancy is not like that of your neighbor. You might have issues with diabetes, heart disease, mental health issues (think of all the stories you hear of women who kill their 3-year-old-and-under babies--that's hormonal depression from PMDD, which worsens after pregnancy), or the fetus itself might have issues to where it's born with defects like being without a brain (and I'm sorry, but not everyone has the financial resources or luck that the one family did, where their child lived to the age of three as a virtual vegetable).

And this is exactly what our almost-VP Ryan was proposing along with egghead Akin--to take YOUR CHOICE out of your hands. To put YOUR medical history on display before a committee not composed of your husband/loved one, doctor and OB-GYN.

The right to YOUR PRIVATE MEDICAL DECISION was a hair's breath away from being decided by committee. (And to think, Republicans complain about the government being more involved in our personal lives and taking away our personal freedoms, yet they wanted this!)

And if you see abortion as murder, then that is not your soul-burden to bear. It is that of the woman who chose to end that life. And SHE is the one who will be judged... by GOD, not by you. You cannot pick and choose other people's sins for them, nor are you worthy or entitled enough to pass such judgment on another person--that is GOD'S territory and you'd best keep your ego in check and not presume to know the mind of God.

And who's to say it would have stopped there? Is there any logical argument that says that such medical committees wouldn't be invoked in the cases of certain types of surgeries (i.e. gender reassignment)? The planned abortion panels would have been a gateway for similar techniques, some of the taken up by the health insurance companies in this country, as an excuse not to do something.

Steve, you said, "Guess some folks would like to murder the child right up to the moment of birth?"

About a dozen years ago, I was discussing this subject with the rabbi of a conservative Jewish congregation right after Saturday morning services, while we were standing around at the "oneg" (a traditional little get-together held after services) munching on pickled herring and gefilte fish. I asked this rabbi, whom I had (up to that point) respected as a learned elder scholar, how far along a pregnancy could be before it should be considered "too late". He said, and I quote, "Up to the time of parturition." I asked him what 'parturition' meant, and he explained, "Up to the moment of birth." Such an fool is unworthy to be addressed with the revered title of "rabbi," and I have not spoken to him since then. True story. So the answer to your question, is "Yes. Some folks think it is perfectly OK to murder the child right up to the moment of birth." That said, why then is it considered capital murder, to murder the very same child a minute AFTER it is born, because you don't like, say, its gender or eye color?

Arkansas, get your act together! This is what happens when you vote ignorant people in to office. If your too stupid to be embarrassed don't worry, we're all embarrassed for you.

@JermoMurmo - so God in essence murdered his son Jesus Christ (all-powerful God could have sent his angels when his son begged that he not have to die) and you would have me follow his example? Okay - let's kill all the slacker kids who are underperforming in schools. Let's kill all the kids who don't behave. Let's kill all the kids that need my tax dollars (above and beyond education). Go on and use the Bible, especially when there are many world religions that do not consider the unborn child as "alive" and have no ethical or moral issues with abortion.

Olivia Dunham:

I feel so bad for you. Do you truly believe men or anyone else really cares about taking away your right's. Really? Maybe they really want to protect your babies right's against being murdered! May I suggest you get on the pill or use a condom and hopefully you will never have to experience making the choice to kill your own baby. What would you have said if Casey Antony would've stood up and said hay it's my choice. Again, most people and men even, understand the need for abortion in cases of verified rape and verified medical emergeny. But just because you have a vagina does not give you the right to kill because you choice to not use a conventional method of birth control. And I'm a Life long Demarcate and I still know that killing your baby's is wrong.

JustMe: tell me you're not ignorant enough to believe birth control is 100% effective for every person on the planet... I, for one, cannot take birth control--the doctors' solution has been, time and again, for a hysterectomy. Doing so would remove my ovaries. Doing that would up my odds of osteoporosis and a broken hip ten or fifteen years down the line. Then I could luxuriate on Social Security Disability for the rest of my days. Great.

My choice to not get pregnant has been to avoid sexual contact that will get me pregnant. Is that healthy, realistic or right for everyone? No. To expect birth control is the absolute way not to get pregnant is absurd. I could still be raped or drugged and be impregnated. Then would you be blaming me for putting myself in "vulnerable" situations? And should I be forced to bear that child which was not only unwanted and unexpected, but a stark traumatic reminder of that incident? I, who have almost no money in the bank and live in a country where pregnant women are not taken care of by the state?

Pregnancy is not always planned. Sometimes it is a genuine accident. Preventing abortions for every reason there is for a woman to end a pregnancy (due to physical health, mental health, birth defects) is throwing a blanket over society and saying, "You must all do as God says."

Since I don't believe in god, am I exempt from following all the stupid religiuos rules that the GOP is trying to force down our throats, all in the name of their 2000 year old, outdated manuscript?

Did you know you can use more than one form of birth control method at a time?

To JustME:I did have an abortion in college. We were using a condom and it broke. The morning after pill was not readily available back then. I mulled over all of my choices and ultimately made MY CHOICE. And my choice was to not become a parent. I have no regrets.

And I am fortunate enough, unlike many women, that if abortion had been illegal here in Texas or in this country, my parents would've taken me elsewhere so I could see MY CHOICE through. But no woman should have to do that. Abortion is a safe and legal medical procedure. And my boyfriend and I WERE BEING RESPONSIBLE. And choosing to have an abortion, realizing we weren't ready to become parents, WAS TAKING RESPONSIBILITY.

And not that it's your business, but I am now using the IUD, the most effective contraceptive device on the market. But birth control fails as does sterilization in some cases. The backup plan when you don't want to become pregnant and do, is abortion. There is no shame in choosing that if you feel that is what's best for you.

You have NO SAY in what I do with my body. If I got pregnant again, despite my IUD, I would again choose abortion. I have many reasons for doing so. Abortion is not a decision any woman makes lightly. We are intelligent human beings who can do things such as get college degrees, run companies and even vote! We don't need nor want OTHER PEOPLE telling us what they think we should do with OUR BODIES.

My pregnancy was none of your business when I was 19 and if I were pregnant now, it would still be none of your damn business. Why don't you try saving the foster children first and maybe later you can concern yourself with A FETUS, your own. You have the right to your opinion. What you don't have the right to do is tell me or other women what we can and cannot do with our bodies. Don't like abortion? Don't believe in abortion rights? It's simple. DON'T HAVE AN ABORTION!

This isn't about God. Since I haven't stepped foot in a church is 17 years. It's about children and your choice to chose death for them. I would gladly lay down my life for my kids, to bad you can't say the same. Nowhere did they ban abortion, just a earlier date of killing. I truly am sorry you can not use convention birth control and never wish you ill will. May i suggest getting your tubes tied. That way they can re due when your ready for kid's. Oh and adoption is still a way not kill your baby and help a family from having to go to Russia to get a child. That is so F'd up. Russian have plenty of kids to adopt, but not the USA, we have killed most of ours.

JustMe...I think the main difference between what you are saying and what us pro-choice people think is that you believe it's a baby the minute the sperm fertilizes the egg. We only think it has the propensity to become a baby. And, do you really expect the Ferris Beulers of this country to be responsible enough to use birth control all the time? They just aren't smart enough....and I really don't want these wizards raising babies if they do decide to go full term. This is reality, and which is exactly why the GOP is having such problems winning elections nowadays....they just don't live in reality

JustMe, you are truly an ignorant misogynist. I WAS USING BIRTH CONTROL. And even if I wasn't, it still would have been MY CHOICE as to what to do about the unwanted pregnancy I was facing and the trauma it caused. You don't live in the real world.

And I am so sick of antis like you saying there are no kids to adopt here. THERE ARE. They are languishing in foster homes, just praying for a loving and permanent home. But no. Many barren couples are selfish bastards who only want a lily white newborn. Sure, let's take all the women facing unplanned pregnancies as of now and FORCE THEM to gestate that fetus just so the infertile can have their perfect little newborn. Hypocrites. You are ALL HYPOCRITES!!!!!

You SUGGEST I get my tubes tied? That I submit myself for a potentially deadly medical procedure, running the risk of dying under anesthesia, PTLS, heavy periods, hormonal imbalance... rather than risk being attacked and getting pregnant by accident, all to save what is, at this point, a hypothetical child? That my health as a woman be put at risk now, with future complications, just in case I might end up pregnant?

Don't you see?!? THAT is what we mean on this board when we say "pro-choice." Not you, nor anyone else, has the right to determine when, if and how ANY of my medical procedures are done! Your "suggestion" can easily be turned in to law once we start fiddling around with the legal abortion process. That puts us steps away from then having the law demand that a woman, after a given number of abortions, be sterilized! Utterly taking away her freedom of choice to get pregnant later in life, at a time when she would be capable of having a stable family life.

The interest in saving the unborn is not without merit, but passing legislation against abortion is taking away that freedom of choice that we have in America. Because there are no major societal back-up solutions for pregnant women to turn to. There are no facilities for pregnant women to get free treatment, be it for themselves or their unborn children. There are no social programs that can "fast-track" pregnant women into housing, food assistance, drug/alcohol treatment or other aid that will, in turn, help ensure a healthy baby is born. Those who are kicked out of their homes, or in abusive relationships, or have other children, don't have anywhere to live but the shelter system, which is already overburdened and turning people away at their doors; here in L.A., shelters have turned to forcing people to sleep in chairs (not even on the floor, on a mat) when they have run out of beds.

We don't take care of the "vessel," the mother, but we insist (and even demand laws) that a woman with any number of issues incapable of carrying a child is forced to do so! That is why there is such a freedom of choice in this country. Let the trauma of her decision to end that life fall to the woman, as it should. Her punishment will be, for the rest of her life, comparing the children and young adults that she sees around her to her memory of how, "My son/daughter would be that age now..."

Standup....The GOP works to protect that hypothetical child in much the same way that poor people support the GOP's decision not to raise taxes on the rich so that their own hypothetical millions won't be taxed in the event that they discover a cure for cancer. They just don't live in a reality based world.

At the average time when a woman is aware that she
is pregnant (the fifth to sixth week after conception), the preborn human being
living inside her is metabolizing nutrition, excreting waste, moving, sucking
his or her thumb, growing, and doing many other things that non-living things
just do not do. As early as 21 days after conception, the baby's heart has
begun to beat his or her own unique blood-type, often different than the
mother's. (Moore & Persaud, The Developing Human, p.310; Nilsson
& Hamberger, A Child is Born, p.86; Rugh & Shettles, From
Conception to Birth, p.217.) At 40 days after conception, brain waves can
be read on an EEG, or an electroencephalogram. (Dr. H. Hamlin, Life or Death by
EEG, JAMA, Oct.12, 1964, p.113.)

You know your right! I am so sorry tell you what to do with your babies. Who am I to say that you should not have the right to make two bad choices. As long as they are yours to make. I apologize for being insensitive. It's just that I really do have a hard time with people killing kid's. Sandy Hook made me sick. Again I am truly sorry . I also got people mad when I thought Casey Anthony should have been locked up. But your right, It was her choice.

Ah, yes, sarcasm improves your argumentative stance so much.

For the record, my personal belief is that despite the dangers of my age, medical conditions and so forth, I WOULD have a child if I got pregnant, because it would probably be the only child I ever have.

But that is MY BELIEF. That is not the way other women are obligated to live. Nor am I arrogant or selfish enough to demand anything of a person's private life through legal channels.

Bigger_in_Texas - The Torah/Old Testament (Exodus) describes how if a man causes a woman to miscarry, he must pay a fine. If a man kills another man, he must die. It does not say causing a miscarriage is equal to murder. This is a new idea.

Justme....you are actually trying to compare the Sandy Hook children with a zygote? I am guessing you are one of those nuts that think that masturbation is the murdering of thousands of potential children. Casey Anthony's child was several YEARS old. I don't think any pro-choice people that I have ever heard of would advocate the killing of children....your statements are moronic.

Not sarcasm. You made your choice. Again the law is on your side so it must be right. I do truly wish you well. Now look back and notice no one has taken way your right to kill and you can also carrier an assault rifle as well. Just remember adoption could have saved their life's and maybe grown up to do something great.

JustMe...or they could have grown up to be Charles Manson....

Oh and Stevefoo, not sure how you know what and when a baby is a baby. I don't. Maybe your right about the zygote being sperm at 11 week old. But the facts are what they are. Just men in suites given some the OK to kill and others a term in prison.

Gettin' mighty tired of our state legislators costing us possibly millions in legal fees when we undoubtedly (and quite successfully) get sued for passing yet another unconstitutional law.

And, what's worse, these legislators know damned good and well these laws are unconstitutional. But, they don't care. They're passing them anyway, because it lets them effectively campaign for reelection on taxpayers' dime by pandering to their uneducated, fundamentalist voter base without having to spend a single red cent of their own money to do so. They don't even have to buy ad space and air time to spread their message of contempt for our federal government, because the news is spreading that message for them by covering their asinine behavior.

I think there needs to be some campaign finance reform in our state that requires all legislators who sign onto blatantly unconstitutional legislation to reimburse the state for legal fees from being sued over such legislation from their own campaign coffers (in full) before they're allowed to spend any of it on an actual reelection campaign. And, if those fees outstrip their collective campaign funds, then they simply don't get to run for reelection.

'Cause, frankly, if they don't know any more about constitutional law than a kindergartner, they've no business being legislators. Pass such reform, and they'll either learn to stop flouting federal law when mucking around with state law, or they'll just be one-term politicians whose damage to the state and its people is at least somewhat limited by not being able to run again regardless of term limits.

#1.14 ScubaGolfJim - And please do explain why you believe you should have the right to deny a woman a Choice that affects Her life, and not yours or that of a nonviable fetus. Tell me THE REASON you think this way, that you can dictate a medical choice for someone else.

DBAkron's comments are all about the ego. His reasoning has to do with men like him who have controlled women for centuries. Men first started losing control when women got the right to vote; then smoke, drive, work, and dress the way they wanted to. The very last venue for control over women is in reproductive rights. They are desperately trying to cling to this one, last hold they have over women. They don't care anything about saving babies. That's just a front. Their agenda is to force women to give birth to their offspring. They truly don't give a damn what happens after that.

Olivia Dunham, did you wait around for more than twelve weeks do have your abortion? Do you not agree that if if abortion is bad, later is worse? Is not twelve weeks enough time to make up your f'ing mind?

Enneagram: "They don't care anything about saving babies. That's just a front."

And you know this how?

I do wish all well and no harm. I've just had many of years of dealing with our choices. I lost my wife two years ago due to cervical cancer that the Doctors said started in the scaring left behind from the two abortion from years earlier. You may now understand some of my hell. Karma. The killing of our kid's ended up killing her. Good luck all. May your choices in life not become your nightmares.

Justme....you are entiled to your opinion just as I am. Your opinion is that it's a baby the minute the sperm fertilizes the egg and that's fine. But...just because you think it is fact doesn't make it so. You shouldn't be able to foist your opinion on anybody else just because you believe something is fact.

#1.55 Bigger_in_Texas - They don't care anything about saving babies. That's just a front." And you know this how?

I know this because when babies are born to mothers who don't want them, the 'pro-lifers' never come forward and say, "Please let me adopt your unwanted, minority, HIV-infected, mentally and physically challenged baby. I will raise it in a loving home, give it all the nurturing and love it needs, plus an education so that it will become a productive member of society." Instead, these unwanted kids get bounced around from foster home to foster home until they are 18 years old, at which time they are put out on the streets for society to deal with them, and they wish they had never been born. There are 120,000 - that's One Hundred and Twenty THOUSAND - kids in the U.S. right now that are unadoptable. In answer to your question, THAT'S how I know!

Justme...bad luck...and I am sorry for your loss. But, I really don't believe in Karma....there is just both good results and unfortunate results. What happened to your wife doesn't necessarily happen to all women that have abortions, any more than every smoker getting cancer. It's a risk, as are many things in life. That is, however, little condolence to someone that has lost a spouse.

jh-2945581 - your understanding of murder and sacrifice is tainted, and you do not understand the Gospel. God did not murder His Son - it is human sin that killed Jesus. The Son, Jesus, laid down His life for you, me and all people because we are sinners. In fact, it is our sin that Jesus came to die: "There is no greater love than to lay down one's life for one's friends" - John 15:13. In obedience to His Father Jesus said, "No one can take my life from me. I sacrifice it voluntarily. For I have the authority to lay it down when I want to and also to take it up again. For this is what my Father has commanded." Why could He say such a thing - because He was God in human form - Jn 8:58, 10:30, I Jn 2:23 and Jn 14:7. And, speaking to the religious leaders of the day, "Jesus answered them, 'Destroy this temple (His body), and I will raise it again in three days' " - John 10:18. Jesus was in full control as He is the Author of the universe, "For through him God created everything in heaven and on earth, the seen and the unseen things, including spiritual powers, lords, rulers, and authorities. God created the whole universe through him and for him" - Col 1:16. And He came to set you free!: So if the Son sets you free, you are truly free" John 8:36. "The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly" - John 10:10. Your choice - my choice. Not a government mandate. Ask Jesus to reveal Himself to you.

stevef00- "you shouldn't be able to foist your opinion on anybody else just because you believe something is fact"

Yet Stevefoo you do have that right. It's the first amendment. And I am glad you have it and said all you feel you need to. Because it is your right. Good night and good luck. You may need it.

The United States of America is tumbling toward a precipice at an ever-increasing rate at the behest of out-of-control Republican whackadoodles who want the government out of their business, but in my bedroom and in your uterus!

What does a woman know at 20 weeks that she doesn't know at 12 weeks. Babies have been known to survive outside the womb at 20 weeks. What woman doesn't know she's pregnant shortly after she misses her first period?

The state is not depriving women of choices and the women can still get abortions at any time if their life is in danger.

There are waiting lists to adopt babies and most of those family's want a new born. Yes there are children in foster care but the demand to adopt them is not as high as a new born. Many children in foster care are temporary until the courts or the Department of Human Services allows them to return to their parent or parents. They're also children in foster care that have behavior problems that make them unwanted for adoption.

I have been judged and called a hypocrite for voicing my opinion, while they hide behind their own mask and place their own labels on me. Now that is the question who is the hypocrite. At least I never labeled you this. Try as you may, hiding your face from your own truths do not make them lies.

Arkansas is still a state?

I thought they seceded and then privatized themselves to a Renaissance Festival to earn money rather than taking it from Blue States.

No baby has EVER survived outside the womb at 20 weeks. Clearly you have zero education in the area of science. And most abortions ARE first trimester abortions, aka in the first 12 weeks. But some women don't have normal cycles and they may believe missing their period is just a part of their body's hormonal pattern. Especially if they are using the Pill or Depo Provera, both of which cause women to miss their periods. So it is ENTIRELY FEASIBLE that a woman may not find out she is preggers until well into her second trimester.

Also, some women have to scrounge to gather the money for an abortion and that can take precious weeks. And thanks to the anti-choice laws in numerous states, women without enough resources may also have to raise money to get to a state where they can have the procedure. A ban for abortions after 12 weeks is completely ludicrous given that there are women who truly don't find out right away AND when they do find out at, say 16 or 17 weeks, decide they want an abortion.

If they have to go through the process of gathering money for said abortion or cross state lines, that's even more time for the pregnancy to progress and by this point the woman may be as many as 20 weeks along. This is a very dangerous and precarious situation for the woman. Second trimester abortions are harder on a woman's body than first trimester ones. I had my abortion at 10 weeks with zero complications. But if I were a woman in my 20th week, my uterus would be softer and more vulnerable to uterine punctures, not to mention the products of conception being larger and more difficult to remove. The 12 week ban is just the beginning. This anti-woman, anti-choice crusade is insidious.

choices? you people dont want choices, you want CONTROL!! you know how i know its all about control? so a juvenile or adult can decide to engage in intercourse, get pregnant and decide to abort the HUMAN fetus and its lawful; a person commits a crime and kills a woman who is pregnant and is charged with 2 counts of homicide (does the fetus count as life or not?); a person purchases a product to personally consume but its deemed illegal, he is caught and sent to do hard time; a person feels his life is not worth living anymore and decides to kill himself but fails, he is charged with a felony; a driver and passenger decide not to wear personal seat-belts and gets pulled over and ticketed; a motorcyclist decides not to wear a personal helmet and get pulled over and ticketed. so why can you kill an unwanted human life but these other people cant make choices for their own bodies? your making a choice for 2 when you abort a fetus, they only want a choice for themselves but are denied.

when you make a CHOICE to engage in intercourse, you take all responsibilities that go with it, you may use some pregnancy preventative measures but if they fail then the fault still lies with your decision and you must bear the burden, not an unborn child. no one forces you to have sex but somehow you think they are forcing you to have babies? lol only a twisted mind would think that. if you use abortions as means of birth control then you are a sick depraved monster.

there are hundreds of examples of double standard (unconstitutional) laws and yet some of you people are so blind by ideology or whatever issues you have that you fail to see anything beyond your own emotional garbage. you have no right to kill a viable human fetus unless the life of the mother is at risk due to the fetus, rape also due to the crime being committed. life and liberty pretty much define our laws, when did the courts get power of legislation in creating abortion "rights"? when you create a life you have no right to take that life away unless that life is in violation of your right to life.

Section. 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof,are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

so when are the men who helped create these unwanted fetuses going to be represented by "abortion rights? the DoI and US constitution make it clear about equal protections and rights but somehow the courts dont get it; slavery, segregation, just to name a few "mistakes" the courts made.

Most OBGYN don't do the test for Downs until 20-22 weeks. Many birth defects are not known until 20-24 weeks. A family with children already and who understands the burden of a child with such medical issues may not want to go through with such a pregnacy. This effectively takes a choice from those who may be facing a very difficult situation already--what to do that is best for their family as a whole. No matter how many social programs we throw at this family, it will not cover ALL costs related to the medical needs and care required by such a child. Let us make decisions which are best for our families without your religious beliefs being shoved down our throats.

Most OBGYN don't do the test for Downs until 20-22 weeks. Many birth defects are not known until 20-24 weeks. A family with children already and who understands the burden of a child with such medical issues may not want to go through with such a pregnacy. This effectively takes a choice from those who may be facing a very difficult situation already--what to do that is best for their family as a whole. No matter how many social programs we throw at this family, it will not cover all costs related to the medical needs and care required by such a child. Let us make decisions which are best for our families without religious beliefs being shoved down our throats.

Um, Swagganaut, you are yet another misogynist pig who doesn't live in the real world. Sex is fun. Sex is a normal and natural thing to do. And despite the best birth control, a woman may still conceive. This doesn't mean she should be forced to gestate and birth the progeny she never wanted in the first place.

You people truly aren't capable of hiding the real reasons you want abortions outlawed. It's really not about a fetus. It's about controlling women, "putting us in our place" and seeing to it that we are "punished" for daring to have sex and revel in our sexuality. And last time I checked, it takes two to tango.

And guess what? No woman should have to bear the burden of an unwanted pregnancy just because you think she should be punished for having a sex life. You're an ignorant jerk who will NEVER get pregnant and NEVER give birth. You will also never have to face the trauma of an unwanted pregnancy. Stay out of women's lives! STEP THE HELL OFF!

#1.67 Swagganaut: I'm sorry your keyboard is defective and doesn't have a shift key so you could throw in a capital letter now and then. That's the only comment I have on your post, except to say that irrefutably, a fetus remains a part of the mother's body--hence it is still the mother's body--until it is surgically severed. Until then IT IS HER BODY TO DO WITH AS SHE CHOOSES. Period.

And Angela, you are correct. I work for an OB/Gyn and if the blood screening test they do to check for defects has one of the potential defects come up positive, the woman by then is in her 16th to 17th week. If she wants amnio done to confirm the blood test was not a false positive, it may be another 2 weeks before she finds out her fetus has a severe birth defect.

Therefore, you are looking at abortions performed between 20 and 23 weeks. Every patient I have that has discovered her fetus has a birth defect has decided to abort. And I've worked there for 6 years. They get pregnant later with a healthy pregnancy, none the worse for wear physically. But emotionally they had to abort a very much wanted pregnancy and that could not have been easy for them. As it is, abortion is never a simple decision to make. It's one many women think out carefully before they make the decision to end the pregnancy.

#1.67 Swagganaut - you people dont want choices, you want CONTROL!!

Of course! You want to talk about control? See my post at #1.53. If women (or as you say "you people") want control, it's to Take Back control of our own bodies from men who had the audacity to think they have a say in what a woman should do with her own body. And it's long past time!

hey jermo - your fuc king dogs won't hunt. IF you want to live according to BULLS HIT, that's YOUR choice - but you don't get to make the choice FOR EVERYONE ELSE.

reichwingreligionazis disgust me - you and the religious horse you rode in upon

"Geez, doesn't seem a little F'd up that they had to actually have an override vote to stop the killing of babies for the lazy persons birth control. I'm all for abortion in verified cases of rape or if there's at least two Dr. that believe the mom's life is in danger but otherwise use a condom. Not a vacuum!"

Babies do not exist in a womb. Those are called fetuses.

"lazy person's birth control"? Do you know how many women become pregnant and didn't want to but the guy came inside her anyway? Or how many women are abandoned by the guys that impregnated them, once the guy found out?

"verified cases of rape"? Why do you want to put the government in between a doctor and their patient?

You are an embarrassment.

"I made this comment yesterday, but it bears repeating...Why is it that the uneducated, poor, redneck states are so incessant upon creating more uneducated, poor, redneck citizens?"

Because people who are proudly ignorant and intolerant must maintain their power and domination by outbreeding the competition.

Olivia Dunham

Um, Swagganaut, you are yet another misogynist pig who doesn't live in the real world. Sex is fun.

Come on now, Olivia... we can tell that sex is apparently not fun for Swagganaut, or at least for the victim subject of Swag's advances.

Jermo Murmo

Sure are a lot of pro-murder folks commenting on this article. One reason we fought WW II was because the Nazis euthanized millions and manufactured the bodies into products.

And another one demonstrates their ignorance of not knowing the difference between zygotes, fetuses, and living human beings.

As for the rest of your diatribe, you LOSE. Just as soon as you start quoting scripture or mentioning your buybull or your gawd... you guessed it. You LOSE. You don't want an abortion? Don't get one. But you have No Right to even make someone you impregnate not get one. (As If)

Your pathetic, archaic, religious beliefs have no standing in the lives of others. The US Constitution says so. If you don't like it, move to another country that does restrict a woman's rights to an abortion:

China, Mongolia, North Korea, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Nepal, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Cambodia, Singapore, Vietnam, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Bahrain, Georgia, Turkey, Belarus, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Hungary, Moldova, Romania, Russia, Slovakia, Ukraine, Denmark, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Norway, Sweden, Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Greece, Italy, Macedonia, Montenegro, Portugal, Serbia, Slovenia, Spain, Austria, Belgium, France, Germany, Netherlands, Switzerland, Cuba, Mexico, Guyana, Uruguay, Australia, Canada, or the US.

Oh Damn! See what I did? I put up a list of the countries where Freedom of Choice is a matter of Law. North Korea? Cambodia? Vietnam? Bosnia and Herzegovina? So you think we should deny a woman the right to make decisions about her own body while these stalwarts of freedom do not?

"Restrictions on abortion are most stringent in countries that are more strongly observant of the Catholic faith." Glad we have Freedom Of Religion in the good 'ole USA. See, that also means Freedom From Religion.

So just to summarize, you claim religion as the reason to deny a woman's rights, and by US Law... (and common sense) You LOSE.

I think too much attention is focused on the woman's rights and never on the child's. After 12 weeks, you can hear the baby's heartbeat which is separate from its mother's. Therefore, from a scientific viewpoint, an abortion past 12 weeks is just plain murder. That child is just as dependent on its mother as a toddler would be and no one would ever think of murdering a toddler, just because the mother did not want them anymore. Too many women don't want to consider the fact, that abortion kills a child whose life is separate from their own.

And despite what most liberals say about these babies being a burden on society, their words doesn't make sense when couples are constantly leaving the US to go in search of babies elsewhere.

Let's be honest, the real reason for an abortion is not that these children are a burden on society, but whether the mother can stand to have them around for 9 months. Most women are not willing to give up their children when they are born, so to kill them in the womb is easier for them, rather than having them faced with the possibility that this child will be a reminder to them of their "mistake".

This has nothing to do with Democrat or Republican, but rather who's for life or against it.

I think too much attention is focused on the woman's rights and never on the child's.

A fetus is not yet a child and has no rights.

After 12 weeks, you can hear the baby's heartbeat which is separate from its mother's.

Irrelevant. A heartbeat alone does not a human make.

, from a scientific viewpoint, an abortion past 12 weeks is just plain murder.

Better go back to a science class. Murder is a legal term, not a scientific one.

That child is just as dependent on its mother as a toddler would be and no one would ever think of murdering a toddler, just because the mother did not want them anymore.

Again, a fetus isn't a child. And if the mother doesn't want it, it's getting evicted.

Too many women don't want to consider the fact, that abortion kills a child whose life is separate from their own.

Do you seriously believe women don't consider that, or make the decision to abort lightly?

Let's be honest, the real reason for an abortion is not that these children are a burden on society, but whether the mother can stand to have them around for 9 months.

Or maybe because a woman is exercising her right to abort.

but rather who's for life or against it.

Or rather who supports a woman's rights and who does not!

So because sex is fun, normal and natural, that gives you a free pass to shirk any responsibilities of engaging in intercourse? You do have an option of saying "no!" but of course because sex if fun, you would rather have viable human life scraped from its mothers womb for no other reason other than because "sex is fun, normal and natural," how human of you.

I will make it simple for you people; if you can abort an unwanted fetus because its "your body" then anyone else can make decisions regarding their body, you cannot say abortion should be legal while at the same time ignoring suicide laws, seat belt laws, helmet laws, drug laws and any other law that prohibits personal choice in regards to ones own body. My body, my choice right?

And again, when are the men going to be protected by "abortion rights?" No law shall favor one citizen over another and the Constitution makes it clear about equal protections of law but i guess who cares about the Constitution, we have politicians, pundits, celebrities and judges to tell us what to do. If a male who got a female pregnant wanted to get the fetus aborted but the female said no, there is nothing the male can do. In deciding to keep the fetus, the female gives birth and no longer wants to be with the father, she can force him to pay support for that child till its 18 even though he did'nt want the fetus. Where is the equality in this? There are no "special rights" given to anyone, we all have the same exact rights and privileges.

A simple observation is that liberals decry war because of the death it would cause but in the same breath would have no problem allowing the killing of an unwanted human fetus. One has to question their motives, i would say they do not think a fetus is life because they can not see it nor control it.

I'm not against abortion entirely, i see its uses. I'm against double-standard unconstitutional laws that favor one citizen over another and blind citizens who vote based on emotional driven agendas created by people who lust for power.

Swagganaut, since when is a fetus a citizen?

but of course because sex if fun, you would rather have viable human life scraped from its mothers womb for no other reason other than because "sex is fun, normal and natural," how human of you.

A fetus isn't viable until it can live outside the mother's womb. And electing abortion is taking responsibility for that "fun."

if you can abort an unwanted fetus because its "your body" then anyone else can make decisions regarding their body,

Of course they can.

My body, my choice right?

Absolutely.

No law shall favor one citizen over another and the Constitution makes it clear about equal protections of law but i guess who cares about the Constitution, we have politicians, pundits, celebrities and judges to tell us what to do.

A fetus isn't a citizen and abortion is constitutionally protected. Care to try again?

If a male who got a female pregnant wanted to get the fetus aborted but the female said no, there is nothing the male can do.

That's correct. It's the female's body, so it's her choice!

In deciding to keep the fetus, the female gives birth and no longer wants to be with the father, she can force him to pay support for that child till its 18 even though he did'nt want the fetus.

You confuse child bearing with child rearing. Those are two separate issues.

There are no "special rights" given to anyone, we all have the same exact rights and privileges.

However, you seem to advocate limiting or eliminating a woman's right to choose. How is that fair?

A simple observation is that liberals decry war because of the death it would cause but in the same breath would have no problem allowing the killing of an unwanted human fetus.

A false equaivalency. Just my observation.

I'm not against abortion entirely, i see its uses.

Somehow, I doubt that.

I'm against double-standard unconstitutional laws that favor one citizen over another

Which laws are you referring?

DB Akron

Charles.

I know it's hard to swallow, but more women are pro-life than men. Not only that but the most adamant about not having abortions at all, Is also WOMEN.

The Pro-choice people are about getting their own way regardless of who is hurt, especially those that cannot yet speak for themselves.

Flip over. You pulled that information out of the wrong orofice. Are you so arrogant as to believe that someone like me or like you could stop God from presenting His personally chosen soul from coming into this world? You can't stop life from occuring anymore than you can stop death! In both cases, it can only be delayed at best. Believing otherwise is a slap in God's face.

starsailing....isn't Arkansas where your beloved Clintons are from..just sayin

On this subject I really don't believe in abortion except in cases of rape,incest or the mothers health is in jeapordy especially after there is a heartbeat. Someone made the comment about a child becoming a burden on society using the welfare system. I am also of the opinion that if a woman is and has been on welfare for any long period of time she should only be allowed to give birth to one child. At the time of that childs birth she should have her tubes tied. We should not allow career welfare mothers to simply be irresponsible breeders.

Wow Avenger. You take the cake when it comes to all the misogyny on this board. Who are you to decide what a woman does with her body? Who are you? Hitler's long lost grandson? Cause that's who you sound like.

If a woman wants to have a child, that is her choice. Just as having an abortion is her choice. Just as whether deciding to have her tubes tied is HER CHOICE. You anti-choicers just confound me. I know you all hate women, but what makes you think YOU have the RIGHT to impose your personal opinions onto another person's body? Seriously?

Oh, wait. Controlling a woman's body IS what you antis want to do. You are a pig. Yes, let's force women to be sterilized because Avenger says so. And because there are so-called other men out there who think so. You don't live in the real world. Would you like for me, a complete stranger, to make medical decisions for you? I would guess not.

#1.81 Swagganaut - if you can abort an unwanted fetus because its "your body" then anyone else can make decisions regarding their body, you cannot say abortion should be legal while at the same time ignoring suicide laws, seat belt laws, helmet laws, drug laws and any other law that prohibits personal choice in regards to one's own body.

You're wrong about this. The other situations you mention (helmet laws, drug laws, seat belt laws, etc.) affect other people and common resources. I don't want someone high or drunk driving behind me for obvious reasons; communities don't want to use their resources (police and fire depts) to clean up after a motorcyclist has spilled his brains on the highway. Same with seat belt law. Perhaps I don't need to go on and you get the idea here. Abortion does not relate to these common laws. Find something else to complain about. Your argument is nonsense.

#1.86 Olivia - Who are you? Hitler's long lost grandson? Cause that's who you sound like.

For the record, we'll never know what Hitler's grandson sounds like, because the Fuhrer did not have any children. As a matter of fact, his family was so distraught about the choices Hitler made during his lifetime that they let the entire gene pool die out. Fact.

All Republican State legislators should be required to undergo a psychiatric exam before they are sworn into office.

And these moron state legislatures are passing laws that give the state legal authorization to (1) ignore federal law when they don't like it, and (2) make it illegal to enforce federal laws that they don't like.

Perhaps Sarah Palin was right (like a broken clock - right twice a day) - in her saying that it is time to pick up our guns and take back our country -- from these morons.

Why just Republicans, why not all of them?

Because, texasbob, it is the Republican party who has self defined as "the party of stupid". The party is really living up to their name. It is extreme right wingers who believe in "legitimate rape". It is extreme right wingers who defy the laws of science. It is extreme right wingers who are doing their best to drive this country right into the @!$%#ter. The new Republican party must take back their party from the cancerous tumor that has overtaken them. They are called the Tea party.

I hate living in this state. Trust me, we're not all insane, religious, ignorant, controlling weirdos... but there are a lot of them here.

What is meant by legitimate rape is rape that wasn't statutory rape or when a female gets drunk, blacks out, and doesn't remember having sex and feeling like she was taken advantage of, even though she was a willing participant. I had a friend in high school that ended up in juvi because his girlfriend's father found out they were having sex, so he called the cops and had him arrested for statutory rape. They were both 15.

You are a complete moron. If a woman is not in control of her mind or body due to alcohol or drugs, there is no consent. It is rape. Try to spin it and spin it any way you like. Geez. Again....Moron.

GOP = RIP

Sequester = Red State Starvation

It's amazing how much stupid can be crammed into one little corner of the US isn't it?

Rick - unfortunately, it is spread from coast to coast. From AZ to FL. From Minnesota and Wisconsin (bright bulbs in the far north) to the entire south. This is more evidence that the rocket fuel pollution in the water causes brain damage and paranoid fears.

Today, I set before you life and death; a blessing and a curse. Choose life that you and your descendants may live - Deuteronomy 30

I live in AL and am chuckling at the last few posts. No, of course not all people in southern states are anything you all said, but there are enough to keep these people in office to pass those types of laws, so there must be a decent number.

@3.4 I haven't been religious for 6 years, so I doubt proselytizing will persuade me to support abortion bans.

@3.5 I live in Virginia, and people here can be screwed up too. I don't mind people making fun of the region unless they make it personal.

hey jermo - go attempt an anatomically impossible act of self procreation... (if that is to educated or cryptic for you - it's a request for you to go FOOK yourself) have to love cretins...

Gettin' real tired of your @!$%#, Southern U.S.!

Me too, but South Dakota (in the north) has been pushing abortion regulations as well. A simple Google search will show how obsessed SD is with abortion.

These morons just need to leave people alone... And stop interjecting your damn religion into laws.

ram-762581

I live in AL and am chuckling at the last few posts. No, of course not all people in southern states are anything you all said, but there are enough to keep these people in office to pass those types of laws, so there must be a decent number.

With all due respect ram, the only way things are going to change in your state is if good citizens like you stop chuckling, and start organizing.

Bryan, Wasted monies? I suppose you believe it perfectly fine that Obama renewed the Nazi organization, Planned Parenthood, with another (count the zeroes) $500,000,000 this year of taxpayers' dollars. Why? So they can abort 3000+ babies each and every day in the USA. You should take a course in Biblical economics. Violence begets violence and death begets death - sow to the wind and reap a whirlwind. God does not play games with life. In fact, He tells us to choose life over death, that we may receive a blessing on our nation - Open your eyes and see the violence of murder in America. As long as we kill babies in the womb, a curse is what will prevail on our country. There is a natural flow of consequences from the choices we make: Life = blessing. Death = curse.

Jermo - That sounds like a threat.

@Jermo. Thats fine for you, but it requires something I don't have to be true for me: A belief in God. I don't tow the religious line, so "Biblical economics" means nothing to me. (nor should it to you, what an unpleasent way to live your life.)

jermo - do you EVER quit babbling? Go examine your fuc ked up religious principles - remember that to someone who is brainwashed, they don't realize that religion is the opium of the masses...and BUD, you are BRAINWASHED - your brain was washed clean a long time a go

Jermo - That sounds like a threat.

Actually, it sounds more delusional. And completely misinformed too!

Jermo Murmo

As long as we kill babies in the womb, a curse is what will prevail on our country. There is a natural flow of consequences from the choices we make: Life = blessing. Death = curse.

You know who told that first sermon? It wasn't Jesus Christ. No, it was the genius priest who realized that more children meant more people at church in the future, so why not encourage large families - and I'll thank you to leave the money in the envelope. And bring your large families, and make sure they learn the way to tithe... to a preacher who figured out how to make a pretty fine living spinning folklore to the small-minded townfolk.

Yes, because Obama is the ONLY person in the history of the United States to trump states rights... /sarcasm.

Guns = Trump

@ warrren: You do realize that Roe V Wade was passed into law 40 years ago and that all presidents since then have upheld the law? This is not an Obama thing, so either bury your head back up your ass and shut up, or get educated because it is blatantly obvious that you have no clue as to what you are talking about.

These nutty state legislators believe they can overrule the law of the USA. They've never respected the laws of this country, and every single time they've been forced to accept it. This time will be no different. Meanwhile, pressing business is ignored to the detriment of all in the state.

Trump = Bad Hair

AlaskaGirl-759554

Politicians may be stoopid but they ain't dumb.

They tend to shy away from religious related issues.

Warren, what planet are you from?

In the USofA, GOP politicians wallow in religious related issues.

Wow, celtic curmudgeon, that was a real head shaker wasn't it?! LOL

AlaskaGirl-759554

Oh my you have a Fan

warrren, your mommy is calling you in for dinner. Make sure you wash that sticky stuff off your hands. Dude, you really are such a douche.

State representatives should just pack up and come back home because the Federal government will decide what's best for the states and the citizens regardless of what they say.

If only that were true. I trust the Federal government far more than most state legislatures to defend my rights.

Sounds like Obama's 51%.

mfhpr - So. Are you implying that Jesus Christ would take scalpels, forceps and vacuums to kill a baby in a mother's womb. Be careful how you answer this: "But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken" - Jesus - Matt 12:36. Whether you believe it or not.

Jermo

We don't live in a theocracy, we live in a republic. Our Constitution is the foundational law, not your religion. Further, your inability to grasp basic science and understand the difference between a group of cells and an infant does not need to be inflicted upon the rest of us. You are free to live in that kind of tyrannical chaos, you are not free to impose it upon others.

Jermo, perhaps you should ship off to Jesus-land, because (as Ro Mar commented) the last time I check the United States was not a theocracy. And why is it that your type completely ignores the Old Testament (except when trying to argue against homosexuality)? That book imposes the death penalty for the most trivial offenses. Why is the that book not worthy of following as much as the NT? all God's word, right?

well jermo, jesus fuc king christ wouldn't care

Jermo Murmo

mfhpr - So. Are you implying that Jesus Christ would take scalpels, forceps and vacuums to kill a baby in a mother's womb. Be careful how you answer this: "But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken" - Jesus - Matt 12:36. Whether you believe it or not.

God created the scalpels, forceps and vacuums to kill just as certainly as he created computers so that we could write words of hate; words that lead to cultural division, killing and war. Words that make men scramble to their nearest gun stores to by AR-15 assault weapons before they are outlawed. "Ask not for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for thee" - John Donne.

They only need to worry about you spending food stamps.

What's Alaska (AK) have to do with it? I mean, yeah, we have our wing nuts, but who doesn't?

Funny how Arkansas is one of the biggest "free-loading" red states, when it comes to federal tax revenue.

stopfreeloaders

They only need to worry about you spending food stamps.

If there were profit in ignorance you'd likely be a billionaire by now. Actually, I guess that is Fox News' business plan isn't it? And Rush Limbaugh's, and Glenn Beck, and Ann Coulter and every other millionaire who profit off the ignorant and easily inflamed.

Girl - I'm sure he meant AR. I used to live in Fairbanks and thought the same thing for a moment.

I know he did, Carl, just giving him a little fun ribbing! Funny though, many do get the initials mixed up with both of those states.

Sorry for the typo. I did mean AR.

I knows it! :)

Wow! An incredible misrepresentation. This law is about protecting living human beings. I realize that a lot of people say killing babies is a "choice." But it is not a decision over your own body. Drug use -- that's a decision over your own body. Deciding to chop off your own hand is a decision over your own body. Even suicide is a decision over your own body. And most abortion supporters oppose that last one. But killing your child is not a decision over your own body.

^^^ I assume those same lawmakers want to support the children if the mother can't actually take care of them, right?

@ Publivs: My body, my choice. Get the @!$%# out of my rights.

You people are nothing but a bunch of hypocrites. You want to demand that a woman carry a pregnancy to full term and give birth to the child. Then what? You are going to spend the next 18-22 years supporting it? I mean, you don't get to have it both ways. You are all right there ready to ax the @!$%# out of assistance to low income mothers with children, ax the @!$%# out of public assistance. So, tell me, where oh where will this new poor mother go to feed and clothe this child you forced her to have because as sure as @!$%# your involvement ends at birth.

Well just remember the old men gave you the right to kill your babies, why not put a timer on it. Bet you were also outraged over sandy hook yet you condone killing your own children in the name of YOUR CHOICE. WOW we are a out of touch with reality country.

Can't be killing a child that is not there. Some split up cells do not constitute a child. If you want to take your route then I suggest men be charged with murdering millions of children when they blow their wad into a towel.

It's so outrageous how many anti-choicers say "It's not about controlling women. It's about saving lives." Nope. Cause if you cared about human lives, you'd care about the women who will surely die if abortion is outlawed again. You only care about a FETUS! And who carries that fetus? A fully aware, living, breathing woman whose LIFE DOES MATTER!!!! You'd care about the unwanted children who are languishing in foster homes desperately hoping someone will scoop them up and make them a part of their forever family.

If you wingnuts really cared about saving lives, you wouldn't be trying to make abortion unsafe and illegal again. You would respect the lives of women who are faced with an unplanned pregnancy and whatever choice they make. Because every person, every situation is different. And you don't get to CHOOSE for anyone else what they do with THEIR PREGNANCY. Our bodies. Our rights. Our choice. STAY OUT OF IT.

We've always said that this would not even be an issue or the need for a law on the books if men were able to get pregnant. They don't understand that they have no seat at the table.

EXACTLY!

Pvblivs, I am pro-choice yet I completely believe that *you* should be able to off yourself at will - completely!

AlaskaGirl:

Not your body. Not your choice. That's the whole point. Those who are pro-abortion (Olivia will agree that "choice" is just a code word for abortion and that it is pro-abortion; she does this by using the term "anti-choicer") will make all sorts of excuses -- pretending the child is actually the "mother's body," insisting that a recognizable human being is nothing more than a "clump of cells," and even the claim of "potential life." The same excuses could just as easily be applied to "post-natal abortions." Were people like Olivia to get their way, I'm sure they would.

"They don't understand that they have no seat at the table."

I realize that you think that men exist only to serve as ATM machines. But if you are going to tell people that they have no voice, you have no cause to object to those who (in your mind) say the same to you.

MissionMan:

Oh, don't worry. I have no intention of killing myself. But for your statement not to be blatantly evil, it must apply to all and not just me. So you must have no objection to AlaskaGirl or Olivia offing themselves. After all, that is something we can agree is their body.

Those who are pro-abortion (Olivia will agree that "choice" is just a code word for abortion and that it is pro-abortion; she does this by using the term "anti-choicer")

There's no such thing as "pro-abortion," and pro-choice does not equal pro-abortion!

pretending the child is actually the "mother's body," insisting that a recognizable human being is nothing more than a "clump of cells," and even the claim of "potential life."

No one is pretending. It's a fetus, not a child. It's attached and feeding off the mother's body, like a parasite. And it is a clump of cells and a potential human, especially in the early stages of pregnancy!

The same excuses could just as easily be applied to "post-natal abortions."

What is a post natal abortion?

But if you are going to tell people that they have no voice, you have no cause to object to those who (in your mind) say the same to you.

That's right, they don't! A woman's choices and medical decisions is her business and hers alone. Certainly not yours! You have no more say in her health decisions than she has in yours!

Well just remember the old men gave you the right to kill your babies, why not put a timer on it.

I thought killing babies was illegal? Specify where in the law books it says that's a right!

Gordy:

There is such a thing as pro-abortion. Now, you may argue that not everyone who believes in abortion rights actively wants to increase the abortion rate. But that does not mean that there is no such thing as wanting to increase the abortion rate.

"No one is pretending. It's a fetus, not a child. It's attached and feeding off the mother's body, like a parasite."

Attached, yes. But still a distinct body. Indeed, if they could not tell where the child ended and the mother began, abortion would have a high fatality rate for the mother. Abortion is safe (for the mother) precisely because it is not her body being killed.

"What is a post natal abortion?"

Which words are confusing you?

"That's right, they don't! A woman's choices and medical decisions is her business and hers alone. Certainly not yours! You have no more say in her health decisions than she has in yours!"

But we are not talking about a health decision. We are talking about killing another human being.

"I thought killing babies was illegal? Specify where in the law books it says that's a right!"

This was addressed to a quote of somebody else. But I'll address it anyway. You will not find any spot in the law books that says abortion is a right. (That "right" was manufactured out of thin air.) He is referring to the court case "Roe v Wade" in which five old men decided that women had a right to kill babies as long as it's done before birth. But who knows? If the pro-abortionists get their way, another ruling may extend that for several years after birth. After all, sometimes it takes a while for a woman to decide she's "not ready to be a mother."

There is such a thing as pro-abortion.

Tell me, who's "pro-abortion?" I don't see anyone going around saying women should or must abort. The ultimate decision rests with the woman. That's what choice is!

Now, you may argue that not everyone who believes in abortion rights actively wants to increase the abortion rate. But that does not mean that there is no such thing as wanting to increase the abortion rate.

Pure conjecture on your part. See my first statement above.

Attached, yes. But still a distinct body.

And still irrelevant!

Abortion is safe (for the mother) precisely because it is not her body being killed.

The mother's safety is one reason why abortions were allowed in the first place.

Which words are confusing you?

That whole phrase! There's no such thing! "Post natal abortion" is a misnomer.

But we are not talking about a health decision. We are talking about killing another human being.

Abortion is a woman's health decision, and one between her and her doctor too. Abortion is not the same as killing, no matter how you want to spin it.

He is referring to the court case "Roe v Wade"

ANd the Roe case made abortion a right. So yes, it is in law.

If the pro-abortionists get their way, another ruling may extend that for several years after birth.

Again with the lame slippery slope arguments!

"Tell me, who's 'pro-abortion'?"

Anyone who uses the term "anti-choice" for a start. Anyone who accepts the term as valid to continue. They demonstrate that, to them, the word "choice" is only code for "abortion."

"'Attached, yes. But still a distinct body.'

"And still irrelevant!"

Not at all irrelevant. It's something that you don't want to hear. After all, you keep using the claim "the mother's body" as a pseudo-justification. And now you are sitting here saying that the fact that the entire premise of the pseudo-justification is fictional is irrelevant.

"The mother's safety is one reason why abortions were allowed in the first place."

And the child's safety is the reason many people want it recognized as illegal. (The court case was really an unlawful ruling.)

"That whole phrase! There's no such thing! 'Post natal abortion' is a misnomer."

It's no misnomer. It's just doing the same thing to the child, only after birth. You would like that. It's much safer for the mother.

"Abortion is a woman's health decision, and one between her and her doctor too. Abortion is not the same as killing, no matter how you want to spin it."

I'm not the one spinning. You are. If I went so far as to use the word "murder" (which I find accurate) you might have a case to say that I was spinning. But in an abortion, the child starts off alive (both scientifically and medically) and ends up dead. That is killing.

It is also quite telling that pro-abortionists object to the word "kill." We have adverts that boast the word "kill" as applied to mice, roaches, and bacteria. Clearly, when we really believe that a life should not be protected, there is no objection to the word "kill."

"ANd the Roe case made abortion a right. So yes, it is in law."

Your previous demand was "where in the law books." Well, Supreme Court decisions are not in the law books. In fact, they are not rally authorized to write law. Since the decision was manufacturing a "right" out of thin air, with no backing from the law or the Constitution, they exceeded their authority and made an unlawful ruling.

You mean like one in Bentonville perhaps?

Yeah, but that would only hurt people in China.....

Walmart... or is that what you were getting at? I already boycott them! They fired me in college for dating a co-worker!!! And we rarely talked at work after we started dating since it was against their rules at the time! It was just so they could hire someone for 35 cents an hour less!

Not just china.... but it might bring back some of those local businesses they ran out out business...

I've never bought anything from them, and never will.

Hey Dan, did she have big hoots?

If this is their idea of re-branding their identity.............The Party of Stupid continues to be so.

I note that there are two major "parties of stupid." They just express their stupidity in different ways.

Barb H - I suppose you believe imposing federal taxes on all American citizens to cover abortions is not legislating one's beliefs? And that giving $500,000,000 each year to Planned Parenthood to abort 3000 plus children each day in America is also not legislating a belief? Don't speak unless you have the facts.

No federal funds are used by Planned Parenthood to fund abortions. Planned Parenthood is the primary provider of health care to poor women. Where do you think poor women go to get birth control so pregnancy is prevented so abortion doesn't have to be an option. Providing access to contraception has prevented abortions.

So Jermo Murmo.... Don't speak unless you have the facts.

Mari:

I will believe that no federal funds go into abortions when that money is handled by an organization that takes no part in abortion. Currently it is a shell game.

Barb:

I am not religious. I oppose abortion on the basis of human rights. And I am calling you out on your strawman. All legislation is a legislation of beliefs. But the claim that it is necessarily a religious belief (while a useful sound bite) is a strawman.

Well, to be completely accurate, it's not the woman's life that is being terminated. Just sayin'

In some cases, forcing a woman to bear and keep the child is worse than death. They might as well put a gun to her head. Incest. Rape. Any of those things ring a bell? Are you going to adopt all these "children"? I didn't think so.

Yeah, but does the woman have a right to her own destiny or should her "religious, morally superior" neighbor (who happens to be a stranger and doesn't know her circumstances), have the right to determine her destiny? Which person do you think should call the shot?? Just wondrin'.

Grumpy:

Are you arguing for exceptions in extenuating circumstances? Or are you arguing for "I think I'll kill my baby. It's just a 'choice'?" I could see an exception in the case of rape. But many five-year-olds are spared through force of law. Are you willing to adopt all those children? Do you think it should be acceptable to slit the throats of five-year-olds? Or do you believe that you don't need to take over responsibility for a person before prohibiting the killing of said person?

Or are you arguing for "I think I'll kill my baby. It's just a 'choice'?"

Yes, it is a choice. And a woman's reasons for that choice is hers alone!

I could see an exception in the case of rape.

Why? What difference does it make? It's still an abortion and "killing" as you imply.

To gordy37, Pvblivs thinks abortion is wrong except in cases of rape because he wants to punish women for having sexuality. But he's obviously a religious zealot who believes in an invisible deity creating humans, rather than evolution, so even under his fairy tale beliefs system human sexuality was created by God. Pvblivs you should be happy it exists instead of so terrified of it, and stop trying to punish women for being happy, well adjusted normal humans.

Pvblivs thinks abortion is wrong except in cases of rape because he wants to punish women for having sexuality.

Well, somebody needs to teach those uppity women a lesson! LOL

Lalaw:

You can speak for yourself and your own motivations. Unlike you, I am not out to punish anybody. However, I do have sympathy for people who find themselves in an adverse situation completely beyond their own control. MY motivation is to protect the life of the child. But should not be compelled to raise a child that was left on their doorstep.

Gordy:

I find abortion to be a choice in the same sense that any other murder is a choice. Perhaps you think that the murderers should be released and that the laws against murder should be taken off the books? After all, the murderers' reasons are theirs alone -- in the type of logic you are presenting to me.

"Why? What difference does it make?"

It's called an "extenuating circumstance." No, it doesn't change the fact that it is killing. And a 12-week window is more than enough time to take care of an issue of rape in that regard. But Grumpy seems to be holding an incoherent position.

I find abortion to be a choice in the same sense that any other murder is a choice.

Then you're wrong!

in the type of logic you are presenting to me.

Apparently, logic, and legal interpretations, is over your head.

It's called an "extenuating circumstance."

So? It's still an abortion and "killing" according to you. But you're ok with it in that instance? That's seems quite hypocritical! It seems you think abortion is ok if it fits your parameters.

And a 12-week window is more than enough time to take care of an issue of rape in that regard.

That's when most abortions are performed regardless of the circumstances.

MY motivation is to protect the life of the child.

Not your business what someone does with their body!

"Then you're wrong!"

A flat declaration to that effect is not going to convince me.

"Apparently, logic, and legal interpretations, is over your head."

Not at all. Perhaps they are over yours. A proposition held as true does not only apply where convenient. It applies in all cases. I simply applied your proposition to something inconvenient. Now, I don't hold your proposition as true. So I specified that this is according to your reasoning.

"So? It's still an abortion and "killing" according to you. But you're ok with it in that instance? That's seems quite hypocritical! It seems you think abortion is ok if it fits your parameters."

I consider it a somewhat bitter pill. But I think that certain circumstances are, in fact, more important than the child's life. That is not a hypocrisy. It is a weighing of considerations.

DING DING DING!!! Exactly right. They want us to be treated as nothing but broodmares, tied a stove.

Olivia: ...and don't forget to remove your shoes while you're a cookin'.

And we have a bald-faced lie. It must be remembered that 40 percent of Republicans are women. This would not be the case if Republicans wanted women to be property.

We are witnessing the results of a partial birth abortion when we read your post.

Yes, reading your comments are as close as I care to get to that medical procedure. In your mom's case, it was a huge missed opportunity.

Clint - though it be banned, it does not stop the meat cleavers from chopping babies from mothers' wombs: www.abortioninstruments.com/ . Those who flippantly speak of an unborn child as a mass of cells, or that it does not have a chance for a full life are ignorant, gratified and pleasingly uninformed. At conception, a child is formed - "You made all the delicate, inner parts of my body and knit me together in my mother's womb." Psalm 139:13. Our lives belong to God Almighty, and to Him alone.

You who believe that children should be aborted at 3000 plus babies each day in America will give an account to God, not because you believe abortion is ok, but because your thinking is sinful. "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each of us may receive what is due us for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad." II Corinthians 5:10. The cure:

"Repent, then, and turn to God (Jesus Christ), so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord,..." - Acts 3:19

Out of curiosity, can you quote any bit of the new testament that specifically references abortion, the fact that it's a sin, or the punishment for committing it? I know that the old testament treats it like more of a civil offense (rather than criminal) and specifies a fine be levied, but I don't recall Jesus or the Apostles specifically referencing it.

If you can't, well then, STFU and GTFO :)

We have more than our fair share of idiots here in TN... Too many idiots to count... Wish I could move!

Sheepdog, I bet if you took up a collection, you'd get the funding needed for a one way ticket out of there in about two nanoseconds.

And I suppose you breathe through your ears, Boogie.

Best comment on this thread.

Grumpy, You can take your life if you want. It is someone Else's life that you should not be able to take just for shets and grins.

The gop also was trying to pass legislation not too long ago that would make it legal for a doctor to lie to a woman. If the truth would make her want an abortion, the doctor would have been given a pass to lie to her in order to keep her from having one... Kansas Georgia, Virginia, etc. A lot of interesting articles on the web about these...

GOA - What about my freedom of choice? I choose life over death and abhor abortion, mother's life excepted, yet, our President renewed Planned Parenthood's yearly, TAX-PAYERS' funded, $500,000,000 (notice the zeroes) to abort 3000 plus babies each day. Some freedom, eh? Get your facts straight before making such a ridiculous comment.

You may choose not to have an abortion should some hillbilly get so drunk as to populate your womb with... whatever. That's your right. Your rights end where mine (and everybody elses' rights begin)...

GOA - What about my freedom of choice?

You have freedom of choice. Don't get an abortion if you don't want one.

What about my freedom of choice?

You are not required to have an abortion if you don't want one. That's choice.

our President renewed Planned Parenthood's yearly, TAX-PAYERS' funded, $500,000,000

Taxpayer money does not go towards abortions, per the Hyde Amendment!

Get your facts straight before making such a ridiculous comment.

Why don't you go first, as your "facts" is clearly wrong!

Gordy:

There are thousands (millions?) of laws on the books that restrict choices. What if someone wants to drive drunk 100mph the wrong way down a freeway? That's a choice. What if someone decides that it is cheaper to dump industrial waste into meat to be packed and shipped to supermarkets than disposing of it properly? That's a choice. What if somebody's hobby is throwing bricks through people's windows? That's a choice. But we, as a society decide to forbid certain choices and add consequences (like jail time) to them.

The issue isn't about choice. It's about the action in question.

But we, as a society decide to forbid certain choices and add consequences (like jail time) to them.

Thqat's because the consequences of those "choices" can negatively impact another or society as a whole. A woman choosing an abortion affects no one but her, much less anyone else or society.

"Thqat's because the consequences of those "choices" can negatively impact another or society as a whole."

And the consequences of the "choice" of abortion affect another human being -- the child being killed. Now a lot of people say "we shouldn't care about the baby" and use that to falsely claim that abortion affects only the mother. But that claim that the child being killed isn't affected is so obviously false that no one believes it, not even the ones making the claim.

And the consequences of the "choice" of abortion affect another human being -- the child being killed.

It's not a child yet, especially in the early stages of pregnancy when most abortions are performed.

Now a lot of people say "we shouldn't care about the baby" and use that to falsely claim that abortion affects only the mother.

It's not a baby yet either! And yes, it does affect only the mother.

But that claim that the child being killed isn't affected is so obviously false that no one believes it, not even the ones making the claim.

Immaterial! Abortion is still a woman's right and her choice, and really no one else's business!

Gordy:

I will dismiss your claims of "it is not a child" and "it is not a baby" as immaterial, since you keep using that word on me.

I recognize the child as a child and you keep saying that being killed doesn't affect the child. That is a blatant lie. Maybe you think that if someone killed you that it wouldn't affect you. But I consider it a sick and twisted way of thinking. The child is affected. And deliberately killing another human being is everybody's business.

I will dismiss your claims of "it is not a child" and "it is not a baby" as immaterial, since you keep using that word on me.

Whether you want to dismiss it and bury your head in the sand doesn't matter, as you're still wrong! It also seems you can not logically refute anything I post either, as your replies have turned to little more than "I know you are but what am I."

I recognize the child as a child and you keep saying that being killed doesn't affect the child.

Except a fetus isn't a child, no matteer how much you wish otherwise, and it certainly doesn't override the rights of the mother!

Maybe you think that if someone killed you that it wouldn't affect you.

A very poor analogy!

But I consider it a sick and twisted way of thinking.

That's your perogative.

The child is affected.

Repeating yourself is neither convincing or persuasive!

And deliberately killing another human being is everybody's business.

Except abortion isn't killing and a woman's legally protected health care choices is certainly none of your business!

Yep, and they want to make damn sure their aunt/sister can't get rid of their nephew/cousin/son/future third step-father. Family's gotta be preserved!!

sanity, that ain't NEVER gonna happen. not in THIS lifetime. all the repubes' wives with their weapons will kill them first. and do us ALL a big favor.